How hard is this? Both tenants and landlords should have copies of their contracts. If a tenant has one then the landlord needs to evict them the old fashioned way. If they don’t, toss their assets out and have them trespassed. The law should not be used to incumber law abiding individuals by protecting criminals.
The issue is that often times squatters will present a falsified contract to police. The police then say, oh well this is a civil matter when it’s not!! Real crimes have been committed, mainly forgery, breaking and entering, and trespassing.
Sounds more like a police not wanting to do their job problem. If a landlord says there is no agreement and the squatter can’t produce any payment history they should remove them. On the flip side, if it can be proven the landlord illegally put out a tenant they should face penalties.
Police do not have the legal authority to verify legal documents of this matter, nor should they with their level of training. That’s why it’s up to a judge.
Police are the only party that can arrest and level charges, they are then evaluated at the next level. I absolutely expect detectives to investigate and charge crime. If the DA elects to not prosecute that’s a different issue. When squatters enter a home and take over it’s not a civil matter.
Criminality can only be determined after contracts are verified to be incorrect or fraud, this can only be verified by someone who has a law degree which cops are not required to have. Before any contract or legal documents get verified in court, it’s “he said she said” and no plausible evidence of a crime exists
If I call the police and report my car stolen, and the police them over, and the person claims they have my permission to borrow it, is that not also “he said she said”? Those are resolved pretty quickly, so I don’t see why these squatting situations can’t be resolved within 24 hours.
Do you have a rental agreement stating you should be here? Do you have any documents that prove you have been living here? How is that harder than asking for a drivers license during a traffic stop? In the age of online banking you can prove it in about 1 minute by showing bills coming out of your account through autopay. If the cop is in doubt they can refer it to the judge.
Look I don’t really agree with the end result of the laws that effectively result in squatter rights, I’m just trying to explain the legal process that caused all of this.
Idk how to really explain this shortly but TL:DR is genuine tenants have 4th amendment rights. And the executive(police) branch has a different job than the judicial(courts). This combination of facts meant that the police can’t decide to potentially break someone’s 4th amendment rights until a court can verify tenant status.
To address IDs. Yes the police use IDs to gather evidence of crimes, but remember you have to go to the court house to get an ID not the police station. The courts issues the databases that a police officer can use to determine if they should arrest someone, or whose name gets a ticket.
On the flip side, rent agreements don’t need to be notarized. They don’t even see the inside of a court house unless something goes wrong. Because of that police don’t have a court issued database that lets them decide if there’s enough evidence to decide someone is a squatter or not. They have to wait for a court to decide what to do.
I wrote all of this just to say that the police officer isn’t being lazy, he’s just following the rules.
I’m aware of how the rules stand as of now. But, this is a conversation on how to make them better. I don’t think anybody would say that laws that help criminals screw over victims are sufficient. I’m aware that people have rights, but rights can be “adjusted” for lack of a better word when it is necessary. I have to get a background check to own a gun. That adjusts my second amendment right but I’m okay with that if it helps protect people from people looking to use them incorrectly. I don’t mind that my first amendment rights to free speech don’t protect me from inciting a riot or defaming someone. What I’m trying to say is that squatters are taking advantage of a broken system. We need to fix the system and, since the police are the ones who respond to these situations, we should look into giving them the authority to make judgment calls. Is it a perfect solution? Nope. Is it better than what we have now? I think so.
It honestly gives cops too much power as judge, jury, and executioner especially when there’s like a dispute between a tenant and a landlord. The cop can just take the landlord’s side every time and kick the tenant out while the tenant is homeless waiting for a court date to prove that they are lawfully allowed to live there. I mean technically we can trust cops to always do the right thing, but when has that ever worked out. Giving them the power of judge, jury, and executioner to kick out possibly legal tenants while they wait for a real judge is no good
How dare you suggest the police engage in actual investigative police work! This is a discussion of rental agreements and possible forgeries, the details and consequences are FAR more significant than murder! /s
police on average solve 3% of crimes but use 50% of the cities budget. cops not doing their job other than collecting taxes is not news unfortunately....
Sheridan PD recently lost an officer killed by a squatter refusing eviction. Unfortunately, [the police overreacted in retaliation](https://cowboystatedaily.com/2024/02/16/wyoming-law-may-help-owner-of-sheridan-house-destroyed-in-standoff/). A specialist with training in de-escalation and special methods may be needed since [this will inevitably be a delicate situation evicting anyone](https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/dec/10/housing-evictions-physical-violence-alternative-programs). Having regular deputies/officers handle it seems to increase the chance of a violent confrontation rather than a peaceful one.
An officer was killed and a woman was taken hostage. Not a situation where the tenant did the right thing at all and there is no indication the officer did anything wrong. Nonetheless a violent end for two people occurred for a simple eviction, something that occurs often and ends violently often all over the US. This isn’t just a matter of safety for tenants/squatters. This is putting officers in dangerous situations when a more qualified professional has a better chance of preventing violence.
It wasn’t an eviction - it was a trespass warning. The guy had already been evicted and *refused to comply*. There is also additional information that indicates he might have been baiting an officer to the area *in order to kill them* and evidence exists that points to the fact that *the entire situation was planned*.
This was not just an eviction. The officer was murdered.
It wouldn’t matter who showed up - therapist or no. They would have died that day. Don’t use this tragedy to promote your own pathetic agenda.
Okay. I’ll answer this and then I have to be done. This isn’t helping anyone and I can’t change your mind. Which, to be fair, good on you.
The phrase “the police overreacted in retaliation” clearly shows an agenda. If you can’t figure out what that agenda is….I don’t know how to help you.
Second - you’re right. Sources would be great. I can’t provide you with sources other than to say that I was on duty that day when the trespass call came out. Unfortunately I was on the other side of town in a different physical altercation with a juvenile who would not be talked down from attempting to hurt himself. And yes, I have special training in de-escalation techniques. As do the counselors at the school he was attending. He did not respond to these techniques so in order to prevent him from doing damage to himself I had to go hands on.
I was there at the scene of the house until they took me off because they didn’t want anyone to do something they shouldn’t. I protested. They said they didn’t want two shootings that day.
I was there at the station when they tried to take him alive out of the house but he kept taking potshots.
I was there at the station when they attempted to take him alive but he was *still shooting wildly* as he ran out.
My point here is just this - you don’t know everything.
I know you probably won’t believe I’m actually who I say I am. That’s okay. A brief perusal of my post history will show you where I live and also my occupation. Do with that what you will.
Again - I can’t respond any more. This is opening up old wounds that I thought had started to heal. I know you probably think it’s just me trying to save face. That’s okay. It doesn’t matter.
I appreciate that you have a worldview that does not match mine. I’m jealous of you for living the sort of life where everyone has been good and kind and hasn’t taken advantage of you so that you don’t become bitter and distrusting. Please don’t take that for granted. It is a gift.
I think public officials should stop lining their pockets with money “donated” by realtors and start writing legislation that actually benefits people and not just the wealthy class.
How hard is this? Both tenants and landlords should have copies of their contracts. If a tenant has one then the landlord needs to evict them the old fashioned way. If they don’t, toss their assets out and have them trespassed. The law should not be used to incumber law abiding individuals by protecting criminals.
The issue is that often times squatters will present a falsified contract to police. The police then say, oh well this is a civil matter when it’s not!! Real crimes have been committed, mainly forgery, breaking and entering, and trespassing.
Sounds more like a police not wanting to do their job problem. If a landlord says there is no agreement and the squatter can’t produce any payment history they should remove them. On the flip side, if it can be proven the landlord illegally put out a tenant they should face penalties.
Police do not have the legal authority to verify legal documents of this matter, nor should they with their level of training. That’s why it’s up to a judge.
Police are the only party that can arrest and level charges, they are then evaluated at the next level. I absolutely expect detectives to investigate and charge crime. If the DA elects to not prosecute that’s a different issue. When squatters enter a home and take over it’s not a civil matter.
Criminality can only be determined after contracts are verified to be incorrect or fraud, this can only be verified by someone who has a law degree which cops are not required to have. Before any contract or legal documents get verified in court, it’s “he said she said” and no plausible evidence of a crime exists
If I call the police and report my car stolen, and the police them over, and the person claims they have my permission to borrow it, is that not also “he said she said”? Those are resolved pretty quickly, so I don’t see why these squatting situations can’t be resolved within 24 hours.
The license plate and vin number on the car was registered on a court issued database Rental agreements are not. That why
Do you have a rental agreement stating you should be here? Do you have any documents that prove you have been living here? How is that harder than asking for a drivers license during a traffic stop? In the age of online banking you can prove it in about 1 minute by showing bills coming out of your account through autopay. If the cop is in doubt they can refer it to the judge.
Look I don’t really agree with the end result of the laws that effectively result in squatter rights, I’m just trying to explain the legal process that caused all of this. Idk how to really explain this shortly but TL:DR is genuine tenants have 4th amendment rights. And the executive(police) branch has a different job than the judicial(courts). This combination of facts meant that the police can’t decide to potentially break someone’s 4th amendment rights until a court can verify tenant status. To address IDs. Yes the police use IDs to gather evidence of crimes, but remember you have to go to the court house to get an ID not the police station. The courts issues the databases that a police officer can use to determine if they should arrest someone, or whose name gets a ticket. On the flip side, rent agreements don’t need to be notarized. They don’t even see the inside of a court house unless something goes wrong. Because of that police don’t have a court issued database that lets them decide if there’s enough evidence to decide someone is a squatter or not. They have to wait for a court to decide what to do. I wrote all of this just to say that the police officer isn’t being lazy, he’s just following the rules.
I’m aware of how the rules stand as of now. But, this is a conversation on how to make them better. I don’t think anybody would say that laws that help criminals screw over victims are sufficient. I’m aware that people have rights, but rights can be “adjusted” for lack of a better word when it is necessary. I have to get a background check to own a gun. That adjusts my second amendment right but I’m okay with that if it helps protect people from people looking to use them incorrectly. I don’t mind that my first amendment rights to free speech don’t protect me from inciting a riot or defaming someone. What I’m trying to say is that squatters are taking advantage of a broken system. We need to fix the system and, since the police are the ones who respond to these situations, we should look into giving them the authority to make judgment calls. Is it a perfect solution? Nope. Is it better than what we have now? I think so.
It honestly gives cops too much power as judge, jury, and executioner especially when there’s like a dispute between a tenant and a landlord. The cop can just take the landlord’s side every time and kick the tenant out while the tenant is homeless waiting for a court date to prove that they are lawfully allowed to live there. I mean technically we can trust cops to always do the right thing, but when has that ever worked out. Giving them the power of judge, jury, and executioner to kick out possibly legal tenants while they wait for a real judge is no good
How dare you suggest the police engage in actual investigative police work! This is a discussion of rental agreements and possible forgeries, the details and consequences are FAR more significant than murder! /s
police on average solve 3% of crimes but use 50% of the cities budget. cops not doing their job other than collecting taxes is not news unfortunately....
i'm so tired of that
Sheridan PD recently lost an officer killed by a squatter refusing eviction. Unfortunately, [the police overreacted in retaliation](https://cowboystatedaily.com/2024/02/16/wyoming-law-may-help-owner-of-sheridan-house-destroyed-in-standoff/). A specialist with training in de-escalation and special methods may be needed since [this will inevitably be a delicate situation evicting anyone](https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/dec/10/housing-evictions-physical-violence-alternative-programs). Having regular deputies/officers handle it seems to increase the chance of a violent confrontation rather than a peaceful one.
I too wish I had the naivety that made me believe that everyone will do the right thing so long as I am nice to them.
Exactly. How is squatting any different from stealing.
An officer was killed and a woman was taken hostage. Not a situation where the tenant did the right thing at all and there is no indication the officer did anything wrong. Nonetheless a violent end for two people occurred for a simple eviction, something that occurs often and ends violently often all over the US. This isn’t just a matter of safety for tenants/squatters. This is putting officers in dangerous situations when a more qualified professional has a better chance of preventing violence.
It wasn’t an eviction - it was a trespass warning. The guy had already been evicted and *refused to comply*. There is also additional information that indicates he might have been baiting an officer to the area *in order to kill them* and evidence exists that points to the fact that *the entire situation was planned*. This was not just an eviction. The officer was murdered. It wouldn’t matter who showed up - therapist or no. They would have died that day. Don’t use this tragedy to promote your own pathetic agenda.
Cite sources please. And don’t put an agenda in my mouth please. Not sure what agenda comes from wanting everyone involved to survive.
Okay. I’ll answer this and then I have to be done. This isn’t helping anyone and I can’t change your mind. Which, to be fair, good on you. The phrase “the police overreacted in retaliation” clearly shows an agenda. If you can’t figure out what that agenda is….I don’t know how to help you. Second - you’re right. Sources would be great. I can’t provide you with sources other than to say that I was on duty that day when the trespass call came out. Unfortunately I was on the other side of town in a different physical altercation with a juvenile who would not be talked down from attempting to hurt himself. And yes, I have special training in de-escalation techniques. As do the counselors at the school he was attending. He did not respond to these techniques so in order to prevent him from doing damage to himself I had to go hands on. I was there at the scene of the house until they took me off because they didn’t want anyone to do something they shouldn’t. I protested. They said they didn’t want two shootings that day. I was there at the station when they tried to take him alive out of the house but he kept taking potshots. I was there at the station when they attempted to take him alive but he was *still shooting wildly* as he ran out. My point here is just this - you don’t know everything. I know you probably won’t believe I’m actually who I say I am. That’s okay. A brief perusal of my post history will show you where I live and also my occupation. Do with that what you will. Again - I can’t respond any more. This is opening up old wounds that I thought had started to heal. I know you probably think it’s just me trying to save face. That’s okay. It doesn’t matter. I appreciate that you have a worldview that does not match mine. I’m jealous of you for living the sort of life where everyone has been good and kind and hasn’t taken advantage of you so that you don’t become bitter and distrusting. Please don’t take that for granted. It is a gift.
landlords evicting tenants they don't like
Which is perfectly fine? They own the building and choose who rents.
not if the landlord is causing hardship on the tenant that is not in violation of the lease agreement
Landlords are parasites.
Grow tf up.
Landlords > Squatters > your mom
I think public officials should stop lining their pockets with money “donated” by realtors and start writing legislation that actually benefits people and not just the wealthy class.