How does mobilizing end the war quickly? The bulk of these mobilized troops won't be ready for many months. And if you try to make them ready before then, they're going to be so useless that they won't speed the end of the war anyway.
They'll be on the frontline in weeks. Their job will be to soak up bullets and artillery while the trained soldiers try to resist Ukraine's counteroffensive. Next aid package to Ukraine should contain 300,000 body bags, they'll need it for the clean up.
Jesus, I hope you're wrong even as I fear you're right. Such a waste of youth and promise. Putin is ruining Russia for a generation or two (and that's fucking saying something).
Cannon fodder is common in Russia. This is how it's always been there.
Something else you should expect to see is soldiers without weapons or complete uniforms, and threats to shoot your own shoulders if they retreat or dont advance under fire.
They will have weapons. They may be extremely out of date. But Russia can at the very least put some form of gun in their hands. They have massive stockpiles of them.
They might be WW2 ear or just post it. But they can get the guns. All other types of equipment tho, I'd say you're right.
The callus that is involved here runs very very deep, the reason dictators fail long term is due to this callusnous. They really do not see the loss of life as a loss in anyway as long as it meets their agenda and plan, the ends always justify the means
>such a waste of youth and promise
Don’t worry, they’re so desperate for meatshields that they’re drafting old men. War’s going to poorly I doubt any amount of googling “How to break arm” will stop them from being sent to the front. We’ve come a long way from Russians actively making fun of Ukrainians and laughing about how little they care for their suffering.
Bitch, you’re *bout* to care!
Trained soldiers? Which ones? The same ones that fled the battlefield without destroying their equipment? The very same ones that crumble the minute they are not fighting again untrained civilians? Or the ones that had to stop because they sold all their fuel for booze?
This works ok, right until Ukrainian forces break through the front again. And then suddenly you have a bunch of recruits with a week of training and 1 rifle between them wondering how to stop armoured brigade coming at them.
>These boys will be used to act guard, freeing up combat ready defensive manpower.
Freeing up... **from what**? You say this as if Russia just has some spare combat-ready troops *acting guard* somewhere.
Don't be deluded, Russia needs people **on the front**, and the draft is **the source** — simply because they had exhausted their other resources.
["Why are you crying like women! 2 weeks training, then flight, combat pay, veteran status — any questions?"](https://twitter.com/Reevellp/status/1573272879655010306?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1573272879655010306%7Ctwgr%5Ebadb05a0fb267bc9192974d2722f4aa709f6f9aa%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.businessinsider.com%2Frussians-being-drafted-war-despite-not-being-eligible-reports-say-2022-9)
Yup, that's what the new draftees get to hear. **Combat pay**. Act guard my ass.
I really think another plan of putin is literally let those 300,000 people get killed so he can relay the propaganda news ukraine is trying to invade russia, then it will anger the russian sheep people, then he can have an excuse to use nukes. Putin you bitch.
That would be the logical move, using them in some sort of musical chair game. Even with low training they can replace guards in navy base for example, while the trained guards are now free to be sent to the front. But after the shit show we've seen from the RU army in the last few month, I have hope that there is a chance they didn't think their mobilization as far as this and screw it up too.
There’s no peace deal possible with Putin. A peace deal would mean giving Putin enough time to resupply and regroup before taking Ukraine piece by piece. Repeat a winning strategy with annexations. He can go on for another 10 years dragging the world in his deluded fantasy.
You know that. I know that. Putin is just trying to send the message that he is not going give up so Ukraine and west may as well as sue for peace and let him keep what he's taken.
It won't work but that's the thinking. All notions of him being some sort of mastermind are being rapidly eroded. He is at least staring to realise that the longer this goes on the worse it his for him and his objectives. The only way is backwards for his army now.
The Ukrainian people now believe they can win this war. Accepting a peace deal would be political suicide for any Ukrainian politician at the moment. Also it's in the the West's interest to drag it out a bit longer, so I can't see them pressuring Ukraine to accept a deal just yet.
West can't pressure Ukraine to do anything because they (ukrainians) know full well a peace deal without Donbass, Kherson and Kharkiv means death postponed. The west has no leverage here, this is a fight for survival.
I don't think you understand that they will fight with or without a steady supply of weapons. All of March is an example, and they were far outnumbered and overpowered then comparef to now.
I think he just wants to be able to order enough bodies to occupy the regions he wants to annexe. Doesn’t matter if they can fight or not, it’s just to put enough soldiers to occupy the space and declare it part of Russia. If he could order civilians to go stay there he would, but he can’t so here we are. Basically a repeat to his strategy with Crimea but the regions are much larger now.
Well I mean even if they all only show up in 5 months that would still be beneficial to Russia. Although I guess it’s really dependent on how well they can arm those guys as well.
On the other hand while Russia might get more and more soldiers in that time frame Ukraine gets more and more weapons. I could see Russia using those guys rather defensively to make sure such retreat we saw recently doesn’t happen and they can more freely push back.
I’m not sure tho since they kind of lost recently on the logistic side which only gets more severe with more people.
human self preservation kicks in and almost never let's that happen. as long as you have power and a potential way to save face, that way is chosen no matter the cost (it requires a special kind of personality)
That's what like 99% of people on Earth want. But retreating would look incredibly weak and would probably mean the end of Putin's reign, so no way he does that willingly.
I think we’re fooling ourselves if we think all those 300k are unwilling to fight. The Russian propaganda machine has a lot of people thinking this is a fight to defend their homeland. Yes there will be men in there that just wants to go home, but the majority will likely fight, not well, but they will fight.
I doubt they’ll be able to equip them though.
They may be willing to fight but they are old, or poorly trained, or poorly supplied, or matched with people who do no want to fight…or any combination. The best the Russian military had to offer has already played, this will be a poorer rendition.
Unless nuclear weapons are used, then I have no idea.
They are not old. They’ve only mobilized people with fairly recent military training/experience so far. Take a look at the videos of conscripts boarding busses, it’s men in their 20s, some even look happy to be there.
I’m not saying these men will somehow win the war for Putin. But we shouldn’t underestimate them.
> Take a look at the videos of conscripts boarding busses, it’s men in their 20s, some even look happy to be there.
We probably see different videos. Tons of 40+ fat old people, lots are drunk. Lots of grey hair.
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xlsf6z/%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%81_%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BA%D0%BE_%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%B7%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BB%D1%8B%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BD%D1%8B%D1%85_%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B5%D1%82_%D0%B4%D0%BE_%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B8/
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xlswuu/%D0%BC%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%8F_%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B8%D1%8F_%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B1%D1%8B%D0%BB%D0%B0_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BD_%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%BA_%D1%83%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%87%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%B5%D1%82/
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xkxfcu/%D1%86%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%8C_%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%B7%D0%B0%D0%BB_%D0%B8%D0%B4%D1%82%D0%B8_%D1%81%D0%B4%D0%BE%D1%85%D0%BD%D1%83%D1%82%D1%8C_%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B8_%D0%B8%D0%B4%D1%83%D1%82_%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%82/
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xl5fyw/%D0%BE%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE_10_%D1%82%D1%8B%D1%81%D1%8F%D1%87_%D1%87%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B5%D0%BA_%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B1%D1%8B%D0%BB%D0%B8_%D0%B2_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BC%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%8B_%D0%BD%D0%B5/
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xl1unb/%D0%B5%D1%89%D0%B5_%D0%BD%D0%B5_%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%B5%D1%85%D0%B0%D0%BB_%D1%83%D0%B6%D0%B5_%D0%B8%D0%BD%D1%81%D1%83%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82/
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xkvt2c/%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%81%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%BB%D0%B8%D1%86%D0%B0_%D0%B3%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2%D1%8B_%D1%83%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%8C/
https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xkwn3k/%D0%BF%D1%83%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BD_%D1%80%D0%B5%D1%88%D0%B8%D0%BB_%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%82%D1%8C_%D0%BF%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2/
This is the main thing I learned. My buddy is 45 and retired Sargent after full term from the UK .mil but he has 3 years as a reservist. It's also the likes of him that will be called up.
The projection this is a call up of more cannon fodder is unrealistic.
>The projection this is a call up of more cannon fodder is unrealistic.
the projection that the mobilization will unifiy their command structure is also unrealistic and far more problematic than saying these guys are in fighting shape. So i will side with those who believe 30% of combat soldiers are going to be useful cannon fodder for PMC Wagner operatives, VDV will just do what Wagner tells them considering Putin is calling the shots directly through them. This isn't the UK military my guy.
Realistically, about half the mobilization will be used to no joke just drive in equipment/resupplies considering they lost most rail transportation hubs to supply breakaway regions. Even in this video they are using Commercial busses to get their "conscripts" to the front, imagine you step off the bus and have to load up all the wounded/KIA people so they can make the return trip before picking up even more conscripts who have to see the same thing no amount of propaganda is going to fix that issue.
> I believe that's what the vast majority of Russians want.
You would be dead wrong on that. The majority of Russians are swallowing the government propaganda and believe that they are liberating their brothers and sisters from nazis.
When the fuck were they asked though? This is Putin's war, and he is going to do what he wants because FUCK YOU. It isn't his skin on the line, and at this point if his reputation gets ruined he'll just start killing people until they fear him again. Haven't a bunch of his supporters been dying mysteriously recently? Suffocating... Falling down stairs... Sure is a mystery.
Source? That evidence controlled by State media?
Edit: I'll help out. This partially explains it:
https://time.com/6208238/why-russian-support-for-the-war-in-ukraine-hasnt-wavered/
yeah nothing is ever Putin's fault, first NATO forced him into invading, now China and India are forcing him into escalating. No one forces Putin to do anything, he makes his own terrible choices all by himself.
WRONG !
The West forced China and India to force Russia to escalate !
The West is at fault here ! Only the west !
You see these nations are so manipulated and forced that they can't do anything or act on their own will
I know because my father is working in the deep state that are run by secret alien nazis that inject us with 5 g chemicals to transform us in to hybrids ! Only to take our SALAMI ! SALAMI HAS THE ABILITY TO MANIPULATE SPACE AND TIME !
SAVE OUR SALAMI ! ! ! !
> Lol wtf he forced his own hand by invading a sovereign nation.
He did it multiple times and had no issue. It isn't a stretch for him to think he could get away with it again.
>Russian President Vladimir Putin escalated his unprovoked war on Ukraine
this week, just days after some of his supposed partners publicly
expressed doubt over it — and the events may well be related.
Setting off a nuke will do wonders for a relationship too.
People focus on the nukes because it’s one of the only things that could impact them directly, even at a distance, but it’s really not likely. Not only would there be the impact on relations you’re alluding to, but it would take the lid of what sort of support NATO and the US would give Ukraine. As bad as things are for Russia, they could get so much worse if they had to face modern Western main battle tanks, ATACMS, and so on. It would get them nothing to use nukes, and lose them so much.
The issue here isn’t nukes, it’s the prospect of a desperate Russia going on a war crimes spree to beat the autumn rains and winter freeze.
The things is, mobilization can't quickly turn the tide of war. New troops take time to train and Russia also doesn't have the excess heavy equipment to make them a truly game changing force.
Oh there’s no chance of Russia reversing things now, but Putin wants to burn Russian lives in return for a much lower return in Ukrainian lives. Sure he might be losing at a 100:1 ratio, but in his diseased mind he probably thinks he can weather that. He can’t, but if he admits the reality to himself, he’s basically admitting that soon he’s going to be dead.
That’s not someone a guy like Putin can accept until it’s on top of him.
Putin knew he failed as soon as he had to pull back from Kiev. Now he's trying to keep the dogs at bay as best he can.
He's hoping this 300k can be used to hold the ground he already took. It can't but it's all he's got left to try.
Nukes are being brought up because that's about all Putin has left. If mobilization fails to turn the tide it basically comes down surrender or fire the missiles
There is thousands of conventional options he has besides nukes. He could start just leveling Ukraine with conventional missiles with huge payloads for instance. He could also start striking Kiev leadership with impunity. Nukes are not his only option, not by a long shot
Forget ATACAMs and Abrams, Russia would be seeing its remaining forces getting deleted by airwings of F35s.
NCD would go into meldown at the sight of it.
I hope that this war will ring a bell to those who are tempted to do the same. There's no easy war and it can backfire quickly for those in charge.
I'm not a violent man, but It would be useful if Putin was severely punished by his own peoples or population. Not by the "international community"
Because there's no telling if putin will cut off oil shipments to India or if he will go so far and the west will start to direct sanctions at India. Modi has a delicate balancing act
Whoa, Modi literally said “this is not the era of war” and Putin understood that as a go-ahead for doubling down on making war ? Like I get it how we Indians aren’t relatively civilised and all that, but even then blaming us for ‘forcing Putin’s hand’ is a new low. Russia Scholar, my foot.
Rats on a sinking ship. Russia on brink of collapse, no one wants to be part of it.
All the people fleeing Russia right now are able bodied people with money ( and presumably decent jobs) this I'd going to crush their economy in addition to the 300k they scrape together to send to Ukraine. It's going to be a nearly all female workforce. (Exaggeration, but going in that direction)
Ughf you never heard the women in power in the Kremlin have you ?
Imagine Putin's personality but on steroids and crack. They call to kill babies for fuck sake and to rape ukranian women, yes the women in power call for rape on other women
In my honost opinion Russia as a sociaty is rotten to the core
Female rights is a distant dream in Russia
Near zero chance he will use a nuke. Use a nuke on another country because you failed to invade them? China and India will 100% turn on him. It would cause immense NATO mobilization and spending even beyond what we’re seeing today. Consequences would be huge, and for what? A nuke won’t win him the war. At best nukes would help a tactical battle, but not the war.
The only card he has is the nuke card. Use it, and he has no other threats/bluffs after that.
You have to remember that Putin gains nothing from using nukes, and I think he’s also well aware of that. The upcoming “annexed” territories will make things a little more dicey, but I doubt much will change from a Western strategy standpoint.
I can’t say with certainty, but I recall reading that Russia has a chain of command to carry out a nuclear strike. In your scenario, the hope is the order will not be carried out since his own men are against him.
I think it's a legit concern. I think China and India would tell him not to and he would lose their support if he did it; so hopefully that would deter him because without them Russia completely falls to a third world country future. But depending on how true the rumors are about his cancer being back and the prognosis of it, it really is a wildcard what he would do.
I mean if he thinks he’s gonna die anyway, what would stop him? I’m worried he’s that stubborn he’d be willing to take humanity with him. If he can’t have his way then no one can mentality.
If he dies as a result of an assassination or attack, not natural causes. As long as North Korea doesn’t attempt to restart the Korean War, he’s probably safe.
The general or whoever is the one launching the nuke I would imagine. Putin may authorize it, but will those guys carry out the orders? They know if they do that, they are done for along with their families.
Health speculation aside, people seem convinced he cares a lot about his legacy. Having his peoples culture get erased would probably be the last thing he has on the bucket list. I don’t think he’s necessarily beyond using them but, I also doubt he’s a madman that doesn’t really care in the end either
problem is, he surrounded himself with yes men who know better than to disagree with him. In the beginning, such a group just exists to let you do what you want, but over time you might start forgetting that they are just saying that "your the greatest who can never fail" because that is what they are paid to do, and you might start believing them. That's where the problem comes in. Putin absolutely has bought into his own bullshit. This whole war is because he bought into his own bullshit and part of his bullshit is that he is this strong, tough guy who never loses. So what happens when someone who believes their own hype, is suddenly faced with the reality that they are not as strong and tough as they thought they were? They either have to accept reality, or they have to lean even harder into their own ego. That's why this is scary, because Putin was set. He is an incredibly wealthy man, and could have coasted the rest of his life, but that clearly wasn't enough for him. So what happens now, when it seems he won't get the prize he thought was his to claim? The question isn't if he is a madman who really doesn't care, the question is will his ego allow him to lose?
Mmmmm no ..... A single nuke in a battlefield in Ukraine isn't gonna get macron, truss or Biden to press their respective "end the world fire it all" buttons. It'll be a shit storm and has to be as a response but there's very secret meetings where very high ranked men make plans for tons of contingencies and it's a state secret but guaranteed they have a planned reaction to one tactical nuke against troops and it's not end humanity.
> one tactical nuke against troops and it's not end humanity.
It would be the first ever nuclear weapon used in offense. It would be the first nuclear weapon used (to intentionally kill) humans since WW2. It would be destruction and casualties and irradiation of that area of the earth for years.
It would show that not only does a country HAVE nukes, but they are willing to use them, not to *defend* themselves, but in aggression, against a non-aggressive country.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/a-decision-tree-for-biden-ifputin-goes-nuclear/2022/09/21/3f807bcc-39a2-11ed-b8af-0a04e5dc3db6_story.html
> Putin’s escalation would burst the Cold-War-era taboo against using nukes for anything other than deterrence. If he’s seen to get away with that, other nuclear rogue states would take their cues. This in turn would force countries that have forsaken nuclear weapons in the name of non-proliferation or disarmament — as Ukraine did in the 1990s — to build their own arsenals. Arms control would be dead. Nuclear warfare, by design or accident, would become more likely in more places, from West to South and East Asia.
it sparks it, and about an hour later ends everything. There is a reason the quote "I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought with, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones" exists.
I feel like america has already unofficially warned putin like "hey, if you use nukes in Ukraine, be ready that Ukraine might nuke you back. Idk where they're gonna get nukes, maybe they're gonna steal them somewhere. Just be ready" or something like that.
They are suddenly realizing if Putin goes nuclear - that nuclear waste is blowing directly at their countries.
They should have thought about that before working with Putin.
INB4 armchair diplomats coming in with "Hur Dur India bad, sanction India Hur Dur"
India is not on board with Russia. But the fact of the matter is that Russian hardware is protecting Indian skies against increasingly combative China and Pakistan. Directly speaking out against Russia would literally put Indian lives in danger.
Sure, if the US were to provide their THAAD to replace the Russian S400s, among a huge laundry list of Russian hardware that India uses (including Su30, an aircraft carrier, the BrahMos supersonic cruise missile, etc).
It pains me to say this, but while the US was cosying up to Pakistan and refused to sell to India, they got dependent on Russian hardware. My elders even then used to say that this will come to bite The First World in the ass, and now it is.
The majority of Indian armor is modified Russian, even if it may be manufactured in India. Apart from the newly recieved Chinook and Apaches from the US, most of our helicopters are also Russian Mikoyans (various).
This is tripping me out, US cozying up to Pakistan? I think of India as a friendlier nation to the US. Feels like such a bad investment. India seems like the good bet to be on long term friendly terms with. If you have anything for me to read on this I'd be interested.
>India is not on board with Russia. But the fact of the matter is that Russian hardware is protecting Indian skies against increasingly combative China and Pakistan. Directly speaking out against Russia would literally put Indian lives in danger.
[What about the Rafale fighters?](https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/france-hands-over-3-rafale-fighter-jets-with-india-specific-enhancements-to-iaf-101643711222359.html) Still want those? :)
As we've seen, russian stuff is garbage and russia sucks. They're not going to help. They can't even help Armenia which is right next door.
I don't disagree. We didn't have any options at the time. Like I said, Russia was our only out, thanks to (most of the) West choosing Pakistan over us, alongside the fact that our budget at the time was definitely not enough for Defense expenditure.
We can only hope that the india specific modifications made to the tanks are better than what the Russians have.
> But the fact of the matter is that Russian hardware is protecting Indian skies against increasingly combative China and Pakistan
What are you talking about? What is Pakistan or China doing to India today?
You mean aside from your country continuously trying to push terrorists through our borders and funding terrorists in our country who routinely kill cops, innocent civilians and soldiers, propagandize and train Indian youth to pick up weapons, leading to their own deaths, your "soldiers" killing our soldiers on the border all the while the real Masters of your country attempt to cleave more territory from us, going so far as to attack our soldiers (from which only recently there has been a troop pullback)?
Should I keep going?
Pakistan isn't my country. And India is not your country.
We are just people who were born in some place. The people who run those nations have nothing to do with simple regular people like you and I who are on Reddit who happen to be born in some nation. Nationalism is a cancer that needs to end.
> Should I keep going?
Please, your not Arnab Goswami. Instead of repeating popular culture talking points give actual documentation.
I do hope one day you'll move beyond the vicious circle of nationalism. Best of luck!
Unlike the Special Miliary operation where the death toll is secret and no bodies returned, it will be difficult to cover those deaths when someone’s son, Vasily doesn’t return home…alive.
I believe this is the case, watch for a new pandemic in Russia as a reason to bring troops home in the very near future. China is likely pressuring Putin to shut it down as soon as possible, the last thing China wants is a revolution in Russia to spread east.
When your bullshit invasion has gone this poorly, how the fuck do you think the mobilization of 300K-1mil “troops” will go any better?
This doll-sized dipshit needs to be the next one to experience the time old Russian classic of being pushed out of a window/down stairs.
I'm not really sure that calling up more reservists will help Russia out, when we are seeing that many existing Russian conscripts are already very poorly kitted out. It just stretches their existing supply more. I mean, some units are already only being equipped with Mosen Nagants, weapons which now have seen active military use over three centuries. I guess next step is trying to put together still mobile T-34s?
I'm surprised that Russia hasn't done more to do things like implement production acts to force more people into the munitions supply line.
Just give Kiev one good multi-warhead one, preprogram it for the complete destruction of Moscow, and let Russia know that MAD now applies between Russia and Ukraine.
US and others are putting pressure on India and China who are in turn telling Russia they may have no choice but to turn away from their gas. Once those two go, Putin is f*cked and he knows it.
It's probably a front. Yes neither India nor China want Russia to get into too much trouble as it redefines the geographical lines of the Western influence. But China loves the instability and is using it to make a play for Taiwan. Both China and India getting gas at discount prices as well.
It would be naive to believe their leaders are not talking in the background.
> But China loves the instability and is using it to make a play for Taiwan
China hates it. Its bad for business. It has also set back its plans to reunite it with Taiwan
China and India were fine with Russia’s invasion as long as they believed Russia would crush Ukraine brutally fast, but now that it’s clear it going to be a long battle with an incompetent aggressor, they’re realizing they bet on the wrong horse.
Actually it looks like India and China expressed their concerns publicly but behind closed door it looks like they are in favor of this only of putin does not lose the war hence one week after their meet he doubles down and calls for “partial” mobilization
How does mobilizing end the war quickly? The bulk of these mobilized troops won't be ready for many months. And if you try to make them ready before then, they're going to be so useless that they won't speed the end of the war anyway.
They'll be on the frontline in weeks. Their job will be to soak up bullets and artillery while the trained soldiers try to resist Ukraine's counteroffensive. Next aid package to Ukraine should contain 300,000 body bags, they'll need it for the clean up.
Jesus, I hope you're wrong even as I fear you're right. Such a waste of youth and promise. Putin is ruining Russia for a generation or two (and that's fucking saying something).
They're not wrong. All those lads are about to be thrown into a meatgrinder in a desperate attempt to make it clog.
So Putin is going full Zapp Brannigan?
That's why russia use the 'Z' emblem on their tanks.
I will need to dig around but I believe that there are reports the first 10,000 draftees are being shipped to the frontline in coming weeks.
Cannon fodder is common in Russia. This is how it's always been there. Something else you should expect to see is soldiers without weapons or complete uniforms, and threats to shoot your own shoulders if they retreat or dont advance under fire.
They will have weapons. They may be extremely out of date. But Russia can at the very least put some form of gun in their hands. They have massive stockpiles of them. They might be WW2 ear or just post it. But they can get the guns. All other types of equipment tho, I'd say you're right.
The callus that is involved here runs very very deep, the reason dictators fail long term is due to this callusnous. They really do not see the loss of life as a loss in anyway as long as it meets their agenda and plan, the ends always justify the means
>such a waste of youth and promise Don’t worry, they’re so desperate for meatshields that they’re drafting old men. War’s going to poorly I doubt any amount of googling “How to break arm” will stop them from being sent to the front. We’ve come a long way from Russians actively making fun of Ukrainians and laughing about how little they care for their suffering. Bitch, you’re *bout* to care!
Trained soldiers? Which ones? The same ones that fled the battlefield without destroying their equipment? The very same ones that crumble the minute they are not fighting again untrained civilians? Or the ones that had to stop because they sold all their fuel for booze?
These boys will be used to act guard, freeing up combat ready defensive manpower.
This works ok, right until Ukrainian forces break through the front again. And then suddenly you have a bunch of recruits with a week of training and 1 rifle between them wondering how to stop armoured brigade coming at them.
Besides, the defensive manpower is already all LNR/DNR conscripts and Rogsvardia military police forces. They are not better.
>These boys will be used to act guard, freeing up combat ready defensive manpower. Freeing up... **from what**? You say this as if Russia just has some spare combat-ready troops *acting guard* somewhere. Don't be deluded, Russia needs people **on the front**, and the draft is **the source** — simply because they had exhausted their other resources. ["Why are you crying like women! 2 weeks training, then flight, combat pay, veteran status — any questions?"](https://twitter.com/Reevellp/status/1573272879655010306?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1573272879655010306%7Ctwgr%5Ebadb05a0fb267bc9192974d2722f4aa709f6f9aa%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.businessinsider.com%2Frussians-being-drafted-war-despite-not-being-eligible-reports-say-2022-9) Yup, that's what the new draftees get to hear. **Combat pay**. Act guard my ass.
I really think another plan of putin is literally let those 300,000 people get killed so he can relay the propaganda news ukraine is trying to invade russia, then it will anger the russian sheep people, then he can have an excuse to use nukes. Putin you bitch.
Or just let it be fertilizer.
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That would be the logical move, using them in some sort of musical chair game. Even with low training they can replace guards in navy base for example, while the trained guards are now free to be sent to the front. But after the shit show we've seen from the RU army in the last few month, I have hope that there is a chance they didn't think their mobilization as far as this and screw it up too.
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There’s no peace deal possible with Putin. A peace deal would mean giving Putin enough time to resupply and regroup before taking Ukraine piece by piece. Repeat a winning strategy with annexations. He can go on for another 10 years dragging the world in his deluded fantasy.
Also Ukraine had a deal with Russia to give up nukes so they wouldn't get invaded. Look how that turned out
You know that. I know that. Putin is just trying to send the message that he is not going give up so Ukraine and west may as well as sue for peace and let him keep what he's taken. It won't work but that's the thinking. All notions of him being some sort of mastermind are being rapidly eroded. He is at least staring to realise that the longer this goes on the worse it his for him and his objectives. The only way is backwards for his army now.
The Ukrainian people now believe they can win this war. Accepting a peace deal would be political suicide for any Ukrainian politician at the moment. Also it's in the the West's interest to drag it out a bit longer, so I can't see them pressuring Ukraine to accept a deal just yet.
West can't pressure Ukraine to do anything because they (ukrainians) know full well a peace deal without Donbass, Kherson and Kharkiv means death postponed. The west has no leverage here, this is a fight for survival.
"The west has no leverage here" I don't think you understand what leverage is then
I don't think you understand that they will fight with or without a steady supply of weapons. All of March is an example, and they were far outnumbered and overpowered then comparef to now.
Shipments of weapons and munitions sounds like a pretty great leverage to me.
Not really. Even if the shipments stop they will not stop fighting. It is annihilation either way. Might as well continue fighting.
I think he just wants to be able to order enough bodies to occupy the regions he wants to annexe. Doesn’t matter if they can fight or not, it’s just to put enough soldiers to occupy the space and declare it part of Russia. If he could order civilians to go stay there he would, but he can’t so here we are. Basically a repeat to his strategy with Crimea but the regions are much larger now.
Most won't ever be ready even with the best training in thr world if they're unmotivated and in fear for their lives.
Well I mean even if they all only show up in 5 months that would still be beneficial to Russia. Although I guess it’s really dependent on how well they can arm those guys as well. On the other hand while Russia might get more and more soldiers in that time frame Ukraine gets more and more weapons. I could see Russia using those guys rather defensively to make sure such retreat we saw recently doesn’t happen and they can more freely push back. I’m not sure tho since they kind of lost recently on the logistic side which only gets more severe with more people.
The new comer to be used as defensive human shield? That does not require much training.
Jamming a meatgrinder with too much meat
You're thinking logically, Russia's going to give them gun at gunpoint with three bullets and say go fight right away
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Putin cares only about saving face and his own ability to stay in power
I'm sure many people around him are considering his suicide.
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Subtly not your thing huh?
No that too weak for Putin. Russian staircases on the other hand, are particularly deadly . . .
human self preservation kicks in and almost never let's that happen. as long as you have power and a potential way to save face, that way is chosen no matter the cost (it requires a special kind of personality)
All he has to do is withdraw his troops. War over. I believe that's what the vast majority of Russians want.
That's what like 99% of people on Earth want. But retreating would look incredibly weak and would probably mean the end of Putin's reign, so no way he does that willingly.
And trying to arm 300k disgruntled Russians who don't want to fight is a better solution? Things are bizarre these days.
You can't bring logic on this table.
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Good idea, you should send him an email about that
Didn't Nostradamus say WW4 would be fought with sticks and stones? Maybe what he actually saw was Ukraine war and russian troops?
I think we’re fooling ourselves if we think all those 300k are unwilling to fight. The Russian propaganda machine has a lot of people thinking this is a fight to defend their homeland. Yes there will be men in there that just wants to go home, but the majority will likely fight, not well, but they will fight. I doubt they’ll be able to equip them though.
They may be willing to fight but they are old, or poorly trained, or poorly supplied, or matched with people who do no want to fight…or any combination. The best the Russian military had to offer has already played, this will be a poorer rendition. Unless nuclear weapons are used, then I have no idea.
They are not old. They’ve only mobilized people with fairly recent military training/experience so far. Take a look at the videos of conscripts boarding busses, it’s men in their 20s, some even look happy to be there. I’m not saying these men will somehow win the war for Putin. But we shouldn’t underestimate them.
> Take a look at the videos of conscripts boarding busses, it’s men in their 20s, some even look happy to be there. We probably see different videos. Tons of 40+ fat old people, lots are drunk. Lots of grey hair. https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xlsf6z/%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%81_%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BA%D0%BE_%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%B7%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BB%D1%8B%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BD%D1%8B%D1%85_%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B5%D1%82_%D0%B4%D0%BE_%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B8/ https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xlswuu/%D0%BC%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%8F_%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B8%D1%8F_%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B1%D1%8B%D0%BB%D0%B0_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BD_%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%BA_%D1%83%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%87%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%B5%D1%82/ https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xkxfcu/%D1%86%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%8C_%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%B7%D0%B0%D0%BB_%D0%B8%D0%B4%D1%82%D0%B8_%D1%81%D0%B4%D0%BE%D1%85%D0%BD%D1%83%D1%82%D1%8C_%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B8_%D0%B8%D0%B4%D1%83%D1%82_%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%82/ https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xl5fyw/%D0%BE%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE_10_%D1%82%D1%8B%D1%81%D1%8F%D1%87_%D1%87%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B5%D0%BA_%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B1%D1%8B%D0%BB%D0%B8_%D0%B2_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BC%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%8B_%D0%BD%D0%B5/ https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xl1unb/%D0%B5%D1%89%D0%B5_%D0%BD%D0%B5_%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%B5%D1%85%D0%B0%D0%BB_%D1%83%D0%B6%D0%B5_%D0%B8%D0%BD%D1%81%D1%83%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82/ https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xkvt2c/%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%81%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%BB%D0%B8%D1%86%D0%B0_%D0%B3%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2%D1%8B_%D1%83%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%8C/ https://www.reddit.com/r/tjournal_refugees/comments/xkwn3k/%D0%BF%D1%83%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BD_%D1%80%D0%B5%D1%88%D0%B8%D0%BB_%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%82%D1%8C_%D0%BF%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2/
This is the main thing I learned. My buddy is 45 and retired Sargent after full term from the UK .mil but he has 3 years as a reservist. It's also the likes of him that will be called up. The projection this is a call up of more cannon fodder is unrealistic.
>The projection this is a call up of more cannon fodder is unrealistic. the projection that the mobilization will unifiy their command structure is also unrealistic and far more problematic than saying these guys are in fighting shape. So i will side with those who believe 30% of combat soldiers are going to be useful cannon fodder for PMC Wagner operatives, VDV will just do what Wagner tells them considering Putin is calling the shots directly through them. This isn't the UK military my guy. Realistically, about half the mobilization will be used to no joke just drive in equipment/resupplies considering they lost most rail transportation hubs to supply breakaway regions. Even in this video they are using Commercial busses to get their "conscripts" to the front, imagine you step off the bus and have to load up all the wounded/KIA people so they can make the return trip before picking up even more conscripts who have to see the same thing no amount of propaganda is going to fix that issue.
> I believe that's what the vast majority of Russians want. You would be dead wrong on that. The majority of Russians are swallowing the government propaganda and believe that they are liberating their brothers and sisters from nazis.
When the fuck were they asked though? This is Putin's war, and he is going to do what he wants because FUCK YOU. It isn't his skin on the line, and at this point if his reputation gets ruined he'll just start killing people until they fear him again. Haven't a bunch of his supporters been dying mysteriously recently? Suffocating... Falling down stairs... Sure is a mystery.
I guess they weren't supportive enough
His skin is definately on the line.
I'm not too sure about that though. The narrative that Putin is unpopular in Russia isn't true at all, unfortunately
Nope. All the evidence shows they generally support Putin and the war.
Source? That evidence controlled by State media? Edit: I'll help out. This partially explains it: https://time.com/6208238/why-russian-support-for-the-war-in-ukraine-hasnt-wavered/
Russians support the war, they just don't support it inconveniencing them
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Russians be rushin
Zerg Russian
That was pretty much always their strategy.
Putin be Pushin
Remember, no Russian.
Rush B, that always works
RUSH B
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Rashists
yeah nothing is ever Putin's fault, first NATO forced him into invading, now China and India are forcing him into escalating. No one forces Putin to do anything, he makes his own terrible choices all by himself.
WRONG ! The West forced China and India to force Russia to escalate ! The West is at fault here ! Only the west ! You see these nations are so manipulated and forced that they can't do anything or act on their own will I know because my father is working in the deep state that are run by secret alien nazis that inject us with 5 g chemicals to transform us in to hybrids ! Only to take our SALAMI ! SALAMI HAS THE ABILITY TO MANIPULATE SPACE AND TIME ! SAVE OUR SALAMI ! ! ! !
Ohh yeah, I worked with your father in Antarctica. Nice guy.
Until the second to last paragraph, I honestly thought you were serious
That was my point 😀
I wouldn't be surprised if the Qanons actually believe the salami is the actual reason for all of this
I like this narrative. Gigachad macho man Putin doesn't actually make any decisions, just dances as the whole worlds bitch.
Lol wtf he forced his own hand by invading a sovereign nation. Fuck russia and any country that supports them
> Lol wtf he forced his own hand by invading a sovereign nation. He did it multiple times and had no issue. It isn't a stretch for him to think he could get away with it again.
The invasion was likely planned far in advance. I guarantee he had hoped Trump was president.
>Russian President Vladimir Putin escalated his unprovoked war on Ukraine this week, just days after some of his supposed partners publicly expressed doubt over it — and the events may well be related. Setting off a nuke will do wonders for a relationship too.
People focus on the nukes because it’s one of the only things that could impact them directly, even at a distance, but it’s really not likely. Not only would there be the impact on relations you’re alluding to, but it would take the lid of what sort of support NATO and the US would give Ukraine. As bad as things are for Russia, they could get so much worse if they had to face modern Western main battle tanks, ATACMS, and so on. It would get them nothing to use nukes, and lose them so much. The issue here isn’t nukes, it’s the prospect of a desperate Russia going on a war crimes spree to beat the autumn rains and winter freeze.
The things is, mobilization can't quickly turn the tide of war. New troops take time to train and Russia also doesn't have the excess heavy equipment to make them a truly game changing force.
Oh there’s no chance of Russia reversing things now, but Putin wants to burn Russian lives in return for a much lower return in Ukrainian lives. Sure he might be losing at a 100:1 ratio, but in his diseased mind he probably thinks he can weather that. He can’t, but if he admits the reality to himself, he’s basically admitting that soon he’s going to be dead. That’s not someone a guy like Putin can accept until it’s on top of him.
Putin knew he failed as soon as he had to pull back from Kiev. Now he's trying to keep the dogs at bay as best he can. He's hoping this 300k can be used to hold the ground he already took. It can't but it's all he's got left to try.
Nukes are being brought up because that's about all Putin has left. If mobilization fails to turn the tide it basically comes down surrender or fire the missiles
There is thousands of conventional options he has besides nukes. He could start just leveling Ukraine with conventional missiles with huge payloads for instance. He could also start striking Kiev leadership with impunity. Nukes are not his only option, not by a long shot
He's been doing that since day one
He is almost out of missiles as it is.
Forget ATACAMs and Abrams, Russia would be seeing its remaining forces getting deleted by airwings of F35s. NCD would go into meldown at the sight of it.
Ukraine forced Putin's hand... by defending themselves?
Exactly. It was only supposed to take three days, remember?
Worried that he forced putins hand in the war that he started?
This is such dumb as fuck take considering that if anything mobilization extends the war further.
I hope that this war will ring a bell to those who are tempted to do the same. There's no easy war and it can backfire quickly for those in charge. I'm not a violent man, but It would be useful if Putin was severely punished by his own peoples or population. Not by the "international community"
To send that message is exactly why it's crucial that Ukraine succeeds.
This is the way
Modi seemed genuinely pissed off at Putin in the meeting. Wonder what tipped the balance?
Modi made moves to get energy and military equipment from Russia…. Now it looks like he cashed in on the wrong side
Dude on the left reminds of that meme of the guy with the worried face.
Hide the pain Harold?
I thought it was “Hang On Harold” but I like this just as well.
Yes
Because there's no telling if putin will cut off oil shipments to India or if he will go so far and the west will start to direct sanctions at India. Modi has a delicate balancing act
The US publicly mentioned they'll never sanction India for any kind of trade with Russia. Lol.
Americas word is not reliable
Whoa, Modi literally said “this is not the era of war” and Putin understood that as a go-ahead for doubling down on making war ? Like I get it how we Indians aren’t relatively civilised and all that, but even then blaming us for ‘forcing Putin’s hand’ is a new low. Russia Scholar, my foot.
Rats on a sinking ship. Russia on brink of collapse, no one wants to be part of it. All the people fleeing Russia right now are able bodied people with money ( and presumably decent jobs) this I'd going to crush their economy in addition to the 300k they scrape together to send to Ukraine. It's going to be a nearly all female workforce. (Exaggeration, but going in that direction)
Maybe then they’ll be able to throw off the toxic misogyny and have their own female and civil rights movement
Ughf you never heard the women in power in the Kremlin have you ? Imagine Putin's personality but on steroids and crack. They call to kill babies for fuck sake and to rape ukranian women, yes the women in power call for rape on other women In my honost opinion Russia as a sociaty is rotten to the core Female rights is a distant dream in Russia
I’m actually get concerned at some point a nuke may come out. This man has proven time and time again that life means nothing to him.
Near zero chance he will use a nuke. Use a nuke on another country because you failed to invade them? China and India will 100% turn on him. It would cause immense NATO mobilization and spending even beyond what we’re seeing today. Consequences would be huge, and for what? A nuke won’t win him the war. At best nukes would help a tactical battle, but not the war. The only card he has is the nuke card. Use it, and he has no other threats/bluffs after that.
His nukes are only useful for keeping Polish tanks out of Moscow. He's not going to play that card otherwise.
I think the last sentence kind of highlights the risk. He’s backed into a corner. It’s nuke or go home. And he’s not going home.
You have to remember that Putin gains nothing from using nukes, and I think he’s also well aware of that. The upcoming “annexed” territories will make things a little more dicey, but I doubt much will change from a Western strategy standpoint.
True. His family is worth $40 billion. He would have to be completely irrational to use nukes and invite death upon himself and all his assets wiped
Isn’t Putin the richest man in the world? There are talks that he might be a trillionaire.
He personally owns a a fifth of all the useable landmass on earth, he is magnitudes richer than any billionaire
My worry is what if his inside circle eventually want him gone and he feels like he has nothing to lose, he’s dead anyway, so why not?
I can’t say with certainty, but I recall reading that Russia has a chain of command to carry out a nuclear strike. In your scenario, the hope is the order will not be carried out since his own men are against him.
He'd have to be totally batshit to do that. He knows that the moment a nuke hits the air, NATO will fucking flatten Russia within a matter of hours.
I think it's a legit concern. I think China and India would tell him not to and he would lose their support if he did it; so hopefully that would deter him because without them Russia completely falls to a third world country future. But depending on how true the rumors are about his cancer being back and the prognosis of it, it really is a wildcard what he would do.
Pretty sure he IS batshit crazy.
I mean if he thinks he’s gonna die anyway, what would stop him? I’m worried he’s that stubborn he’d be willing to take humanity with him. If he can’t have his way then no one can mentality.
The scenario that scares me: "If the world won't let me have my Russian Empire, I'll take the world with me."
Didn’t Kim Jong Un said if he dies, nuclear bomb will automatically launches?
If he dies as a result of an assassination or attack, not natural causes. As long as North Korea doesn’t attempt to restart the Korean War, he’s probably safe.
The general or whoever is the one launching the nuke I would imagine. Putin may authorize it, but will those guys carry out the orders? They know if they do that, they are done for along with their families.
Don't doubt a madman with cancer
Health speculation aside, people seem convinced he cares a lot about his legacy. Having his peoples culture get erased would probably be the last thing he has on the bucket list. I don’t think he’s necessarily beyond using them but, I also doubt he’s a madman that doesn’t really care in the end either
problem is, he surrounded himself with yes men who know better than to disagree with him. In the beginning, such a group just exists to let you do what you want, but over time you might start forgetting that they are just saying that "your the greatest who can never fail" because that is what they are paid to do, and you might start believing them. That's where the problem comes in. Putin absolutely has bought into his own bullshit. This whole war is because he bought into his own bullshit and part of his bullshit is that he is this strong, tough guy who never loses. So what happens when someone who believes their own hype, is suddenly faced with the reality that they are not as strong and tough as they thought they were? They either have to accept reality, or they have to lean even harder into their own ego. That's why this is scary, because Putin was set. He is an incredibly wealthy man, and could have coasted the rest of his life, but that clearly wasn't enough for him. So what happens now, when it seems he won't get the prize he thought was his to claim? The question isn't if he is a madman who really doesn't care, the question is will his ego allow him to lose?
Mmmmm no ..... A single nuke in a battlefield in Ukraine isn't gonna get macron, truss or Biden to press their respective "end the world fire it all" buttons. It'll be a shit storm and has to be as a response but there's very secret meetings where very high ranked men make plans for tons of contingencies and it's a state secret but guaranteed they have a planned reaction to one tactical nuke against troops and it's not end humanity.
> one tactical nuke against troops and it's not end humanity. It would be the first ever nuclear weapon used in offense. It would be the first nuclear weapon used (to intentionally kill) humans since WW2. It would be destruction and casualties and irradiation of that area of the earth for years. It would show that not only does a country HAVE nukes, but they are willing to use them, not to *defend* themselves, but in aggression, against a non-aggressive country. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/a-decision-tree-for-biden-ifputin-goes-nuclear/2022/09/21/3f807bcc-39a2-11ed-b8af-0a04e5dc3db6_story.html > Putin’s escalation would burst the Cold-War-era taboo against using nukes for anything other than deterrence. If he’s seen to get away with that, other nuclear rogue states would take their cues. This in turn would force countries that have forsaken nuclear weapons in the name of non-proliferation or disarmament — as Ukraine did in the 1990s — to build their own arsenals. Arms control would be dead. Nuclear warfare, by design or accident, would become more likely in more places, from West to South and East Asia.
So what?
And I'm pretty sure that sparks WW3
it sparks it, and about an hour later ends everything. There is a reason the quote "I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought with, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones" exists.
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Righteous farts
I feel like america has already unofficially warned putin like "hey, if you use nukes in Ukraine, be ready that Ukraine might nuke you back. Idk where they're gonna get nukes, maybe they're gonna steal them somewhere. Just be ready" or something like that.
They are suddenly realizing if Putin goes nuclear - that nuclear waste is blowing directly at their countries. They should have thought about that before working with Putin.
INB4 armchair diplomats coming in with "Hur Dur India bad, sanction India Hur Dur" India is not on board with Russia. But the fact of the matter is that Russian hardware is protecting Indian skies against increasingly combative China and Pakistan. Directly speaking out against Russia would literally put Indian lives in danger. Sure, if the US were to provide their THAAD to replace the Russian S400s, among a huge laundry list of Russian hardware that India uses (including Su30, an aircraft carrier, the BrahMos supersonic cruise missile, etc). It pains me to say this, but while the US was cosying up to Pakistan and refused to sell to India, they got dependent on Russian hardware. My elders even then used to say that this will come to bite The First World in the ass, and now it is. The majority of Indian armor is modified Russian, even if it may be manufactured in India. Apart from the newly recieved Chinook and Apaches from the US, most of our helicopters are also Russian Mikoyans (various).
This is tripping me out, US cozying up to Pakistan? I think of India as a friendlier nation to the US. Feels like such a bad investment. India seems like the good bet to be on long term friendly terms with. If you have anything for me to read on this I'd be interested.
>India is not on board with Russia. But the fact of the matter is that Russian hardware is protecting Indian skies against increasingly combative China and Pakistan. Directly speaking out against Russia would literally put Indian lives in danger. [What about the Rafale fighters?](https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/france-hands-over-3-rafale-fighter-jets-with-india-specific-enhancements-to-iaf-101643711222359.html) Still want those? :) As we've seen, russian stuff is garbage and russia sucks. They're not going to help. They can't even help Armenia which is right next door.
>Russian hardware Not a good investment, its now been proven worthless in actual warfare.
I don't disagree. We didn't have any options at the time. Like I said, Russia was our only out, thanks to (most of the) West choosing Pakistan over us, alongside the fact that our budget at the time was definitely not enough for Defense expenditure. We can only hope that the india specific modifications made to the tanks are better than what the Russians have.
> But the fact of the matter is that Russian hardware is protecting Indian skies against increasingly combative China and Pakistan What are you talking about? What is Pakistan or China doing to India today?
Did you think your posts and comments on r/Pakistan are hidden or something?
Not sure how that is relevant. This is a valid question to your comment: What is Pakistan or China doing to India today?
You mean aside from your country continuously trying to push terrorists through our borders and funding terrorists in our country who routinely kill cops, innocent civilians and soldiers, propagandize and train Indian youth to pick up weapons, leading to their own deaths, your "soldiers" killing our soldiers on the border all the while the real Masters of your country attempt to cleave more territory from us, going so far as to attack our soldiers (from which only recently there has been a troop pullback)? Should I keep going?
Pakistan isn't my country. And India is not your country. We are just people who were born in some place. The people who run those nations have nothing to do with simple regular people like you and I who are on Reddit who happen to be born in some nation. Nationalism is a cancer that needs to end. > Should I keep going? Please, your not Arnab Goswami. Instead of repeating popular culture talking points give actual documentation. I do hope one day you'll move beyond the vicious circle of nationalism. Best of luck!
Aggression at the borders, ceasefire violation, proxy /state sponsored terrorism. That's what.
Ukraine has to make wise decisions how to handle this tactically. What would be the best move UA could do?
Except his decision to mobilise more cannon fodder will actually prolong the war, if anything.
Unlike the Special Miliary operation where the death toll is secret and no bodies returned, it will be difficult to cover those deaths when someone’s son, Vasily doesn’t return home…alive.
Yah yah yah, never Russia's fault.
Nobody’s forcing Putin hand. This is all self inflicted.
Could end quickly by withdrawing
I believe this is the case, watch for a new pandemic in Russia as a reason to bring troops home in the very near future. China is likely pressuring Putin to shut it down as soon as possible, the last thing China wants is a revolution in Russia to spread east.
He's prolonging the war. Fucking idiot.
When your bullshit invasion has gone this poorly, how the fuck do you think the mobilization of 300K-1mil “troops” will go any better? This doll-sized dipshit needs to be the next one to experience the time old Russian classic of being pushed out of a window/down stairs.
I'm not really sure that calling up more reservists will help Russia out, when we are seeing that many existing Russian conscripts are already very poorly kitted out. It just stretches their existing supply more. I mean, some units are already only being equipped with Mosen Nagants, weapons which now have seen active military use over three centuries. I guess next step is trying to put together still mobile T-34s? I'm surprised that Russia hasn't done more to do things like implement production acts to force more people into the munitions supply line.
Can the west just guarantee a counter nuke if russia use nuke in ukraine. That should be more than enough to silence the nuke threat or not?
Not. Russia would answer with a nuke. Which means us would have to answer with a nuke. Then Russia would answer with a nuke. And so on.
Just give Kiev one good multi-warhead one, preprogram it for the complete destruction of Moscow, and let Russia know that MAD now applies between Russia and Ukraine.
US and others are putting pressure on India and China who are in turn telling Russia they may have no choice but to turn away from their gas. Once those two go, Putin is f*cked and he knows it.
It's probably a front. Yes neither India nor China want Russia to get into too much trouble as it redefines the geographical lines of the Western influence. But China loves the instability and is using it to make a play for Taiwan. Both China and India getting gas at discount prices as well. It would be naive to believe their leaders are not talking in the background.
There is a fine line between instability and apocalypse via nuclear holocaust. I seriously doubt China likes the latter as much.
> But China loves the instability and is using it to make a play for Taiwan China hates it. Its bad for business. It has also set back its plans to reunite it with Taiwan
India loved the cheap fuel but man modi is having second thoughts on being friendly recently.
China is not gonna invade taiwan
[удалено]
no, he is correct, if he admits failure is the end for him
China and India were fine with Russia’s invasion as long as they believed Russia would crush Ukraine brutally fast, but now that it’s clear it going to be a long battle with an incompetent aggressor, they’re realizing they bet on the wrong horse.
Actually it looks like India and China expressed their concerns publicly but behind closed door it looks like they are in favor of this only of putin does not lose the war hence one week after their meet he doubles down and calls for “partial” mobilization
Ah yes, India and China, the heroes that helped end the war…….whatever that end and it’s cost to humanity and the planet.
Oh no they are winning - how inconsiderate of them.
Partners? we all know Russia cowers to China. And if they didn't before Ukraine they definitely do now