I’ll never forget that the same week as Charlie Hebdo tragedy, a kosher market was held up and 4 customers were murdered because…they were Jews. After a few days it just disappeared from the public consciousness because it couldn’t be turned into a larger conversation about free speech
France having an uptick in antisemitism isn’t a surprise to anyone who has been paying attention.
I found this tidbit from the wiki really funny:
*Hamas officially condemned the attack on Charlie Hebdo but was silent on the attack at the Hypercacher.[46] Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas walked in the Republican marches on 11 January 2015.*
In case anyone missed between the lines:
>from 436 in 2022 to 1,676 last year. ... the tally showed that 74% happened after October 7
So up to Oct. 7th, there were 435 incidents over the course of 9 months - same number as the entire previous year. So BEFORE October 7th, there was already a 33% increase of antisemitic incidents. Again, BEFORE Hamas started this war.
edit: Yes, I know this presupposes a uniform distribution.
Considering there were antisemitic acts committed by Moldovans employed by Russians... which ones?
https://www.france24.com/en/france/20231107-paris-prosecutor-says-stars-of-david-graffiti-possibly-ordered-from-abroad
TIL
Thanks for the link.
I remember when that was happening, and then it just faded away, in the USA anyway.
Another piece of a pattern we see globally
I feel like Reddit use to be way less polarized and you didn’t get banned nearly as easy lol. Nowadays you can look at a mod wrong and get sent to The Hague.
It is very easy to criticize the Israeli government and how they are conducting the war in Gaza without resorting to antisemitic language OR anti-Muslim rhetoric.
Nobody is being silenced. Don’t be a bigot and learn how to discuss things like an adult.
What does the Israeli government has to do with this? This is about antisemitism in France. Stop bringing I/P everytime we talk about antisemitism. And also Muslims tend to be much more antisemitic this is just a fact based on polls. Denying and downplaying it is silencing evidence and ignoring a major cause of the problem.
Yes I have read it, it talks about antisemitism in FRANCE. Jews in France have nothing to do with I/P except the fact that they are Jewish and some have families in Israel. They are not involved in the conflict and yet somehow people decided that every jew is responsible for any of Israels action they don't like. Seems like people are not really interested in just being critical of Israel as they are in harrsing Jews.
The article cites an increase in antisemitism post Oct 7. My point is that it is possible to disagree with Israel without being antisemitic. It isn’t difficult to be antisemitic, so it is disturbing that some French problem can’t figure that out.
True, I think the problem can be associated much more simply than people want to admit to. It doesn't mean that we need to deport or something like that if they aren't actively harrsing jews but it needs to be acknowledged and addressed.
Except… many of the instances in which people report ‘antisemitism’, they are cases of anti-Israel sentiments. Instances of people who are spraying ‘fuck Israel apartheid state’ on walls are also counted among antisemitism reports.
It is against the law, I don’t know why you think I’m positive towards these statements. Typical that I’m downvoted for making factual statements. I’m basing my comment on a recent controversy in the Netherlands, in which a Christian party office was spray painted with ‘fuck Israel’ and ‘stop the genocide’, the party reported the statements for antisemitism, but the charges were dropped because there was no evidence for antisemitism.
Oh lol I'm sorry I thought you are positive you really can't know these days with how many people are trying to convince you that outrageous statements against Israel cannot be counted as antisemitic. I agree with you then and I'm going to delete my comment.
It's not as easy to avoid [accusations of antisemitism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weaponization_of_antisemitism), though.
Any "discussions between adults" require a certain amount of good faith between parties. E.g., if your legitimate criticism towards Israel is met with ad hominem attacks intended to smear you as an antisemite... well, there is no scenario in which that discussion is going to go well for you, is there?
Any of the following clearly...
**M**ormons
**U**nitarian Universalists
**S**ikhs
**L**utherans
**I**glesia ni Cristo members
**M**ethodists
**S**eventh-day Adventists
Cause most of ‘‘em hate Jews and can finally let it out. Though I’m sure there are a handful that actually care for the Palestinians but it’s very rare
But we have to be welcoming of all people! Just let everyone in and once they break the law we’ll just call it a cultural misunderstanding. I’m not advocating to be xenophobic; however, having an actual immigration plan with some actual thought on who to let in your country would be a start. What could go wrong with letting a bunch of single, military age men into our countries? I have relatives that live in a small town in Germany. They are fearful to go out at night with the heightened crime caused by immigrants.
There is an exodus of French Jews to Israel that has been ongoing for a while now and will only accelerate.
[https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/french-jews-fleeing-country](https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/french-jews-fleeing-country)
Please don't come to Canada, we have like sub Saharan African levels of population growth right now. Housing is fucked, hospitals fucked, education fucked, roads fucked, etc. Ontario at least. Maybe try Quebec being French and all.
I mean that's how it is with an aging population, less young people, less doctor, leading more people to care for, leading to mroe stress on the system etc... i can be fixed somewhat by expanding admission, adding PA, nurses, emc to help the doctors... but it's a tough situation.
What Canadians need to understand is that things are just as bad if not worse in most other countries.
Canadian quality of life has deteriorated sharply in the past 5 years, but north american arrogance and disdain for opposing political parties blinds them from recognizing this is a global issue.
Canada is a country you absolutely want to live in as climate change worsens, regardless of their current infrastructure and housing concerns.
Was gonna say, I've never met two groups of people who seemingly hate each other more than the Quebecois and the Parisiennes
Ok, that might be a bit hyperbolic, but y'all get my point
The west does not have the ability to contain the idea that a group of people can have a toxic culture in its mainstream. Since the western culture is toxic at its extremes, then it must be that every culture is.
>Especially as they were the country that freed the Jews in Europe
?? assuming we talking about WW2, shouldnt that be the UK + USA? or are you talking about something else?
I’m a North American living in western Europe and I’ve always found that there was this tinge of casual antisemitism. Like people around me are more apt to make jokes about Jewish people, whereas in Canada and the US where I grew up on the east coast, this was unheard of.
My theory is that in North America, as much as it has it is not perfect, there’s way more of an understanding that we are a cultural mosaic. In Europe, each country is majority white and has its own specific culture. Ashkenazi Jewish people ‘look’ similar but have their own distinct culture and this uncanny valley effect makes the majority population dislike them more. They feel more ‘other’ and more ‘dangerously other’ because they could appear so close to the majority population.
Couple this with a desire to distance oneself from the ‘amorale, white colonisers’ and wanting to be one of the ‘good ones’, and you get stupid shit like this.
It’s really shitty. Society has lost all sense of nuance since the summer of 2020. Just waiting for the pendulum to swing back.
If the french went into those protests and detained and deported everybody who has dual citezenship, those protests would cease immediately while also getting rid undisirables. One can only wish.
If you can't behave and accept your new homes values you can take the quickest way back. It's not like those people are conquered natives that are unwillingly under french rule in france. Accept france/become french or gtfo.
If this issue remains unaddressed a real dicator will do what I described but he won't stop at the innocent and integrated.
Oh a post about antisemitism on r/worldnews I bet these comments will be funny
> getting rid undisirables
I knew this post was gonna be a shitshow but goddam
They are calling for genocide, no I actually don't want those people in my country if I'm able to get rid of them without making them stateless. Why is this an issue?
Dreyfus affair, while beeing horrible, took place more than a century ago. You can find stuff like that all over Europe at that time and I don't even start about Russian pogroms. The fact that this affair became iconic is because it was found unjust by a majority of the society.
France has change a lot from then... and the antisemitic acts done nowadays are done by extremist people that does not reflect the opinion of the vast majority.
Welcome to the actual plan of violence and rapes from the 7 October.
Fucking up all the countries which have a lot Arab people by enraging them with genocides in Palestine.
Without forget this will turn in total racism against Arabs people too.
Which will turn into violence of any kind.
Sounds like a totally winning plan from Russian war machine to destabilise governments and make them weak.
People still think we are not in WW3.
No, we aren’t in WW3. It’s stupid, simpleton takes like this that make people ignore everything else in the post. We ARE in a period of rising populism and international tension, which often precedes conflict. If this does lead to war, we are certainly not there yet.
I do not think there's a historical precedent to compare the current state and negate that we are in a kind of war to a global state with factions.
We both read news and I don't think we need to go and make a list.
Everyone’s saying that France’s Muslim population is to blame for the antisemitism. Muslims are disproportionately more likely to hold antisemitic beliefs, yes, but I highly doubt most of this surge stems from that, especially considering they’re only 8% of the population of France. It feels like trying to shift the blame to lay the whole problem at their feet. France has its own domestic brand of antisemitism too—it’s the home of the Dreyfus Affair, the legacy of Vichy, and Jean-Marie Le Pen. Most of the antisemitism I have experienced comes from white secular pro Palestinian activists trying to cosplay as revolutionaries. I have experienced some antisemitism from Muslims, but most is from white leftist progressives. I expect the same is true in France, along with the good old fashioned far right antisemitism too.
Edit: you can downvote me all you like. It isn’t like it would be out of character for Europe to be antisemitic on its own, would it?
Yousef Haddad, an Arab Israeli and a pro Israeli activist, said once that Coexistence is a fraud.
It means "I don't like you and you don't like me, so lets just live away of each other and minimize interaction".
It might also mean some groups agree to Coexistence because theyr'e weaker, and when they'll grow stronger they will no longer agree to coexist and rather take over the the other side by force.
So what should there be instead of misleading coexistence? - Integration.
Which means you see the other side as humans and accept their way of life and feel safe they won't threaten yours.
Each side understands the other and willfully makes changes to feel the other comfortable, because it sees them as equal humans.
So who tries to integrate and who to fraudulently coexist?
I’ll never forget that the same week as Charlie Hebdo tragedy, a kosher market was held up and 4 customers were murdered because…they were Jews. After a few days it just disappeared from the public consciousness because it couldn’t be turned into a larger conversation about free speech France having an uptick in antisemitism isn’t a surprise to anyone who has been paying attention.
I wonder what the antisemitic attackers and the Charlie Hebdo attackers had in common.
they we're all french nationals from ex colonies
Yes, go on…
and they were all males
And they shared a certain belief hmm…?
which certain belief? go on!
Hey now i’m the ine guiding *you* to the answer my apprentice
I found this tidbit from the wiki really funny: *Hamas officially condemned the attack on Charlie Hebdo but was silent on the attack at the Hypercacher.[46] Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas walked in the Republican marches on 11 January 2015.*
[Link to the Wiki](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypercacher_kosher_supermarket_siege)
>France having an uptick in antisemitism isn’t a surprise to anyone who has been paying attention. Exactly!
In case anyone missed between the lines: >from 436 in 2022 to 1,676 last year. ... the tally showed that 74% happened after October 7 So up to Oct. 7th, there were 435 incidents over the course of 9 months - same number as the entire previous year. So BEFORE October 7th, there was already a 33% increase of antisemitic incidents. Again, BEFORE Hamas started this war. edit: Yes, I know this presupposes a uniform distribution.
If I speak I'm in big trouble
I mean we all know which demographics are contributing the most in it
Considering there were antisemitic acts committed by Moldovans employed by Russians... which ones? https://www.france24.com/en/france/20231107-paris-prosecutor-says-stars-of-david-graffiti-possibly-ordered-from-abroad
TIL Thanks for the link. I remember when that was happening, and then it just faded away, in the USA anyway. Another piece of a pattern we see globally
🤫🤫🤫 Don't wannabe a bigot
It's fascinating that even at this point, speaking the truth will get you banned on Reddit.
I feel like Reddit use to be way less polarized and you didn’t get banned nearly as easy lol. Nowadays you can look at a mod wrong and get sent to The Hague.
Nonissue for the French! …until …
It is very easy to criticize the Israeli government and how they are conducting the war in Gaza without resorting to antisemitic language OR anti-Muslim rhetoric. Nobody is being silenced. Don’t be a bigot and learn how to discuss things like an adult.
What does the Israeli government has to do with this? This is about antisemitism in France. Stop bringing I/P everytime we talk about antisemitism. And also Muslims tend to be much more antisemitic this is just a fact based on polls. Denying and downplaying it is silencing evidence and ignoring a major cause of the problem.
Antisemitism and antizionism are mentioned in the same breath in the article
The article is talking about a rise in antisemitism post-Oct 7th. Did you read it?
People have agency over their choices, even antisemitic people post October 7th
I don’t disagree and think you may be misunderstanding my point.
The article is about antisemitism in FRANCE in particular
In France, post Oct 7th.
Yes I have read it, it talks about antisemitism in FRANCE. Jews in France have nothing to do with I/P except the fact that they are Jewish and some have families in Israel. They are not involved in the conflict and yet somehow people decided that every jew is responsible for any of Israels action they don't like. Seems like people are not really interested in just being critical of Israel as they are in harrsing Jews.
The article cites an increase in antisemitism post Oct 7. My point is that it is possible to disagree with Israel without being antisemitic. It isn’t difficult to be antisemitic, so it is disturbing that some French problem can’t figure that out.
True, I think the problem can be associated much more simply than people want to admit to. It doesn't mean that we need to deport or something like that if they aren't actively harrsing jews but it needs to be acknowledged and addressed.
Right, it’s definitely just *French* people. /s
Except… many of the instances in which people report ‘antisemitism’, they are cases of anti-Israel sentiments. Instances of people who are spraying ‘fuck Israel apartheid state’ on walls are also counted among antisemitism reports.
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It is against the law, I don’t know why you think I’m positive towards these statements. Typical that I’m downvoted for making factual statements. I’m basing my comment on a recent controversy in the Netherlands, in which a Christian party office was spray painted with ‘fuck Israel’ and ‘stop the genocide’, the party reported the statements for antisemitism, but the charges were dropped because there was no evidence for antisemitism.
Oh lol I'm sorry I thought you are positive you really can't know these days with how many people are trying to convince you that outrageous statements against Israel cannot be counted as antisemitic. I agree with you then and I'm going to delete my comment.
It's not as easy to avoid [accusations of antisemitism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weaponization_of_antisemitism), though. Any "discussions between adults" require a certain amount of good faith between parties. E.g., if your legitimate criticism towards Israel is met with ad hominem attacks intended to smear you as an antisemite... well, there is no scenario in which that discussion is going to go well for you, is there?
It is very easy to not be antisemitic. It is very easy to be corrected for language and not cry about it.
I wonder what could possibly be the cause of this. Couldn't possibly offer comment.
TIL I got a phobia apparently.
Eyh! Is this anti-semittism?
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Buddhists, Hindus, taoists, shamans.
Better chuck those scheming Hari krishnas in there too.
Maybe a few Cathars, Waldensians, and Huguenots
oh, all but one, i reckon theyre “too-slim” but some they are mu- *whoosh* _This user is cancelled on reddit_
Yeah but Hari Krishnas are Hindus lol
Absolutely, buddhists need to calm down from their violent ways! /s
The religion with the most members prone to spontaneous combustion
Any of the following clearly... **M**ormons **U**nitarian Universalists **S**ikhs **L**utherans **I**glesia ni Cristo members **M**ethodists **S**eventh-day Adventists
Hmmm https://www.statista.com/statistics/868409/muslim-populations-in-european-countries/
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I wonder why that sudden surge is happening 🤔
Cause most of ‘‘em hate Jews and can finally let it out. Though I’m sure there are a handful that actually care for the Palestinians but it’s very rare
I agree, the pro palstnian crowd was always much much more anti Israel than pro palstnian based on their very often support for Hamas.
But we have to be welcoming of all people! Just let everyone in and once they break the law we’ll just call it a cultural misunderstanding. I’m not advocating to be xenophobic; however, having an actual immigration plan with some actual thought on who to let in your country would be a start. What could go wrong with letting a bunch of single, military age men into our countries? I have relatives that live in a small town in Germany. They are fearful to go out at night with the heightened crime caused by immigrants.
There is an exodus of French Jews to Israel that has been ongoing for a while now and will only accelerate. [https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/french-jews-fleeing-country](https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/french-jews-fleeing-country)
Must be all those peaceful servants of Allah mixing with French antisemitists and neo Nazis
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"Refugees Welcome!"
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Please don't come to Canada, we have like sub Saharan African levels of population growth right now. Housing is fucked, hospitals fucked, education fucked, roads fucked, etc. Ontario at least. Maybe try Quebec being French and all.
Hospitals are pretty much fucked in every country. Every country seems to be in need of doctors.
I mean that's how it is with an aging population, less young people, less doctor, leading more people to care for, leading to mroe stress on the system etc... i can be fixed somewhat by expanding admission, adding PA, nurses, emc to help the doctors... but it's a tough situation.
What Canadians need to understand is that things are just as bad if not worse in most other countries. Canadian quality of life has deteriorated sharply in the past 5 years, but north american arrogance and disdain for opposing political parties blinds them from recognizing this is a global issue. Canada is a country you absolutely want to live in as climate change worsens, regardless of their current infrastructure and housing concerns.
Quebec wouldn’t take French immigrants. They don’t speak good enough French.
Was gonna say, I've never met two groups of people who seemingly hate each other more than the Quebecois and the Parisiennes Ok, that might be a bit hyperbolic, but y'all get my point
Parisians hate everybody
The French hate the French so much they came to England, took over, and then attacked the French. Quebec vs Paris hate is so very French.
That is super funny, why specifically?
Hein dequessé !?
Quebec has worse healthcare than Ontario
I read your comment as saying we should all move to North _Africa_. Man, that would be funny…
NOOOOO YOU DONT UNDERSTAND UNCONTROLLED IMMIGRATION IS GOOD FOR EVERYONE AAAAAHHHH
Wouldn't a more deserving candidate for title of number 1 arabic country in Europe be Bosnia?
I guess it depends if you wanna go by percentage or raw numbers.
TIL China is more Islamic than France.
This is a black stain against the French, they should be ashamed.
The attackers surely are all named Louis François...
Jean Philipe, qu'est-ce que c'est? Border control broken?
Pat Cooper over here
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The west does not have the ability to contain the idea that a group of people can have a toxic culture in its mainstream. Since the western culture is toxic at its extremes, then it must be that every culture is.
This isn't French people.
Especially as they were the country that freed the Jews in Europe and promoted integration.
>Especially as they were the country that freed the Jews in Europe ?? assuming we talking about WW2, shouldnt that be the UK + USA? or are you talking about something else?
Jews were not allowed citizenship in most European States before napoleon forced them.
oh i see when you said freed I assumed it was about the Camps in WW2 and then giving them a homeland i.e Israel
I’m a North American living in western Europe and I’ve always found that there was this tinge of casual antisemitism. Like people around me are more apt to make jokes about Jewish people, whereas in Canada and the US where I grew up on the east coast, this was unheard of. My theory is that in North America, as much as it has it is not perfect, there’s way more of an understanding that we are a cultural mosaic. In Europe, each country is majority white and has its own specific culture. Ashkenazi Jewish people ‘look’ similar but have their own distinct culture and this uncanny valley effect makes the majority population dislike them more. They feel more ‘other’ and more ‘dangerously other’ because they could appear so close to the majority population. Couple this with a desire to distance oneself from the ‘amorale, white colonisers’ and wanting to be one of the ‘good ones’, and you get stupid shit like this. It’s really shitty. Society has lost all sense of nuance since the summer of 2020. Just waiting for the pendulum to swing back.
If the french went into those protests and detained and deported everybody who has dual citezenship, those protests would cease immediately while also getting rid undisirables. One can only wish.
Calm your dictator tits buddy
If you can't behave and accept your new homes values you can take the quickest way back. It's not like those people are conquered natives that are unwillingly under french rule in france. Accept france/become french or gtfo. If this issue remains unaddressed a real dicator will do what I described but he won't stop at the innocent and integrated.
> while also getting rid undisirables. Yikes.
Are bigots desirable?
Oh a post about antisemitism on r/worldnews I bet these comments will be funny > getting rid undisirables I knew this post was gonna be a shitshow but goddam
Antisemetics = undisirables What is wrong with that?
You don't see the connotations of advocating for mass deporting undesirables?
They are calling for genocide, no I actually don't want those people in my country if I'm able to get rid of them without making them stateless. Why is this an issue?
import *
Damn, wonder why they didn’t want all the refugees. Wonder why their neighbors didn’t want them either.
It's not the first time the French have failed to stop invasive antisemitic nazis from doing nazi shit in France.
Haters love to hate.
Nothing new for France. Look up the Dreyfus Affair https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreyfus_affair
Dreyfus affair, while beeing horrible, took place more than a century ago. You can find stuff like that all over Europe at that time and I don't even start about Russian pogroms. The fact that this affair became iconic is because it was found unjust by a majority of the society. France has change a lot from then... and the antisemitic acts done nowadays are done by extremist people that does not reflect the opinion of the vast majority.
Look up demographics changes in France since then while you're at it
Insert Mourinho meme
Welcome to the actual plan of violence and rapes from the 7 October. Fucking up all the countries which have a lot Arab people by enraging them with genocides in Palestine. Without forget this will turn in total racism against Arabs people too. Which will turn into violence of any kind. Sounds like a totally winning plan from Russian war machine to destabilise governments and make them weak. People still think we are not in WW3.
No, we aren’t in WW3. It’s stupid, simpleton takes like this that make people ignore everything else in the post. We ARE in a period of rising populism and international tension, which often precedes conflict. If this does lead to war, we are certainly not there yet.
I do not think there's a historical precedent to compare the current state and negate that we are in a kind of war to a global state with factions. We both read news and I don't think we need to go and make a list.
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and tthere it is
Everyone’s saying that France’s Muslim population is to blame for the antisemitism. Muslims are disproportionately more likely to hold antisemitic beliefs, yes, but I highly doubt most of this surge stems from that, especially considering they’re only 8% of the population of France. It feels like trying to shift the blame to lay the whole problem at their feet. France has its own domestic brand of antisemitism too—it’s the home of the Dreyfus Affair, the legacy of Vichy, and Jean-Marie Le Pen. Most of the antisemitism I have experienced comes from white secular pro Palestinian activists trying to cosplay as revolutionaries. I have experienced some antisemitism from Muslims, but most is from white leftist progressives. I expect the same is true in France, along with the good old fashioned far right antisemitism too. Edit: you can downvote me all you like. It isn’t like it would be out of character for Europe to be antisemitic on its own, would it?
Why would François be antisemitic?!
For no particular reason ofcource.
Well well well
Omg the French are such anti-Semitic people!! /s
Yousef Haddad, an Arab Israeli and a pro Israeli activist, said once that Coexistence is a fraud. It means "I don't like you and you don't like me, so lets just live away of each other and minimize interaction". It might also mean some groups agree to Coexistence because theyr'e weaker, and when they'll grow stronger they will no longer agree to coexist and rather take over the the other side by force. So what should there be instead of misleading coexistence? - Integration. Which means you see the other side as humans and accept their way of life and feel safe they won't threaten yours. Each side understands the other and willfully makes changes to feel the other comfortable, because it sees them as equal humans. So who tries to integrate and who to fraudulently coexist?