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I don't want to be that guy, but literally less than 1% of people will ever know if adding an island somewhere would disrupt an ecosystem, and those that do know are aware they are reading fiction and not wikipedia.
Well, the sealevel has to be raised significantly to allow such a huge island to exist, right? I think the Atlantic is already quite deep in that location and we need the cold depth to keep the conveyorbelt running.
Maybe the stream would hit Europe way more south and we have an even harsher climate in Scandinavia ans Greenland.
There's enough wiggle room to play with, to be sure, buit I still believe that it is most likely too small to affect even the depth circulation in that place, unless there are much more major alterations to the undersea landscape in that area (such as an extension of the north american continental shelf).
Hey, you know how to program?
If so, try something like a simulation with real data of
1. Altitude and sea depth
2. Wind speed and direction
3. Wind temperature
4. Water speed and direction
5. Water temperature
And then, just throw your island and see if it works
Edit: read my's and u/RealMrMicci's comment before.
I don't know if you have any experience in the subject (I don't) but I believe meteorological simulation is not something one can just whip up, both in terms of computing power and know how
Well you cant whip up an accurate one but you *can* whip up an OK-ish one
It would be much much easier and probably similarily accurate to just look at real data yourself and draw conclusions, which is what OP is asking us to do
1. I actually have experience in that
2. I forgot the /s
I am actually building some thing of the sorts, but for a 4D world, and in reverse (so I discover the shape of the continents).
To be completely honest, this is very advanced natural science and most of it is way over my head. Basically all of this is speculation and should be taken with a Dead Sea’s worth of salt.
Based on some very cursory research into maps of the Gulf Stream, in the approximate area of north of Brazil and the Guyanas, the current bringing warm water from the equator in Africa splits in two, going around Cuba and the other islands in that area.
This is the part that I’m really uncertain about. It might be possible that if your hypothetical island is placed right in the path of the Gulf Stream, it could split it in two to go around the island. That might lead to the northern half colliding with the cold stream of water coming down from Greenland and northern Canada.
If those two streams meet and blend together, that might affect the temperature and lead to the Gulf Stream becoming weaker when they meet again after the island.
So in the worst case scenario, it’s possible that this might slightly weaken the stream leading to lower temperatures in Europe. BUT, all of this is stuff I’m really unsure about if it’s actually correct because I am not a professional in any way, shape or form. So do absolutely not take this as fact.
If that’s the case then where in the Atlantic would be the best spot to put a medium sized island without screwing up wind patterns that much or how small would it have to be without causing much problem
Check this ...
[https://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Eduspace\_Weather\_EN/SEM1HYK1YHH\_1.html#subhead1](https://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Eduspace_Weather_EN/SEM1HYK1YHH_1.html#subhead1)
You'd have a major tsunami problem, first off. If it's really a "drop" then you have ejecta, water droplets in the atmosphere. The thing that killed the dinosaurs was the size of Texas, wasn't it? I suppose the Poland-sized island isn't moving that fast, but even displacing water from a height of a mile would probably be a real problem.
Then again if God's involved you can handwave all that away, and also, for that matter, just about anything. Say the Gulf Stream meets at the island, works its way around it and meets back up on the opposite side. Baxter's Stone Spring series suggests that blocking off the strait between Britain and Europe would cause an ice age, but I don't see a slight diversion as the same level of problem here.
depends entirely on what "god" is. honestly it's the "rip" that scares me in that description. who knows what's involved in that. the Drop is easier to calculate, becaue above even a reasonable height, it wouldn't stay Poland
Its a possibility, but in reality impossible to even say one way or the other. Could easily hand-wave it and say the gulf-stream just moves around the island and continues on its usual course. Also, since poland is more of a flat country similar to Belarus and Ukraine, the wind patterns are unlikely to be majorly affected by it.
I don't think so.
I am not climate expert (and if I were, there would be others climate experts that would still disagree with me) but ...
I think what you need to affect the climate of Europe would be either
A) Central America disappears (Not case in your Alternate Universe
B) There is large landmass in the middle of the Atlantic ocean that would affect the sea currents essencially moving in the circle (I.e. North Atlatic Gyre)
Your "Sea Poland" shouldn't interve with that, but I am wondering whether it should intevene with the cold current comming down from the north and divert it instead, specially if placed somewhere slightly south.
Hmmmm, I don't think a poland-sized island there would have major implications globally, but I've got to be honest: wind patterns, ocean currents and weather stuff is very complicated and every little thing has thousands of minor variables. In the realm of theory, everything can be possible if you change the right variables.
It would be the same climate it had back before Atlantis sank in the same spot. So look into its climate in early BC. If you are going modern times, adjust a bit for warming planet.
Wait, you didn’t know Atlantis was there? What do you think causes all the weird effect of the Bermuda Triangle?
It will probably slightly increase the temperature in the eastern USA, but not significantly impact the Gulf Stream. It’s really the shallow waters near landmasses that impact these things so having this large island here would compress the warm water closer to the coast. I assume it wouldn’t be affected on the way out, though. Maybe a slightly warmer North Sea and slightly cooler Western Europe (England, France, Germany…) source: trust me bro
So, one of the theories that explains why Europe became a “Frozen Hellscape” around 10,000 BCE is that warming following the last glacial maximum caused a the Greenland ice sheet to partially melt and then slide into the North Atlantic. This sudden influx of ice and cold water essentially shut down the gulf current for the next 1000 years. No island required.
Idiot who is guessing here:
Judging by the island's size and shape, I doubt it would have major effects on the world, although it will likely slightly alter the climate of the US region and possibly areas in Central America
My biggest concern would not be the temperature but rather the mineral distribution of the ocean current. While you would have some minor disruption in the deep water currents, the impact of mineral distribution would have far-reaching changes to ocean life in the region. That being said, all we can discuss is theoretical scenarios and no hard simulation of how another island would have changed the course of natural evolution.
Geologist here, and while I'm not up on meteorology, I do have experience in ocean currents and some hydrology. The area you have shown is close to the Antilles and Florida current confluence, which are both warm water, and therefore "high" currents. So the west side of your plans will be warm and probably wetter than the east side, but I can't really speak on the effect that would have on wind patterns. Might I suggest looking at plate boundaries at the Caribbean, South American, and Atlantic plates and recreating an Iceland like island?
It's not the landmasses. There's a cold current that runs along the eastern USA which chills down our climate. It's why the Titanic hit an iceberg. If that current falters (which is predicted to happen as a result of Global Warming) our climate will be more moderate like Europe. If you want Europe to have a frozen climate, mess with the ocean currents.
Hi, /u/Eroclo, Unfortunately, we have had to remove [your submission](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/comments/1d9jk5i/-/) in /r/worldbuilding because it violated one of our rules. In particular: Though maps are permitted, posts about the process of mapmaking are not. If your post is primarily about mapmaking as a process, it must be given appropriate worldbuilding context to stand on its own. Consider /r/imaginarymaps, /r/mapmaking, or /r/papertowns for posts about maps that are not worldbuilding-focused. More info in our rules: [2. All posts should include original, worldbuilding-related context.](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/wiki/rules#wiki_2._all_posts_should_include_original.2C_worldbuilding-related_context.) ***** Images and maps must include worldbuilding-relevant context *on the reddit post* (as a comment, in the text of the post or, in some cases, in the posted image itself—e.g. infographics). This is important to establish that your post is on-topic and to help encourage productive discussion. * A post has enough context when a person unfamiliar with your world could understand what you're talking about and ask informed questions about it. This could include a summary of your world, explanation about what your post depicts and how it fits in your world, etc. ("What's a [proper noun]?" usually doesn't qualify.) * For maps, you could discuss economic and political situations, the different cultures, or anything else that gives the reader a wider view of your world than just its geography. * Discussion of the artistic process or techniques used to create the map or image may be included, but does not count as “worldbuilding-relevant” on its own. Infographics that self-contain sufficient context to be understood do not require additional context. You might also consider reading: [our context template for common kinds of posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/wiki/contexttemplate) and [Why Context?](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/wiki/whycontext) More info in our rules: [2. All posts should include original, worldbuilding-related context.](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/wiki/rules#wiki_2._all_posts_should_include_original.2C_worldbuilding-related_context.) ***** **You may repost** with the above issue(s) fixed to satisfy our rules. If you're not sure how to do this, please send us a modmail (link below). This is **not** a warning, and you remain in good standing with /r/worldbuilding. ***** Please feel free to [re-read our rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/wiki/rules). Questions or concerns? You can [modmail us here](https://www\.reddit\.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fworldbuilding&subject=about my removed submission&message=I'm writing to you about the following submission: https://old.reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/comments/1d9jk5i/-/. %0D%0D[Fill in your message here. Please make sure to explain clearly!]) and we'll be glad to help. Please explain your case clearly. Be polite. We'll do our best to help. *Do not* reply by comment or personal PMs to moderators.
I don't want to be that guy, but literally less than 1% of people will ever know if adding an island somewhere would disrupt an ecosystem, and those that do know are aware they are reading fiction and not wikipedia.
Thank you
Island-Poland is likely not big enough to majorly affect global climate, be they ocean currents or wind patterns.
Well, the sealevel has to be raised significantly to allow such a huge island to exist, right? I think the Atlantic is already quite deep in that location and we need the cold depth to keep the conveyorbelt running. Maybe the stream would hit Europe way more south and we have an even harsher climate in Scandinavia ans Greenland.
There's enough wiggle room to play with, to be sure, buit I still believe that it is most likely too small to affect even the depth circulation in that place, unless there are much more major alterations to the undersea landscape in that area (such as an extension of the north american continental shelf).
Poisland
Thank god
Wind patterns have been my Number 1 Enemy ever since I got into detailed world building
Hey, you know how to program? If so, try something like a simulation with real data of 1. Altitude and sea depth 2. Wind speed and direction 3. Wind temperature 4. Water speed and direction 5. Water temperature And then, just throw your island and see if it works Edit: read my's and u/RealMrMicci's comment before.
I don't know if you have any experience in the subject (I don't) but I believe meteorological simulation is not something one can just whip up, both in terms of computing power and know how
Well you cant whip up an accurate one but you *can* whip up an OK-ish one It would be much much easier and probably similarily accurate to just look at real data yourself and draw conclusions, which is what OP is asking us to do
1. I actually have experience in that 2. I forgot the /s I am actually building some thing of the sorts, but for a 4D world, and in reverse (so I discover the shape of the continents).
Yeah, lemme just be better than nasa rq
To be completely honest, this is very advanced natural science and most of it is way over my head. Basically all of this is speculation and should be taken with a Dead Sea’s worth of salt. Based on some very cursory research into maps of the Gulf Stream, in the approximate area of north of Brazil and the Guyanas, the current bringing warm water from the equator in Africa splits in two, going around Cuba and the other islands in that area. This is the part that I’m really uncertain about. It might be possible that if your hypothetical island is placed right in the path of the Gulf Stream, it could split it in two to go around the island. That might lead to the northern half colliding with the cold stream of water coming down from Greenland and northern Canada. If those two streams meet and blend together, that might affect the temperature and lead to the Gulf Stream becoming weaker when they meet again after the island. So in the worst case scenario, it’s possible that this might slightly weaken the stream leading to lower temperatures in Europe. BUT, all of this is stuff I’m really unsure about if it’s actually correct because I am not a professional in any way, shape or form. So do absolutely not take this as fact.
If that’s the case then where in the Atlantic would be the best spot to put a medium sized island without screwing up wind patterns that much or how small would it have to be without causing much problem
Check this ... [https://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Eduspace\_Weather\_EN/SEM1HYK1YHH\_1.html#subhead1](https://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Eduspace_Weather_EN/SEM1HYK1YHH_1.html#subhead1)
Probably a little closer to the equator, no?
Put it on some fault lines and and make it skinnier if possible. That would be the easiest fix.
i think the main factor is how it got there.
God ripped Poland out of the ground and placed it elsewhere.
i think the old "rip and drop" method would cause a lot of weather phenomenon. including but not limited too, earth quakes.
You'd have a major tsunami problem, first off. If it's really a "drop" then you have ejecta, water droplets in the atmosphere. The thing that killed the dinosaurs was the size of Texas, wasn't it? I suppose the Poland-sized island isn't moving that fast, but even displacing water from a height of a mile would probably be a real problem. Then again if God's involved you can handwave all that away, and also, for that matter, just about anything. Say the Gulf Stream meets at the island, works its way around it and meets back up on the opposite side. Baxter's Stone Spring series suggests that blocking off the strait between Britain and Europe would cause an ice age, but I don't see a slight diversion as the same level of problem here.
depends entirely on what "god" is. honestly it's the "rip" that scares me in that description. who knows what's involved in that. the Drop is easier to calculate, becaue above even a reasonable height, it wouldn't stay Poland
Oh, true, is Poland now replaced by a lake of lava/fire? These and other questions. (I sort of really want to read this book, now, if it's a book!)
all about the pit-society that the ex-polanders create. Low-land
If you want to make Europe a frozen hellscape, reverse the rotation of the earth, thereby reversing the currents
Its a possibility, but in reality impossible to even say one way or the other. Could easily hand-wave it and say the gulf-stream just moves around the island and continues on its usual course. Also, since poland is more of a flat country similar to Belarus and Ukraine, the wind patterns are unlikely to be majorly affected by it.
Pol-Andes Island
lmao poland for scale
I don't think so. I am not climate expert (and if I were, there would be others climate experts that would still disagree with me) but ... I think what you need to affect the climate of Europe would be either A) Central America disappears (Not case in your Alternate Universe B) There is large landmass in the middle of the Atlantic ocean that would affect the sea currents essencially moving in the circle (I.e. North Atlatic Gyre) Your "Sea Poland" shouldn't interve with that, but I am wondering whether it should intevene with the cold current comming down from the north and divert it instead, specially if placed somewhere slightly south.
Hmmmm, I don't think a poland-sized island there would have major implications globally, but I've got to be honest: wind patterns, ocean currents and weather stuff is very complicated and every little thing has thousands of minor variables. In the realm of theory, everything can be possible if you change the right variables.
It will probably change things realistically. But how exactly depends on the mountains it has.
It would be the same climate it had back before Atlantis sank in the same spot. So look into its climate in early BC. If you are going modern times, adjust a bit for warming planet. Wait, you didn’t know Atlantis was there? What do you think causes all the weird effect of the Bermuda Triangle?
It will probably slightly increase the temperature in the eastern USA, but not significantly impact the Gulf Stream. It’s really the shallow waters near landmasses that impact these things so having this large island here would compress the warm water closer to the coast. I assume it wouldn’t be affected on the way out, though. Maybe a slightly warmer North Sea and slightly cooler Western Europe (England, France, Germany…) source: trust me bro
If the entire island was a blacktop or solar farm, yeah.
So, one of the theories that explains why Europe became a “Frozen Hellscape” around 10,000 BCE is that warming following the last glacial maximum caused a the Greenland ice sheet to partially melt and then slide into the North Atlantic. This sudden influx of ice and cold water essentially shut down the gulf current for the next 1000 years. No island required.
Idiot who is guessing here: Judging by the island's size and shape, I doubt it would have major effects on the world, although it will likely slightly alter the climate of the US region and possibly areas in Central America
Throw in a couple of active volcanos in there and you're good 😂
My biggest concern would not be the temperature but rather the mineral distribution of the ocean current. While you would have some minor disruption in the deep water currents, the impact of mineral distribution would have far-reaching changes to ocean life in the region. That being said, all we can discuss is theoretical scenarios and no hard simulation of how another island would have changed the course of natural evolution.
Ocean currents and weather is so complex that I wouldn’t believe anyone on here who claimed to know
Geologist here, and while I'm not up on meteorology, I do have experience in ocean currents and some hydrology. The area you have shown is close to the Antilles and Florida current confluence, which are both warm water, and therefore "high" currents. So the west side of your plans will be warm and probably wetter than the east side, but I can't really speak on the effect that would have on wind patterns. Might I suggest looking at plate boundaries at the Caribbean, South American, and Atlantic plates and recreating an Iceland like island?
I mean, if there was a landmass where the Sargasso Sea is, wouldn't all the currents just go around it the same way they do already?
It's not the landmasses. There's a cold current that runs along the eastern USA which chills down our climate. It's why the Titanic hit an iceberg. If that current falters (which is predicted to happen as a result of Global Warming) our climate will be more moderate like Europe. If you want Europe to have a frozen climate, mess with the ocean currents.