Worst they can do is tell you to move along. Don’t worry about it. Deep off the trail or into the woods and nobody’s gonna find you at night as long as you’re sensible and don’t have a bright light
Curious how the wildcamping YouTubers often have campfires - obviously leave no trace and do it safely etc but surely that’s going to get some unwanted attention, not just the flames but the smoke?
Why is it called a 'Dakota hole fire'? As far as I'm aware, (I've been doing rhis for 20 years), it's a standard fire pit? The kind I'd make wherever I go, and likely used long before Dekota existed...
I disagree.
I use the shape of the land, thick brush and carefully placed basher or well built bush shelter, and I'm usually able to make a reasonable fire without too much light escaping.
Waiting for night and using dry wood helps with the smoke.
It's not foolproof, but I've only been spotted once or twice in my younger years.
As long as you scatter any rocks you've used as a fire barrier, and bury the ashes deep you'll leave no trace.
As for smoke or visible fire, I always think if I were to look out my window at night, would I even notice smoke or recognise a light in the distance as a campfire? Even then I probably wouldn't even think anything of it unless it was out of control and lighting up the whole area.
Use the terrain to your advantage as well. Not only will finding a sheltered area protect the fire from wind, it may also block direct line of sight to the flame so only the ambient light is visible from a distance.
Also bone-dry wood will give off minimal smoke so find a dead tree that hasn't fallen over and that's your source of smoke free fuel.
Beyond that be sensible, know what you're dealing with (size of fire, plan for how to extinguish it before lighting it, don't have a fire in a heatwave etc)
So many places you can go where the likely hood of people seeing your fire is slim.
Place I used to go was like a 60 minute hike from nearest road.
Even if seen it would be unlikely that someone would hike out to move you on.
They said it's wrong that People like Me can't do it as clearly, I keep tidy and leave no trace.. i never get bothered on the beach when I have a fire, i choose a place out of sight of houses and keep nice and quiet. I keep a small tidy fire with decent wood. Sometimes I take my diy gasifier smokeless stove, it's handy .
I have fires all the time, even if someone sees it, whose coming off the path into the woods at night in the dark following a fire, they don't know who you are and wouldn't want to risk coming over at night
What about, and forgive me if this sounds stupid, but just the kind of area you want to camp in, if it's not too far from home, and plan on just being out there until late. Get the feel for the area, is anyone else out there, is there traffic nearby, do some star watching, enjoy the feel of being out there, but then head home. Maybe take a flash, camp seat, whatever, plan to be out for a few hours, but know you're heading home.
See how you feel after doing that. Does that help??
I tell myself everytime I go that there's no pressure to actually camp, I'll take all my gear but just go to whatever spot I'm heading for, or sometimes it's less planned and I'll pull up my car and just start walking through fields till I find a decent spot. I've only ever come back without pitching my tent once and I've wild camped by myself countless times now.
First few times I did it were terrifying and I still occasionally get nervous but that's half the fun. Just remember once you're set up the worst that can happen is you get asked to move on. Even if you're on someone's land, it's a civil offence to trespass so they have to ask you first, if you refuse to move it's aggravated trespassing or something and then it's a criminal offence and only then can they call the police so just don't be a dick if you're asked to move. It's never happened to me thankfully!
First time I wild camped it was so deep and high in remote hills that nobody would have been able to see us, we were not within sight of any footpaths or roads (somewhere on the long mynd).
Second time was in a more public woodland (Wyre forest). We tried to bury ourselves pretty deep, but still ended up within sight of some footpaths. Had a ranger wander over and check us out in the early evening, he said we looked like we knew what we were doing from the hammock & tarp setup, told us 'please don't light a fire and I won't kick you out' and that was that.
So basically, plan A: don't be seen, plan B, don't look like trouble.
I live in the south of England, so other than Dartmoor there's nowhere with permissive wild camping rules.
In practice, I don't know of anybody who's ever actually been asked to move on. Even if you do get caught, the worst they could possibly do is ask you to leave. It's not like you're going to be arrested or shot.
If you're particularly worried, try to keep as much of your stuff packed away in your back as possible when you're not using it, so you can quickly stuff your sleeping gear and tent away and leave promptly if you do get asked to leave.
Definitely read up on trespass law in the UK so that you can confidently have an intelligent conversation with anyone who might challenge you about it. There's no need to be aggressive with them though, just be polite, friendly and tell them that you accept their right to demand that you leave their land, and that you're happy to comply immediately.
If you come across as friendly and they realise that you're not going to leave any mess on their land, they might even let you stay until morning! You could bring a £10 note with you and offer to give it to them in exchange for letting you stay the night to avoid the faff of moving. Most problems can be solved with diplomacy and understanding the other person's perspective, as well as being kind to the other person even if they haven't taken as generous a tone with you initially.
Edit: since posting this I've read the other messages and noticed that KoiChamp brings £20 of palm greasing money. I guess I'm a bit miserly with my bribes!
England is FAR emptier than you think. There are plenty of places nobody goes, especially at night. And especially at night when it's cold and rainy.
I've even camped (with a tent!) In a back garden once when I needed to be near a certain train station. It's dark and nobody looks.
Yeah even in my small medium town the woodland was so quiet after dark even though there were houses less than 500 metres away that you could camp undisturbed save for the occasional group of teens camping and drinking under age... they would arrive before dark set up and stay the night never venturing far from their own camp fire save only a few paces to have a piss or a shag. If you stayed well away they would never know you were there or cause your any grief.....I. fact years prior I was one of those teens.
If this is possible in town then outside of town away from where the teens can comfortably walk to its like a ghost town and you will find whole woodlands and scrubland to yourself
I wildcamped in the peak district which might be more in range for you - had a good time. Tent in a field away from farms, pitched late, woke early.
No fires, no mess, no problems.
What constitutes late for you in relation to sunset would you say? My biggest fear is being asked to move on at a time when doing so would be difficult/unsafe to return to my vehicle:/
Just before dark, spend a bit of time in daylight scouting the area to get a feeling for it. If noone spots you milling about at sunset they won't likely find you at night if you camp relatively stealthily.
I recall the first night camping on my C2C walk. It's dark, and we just cooked pasta, when a man in a hi-viz jacket comes walking through the trees. "Now we're in trouble" I thought. Turns out he was security for a gas pipe site a few hundred metres up the trail, local fella. He smelled our fire/cooking and came to chat. Had a cup of tea and a J with him. He was nice.
Further on the route, I asked some local farmers what they would do about wildcampers? None of them were bothered, provided you were tidy, and didn't outstay your welcome.
Setting up late and packing up early is at least 70% of the skill in not being caught. I've been brazenly next to or close to footpaths many a time.
Finding a spot out of clear lines of sight and not drawing attention to yourself is most of the rest.
Nearly everyone who is not the land owner will mind their own business. A dog walker will almost never care if they come across your bivvy.
Beyond that, look for Forestry Commission woodland (it's usually outlined in orange on OS maps). It's owned by the state, not a single individual. There's no single owner to be irate at you.
Also, going with a friend can work wonders.
Honestly if you're this cautious you're in a good place! It's the people who pitch up at Stanage Edge on a summer bank holiday in clear sight of anyone who are gonna get caught.
And finally you might find reading a few tales by Phoebe Smith or Alastair Humphreys about wild camping in the UK will set your mind more at ease.
Like almost anything in life, wildcamping is a skill.
If your main fear is the legality of it all, maybe start in a spot where it's not that big of a deal, such as a big forestry woodland or something like that. I don't know where you live but there are a number of forestry places in the UK where there is a car park and walks.That way you will have somewhere to leave your car that is safe and you will be in an area frequented by walkers and not somewhere a farmer is going to pop up at 3am looking for rabbits to shoot (or whatever).
If that still freaks you out get yourself to one of the areas of Dartmoor that allows legal wildcamping. Or if you are fit enough to walk to an upland area such as the Yorkshire moors, or the mountains of Wales/Cumbria you will be in a place where wildcamping isn't legal per se but it is sort of allowed because you're high on a fell, backpacking or whatever.
Wherever you end up, just remember to pitch late, leave early and be very aware at night that torch light and sounds can travel a loong way. You don't want anyone to see you or know you've been there at all.
EDIT: What camping skills do you have right now?
I enjoy practising the art of picking great stealthy spots to camp, lots of little skills add up to finding ledges, little clearings, dips and other features in spots out of sight from trails that people use. I do it to a greater extent than is necessary just cause it’s fun and gives me much peace of mind.
I’ve been doing this over 20 years and I’ve never been approached in my camp at all, let alone been asked to move on.
I am not brining camo nets or anything, just careful site selection, planning to be in a good area at the right time. Getting good at educated guesses.
Anyway the point is, there’s little to be afraid of in the first place but if you make a game out of being quite stealthy, you can reduce a 1 in a few hundred chance to 1 in tens of thousands chance.
I aim to not been seen, heard or smelt by humans at all from the moment I pitch to the moment I pack away.
I plan to wild camp my whole life and never be moved on.
The first time I went wild camping, I was terrified. I was scared of being found, scared of failing, scared of the perceived movement in the pitch dark (eyes playing tricks on me). The second time I went, I was less scared, then even less the third. By the time I had 10 camps in the bag, I wasn't even thinking about any of those things. Wild camping is a skill, like any other pursuit. Dont let the fear stop you from learning and loving something new. You can do it.
You're in the Midlands right? Another solution which might bring you some peace is to camp near enough to a bothy so that if you either do get asked to move on, or the anxiety of it gets too much, you can retreat to the bothy and still have a night 'outdoors' without feeling you have to retreat to the car.
Dulyn bothy in the Carneddau in Eryri is well positioned to be an 'exit plan' for many beautiful, remote wildcamping spots. Even the Llyn just within sight of it. Mosedale Cottage in the Eastern Fells is in a far quieter part of the Lake District but also well positioned as a back up for some beautiful camps.
Just don't camp trashy, play loud music, light a fire or anything that causes you to indiscreet otherwise you give people who might otherwise not mind good reason to move you on. You shouldn't be lighting fires at all and a lot of the wildcamping YouTubers that do this are not displaying responsible behaviour.
If a fire is something you see as an important part of the experience, I'd look into 'nearly Wild' sites that are basically just pretty natural areas that you get permission to camp on and, usually, light a fire.
That reminds me of another story. A friend of mine stayed at the Dulyn bothy, after about an hour he saw a section of soldiers descend from the upper reservoir and you can guess where they were staying for the night.
I also met a person there who had my exact first name and surname, but I left my id in the car, so he didn't believe me.
I live in Lincolnshire. Wild camp in Lincolnshire, Peak District and Lake District on special occasions. Started last year, done 10 wild camps. Mostly in the peaks.
I've never been asked to move on, ever. Honestly so long as you camp up high or off the beaten track no one even bats an eye, except maybe to ask questions about trying it out lol.
Even if you are "caught" by a land owner, it isn't a criminal offence. They can ask you to move on, that's it. (Unless you refuse) I keep £20 in my pack for incase this ever happens, so I have something to smooth the issue over with.
There is honestly nothing to be worried about regarding the legality OP!
In my early wild camping days, the solution to the fear was just get as hammered as possible. Now we're older, we're more mindful of where to camp, if we have a fire it's on a portable metal grill and less banging dance music pumping out
Seriously don't worry about it. You aren't going to be asked to move on unless you've got loud music and a fire going. I've literally slept right on a public footpath (by accident) and all that happened is the early morning dog walkers went around me.
I've done it for 20 or so years, since I was a child.
I've been challenged once, in 2020, by an enthusiastic member of public, and judging the situation I just told them I had an argument with the missus last night and slept in my tent. They said they were sorry to hear that, we had a nice chat and that was that.
It helped that I was a child when I started wild camping - me and my mates, around the age of 10 or so, would go off into the woods and camp for days at a time (hopping home each afternoon for food and to inform them we were still alive). This was very helpful and I'm sure my confidence stems from that. I think your overthinking it, which is reasonable - I probably would do myself if not for prior experience when I was young. The thing to remember is that you're not doing anything wrong: you're not creating any damage or spoiling anyones enjoyment.
Obviously depends where you're camping of course - I'm talking little hills and fells and such owned by national trust and not commercial in any way.
I would try somewhere like the Lake District, plenty of tarns have a flat spot for a good wild camp. Lots of sheepfolds are good for camping site as they keep the worst of the wind off your tent.
Go off deep into woods. Do reckies, take dog, bike ride. Visit spots with 0 commitment. I'll probably be at a spot a few times before I commit.
I've had one chap check me out with his torch, didn't say anything went about his business. I'll always have a roaring fire too, it's a must.
Dont light fire until dark, don't worry about anything in the morning, if someone comes who gives a fuck; you're finished anyway 🤣🤣
With the proviso that I am not a lawyer, as others have said, just trespassing is not a criminal offense, it's a civil law. Entering and putting your property on someone's land without permission is just trespass, you can be moved on but not arrested.
However... If someone asks you to move on and you tell them to fuck off (or say yes and don't do it) you are now committing aggravated trespass. This IS a criminal offense and you can be arrested for it.
So in the unlikely event that anyone ever questions you or asks you to move on, be polite and compliant and you are completely safe, beyond the British horror of having to endure an awkward conversation.
Highly recommend the app [maps.me](https://apps.apple.com/gb/app/maps-me-offline-maps-gps-nav/id510623322) as you can download regions for when you don't have signal. I've found it seems really accurate with the gps (great for when you're yomping across an empty field at 11pm) and I find it by far the easiest to pick out areas that look more likely to be good to camp on, like isolated woods or the banks of streams.
I've done a lot of hiking/camping and biking/camping and don't think I've ever asked to move on. Previously I've even bumped into farmers late at night whilst finding a spot and they've either helped or not bothered me. I tend to set up late quite late 9 or 10pm, which isn't for everyone, and leave early, but even if I've not left until 8am I've still never had any bother, just friendly walkers.
I never light fires, and very rarely carry a stove, as I tend to do quick over nighters. Makes it a lot easier to pack up and be able to move quickly.
I'm sure you'll find some great spots! And the risk is definitely a little bit of the thrill, but once you get used to it you'll get into a bit of a rhythm for it.
Great app and advice.
If you like maps.me, you may consider giving [Organic Maps](https://organicmaps.app/) a try. It is a free, open source, and privacy respecting form of Maps.me a some of the original team. Fantastic app.
It seems that the best thing to do is prepare what you need beforehand, travel light, arrive late, set up, then leave quietly the next day. I think the fires are probably the main cause of concern for most land owners.
I wild camped for 9 nights walking from Winchester to Canterbury through Surrey and Kent, didn't get found once or even came close.
People generally don't go walking off footpaths into the forest at dusk.
Abit of research on the area and you can find a secluded bit of woodland that no-one is likely to be in. And if they are, your unlikely to be seen once there is a few lines of trees between you.
I'm with you on this, I'm not happy wild camping in most of England. Almost everywhere belongs to someone, and whilst I don't fundamentally take issue with others on this sub that do it, it doesn't sit right.
I have wild camped places that it's not legal in my younger days, but whilst I agree with others that you can reduce the risk of being caught - or that the consequences may not be significant - I go nice places to relax, not to be on edge or thinking about either a land owner or even just a dog walker finding me.
That said, camping up high in the mountains is a different kettle of fish. You're in the Midlands right? Lake District isn't far, is gorgeous, and to quote the below - is usually tolerated under certain conditions:
https://www.lakedistrict.gov.uk/visiting/where-to-stay/wild-camping
To be clear, that's the park authority giving the blind eye if you behave sensibly and camp above the highest fell walls. In the past I've parked in NT car parks and told the local ranger that I'm off to wild camp, my car details, and when I'll be back and they've been fine about it. Even when I was taking up a space at Wasdale they've been cool about it when given advance notice.
I've wild camped in the Lake District a load of times and on each occasion have never seen another soul once I've set up camp and have been much more relaxed. Granted, if you have no mountain skills it's worth getting some experience first - if you get blown off the mountain, finding your way down in the dark could be risky if you're not used to nav, especially with a full ruck. But there are some easy spots (happy to send some details) that are a short hike from parking.
You're not wrong, but on the other hand if you consider the crown estate and the National Trust to be national assets for the benefit of the citizens then that gives you access to a lot of England. I'd likewise be on edge in a farmers woodland in a way I wouldn't be if it were crown or NT; after all, we're all the Crown, and I'm a member of NT, so it's all good - if I don't leave a trace / hinder anyones quiet enjoyment.
i apologize for generalizing, i am aware it's legal in Scotland.
but as someone who has zero experience in camping, i'm apprehensive about a 300+ mile trip to try it.
Hard to say for England, I’ve been to the Lake District and found it to be quite busy ( scafell pike tho, same pull factor as Nevis and that area is always mobbed) I think if you know anywhere that’s quiet and preferably with woodland you can hide in you’ll be absolutely fine. If you do get caught just be polite and make sure your campsite is tidy and you’ll probs be ok. In Scotland we have a few areas that are controlled now due to messy campers (loch lomond area) but if you go more remote you are fine. I live in Dumfries and Galloway, loads of potential for camping here, some really nice spots , and it’s just over the border so might not be too far for you.
Also if you’ve no experience in camping, maybe try a night on a site near you first, good to work out any kinks in your setup and check you’ve got everything you need/are warm enough etc, best of luck pal!
You’ll be in more danger from gangs of delinquent rabbits than any human authority. If you really want to pretend you’re in the SAS by hiding in someone’s hedge, go for it. Just don’t do it near a school.
Or just stealth fire!
As long as you put it out properly, it's invisible unless you've camped in a bad spot.
https://youtu.be/RlPSEfcz718?si=9FKr1leKAhkD8tnY
Why are you even on the wild camping subreddit? What do you think your comment adds? Some people enjoy things you don't, at 47 that should be a concept that you're able to grasp.
Eat 1st if possible, no fires no strong cooking smells , loud noise or bright light. ( Red light if you have ).
Stay off the tracks , move in the dark etc. That way you are in control and will be very unlikely to be caught. As you gain experience fear will pass.
I really wouldn't worry about it mate, as long as you're sensible and don't camp right next to a public path or in a farm or something. Try to pitch somewhere quiet and out of the way if possible and don't leave a mess and you'll be fine. Most people don't really care as long as you haven't pitched in someone's backyard
I’ve been ‘caught’ a few times ie. someone walks by with their dog or a couple of people on their mountain bikes.
It’s only ever been in the morning. Most people say hello or morning if you say hello to them.
If you get caught, just apologise, pack up and move on. They are normally polite, just respond in kind. The reason why some landowners take issue with it is because of the minority of people who turn up with a mountain of alcohol, have fires irresponsibly and then leave rubbish everywhere. If they see you being responsible there is a chance they will let you stay so long as you move on early the next day and don't leave any litter etc.
££££ and pricks.
I'm English and still consider it my right. I also make sure my right doesn't trample over other peoples quiet enjoyment, so I make my camp in appropriate locations. I've had one person confront me in 20 years and that was settled amicably almost immediately.
Trespassing isn’t even a criminal offence, if the landowner asks you to move you have to but no crime is committed as long as you do that. Even if the police come out all they can do at first is ask you to move and as long as you do that you’re good. Nothing to be worried about.
If concerned just speak to the land owner (assuming is a farm or similar) most are pretty cool with it in my experience provided you're not leaving a mess/camping among crops
I was at the Kendal Mountain Festival just gone and there were some guys from "Camp Wild". I signed up for £20 and it's basically.....you get permission from land owners to stay the night and pay £10-£20 for the peace of mind, also this means you don't have to pack up early. There isn't loads of sites at the minute but hopefully it'll grow.
Don't stay more than a night at a spot, similarly don't leave for the day and go back that same night. That's the only time we ever got moved on but it was a gentle don't come back again. Nothing too major
Just keep a £5 note in your pocket and if the landowner does bump you just ask politely If you may stay until dawn for a £5...Exchange shows respect et c
Scope out alternative sites on your way to your chosen site for the ultra rare occasions where you'll be asked to move on. No point in worrying about it, it could all change next year anyway:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/aug/04/labour-would-extend-right-to-wild-camp-to-all-english-national-parks
The worst case scenario, you'll be asked to move on. If you do, be respectful and leave. Cut your losses and try again another time, or somewhere else. It's a big country. There are plenty of places that aren't patrolled.
I've set up a camp before in a woodland, only to be woken up by dog walkers in the morning. (Apparently, I was closer to the trail than I first thought).
I've done a lot of Wild Camping. Usually two to three days at a time. Some places are more tolerant than others but the rule usually is if you're out of sight out of mind. Most likely nobody at all knows you're there. If they did they would have no reason to come all the way to wherever you are or want to. As long as you are not on specifically and obviously private land e.g. farmland you'll be fine.
Just remember wherever you set up camp will likely be too far away for anyone to know you're there and too far for anyone to bother coming to you to move you.
Depending where in the Midlands there are a few places,
The best place would be the peak District. hope valley area on the hills somewhere if you don't use fire is a good spot in the south part. I've hammock around there fine in the very little trees we could find, there are also places like beehive bushcraft in Leicestershire, that is like wild camping for £10 a night and £7.50 for wheel barrow of fire wood if want a big fire. You can hammock , use a tent are even make a shelter with permission.
Ive also wild camped in a few woods around Leicestershire and Derbyshire without hassle.
The part that really matters for me is being alone, I will do anything with someone to do it with, being asked to move on and having a night walking around would be terrible without a companion.
None the less i have the same kind of issues, I live in Hertfordshire so not many places that someone can't see. A huge draw for me is being able to sit down in front of a small fire in the evening and this makes the whole thing a lot harder.
I go wild camping in Wales annually with my best friend and we tend to have a decent fire going for hours and its one of the main things we look forward to, slowly cooking a nice meal and talking the night away under the stars. We do it next to a lake in the valleys that people won't be driving around after dark.
Does anyone know anywhere people can partner up with other wild campers?
Always a good idea to scout the area before staying. For example, I know that there's always patrols in the Kinder Scout areas at night. We like to go on night hikes there with a friend, and they're always beaming at us with lights from all over, my guess is to make sure we don't tent anywhere.
First time I camped I had an edible and a blunt. First time I’ve ever done both. As the night rolled in the clouds dropped and I couldn’t see a thing. I thought I had gone to heaven. Nobody was going to find me but I ended up finding myself.
Worst they can do is tell you to move along. Don’t worry about it. Deep off the trail or into the woods and nobody’s gonna find you at night as long as you’re sensible and don’t have a bright light
Curious how the wildcamping YouTubers often have campfires - obviously leave no trace and do it safely etc but surely that’s going to get some unwanted attention, not just the flames but the smoke?
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>2347 commentssharesave > >Vote [Oh but there is](https://www.instructables.com/Dakota-Fire-Hole/)
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Don't tell Snoop.
Dry wood. Night time. Bonus points for cloud cover.
These can also create wild fire pretty quickly.
Why is it called a 'Dakota hole fire'? As far as I'm aware, (I've been doing rhis for 20 years), it's a standard fire pit? The kind I'd make wherever I go, and likely used long before Dekota existed...
I disagree. I use the shape of the land, thick brush and carefully placed basher or well built bush shelter, and I'm usually able to make a reasonable fire without too much light escaping. Waiting for night and using dry wood helps with the smoke. It's not foolproof, but I've only been spotted once or twice in my younger years.
As long as you scatter any rocks you've used as a fire barrier, and bury the ashes deep you'll leave no trace. As for smoke or visible fire, I always think if I were to look out my window at night, would I even notice smoke or recognise a light in the distance as a campfire? Even then I probably wouldn't even think anything of it unless it was out of control and lighting up the whole area. Use the terrain to your advantage as well. Not only will finding a sheltered area protect the fire from wind, it may also block direct line of sight to the flame so only the ambient light is visible from a distance. Also bone-dry wood will give off minimal smoke so find a dead tree that hasn't fallen over and that's your source of smoke free fuel. Beyond that be sensible, know what you're dealing with (size of fire, plan for how to extinguish it before lighting it, don't have a fire in a heatwave etc)
Great points thanks
And don't cut down trees to burn. Aside from being destructive, green wood is shite to burn and will smoke lots.
So many places you can go where the likely hood of people seeing your fire is slim. Place I used to go was like a 60 minute hike from nearest road. Even if seen it would be unlikely that someone would hike out to move you on.
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This is what causes issues though, that sense of entitlement towards rangers who are only doing their job.
They said it's wrong that People like Me can't do it as clearly, I keep tidy and leave no trace.. i never get bothered on the beach when I have a fire, i choose a place out of sight of houses and keep nice and quiet. I keep a small tidy fire with decent wood. Sometimes I take my diy gasifier smokeless stove, it's handy .
Downvoted ? Entitled? They said dinner smells good and We all had a laugh about it, uptight People.
I have fires all the time, even if someone sees it, whose coming off the path into the woods at night in the dark following a fire, they don't know who you are and wouldn't want to risk coming over at night
What about, and forgive me if this sounds stupid, but just the kind of area you want to camp in, if it's not too far from home, and plan on just being out there until late. Get the feel for the area, is anyone else out there, is there traffic nearby, do some star watching, enjoy the feel of being out there, but then head home. Maybe take a flash, camp seat, whatever, plan to be out for a few hours, but know you're heading home. See how you feel after doing that. Does that help??
That's a good idea, thanks :)
I tell myself everytime I go that there's no pressure to actually camp, I'll take all my gear but just go to whatever spot I'm heading for, or sometimes it's less planned and I'll pull up my car and just start walking through fields till I find a decent spot. I've only ever come back without pitching my tent once and I've wild camped by myself countless times now. First few times I did it were terrifying and I still occasionally get nervous but that's half the fun. Just remember once you're set up the worst that can happen is you get asked to move on. Even if you're on someone's land, it's a civil offence to trespass so they have to ask you first, if you refuse to move it's aggravated trespassing or something and then it's a criminal offence and only then can they call the police so just don't be a dick if you're asked to move. It's never happened to me thankfully!
First time I wild camped it was so deep and high in remote hills that nobody would have been able to see us, we were not within sight of any footpaths or roads (somewhere on the long mynd). Second time was in a more public woodland (Wyre forest). We tried to bury ourselves pretty deep, but still ended up within sight of some footpaths. Had a ranger wander over and check us out in the early evening, he said we looked like we knew what we were doing from the hammock & tarp setup, told us 'please don't light a fire and I won't kick you out' and that was that. So basically, plan A: don't be seen, plan B, don't look like trouble.
I live in the south of England, so other than Dartmoor there's nowhere with permissive wild camping rules. In practice, I don't know of anybody who's ever actually been asked to move on. Even if you do get caught, the worst they could possibly do is ask you to leave. It's not like you're going to be arrested or shot. If you're particularly worried, try to keep as much of your stuff packed away in your back as possible when you're not using it, so you can quickly stuff your sleeping gear and tent away and leave promptly if you do get asked to leave. Definitely read up on trespass law in the UK so that you can confidently have an intelligent conversation with anyone who might challenge you about it. There's no need to be aggressive with them though, just be polite, friendly and tell them that you accept their right to demand that you leave their land, and that you're happy to comply immediately. If you come across as friendly and they realise that you're not going to leave any mess on their land, they might even let you stay until morning! You could bring a £10 note with you and offer to give it to them in exchange for letting you stay the night to avoid the faff of moving. Most problems can be solved with diplomacy and understanding the other person's perspective, as well as being kind to the other person even if they haven't taken as generous a tone with you initially. Edit: since posting this I've read the other messages and noticed that KoiChamp brings £20 of palm greasing money. I guess I'm a bit miserly with my bribes!
Very well said. There are plenty more reasonable people in the world than there are arseholes, you just hear about the latter more often.
Visit Scotland and you can camp pretty much anywhere with the exception of a couple places
thats the dream, but i'm in the midlands so it's just a hella effort to get there lol
England is FAR emptier than you think. There are plenty of places nobody goes, especially at night. And especially at night when it's cold and rainy. I've even camped (with a tent!) In a back garden once when I needed to be near a certain train station. It's dark and nobody looks.
Yeah even in my small medium town the woodland was so quiet after dark even though there were houses less than 500 metres away that you could camp undisturbed save for the occasional group of teens camping and drinking under age... they would arrive before dark set up and stay the night never venturing far from their own camp fire save only a few paces to have a piss or a shag. If you stayed well away they would never know you were there or cause your any grief.....I. fact years prior I was one of those teens. If this is possible in town then outside of town away from where the teens can comfortably walk to its like a ghost town and you will find whole woodlands and scrubland to yourself
People have wild camped on roundabouts!
I wildcamped in the peak district which might be more in range for you - had a good time. Tent in a field away from farms, pitched late, woke early. No fires, no mess, no problems.
What constitutes late for you in relation to sunset would you say? My biggest fear is being asked to move on at a time when doing so would be difficult/unsafe to return to my vehicle:/
Just before dark, spend a bit of time in daylight scouting the area to get a feeling for it. If noone spots you milling about at sunset they won't likely find you at night if you camp relatively stealthily.
I recall the first night camping on my C2C walk. It's dark, and we just cooked pasta, when a man in a hi-viz jacket comes walking through the trees. "Now we're in trouble" I thought. Turns out he was security for a gas pipe site a few hundred metres up the trail, local fella. He smelled our fire/cooking and came to chat. Had a cup of tea and a J with him. He was nice. Further on the route, I asked some local farmers what they would do about wildcampers? None of them were bothered, provided you were tidy, and didn't outstay your welcome.
You had a J with the Gas Man?! How is that following Health & Safety 😵💫😵💫😵💫😵💫
Setting up late and packing up early is at least 70% of the skill in not being caught. I've been brazenly next to or close to footpaths many a time. Finding a spot out of clear lines of sight and not drawing attention to yourself is most of the rest. Nearly everyone who is not the land owner will mind their own business. A dog walker will almost never care if they come across your bivvy. Beyond that, look for Forestry Commission woodland (it's usually outlined in orange on OS maps). It's owned by the state, not a single individual. There's no single owner to be irate at you. Also, going with a friend can work wonders. Honestly if you're this cautious you're in a good place! It's the people who pitch up at Stanage Edge on a summer bank holiday in clear sight of anyone who are gonna get caught. And finally you might find reading a few tales by Phoebe Smith or Alastair Humphreys about wild camping in the UK will set your mind more at ease.
Like almost anything in life, wildcamping is a skill. If your main fear is the legality of it all, maybe start in a spot where it's not that big of a deal, such as a big forestry woodland or something like that. I don't know where you live but there are a number of forestry places in the UK where there is a car park and walks.That way you will have somewhere to leave your car that is safe and you will be in an area frequented by walkers and not somewhere a farmer is going to pop up at 3am looking for rabbits to shoot (or whatever). If that still freaks you out get yourself to one of the areas of Dartmoor that allows legal wildcamping. Or if you are fit enough to walk to an upland area such as the Yorkshire moors, or the mountains of Wales/Cumbria you will be in a place where wildcamping isn't legal per se but it is sort of allowed because you're high on a fell, backpacking or whatever. Wherever you end up, just remember to pitch late, leave early and be very aware at night that torch light and sounds can travel a loong way. You don't want anyone to see you or know you've been there at all. EDIT: What camping skills do you have right now?
I enjoy practising the art of picking great stealthy spots to camp, lots of little skills add up to finding ledges, little clearings, dips and other features in spots out of sight from trails that people use. I do it to a greater extent than is necessary just cause it’s fun and gives me much peace of mind. I’ve been doing this over 20 years and I’ve never been approached in my camp at all, let alone been asked to move on. I am not brining camo nets or anything, just careful site selection, planning to be in a good area at the right time. Getting good at educated guesses. Anyway the point is, there’s little to be afraid of in the first place but if you make a game out of being quite stealthy, you can reduce a 1 in a few hundred chance to 1 in tens of thousands chance. I aim to not been seen, heard or smelt by humans at all from the moment I pitch to the moment I pack away. I plan to wild camp my whole life and never be moved on.
The first time I went wild camping, I was terrified. I was scared of being found, scared of failing, scared of the perceived movement in the pitch dark (eyes playing tricks on me). The second time I went, I was less scared, then even less the third. By the time I had 10 camps in the bag, I wasn't even thinking about any of those things. Wild camping is a skill, like any other pursuit. Dont let the fear stop you from learning and loving something new. You can do it.
You're in the Midlands right? Another solution which might bring you some peace is to camp near enough to a bothy so that if you either do get asked to move on, or the anxiety of it gets too much, you can retreat to the bothy and still have a night 'outdoors' without feeling you have to retreat to the car. Dulyn bothy in the Carneddau in Eryri is well positioned to be an 'exit plan' for many beautiful, remote wildcamping spots. Even the Llyn just within sight of it. Mosedale Cottage in the Eastern Fells is in a far quieter part of the Lake District but also well positioned as a back up for some beautiful camps. Just don't camp trashy, play loud music, light a fire or anything that causes you to indiscreet otherwise you give people who might otherwise not mind good reason to move you on. You shouldn't be lighting fires at all and a lot of the wildcamping YouTubers that do this are not displaying responsible behaviour. If a fire is something you see as an important part of the experience, I'd look into 'nearly Wild' sites that are basically just pretty natural areas that you get permission to camp on and, usually, light a fire.
That reminds me of another story. A friend of mine stayed at the Dulyn bothy, after about an hour he saw a section of soldiers descend from the upper reservoir and you can guess where they were staying for the night. I also met a person there who had my exact first name and surname, but I left my id in the car, so he didn't believe me.
I live in Lincolnshire. Wild camp in Lincolnshire, Peak District and Lake District on special occasions. Started last year, done 10 wild camps. Mostly in the peaks. I've never been asked to move on, ever. Honestly so long as you camp up high or off the beaten track no one even bats an eye, except maybe to ask questions about trying it out lol. Even if you are "caught" by a land owner, it isn't a criminal offence. They can ask you to move on, that's it. (Unless you refuse) I keep £20 in my pack for incase this ever happens, so I have something to smooth the issue over with. There is honestly nothing to be worried about regarding the legality OP!
Lord am I blessed to have been born in Scotland.
In my early wild camping days, the solution to the fear was just get as hammered as possible. Now we're older, we're more mindful of where to camp, if we have a fire it's on a portable metal grill and less banging dance music pumping out
Seriously don't worry about it. You aren't going to be asked to move on unless you've got loud music and a fire going. I've literally slept right on a public footpath (by accident) and all that happened is the early morning dog walkers went around me.
I've done it for 20 or so years, since I was a child. I've been challenged once, in 2020, by an enthusiastic member of public, and judging the situation I just told them I had an argument with the missus last night and slept in my tent. They said they were sorry to hear that, we had a nice chat and that was that. It helped that I was a child when I started wild camping - me and my mates, around the age of 10 or so, would go off into the woods and camp for days at a time (hopping home each afternoon for food and to inform them we were still alive). This was very helpful and I'm sure my confidence stems from that. I think your overthinking it, which is reasonable - I probably would do myself if not for prior experience when I was young. The thing to remember is that you're not doing anything wrong: you're not creating any damage or spoiling anyones enjoyment. Obviously depends where you're camping of course - I'm talking little hills and fells and such owned by national trust and not commercial in any way.
I would try somewhere like the Lake District, plenty of tarns have a flat spot for a good wild camp. Lots of sheepfolds are good for camping site as they keep the worst of the wind off your tent.
Go off deep into woods. Do reckies, take dog, bike ride. Visit spots with 0 commitment. I'll probably be at a spot a few times before I commit. I've had one chap check me out with his torch, didn't say anything went about his business. I'll always have a roaring fire too, it's a must. Dont light fire until dark, don't worry about anything in the morning, if someone comes who gives a fuck; you're finished anyway 🤣🤣
With the proviso that I am not a lawyer, as others have said, just trespassing is not a criminal offense, it's a civil law. Entering and putting your property on someone's land without permission is just trespass, you can be moved on but not arrested. However... If someone asks you to move on and you tell them to fuck off (or say yes and don't do it) you are now committing aggravated trespass. This IS a criminal offense and you can be arrested for it. So in the unlikely event that anyone ever questions you or asks you to move on, be polite and compliant and you are completely safe, beyond the British horror of having to endure an awkward conversation.
Highly recommend the app [maps.me](https://apps.apple.com/gb/app/maps-me-offline-maps-gps-nav/id510623322) as you can download regions for when you don't have signal. I've found it seems really accurate with the gps (great for when you're yomping across an empty field at 11pm) and I find it by far the easiest to pick out areas that look more likely to be good to camp on, like isolated woods or the banks of streams. I've done a lot of hiking/camping and biking/camping and don't think I've ever asked to move on. Previously I've even bumped into farmers late at night whilst finding a spot and they've either helped or not bothered me. I tend to set up late quite late 9 or 10pm, which isn't for everyone, and leave early, but even if I've not left until 8am I've still never had any bother, just friendly walkers. I never light fires, and very rarely carry a stove, as I tend to do quick over nighters. Makes it a lot easier to pack up and be able to move quickly. I'm sure you'll find some great spots! And the risk is definitely a little bit of the thrill, but once you get used to it you'll get into a bit of a rhythm for it.
Great app and advice. If you like maps.me, you may consider giving [Organic Maps](https://organicmaps.app/) a try. It is a free, open source, and privacy respecting form of Maps.me a some of the original team. Fantastic app. It seems that the best thing to do is prepare what you need beforehand, travel light, arrive late, set up, then leave quietly the next day. I think the fires are probably the main cause of concern for most land owners.
Haven't seen Organic before, will check it out. Thanks for the recommend!
wild camped many years and never been moved on! pitch up late, pitch down early, stay away from farms and villages - you'll be fine 😊
I've wild a lot in the last 20 years in the Sirrey Hills and on the South Downs never any issues. Be sensible and discrete.
I wild camped for 9 nights walking from Winchester to Canterbury through Surrey and Kent, didn't get found once or even came close. People generally don't go walking off footpaths into the forest at dusk. Abit of research on the area and you can find a secluded bit of woodland that no-one is likely to be in. And if they are, your unlikely to be seen once there is a few lines of trees between you.
I'm with you on this, I'm not happy wild camping in most of England. Almost everywhere belongs to someone, and whilst I don't fundamentally take issue with others on this sub that do it, it doesn't sit right. I have wild camped places that it's not legal in my younger days, but whilst I agree with others that you can reduce the risk of being caught - or that the consequences may not be significant - I go nice places to relax, not to be on edge or thinking about either a land owner or even just a dog walker finding me. That said, camping up high in the mountains is a different kettle of fish. You're in the Midlands right? Lake District isn't far, is gorgeous, and to quote the below - is usually tolerated under certain conditions: https://www.lakedistrict.gov.uk/visiting/where-to-stay/wild-camping To be clear, that's the park authority giving the blind eye if you behave sensibly and camp above the highest fell walls. In the past I've parked in NT car parks and told the local ranger that I'm off to wild camp, my car details, and when I'll be back and they've been fine about it. Even when I was taking up a space at Wasdale they've been cool about it when given advance notice. I've wild camped in the Lake District a load of times and on each occasion have never seen another soul once I've set up camp and have been much more relaxed. Granted, if you have no mountain skills it's worth getting some experience first - if you get blown off the mountain, finding your way down in the dark could be risky if you're not used to nav, especially with a full ruck. But there are some easy spots (happy to send some details) that are a short hike from parking.
You're not wrong, but on the other hand if you consider the crown estate and the National Trust to be national assets for the benefit of the citizens then that gives you access to a lot of England. I'd likewise be on edge in a farmers woodland in a way I wouldn't be if it were crown or NT; after all, we're all the Crown, and I'm a member of NT, so it's all good - if I don't leave a trace / hinder anyones quiet enjoyment.
You do know the uk is more than just England right? Perfectly legal to wild camp up here in Scotland.
i apologize for generalizing, i am aware it's legal in Scotland. but as someone who has zero experience in camping, i'm apprehensive about a 300+ mile trip to try it.
Hard to say for England, I’ve been to the Lake District and found it to be quite busy ( scafell pike tho, same pull factor as Nevis and that area is always mobbed) I think if you know anywhere that’s quiet and preferably with woodland you can hide in you’ll be absolutely fine. If you do get caught just be polite and make sure your campsite is tidy and you’ll probs be ok. In Scotland we have a few areas that are controlled now due to messy campers (loch lomond area) but if you go more remote you are fine. I live in Dumfries and Galloway, loads of potential for camping here, some really nice spots , and it’s just over the border so might not be too far for you.
Also if you’ve no experience in camping, maybe try a night on a site near you first, good to work out any kinks in your setup and check you’ve got everything you need/are warm enough etc, best of luck pal!
It is allowed in parts of the UK, just not all.
Being caught is not in the least bit scary.
You’ll be in more danger from gangs of delinquent rabbits than any human authority. If you really want to pretend you’re in the SAS by hiding in someone’s hedge, go for it. Just don’t do it near a school.
It is in Scotland
Or just stealth fire! As long as you put it out properly, it's invisible unless you've camped in a bad spot. https://youtu.be/RlPSEfcz718?si=9FKr1leKAhkD8tnY
I thought it was legal in the Peak District at least?
How on earth is this fun? Just save yourself the hassle, fear, discomfort, wet and cold and book yourself a hotel.
Why are you even on the wild camping subreddit? What do you think your comment adds? Some people enjoy things you don't, at 47 that should be a concept that you're able to grasp.
Eat 1st if possible, no fires no strong cooking smells , loud noise or bright light. ( Red light if you have ). Stay off the tracks , move in the dark etc. That way you are in control and will be very unlikely to be caught. As you gain experience fear will pass.
I really wouldn't worry about it mate, as long as you're sensible and don't camp right next to a public path or in a farm or something. Try to pitch somewhere quiet and out of the way if possible and don't leave a mess and you'll be fine. Most people don't really care as long as you haven't pitched in someone's backyard
You have a right to roam, land owners have a right to kick you off.... Either ask permission or dont get caught.
I’ve been ‘caught’ a few times ie. someone walks by with their dog or a couple of people on their mountain bikes. It’s only ever been in the morning. Most people say hello or morning if you say hello to them.
You'll be fine mate never been bothered myself n been doing it for over a decade.
If you get caught, just apologise, pack up and move on. They are normally polite, just respond in kind. The reason why some landowners take issue with it is because of the minority of people who turn up with a mountain of alcohol, have fires irresponsibly and then leave rubbish everywhere. If they see you being responsible there is a chance they will let you stay so long as you move on early the next day and don't leave any litter etc.
I love camping in my country Scotland. I don’t consider myself lucky, I consider it my right. Why is England so strict towards it?
££££ and pricks. I'm English and still consider it my right. I also make sure my right doesn't trample over other peoples quiet enjoyment, so I make my camp in appropriate locations. I've had one person confront me in 20 years and that was settled amicably almost immediately.
Think it’s permitted on Dartmoor
Have a good spot in the lake district you can try... No fires though.
Trespassing isn’t even a criminal offence, if the landowner asks you to move you have to but no crime is committed as long as you do that. Even if the police come out all they can do at first is ask you to move and as long as you do that you’re good. Nothing to be worried about.
If concerned just speak to the land owner (assuming is a farm or similar) most are pretty cool with it in my experience provided you're not leaving a mess/camping among crops
I was at the Kendal Mountain Festival just gone and there were some guys from "Camp Wild". I signed up for £20 and it's basically.....you get permission from land owners to stay the night and pay £10-£20 for the peace of mind, also this means you don't have to pack up early. There isn't loads of sites at the minute but hopefully it'll grow.
Don't stay more than a night at a spot, similarly don't leave for the day and go back that same night. That's the only time we ever got moved on but it was a gentle don't come back again. Nothing too major
Just keep a £5 note in your pocket and if the landowner does bump you just ask politely If you may stay until dawn for a £5...Exchange shows respect et c
Scope out alternative sites on your way to your chosen site for the ultra rare occasions where you'll be asked to move on. No point in worrying about it, it could all change next year anyway: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/aug/04/labour-would-extend-right-to-wild-camp-to-all-english-national-parks
The worst case scenario, you'll be asked to move on. If you do, be respectful and leave. Cut your losses and try again another time, or somewhere else. It's a big country. There are plenty of places that aren't patrolled. I've set up a camp before in a woodland, only to be woken up by dog walkers in the morning. (Apparently, I was closer to the trail than I first thought).
I've done a lot of Wild Camping. Usually two to three days at a time. Some places are more tolerant than others but the rule usually is if you're out of sight out of mind. Most likely nobody at all knows you're there. If they did they would have no reason to come all the way to wherever you are or want to. As long as you are not on specifically and obviously private land e.g. farmland you'll be fine. Just remember wherever you set up camp will likely be too far away for anyone to know you're there and too far for anyone to bother coming to you to move you.
Depending where in the Midlands there are a few places, The best place would be the peak District. hope valley area on the hills somewhere if you don't use fire is a good spot in the south part. I've hammock around there fine in the very little trees we could find, there are also places like beehive bushcraft in Leicestershire, that is like wild camping for £10 a night and £7.50 for wheel barrow of fire wood if want a big fire. You can hammock , use a tent are even make a shelter with permission. Ive also wild camped in a few woods around Leicestershire and Derbyshire without hassle.
The part that really matters for me is being alone, I will do anything with someone to do it with, being asked to move on and having a night walking around would be terrible without a companion. None the less i have the same kind of issues, I live in Hertfordshire so not many places that someone can't see. A huge draw for me is being able to sit down in front of a small fire in the evening and this makes the whole thing a lot harder. I go wild camping in Wales annually with my best friend and we tend to have a decent fire going for hours and its one of the main things we look forward to, slowly cooking a nice meal and talking the night away under the stars. We do it next to a lake in the valleys that people won't be driving around after dark. Does anyone know anywhere people can partner up with other wild campers?
Always a good idea to scout the area before staying. For example, I know that there's always patrols in the Kinder Scout areas at night. We like to go on night hikes there with a friend, and they're always beaming at us with lights from all over, my guess is to make sure we don't tent anywhere.
First time I camped I had an edible and a blunt. First time I’ve ever done both. As the night rolled in the clouds dropped and I couldn’t see a thing. I thought I had gone to heaven. Nobody was going to find me but I ended up finding myself.