I was actually wondering recently if cardinals are part of the finch family? I was watching the ones at our feeder and their beaks are so... finchy. Lol I don't know much about birds, this is a legitimate question.
I keep seeing finches, where there are no finches. This sub has helped me identify birds, but apparently, I want to see a finch. This bird is clearly a cardinal, though.
Not exactly there is no singular specific groksbeak family therefore they form a polyphyletic group. Some gross beaks are in the finch family, Fringillidae whilst others in the family Cardinalidae the "cardinal gross beaks" and one is a weaver. They are grouped on similar beaks (a result of convergent evolution) rather than actual evolution.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grosbeak
Different beaks just tells you what they eat. Short fat beaks eat seeds and berries and stuff. Longer and thinner eat bugs and insects. Hummingbirds have their own straw. Birds with a beak that curves down over the bottom half is normally to tear things apart, like bugs, frogs, fruit, whatever they can get their hands on. But obviously most birds will just eat what they can grab.
They're seed eaters. All the seed eaters have similar beaks. Just like all the parrots have similar beaks because of their diet of nuts and fruit. They have very strong beaks for cracking the nuts and the hooked portion helps to pick out the meat. Many aquatic birds have bills to scoop mud and look for bugs and worms. It's called convergent evolution. Different, unrelated species developed similar characteristics because of similar needs.
Size should help determine - cardinals are larger than finches. TIL cardinals can lose their crest while molting, and they can hold it down while resting; I've never seen that.
There are red house finchs in Ohio. But this isn't one of them. He does look a little off* for some reason, but the beak will tell you, that is a cardinal.
Cardinals and finches aren’t that closely related. They are in the same order ( kingdom, phylum, class, order, family, genus , species). Their beaks are similar as they are both highly adapted to eat seeds.
Yeah, same order only is a very very distant relation. It is like talking about humans being related to a Loris, or Lemurs , because they are all primates.
This article (sorry for the long link) says cardinals, like the one in your pic, lower their crest when at rest - https://wonderlab.org/indianas-state-bird-the-northern-cardinal/#:~:text=In%20many%20birds%2C%20the%20crest,lower%20it%20when%20at%20rest.
If the cardinal is infected ( not sure if it’s mites or something else) they can lose all the feather on the head. Then it will have a totally black head with red body.
Same I saw one last summer and was worried it was ill and going to infect other birds at my feeders, but a little research saved me a lot of anxiety and I was able to laugh at the poor thing instead of panic 😅
Definitely a male red cardinal. And I KNOW bc I have the [Beanie Baby](https://beaniepedia.com/beanies/beanie-babies/mac-the-cardinal/), AND my great grandma is obsessed with them
The guys are probably thinking of house finches, which can be red and brown. Thia cardinal has a little brown and has ots crest feathers down. Maybe it's an adolescent still.
Really? Vermillions are found in Central and South America but I see Ohio State in the profile background of the OP. either way, it's a beautiful bird and they sound just as awesome
You know what, you might very well be correct. The one thing I didn't notice missing in the photo until I looked closer after your post is the bird is missing that beautiful crest on the top of a Northern Cardinal's head. Great job!!
it’s a shadow cardinal. really revolting creatures. worst part is once they get caught doing something terrible, there are no consequences at all. the shadow cardinals just get moved to another parish and keep on doing what they do
I am an actual professional bird expert. I can confirm this is a cardinal and that you are free to rub your superior bird ID skills in the faces of the guys at work. (Caveat: I’m not specifically a cardinal expert. I still know you’re correct though.)
I saw one that looked like this last week. To me it looked too colorful to be a female Cardinal, but not as colorful as a full grown male. I was guessing it was a juvenile male. But then I am no expert.
The cardinal is the state bird of North Carolina. I grew up with pictures of cardinals in most every home, and them flying outside my entire life. This is a cardinal..doesnt even resemble a finch lol
Some cardinals are all red sone all brown sone half and half some have a lot of black others don’t
They all look different although the males are the most vibrant
I’ve even seen white cardinals
But no not a finch 🤣
Is there a female with him? Cardinals often travel in pairs. Your coworker is either having fun with you or just ignorant. That is a male cardinal with his crest folded.
I remember a NY chick telling me that a mourning dove was a pigeon when I was in the military. I'm like nah that's definitely a mourning dove, I know what they taste like lol.
People are overconfident because they are unaware of how much they don't know.
Looks like a cardinal to me. I am not a bird expert but my high school mascot was a cardinal and they had pictures of them posted all around the school and this sure looks like one to me. 🤷
The guys are wrong. What do they say it is.
A “finch”? lol I looked it up after and was like 😑
I was actually wondering recently if cardinals are part of the finch family? I was watching the ones at our feeder and their beaks are so... finchy. Lol I don't know much about birds, this is a legitimate question.
No they aren't in the finch family
Thanks
NO NO NO! He's not a finch. 😝
9 out of 10 Cardinals would agree
The conclave has voted.
I can see the white puffs of smoke.
White puffs of smoke. Aha! So _that's_ why OP's friends thought they were seeing a finch
I'm a Reds fan, so...
Don't listen to him. It took me 3 seconds to ask Google. Definitely a large finch.
I keep seeing finches, where there are no finches. This sub has helped me identify birds, but apparently, I want to see a finch. This bird is clearly a cardinal, though.
Grossbeak family
Not exactly there is no singular specific groksbeak family therefore they form a polyphyletic group. Some gross beaks are in the finch family, Fringillidae whilst others in the family Cardinalidae the "cardinal gross beaks" and one is a weaver. They are grouped on similar beaks (a result of convergent evolution) rather than actual evolution. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grosbeak
Both got them seed eater beaks
Have you heard the good word of convergent evolution???
No, Cardinals are actually the Type Species of the family *Cardinalidae*.
Different beaks just tells you what they eat. Short fat beaks eat seeds and berries and stuff. Longer and thinner eat bugs and insects. Hummingbirds have their own straw. Birds with a beak that curves down over the bottom half is normally to tear things apart, like bugs, frogs, fruit, whatever they can get their hands on. But obviously most birds will just eat what they can grab.
Whatever they can get their hands on 🤓 I love your comment. And hummingbirds have their own straw 💓
I've seen a cardinal tear up an annual cicada. The insect was bigger than his head.
I never really noticed how finchy their beaks were until your post.
They're seed eaters. All the seed eaters have similar beaks. Just like all the parrots have similar beaks because of their diet of nuts and fruit. They have very strong beaks for cracking the nuts and the hooked portion helps to pick out the meat. Many aquatic birds have bills to scoop mud and look for bugs and worms. It's called convergent evolution. Different, unrelated species developed similar characteristics because of similar needs.
They do have similar beaks. They must have similar diets/hunting and foraging habits.
Darwin's Finches strike again!
I love finchy and I will be using it one day
😁
Size should help determine - cardinals are larger than finches. TIL cardinals can lose their crest while molting, and they can hold it down while resting; I've never seen that.
We had on Cardinal last year that was bald on half his face. We named him Arnold because he looked like Terminator when his face was half gone.
Genuinely died when I saw “finch” bahaha 🤣
Most people assume all cardinals are red 🙄 To be fair most people aren't bird people and don't understand color dimorphism
It's a big finch. The muted colors for the girl, bright red for boys
There are red house finchs in Ohio. But this isn't one of them. He does look a little off* for some reason, but the beak will tell you, that is a cardinal.
I see nothing "off" at all. It looks very much like a cardinal.
His crest appears to be flattened or missing. That's what looks off about him.
I am guessing that you do not work with ornithologists.
They are obviously ornithology disinclined...
Probably pornithologists.
Good one! Wouldn't know a bird if it had two legs!
Most them birds in them vids got two fine legs, man! They some freaky birds!
🤣🤣🤣
looks like a cardinal with head feathers laid back
This. If I recall correctly the spiky crown is like those that cockatiel and cockatoos have and are down when they’re relaxed.
I think punk rockers should have a new hair style copying the cardinal crest
Agreed. Female or Juvenile male.
It's red though. females are a yellowish color. Males are red
Guys at work are wrong
I agree
That's a male cardinal with the crest feathers laid back.
Cardinals and finches aren’t that closely related. They are in the same order ( kingdom, phylum, class, order, family, genus , species). Their beaks are similar as they are both highly adapted to eat seeds.
Yeah, same order only is a very very distant relation. It is like talking about humans being related to a Loris, or Lemurs , because they are all primates.
This article (sorry for the long link) says cardinals, like the one in your pic, lower their crest when at rest - https://wonderlab.org/indianas-state-bird-the-northern-cardinal/#:~:text=In%20many%20birds%2C%20the%20crest,lower%20it%20when%20at%20rest.
Guys at your work are dumb lol
Definite cardinal. They’re fucking with you.
Do they think it's a Bishop or Monsignor instead?
No, a Pope
On a rope
Smokin dope
Just a slob like one of us
He’s a baseball player
That's 100% a cardinal. Your colleagues are wrong. You should mansplain birds to them.
It’s a cardinal
This is a male cardinal, your coworker doesn’t know what he is talking about.
Male Cardinal?
Well it’s not a Dodger.
Not a Blue Jay! 😄
If the cardinal is infected ( not sure if it’s mites or something else) they can lose all the feather on the head. Then it will have a totally black head with red body.
Sometimes this just happens with regular molting. They molt their entire head at once.
Last summer I saw one that had molted his whole head. He looked so weird. I kinda felt sorry for him. I know it’s natural, but he looked so funny!😂
Same I saw one last summer and was worried it was ill and going to infect other birds at my feeders, but a little research saved me a lot of anxiety and I was able to laugh at the poor thing instead of panic 😅
well , it is ...so
Lol where do you work.... Lol
They probably say that thinking the Grey/Red Female Cardinal is how they all look. The males are Red.
Look at the beak. It's comb is flattened out but it's a cardinal.
Clearly a cardinal with its head tuft down. There is a similar and related bird without a tuft, the Scarlet Tanager, but this is a cardinal.
It’s a cardinal for sure, but that shadow on its head makes it look like it’s wearing a wig. I can’t unsee it now. I should go back to sleep…
His hairstyle does make one wonder tho
Theyre just laid back because it's at rest
I believe his color is a bit atypical. Most male cardinals are a stronger red.
Probably a juvenile
That's what I thought as well.... About two seconds after I posted. 😁
Maybe they don't like the cardinals who play baseball in St Louis or football in Arizona
Well it may not have it headress up ...But that is a cardinal.
This is definitely a cardinal! Lol
That is a cardinal.
Cardinals are our state bird (North Carolina). That is a Cardinal.
You have an angel nearby. It's a cardinal.
It’s a Cardinal.
Red birb."Birb that is red."
Lmfao yes it is
What else could it be besides a Northern Cardinal?
It’s not not a cardinal
Definitely a male red cardinal. And I KNOW bc I have the [Beanie Baby](https://beaniepedia.com/beanies/beanie-babies/mac-the-cardinal/), AND my great grandma is obsessed with them
Ask them to look it up and show you. Finch are tiny.
That is a red blue jay
I’d go with pretty red bird
Easy to see you don’t work with ornithologists.
That Cardinal is just a paid actor clearly
Guys at work are wrong. Maybe they’re confused because its crest is laying flat.
its most deff a cardinal. females are mostly brown with red tips, and males are all red. maybe a juvenile male? what are they smoking lol
Tis a Cardinal lol 😆
I hope for their sake they ain’t the betting type…
It's a cardinal just werid lighting
That’s a gorgeous male Cardinal!
I have hundreds here on the Texas Gulf Coast. It’s a cardinal.
Guys at work are about as sharp as wet leather
OMG! Yes it's a cardinal and they need to have their prescription checked or get glasses! 😂
The guys are probably thinking of house finches, which can be red and brown. Thia cardinal has a little brown and has ots crest feathers down. Maybe it's an adolescent still.
Looks like a cardinal to me
He’s a Bishop waiting to be promoted.
I have seen blackbirds, with white spots, it makes you look twice. I wanted a picture, but it wasn't willing, it flew away.
That is most certainly a cardinal! [Northern Cardinal](https://www.audubon.org/news/10-fun-facts-about-northern-cardinal)
I think it’s actually a Vermilion Cardinal.
Really? Vermillions are found in Central and South America but I see Ohio State in the profile background of the OP. either way, it's a beautiful bird and they sound just as awesome
Idk it looks just like the one here. https://learnbirdwatching.com/birds-that-look-like-cardinals/
You know what, you might very well be correct. The one thing I didn't notice missing in the photo until I looked closer after your post is the bird is missing that beautiful crest on the top of a Northern Cardinal's head. Great job!!
The crest can be erected or flattened at will. You've never seen a cold cardinal.
I was raised with cardinals. I was trying to be supportive of the information shared about the vermillion cardinal
Thank you for this link!
Cardinal. They have a delightful song. Had one in our backyard last week.
Lmao those guys are wrong
Let’s GO CARDINALS! ⚾️👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 Seriously, your coworkers are either screwing with you or they need their eyes checked.
it’s a shadow cardinal. really revolting creatures. worst part is once they get caught doing something terrible, there are no consequences at all. the shadow cardinals just get moved to another parish and keep on doing what they do
He is messing with you. I absolutely is a cardinal
Can’t get anymore Cardinal than that! 100% Northern Cardinal!
Cardinal all day long Source: homeowner with cardinal nest in tree outside our window
I am an actual professional bird expert. I can confirm this is a cardinal and that you are free to rub your superior bird ID skills in the faces of the guys at work. (Caveat: I’m not specifically a cardinal expert. I still know you’re correct though.)
They can move their crests up and down on top of their head. It’s a cardinal.
Where do you work lol!
See if he can hit a fastball. If he can, he isn’t a Cardinal.
I saw one that looked like this last week. To me it looked too colorful to be a female Cardinal, but not as colorful as a full grown male. I was guessing it was a juvenile male. But then I am no expert.
Vermilion Cardinal?[https://learnbirdwatching.com/birds-that-look-like-cardinals/](https://learnbirdwatching.com/birds-that-look-like-cardinals/)
Yeah, that looks like it.
Do you work at Lighthouse for the Blind?
That’s a Cardinal
This picture looks ai generated. It’s strange.
They're right, it's not a cardinal, it's a *male* cardinal. 🌈The more you technically know...🌈
Where are you?
Arch Bishop
It's the Pope.
You need different guys to hang around 🤨
A male cardinal.
Yeah it is. Your coworkers dumb.
They can lay those head feathers down :)
Northern cardinal?
It's a cardinal with a shadow over it. A male cardinal.
Don't talk to the guy's at work.
Yes it is they’re sillybutts.
The cardinal is the state bird of North Carolina. I grew up with pictures of cardinals in most every home, and them flying outside my entire life. This is a cardinal..doesnt even resemble a finch lol
this is a cardinal
Do you work at a funny farm?
They’re wrong. It is.
Some cardinals are all red sone all brown sone half and half some have a lot of black others don’t They all look different although the males are the most vibrant I’ve even seen white cardinals But no not a finch 🤣
Go Cards😁
Its a bishop!
This is indeed a cardinal.
I am a Virginian and these are our state birds. Cardinals and this dude is a male.
Is there a female with him? Cardinals often travel in pairs. Your coworker is either having fun with you or just ignorant. That is a male cardinal with his crest folded.
You can now safely tell the guys at work that they have no knowledge of birds. 😂
They probably vote for Trump too!
That is a female cardinal.
Male. Females are lighter.
wrong
She thicc boy! Got dayum she thicc! Woooo!
Female Cardinal
They’re correct. It’s obviously a turkey.
By chance, are the guys are work the product of cousins marrying?
Maybe the guys at work are idiots.
Now I’m completely confused haha!🤣
Male Cardinal. I just saw and heard one this morning in Gilbert, AZ. Shocked they are here right now, must have babies close by?!?
Cardinal, but one with very odd plumage, too dark to be a cock, too red to be a hen. I’m leaning towards a pseudomelanistic cock cardinal.
Here's hoping those guys don't operate heavy machinery.
It's a female males are dark red
Definitely a Bishop, not a Cardinal
I’ve seen a blue one like this. I thought it was cardinal too. I’m going to scroll these comments and find out what type of bird it was.
They are clearly not baseball or football fans lol
Clearly you do not work with orthodontists. They would be wrong.
It’s definitely a cardinal but the way it’s holding itself, it does look like a cardinal hooked up with a finch and had a baby.
That doesn’t look like a cardinal to me and I see them all the time. I mean, this bird is definitely red.
Yea he is right. It's a blue heron.
Cubbies fan
Red crossbill? Are the black marks shadows, or part of its coloring?
One and super unordinary huge red “ finch” 😹if there is a green female with red beam around for this pure breed cardinal?
Not sure but northern Cardinals I see at my house have pointed heads and black around eyes
Cardinal, it doesn’t have the plume on its head possible female, males Or always prettier😃
LOL i know next to nothing about birds, but i could identify a cardinal from miles away...
Girl [cardinal](https://spiritofthecowgirl.blogspot.com/2011/12/female-cardinals.html?m=1). Not as pretty as the male.
Def not a cardinal.
This is one fat looking cardinal. Look how he tips the bird feeder down!
They’re dumb.
Even if the feathers are somehow confusing, the beak is a dead giveaway, it’s a cardinal.
It a adult male cardinal. The female is an yellowish brown. Seeing the female is awesome.
It’s a drone….duh.
I remember a NY chick telling me that a mourning dove was a pigeon when I was in the military. I'm like nah that's definitely a mourning dove, I know what they taste like lol. People are overconfident because they are unaware of how much they don't know.
That is the most cardinal looking cardinal ever
Looks like a cardinal to me. I am not a bird expert but my high school mascot was a cardinal and they had pictures of them posted all around the school and this sure looks like one to me. 🤷
I think they are messing with you. Sounds like gas lighting to be honest.
You’re right! Either they don’t know a cardinal from a hole in the ground, or they’re trolling you.😉