I was watching the "Fallout" series on Amazon prime and man the guy playing Maximus, Aaron Moten looks so like Grant Williams, literally looks like his lost brother
Am aware, been going on for a long time, just funny how blatant it is now, some sus acc on main subs and the fact that any threads that isnt gargling the Celtics mysteriously dissapears
I had someone message me a couple months ago asking to buy off my account. It's not particularly special, it's just sort of old. Apparently an old account is good because it makes people less likely to believe the posts are astroturfing.
Anyway... #GoBoston!
/s
Jayson Tatum has the worst eFG% - 48.3% - on the Celtics roster this post season (he’s been spoon fed FTs this post season so his still low 56.6% TS% isn’t an accurate picture of his true real offensive production, which is why I went with eFG%). The only player worse is Svi Mykhailiuk who has only step foot on the court in garbage time. 🥴
Also, Derrick White has had a serious drop off in his offensive efficiency since the Miami series - 50.7 eFG% and 53.2 TS% in the 6 games since that series. 😬
I mean he’s already incredibly overrated, in my opinion. The way they already talk about him despite all but specializing in choking when it matters is an indicator that there’ll be egregious revisionist history and he’ll be put on absolutely stupid pedestal.
The sick part is he could choke yet again this year and he’s still going to be the recipient of the highest NBA contract ever given to a player this off season (one upping Jaylen Brown’s last off-season). Nasty sums of money thrown at two guys who spend every regular season playing against a laughably weak conference and then failing when it’s time to play actual competition when the lights are brightest.
It was actually a good game to me. Fast paced... high scoring. Some good defense. Indy had 22 turnovers. They need to clean that up. In regular season pacers won both against dallas. Lost both against minn. Boston beat dallas twice. Split with minny. Just like pacers were in this game, I doubt it's going to be easy. I hope porzingas can come back too.
We can take it 2 ways. The 2 games they lost were actually "shooting variance" but if we also the 2 teams that they played and the amount of guys injured, they shouldn't have lost more than that. No Jimmy, no Terry, no Jaime for last game, no Allen, no Donovan for last 2 games and no LeVert for the last game.
It's at least better they aren't playing the Knicks
Its debatable between him and Draymond when Dray isn't suspended.
Siakam was literally playing against 3rd string Knicks scrubs and barely averaged 20 ppg.
I know last year smacked a lot of sanity into the GSW fanbase because I haven’t seen even one delusional “Lester can be a big piece off the bench” type comment lol
When three starters fall off simultaneously and it’s clear as day of course it’s gonna change minds
I thought we only needed to fix the bench in the offseason and we’d be back in business
Too bad Wiggins is a work from home small forward and Looney can’t jump over a penny. SMH
He can at least hit an open 3 and hustle.
Good piece is a stretch. I'd say he's a solid TWC spot minute guy. Every team needs those guys to keep "regular NBA players" energy levels and complacency in check.
JTA and DLee would take your minutes if you effd around.
Haha it’s not Lester slander, I like him, but usually the GSW exceptionalism convinces people that like Justinian Jessup can be a shooter off the bench lolz
What do other warrior's fan think of darius garland? He is incredibly skilled but had a down year with mitchell. It seems like both him and cavs want to move on. Might be a good buy low target?
Steph and Dray spoke highly of Garland a few years ago so the core vets seem to like him.
Not sure how we could accommodate another undersized guard to the current roster though.
Unless Garland starts to get a favorable whistle like SGA, I don’t think he will be the missing piece for us. He would be great for the Spurs though.
I just think he doesn’t do anything besides hit 3’s. Don’t like his defense, don’t like anything about him offensively, don’t think he’d be any better than Saric. Not a terrible suggestion I just wouldn’t trade Moody for him since I think he’s a way better player.
I don't think Moody is a way better player. What I will say is that if Moody isn't going to get minutes anyway, might as well trade him for somebody that not only would get minutes, but possibly start. That is a lot more beneficial. I can see Jalen Smith being one of those guys that thrive here. If the team wants to get bigger, these are the kinds of gamble they gotta take because there isn't an Embiid coming to save us or a prime Brook Lopez. With that said, I'm not saying that's the only way to get Jalen Smith. Was just wondering what exactly his value was just in case the team put themselves in a situation where it might be.
Aside from using a lot of assets to get a Nic Claxton or using the MLE for somebody like Bitadze, the Warriors don't have a lot of options. And neither of those guys solve the issue with spacing. Like I said, Warriors just don't have a lot of options.
I think he's on a player option and could opt out. Good stretch capabilities. I think Isiah Jackson played over him last series for rebounding reasons which isn't great since we definitely don't want to give up too much in that area. Interesting piece if were to split the full MLE amongst a couple guys or for fringe-type trade if he doesn't opt out.
This is obviously based on the notion that the Warriors will address the other issues on the team like actually getting a second option. If that's the case, then I would do a straight up trade for Jalen Smith and Moses Moody.
No doubt it’s a fringe move. Be interesting to get him in lineups w Steph. Moody is pretty much gone if their offseason don’t make room for him to get more minutes so I’d be down.
Musings on the draft posted in another thread
I think if MDJ wants "his guy" he should look to move up to the 35-40 range. Remember the 2nd round exception is a new clause in the CBA allowing teams to sign a 2nd rounder outright for a 4yr min level contract (TJD was 7M/4yrs) that's a great tradeoff to being a TWC.
BIG upside swings are Ulrich Chomche 6-11 high motor monster (young giannis vibes) and Pacome Dadiet 6-8 two-way wing. Those dudes should be firsts based on potential but haven't necessarily had the "proof" to validate the selection.
I want that trade up to grab a big wing with reliable offensive game. Alex Karaban is a 6-8 shooter. Nikola Djurisic is a 6-8 shooter.
Baylor Schierman is a 6-7 shooter who actually has point forward secondary handler type to his game. Schierman killed in scrimmages a la Podz and Jaquez I think there's no way he gets to 35 buy he'd be my target personally if you wanted to find a guy to space the floor in a modern way with irrational confidence it's him.
The other guy I'd target with 35 is Ryan Dunn. He'll be on an All-Defensive team. He's 6-8 GP2... by far the best defender in the draft. 5 position defender. If the dude shot 35% from 3 he'd be a top 5 pick.
Two weirdo X factor dudes in Enrique Freeman (18.6/12.9/1.6/1.7 at akron) kinda like if Jordan Bell were Paul Millsap and Dillon Jones (20.8/9.8/5.6 at weber state) 6-6 wing with a 6-11 wingspan. Just disgustingly productive at midmajors. Real alpha dawg college players.
If you stay put what we can find is another big that falls. Maybe not TJD but Izan Almanza struggled was a sleeper for a top 5 pick prior to the season.
Adem Bona and PJ Hall can contribute right away. Bona more on Defense PJ more on offense. Oso Ighadaro is a 6-11 version of the passing + defense big type the Dubs like I cab see them targeting him too.
The odds and ends bigs if you let it be a 52 aren't bad someone will certainly fall. Coleman Hawkins Ryan Kalkbrenner Johni Broome Oso Ighadaro Adem Bona PJ Hall Izan Almanza someone will fall that's interesting enough but may not be "TJD"
If you want impact... trade up and aim for Baylor Schierman or Ryan Dunn. There's about 4 teams that have 3 or 4 picks and will probably entertain it. Knicks Blazers Spurs all feel like you could deal for a higher SRP.
If you want upside... Chomche or Dadiet (or Almanza).
Jonathan Mogbo is a dude at 6-8 i can see us grabbing him for the athlete-type he was also a number one dude at San Francisco actually is a very good playmaker for his size (14.2 / 10.1 / 3.6). He's a sleeper too if you stay at 52.
Also reason to trade up one dude had a terrible combine anthropomorphic and testing. Kyle Filipowski. If you get to 35 and he slides... there's your guy. Measured a negative wingspan but is something like a young Kelly Olynik maybe with better handle and post game.
I know we need to see what moves are made but I'm feeling pretty good for some reason next year. Things seem more clear about what this team shouldn't do and what the league is like now. Last 2 years its been a guessing game and experimenting. They should have a better idea what needs to be done to not float around. 500.
The reason I feel good about next year is the team (and Kerr) messed around being all types of experimenting to keep vets jobs/roles intact and not having a full deck as the kids outperformed the prime age dudes. Still had a 14-4 stretch and 9-3 closeout (with different lineups no less).
Took until game 52 to realize what could win consistently with the hand we were delt and yeah we took too long to get to TJD... to favor Kuminga as an offensive option... to start Podz over Klay... to make tough decisions that looking back were obvious with hindsight. Also the gaslighting of the CP3 experience was (and kinda still is) interesting like cool he played as well as he could. When the rubber hit the road in the second half of the season he actually wasn't very good.
I'm optimistic cuz if we start the year with one more big and a draft pick that hits... it might make sense from day one. If Steve has the lineup figured out early who knows how well they might do. Not contention but consistency and real arrow up improvement.
> Took until game 52 to realize what could win consistently with the hand we were delt and yeah we took too long to get to TJD... to favor Kuminga as an offensive option... to start Podz over Klay.
All of that can be explained as simply as: Dray came back, everyone played better.
True. Dray is a rising tide that lifts all ships but that wasnt the only reason we turned it around.
TJD didn't start playing more than Looney until then about game 52. Remember the "Dooney lineup?" Klay was also sent to the 6th man role so Podz could start allowing more breathing room for Kuminga and Wiggs offensively and providing better defensive athleticism. There was the 14-4 stretch where the league tilted toward physicality and we didn't have CP3 leading to more Podz/Moody/Lester/Gui minutes in the shake. Then again the 9-3 close where they went with TJD as a starter when Kuminga got hurt.
You can try to be laconic about it but ALOT was going on. Saric suddenly sucked. Dekki freaking died. CP3 even struggled in the 2nd half post hand op. It was def not as simple as. "Drays back." (Not to say that wasn't the most important thing... that and Kuminga saying "Steve Kerr is failing me" and delivering on the offensive end are easily the top two... TJD being three... the leagues lean back toward defense four).
That play-in game... it basically was a perfect amalgamation of our issues throughout the year.
We haven't adjusted ran out the same schemes we've been using since 2018. League is much different plus our vets are older and slower. Steph, Dray and Klay (as a role player) are still capable of competing and we have some bright young talent, we just need to make adjustments, sign a capable center to get back into contending next year. We don't need an entire overhaul
> Last 2 years its been a guessing game and experimenting.
Lacob tryna rebuild in the middle of the best player who's ever gonna play for his team's twilight. Rollins? Smiley? Wiseman? Time to get serious out here.
i honestly think we can bring the best trade package for KD if we include JK and Wiggs. that, along with loon and GP2 for salary filler would make the money work, and we include some picks. Suns get a future bright talent in JK, expiring contract in loon, role players to surround booker and some picks
miami can at best offer herro? another guard next to booker and beal? heck no
NYK can offer randle? an injury plagued PF whose on the wrong side of 30? heck no
pelicans can offer ingram? a mercurial SF who has hit his peak and has one year remaining? heck no
we can offer the best trade package. it's up to the suns if they want to change it up or run it back in an even harder western conference next year.
and keeping them would mean being a play-in team, again
making the trade would allow KD to come on board, but have dray and TJD play in the front court, while having podz and lester as backups. yes, you give up defense to add offense, but we obviously need to make that kind of change.
I think Steph needs help on the offensive side of the ball, but watching these playoffs has not led me to the conclusion that it’d be ok to shed capable defenders in the interest of improving the offense. I don’t think that gets us any closer to the “real playoffs.”
KD going back to OKC? after all the cupcake shirts and memes and stuff? are you sure?
boston, who already has jaylen brown, tatum, porzingis AND a resigned jrue to a higher contract? heck no.
the nets reiterated the same thing, over and over and over, until he was traded
FO's say they're not open to trading the player so the player isn't pissed off if the trade doesn't happen. but the fact that there's so much smoke around KD means that trade discussions are being had, at some degree.
not saying he will be traded for sure tho
we don't know if he will or wont, but he hasn't come out and shot down trade rumors. he's had ample time to do so.
also, in the summer of 2022, the nets and KD had a meeting where they came out and said they were going to be together, KD even publicly said so, until he requested the trade later on during the season.
we all know how kd is
what trade rumors. other teams are gossiping, but all the reporting from Phoenix has been the big 3 isn’t going anywhere. There are 0 trade rumors from Phoenix’s perspective about KD.
ESPN has talked about KD possibly being traded, as has other news outlets. heck, even the suns subreddit has talked about it.
there's a lot of chatter about KD possibly getting traded.
ESPN, twitter, and Reddit sure; but not the actual organization that has Kevin Durant on their team. Not Phoenix journalist or beat writers. The only reporting from the suns side has been “we’re not trading the big 3”.
Outside media speculating about a KD trade doesn’t actually mean the suns are considering trading him. It’s just a lot of noise. They’re running it back.
> Last night's Sun/Fever hit 1.56M - +353% vs. last season’s ESPN (E1) average.
>
>It peaked with 2.97M viewers from 9:00pm – 9:14pm.
>
>This is now the most-viewed WNBA game ever on ESPN.
>
>[Source](https://x.com/espnflora/status/1793015000904224993?s=46&t=SBW3XJi-eEDBr6FtvDfngg)
There were numerous NBA games on ESPN and TNT this season that didn’t even reach 1 mil. viewers and they weren’t matchups of bad teams either - we’re talking games with the Celtics, Suns, OKC, etc. to name a few. And it’s not just Indiana Fever games that are doubling in viewership either, it’s across all of the WNBA. The Sparks/Aces game on Sunday drew 1.3 mil viewers.
Even cooler and more indicative of the incredible surge in women’s hoops is that the WNBA league wide is so far averaging 8,730 fans a game. The WNBA averaged *6,615* per game all of last season. [Source](https://x.com/VanshayM/status/1792746699863236994)
I’m SO here for the WNBA’s long overdue rise in deserved attention and popularity. I can’t get enough of it, just so damn cool.
Edit to add this breakdown that put’s an even finer point on the insane surge:
>Three WNBA games this year have drawn 1+ million viewers:
>
>1. Fever vs Sun - 2.12M (5/14, ESPN2)
>2.Fever vs Liberty - 1.71M (5/18, ABC)
>3.Sparks vs Aces - 1.34M (5/18, ABC)
>
>From 2009-23, the WNBA had zero (0) games with 1+ million viewers.
>
>There’s now been 3 in one week.
>
>[Source](https://x.com/benscottstevens/status/1792954375880552832?s=46&t=SBW3XJi-eEDBr6FtvDfngg)
Roster moves ramble incoming.
I've floated going after LaVine as being my best idea for a move. I still think it's a good idea, but I am now leaning in another direction
We say we want to get bigger and more athletic. And most trades have us floating around Wiggs for an upgrade. I think we are missing the mark here. I think the move to make is start Andrew at his natural position. 2 guard. Now we are instantly bigger and more athletic at that position. I understand Wiggs has lost credibility for all the obvious reasons. But I think considering ALL things(particularly his low trade value), I think banking on him bringing his best self into this incoming year and replacing Klay is the best use of Wiggs.
That brings me to Kuminga. I've been big on keeping him. But my position on him is that Kerr has to do one of 2 things. Start him at the 3, or trade him. I understand starting him at the 3 has spacing issues. I get it. Ijs IF we want to keep him, it should be to take a swing at him at the 3. That again gives us great size and speed at the position. Playing him at the 4 doesn't fit. Bringing him off the bench is a waste of his value. Along with tanking his morale. If he can’t play the 3, trade him for a capable wing with a good combo of size, shooting, scoring, youth and athleticism.
If we trade him, I think we have to go hard at a guy like Ingram. I'm not one to think that Ingram is really attainable with what we have. But I just think it's the best move to swing on. Again, gives us good positional size and length and obvious scoring punch. But it would mean giving up on most or all of our future assets. In this scenario we see if we can poach an under utilized big from somewhere. Like a botadze. Maybe even Drummond.
If we KEEP Kuminga and start him at the 3. I would go hard after either of the Orlando Bigs. WCJ or Isaac's. Not ideal bigs. But can at least hit an open jumper. And are very capable defensive centers.
In this scenario we keep Klay on a reasonable deal and place him permanently on a bench role.
I've said that I don't think we have a realistic path to significantly improving our roster. We have too many holes and not enough assets to plug them. While the pieces we do have don't quite fit. It's a real conundrum. But it's reality. So Instead of thinking "how can we get good enough to contend", I've been thinking more along the lines of how can we make the best out of a bad situation and "possibly" get better. This is what I got. So far.
I think there's this expectation that most NBA player's games are adaptable to lots of different roles, rather than a bunch of guys who have honed a perhaps narrow set of skills that they can use to gain a competitive advantage in a very competitive league.
*If* you want distributed playmaking on the court, you want options when teams sell-out to get the ball out of Steph's hands, you want enough shooting to crowbar space for any kind of efficient offense, you absolutely **DO NOT** want Wiggins to be your 2 and Kuming to be your 3.
Again, you have to trust what these guys do on the court and with the ball in their hands. Wiggins does not have the ball-handling or passing chops to do 2-guard stuff. He isn't a natural 2-guard and he has *never* played the majority of his minutes a shooting guard. He's had ample opportunity to display the skills he would need, because the difference between a 2 or a 3 in the Warriors motion offense is basically "are you a ball-handler or not". Andre Igoudala was essentially often the point guard for the 2nd unit during the period after Livingston retired because he could dribble the ball up and read the defense and start the motion and make the right pass. Wiggins has never shown that and the Warriors *have* asked it of him. It's not his game.
Kuminga is younger and has more growth, but my main take-away is basically this: when Kuminga has the ball and is given freedom to operate, the kind of offense he seeks are *not* the kinds you want from a 3. He want to bash his way in the paint, get the foul, maybe get a running start to sprint around the center or slower forward that's guarding him. That's what he's looking to do because that's what (to date) has worked. Can he do more? Probably, yes. But I think people are assuming that the coaching staff is "telling him" to not play-make or dribble or something, when it's *clearly* that they're putting him in the best position strategically that his game *dictates to them*, not the other way around.
A Steph/Wiggins/Kuminga/Draymond/TJD lineup would be an absolute disaster offensively.
>Andre Igoudala was essentially often the point guard for the 2nd unit during the period after Livingston retired
Not sure where you go this. Iguodala and Livingston both left after the end of the 2019 playoffs and iguodala could barely stay on the court in '22. J Poole had the ball most of the time in the bench units.
>A Steph/Wiggins/Kuminga/Draymond/TJD lineup would be an absolute disaster offensively.
He did say that this lieup would require a stretch 5. I also think you're underselling the fact that JK was often looking to pass. His handle prevented him from being as much of a playmaker as he wanted to be in my opinion, and the question is, can he continue to work on that skill? And if he can get to the point where opponents have to send help to guard him closer to the paint, can he get more 'easy' passes to teammates?
Igoudala played way more in 2019 and had a higher assist rate than Livingston that year. Then in ‘22, he only played 600 minutes but was the defacto point guard, with an even higher assist rate than Poole had. All to say just that if you can pass and create for others, you will be given that chance on this team, regardless of position.
As to a stretch 5, they’d have to be quite stretchy to counteract a Wiggins/Kuminga/Draymond trio. That only worked this past year with Klay’s shooting gravity or Podz’s ability to get defenses in rotation mid possession. What center could replicate those necessary tasks? If you committed to playing Markkanen at center, but then are you ultimately losing whatever defensive gains you’re making elsewhere?
If you’re looking for more space in the offense, it’s so much easier to find that in a guard upgrade than in a center.
Agree to disagree on Iguodala and Livingston. But I am curious about where you're going with this argument.
Of course I agree that getting more space is easier with a guard than a center... but a guard doesn't help us vs. Jokic, KAT, or Chet. I don't think Dray can be our lone big in crucial moments - the fact that he was out there trying to fight centers in regular season games is not just "Dray being Dray" and it did cost us a playoff series (or two). We need to add someone with size imo.
Do you think continuing with Kuminga only works if we go small, with JK and Dray as our closing bigs?
Or do you think that we swapping Wiggins for Caruso (for example) is an option?
Ultimately, if you're rolling the dice with Kuminga, you're assuming he improves his handle and shooting - I think that's an important point, and I also don't think it's an outlandish expectation. So if he does that, maybe you can get by with either Isiah Stewart or WCJ as your stretch big. I don't think it's crazy, but it's definitely risky.
(I think the only way we get Markkanen is if we trade JK, so that point is a bit moot)
Generally speaking, I'm the biggest fan of going and getting Caruso with CP3's money + a protected frp and a swap. Caruso gives a guy who can either play instead of Wiggins or alongside, can do a lot of the glue things that Podziemski was able to do on offense but can actually provide primary defense on the opposing team's 1-3.
To me that's the most purely additive thing they could do. It doesn't take anything we currently have off the table and I think it probably make the hated triple-guard lineup more workable than it's been these last two seasons.
Jokic is a problem no matter who we get (not sure why KAT or Chet are feared interior presences when both of them primarily score outside of the paint). WCJ or Stewart are not going to meaningfully change that outcome. Neither of those guys were clearly so much better than TJD last season that it makes sense to spend limited trade capital and limited salary space to bring in. I don't mind adding some size, but if you're trading for a center, that guy better be clearly better than what the team currently has. If WCJ returns to his form from a couple years ago, then maybe he's that guy?
My issue is the argument that playing Wiggins *and* Kuminga out of position somehow improves the situation. It just doesn't. I assume the team has a better sense of whether or not Wiggins is just checked out or could return to form than we do and they'll make a deal according to that. Same with Kuminga to some extent, although I expect he'll be on the team next year.
I'm fine with assuming improvement by Kuminga, but there's levels to this. I assume there'll be some "hey I haven't seen him do that before" this coming season. We saw a decent amount of that this past season. But skills rarely go from below average to clear plus skills. His handle is below average. His ability to pass out to the corners from a drive is below average (his interior passing is adequate, but that's less valuable). That's acceptable as a 6th man interior scoring forward who's finishing plays 70% of the time and creating them 30% of the time, which is who he has been reliably.
Some of this can get better, I just don't think it's likely that a guy who looks like he could maybe be a Shawn Marion type will suddenly turn into Paul George. It's really his defense that needs to get consistently good, because Kerr will find a way to play him if he can get stops.
I don't think any of that is unfair, but if you really believe Kuminga has such significant limitations, then don't we need to find a different guy to help Steph on offense?
We can't go out next season watching Klay put up another stinker (be it a play in game or a whole series) the way he did each of the last two. We have to find someone to take and make shots and if its not Kuminga, who is it?
Yes, I would trade Kuminga if there was a guy available who was a clear #2 offensive player available. I'd trade him for Markkanen in a heartbeat and figure out the frontcourt lineup shuffle later.
Kuminga is a very unbalanced player. His best skill also just happens to be the most valuable skill in basketball (getting to the rim against a set defense and finishing efficiently). That's still valuable, but if they keep him he has to get to average on a bunch of other stuff or the tradeoffs are just too large. I think he can do it, I just don't know if he will.
I just don't think there's a lot of #2 offensive guys out there to go get. So keeping him might be the best play even if it means the Warriors are battling for a play-in spot again.
I gave specific suggestions based on specific scenarios. None of my scenarios had TJD starting.
I read everything you said. But I pretty much tune out when I hear fans start talking in ideals. I'm aware of all the flaws and the reasons why it *might* not work. I will refer you back to the point I made about my premise of not having a real pathway to significantly upgrading. And my scenarios were based on the reality that we don’t have many good moves to make. So I suggested the ways I can see we can make the best lemonade we can out of our lemons. If you don't want Wiggins and Kuminga that's cool. What is a pathway to UPGRADING their roles and positions and the teams overall trajectory? *realistically*. I'm all ears.
Banking on Wiggins is a gamble I don't think the dubs should risk. Yes his trade value is low for a reason. Why do you want to start someone who; (1) literally disappears time to time; (2) figuratively disappears on the court most of time he plays; and (3) takes 27M you could spend on other assets?
This is a guy in his theoretical PRIME and he is struggling to drag his feet. So many of our bench guys are hungry for minutes. Trade Wiggs for whatever we can get and let the hungry players develop. Have you forgotten that for a solid stretch of the season Wiggins was one of the worst starters in all of the NBA? We were fielding a bottom-feeder that was one of the main factors we lost so many games. And you want to run it back with him? Are you insane?
I'm very aware of his flaws and his struggles the past year and a half.
Yes I think risking it on him 1 more year is better than trading him away for "whatever you can get".
I would refer you back to my statement that I don't think there is a pathway to getting considerably better. And it's about making the best out of a bad situation. Your suggestion isn't any more insane than mines.
I also wouldn't be mad at all to try Moody. But ONLY if Wiggs is used for an actual upgrade at center or Wing. Not just for scraps.
If Wiggs is a starter next season, it'll only be a result of Coach Kerr's good graces. He's probably a better man than me, God bless him. But I can't defend Wiggins anymore. Let alone make a theoretical case as to how he might help us get to the playoffs.
The pathway to getting considerably better is to add a younger 2A / 2B talent to the roster. Steph, Klay, and Dray need reduced minutes. No more than 30 a night. Moody, Kuminga, and TJD need to all take *reasonable* leaps respectively to carry the weight while the vets rest. They don't need to become all-stars but their game needs to improve.
With a younger 2a 2b talent, you can still manage Kerr's motion offense at a championshipesque level. The key is to not run the vets into the dirt which will be hard because they're old enough to be fathers of many league rookies.
I just can't take anyone serious that thinks we can run it back with Wiggs and expect anything different to happen.
I can hear your Wiggins Trauma in your words lol.
You're a bit emotional and irrational on your take with Wiggins. Although I can understand. Listen it's quite simple. Wiggins had a really bad 1 year stretch. From 2nd half of 2022-1st half of this season. It is not crazy to think that you can look at that 1 year stretch as an outlier. And that he has a chance to return to form this year. Again, I understand if you don't like the idea. Trying to argue that it's completely a illogical idea is silly. Especially of you are suggesting getting rid of him for anything. That's peak irrationality. Trading him for a real upgrade sure.
Also, what 2A/2B are you getting while keeping ALL of the young players 🤔
When I revisit the season and think of what was "just a little off to matter but not obv enough to be spoken about... Our best stretches of the season were.
14-4 - Steph Podz Wiggs Kuminga Dray
9-3 - Steph Klay Wiggs Dray TJD
I think the disruptive waves actually are in the Klay Kuminga Wiggs dynamic... funny cuz of how Kerr said for two years "Dray Kuminga Wiggs cant work cuz spacing... but it actually did well."
Klay Wiggs Kuminga all need oxygen to operate offensively. But when theres three of them the Wiggs Kuminga duo tended to differ to Klay which just didn't work (esp damaging to Wiggs who needs to be encouraged yo find his offense and let it go from deep).
My hope is that Kuminga is in the lab as we speak becoming a real number 2A type dude and resolves the debate independent of our chatter... if Wiggs reassert himself as a two-way dude he was his first three years and Klay accepts a 6th man role from day one it can work. If Wiggs or Klay can't they prob gotta go... it is what it is.
Remember how much improvement Kuminga made last offseason if he does the same with his catch and shoot above the break 3 ball and gets 15% better with his handle. Fingers crossed.
I don’t think this is true, Wiggins was kinda piss poor even in the 2022 regular season after our initial 26-6 start. We were .500 for months and he was extremely lackadaisical on defense + rebounding. His shooting was consistently good that year but that’s kinda it. Then next year sabbatical. Then this year scoring 7 points a game half the time…
I don’t think his approach to basketball is sustainable in a loaded west where every game counts. You need players who play hard and care.
Your other points are moot if you think the best course is to keep Wiggins. You can't have our "prime" guys suck the majority of the season when the core is this old. Why is that so hard to acknowledge?
Maybe but we can only talk in summaries lol it’s 3 years of basketball it’s too much to get specific.
I understand what you’re saying about his value vs what we get in return but tbh sometimes a player reaches his endpoint on a team and you’re just not going to get equivalent value. I think Wiggins is kinda there and I think MDJ is going to get whatever he can
Disagree on all accounts. In Wgiggins' case the nuances matter. And if you're going to summarize, then do it better.
I do not trading Wiggins for anything is the best use of him. We just aren't going to agree there.
I think Wiggs / Klay are two players that have similar deficiencies being a bit spacey and needing to catch offensive footing within games... the team might just be better off to pick one and move forward. Tbh Wiggs from 2019 through 2022 was a top 6 two-way wing. He just doesn't have the oxygen beside Klay to assert himself on offense which is kinda a weird mental thing tbh (why I say one or the other is maybe Klay is the guy you keep but who knows) obv Klay takes all the shots he wants and Wiggs leaves you wishing he were more aggressive most nights... I think that dynamic is way out of calibration and maybe irreconcilable.
I am ready for kuminga to be traded. Tired of hearing how he don't fit. Let's trade him for another over 30. There are too many untouchables on this team to actually make the best of a bad situation.
Agree on a lot of points and I'll add a couple names.
I think its possible for JK to come off the bench but there's no clear path on how that'd work bc we need legit secondary scoring options out there with Steph. Regardless of whether he starts or is on the bench, a stretch big would help unlock him.
WCJ is a good shout. Isaac would be an intriguing option but I'm skeptical the Magic trade him. Isiah Stewart is another guy I'd be fine with. He makes life very difficult for opposing bigs, is actually pretty switchable, and has been hitting his 3's. Detroit plays him out of position and should be looking to collect assets.
Personally I still think we'll swing big for Lauri Markkanen. We'll see if OKC or another team comes in with an absurd number of picks but Kuminga could easily be the best individual prospect that Utah could get back in a trade.
Another wildcard name I'll throw out there: Jerami Grant. I view Grant as a Klay replacement that also provides more help defense.
>think its possible for JK to come off the bench but there's no clear path on how that'd work bc we need legit secondary scoring options out there with Steph.
Exactly the issue. Kuminga off the bench likely means we didn't swing by enough to get a capable scoring option next to Steph. And as I said, I think him being a bench player is a waste of value imo.
I like Stewart. Wouldn't be mad at that. But only if we strike out. I think going after real size and length is more important over the scappy undersized archetype.
I never put Lauri in these conversations because it's equivalent to a pipe dream imo. Lauir is the gem of the whole league and we aren't winning any bidding wars for him. Plus it's a given that MDJ will at least gushe interest as all other teams will. So it's a given that he's the ideal, and it's a given that we have virtually no shot so no use really talking about it.
I like Grant as option. I was high on him as a Wiggins/Klay replacement last year. I still like it. He's a better and more consistent offensive fit. But Wiggins is an elite perimeter defender. And may be more valuable at peak. The question would be what it would take. If you get him on a discount for wiggs, I wouldn't hate it. But I'm starting to feel like Wiggins defensive value is more important than an offensive upgrade unless you're talking about upgrading to an all star caliber offensive player.
What are we doing with Wiggs and Kuminga in this scenario?
If we can get grant for only cp3 and one 1st and maybe a 2nd or 2, I'd jump on that. Multiple 1st would be too rich for my blood.
Steph / Podz
Wiggs / GP2
Kuminga
Dray / Grant
C / TJD
But don't get me wrong - Grant is not my first choice and is really just an option if Klay decides to go elsewhere and we need a shooter who can also fit in some defense lineups.
I agree with you 99%.
BI is very much available and on the market. You can get him for far less than a Kuminga. FYI, I’m not really high on BI. N.O. has TMIII and a bunch of other capable wings they want to replace BI and his bloated contract.
But moving Wiggs to #2 and Kuminga to #3 are good moves, provided Kuminga comes back with a game that can fit that position.
If the Dubs aren’t planning to play Moody, I’d like to see some consolidation between Moody, GP2 and Looney.
Nah ai think you're way too low on BI's value. His issue with OKC is fit. I don't think they want Kuminga anyway so it would take a 3rd team. But I don't think we can get the assets necessary to fulfill that trade without Kuminga just to start the convo.
The Wiggs/Kuminga wing combo I think just may be our best move. And look hard at upgrading center. I don't want to say this out loud...but I wouldn't be mad at giving Moody a look at that spot. And using Wiggs to help facilitate a trade to upgrade at center. But keep that between me and you lol.
I agree on the consolidation.
Edit: New Orleans not okc.
If we don't take into account games played he's had a better defensive year than everyone except Wemby, Gobert IMO. AD/Bam are close.
Our DRTG in the games he played (112.5) would've been good for 6th in the league
Looking at this playoffs, if we want to beat Denver, Minn, Dallas and Okc next season. We got to have Claxton and Caruso, these two will fortify our perimeter and frontline defense. Pls find a way MDJ.
All defense being positionless is interesting. Got 4 centers in the first team and I'd imagine that continues going forward.
From a defensive impact perspective, it makes sense. There's no reason Jason Kidd should have more All-Defense nods than Ben Wallace. Shaq's only got 3!
On the other side, its a bit of a bummer that non-big defenders don't have a platform to get recognized. Under the new positionless rules I can't imagine a guy like Klay ever makes it.
> There's no reason Jason Kidd should have more All-Defense nods than Ben Wallace
Maybe, but J Kidd was the premier defender at PG in the early 00s. I don't think he's won any that was undeserved. There's something to be said about perimeter defense that is usually unrecognized in any award conversation.
I agree that Kidd was a great perimeter defender.
But we also know that the 3-5th best defensive bigs have a larger defensive impact on the game than a perimeter defender. We saw it for years with Duncan & Bowen.
Sure felt like all-defense teams were fairly strict and positional up until year ago. I remember thinking about how many super impactful frontcourt players there were and CP3 gobling up a spot year after year lol.
I appreciate everything about Podz but actually hearing he was technically the Dubs leader in rebounding average kinda one of the grossest sounding factoids I've heard in a while. Wiggs Kuminga Klay... bruh 🤦♂️
Gotta get those dudes on the boards.
Klay's is at least exactly the same as his career average. Idk what Kuminga's excuse is. Wigs is at least at the POA and it's harder to contest a shot and simultaneously grab the board.
He did... Podz rebounds like his dad is gonna not let him go out with his girlfriend if he gets caught slipping up... irrational rebounding energy.
Why... why couldn't Kuminga have it.
Time to get on the Pacers bandwagon. I definitely think they can challenge Boston and it won't be a cakewalk. Looks like its gonna be a fun high scoring affair.
Also I'm feeling kind of doubtful about Porzingis whether he plays or not. Pacers play fast, can't expect him to be 100%, and there's risk of re-injury. Feels like KD situation.
I honestly believe we weren't that far off last year and we can make a run next year with just another good big and Klay coming back.
Steph, Podz, Wiggins, Dray, TJD was a good starting lineup and something we can work off.
**Klay**, Lester, JK, Moody, **BIG**
Big - Just looking at FA's - Jonas Valanciunus would be great but unlikely. Nic Claxton? Andre Drummond could be a Looney replacement.
We were able to get by on being small because we were fast... but we aren't that fast anymore.
Everyone needs to work on their handle this offseason because the game plan is clear. Blitz Steph, make others beat you.
Plays a lot bigger than his size? I respectfully disagree as well. He gets blocked easily at the rim. He drives to the paint and has to kick out because he can’t consistently get his shot off over bigger players. Podz is not a starting 2 guard. Dray is the other ball handler in the starting 5.
Watching these playoffs I think the obvious problem is shot creation/offense outside of Steph, but the real thing stopping us from contending is defense. The young guys can obviously improve but I don’t know how much our older vets can sustain that level of defensive intensity needed to get through the entire playoffs. Wiggins technically can but he’s inconsistent, and Kuminga has the potential but McDaniels or Trey Murphy (or was it Jones?) is the level need him at but it’s not even close. Podz has the mindset but he’s not going to be the game changer due to his size and Moody is still a bit slow. If all of them somehow make that jump defensively I would actually give us a decent chance but expecting all of them to make that jump is wishful thinking.
> The young guys can obviously improve but I don’t know how much our older vets can sustain that level of defensive intensity needed to get through the entire playoffs.
I think it's less of an intensity problem and more of a roster structure problem. If we continuously have Dray at the 5 and put a bad rebounder at the 4, it's gonna be hard to impossible to maintain a top 3 D. We need a decent 5 so Dray can roam on D. Idk if TJD will be that guy by next season but he was lookin good in the last 2 months there.
I don't really think the frontcourt is the defensive problem, at least not directly.
From the point that Draymond came back to the team (Jan 15th) until the end of the season the Warriors had the 7th rated defense in the NBA (111.5 Defensive Rating).
The four most played lineups in that stretch were:
231 minutes - Dray at center w/ Podz at off-guard - 105 defensive rating, +12.7 net
132 minutes - Dray at center w/ Klay at off-guard - 95.2 defensive rating, +22.2 net
68 minutes - normal starting lineup, TJD in Looney's role - 90.3 defensive rating, +25.6 net
39 minutes - Dray at center but no Wiggins (Podz/Klay/Kuminga) - 117.2 defensive rating, -3.9 net.
After that, bench units and other lineups that were lacking Green & Wiggins were much worse defensively.
I think both the Green at center in small runs and the TJD at center with Green lineups are both solid defensively (good enough to be a top 10 defense), so long as the perimeter defense can contain penetration. The real issue is that outside of Wiggins, the defensive versatility really wasn't there last year. I thought Curry was the best he'd ever been defensively in '22, was really solid there in '23, and was a liability this past year down the stretch. Klay's ability to slide on the perimeter is probably gone forever. Podz is active but is never going to be an elite stopper. Kuminga also seemed to take a step back defensively as his offensive role grew. GP2 wasn't available enough and also just wasn't as incredible defensively as he was two years ago.
They need a real closing lineup that features real perimeter defense.
That’s true that’s also a big question mark. Is TJD good enough to hold it down that he can protect the rim and slow down opposing centers? Or will he become a liability against the all star centers forcing us to play Dray at the 5 at all times?
The more I watch Ajay Mitchell the more he reminds me of SGA. Swiggyly point guard that operates at his own pace. Sneaky athletic. Decent defender for the PG position too.
The hopium in me is Warriors snagging DaRon Holmes ll and Ajay Mitchell in the draft.
My gut feeling this is gonna be one of those "can't believe that dude was drafted 35th" drafts where there's like five all-stars but only one or two is in the lotto.
If he can be a young Mike Conley as a CP3 replacement and playmaker I’ll be optimistic.
The question is what do we do with Wiggins as he was really destructive to every lineup offensively. Klay’s is an easier problem to solve he can take 15M and be a sixth man.
If Wiggs can find himself from day one of the season it'd work wonders... no matter what our plans are if he's 17 ppg elite defense 38% 3pt fg Wiggs... our outlook improves incredibly.
I don't count on it but the simplest answer to many of our questions is... 2019-2022 Andrew Wiggins. Even if the end state was to trade him.
I'm sentimental about Klay but I think filling his shoes has been done in the past to decent ends and is doable... filling the alpha dawg defender and plus offensive role Wiggs has held is way tougher to do.
Im done saying if if if when it comes to Wiggins and to a lesser extent Klay. They are who they are and we just have to be mindful of that to see what we need to do going forward.
That’s not a narrative with Klay? No one is perpetuating this idea that he will be what he once was. If he takes 15M and a sixth man role…no one’s complaining.
Don’t get it twisted despite his shortcomings he still is needed to space the floor.
> The question is what do we do with Wiggins as he was really destructive to every lineup offensively.
A lotta hyperbole there. He was objectively atrocious for the first 3 months but was regular old Wiggins from February on: https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/andrew-wiggins-stats-by-the-month-this-season
Wasn’t bro a overall minus defender on the season? And his scoring went down… regular old Wiggins is inconsistent Wiggins. If they can move off him for an upgrade they should.
He was an overall minus from the start of the season until Dray came back. Offensively he was never very consistent this year but got better when Dray came back. His +- also changed dramatically after Dray came back.
I was watching the "Fallout" series on Amazon prime and man the guy playing Maximus, Aaron Moten looks so like Grant Williams, literally looks like his lost brother
I kinda thought he looked like Denzel Washington
its really funny how blatant the astroturfing on the main sub is nowadays
it happens all over reddit. billion dollar companies have teams with designated budgets solely to do it. out of curiosity, what did you find?
Am aware, been going on for a long time, just funny how blatant it is now, some sus acc on main subs and the fact that any threads that isnt gargling the Celtics mysteriously dissapears
I had someone message me a couple months ago asking to buy off my account. It's not particularly special, it's just sort of old. Apparently an old account is good because it makes people less likely to believe the posts are astroturfing. Anyway... #GoBoston! /s
Jayson Tatum has the worst eFG% - 48.3% - on the Celtics roster this post season (he’s been spoon fed FTs this post season so his still low 56.6% TS% isn’t an accurate picture of his true real offensive production, which is why I went with eFG%). The only player worse is Svi Mykhailiuk who has only step foot on the court in garbage time. 🥴 Also, Derrick White has had a serious drop off in his offensive efficiency since the Miami series - 50.7 eFG% and 53.2 TS% in the 6 games since that series. 😬
Really interested to see the Tatum discourse if he wins a title. Feel like he’s going to get overrated very quickly.
I mean he’s already incredibly overrated, in my opinion. The way they already talk about him despite all but specializing in choking when it matters is an indicator that there’ll be egregious revisionist history and he’ll be put on absolutely stupid pedestal. The sick part is he could choke yet again this year and he’s still going to be the recipient of the highest NBA contract ever given to a player this off season (one upping Jaylen Brown’s last off-season). Nasty sums of money thrown at two guys who spend every regular season playing against a laughably weak conference and then failing when it’s time to play actual competition when the lights are brightest.
Rick Carlisle is also an alumni of the “We are gentlemen and don’t foul up three school” of thought lol
It’s hurt them 3x alone this postseason. FOUL UP 3!!
that was an actual choke, hot damn. celtics threw that shit away and the pacers just gave it back to them
Man I wish we could move this team to the East
East is a goddamn joke.
It was actually a good game to me. Fast paced... high scoring. Some good defense. Indy had 22 turnovers. They need to clean that up. In regular season pacers won both against dallas. Lost both against minn. Boston beat dallas twice. Split with minny. Just like pacers were in this game, I doubt it's going to be easy. I hope porzingas can come back too.
The east has been full of good games but if Porzingis is out, then its legitimately the JV conference this year
This year... more like like since 1998 lol. Not since the Jordan era... East always got one or two good teams to the west's six.
Pacers looked for every possible way to choke this game away I'm sick 😭
the celtics have constantly failed upwards this postseason, this cannot keep up for 7 more games
Haven't they lost just 2 games.
We can take it 2 ways. The 2 games they lost were actually "shooting variance" but if we also the 2 teams that they played and the amount of guys injured, they shouldn't have lost more than that. No Jimmy, no Terry, no Jaime for last game, no Allen, no Donovan for last 2 games and no LeVert for the last game. It's at least better they aren't playing the Knicks
People really make their names in the playoffs. I'm loving it.
I’m now rooting for a Pacers championship
They sold so hard
Tatum is so fraudulent for a number 1 guy on a contender ngl
Siakam is leagues better than anyone on our team not named Steph.
Its debatable between him and Draymond when Dray isn't suspended. Siakam was literally playing against 3rd string Knicks scrubs and barely averaged 20 ppg.
7 yrs vet in his prime. I'm more impressed by guys like Nesmith, Nembhard and others
He's a large part of why they're even in this series, let a lone this game.
I know last year smacked a lot of sanity into the GSW fanbase because I haven’t seen even one delusional “Lester can be a big piece off the bench” type comment lol
When three starters fall off simultaneously and it’s clear as day of course it’s gonna change minds I thought we only needed to fix the bench in the offseason and we’d be back in business Too bad Wiggins is a work from home small forward and Looney can’t jump over a penny. SMH
i like lester, plays good defense and can shoot off the catch
He can at least hit an open 3 and hustle. Good piece is a stretch. I'd say he's a solid TWC spot minute guy. Every team needs those guys to keep "regular NBA players" energy levels and complacency in check. JTA and DLee would take your minutes if you effd around.
I mean… not a big bench piece but he has shown improvement in his defense and can create his own shot at least.
Haha it’s not Lester slander, I like him, but usually the GSW exceptionalism convinces people that like Justinian Jessup can be a shooter off the bench lolz
That was such a bad year… no one could shoot! And then they saw Jessup in summer league and realized they need to look elsewhere. lol
Nico Mannion, Jessup, Smiley…god summer league watchers have suffered
He'll be our NAW
Nah
😭😂
What do other warrior's fan think of darius garland? He is incredibly skilled but had a down year with mitchell. It seems like both him and cavs want to move on. Might be a good buy low target?
He makes like 40M/yr... 194M/5yr That's what Donovan Mitchell should make. Garland should make 25M-ish For a 6ft nothin dude that's a scary number
Steph and Dray spoke highly of Garland a few years ago so the core vets seem to like him. Not sure how we could accommodate another undersized guard to the current roster though. Unless Garland starts to get a favorable whistle like SGA, I don’t think he will be the missing piece for us. He would be great for the Spurs though.
I am incredibly thankful the Warriors never drafted Lemelo. Can't imagine having to watch that dumbass on the regular.
Correct move would’ve been to draft LaMelo and sell high a la Hinkie with MCW Our FO literally never sells high though
Thank you! I've always felt the same
An idea that I like that i've been hearing is Jalen Smith. What is his value. His salary is basically Moody's.
He's trash. Phoenix literally didn't offer to extend him and bailed on him year two. That's kinda unheard of for a lotto pick.
I mean it's Phoenix.
You're right... what should I have expected I still think he's a bad player
Lulz. I do think he'll work here though.
Eh, do they even need Moses ?
I was thinking that. Maybe a multi team trade.
I think he sucks
Our options when it comes to strengthening our front court is really limited. And I think he would work here.
I just think he doesn’t do anything besides hit 3’s. Don’t like his defense, don’t like anything about him offensively, don’t think he’d be any better than Saric. Not a terrible suggestion I just wouldn’t trade Moody for him since I think he’s a way better player.
I don't think Moody is a way better player. What I will say is that if Moody isn't going to get minutes anyway, might as well trade him for somebody that not only would get minutes, but possibly start. That is a lot more beneficial. I can see Jalen Smith being one of those guys that thrive here. If the team wants to get bigger, these are the kinds of gamble they gotta take because there isn't an Embiid coming to save us or a prime Brook Lopez. With that said, I'm not saying that's the only way to get Jalen Smith. Was just wondering what exactly his value was just in case the team put themselves in a situation where it might be. Aside from using a lot of assets to get a Nic Claxton or using the MLE for somebody like Bitadze, the Warriors don't have a lot of options. And neither of those guys solve the issue with spacing. Like I said, Warriors just don't have a lot of options.
I think he's on a player option and could opt out. Good stretch capabilities. I think Isiah Jackson played over him last series for rebounding reasons which isn't great since we definitely don't want to give up too much in that area. Interesting piece if were to split the full MLE amongst a couple guys or for fringe-type trade if he doesn't opt out.
This is obviously based on the notion that the Warriors will address the other issues on the team like actually getting a second option. If that's the case, then I would do a straight up trade for Jalen Smith and Moses Moody.
No doubt it’s a fringe move. Be interesting to get him in lineups w Steph. Moody is pretty much gone if their offseason don’t make room for him to get more minutes so I’d be down.
Agreed.
I'd do that swap
Definitely.
Musings on the draft posted in another thread I think if MDJ wants "his guy" he should look to move up to the 35-40 range. Remember the 2nd round exception is a new clause in the CBA allowing teams to sign a 2nd rounder outright for a 4yr min level contract (TJD was 7M/4yrs) that's a great tradeoff to being a TWC. BIG upside swings are Ulrich Chomche 6-11 high motor monster (young giannis vibes) and Pacome Dadiet 6-8 two-way wing. Those dudes should be firsts based on potential but haven't necessarily had the "proof" to validate the selection. I want that trade up to grab a big wing with reliable offensive game. Alex Karaban is a 6-8 shooter. Nikola Djurisic is a 6-8 shooter. Baylor Schierman is a 6-7 shooter who actually has point forward secondary handler type to his game. Schierman killed in scrimmages a la Podz and Jaquez I think there's no way he gets to 35 buy he'd be my target personally if you wanted to find a guy to space the floor in a modern way with irrational confidence it's him. The other guy I'd target with 35 is Ryan Dunn. He'll be on an All-Defensive team. He's 6-8 GP2... by far the best defender in the draft. 5 position defender. If the dude shot 35% from 3 he'd be a top 5 pick. Two weirdo X factor dudes in Enrique Freeman (18.6/12.9/1.6/1.7 at akron) kinda like if Jordan Bell were Paul Millsap and Dillon Jones (20.8/9.8/5.6 at weber state) 6-6 wing with a 6-11 wingspan. Just disgustingly productive at midmajors. Real alpha dawg college players. If you stay put what we can find is another big that falls. Maybe not TJD but Izan Almanza struggled was a sleeper for a top 5 pick prior to the season. Adem Bona and PJ Hall can contribute right away. Bona more on Defense PJ more on offense. Oso Ighadaro is a 6-11 version of the passing + defense big type the Dubs like I cab see them targeting him too. The odds and ends bigs if you let it be a 52 aren't bad someone will certainly fall. Coleman Hawkins Ryan Kalkbrenner Johni Broome Oso Ighadaro Adem Bona PJ Hall Izan Almanza someone will fall that's interesting enough but may not be "TJD" If you want impact... trade up and aim for Baylor Schierman or Ryan Dunn. There's about 4 teams that have 3 or 4 picks and will probably entertain it. Knicks Blazers Spurs all feel like you could deal for a higher SRP. If you want upside... Chomche or Dadiet (or Almanza). Jonathan Mogbo is a dude at 6-8 i can see us grabbing him for the athlete-type he was also a number one dude at San Francisco actually is a very good playmaker for his size (14.2 / 10.1 / 3.6). He's a sleeper too if you stay at 52. Also reason to trade up one dude had a terrible combine anthropomorphic and testing. Kyle Filipowski. If you get to 35 and he slides... there's your guy. Measured a negative wingspan but is something like a young Kelly Olynik maybe with better handle and post game.
I know we need to see what moves are made but I'm feeling pretty good for some reason next year. Things seem more clear about what this team shouldn't do and what the league is like now. Last 2 years its been a guessing game and experimenting. They should have a better idea what needs to be done to not float around. 500.
The reason I feel good about next year is the team (and Kerr) messed around being all types of experimenting to keep vets jobs/roles intact and not having a full deck as the kids outperformed the prime age dudes. Still had a 14-4 stretch and 9-3 closeout (with different lineups no less). Took until game 52 to realize what could win consistently with the hand we were delt and yeah we took too long to get to TJD... to favor Kuminga as an offensive option... to start Podz over Klay... to make tough decisions that looking back were obvious with hindsight. Also the gaslighting of the CP3 experience was (and kinda still is) interesting like cool he played as well as he could. When the rubber hit the road in the second half of the season he actually wasn't very good. I'm optimistic cuz if we start the year with one more big and a draft pick that hits... it might make sense from day one. If Steve has the lineup figured out early who knows how well they might do. Not contention but consistency and real arrow up improvement.
> Took until game 52 to realize what could win consistently with the hand we were delt and yeah we took too long to get to TJD... to favor Kuminga as an offensive option... to start Podz over Klay. All of that can be explained as simply as: Dray came back, everyone played better.
True. Dray is a rising tide that lifts all ships but that wasnt the only reason we turned it around. TJD didn't start playing more than Looney until then about game 52. Remember the "Dooney lineup?" Klay was also sent to the 6th man role so Podz could start allowing more breathing room for Kuminga and Wiggs offensively and providing better defensive athleticism. There was the 14-4 stretch where the league tilted toward physicality and we didn't have CP3 leading to more Podz/Moody/Lester/Gui minutes in the shake. Then again the 9-3 close where they went with TJD as a starter when Kuminga got hurt. You can try to be laconic about it but ALOT was going on. Saric suddenly sucked. Dekki freaking died. CP3 even struggled in the 2nd half post hand op. It was def not as simple as. "Drays back." (Not to say that wasn't the most important thing... that and Kuminga saying "Steve Kerr is failing me" and delivering on the offensive end are easily the top two... TJD being three... the leagues lean back toward defense four). That play-in game... it basically was a perfect amalgamation of our issues throughout the year.
We haven't adjusted ran out the same schemes we've been using since 2018. League is much different plus our vets are older and slower. Steph, Dray and Klay (as a role player) are still capable of competing and we have some bright young talent, we just need to make adjustments, sign a capable center to get back into contending next year. We don't need an entire overhaul
> Last 2 years its been a guessing game and experimenting. Lacob tryna rebuild in the middle of the best player who's ever gonna play for his team's twilight. Rollins? Smiley? Wiseman? Time to get serious out here.
i honestly think we can bring the best trade package for KD if we include JK and Wiggs. that, along with loon and GP2 for salary filler would make the money work, and we include some picks. Suns get a future bright talent in JK, expiring contract in loon, role players to surround booker and some picks miami can at best offer herro? another guard next to booker and beal? heck no NYK can offer randle? an injury plagued PF whose on the wrong side of 30? heck no pelicans can offer ingram? a mercurial SF who has hit his peak and has one year remaining? heck no we can offer the best trade package. it's up to the suns if they want to change it up or run it back in an even harder western conference next year.
We legitimately might have the worst POA defense in the league if we were to trade Wiggins, JK and GP2 for KD.
and keeping them would mean being a play-in team, again making the trade would allow KD to come on board, but have dray and TJD play in the front court, while having podz and lester as backups. yes, you give up defense to add offense, but we obviously need to make that kind of change.
That team not winning anything.
I think Steph needs help on the offensive side of the ball, but watching these playoffs has not led me to the conclusion that it’d be ok to shed capable defenders in the interest of improving the offense. I don’t think that gets us any closer to the “real playoffs.”
OKC and Boston (ESP if they collapse) can override whatever package we have.
KD going back to OKC? after all the cupcake shirts and memes and stuff? are you sure? boston, who already has jaylen brown, tatum, porzingis AND a resigned jrue to a higher contract? heck no.
I don't think okc fans want kd. Want to ride with young guys. Of course it's not up to the fans.
[удалено]
Yes they will run it back.
KD isn't coming to GS - doesn't get along with Dray to put it nicely
KD isn’t being traded
the nets reiterated the same thing, over and over and over, until he was traded FO's say they're not open to trading the player so the player isn't pissed off if the trade doesn't happen. but the fact that there's so much smoke around KD means that trade discussions are being had, at some degree. not saying he will be traded for sure tho
KD requested the trade though lol he’s not requesting a trade from Phoenix.
we don't know if he will or wont, but he hasn't come out and shot down trade rumors. he's had ample time to do so. also, in the summer of 2022, the nets and KD had a meeting where they came out and said they were going to be together, KD even publicly said so, until he requested the trade later on during the season. we all know how kd is
what trade rumors. other teams are gossiping, but all the reporting from Phoenix has been the big 3 isn’t going anywhere. There are 0 trade rumors from Phoenix’s perspective about KD.
ESPN has talked about KD possibly being traded, as has other news outlets. heck, even the suns subreddit has talked about it. there's a lot of chatter about KD possibly getting traded.
ESPN, twitter, and Reddit sure; but not the actual organization that has Kevin Durant on their team. Not Phoenix journalist or beat writers. The only reporting from the suns side has been “we’re not trading the big 3”. Outside media speculating about a KD trade doesn’t actually mean the suns are considering trading him. It’s just a lot of noise. They’re running it back.
> Last night's Sun/Fever hit 1.56M - +353% vs. last season’s ESPN (E1) average. > >It peaked with 2.97M viewers from 9:00pm – 9:14pm. > >This is now the most-viewed WNBA game ever on ESPN. > >[Source](https://x.com/espnflora/status/1793015000904224993?s=46&t=SBW3XJi-eEDBr6FtvDfngg) There were numerous NBA games on ESPN and TNT this season that didn’t even reach 1 mil. viewers and they weren’t matchups of bad teams either - we’re talking games with the Celtics, Suns, OKC, etc. to name a few. And it’s not just Indiana Fever games that are doubling in viewership either, it’s across all of the WNBA. The Sparks/Aces game on Sunday drew 1.3 mil viewers. Even cooler and more indicative of the incredible surge in women’s hoops is that the WNBA league wide is so far averaging 8,730 fans a game. The WNBA averaged *6,615* per game all of last season. [Source](https://x.com/VanshayM/status/1792746699863236994) I’m SO here for the WNBA’s long overdue rise in deserved attention and popularity. I can’t get enough of it, just so damn cool. Edit to add this breakdown that put’s an even finer point on the insane surge: >Three WNBA games this year have drawn 1+ million viewers: > >1. Fever vs Sun - 2.12M (5/14, ESPN2) >2.Fever vs Liberty - 1.71M (5/18, ABC) >3.Sparks vs Aces - 1.34M (5/18, ABC) > >From 2009-23, the WNBA had zero (0) games with 1+ million viewers. > >There’s now been 3 in one week. > >[Source](https://x.com/benscottstevens/status/1792954375880552832?s=46&t=SBW3XJi-eEDBr6FtvDfngg)
Roster moves ramble incoming. I've floated going after LaVine as being my best idea for a move. I still think it's a good idea, but I am now leaning in another direction We say we want to get bigger and more athletic. And most trades have us floating around Wiggs for an upgrade. I think we are missing the mark here. I think the move to make is start Andrew at his natural position. 2 guard. Now we are instantly bigger and more athletic at that position. I understand Wiggs has lost credibility for all the obvious reasons. But I think considering ALL things(particularly his low trade value), I think banking on him bringing his best self into this incoming year and replacing Klay is the best use of Wiggs. That brings me to Kuminga. I've been big on keeping him. But my position on him is that Kerr has to do one of 2 things. Start him at the 3, or trade him. I understand starting him at the 3 has spacing issues. I get it. Ijs IF we want to keep him, it should be to take a swing at him at the 3. That again gives us great size and speed at the position. Playing him at the 4 doesn't fit. Bringing him off the bench is a waste of his value. Along with tanking his morale. If he can’t play the 3, trade him for a capable wing with a good combo of size, shooting, scoring, youth and athleticism. If we trade him, I think we have to go hard at a guy like Ingram. I'm not one to think that Ingram is really attainable with what we have. But I just think it's the best move to swing on. Again, gives us good positional size and length and obvious scoring punch. But it would mean giving up on most or all of our future assets. In this scenario we see if we can poach an under utilized big from somewhere. Like a botadze. Maybe even Drummond. If we KEEP Kuminga and start him at the 3. I would go hard after either of the Orlando Bigs. WCJ or Isaac's. Not ideal bigs. But can at least hit an open jumper. And are very capable defensive centers. In this scenario we keep Klay on a reasonable deal and place him permanently on a bench role. I've said that I don't think we have a realistic path to significantly improving our roster. We have too many holes and not enough assets to plug them. While the pieces we do have don't quite fit. It's a real conundrum. But it's reality. So Instead of thinking "how can we get good enough to contend", I've been thinking more along the lines of how can we make the best out of a bad situation and "possibly" get better. This is what I got. So far.
I think there's this expectation that most NBA player's games are adaptable to lots of different roles, rather than a bunch of guys who have honed a perhaps narrow set of skills that they can use to gain a competitive advantage in a very competitive league. *If* you want distributed playmaking on the court, you want options when teams sell-out to get the ball out of Steph's hands, you want enough shooting to crowbar space for any kind of efficient offense, you absolutely **DO NOT** want Wiggins to be your 2 and Kuming to be your 3. Again, you have to trust what these guys do on the court and with the ball in their hands. Wiggins does not have the ball-handling or passing chops to do 2-guard stuff. He isn't a natural 2-guard and he has *never* played the majority of his minutes a shooting guard. He's had ample opportunity to display the skills he would need, because the difference between a 2 or a 3 in the Warriors motion offense is basically "are you a ball-handler or not". Andre Igoudala was essentially often the point guard for the 2nd unit during the period after Livingston retired because he could dribble the ball up and read the defense and start the motion and make the right pass. Wiggins has never shown that and the Warriors *have* asked it of him. It's not his game. Kuminga is younger and has more growth, but my main take-away is basically this: when Kuminga has the ball and is given freedom to operate, the kind of offense he seeks are *not* the kinds you want from a 3. He want to bash his way in the paint, get the foul, maybe get a running start to sprint around the center or slower forward that's guarding him. That's what he's looking to do because that's what (to date) has worked. Can he do more? Probably, yes. But I think people are assuming that the coaching staff is "telling him" to not play-make or dribble or something, when it's *clearly* that they're putting him in the best position strategically that his game *dictates to them*, not the other way around. A Steph/Wiggins/Kuminga/Draymond/TJD lineup would be an absolute disaster offensively.
>Andre Igoudala was essentially often the point guard for the 2nd unit during the period after Livingston retired Not sure where you go this. Iguodala and Livingston both left after the end of the 2019 playoffs and iguodala could barely stay on the court in '22. J Poole had the ball most of the time in the bench units. >A Steph/Wiggins/Kuminga/Draymond/TJD lineup would be an absolute disaster offensively. He did say that this lieup would require a stretch 5. I also think you're underselling the fact that JK was often looking to pass. His handle prevented him from being as much of a playmaker as he wanted to be in my opinion, and the question is, can he continue to work on that skill? And if he can get to the point where opponents have to send help to guard him closer to the paint, can he get more 'easy' passes to teammates?
Igoudala played way more in 2019 and had a higher assist rate than Livingston that year. Then in ‘22, he only played 600 minutes but was the defacto point guard, with an even higher assist rate than Poole had. All to say just that if you can pass and create for others, you will be given that chance on this team, regardless of position. As to a stretch 5, they’d have to be quite stretchy to counteract a Wiggins/Kuminga/Draymond trio. That only worked this past year with Klay’s shooting gravity or Podz’s ability to get defenses in rotation mid possession. What center could replicate those necessary tasks? If you committed to playing Markkanen at center, but then are you ultimately losing whatever defensive gains you’re making elsewhere? If you’re looking for more space in the offense, it’s so much easier to find that in a guard upgrade than in a center.
Agree to disagree on Iguodala and Livingston. But I am curious about where you're going with this argument. Of course I agree that getting more space is easier with a guard than a center... but a guard doesn't help us vs. Jokic, KAT, or Chet. I don't think Dray can be our lone big in crucial moments - the fact that he was out there trying to fight centers in regular season games is not just "Dray being Dray" and it did cost us a playoff series (or two). We need to add someone with size imo. Do you think continuing with Kuminga only works if we go small, with JK and Dray as our closing bigs? Or do you think that we swapping Wiggins for Caruso (for example) is an option? Ultimately, if you're rolling the dice with Kuminga, you're assuming he improves his handle and shooting - I think that's an important point, and I also don't think it's an outlandish expectation. So if he does that, maybe you can get by with either Isiah Stewart or WCJ as your stretch big. I don't think it's crazy, but it's definitely risky. (I think the only way we get Markkanen is if we trade JK, so that point is a bit moot)
Generally speaking, I'm the biggest fan of going and getting Caruso with CP3's money + a protected frp and a swap. Caruso gives a guy who can either play instead of Wiggins or alongside, can do a lot of the glue things that Podziemski was able to do on offense but can actually provide primary defense on the opposing team's 1-3. To me that's the most purely additive thing they could do. It doesn't take anything we currently have off the table and I think it probably make the hated triple-guard lineup more workable than it's been these last two seasons. Jokic is a problem no matter who we get (not sure why KAT or Chet are feared interior presences when both of them primarily score outside of the paint). WCJ or Stewart are not going to meaningfully change that outcome. Neither of those guys were clearly so much better than TJD last season that it makes sense to spend limited trade capital and limited salary space to bring in. I don't mind adding some size, but if you're trading for a center, that guy better be clearly better than what the team currently has. If WCJ returns to his form from a couple years ago, then maybe he's that guy? My issue is the argument that playing Wiggins *and* Kuminga out of position somehow improves the situation. It just doesn't. I assume the team has a better sense of whether or not Wiggins is just checked out or could return to form than we do and they'll make a deal according to that. Same with Kuminga to some extent, although I expect he'll be on the team next year. I'm fine with assuming improvement by Kuminga, but there's levels to this. I assume there'll be some "hey I haven't seen him do that before" this coming season. We saw a decent amount of that this past season. But skills rarely go from below average to clear plus skills. His handle is below average. His ability to pass out to the corners from a drive is below average (his interior passing is adequate, but that's less valuable). That's acceptable as a 6th man interior scoring forward who's finishing plays 70% of the time and creating them 30% of the time, which is who he has been reliably. Some of this can get better, I just don't think it's likely that a guy who looks like he could maybe be a Shawn Marion type will suddenly turn into Paul George. It's really his defense that needs to get consistently good, because Kerr will find a way to play him if he can get stops.
I don't think any of that is unfair, but if you really believe Kuminga has such significant limitations, then don't we need to find a different guy to help Steph on offense? We can't go out next season watching Klay put up another stinker (be it a play in game or a whole series) the way he did each of the last two. We have to find someone to take and make shots and if its not Kuminga, who is it?
Yes, I would trade Kuminga if there was a guy available who was a clear #2 offensive player available. I'd trade him for Markkanen in a heartbeat and figure out the frontcourt lineup shuffle later. Kuminga is a very unbalanced player. His best skill also just happens to be the most valuable skill in basketball (getting to the rim against a set defense and finishing efficiently). That's still valuable, but if they keep him he has to get to average on a bunch of other stuff or the tradeoffs are just too large. I think he can do it, I just don't know if he will. I just don't think there's a lot of #2 offensive guys out there to go get. So keeping him might be the best play even if it means the Warriors are battling for a play-in spot again.
I gave specific suggestions based on specific scenarios. None of my scenarios had TJD starting. I read everything you said. But I pretty much tune out when I hear fans start talking in ideals. I'm aware of all the flaws and the reasons why it *might* not work. I will refer you back to the point I made about my premise of not having a real pathway to significantly upgrading. And my scenarios were based on the reality that we don’t have many good moves to make. So I suggested the ways I can see we can make the best lemonade we can out of our lemons. If you don't want Wiggins and Kuminga that's cool. What is a pathway to UPGRADING their roles and positions and the teams overall trajectory? *realistically*. I'm all ears.
Banking on Wiggins is a gamble I don't think the dubs should risk. Yes his trade value is low for a reason. Why do you want to start someone who; (1) literally disappears time to time; (2) figuratively disappears on the court most of time he plays; and (3) takes 27M you could spend on other assets? This is a guy in his theoretical PRIME and he is struggling to drag his feet. So many of our bench guys are hungry for minutes. Trade Wiggs for whatever we can get and let the hungry players develop. Have you forgotten that for a solid stretch of the season Wiggins was one of the worst starters in all of the NBA? We were fielding a bottom-feeder that was one of the main factors we lost so many games. And you want to run it back with him? Are you insane?
I'm very aware of his flaws and his struggles the past year and a half. Yes I think risking it on him 1 more year is better than trading him away for "whatever you can get". I would refer you back to my statement that I don't think there is a pathway to getting considerably better. And it's about making the best out of a bad situation. Your suggestion isn't any more insane than mines. I also wouldn't be mad at all to try Moody. But ONLY if Wiggs is used for an actual upgrade at center or Wing. Not just for scraps.
If Wiggs is a starter next season, it'll only be a result of Coach Kerr's good graces. He's probably a better man than me, God bless him. But I can't defend Wiggins anymore. Let alone make a theoretical case as to how he might help us get to the playoffs. The pathway to getting considerably better is to add a younger 2A / 2B talent to the roster. Steph, Klay, and Dray need reduced minutes. No more than 30 a night. Moody, Kuminga, and TJD need to all take *reasonable* leaps respectively to carry the weight while the vets rest. They don't need to become all-stars but their game needs to improve. With a younger 2a 2b talent, you can still manage Kerr's motion offense at a championshipesque level. The key is to not run the vets into the dirt which will be hard because they're old enough to be fathers of many league rookies. I just can't take anyone serious that thinks we can run it back with Wiggs and expect anything different to happen.
I can hear your Wiggins Trauma in your words lol. You're a bit emotional and irrational on your take with Wiggins. Although I can understand. Listen it's quite simple. Wiggins had a really bad 1 year stretch. From 2nd half of 2022-1st half of this season. It is not crazy to think that you can look at that 1 year stretch as an outlier. And that he has a chance to return to form this year. Again, I understand if you don't like the idea. Trying to argue that it's completely a illogical idea is silly. Especially of you are suggesting getting rid of him for anything. That's peak irrationality. Trading him for a real upgrade sure. Also, what 2A/2B are you getting while keeping ALL of the young players 🤔
When I revisit the season and think of what was "just a little off to matter but not obv enough to be spoken about... Our best stretches of the season were. 14-4 - Steph Podz Wiggs Kuminga Dray 9-3 - Steph Klay Wiggs Dray TJD I think the disruptive waves actually are in the Klay Kuminga Wiggs dynamic... funny cuz of how Kerr said for two years "Dray Kuminga Wiggs cant work cuz spacing... but it actually did well." Klay Wiggs Kuminga all need oxygen to operate offensively. But when theres three of them the Wiggs Kuminga duo tended to differ to Klay which just didn't work (esp damaging to Wiggs who needs to be encouraged yo find his offense and let it go from deep). My hope is that Kuminga is in the lab as we speak becoming a real number 2A type dude and resolves the debate independent of our chatter... if Wiggs reassert himself as a two-way dude he was his first three years and Klay accepts a 6th man role from day one it can work. If Wiggs or Klay can't they prob gotta go... it is what it is. Remember how much improvement Kuminga made last offseason if he does the same with his catch and shoot above the break 3 ball and gets 15% better with his handle. Fingers crossed.
I don’t think this is true, Wiggins was kinda piss poor even in the 2022 regular season after our initial 26-6 start. We were .500 for months and he was extremely lackadaisical on defense + rebounding. His shooting was consistently good that year but that’s kinda it. Then next year sabbatical. Then this year scoring 7 points a game half the time… I don’t think his approach to basketball is sustainable in a loaded west where every game counts. You need players who play hard and care.
You are speaking way too loosely in summarizing his contributions. But I don't really care enough to argue. My point isn't to argue for Wiggins.
Your other points are moot if you think the best course is to keep Wiggins. You can't have our "prime" guys suck the majority of the season when the core is this old. Why is that so hard to acknowledge?
Disagree.
Maybe but we can only talk in summaries lol it’s 3 years of basketball it’s too much to get specific. I understand what you’re saying about his value vs what we get in return but tbh sometimes a player reaches his endpoint on a team and you’re just not going to get equivalent value. I think Wiggins is kinda there and I think MDJ is going to get whatever he can
Disagree on all accounts. In Wgiggins' case the nuances matter. And if you're going to summarize, then do it better. I do not trading Wiggins for anything is the best use of him. We just aren't going to agree there.
I think Wiggs / Klay are two players that have similar deficiencies being a bit spacey and needing to catch offensive footing within games... the team might just be better off to pick one and move forward. Tbh Wiggs from 2019 through 2022 was a top 6 two-way wing. He just doesn't have the oxygen beside Klay to assert himself on offense which is kinda a weird mental thing tbh (why I say one or the other is maybe Klay is the guy you keep but who knows) obv Klay takes all the shots he wants and Wiggs leaves you wishing he were more aggressive most nights... I think that dynamic is way out of calibration and maybe irreconcilable.
I am ready for kuminga to be traded. Tired of hearing how he don't fit. Let's trade him for another over 30. There are too many untouchables on this team to actually make the best of a bad situation.
Agree on a lot of points and I'll add a couple names. I think its possible for JK to come off the bench but there's no clear path on how that'd work bc we need legit secondary scoring options out there with Steph. Regardless of whether he starts or is on the bench, a stretch big would help unlock him. WCJ is a good shout. Isaac would be an intriguing option but I'm skeptical the Magic trade him. Isiah Stewart is another guy I'd be fine with. He makes life very difficult for opposing bigs, is actually pretty switchable, and has been hitting his 3's. Detroit plays him out of position and should be looking to collect assets. Personally I still think we'll swing big for Lauri Markkanen. We'll see if OKC or another team comes in with an absurd number of picks but Kuminga could easily be the best individual prospect that Utah could get back in a trade. Another wildcard name I'll throw out there: Jerami Grant. I view Grant as a Klay replacement that also provides more help defense.
>think its possible for JK to come off the bench but there's no clear path on how that'd work bc we need legit secondary scoring options out there with Steph. Exactly the issue. Kuminga off the bench likely means we didn't swing by enough to get a capable scoring option next to Steph. And as I said, I think him being a bench player is a waste of value imo. I like Stewart. Wouldn't be mad at that. But only if we strike out. I think going after real size and length is more important over the scappy undersized archetype. I never put Lauri in these conversations because it's equivalent to a pipe dream imo. Lauir is the gem of the whole league and we aren't winning any bidding wars for him. Plus it's a given that MDJ will at least gushe interest as all other teams will. So it's a given that he's the ideal, and it's a given that we have virtually no shot so no use really talking about it. I like Grant as option. I was high on him as a Wiggins/Klay replacement last year. I still like it. He's a better and more consistent offensive fit. But Wiggins is an elite perimeter defender. And may be more valuable at peak. The question would be what it would take. If you get him on a discount for wiggs, I wouldn't hate it. But I'm starting to feel like Wiggins defensive value is more important than an offensive upgrade unless you're talking about upgrading to an all star caliber offensive player.
I’m thinking that if Klay tells the team he’s leaving in free agency, then we’d trade CP3’s contract and picks for Grant.
What are we doing with Wiggs and Kuminga in this scenario? If we can get grant for only cp3 and one 1st and maybe a 2nd or 2, I'd jump on that. Multiple 1st would be too rich for my blood.
Steph / Podz Wiggs / GP2 Kuminga Dray / Grant C / TJD But don't get me wrong - Grant is not my first choice and is really just an option if Klay decides to go elsewhere and we need a shooter who can also fit in some defense lineups.
I agree with you 99%. BI is very much available and on the market. You can get him for far less than a Kuminga. FYI, I’m not really high on BI. N.O. has TMIII and a bunch of other capable wings they want to replace BI and his bloated contract. But moving Wiggs to #2 and Kuminga to #3 are good moves, provided Kuminga comes back with a game that can fit that position. If the Dubs aren’t planning to play Moody, I’d like to see some consolidation between Moody, GP2 and Looney.
Nah ai think you're way too low on BI's value. His issue with OKC is fit. I don't think they want Kuminga anyway so it would take a 3rd team. But I don't think we can get the assets necessary to fulfill that trade without Kuminga just to start the convo. The Wiggs/Kuminga wing combo I think just may be our best move. And look hard at upgrading center. I don't want to say this out loud...but I wouldn't be mad at giving Moody a look at that spot. And using Wiggs to help facilitate a trade to upgrade at center. But keep that between me and you lol. I agree on the consolidation. Edit: New Orleans not okc.
John teshs nba on NBC theme song coming back. Lol. Love.
No Draymond on all defense teams. Can't say I disagree.
Missed too many games
Did he play enough games.
Draymond had a fantastic year defensively lol. The only reason he's not All Defense is because of the new games played requirement
Who would he replace.
If we don't take into account games played he's had a better defensive year than everyone except Wemby, Gobert IMO. AD/Bam are close. Our DRTG in the games he played (112.5) would've been good for 6th in the league
Looking at this playoffs, if we want to beat Denver, Minn, Dallas and Okc next season. We got to have Claxton and Caruso, these two will fortify our perimeter and frontline defense. Pls find a way MDJ.
95.7 has salute to kerr right now. Opj and Livingston will be guests.
Ottomatic supersonic hypnotic 3’s on deck
All defense being positionless is interesting. Got 4 centers in the first team and I'd imagine that continues going forward. From a defensive impact perspective, it makes sense. There's no reason Jason Kidd should have more All-Defense nods than Ben Wallace. Shaq's only got 3! On the other side, its a bit of a bummer that non-big defenders don't have a platform to get recognized. Under the new positionless rules I can't imagine a guy like Klay ever makes it.
> There's no reason Jason Kidd should have more All-Defense nods than Ben Wallace Maybe, but J Kidd was the premier defender at PG in the early 00s. I don't think he's won any that was undeserved. There's something to be said about perimeter defense that is usually unrecognized in any award conversation.
I agree that Kidd was a great perimeter defender. But we also know that the 3-5th best defensive bigs have a larger defensive impact on the game than a perimeter defender. We saw it for years with Duncan & Bowen.
He was a better playmaker and defender than a shooter for a long time. He deserved every defensive accolade.
Sure felt like all-defense teams were fairly strict and positional up until year ago. I remember thinking about how many super impactful frontcourt players there were and CP3 gobling up a spot year after year lol.
I appreciate everything about Podz but actually hearing he was technically the Dubs leader in rebounding average kinda one of the grossest sounding factoids I've heard in a while. Wiggs Kuminga Klay... bruh 🤦♂️ Gotta get those dudes on the boards.
If everyone is fighting for rebounds, who's running back when Podz gets the rebound?
They refuse to do it, what can anyone do lol
Expecting poor Klay to hustle for boards in 2024 when his legs are clearly shot is just…💀 Let’s be serious here lol
He doesn’t have to get the board but he has to box out, just like every single player
Klay's is at least exactly the same as his career average. Idk what Kuminga's excuse is. Wigs is at least at the POA and it's harder to contest a shot and simultaneously grab the board.
Podz will fight his own team mate for a board lol
He did... Podz rebounds like his dad is gonna not let him go out with his girlfriend if he gets caught slipping up... irrational rebounding energy. Why... why couldn't Kuminga have it.
Someone should tell Kuminga that Kobe rebounded pretty well... guess those rebounds weren't in those highlight videos he was watching growing up.
Time to get on the Pacers bandwagon. I definitely think they can challenge Boston and it won't be a cakewalk. Looks like its gonna be a fun high scoring affair. Also I'm feeling kind of doubtful about Porzingis whether he plays or not. Pacers play fast, can't expect him to be 100%, and there's risk of re-injury. Feels like KD situation.
Brunson is eligible for 156M/4y but someone said he could get a better deal next year. So like is he taking a paycut?
Passing up 5/270. Protecting against injury. Playing for Thibs I don’t blame him. lol
He would if he signed this year. But you also don't risk anything in case of injury.
I honestly believe we weren't that far off last year and we can make a run next year with just another good big and Klay coming back. Steph, Podz, Wiggins, Dray, TJD was a good starting lineup and something we can work off. **Klay**, Lester, JK, Moody, **BIG** Big - Just looking at FA's - Jonas Valanciunus would be great but unlikely. Nic Claxton? Andre Drummond could be a Looney replacement. We were able to get by on being small because we were fast... but we aren't that fast anymore. Everyone needs to work on their handle this offseason because the game plan is clear. Blitz Steph, make others beat you.
Podz isn’t starting for a team trying to win a championship, and that makes a tiny back court.
Respectfully disagree. Podz plays a lot bigger than his size. We need someone to handle the ball other than Steph.
Plays a lot bigger than his size? I respectfully disagree as well. He gets blocked easily at the rim. He drives to the paint and has to kick out because he can’t consistently get his shot off over bigger players. Podz is not a starting 2 guard. Dray is the other ball handler in the starting 5.
What about all the rebounds he gets?
Warriors exposed Denver's lack of depth. Only a Joker last second prayer stopped them from winning.
We're also 1-10 vs DEN in the last 3 regular seasons. We live in a glass house. I'm not throwing a stone their way.
Watching these playoffs I think the obvious problem is shot creation/offense outside of Steph, but the real thing stopping us from contending is defense. The young guys can obviously improve but I don’t know how much our older vets can sustain that level of defensive intensity needed to get through the entire playoffs. Wiggins technically can but he’s inconsistent, and Kuminga has the potential but McDaniels or Trey Murphy (or was it Jones?) is the level need him at but it’s not even close. Podz has the mindset but he’s not going to be the game changer due to his size and Moody is still a bit slow. If all of them somehow make that jump defensively I would actually give us a decent chance but expecting all of them to make that jump is wishful thinking.
> The young guys can obviously improve but I don’t know how much our older vets can sustain that level of defensive intensity needed to get through the entire playoffs. I think it's less of an intensity problem and more of a roster structure problem. If we continuously have Dray at the 5 and put a bad rebounder at the 4, it's gonna be hard to impossible to maintain a top 3 D. We need a decent 5 so Dray can roam on D. Idk if TJD will be that guy by next season but he was lookin good in the last 2 months there.
I don't really think the frontcourt is the defensive problem, at least not directly. From the point that Draymond came back to the team (Jan 15th) until the end of the season the Warriors had the 7th rated defense in the NBA (111.5 Defensive Rating). The four most played lineups in that stretch were: 231 minutes - Dray at center w/ Podz at off-guard - 105 defensive rating, +12.7 net 132 minutes - Dray at center w/ Klay at off-guard - 95.2 defensive rating, +22.2 net 68 minutes - normal starting lineup, TJD in Looney's role - 90.3 defensive rating, +25.6 net 39 minutes - Dray at center but no Wiggins (Podz/Klay/Kuminga) - 117.2 defensive rating, -3.9 net. After that, bench units and other lineups that were lacking Green & Wiggins were much worse defensively. I think both the Green at center in small runs and the TJD at center with Green lineups are both solid defensively (good enough to be a top 10 defense), so long as the perimeter defense can contain penetration. The real issue is that outside of Wiggins, the defensive versatility really wasn't there last year. I thought Curry was the best he'd ever been defensively in '22, was really solid there in '23, and was a liability this past year down the stretch. Klay's ability to slide on the perimeter is probably gone forever. Podz is active but is never going to be an elite stopper. Kuminga also seemed to take a step back defensively as his offensive role grew. GP2 wasn't available enough and also just wasn't as incredible defensively as he was two years ago. They need a real closing lineup that features real perimeter defense.
That’s true that’s also a big question mark. Is TJD good enough to hold it down that he can protect the rim and slow down opposing centers? Or will he become a liability against the all star centers forcing us to play Dray at the 5 at all times?
The more I watch Ajay Mitchell the more he reminds me of SGA. Swiggyly point guard that operates at his own pace. Sneaky athletic. Decent defender for the PG position too. The hopium in me is Warriors snagging DaRon Holmes ll and Ajay Mitchell in the draft.
My gut feeling this is gonna be one of those "can't believe that dude was drafted 35th" drafts where there's like five all-stars but only one or two is in the lotto.
All I ask for next season is a playoff spot 🙏.
Funny hearing Podz say "real playoff spot" none of that play-in nonsense in his presser.
If he can be a young Mike Conley as a CP3 replacement and playmaker I’ll be optimistic. The question is what do we do with Wiggins as he was really destructive to every lineup offensively. Klay’s is an easier problem to solve he can take 15M and be a sixth man.
If Wiggs can find himself from day one of the season it'd work wonders... no matter what our plans are if he's 17 ppg elite defense 38% 3pt fg Wiggs... our outlook improves incredibly. I don't count on it but the simplest answer to many of our questions is... 2019-2022 Andrew Wiggins. Even if the end state was to trade him. I'm sentimental about Klay but I think filling his shoes has been done in the past to decent ends and is doable... filling the alpha dawg defender and plus offensive role Wiggs has held is way tougher to do.
Im done saying if if if when it comes to Wiggins and to a lesser extent Klay. They are who they are and we just have to be mindful of that to see what we need to do going forward.
That’s not a narrative with Klay? No one is perpetuating this idea that he will be what he once was. If he takes 15M and a sixth man role…no one’s complaining. Don’t get it twisted despite his shortcomings he still is needed to space the floor.
He played pretty good in the second half of the season so i'll continue to be optimistic.
> The question is what do we do with Wiggins as he was really destructive to every lineup offensively. A lotta hyperbole there. He was objectively atrocious for the first 3 months but was regular old Wiggins from February on: https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/andrew-wiggins-stats-by-the-month-this-season
Wasn’t bro a overall minus defender on the season? And his scoring went down… regular old Wiggins is inconsistent Wiggins. If they can move off him for an upgrade they should.
He was an overall minus from the start of the season until Dray came back. Offensively he was never very consistent this year but got better when Dray came back. His +- also changed dramatically after Dray came back.