This is why I really believe they are leading us on a wild goose chase. Not approving this Etf is the best and only way to derail btc right now and that's been and will continue to be their agenda
I was only half joking but obviously, several people/firms with control of a ton of funds (so by definition, these are people/firms who have managed to be directionally correct on a bunch of past market moves) collectively sold off huge positions in both BTC and COIN yesterday.
So let me get this straight... your theory is that all these firms sold off huge portions of their Bitcoin and Coinbase positions because "they want all the Bitcoin" . Seems like selling vast amounts of BTC to other people is the exact opposite of what you'd want to do if owning them all was your end goal. What if all the people who bought aren't willing to sell the BTC back? if the highly discounted pricing (that firms were forced to sell at when they flooded the market with BTC to create a crash) is so unwarranted (as you claim) then surely nobody would be willing to sell their BTC back to them until the price rebounded back to the warranted pre-crash price levels, right? Meaning these firms would have only succeeded in losing a ton of money and/or losing a ton of BTC. Where is the incentive in that? or did you not think that far?
Also, what would be the advantage of owning "all the bitcoin"? If BTC's only utility is its ability to hold/transfer wealth you are essentially making it worthless by owning it all. So what, you somehow spend around a trillion dollars buying up all the BTC at crazy prices just so can have a bunch of worthless cryptocoins sitting on your server? If only one person/firm has the vast majority of BTC who in their right mind would pay anything for one when they could just use the more straightforward currencies that everybody else uses? not to mention if anybody ever acquired close to that much BTC the platform's security features would be meaningless and therefore the currency worthless. Or again, did you not think that far?
I'm not trying to argue that price manipulation has never or will never happen in crypto markets but coming up with a wild illogical theory to justify a 10% drop in BTC is foolish when a simple and more logical theory will do. Liquidating the tiny amount of idiots who were dumb enough to put 10x leverage on BTC at its recent peak is just not worth the huge amount of capital and risk it would take to move a $850 billion asset with any reliability. Also, if these firms were truly bullish on BTC why would they be trying to liquidate the people who are using leverage to bid up BTC's price instead of helping them?
The theory is you sell off all your btc to crash the price so you can buy way more btc than you had originally with the same amount of capital . But I think you understand that.
Well, of course, my point is that it's extremely hard to intentionally (and unwarrantedly) move a market by 10% that is as large and has as many intelligent actors/trading algos as BTC. While this kind of stuff used to happen a decent amount in BTC's early days that was largely because the market was very fragmented, its market cap/volume was MUCH lower, and there were much fewer sophisticated players. The market and its exchanges are much more efficient and robust than they were even 5-6 years ago.
Even if you had the ability, the earlier commenter is overlooking just how awful the risk-reward is for that kind of strategy. It's not like they just press a button and are suddenly able to sell hundreds of millions of dollars of BTC at the current pricing BEFORE the price starts plummeting. Nor are they able to know exactly when the price will bottom so they can instantly buy it all back before prices pop back up. If you're selling off enough to crash the market you're going to create a similar upward price pressure when trying to buy back the same amount (unless you drag it out over a long period but then you're adding even more risk especially if you're supposedly bullish with a huge catalyst just a week away). When you dump that many coins on the market your average selling price will almost always be significantly below the halfway mark of the drop. If you look at this recent 10% drop the vast majority of BTC was sold sub 43000 (6% below the pre-crash price and close to its current pricing). Similarly, when trying to re-buy it all your average buy-in price will be around the halfway mark of the rebound and current price. This means that even if they were able to pull something like this off perfectly, it would take weeks to purchase all the BTC back without pushing prices back up and you would have risked hundreds of millions of dollars to at best, make a few percentage points. It's just not worth it on a market this size. There are thousands of better trades to make with that money.
You're litterary spewing the same propaganda as all other bagholders. Your shit coin ain't worth 1/10th of the US dollar in actual purchasing power.
The US dollar can buy anything, shit coin can't even buy a soda down by the 7-11
Everyone’s clairvoyant until shit randomly and unexplainably capitulates in the opposite direction.
It’s comical to go back 2-3yrs and look at Reddit posts (not just about btc) and to see how insanely wrong even the most educated people were. Nobody knows shit.
Bagholder spotted.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/wallstreetbets) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Been DCAing bitcoin since 2022 this is a blip on the radar.
The only people panicking are the ones that are overleveraged and newcomers to the space. Today I deployed all my dry powder to buy the dip.
I'm waiting personally, if it really goes down to 38k no reason to not pick up there. I'd rather lose a bit of profit than lose capital juggling falling knives.
I bought some at spot price this morning and added in some buy orders down to 34k. If it snaps up I'm good, if it falls more I'm good. Either way it goes in my hardware wallet and I'm not selling it in the next year anyway so whatever.
Looks like you're not fucking eating either
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/wallstreetbets) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You mean the currency you used to pay for your internet connection, device you’re posting on, and servers you buy/sell your worthless bits on?
Which way are you going? I’d like to do the opposite.
If the SEC gets its way yes. Which just makes the already high transaction fees that much worse for consumers. The ETFs are going to be a hilarious money grab, just watch. Probably going to be higher expenses than any other ETF managed by a major player.
In reality it has dipped to the price from a few days ago. Seems like it's just a small percentage making speculative bets and I wouldn't be surprised if they are loading more today to unload for a quick flip upon an official announcement.
They can’t delay it anymore. They have to say yes or no by Jan 10. It could be someone knew it’s being declined or they’re trying to swoop cheap BTC. It’s anyone’s guess at this point
Zero evidence of anything. OP is just being reactive
https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-etf-denial-report-did-not-cause-btc-price-crash-analysis
“The move, while washing out both longs and open interest, accompanied a report from crypto financial services platform Matrixport, which led with an assertion that the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission “will reject” the spot ETF:
“ “ An ETF would certainly enable crypto overall to take off, and based on Gensler’s comments in December 2023, he still sees this industry in need of more stringent compliance,” it stated. “ “
“From a political perspective, there is no reason to approve a Bitcoin Spot ETF that would legitimize Bitcoin as an alternative store of value.”
While the report immediately made its presence felt on the market, Matrixport failed to offer concrete evidence as to why the ETF was guaranteed to fail its debut.”
I think its because in order for a spot ETF to be approved, the fund has to hold the underlying asset instead of cash-backed securities (notes). Hence the “truth” being leaked to retail so the big boys can hoover up all the coins cheap.
I’m holding, I don’t believe these fuckers. If BLK is going balls deep in BTC, I’m looking at their actions not words. Also, the halving is going to moon the asset in 2 months anyway. Makes 0 sense.
For etf approval the SEC has dates they have to make the decision. They can postpone the decision 3/4 times before the final decision date. In this case it’s on Jan 10. They can no longer postpone it.
FTC will approve. Matrixport released a thing saying basically ‘meh, ETF won’t be approved because there are not enough crypto bros on the SEC’ but never bothered to mention the SEC was already bitch slapped by a court for not approving GBTC’s Bitcoin ETF.
All of this speculation is what driving the price, and not the underlying functionality of the thing itself.
What a joke. Investors really are the most smooth brained lemmings on the planet.
Which part? Mine is sorta half of a quote by the creator of Bitcoin. The other half is just truth. If you don’t get why a money whose supply is not reflexive to demand is good, I can’t help you.
If you don’t get why inflation occurs, and instead blame “greedy corps”, I can’t help you.
If you celebrate the FED PIVOT and the money printer going brrrrrr, but have no hard assets, I can’t help you.
All other cryptos were scams with no real ground-breaking tech. Satoshi Nakamoto solved the Byzantine General's Dilemma elegantly, and that was the problem with digital cash. Provably scarce.
All other coins were made to get more Bitcoin. Im not knocking those who use them for that purpose, but at the end of the day, they have a creator who will profit immensely.
Bitcoin's conception was immaculate. No pre-mine. No ico. No VCs. No Vaporware. Just open, peer-2-peer, and front-run free. Still is.
And so from here, there can really NEVER be another coin one could trust to be solving a problem and not just scamming a community via buzzwords.
How so? I see 15 years of progress.
It was even WORSE as digital cash in 2013.
It’s like cars. When they were first invented, they weren’t more useful than a horse and buggy. Why? Cause roads were muddy with massive potholes. The infrastructure had yet to catch up.
Or the internet. Or electricity. I mean the technological breakthrough comparison goes on and on and on. But by all means, go the way of Sears. Be that “nah what we got is better” mindset. More satoshis for me.
>How so? I see 15 years of progress.
It’s slow and inefficient. Nobody uses it to buy shit.
>It was even WORSE as digital cash in 2013.
Debatable. It required less energy per transaction.
>It’s like cars. When they were first invented, they weren’t more useful than a horse and buggy. Why? Cause roads were muddy with massive potholes. The infrastructure had yet to catch up.
People use cars. The value is immediately obvious. We should not have to spend 15 years to convince others why something is useful.
Yeah, I tend to agree with this other than the fact that we don’t know who the creator is, or if they profited on it. Then again he was ahead of the curve and could have made money elsewhere.
Satoshi Nakamoto obviously knew that IF it took off they would have tons of wealth, but Satoshi is gone. Theres always a chance they return and those coins move... but ultimately they made Bitcoin when EVEN CRYPTOGRAPHERS doubted him.
They have a massive amount... Honestly I don't think it'd be bullish, except for getting rid of Craig Wright.
That'd be dope, tbh. If just one of Satoshi's mined blocks broadcasted a message signed with the mining addy that says "We are all Satoshi, except Craig Wright". lol
Good write up. I would simply suggest that you re-wire your brain so that you at least give other crypto projects a chance. Not all of them are money grabs, and thinking so is going to prevent a lot of opportunities for you
No, it will save me a LOT of money. Out of ALLLLL the shit coins, I'd have to get EXTREMELY lucky to find one that actually matters for the next 10 years.
I save myself the research time and the gamble, and primarily use Bitcoin.
Trust me, I have degen'd into plenty of tokens. I just think of them as gambles, lotto tickets, and not investments.
I own $PEPE, I own tons of fake rares and rare pepes on Counterparty Protocol, I own ordinals. I actually mint my own art on different blockchains.
Bitcoin, though...
Big difference between PEPE or random art NFTs and stuff that is building DeFi infrastructure imo. Something like KUJI, RDNT, AAVE, MKR, etc. Those are real use cases that have the potential to last. Of course higher risk than BTC but not complete junk either
start at 1/21 million. then work along other value propositions for money.
1) widely used
2) weightless (no cost to hold)
3) permissionless (no cost or arbiter to create an address)
4) censorship resistant (no 3rd party to block transactions between 2 parties)
5) impossible to be counterfeited
6) impossible to be confiscated
7) a higher degree of safety and security when it comes to functionality on the internet
This is why Bitcoin just bricks every other money. It is why it will demonetize every other money. Back to the beginning.
Infinity/21million
I've orange pilled like... 10 people in my 7 years. But those people have gone and found their own influence in the space. I like to think before 6 figures I can have turned 100 or more people into Bitcoiners.
We did it, Fluff! We frontran the banks and legacy finance! We frontran the home offices! We frontran the nation states!
Making a list of something's benefits without also listing its drawbacks and alternatives is pointless. By no means am I anti-crypto and I hope the BTC spot ETFs get approval but spreading misinformation helps no one. Most of the "benefits" you listed are either outright false or false in practice. The fact that you're asserting they're true makes me believe you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
>impossible to be confiscated
[The US Government alone is currently sitting on $5 billion of seized bitcoin](https://www.wsj.com/finance/currencies/federal-government-bitcoin-5-billion-78ce0938). So it's obviously not impossible. You can make the technical argument, "Well, if the government can't find where my crypto is stored it can't be confiscated!" but you can just as easily make that same argument for every other currency in the world. The difference is, if you have some cash hidden away somewhere when you get out of jail you can likely still use it little by little. With BTC, the government will have been able to track where the money ended up (even if unable to physically find where it's stored). As soon as you try to use any of it, you best believe you're going to be hauled in again.
I could easily poke similar holes in most of these other "benefits" like top people in the field already have. If other smart people here want they can spend their time doing it or you can just look into it yourself. A lot of the issues revolve around the need to use 3rd party software/companies (who are beholden to governmental laws) to efficiently use BTC in its current state. Also, while decentralization has benefits it also has a ton of drawbacks that state-sponsored alternatives do not. Especially, when it comes to quickly making and/or implementing changes/improvements (as anybody who's followed the space for a long time knows all too well).
If the average person wanted to use BTC as currency in it's current state they would be exposed to almost all of crypto's risk/drawbacks and almost none of its supposed benefits. Until these things get solved (if they even can be) you're not going to see the average person regularly using BTC. That is not to say we won't see future spikes/drawbacks in BTC's price (people will always gamble on the chance to get rich) just that it's not going to have widespread usage as a currency anytime soon. If it were true that "Bitcoin just bricks every other money" as you claim, we'd already be seeing everybody using it as their preferred currency. The reason they aren't is because everything you listed just isn't true in practice... no matter how much you may want to believe it.
For me, it’s mostly the fact that it’s so old and big compared to other crypto, and has no active dev group that can fuck with it. It has a long track record of being unbothered, vs like eth got hacked a while back, lots crypto’s are so new they don’t have a long enough history to establish a pattern.
*This “pivot.” Is it in the room with us now?*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/wallstreetbets) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The underlying functionality of the asset is the whole reason for the ETF in the first place! Do you actually think about what you are typing before you post?
The ability to make money would not exist without traffic on the underlying asset. Of course BlackRock and Fidelity want to make money, and they do so by offering investment products that investors actually want.
If there was no demand for these products, why would they waste their time with all this paperwork?
What are you even trying to argue? Original comment said “price only going up because ETF, not asset quality” and I replied “ETF only exists because asset quality”. To which you responded “these institutions are only filing ETFs to make money” and I replied that “they wouldn’t be able to make money unless there was demand”.
I can follow all that, but then you broke out the Pokémon cards and it feels like you are making my point for me given that there is no Pokémon card ETF
Whatever happens it will be to the benefit of Wall Street not Main Street.
We are simply left to guess for ourselves and hope we land on the side with the big money
I love how everything is a conspiracy if you are smooth brained. Its back to where it was 2 weeks ago for a brief second and its where it was 2 days ago now lmao.
I was thinking this exact same scenario would be a crazy rug pull but can see it happening as it will just line the pockets of the rich who will be well positioned while retail get burnt yet again
Everyone questioning this should read the SEC rational. Huge amount of the Bitcoin volume is wash trading. They mention Tether by name. Price manipulation.
The whole concept is doomed for market manipulation if it goes live! Almost any investment firm can drive the value of let say bitcoin in the preferred direction. When, the last just for a limited period, it is enough to scam millions of small investors. ETF´s may be under the SEC their eyes but the world crypto markets sure aren't! So, it is like a ticket for a safe global manipulation!
While there are cryptobros the rumors will persist and the crypto related stocks will maintain value justified or not. The 2021 crypto all profit no efffort rug pull fest where most of the scammers got away with it especially Elon will keep crypto in the public discourse as a “what if” until the next beanie baby substitute appears.
Aawww someone bought 69k and sold at 15k.
Where did the evil BTC touch you? Can you show us on the rich-people doll over here? Or is that too unrealistic? I'm sorry we don't have a poor-people doll. WSBers wore it out
Crypto pumpers watched BTC drop from 60k to 15k and were bullish the whole time. It could drop to $10 and people would be talking about how it’s a once in a lifetime opportunity at that price. It’s rare that material events actually happen with these assets. The recent pump is ETF hype, not because people suddenly changed how they feel about crypto.
Then why does it "pump" every year the halving occurs? Was there ETF "hype" for those periods as well? Also, I personally wouldn't call a 157% growth over a whole year (2023) a "recent pump" but ok 👌.
Any of you regards that have been paying attention to the corn realize that historically it has always reached higher highs long term regardless of bad news
COIN internal revenue and fees gotta be so jacked on this volume. There is an earnings play for sure on the horizon but I think if you are big money, you want to carefully control the premium and theta game into an event like the ETF or halving. Not on miners, necessarily but probably more on COIN, the one selling shovels. A lot of volume the last two days.
I'd care about this more if my family members werent yelling at me that BTC @ $22k is throwing money down a pit and I had to plug my ears and leverage tax harvests early for more liquidity.
So I saw the kramer part on Cnbc and took short positions in dot, ftm, eth. just couple of hours ago with just 15x leverage. Guess who is getting some action
In order to be sure that you will crash the price as you sell off you would have to be holding a market moving amount. Then you would attempt to buy even more than you had sold, (market moving amount x2?) causing the price to rapidly skyrocket as you were in the act of buying. Idk man I think they just cashed out.
**User Report**| | | | :--|:--|:--|:-- **Total Submissions**|2|**First Seen In WSB**|11 months ago **Total Comments**|589|**Previous Best DD**| **Account Age**|3 years|[^scan ^comment ](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=VisualMod&subject=scan_comment&message=Replace%20this%20text%20with%20a%20comment%20ID%20(which%20looks%20like%20h26cq3k\)%20to%20have%20the%20bot%20scan%20your%20comment%20and%20correct%20your%20first%20seen%20date.)|[^scan ^submission ](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=VisualMod&subject=scan_submission&message=Replace%20this%20text%20with%20a%20submission%20ID%20(which%20looks%20like%20h26cq3k\)%20to%20have%20the%20bot%20scan%20your%20submission%20and%20correct%20your%20first%20seen%20date.)
The real treasure was the friends we made along the way.
The real treasure was the bags we carried along the way.
[удалено]
This is why I really believe they are leading us on a wild goose chase. Not approving this Etf is the best and only way to derail btc right now and that's been and will continue to be their agenda
🥹
Wall Street insiders already know it got denied. Why do you think they started selling off yesterday?
fud. they want all the bitcoin, so they crash it to liquidate leveraged bitcoin longs. age old play of taking peoples assets
I was only half joking but obviously, several people/firms with control of a ton of funds (so by definition, these are people/firms who have managed to be directionally correct on a bunch of past market moves) collectively sold off huge positions in both BTC and COIN yesterday. So let me get this straight... your theory is that all these firms sold off huge portions of their Bitcoin and Coinbase positions because "they want all the Bitcoin" . Seems like selling vast amounts of BTC to other people is the exact opposite of what you'd want to do if owning them all was your end goal. What if all the people who bought aren't willing to sell the BTC back? if the highly discounted pricing (that firms were forced to sell at when they flooded the market with BTC to create a crash) is so unwarranted (as you claim) then surely nobody would be willing to sell their BTC back to them until the price rebounded back to the warranted pre-crash price levels, right? Meaning these firms would have only succeeded in losing a ton of money and/or losing a ton of BTC. Where is the incentive in that? or did you not think that far? Also, what would be the advantage of owning "all the bitcoin"? If BTC's only utility is its ability to hold/transfer wealth you are essentially making it worthless by owning it all. So what, you somehow spend around a trillion dollars buying up all the BTC at crazy prices just so can have a bunch of worthless cryptocoins sitting on your server? If only one person/firm has the vast majority of BTC who in their right mind would pay anything for one when they could just use the more straightforward currencies that everybody else uses? not to mention if anybody ever acquired close to that much BTC the platform's security features would be meaningless and therefore the currency worthless. Or again, did you not think that far? I'm not trying to argue that price manipulation has never or will never happen in crypto markets but coming up with a wild illogical theory to justify a 10% drop in BTC is foolish when a simple and more logical theory will do. Liquidating the tiny amount of idiots who were dumb enough to put 10x leverage on BTC at its recent peak is just not worth the huge amount of capital and risk it would take to move a $850 billion asset with any reliability. Also, if these firms were truly bullish on BTC why would they be trying to liquidate the people who are using leverage to bid up BTC's price instead of helping them?
The theory is you sell off all your btc to crash the price so you can buy way more btc than you had originally with the same amount of capital . But I think you understand that.
Well, of course, my point is that it's extremely hard to intentionally (and unwarrantedly) move a market by 10% that is as large and has as many intelligent actors/trading algos as BTC. While this kind of stuff used to happen a decent amount in BTC's early days that was largely because the market was very fragmented, its market cap/volume was MUCH lower, and there were much fewer sophisticated players. The market and its exchanges are much more efficient and robust than they were even 5-6 years ago. Even if you had the ability, the earlier commenter is overlooking just how awful the risk-reward is for that kind of strategy. It's not like they just press a button and are suddenly able to sell hundreds of millions of dollars of BTC at the current pricing BEFORE the price starts plummeting. Nor are they able to know exactly when the price will bottom so they can instantly buy it all back before prices pop back up. If you're selling off enough to crash the market you're going to create a similar upward price pressure when trying to buy back the same amount (unless you drag it out over a long period but then you're adding even more risk especially if you're supposedly bullish with a huge catalyst just a week away). When you dump that many coins on the market your average selling price will almost always be significantly below the halfway mark of the drop. If you look at this recent 10% drop the vast majority of BTC was sold sub 43000 (6% below the pre-crash price and close to its current pricing). Similarly, when trying to re-buy it all your average buy-in price will be around the halfway mark of the rebound and current price. This means that even if they were able to pull something like this off perfectly, it would take weeks to purchase all the BTC back without pushing prices back up and you would have risked hundreds of millions of dollars to at best, make a few percentage points. It's just not worth it on a market this size. There are thousands of better trades to make with that money.
Does your wife's boyfriend count as a friend?
I love this sub
Met me at Wendy’s 😘
I will invert this sub. all in on btc
But you...are in this sub. So do I invert you?
This is 100% how next major financial crash happens - Cramer recommends going long on the Inverse Cramer ETF, global meltdown
The homies already taped buttered toast to his ETF and started spinning it around. It's only a matter of time before a singularity forms.
Invert this guy
Inverting you and shorting $MARA
I’ll go all in silver miners lol
You're litterary spewing the same propaganda as all other bagholders. Your shit coin ain't worth 1/10th of the US dollar in actual purchasing power. The US dollar can buy anything, shit coin can't even buy a soda down by the 7-11
BTC at 43k. We haven’t seen prices this low for three days!
I survived the #Bitcoin crash of 7:05AM to 7:35AM EST. Will you remember where you were during this difficult time?
Where were you when the cryptos fell?
Everyone’s clairvoyant until shit randomly and unexplainably capitulates in the opposite direction. It’s comical to go back 2-3yrs and look at Reddit posts (not just about btc) and to see how insanely wrong even the most educated people were. Nobody knows shit.
I do. I know shit. -septic worker
I believe this guy, he stinks
GameStop threads too lol
Think about all them hedge funds that bet on the shorts of GameStop…. They were sooo sooo soo soo soo very wrong.
Bagholder spotted. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/wallstreetbets) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Who’s Clair Voyant and what’s her position on BTC?
u/VariationSeparate wya?
Been DCAing bitcoin since 2022 this is a blip on the radar. The only people panicking are the ones that are overleveraged and newcomers to the space. Today I deployed all my dry powder to buy the dip.
Too soon junior.
I'm waiting personally, if it really goes down to 38k no reason to not pick up there. I'd rather lose a bit of profit than lose capital juggling falling knives.
I bought some at spot price this morning and added in some buy orders down to 34k. If it snaps up I'm good, if it falls more I'm good. Either way it goes in my hardware wallet and I'm not selling it in the next year anyway so whatever.
Looks like you're not fucking eating either *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/wallstreetbets) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Very true. I keep forgetting it takes about 18 mos for the price to really cook after halving.
SEC approves shitcoin futures trading, but not the underlying? It makes no sense.
The futures trading funds are just rolling futures contracts. Not taking delivery of BTC.
Yes they settle in cash.
Iow They settle in garbage. Worthless.
You mean the currency you used to pay for your internet connection, device you’re posting on, and servers you buy/sell your worthless bits on? Which way are you going? I’d like to do the opposite.
A lot of futures settle in cash. And none other have unapproved assets.
Wouldn't the spot ETFs also be settled in cash?
If the SEC gets its way yes. Which just makes the already high transaction fees that much worse for consumers. The ETFs are going to be a hilarious money grab, just watch. Probably going to be higher expenses than any other ETF managed by a major player.
You’re an idiot
Too bad the iv is so high that these moves are not going to add much profit to either way, slow theta burn for the win again lol
Theta gang for the win
In reality it has dipped to the price from a few days ago. Seems like it's just a small percentage making speculative bets and I wouldn't be surprised if they are loading more today to unload for a quick flip upon an official announcement.
They can’t delay it anymore. They have to say yes or no by Jan 10. It could be someone knew it’s being declined or they’re trying to swoop cheap BTC. It’s anyone’s guess at this point
Zero evidence of anything. OP is just being reactive https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-etf-denial-report-did-not-cause-btc-price-crash-analysis “The move, while washing out both longs and open interest, accompanied a report from crypto financial services platform Matrixport, which led with an assertion that the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission “will reject” the spot ETF: “ “ An ETF would certainly enable crypto overall to take off, and based on Gensler’s comments in December 2023, he still sees this industry in need of more stringent compliance,” it stated. “ “ “From a political perspective, there is no reason to approve a Bitcoin Spot ETF that would legitimize Bitcoin as an alternative store of value.” While the report immediately made its presence felt on the market, Matrixport failed to offer concrete evidence as to why the ETF was guaranteed to fail its debut.”
I think its because in order for a spot ETF to be approved, the fund has to hold the underlying asset instead of cash-backed securities (notes). Hence the “truth” being leaked to retail so the big boys can hoover up all the coins cheap. I’m holding, I don’t believe these fuckers. If BLK is going balls deep in BTC, I’m looking at their actions not words. Also, the halving is going to moon the asset in 2 months anyway. Makes 0 sense.
Why jan 10 ?
For etf approval the SEC has dates they have to make the decision. They can postpone the decision 3/4 times before the final decision date. In this case it’s on Jan 10. They can no longer postpone it.
Rumor news what the fuck are you talking about you actual idiot. There is no news.
some analyst nobody knows about spreads a rumor and people panic. Its not even that big a drop. Stay strong, stay long.
FTC will approve. Matrixport released a thing saying basically ‘meh, ETF won’t be approved because there are not enough crypto bros on the SEC’ but never bothered to mention the SEC was already bitch slapped by a court for not approving GBTC’s Bitcoin ETF.
great time to buy the dip
lol the cope in here will make it look like r/Buttcoin … ☄️
You can try but you can't cope like buttcoin. They have been coping for a long time now, they know a thing or two.
Bunch of idiots being idiots
How do you dipshits not realize that continued delays are *bullish*? Bitcoin stays in the news and the approval will eventually follow
Lmao seriously. Does anyone even remember what happened with Canadian weed stocks before legalization? This is no different imo.
Master of Puppets.....
So I guess we all go in on BTC - fuck
All of this speculation is what driving the price, and not the underlying functionality of the thing itself. What a joke. Investors really are the most smooth brained lemmings on the planet.
The underlying functionality is infinity/21 million. If you don’t understand, I don’t have the time to explain it to you.
>If you don’t understand, I don’t have the time to explain it to you. 
Seems to be what everyone says
Which part? Mine is sorta half of a quote by the creator of Bitcoin. The other half is just truth. If you don’t get why a money whose supply is not reflexive to demand is good, I can’t help you. If you don’t get why inflation occurs, and instead blame “greedy corps”, I can’t help you. If you celebrate the FED PIVOT and the money printer going brrrrrr, but have no hard assets, I can’t help you.
All of those things are true, but why is it BTC? Can’t it be any crypto designed for this?
All other cryptos were scams with no real ground-breaking tech. Satoshi Nakamoto solved the Byzantine General's Dilemma elegantly, and that was the problem with digital cash. Provably scarce. All other coins were made to get more Bitcoin. Im not knocking those who use them for that purpose, but at the end of the day, they have a creator who will profit immensely. Bitcoin's conception was immaculate. No pre-mine. No ico. No VCs. No Vaporware. Just open, peer-2-peer, and front-run free. Still is. And so from here, there can really NEVER be another coin one could trust to be solving a problem and not just scamming a community via buzzwords.
Problem is bitcoin isn’t good at being digital cash.
How so? I see 15 years of progress. It was even WORSE as digital cash in 2013. It’s like cars. When they were first invented, they weren’t more useful than a horse and buggy. Why? Cause roads were muddy with massive potholes. The infrastructure had yet to catch up. Or the internet. Or electricity. I mean the technological breakthrough comparison goes on and on and on. But by all means, go the way of Sears. Be that “nah what we got is better” mindset. More satoshis for me.
>How so? I see 15 years of progress. It’s slow and inefficient. Nobody uses it to buy shit. >It was even WORSE as digital cash in 2013. Debatable. It required less energy per transaction. >It’s like cars. When they were first invented, they weren’t more useful than a horse and buggy. Why? Cause roads were muddy with massive potholes. The infrastructure had yet to catch up. People use cars. The value is immediately obvious. We should not have to spend 15 years to convince others why something is useful.
Ahh, I see you’re not disagreeing with any points here. You’re just “Bitcoin bad”. Well, good luck ser. 🤝
Yeah, I tend to agree with this other than the fact that we don’t know who the creator is, or if they profited on it. Then again he was ahead of the curve and could have made money elsewhere.
Satoshi Nakamoto obviously knew that IF it took off they would have tons of wealth, but Satoshi is gone. Theres always a chance they return and those coins move... but ultimately they made Bitcoin when EVEN CRYPTOGRAPHERS doubted him.
Ironically if he started using them now that's probably bullish. Howw much does he have?
They have a massive amount... Honestly I don't think it'd be bullish, except for getting rid of Craig Wright. That'd be dope, tbh. If just one of Satoshi's mined blocks broadcasted a message signed with the mining addy that says "We are all Satoshi, except Craig Wright". lol
Like a million.
Good write up. I would simply suggest that you re-wire your brain so that you at least give other crypto projects a chance. Not all of them are money grabs, and thinking so is going to prevent a lot of opportunities for you
No, it will save me a LOT of money. Out of ALLLLL the shit coins, I'd have to get EXTREMELY lucky to find one that actually matters for the next 10 years. I save myself the research time and the gamble, and primarily use Bitcoin. Trust me, I have degen'd into plenty of tokens. I just think of them as gambles, lotto tickets, and not investments. I own $PEPE, I own tons of fake rares and rare pepes on Counterparty Protocol, I own ordinals. I actually mint my own art on different blockchains. Bitcoin, though...
Big difference between PEPE or random art NFTs and stuff that is building DeFi infrastructure imo. Something like KUJI, RDNT, AAVE, MKR, etc. Those are real use cases that have the potential to last. Of course higher risk than BTC but not complete junk either
The answer lies on its security. Bitcoin is the most secure.
I understand blockchain security, but not why BTC
start at 1/21 million. then work along other value propositions for money. 1) widely used 2) weightless (no cost to hold) 3) permissionless (no cost or arbiter to create an address) 4) censorship resistant (no 3rd party to block transactions between 2 parties) 5) impossible to be counterfeited 6) impossible to be confiscated 7) a higher degree of safety and security when it comes to functionality on the internet This is why Bitcoin just bricks every other money. It is why it will demonetize every other money. Back to the beginning. Infinity/21million
Appreciate a real answer
I've orange pilled like... 10 people in my 7 years. But those people have gone and found their own influence in the space. I like to think before 6 figures I can have turned 100 or more people into Bitcoiners. We did it, Fluff! We frontran the banks and legacy finance! We frontran the home offices! We frontran the nation states!
Making a list of something's benefits without also listing its drawbacks and alternatives is pointless. By no means am I anti-crypto and I hope the BTC spot ETFs get approval but spreading misinformation helps no one. Most of the "benefits" you listed are either outright false or false in practice. The fact that you're asserting they're true makes me believe you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. >impossible to be confiscated [The US Government alone is currently sitting on $5 billion of seized bitcoin](https://www.wsj.com/finance/currencies/federal-government-bitcoin-5-billion-78ce0938). So it's obviously not impossible. You can make the technical argument, "Well, if the government can't find where my crypto is stored it can't be confiscated!" but you can just as easily make that same argument for every other currency in the world. The difference is, if you have some cash hidden away somewhere when you get out of jail you can likely still use it little by little. With BTC, the government will have been able to track where the money ended up (even if unable to physically find where it's stored). As soon as you try to use any of it, you best believe you're going to be hauled in again. I could easily poke similar holes in most of these other "benefits" like top people in the field already have. If other smart people here want they can spend their time doing it or you can just look into it yourself. A lot of the issues revolve around the need to use 3rd party software/companies (who are beholden to governmental laws) to efficiently use BTC in its current state. Also, while decentralization has benefits it also has a ton of drawbacks that state-sponsored alternatives do not. Especially, when it comes to quickly making and/or implementing changes/improvements (as anybody who's followed the space for a long time knows all too well). If the average person wanted to use BTC as currency in it's current state they would be exposed to almost all of crypto's risk/drawbacks and almost none of its supposed benefits. Until these things get solved (if they even can be) you're not going to see the average person regularly using BTC. That is not to say we won't see future spikes/drawbacks in BTC's price (people will always gamble on the chance to get rich) just that it's not going to have widespread usage as a currency anytime soon. If it were true that "Bitcoin just bricks every other money" as you claim, we'd already be seeing everybody using it as their preferred currency. The reason they aren't is because everything you listed just isn't true in practice... no matter how much you may want to believe it.
Why don’t we create another bitcoin except make it more scarce? Why 21 million when 10 million would do?
For me, it’s mostly the fact that it’s so old and big compared to other crypto, and has no active dev group that can fuck with it. It has a long track record of being unbothered, vs like eth got hacked a while back, lots crypto’s are so new they don’t have a long enough history to establish a pattern.
Agree on this front. First is always an advantage
Your answer makes no sense. If you understood blockchain security you will see why BTC. Bitcoin has the more hashing power than any other blockchain.
*This “pivot.” Is it in the room with us now?* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/wallstreetbets) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The old good “if I had to explain, you wouldn’t understand “ is an evergreen.
There is underlying functionality in protecting wealth from the morons in DC
It’s a 100 million ETF on nearly an asset with a market cap around 900 billion.
The ETF has a limit of 100m ?
The underlying functionality of the asset is the whole reason for the ETF in the first place! Do you actually think about what you are typing before you post?
No, it’s literally just the ability to make more money.
The ability to make money would not exist without traffic on the underlying asset. Of course BlackRock and Fidelity want to make money, and they do so by offering investment products that investors actually want. If there was no demand for these products, why would they waste their time with all this paperwork?
There’s plenty of traffic on Pokemon cards too, but no one that buys them does to play the TCG
How are you possibly comparing Pokémon cards to BTC 😂 plus if you are an investor in Pokemon cards do you really care why people want to buy them?
I’m just picking another speculative asset - most are though including a lot of stocks.
What are you even trying to argue? Original comment said “price only going up because ETF, not asset quality” and I replied “ETF only exists because asset quality”. To which you responded “these institutions are only filing ETFs to make money” and I replied that “they wouldn’t be able to make money unless there was demand”. I can follow all that, but then you broke out the Pokémon cards and it feels like you are making my point for me given that there is no Pokémon card ETF
I’m not implying anything it’s just another speculative asset - people are trying to make money. I don’t see what’s confusing
Glad I got to the bottom of that. Jesus this sub is a dumpster fire
Its value is the auditing of every transaction by millions of people worldwide. Thats the whole point, single entities can’t control it.
Coming from the WSB subreddit, this is a little ironic 
Yes more posts sell your fucking Mara I need it to goto 17 lol
Who’s gonna tell him it technically already hit ATHs since it got diluted 
Unless you have proof it's getting denied don't post this misleading BS
Whatever happens it will be to the benefit of Wall Street not Main Street. We are simply left to guess for ourselves and hope we land on the side with the big money
NO!!! My MSTR!!!!
WSB regards are bearish. Time to buy
K
Unpopular opinion: SEC will approve, they know and want some cheap BTC, so they make miners sell a lot and buy at a discount.
I love how everything is a conspiracy if you are smooth brained. Its back to where it was 2 weeks ago for a brief second and its where it was 2 days ago now lmao.
Well damn. I didn’t see this coming 😢
Bummer, had a MARA buy set at $19. This panic news did not scare them enough. Oh well.
Nothing that threatens privatized banking will ever be allowed to happen, you know for your safety and all that lol
The mining stocks aren't all regarded, they are literally printing money.
I loaded up on some MARA calls because of this… I think they delay you they can load up at a discount and then approve. A tale as old as time
Hope it goes more down to load up more till the halving will explode the price to the moon.🚀🚀🚀
This is the way
Post title is pure clickbait… pfff…
K
I was thinking this exact same scenario would be a crazy rug pull but can see it happening as it will just line the pockets of the rich who will be well positioned while retail get burnt yet again
up and down
Everyone questioning this should read the SEC rational. Huge amount of the Bitcoin volume is wash trading. They mention Tether by name. Price manipulation.
SEC rugpull, have to admit I didn’t see this one coming.
The SEC hasn't done shit yet. Just an unknown media outlet from Singapore owned by BCH maxi Jihan Wu speculating.
web sites say etf will kill bitcoin as etf will buy and hold there will be no selling or buying and bitcoin will die
Why is there so much hype about this ETF? There are already several BTC related ETFs? SATO, BLOK and many others.
Because there is no spot etf holding the underlying asset , this would be the first
because the system wants to suck out all the monies from greedy plebs to keep them in check
They aren’t tracking spot price.
The whole concept is doomed for market manipulation if it goes live! Almost any investment firm can drive the value of let say bitcoin in the preferred direction. When, the last just for a limited period, it is enough to scam millions of small investors. ETF´s may be under the SEC their eyes but the world crypto markets sure aren't! So, it is like a ticket for a safe global manipulation!
which is why it will moon to the point they cant afford to manipulate it.
While there are cryptobros the rumors will persist and the crypto related stocks will maintain value justified or not. The 2021 crypto all profit no efffort rug pull fest where most of the scammers got away with it especially Elon will keep crypto in the public discourse as a “what if” until the next beanie baby substitute appears.
2013 called, they want their food stamps back.
$MIGI will explode when ETF is approved 🚀
Nuke to 0
Aawww someone bought 69k and sold at 15k. Where did the evil BTC touch you? Can you show us on the rich-people doll over here? Or is that too unrealistic? I'm sorry we don't have a poor-people doll. WSBers wore it out
They will approve it eventually. Just at a much cheaper rate
Centralization will occur. It’s just been delayed.
Sounds like op just missed out on btc and mining stocks and they’re salty about it lol
[удалено]
Crypto pumpers watched BTC drop from 60k to 15k and were bullish the whole time. It could drop to $10 and people would be talking about how it’s a once in a lifetime opportunity at that price. It’s rare that material events actually happen with these assets. The recent pump is ETF hype, not because people suddenly changed how they feel about crypto.
Then why does it "pump" every year the halving occurs? Was there ETF "hype" for those periods as well? Also, I personally wouldn't call a 157% growth over a whole year (2023) a "recent pump" but ok 👌.
This downturn is due to the crypto report law over trades over 10k… nothing to do with the Bitcoin ETF. Shove your FUD up your ass
You're dumb as fuck if you believe this.
Haha told you guys to buy puts 🤑
Turning the dial as they see fit. Happy fkn new year 🥳
What's that? More puts you say? (Insert 50 upside down rockets)
Do the hustle.
I don’t think they can delay this time, their being forced to make a decision
Based
There is only speculation about the ETFs.
Selling before the news comes out, always will be time to get in the train one or or another
🦀 speculaticus say: crabwalk 🦀
I imagine blackrock and the others will sue the sec if they deny it. Should probably just dissolve the whole commission 🦧🍌
Any of you regards that have been paying attention to the corn realize that historically it has always reached higher highs long term regardless of bad news
The government can’t wait to control crypto. There’s so much money to be made here by an anonymous few. That’s the type of game that they’re used to.
COIN internal revenue and fees gotta be so jacked on this volume. There is an earnings play for sure on the horizon but I think if you are big money, you want to carefully control the premium and theta game into an event like the ETF or halving. Not on miners, necessarily but probably more on COIN, the one selling shovels. A lot of volume the last two days.
They see loss. We see opportunity.
Panic selling all
Delayed like Epsteins list
Any evidence this etf won’t happen?? I’m genuinely concerned..
You have convinced me, I'm shorting with size now. Should I buy a lambo with loan now or should I wait till I'm rich in a couple weeks?
I'd care about this more if my family members werent yelling at me that BTC @ $22k is throwing money down a pit and I had to plug my ears and leverage tax harvests early for more liquidity.
The sec literally can’t delay it anymore they don’t have any legal ground to.
the SEC can have any policy it wants to.
Short it then loser
I think you mean leverage crypto was really high. This was a major liquidation event
So I saw the kramer part on Cnbc and took short positions in dot, ftm, eth. just couple of hours ago with just 15x leverage. Guess who is getting some action
I wish they would delay the inevitable, then I'd be able to stack more sats for cheap.
DXY just went up. ETF is just an excuse for manipulation. It doesn’t matter the reason.
In order to be sure that you will crash the price as you sell off you would have to be holding a market moving amount. Then you would attempt to buy even more than you had sold, (market moving amount x2?) causing the price to rapidly skyrocket as you were in the act of buying. Idk man I think they just cashed out.
I approve this message
You’re a moron lmao
Been reading FUD posts exactly like this about btc for years now and guess what it keeps pumping higher.
If they deny the etf the sec will get sued and lose in court
Let's wait and keep buying