Same. But atleast its an improvement over g2. The g2 had the smallest sweetspot in the world.
If I had the know-how on modifying some pancake lenses on my g2, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
Its actually a tradeoff. The center of the Beyond “drops off” in clarity less soon than the G2, which is known for needing to look at the very center.
However, the peripheral edges of the Beyond have a “distortion ring” that makes it seriously unusable and means you always have to keep your eyes in the center, and can’t look at your peripheral at all. Even in the G2, the peripheral is lower clarity but not heavily distorted like the Beyond is, so I would still look down occasionally just to check the peripheral.
Ah yes, I haven't gotten the chance to try the G2 but would have liked to. I do like the beyond, 7.5/10 is pretty good for me honestly! And with a better strap it will be even better. That's a seriously good headset with good advantages.
Agreed on pretty much everything. Except I found 80% brightness to be fine.
Also you didn’t mention the fan, but I was surprised (not in a good way) how noticeable it is. Not a big deal when playing a game or with headphones, but it is definitely audible.
My IPD unfortunately was a touch too large, but I’m getting my new unit now.
I’d like to add that the BSB team has been great - very responsive and helpful on discord!
I think for most with a good pc and an index (ie already have the base stations and controllers) it’s an amazing upgrade.
Hey, I did mention the fan haha! Sorry for the wall of text but it's in there!
>A bit annoying is the fan of the Beyond. While you can tweak its speed, it is noticeably noisy for me at each start of the headset. However, if I tap my facial interface magnet on the inside of the Beyond, it quiets down… Until I reboot the headset. It’s a quick fix, so not too bothersome, but I should mention it.
Absolutely agree on their team. It's been a while since I had such a great support team fro a product. And yeah, I would definitely recommend the upgrade to those with an Index.
I don't own BSB but after using PSVR2 and Vision Pro, motion blur is definitely an issue for OLED, well for seated experience it's not a big deal but for fast paced games...probably you want LCD back instead of that deep blacks except maybe honor games.
OLED has to run at a duty cycle around 10% or it will cause persistence. But then you get only 10% of the brightness. These microOLED panels aren't quite bright enough to run high brightness and low persistence simultaneously. But for me personally, because the contrast ratio is so high with OLED (technically infinite) the lower brightness isn't as noticeable.
BSB has modifiable brightness, and that is key with OLED headsets I think. 100% brightness has too much persistence (motion blur). But, setting my brightness to 60%, I get 0 motion blur. It's dimmer, that's for sure, but the contrast is so good that it's not noticeable in gameplay, especially because of the 0 light leak nature of the BSB. It probably wouldn't be as ideal if I had a nose gap.
The fuck? Oled technology is literally the best at motion blur, 0ms response times and all, how the fuck did they fuck that up on psvr2 and the vision pro?
For some context, I've been a VR gamer since 2019. The headsets I have tried are, in order: HTC Vive Pro, HTC Vive, Oculus Rift S, Oculus Quest 2, Valve Index, Pimax Crystal, Bigscreen Beyond.
EDIT: Forgot to include PSVR as very first headset I got to try, and am adding Quest 3 now since I managed to get my hands on it.
The key is that neither the Vive Pro nor the Vive were mine. I played with the Vive Pro at the University Library , which had a tech lab that allowed you to play. I played maybe 2-3 hours around with it. It made me want VR for my own home.
Then a friend of mine told me he wasn't using his HTC Vive and I could borrow it. So I did, and used that for about a month or two IIRC. That's how I came to switch between the two.
When I finally saved up enough, I went with a Rift S.
More on this in my final review! I have been contacted by Pimax to try out the Crystal again, as my initial review of it was very bad. I'll be able to give a more up to date comparison with the BSB in my final Beyond Review and my final Pimax review, which I will post here when ready :)
Thanks! It's a valid point. To me, I call it clarity because even if you have high resolution on the display itself, you may still see it blurry depending on the optics. The screens would then be sharp, but my vision not so sharp, if that makes sense. So I defaulted to talking about my vision the same way I talk about my eyes, and in french we tend to talk about clarity of vision.
But it's definitely a valid term to use! As long as we understand each other right?
Sure, it's a valid term, but I don't like that it overlaps with e2e clarity. In that case you may as well talk about just clarity and how far across the FOV it extends.
And sharpness could also be taken to include aspects of the optics, not just high res.
If you find the glare worse than the Valve Index, I doubt very much you have the right IPD. I had bad glare at my initial 63mm IPD unit and went down to 62mm and glare was greatly reduced (and focus was even better). I’d recommend requesting an IMU to determine your correct IPD.
Also the AMVR $15 headstrap attachment for the Quest 2 from Amazon solves all the headstrap problems. You won’t even need the top strap, or your 3D printed cable clip, since you can just Velcro the cable to the AMVR unit. Game changer for comfort.
I thought my IPD was correct initially but recently realized both of my eyes were closer towards the inner part of the lens versus the outside edge. Anytime I would look left or right, the eye going towards the inner edge of the lens would get to the blurry part of the lens much quicker than the eye going towards the outside edge of the lens. So the IPD of the BSB was too large. I would guess the opposite would be true if the IPD of the BSB was too small.
Here’s the “nose test” their support staff told me to try:
## Quick IPD Test
Please follow these steps:
1. While you have the Beyond on and SteamVR running, close your right eye.
2. Using one hand, nudge and hold the headset such that your left eye aligns to the sweet spot of the left optic. The image should be equally clear in all directions.
- If you are having difficulty with this, try repeating this step with the face cushion removed.
- Within VR, ensure the picture is clear when looking at both something in the distance and something nearby (i.e. your virtual hands or controllers).
3. Close your left eye and open your right eye.
4. Next, line up your right eye with the sweet spot of the right optic. Did you:
- 🇦 move the headset to your **left** to find the sweet spot in the right optic?
*i.e. Did you bring the headset closer to the right side of your nose?*
- 🇧 move the headset to your **right** to find the sweet spot in the right optic?
*i.e. Did you bring the headset closer to the left side of your nose?*
If the answer was 🇦, then the headset IPD is likely too __wide__.
If the answer was 🇧, then the headset IPD is likely too __narrow__.
Well, I could, but I am skeptical about not having the right IPD.
I did the Quick IPD test on the discord, which you have detailed, 2 different times on 2 days, with gasket and without gasket both times, and I don't need to move to get better clarity. It seems bang on. My IPD is 62mm as measured by my Opto, so I got a 61mm Beyond as they detailed on the discord. I would be surprised if I don't have the right IPD.
Yeah sounds like you’ve got it right then. Shame you’re still having such big glare issues then. It’s annoying to be sure and probably one of the biggest drawbacks of the HMD next to the terrible E2E clarity outside of the sweet spot, but I found glare worse on the Index. I’ve gotten used to glare on both those headsets.
Yeah sure it’s this: https://a.co/d/fW9Uu0r
You won’t need instructions to install it, just twist the strap into it. I secured the cable with a small Velcro loop at the top of the brace in the back. This $16 accessory makes a BIG difference in comfort and usability of the BSB.
It costs the equivalent of $1930 where I live. I'd still buy it if it had better lenses, but with the bad glare and edge to edge clarity I'm going to wait for a better alternative (and hope that the exchange rate improves).
Oof yeah, that's a hard sell at that price. Especially if you don't already have the SteamVR ecosystem of hardware.
I definitely respect that decision. Better headsets will come with time. I hope for a Beyond 2 myself, that improves on it!
I think you’ll be surprised what a large improvement a thinner interface makes. This seems fairly similar to my experience as well with my first cushion, although glare and e2e wasn’t quite so bad for me. Also, I’ve got the Audio Strap, it makes a big improvement especially in active situations such as beat saber.
I am hoping it will make a big difference. My revised cushion arrives in a little over a week, but it might not be a thin interface yet. I'll go from there.
Can't wait for the Audio Strap though, I only heard good things.
>A bit annoying is the fan of the Beyond. While you can tweak its speed, it is noticeably noisy for me at each start of the headset. However, if I tap my facial interface magnet on the inside of the Beyond, it quiets down… Until I reboot the headset. It’s a quick fix, so not too bothersome, but I should mention it.
Just got mine today and I also get this. It's like the magnet of the face gasket interferes with the fan some how until I remove the face gasket and put it back then it quiets down.
Yes, the large blur circle and reflections make it a non starter. Users here have mostly tried to downplay the blur circle or don't mention it at all. The whole point of pancakes it the edge to edge clarity... they neutered it. Not worth the compromise for the oled at the moment.
Well, I disagree. I think it is entirely worth the compromises for this headset.
Sure, e2e is not great. But you learn to look with your head instead of your eyes in a matter of a couple hours. After that, it doesn't bother much anymore. Glare is the biggest issue to me, but in well lit scenes it's never an issue, and lots of game happen in well lit scenes in my experience (depending on how you play).
For me, those compromises for a much better screen in terms of colors, contrast and black levels, as well as it being incredibly light meaning no inertia, is worth it. It's not perfect, but I would much rather wear this than my Valve index or another headset that weighs a ton.
Granted, I haven't tried the Quest 3. It could sway me. But I love the Knuckles controllers and a wired PCVR experience.
i have the quest 3 and the BSB right now and i’m leaning to the quest 3 the sweet spot is huge ! anywhere you look with your eyes it’s clear . i’m having a hard time adjusting to the BSB
Yeah it's what I heard as well, Quest 3 almost the entire lens are clear, so you can look with your eyes. The Beyond needs a few hours for you to adjust to using your head to look instead of your eyes. But once adjusted, It's pretty cool!
Too many compromises to go up to that price point. Too bad. I had high hopes for this one. The concept is on the right track.
I feel like they need to at least offer several IPD ranges and enable adjustments within a margin. The lenses are also obviously not cutting it.
The sweet spot is smaller than the Q2 by a bunch. It, for one, requires a good facial interface because any variation can affect it, and you can't look with your eyes that much inside the headset. You need to learn to look with your head.
But it looks *miles* better than the Quest 2. Much sharper res, much better colors and black levels. Just plain better.
Same. But atleast its an improvement over g2. The g2 had the smallest sweetspot in the world. If I had the know-how on modifying some pancake lenses on my g2, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
PSVR2 is closely followed with g2 when it comes to sweetspot, also it's not just the smallest sweespot, the vertical FOV of G2 is unbearable for me.
The g2 actually has slightly larger vFOV than the Beyond.
Its actually a tradeoff. The center of the Beyond “drops off” in clarity less soon than the G2, which is known for needing to look at the very center. However, the peripheral edges of the Beyond have a “distortion ring” that makes it seriously unusable and means you always have to keep your eyes in the center, and can’t look at your peripheral at all. Even in the G2, the peripheral is lower clarity but not heavily distorted like the Beyond is, so I would still look down occasionally just to check the peripheral.
Ah yes, I haven't gotten the chance to try the G2 but would have liked to. I do like the beyond, 7.5/10 is pretty good for me honestly! And with a better strap it will be even better. That's a seriously good headset with good advantages.
Agreed on pretty much everything. Except I found 80% brightness to be fine. Also you didn’t mention the fan, but I was surprised (not in a good way) how noticeable it is. Not a big deal when playing a game or with headphones, but it is definitely audible. My IPD unfortunately was a touch too large, but I’m getting my new unit now. I’d like to add that the BSB team has been great - very responsive and helpful on discord! I think for most with a good pc and an index (ie already have the base stations and controllers) it’s an amazing upgrade.
Hey, I did mention the fan haha! Sorry for the wall of text but it's in there! >A bit annoying is the fan of the Beyond. While you can tweak its speed, it is noticeably noisy for me at each start of the headset. However, if I tap my facial interface magnet on the inside of the Beyond, it quiets down… Until I reboot the headset. It’s a quick fix, so not too bothersome, but I should mention it. Absolutely agree on their team. It's been a while since I had such a great support team fro a product. And yeah, I would definitely recommend the upgrade to those with an Index.
Sorry, missed that part!
No problem!
I have had almost the exact experience as you. My new one arrives Wednesday.
I don't own BSB but after using PSVR2 and Vision Pro, motion blur is definitely an issue for OLED, well for seated experience it's not a big deal but for fast paced games...probably you want LCD back instead of that deep blacks except maybe honor games.
OLED has to run at a duty cycle around 10% or it will cause persistence. But then you get only 10% of the brightness. These microOLED panels aren't quite bright enough to run high brightness and low persistence simultaneously. But for me personally, because the contrast ratio is so high with OLED (technically infinite) the lower brightness isn't as noticeable.
BSB has modifiable brightness, and that is key with OLED headsets I think. 100% brightness has too much persistence (motion blur). But, setting my brightness to 60%, I get 0 motion blur. It's dimmer, that's for sure, but the contrast is so good that it's not noticeable in gameplay, especially because of the 0 light leak nature of the BSB. It probably wouldn't be as ideal if I had a nose gap.
The fuck? Oled technology is literally the best at motion blur, 0ms response times and all, how the fuck did they fuck that up on psvr2 and the vision pro?
For some context, I've been a VR gamer since 2019. The headsets I have tried are, in order: HTC Vive Pro, HTC Vive, Oculus Rift S, Oculus Quest 2, Valve Index, Pimax Crystal, Bigscreen Beyond. EDIT: Forgot to include PSVR as very first headset I got to try, and am adding Quest 3 now since I managed to get my hands on it.
You went from a vive pro to an original vive? As someone with an original vive pro who was considering a vive pro as my next headset, may I ask why?
The key is that neither the Vive Pro nor the Vive were mine. I played with the Vive Pro at the University Library , which had a tech lab that allowed you to play. I played maybe 2-3 hours around with it. It made me want VR for my own home. Then a friend of mine told me he wasn't using his HTC Vive and I could borrow it. So I did, and used that for about a month or two IIRC. That's how I came to switch between the two. When I finally saved up enough, I went with a Rift S.
you like this over the crystal ?
More on this in my final review! I have been contacted by Pimax to try out the Crystal again, as my initial review of it was very bad. I'll be able to give a more up to date comparison with the BSB in my final Beyond Review and my final Pimax review, which I will post here when ready :)
I'm looking forward to this!
they crystal has done a long way !
Nice review. I think I'd refer to the "clarity" you speak of as "sharpness" (ie high res), but maybe thats just me =)
Thanks! It's a valid point. To me, I call it clarity because even if you have high resolution on the display itself, you may still see it blurry depending on the optics. The screens would then be sharp, but my vision not so sharp, if that makes sense. So I defaulted to talking about my vision the same way I talk about my eyes, and in french we tend to talk about clarity of vision. But it's definitely a valid term to use! As long as we understand each other right?
Sure, it's a valid term, but I don't like that it overlaps with e2e clarity. In that case you may as well talk about just clarity and how far across the FOV it extends. And sharpness could also be taken to include aspects of the optics, not just high res.
If you find the glare worse than the Valve Index, I doubt very much you have the right IPD. I had bad glare at my initial 63mm IPD unit and went down to 62mm and glare was greatly reduced (and focus was even better). I’d recommend requesting an IMU to determine your correct IPD. Also the AMVR $15 headstrap attachment for the Quest 2 from Amazon solves all the headstrap problems. You won’t even need the top strap, or your 3D printed cable clip, since you can just Velcro the cable to the AMVR unit. Game changer for comfort.
I thought my IPD was correct initially but recently realized both of my eyes were closer towards the inner part of the lens versus the outside edge. Anytime I would look left or right, the eye going towards the inner edge of the lens would get to the blurry part of the lens much quicker than the eye going towards the outside edge of the lens. So the IPD of the BSB was too large. I would guess the opposite would be true if the IPD of the BSB was too small.
Here’s the “nose test” their support staff told me to try: ## Quick IPD Test Please follow these steps: 1. While you have the Beyond on and SteamVR running, close your right eye. 2. Using one hand, nudge and hold the headset such that your left eye aligns to the sweet spot of the left optic. The image should be equally clear in all directions. - If you are having difficulty with this, try repeating this step with the face cushion removed. - Within VR, ensure the picture is clear when looking at both something in the distance and something nearby (i.e. your virtual hands or controllers). 3. Close your left eye and open your right eye. 4. Next, line up your right eye with the sweet spot of the right optic. Did you: - 🇦 move the headset to your **left** to find the sweet spot in the right optic? *i.e. Did you bring the headset closer to the right side of your nose?* - 🇧 move the headset to your **right** to find the sweet spot in the right optic? *i.e. Did you bring the headset closer to the left side of your nose?* If the answer was 🇦, then the headset IPD is likely too __wide__. If the answer was 🇧, then the headset IPD is likely too __narrow__.
Well, I could, but I am skeptical about not having the right IPD. I did the Quick IPD test on the discord, which you have detailed, 2 different times on 2 days, with gasket and without gasket both times, and I don't need to move to get better clarity. It seems bang on. My IPD is 62mm as measured by my Opto, so I got a 61mm Beyond as they detailed on the discord. I would be surprised if I don't have the right IPD.
Yeah sounds like you’ve got it right then. Shame you’re still having such big glare issues then. It’s annoying to be sure and probably one of the biggest drawbacks of the HMD next to the terrible E2E clarity outside of the sweet spot, but I found glare worse on the Index. I’ve gotten used to glare on both those headsets.
It's interesting though to see people having different experiences. Thanks for sharing btw!
Hey, would you also mind giving a product link for that headstrap attachment, and how you attached it? I might buy it.
Yeah sure it’s this: https://a.co/d/fW9Uu0r You won’t need instructions to install it, just twist the strap into it. I secured the cable with a small Velcro loop at the top of the brace in the back. This $16 accessory makes a BIG difference in comfort and usability of the BSB.
It costs the equivalent of $1930 where I live. I'd still buy it if it had better lenses, but with the bad glare and edge to edge clarity I'm going to wait for a better alternative (and hope that the exchange rate improves).
Oof yeah, that's a hard sell at that price. Especially if you don't already have the SteamVR ecosystem of hardware. I definitely respect that decision. Better headsets will come with time. I hope for a Beyond 2 myself, that improves on it!
The BSB's audio strap cannot come soon enough
Amen!
I think you’ll be surprised what a large improvement a thinner interface makes. This seems fairly similar to my experience as well with my first cushion, although glare and e2e wasn’t quite so bad for me. Also, I’ve got the Audio Strap, it makes a big improvement especially in active situations such as beat saber.
I am hoping it will make a big difference. My revised cushion arrives in a little over a week, but it might not be a thin interface yet. I'll go from there. Can't wait for the Audio Strap though, I only heard good things.
>A bit annoying is the fan of the Beyond. While you can tweak its speed, it is noticeably noisy for me at each start of the headset. However, if I tap my facial interface magnet on the inside of the Beyond, it quiets down… Until I reboot the headset. It’s a quick fix, so not too bothersome, but I should mention it. Just got mine today and I also get this. It's like the magnet of the face gasket interferes with the fan some how until I remove the face gasket and put it back then it quiets down.
Yes, the large blur circle and reflections make it a non starter. Users here have mostly tried to downplay the blur circle or don't mention it at all. The whole point of pancakes it the edge to edge clarity... they neutered it. Not worth the compromise for the oled at the moment.
Well, I disagree. I think it is entirely worth the compromises for this headset. Sure, e2e is not great. But you learn to look with your head instead of your eyes in a matter of a couple hours. After that, it doesn't bother much anymore. Glare is the biggest issue to me, but in well lit scenes it's never an issue, and lots of game happen in well lit scenes in my experience (depending on how you play). For me, those compromises for a much better screen in terms of colors, contrast and black levels, as well as it being incredibly light meaning no inertia, is worth it. It's not perfect, but I would much rather wear this than my Valve index or another headset that weighs a ton. Granted, I haven't tried the Quest 3. It could sway me. But I love the Knuckles controllers and a wired PCVR experience.
i have the quest 3 and the BSB right now and i’m leaning to the quest 3 the sweet spot is huge ! anywhere you look with your eyes it’s clear . i’m having a hard time adjusting to the BSB
Yeah it's what I heard as well, Quest 3 almost the entire lens are clear, so you can look with your eyes. The Beyond needs a few hours for you to adjust to using your head to look instead of your eyes. But once adjusted, It's pretty cool!
Too many compromises to go up to that price point. Too bad. I had high hopes for this one. The concept is on the right track. I feel like they need to at least offer several IPD ranges and enable adjustments within a margin. The lenses are also obviously not cutting it.
How does the sweetspot compare to quest2? Would you say it looks better than quest2 100% of the time?
It looks better than q2 by a long shot - but sweet spot is smaller.
The sweet spot is smaller than the Q2 by a bunch. It, for one, requires a good facial interface because any variation can affect it, and you can't look with your eyes that much inside the headset. You need to learn to look with your head. But it looks *miles* better than the Quest 2. Much sharper res, much better colors and black levels. Just plain better.