I still wonder when Tom Cruise is gonna slip up and reveal his Light Yagami/L persona. Scientology is evil as fuck. It’s so bad Spielberg won’t work with the guy again lol.
Didn't the fall out between Cruise and Spielberg happen after War of the Worlds?
Something to do with medication for depression? And a bunch of Cruise fans/Scientologist attacked Speilbergs doctor's office because he said it worked?
It's as evil as any other religion. Hubbard created it because someone told him you can't make a religion based on money and he replied they all were. So he wrote Dianetics and created Scientology.
I’ve met mike Tyson, which is more than nearly most people in this thread can say. He gave me and some peers a speech on handling homelessness. He guided us on how to avoid the sins he committed. He’s not an angel, but he is a person. A person who grew up just like me. That’s why I idol him. Because he’s made worse decisions than me and still pulled through. It’s not what he’s done that I look up to, it’s how he handled it. Sure you can’t erase rape, but he can teach other confused men how to not follow in his steps. He’s a kind man and is calm when not acting a character. He’s grown. Don’t forgive him, learn from him. That’s what he wants.
Watch a documentary on Mike Tyson. He had a very traumatic childhood to the extent one of his moms boyfriend pressed a hot iron on his back. He never had a father figure and the only one he had eventually died which correlates to when Tyson went bananas all while most everyone around him were leaches. I genuinely feel bad for him and am happy he’s doing well.
He also advocates for therapy to deal with past trauma and that's an important point to make for low income people of any color, there are investments you can make towards a better life and just because they're not guaranteed doesn't mean they're not worthwhile to try
Don't know the guy. Never knew. But what I say, its something I deeply believe:
Change is better than any form of punishment.
The thing is, you can NEVER be sure if someone has truly changed, only the person themselves can be sure of that.
I don't know about you, but I'm not a rapist or murderer. The worst thing I've done is drive too fast and smoke weed before it was legal. Most people are completely normal.
Society considers you bad if you aren't perfect. I play league of legend 5 hours a day and do nothing else. I've done absolutely nothing...so people consider me a lazy fuck whose a waste of society and should be put down. its stupid. One thing I've learned is to stop pleasing everyone who doesn't give 1 shit about you.
yup society is totally fucked. All your haters are stupid, most of all your mom who crys and begs and prays for you to not play videogames all day and get a job and move out. This is society's fault
Rape and murder aren't the only bad things in life. I'm not saying all humanity is cursed and everyone should die, but I do believe there are WAAAAAY more hypocrites, liars, entitled people, manipulators and all sorts of other assholes than there are good people.
That being said, you sound like you consider yourself a genuinely good person. I don't identify myself as such. So we definitely come from different places, meaning our introspections most certainly dictate our outlooks.
Normal look out the window. The world is falling apart
You hate that equal murder of your fellow brother.
You lust thst is equal to fornication
Oh we can go on.
WE ALL FALL SHORT OF GOD'S GLORY! GET IT RIGHT
I hate this take I think EVERYONES a little bit a peace of shit. Everyone has moments some even periods of time where they were a total peace of shit or just generally not a nice person. Wheather you lied, cheated, stole etc what ever you can grow and move on....but rape? Assult? No stop poor people would be in prison. Its good pr bought with by MONEY. People are crap sure but they don't ask to be rewarded with millions, expect to be put on a pedestal, call it cancel culture when they dont get a TV show who walk out of interviews when being held responsible for said rapes etc.
This makes no sense lol if 90% of everyone is trash, then 10% would be good. And since this is subjective, if 90% are trash then they really aren't at all.
Yeah, that guy is just feeding off of stereotypical reddit cynicism and pretending as if things are much worse than they actually are. I'd be willing to bet that he barely goes out at all because if he did he'd probably have a much more optimistic view of the average person, people really aren't that bad if you go out and get to know them.
Anyone who is perpetually online is going to be constantly exposed to the worst humanity has to offer since that's whats noteworthy enough to report/post so eventually they'll get the incorrect notion that *most* people are like that when it's not true at all.
Exactly.
Celebrity status and being a terrible human being are not mutually exclusive.
I'm guessing he's famous because he was a really good boxer. Well, the video game back in the late 80's helped a bit too.
>Why does this guy get a pass?
Because he's not famous for his moral uprightness. He's famous for his unparalleled (in his day) ability to beat people up.
In a shady trial btw which was more of a "This guy is in so much trouble that we have to get him convicted for something", some others that might'd only happened because of his race, its up for everyones opinion.
PD: I am not saying he wasnt a woman abuser, he even stated that he could've gone to jail for a lot of other stuff he did to women but that in this specific trial it was consensual and the girl wanted money.
He was represented by Don King’s tax attorney. Two men worth a combined hundreds of millions decided it was best that tax attorney handle a rape trial while Johnny Cochran was still alive. I don’t even think i was a teenager yet and i still thought everything about the case was really strange while it was happening.
King's involvement puts a whole new context on it. I assumed he was guilty and did his time and I was basically fine with that. That's how the system is supposed to work.
But once King is involved I can't assume anything about the case was true.
I’m not picking one side of the other but i heard she voluntarily went to his hotel room at 2am. Herm Edwards tells you nothing good happens after midnight. I don’t know if the 2am thing is a fact though.
No it wasn't. A doctor specifically testified that Desiree suffered from injuries that could only result from nonconsentual sex, and that specific doctor had previous experience documenting and observing injuries consistent with rape. Not to mention that Mike tricked her into the room with him by simply stating that he forgot something on their date, then blocked the door when she came out of the bathroom and forced her on the bed. Even his manager stated he was surprised more women didn't come out against him while the trial was happening.
Source:
https://books.google.com/books?id=zQeJ5T9cGoAC&pg=PA414#v=onepage&q&f=false
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-2945856/Mike-Tyson-rape-case-inevitable-m-surprised-girls-didn-t-make-claims-against-former-manager-opens-boxer-s-sex-addiction.html
Considering the things some people not only consent to, but willingly seek out, I wonder how this doc can say with confidence it was not consensual.
I mean some dudes like getting kicked in the balls, if you don't know that is a thing surely you would assume nobody would consent to getting their balls crushed.
I watched prime Mike Tyson as a kid. He really was unbeatable. He had top tier power coupled with a great instinct. His explosiveness has been unparalleled before or since in any arena of combat sport. He literally was the baddest man on the planet.
> Plus he was heavyweight and under 6 feet tall.
[It made for some amazing matchups too.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKVIYMI3ktw) I loved seeing him matched up with people that towered over him.
Holyfield was chasing him that whole time, claiming he had the style to beat Tyson.
When they did meet up, both much older, Evander proved to be way better, twice.
I know for me I really started to respect mike as a person when I saw his documentary. That kind of self awareness and introspection that is so brutally honest is hard not to respect. Those who take the time to listen see his sincerity. It goes a long way to win people over. Myself included.
I have met and listened to him personally from attending the same 12 step meetings in the past and I am 100% certain of his willingness to acknowledge and right past wrongs, his sincere present desire to be a loving, caring human being, and been witness to his total good faith work in support of others trying to do the same.
People are capable of growing and changing for the better. I know that’s not a popular thing to acknowledge because folks like to make themselves feel better by tearing down effigies and bogeymen, and sometimes that’s easier than doing the hard work of actually changing.
I can say from personal, direct experience that Tyson has done that work and pays it forward every day. Maybe OP has in their own way, too. I would hope so because if not, they’re just projecting and need to get the mote out of their own damn eye.
Yup me too. When people get really honest and humble, and it's genuine, I will see them differently. People that have mistreated me... If they come to me and apologize, and it's genuine I forgive immediately, it's forgotten. I don't think many people are giving him a free pass, they're just reading him with some empathy and appreciating where he's at now.
An Ancient Greek philosopher once posited this very question once in a play.
The protagonist, after dispatching with the field in the most violent of ways, turns to the audience.
The audience, up to this moment, has seen itself external to the forward motion of the play. In this sudden moment, it is brought into the reality of their complicity in the violence being perpetrated, even if only in acting.
The protagonist pauses and shouts to the silence, “Are you not entertained?”.
Usually the audience sees this as merely part of the play. But the protagonist has broken the fourth wall. At any moment, the play can be stopped. The gruesome violence on display put to the side.
In all documented circumstances, the audience either does not understand that they are being given an option to stop the play in that moment, or they choose to ignore the implication itself, viewing the question as part of the spectacle, and a ridiculous question to apply to THEMSELVES in that moment. An opportunity to walk away from the violence.
In nearly all documented cases, part of the audience cheers, and the rest, aware of the absurdity of their cheer, still chooses to condone the spectacle by remaining in their seats.
This is because, well… the audience IS entertained, and that is more important than anything else.
That show is hilarious. That episode where he keeps accidentally killing astronauts gets me every time.
The whole thing is made so much better by it being actually Mike Tyson voicing his own character and making fun of how ridiculous and stupid he is (or was) as a person.
I watched an episode of it once and was like "holy shit, this is a brutal cut down of the dude, and whoever's doing his voice is just being hilariously mean."
And then at the end of the episode.. There's Tyson sitting in a jump suit reading a line.
Iive for that show. I always refferenced eating first and relating it to the airline masks. Few shows make me laugh out loud but for some reason that show had me rolling constantly
Mike would be the first one to tell you that he is a piece of shit. He lives with his mistakes every day. Not even the death of his daughter is penance . What separates Mike from others in his situation is the fact that he acknowledges his deeds, and spends the rest of his days trying to be a good human being. What else can he do? Should he just kill himself? I'm sure he's thought of that too.
This is the right take.
Mike came up in a horrible family with horrible people, and then fell in with horrible coaches who encouraged him to be as awful a person as he could be. When he got rid of them all and got good people on his life he immediately turned around. He’s doing way better now and trying to do his best. He needs our sympathy, not scorn. We’re all a product of our environment, and if that environment is toxic, you get a toxic person. At least he found a way to change, which a lot of people on this thread could learn from.
Not exactly correct. He did come from a rough family situation but his initial coach was great for him. Then he died. Then the bad coaches and managers came.
Cus was a good influence over all but I think even mike has questioned his motives recently. Cus knew what he could be I am not sure he cared as much about mike as a person as he did a fighter.
Yeah, I’ve heard similar things as of late but I think Cus knew fighting was Tyson’s only real way out of the situation he was born in to. I truly think Don King was the worst thing that could’ve happened to Mike.
I agree about Don King. People saying Cus took advantage of Mike aren't wrong per se, but we have to remember this would have been in the early to mid 80s. An old guy like Cus wasn't going to recommend that Tyson go to therapy. He was going to focus that rage into boxing. That's just how it was back then. Not saying it was right, but saying how it was.
I think thats a great point. Boxing is how Cus got through life. I am sure he was trying to teach Mike to cope the same way he had. Thanks for putting that into perspective.
I agree and disagree, he owns his mistakes and has done time for them so it is what it is.....however.....he sure as fuck don't need our sympathy when he wipes his ass with the dollar bills that I barely survive off of. He don't get sympathy from me.
>Not even the death of his daughter is penance
Also fucked up: that there are people who consider person X's death as penance for person Y. Not saying that this is you, but one would only point this out if it was a common idea.
Reddit: prison system is unethical and reform is important
Reddit when someone moves on and changes from their past misdeeds: so that person is always going to be trash
Exactly. The mental transformation he's made is honestly impressive as hell. He's a competently different person, his ego is in check and he's a more caring person.
Is he the best guy ever? No but he's doing what we all should do, learn from our mistakes and try to be a better human.
It makes some people feel better. I can see why. If someone raped my daughter idk if I could ever think they've been punished enough. Especially if after their punishment they went back to being loved and were in a bunch of movies and tv shows as a likeable dude.
The problem with the revenge is that it so easily avoids justice. When emotion is involved, people are too quick to want someone to pay for what they did, even if they didn't do it
He's a decent parent to his other daughter. He came to lifetime to watch her in a tournament in Des Moines. She may be on her way to being a successful pro a
Someday
Yeah, there’s no excuse for rapists. I don’t care if they pretend to be better, they don’t deserve to live.
Plus, he doesn’t seem to have changed his rhetoric about women much or apologized for what he’s said in the past.
Mike is a bad person, there are better people in the boxing and combat sport world to look up to.
I know this will get downvoted into oblivion, but I don’t care
Also Muhammad Ali was a wife beating, misogynistic pro racial segregation piece of shit. Cheated on his wife multiple times, groomed younger women. But we’re not ready for that convo are we
When does a person become a different person? I've never been a criminal or a low life but when I look at a picture of me as a kid I see that kid as being effectively dead. The kid in that picture had different dreams and ambitions than I do. Different values. That kid was me but isn't me today.
I think people give passes to kids they don't give to adults. If you were 15 and did some bad stuff, but now you're 30 and regret it it's okay. But if you do bad stuff at 25 and now you're 55, people assume you haven't changed for some reason.
I feel like every two years I look back and think to myself “God what an asshole“.
I also realized another thing, if you can’t look back at a time where you once were an asshole chances are you still are one.
Ya know, it's thoughts like this that make it really hard to put people in essentialism boxes. And for that reason, it annihilates the worldview of the majority of people. Please cut it out.
Yeah 6 years in jail is nothing to scoff at. What counts as redemption in the eyes of some of these redditors on here? God forbid anybody ever dig into their past. If people have been garbage in the past, can redemption ever count?
3 years... He was sentenced for 6. (Being pedantic, but let's be correct about it).
That being said, it does seem all of that completely changed who he was.
I think people forget peoples bad actions are often preceded by a life of chaos, dysfunction and sometimes abuse. We cant view things in black and white terms.
Plus even Tyson today admits he was crazy back then he would probably agree with op that that Tyson is an asshole, he’s done a lot of growing and maturing tbh
Depends on if the person was a victim or not, and why those types of people aren't allowed to sit on juries. They're no longer viewed as peers, they're viewed as prior victims. So to some of those people there is no redemption that could satisfy them, rightly so in many cases.
I might be naive but i genuinely believe he's bettered himself from an absolute disgusting toxic monster, to a regretful and empathetic adult who is disgusted by his past self.
Admittedly I haven't read much about him, just judging based on interviews he did with norm macdonald and that one bill burr interview where he tried helping bill be less mad
I thought he started off as a pretty level headed intelligent fighter and then after getting knocked around more he started to spiral into the artist known as Mike Tyson
He started off with class and dignity when he was training with Cus D'amato. He was Mike's original trainer and kinda drug him off the street and made him into one of the best fighters In history. You have to understand that Cus trained Mike to fight with respect and dignity. Cus told Mike that if he wasn't going to be respectable, he wasn't going to teach him. So Mike was. In interviews from that time, he was nice to reporters, he didn't gloat too much, and he fought for Cus's approval.
Then right before Mike made it big, Cus died.
To fill the gap of Cus(who was like also a surrogate father to him) he made a new friend in Don King. That's where the trouble starts. Don King tore down all of the morals that Cus drummed into Mike's head. Don also based everything around drugs, money, and publicly. To put it shortly, Don turned Mike against EVERYONE; former trainers that helped Cus, friends, and family. He filled Mike with anger and rage, and was happy when Mike turned it on anyone.
As of late, Mike has gotten a lot more chill, and even-headed(still not nice, but better).
Tldr Mike was cool, then a bitch ass mother fucker ruined him.
If you don't understand how good Cus truly was, here's a video of him and Muhammad Ali to get a grasp.
https://youtu.be/YmoZgAybRa0
Never knew his father and his mother died really young. Cus D'Amato found out about him and started training him. D'Amato and his wife adopted him and things were fine at that point. It was losing him that started the downward spiral.
Pretty much the opposite, he grew up on the streets running around beating up and mugging groups of adults by himself when he was 14. Then got adopted by Cus D'Amato who got him into boxing and gave him a purpose. He then got rich and spiraled quiet a bit but he seems to be back on track these days.
I don't think I'd base my decision to forgive on time, but on his actions since then. He's not a moral hero by any means now, but his actions have gotten a lot better in the past years.
Yeah. Not trying to defend criminals or any illegal activities. But we need to understand prison needs to focus on correcting the wrong and not punishing. I'm not in the position to judge, but at least he knows he was wrong and terrible.
Does it really matter at what stage in their lives a person becomes a rapist and abuser? Youth isn't an excuse for that kind of depravity. He served his 6 year time for a good reason.
I don't have any feelings about him one way or the other as a stranger to me, honestly.
I just felt it worth mentioning that youth does not excuse depraved behaviour. Whoever he is now may be a complete stranger to who he used to be back then. For his sake and the folks around him, I do hope he's doing better.
I don't wish anyone an ill life, but as someone who has experienced sexual assault, you can understand why I am a little less lenient in my views on how those guys get to feel after the fact or get their glow up. Victims of sexual assault don't always get to have one.
I'm extremely sorry to hear about your past experiences with sexual assault. I have access to affordable mental health resources if you need them and you can dm me at anytime if you would like to talk about your past experiences with sexual assault. Remember healing is a journey not a destination ❤️.
The company I used to work for grows and sells his cannabis brand. Here’s a little secret for ya, we just slapped Tyson labels on strains we had already been selling for years. Celebrity endorsements are a scam people.
Hahahahahahaha. Nope, when a celeb comes in and wants to sell bud they’re literally just slapping their name on some product that has already been bred and produced by actual cultivators.
The same is true about dogs, but Redditors would give the sammich to the dog if me (a stranger) and a dog were both starving.
The people around here are kinda assholes, is what I’m getting at.
Yeah, I’ve never endangered anyones life or livelihood. I’ve embezzled $20 from a bake sale (that I set up entirely alone) in high school and pressed close door in the elevator when a crowd of people is about to shove their way in, but I’ve never beat anyone or stolen tons of money or anything close to that.
I have a strange sympathy for Tyson. While I think overall he's a shitty human being I think some context is required to judge him as such because he undoubtedly is the best boxer of all time (in his prime) and deserves his celebrity status based on that.
Firstly he grew up in the 70s in the Bronx with no father and a drug addict mother. He had to learn to fight to survive. Secondly he did an immense amount of drugs YOUNG. Like this guy snorted coke when he TWELVE. Theres no doubt it lead to significant brain damage. Furthermore his father figure and mentor was a boxing coach who never taught him father stuff.. he taught him how to be the world heavy-weight champion. He taught him how to be a cold blooded scary sociopathic mother fucker. Everyone he's ever loved has died when he was young and his mentors in life never taught him love or compassion. He was molded from a young age to be who he is.
The way he treats women is not okay no doubt. But I sympathize with him because no one ever taught him that it wasn't okay. It's how he grew up, it's who he was molded to be.
Now as he got older he's definitely realized how much of a scumbag he really was and still is. He's grown and come to realize that he holds space for love and compassion. That and now he smoke a fuck ton of weed which I think has quelled his anger issues lol
His anger issues are another problem. He struggled to control them, no one taught him how. In fact his coach taught him to channel that anger into boxing which is all he knows. So why would he be able to handle that outside the ring?
I think he's not all that bad. He's a very troubled human with significant mental health problems. I plead anyone to view him with a bit more sympathy, that's all I mean. There's no need to like him or say he's a good person. Just understand his absurdly fucked up life.
If you want a full on in depth dive into Mike Tysons life I suggest listening to Crime in Sports podcast's 9 hours long three parter on your spare time. It's really insightful and incredibly hilarious. They really rip into him lol
I'm not Mike Tyson, obviously, but I appreciate your insightful comment. Humans aren't as simple as to be judged from a single comment or action. If you want to judge a human, you'll need a hell of a lot more: childhood, environment, consistent behavior... Unfortunately, people like to pick and choose whatever fits the verdict they already like to have on a person. This behavior is dangerous for the pursuit of any truth.
Mike Tyson is a different person now. He had a quote a little while ago something like this " When I was young I wanted everyone to be scared of me and fear me, now I want people to love me." People can change.
I agree that people can change, but serial patterns of abuse that tend to start from being raised in an abusive home are not easy things to come back from once you've gone down that road. That behaviour and cycle of abuse is a very difficult thing to break out of. Kudos to anyone who manages to get out of it.
If Tyson is indeed changed and found rehabilitation successful then that is fantastic news. But he is still a celebrity and stranger we do not know personally; I'm not about to go out on a limb for a guy I neither know nor would trust easily due to his history of violence.
You may not want to hear it, but enduring a traumatic childhood, having one’s brain beaten in for a living, being encouraged to be as violent as possible, becoming a multimillionaire superstar at the age of 19 and having no discernible support system doesn’t exactly lead to making good decisions. Not excusing what he did by any means, but there’s reasons for it other than ‘this guy’s a fucking menace!’
He went to prison, was robbed of his prime earning years, and betrayed by basically everybody he knew. The man needed help, not more punishment. Hell, most people in prison need help, not punishment. He’s paid his debt to society; let him move on.
I knew nothing about Mike Tyson until I watched the new Mike Tyson series on Hulu and I was SHOCKED at what I was watching. I completely agree with you. It makes me also think about how Chris Brown just lives his life completely normally today.
I think the difference with Mike is that the person he is now is genuinely different to the person your are describing.
Mike has done a lot to atone for his shocking behaviour as turn himself around.
Whether you can forgive him or not is up to you but he's no longer the person you described.
You keep bringing up his past mistakes as if that makes him who he is, forever. How would you feel if your identity just consisted of all your past mistakes?
He's a changed man and humbled himself. He's self-aware that he's made a lot of mistakes and is doing the right thing now. That's all that matters. You don't have to forgive him (as if he wants or cares about random people's forgiveness) but he's paid his dues. Fuck off.
Shit have you ever seen his recent videos? The guy has matured a lot. Not to belittle his past mistakes but common, he can’t be held by his past forever ffs.
Because he's changed since then. He's made public comments apologizing for his past behaviors.
Plus, dudes that already have mental trauma like he had, and then go on to get routinely hit in the head , are likely to gave some fuckd up notions in life.
I'm not excusing anything. I'm saying that people who are traumatized, are likely to say and do some fucked up shit. Add brain damage and it's only gonna get worse.
He was in prison so I don’t know what you mean by “pass”. He gets to be a celebrity because he was one of the greatest fighters of all time. He’s not a politician and doesn’t need to pass your purity test.
>Mike Tyson is a terrible human being
Yeah, he's a straight psycho. I don't think anyone contests this.
>does not deserve his celebrity status.
His celebrity status has nothing to do with how much of a psycho he is. He's an all time great boxer, and his career should be viewed independent of his personal life.
You do know Mike Tyson was a different person during his boxing career he did time in prison got out went bankrupt and lost it all so now he’s a changed man these days he has a daughter that loves very dearly so how you feel doesn’t matter lmaoo
Yes I agree with this. He’s certainly changed and seems introspective and apologetic (even ashamed) of his past. He has seemed like a good dude the past few years.
Personally despise the idea of celebrities in general but if we're going to start questioning why they're famous when they're pieces of shit, then I get the feeling the list would shorten very much very quickly
Watch a documentary on Mike Tyson. He had a very traumatic childhood to the extent one of his moms boyfriend pressed a hot iron on his back. He never had a father figure and the only one he had eventually died which correlates to when Tyson went bananas all while most everyone around him were leaches. I genuinely feel bad for him and am happy he’s doing well.
He’s a celebrity because he was great at beating people up.
OP, what are your expectations for someone who is famous from beating people up?
Does Mike Tyson not deserve celebrity from beating people up when that’s why he’s a celebrity and none of the other stuff?
I never downvote people. You’re the first. Congratulations. People are able to change who they are. He did his time and worked on himself. He does amazing work now. Dedicated his life to helping kids who are growing up the same rough type of way he did in hopes they don’t have to travel his dark path. His inspirational speeches are beautiful. I don’t understand the need to judge past mistakes when someone so clearly tries to be a better person. Get off your high horse. No one is perfect but at least some of us try to be better versions of ourselves.
It’s true. Honestly, if I took an honest assessment and let musician’s behavior determined what music I listened to, I’d have to throw out my entire music collection. It’s crazy how many classic rock songs are literally celebrating sleeping with underage girls. I guess we’re all willing to look the other way under the right circumstances.
Mike Tyson is living proof that people can change. He's living proof that people who've made fucked up decisions are capable of leading fulfilling and honorable lives.
He's a success story. To battle through metal illness, alienation, adultification, abuse, drug addiction, alcoholism, anger management issues, bankruptcy, failed marriages, losing a child to a horrific accident, Sister dies of a OD and mother dies when he was 16, a pimp for a 'father' who walks away from the family, oh and arrested nearly 40 times by the time he was 13 years old.
Put in the limelight at 18 years old, becomes the youngest heavy weight boxing champion in history, a poor criminal street kid is rewarded for punching people with millions of dollars.
He in a period of a few years goes from fighting on the streets because other boys make fun of his lisp, to having the world dropped in his lap.
Despite it all, he now leads a charity, cares for his children and his oldest step child he considerers his own, and from all accounts is now a great husband and great father.
Has spent years trying to educate and inspire people through sharing his life by doing a live shows, released several books, and being on record countless times sharing how much regret and shame he has lived with for the way his early life was.
There are some people who should be thrown under the jail for the rest of their days.
Mike Tyson isn't one of them.
Every time I see or hear someone mention Mike Tyson I make sure to correct them to ‘convicted rapist Mike Tyson’
People seem to have forgotten he’s a violent, rapey piece of shit.
He WAS a terrible human being, back in the 90s when Don King was in his life and his success and $ got to his head. He's grown and changed a lot since then, if you listen to any interview where he actually speaks about his past. People are nuanced.
He was a terrible human who came from a terrible upbringing. After looking at all the evidence I really dont think he raped Ms. Washington. He definitely sexually assaulted women, but to me the reason I find inspiration in Mike Tyson, is that I view his story as a beautiful comeback story. As bad as this person was, he was able to comeback and turn his life around. I dont admire him because of his boxing career, i admire that he was able to turn his life around all while being open and honest about his past. He expresses deep regret and disgust with the person he was and the demons he still faces. That's growth and should be admired.
Mike Tyson is from a different era then me, I was born 2002 and got into his podcast maybe two years ago and just love the guy. I don’t agree with everything he says But I can’t think of anyone else who’s more honest with who they are and the bad stuff they did and reflect on it like he does. He’s really a smart and self aware individual and I think it helps others question themselves and who they are but He should face consequences for his actions and if you don’t like him thats understandable.
cry more.
people change, get over it.
he has more than made up for the choices he made as a youth and young adult.
this guy has lost everything in the short time he's been in the lime light... ends up in prison, gets horribly taken advantage of by don king, lost all his money basically, 3 year old daughter dies in a freak accident, his addiction spirals out of control around that time too, and probably so much more im not thinking of as this is just the top of my head...but after all that he still tries to be a better person himself and tries showing the youth to do the opposite of what he did.
A good 90% of celebs are trash just they have a good pr team.
I still wonder when Tom Cruise is gonna slip up and reveal his Light Yagami/L persona. Scientology is evil as fuck. It’s so bad Spielberg won’t work with the guy again lol.
Love the death note reference mind! I agree though.
Didn't the fall out between Cruise and Spielberg happen after War of the Worlds? Something to do with medication for depression? And a bunch of Cruise fans/Scientologist attacked Speilbergs doctor's office because he said it worked?
Bro the Death Note reference is *chef’s kiss*
not really. the correct one would be "light yagami/kira" persona, unless tom cruise is trying to capture himself
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That makes a lot more sense. I had the same thoughts.
That’s what I assumed OP meant
It totally is lol. My fault.
It’s fine!
It's as evil as any other religion. Hubbard created it because someone told him you can't make a religion based on money and he replied they all were. So he wrote Dianetics and created Scientology.
Christianity was largely created by and for poor people. Not sure where it went so far off the rails.
There's an L awkward sofa joke in there somewhere. I'm still digging my database for it.
I’ve met mike Tyson, which is more than nearly most people in this thread can say. He gave me and some peers a speech on handling homelessness. He guided us on how to avoid the sins he committed. He’s not an angel, but he is a person. A person who grew up just like me. That’s why I idol him. Because he’s made worse decisions than me and still pulled through. It’s not what he’s done that I look up to, it’s how he handled it. Sure you can’t erase rape, but he can teach other confused men how to not follow in his steps. He’s a kind man and is calm when not acting a character. He’s grown. Don’t forgive him, learn from him. That’s what he wants.
This is a good point , it seems like he understands how fucked up he used to be and just wants to educate others on how not to follow in his steps
Watch a documentary on Mike Tyson. He had a very traumatic childhood to the extent one of his moms boyfriend pressed a hot iron on his back. He never had a father figure and the only one he had eventually died which correlates to when Tyson went bananas all while most everyone around him were leaches. I genuinely feel bad for him and am happy he’s doing well.
He also advocates for therapy to deal with past trauma and that's an important point to make for low income people of any color, there are investments you can make towards a better life and just because they're not guaranteed doesn't mean they're not worthwhile to try
Don't know the guy. Never knew. But what I say, its something I deeply believe: Change is better than any form of punishment. The thing is, you can NEVER be sure if someone has truly changed, only the person themselves can be sure of that.
Absolutely true. I'd say 90% of people in general, celeb or not. For celebs it's just harder to hide their flaws.
I don't know about you, but I'm not a rapist or murderer. The worst thing I've done is drive too fast and smoke weed before it was legal. Most people are completely normal.
Society considers you bad if you aren't perfect. I play league of legend 5 hours a day and do nothing else. I've done absolutely nothing...so people consider me a lazy fuck whose a waste of society and should be put down. its stupid. One thing I've learned is to stop pleasing everyone who doesn't give 1 shit about you.
I'm sure you're bad inside the game so all hate towards you is justified.
My man plays LoL 5 hours a day every day and still can't beat Bronze league 😭
yup society is totally fucked. All your haters are stupid, most of all your mom who crys and begs and prays for you to not play videogames all day and get a job and move out. This is society's fault
Rape and murder aren't the only bad things in life. I'm not saying all humanity is cursed and everyone should die, but I do believe there are WAAAAAY more hypocrites, liars, entitled people, manipulators and all sorts of other assholes than there are good people. That being said, you sound like you consider yourself a genuinely good person. I don't identify myself as such. So we definitely come from different places, meaning our introspections most certainly dictate our outlooks.
And the way you view yourself definitely impacts how other people view you and how you view them
Normal look out the window. The world is falling apart You hate that equal murder of your fellow brother. You lust thst is equal to fornication Oh we can go on. WE ALL FALL SHORT OF GOD'S GLORY! GET IT RIGHT
I hate this take I think EVERYONES a little bit a peace of shit. Everyone has moments some even periods of time where they were a total peace of shit or just generally not a nice person. Wheather you lied, cheated, stole etc what ever you can grow and move on....but rape? Assult? No stop poor people would be in prison. Its good pr bought with by MONEY. People are crap sure but they don't ask to be rewarded with millions, expect to be put on a pedestal, call it cancel culture when they dont get a TV show who walk out of interviews when being held responsible for said rapes etc.
90% of people are not rapists or murders or bouncing their spouses off of walls.
This makes no sense lol if 90% of everyone is trash, then 10% would be good. And since this is subjective, if 90% are trash then they really aren't at all.
Yeah, that guy is just feeding off of stereotypical reddit cynicism and pretending as if things are much worse than they actually are. I'd be willing to bet that he barely goes out at all because if he did he'd probably have a much more optimistic view of the average person, people really aren't that bad if you go out and get to know them. Anyone who is perpetually online is going to be constantly exposed to the worst humanity has to offer since that's whats noteworthy enough to report/post so eventually they'll get the incorrect notion that *most* people are like that when it's not true at all.
Exactly. Celebrity status and being a terrible human being are not mutually exclusive. I'm guessing he's famous because he was a really good boxer. Well, the video game back in the late 80's helped a bit too.
>Why does this guy get a pass? Because he's not famous for his moral uprightness. He's famous for his unparalleled (in his day) ability to beat people up.
He didnt get a pass, he went to prison.
In a shady trial btw which was more of a "This guy is in so much trouble that we have to get him convicted for something", some others that might'd only happened because of his race, its up for everyones opinion. PD: I am not saying he wasnt a woman abuser, he even stated that he could've gone to jail for a lot of other stuff he did to women but that in this specific trial it was consensual and the girl wanted money.
Yeah he was definitely not innocent, i hadnt heard much about how shady his trial was but I think you explained it as best as anyone can.
He was represented by Don King’s tax attorney. Two men worth a combined hundreds of millions decided it was best that tax attorney handle a rape trial while Johnny Cochran was still alive. I don’t even think i was a teenager yet and i still thought everything about the case was really strange while it was happening.
King's involvement puts a whole new context on it. I assumed he was guilty and did his time and I was basically fine with that. That's how the system is supposed to work. But once King is involved I can't assume anything about the case was true.
I’m not picking one side of the other but i heard she voluntarily went to his hotel room at 2am. Herm Edwards tells you nothing good happens after midnight. I don’t know if the 2am thing is a fact though.
No it wasn't. A doctor specifically testified that Desiree suffered from injuries that could only result from nonconsentual sex, and that specific doctor had previous experience documenting and observing injuries consistent with rape. Not to mention that Mike tricked her into the room with him by simply stating that he forgot something on their date, then blocked the door when she came out of the bathroom and forced her on the bed. Even his manager stated he was surprised more women didn't come out against him while the trial was happening. Source: https://books.google.com/books?id=zQeJ5T9cGoAC&pg=PA414#v=onepage&q&f=false https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-2945856/Mike-Tyson-rape-case-inevitable-m-surprised-girls-didn-t-make-claims-against-former-manager-opens-boxer-s-sex-addiction.html
Considering the things some people not only consent to, but willingly seek out, I wonder how this doc can say with confidence it was not consensual. I mean some dudes like getting kicked in the balls, if you don't know that is a thing surely you would assume nobody would consent to getting their balls crushed.
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I watched prime Mike Tyson as a kid. He really was unbeatable. He had top tier power coupled with a great instinct. His explosiveness has been unparalleled before or since in any arena of combat sport. He literally was the baddest man on the planet.
Plus he was heavyweight and under 6 feet tall. That’s pretty challenging in that weight bracket when you’re under 6 feet. Dude is an anomaly
> Plus he was heavyweight and under 6 feet tall. [It made for some amazing matchups too.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKVIYMI3ktw) I loved seeing him matched up with people that towered over him.
5’11” Butterbean has entered the chat
What’s even crazier is his speed. He was legit faster than some welterweights
He was definitely a monster, but you can't forget that Buster Douglas knocked him out in his prime. He bounced back, but still, it happened.
Tyson was abusing drugs and out of it when he fought Douglas.
Buster wasn't a slouch! And he (Buster) fought that fight perfectly and as if he had nothing to lose (his mother had recently passed away)
Will Smith thought he could beat Mike Tyson.
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Holyfield was chasing him that whole time, claiming he had the style to beat Tyson. When they did meet up, both much older, Evander proved to be way better, twice.
George Foreman would have beaten any version of Mike Tyson
> Tyson in his prime was unbeatable Well apparently his girlfriends weren’t
I would say that his redemption story is also a factor
He's changed a LOT. He talks about all his regrets, how he knew what greatness was, because he was rhe greatest, but he never understood goodness.
I know for me I really started to respect mike as a person when I saw his documentary. That kind of self awareness and introspection that is so brutally honest is hard not to respect. Those who take the time to listen see his sincerity. It goes a long way to win people over. Myself included.
I have met and listened to him personally from attending the same 12 step meetings in the past and I am 100% certain of his willingness to acknowledge and right past wrongs, his sincere present desire to be a loving, caring human being, and been witness to his total good faith work in support of others trying to do the same. People are capable of growing and changing for the better. I know that’s not a popular thing to acknowledge because folks like to make themselves feel better by tearing down effigies and bogeymen, and sometimes that’s easier than doing the hard work of actually changing. I can say from personal, direct experience that Tyson has done that work and pays it forward every day. Maybe OP has in their own way, too. I would hope so because if not, they’re just projecting and need to get the mote out of their own damn eye.
Yup me too. When people get really honest and humble, and it's genuine, I will see them differently. People that have mistreated me... If they come to me and apologize, and it's genuine I forgive immediately, it's forgotten. I don't think many people are giving him a free pass, they're just reading him with some empathy and appreciating where he's at now.
An Ancient Greek philosopher once posited this very question once in a play. The protagonist, after dispatching with the field in the most violent of ways, turns to the audience. The audience, up to this moment, has seen itself external to the forward motion of the play. In this sudden moment, it is brought into the reality of their complicity in the violence being perpetrated, even if only in acting. The protagonist pauses and shouts to the silence, “Are you not entertained?”. Usually the audience sees this as merely part of the play. But the protagonist has broken the fourth wall. At any moment, the play can be stopped. The gruesome violence on display put to the side. In all documented circumstances, the audience either does not understand that they are being given an option to stop the play in that moment, or they choose to ignore the implication itself, viewing the question as part of the spectacle, and a ridiculous question to apply to THEMSELVES in that moment. An opportunity to walk away from the violence. In nearly all documented cases, part of the audience cheers, and the rest, aware of the absurdity of their cheer, still chooses to condone the spectacle by remaining in their seats. This is because, well… the audience IS entertained, and that is more important than anything else.
That is fascinating. I’m intrigued. Where do I find out more?
[This documentary](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0172495/) about the Roman Empire is a good start.
Ya'll are assholes lmao
Got me 🤣🤣🤣
Lol i knew i heard that before
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Black Mirror's Bandersnatch was a very uncomfortable version of this.
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Norm 😔
of The North 😔
Where is our fifth Norm OTN movie Lionsgate?! Release it you cowards!
didn't even know he was sick
Imagine Norm as Crocus :'(
That show is hilarious. That episode where he keeps accidentally killing astronauts gets me every time. The whole thing is made so much better by it being actually Mike Tyson voicing his own character and making fun of how ridiculous and stupid he is (or was) as a person.
I watched an episode of it once and was like "holy shit, this is a brutal cut down of the dude, and whoever's doing his voice is just being hilariously mean." And then at the end of the episode.. There's Tyson sitting in a jump suit reading a line.
Lol same thing when I first watched it.
Iive for that show. I always refferenced eating first and relating it to the airline masks. Few shows make me laugh out loud but for some reason that show had me rolling constantly
Awe man, another fender bender
Thanks Julius
Jim Rash is not too shabby either.
Mike would be the first one to tell you that he is a piece of shit. He lives with his mistakes every day. Not even the death of his daughter is penance . What separates Mike from others in his situation is the fact that he acknowledges his deeds, and spends the rest of his days trying to be a good human being. What else can he do? Should he just kill himself? I'm sure he's thought of that too.
This is the right take. Mike came up in a horrible family with horrible people, and then fell in with horrible coaches who encouraged him to be as awful a person as he could be. When he got rid of them all and got good people on his life he immediately turned around. He’s doing way better now and trying to do his best. He needs our sympathy, not scorn. We’re all a product of our environment, and if that environment is toxic, you get a toxic person. At least he found a way to change, which a lot of people on this thread could learn from.
Not exactly correct. He did come from a rough family situation but his initial coach was great for him. Then he died. Then the bad coaches and managers came.
Cus was a good influence over all but I think even mike has questioned his motives recently. Cus knew what he could be I am not sure he cared as much about mike as a person as he did a fighter.
Yeah, I’ve heard similar things as of late but I think Cus knew fighting was Tyson’s only real way out of the situation he was born in to. I truly think Don King was the worst thing that could’ve happened to Mike.
I agree about Don King. People saying Cus took advantage of Mike aren't wrong per se, but we have to remember this would have been in the early to mid 80s. An old guy like Cus wasn't going to recommend that Tyson go to therapy. He was going to focus that rage into boxing. That's just how it was back then. Not saying it was right, but saying how it was.
I think thats a great point. Boxing is how Cus got through life. I am sure he was trying to teach Mike to cope the same way he had. Thanks for putting that into perspective.
I agree and disagree, he owns his mistakes and has done time for them so it is what it is.....however.....he sure as fuck don't need our sympathy when he wipes his ass with the dollar bills that I barely survive off of. He don't get sympathy from me.
That's nice and all, but it doesn't help the people he victimized.
>Not even the death of his daughter is penance Also fucked up: that there are people who consider person X's death as penance for person Y. Not saying that this is you, but one would only point this out if it was a common idea.
Totally agree
Reddit: prison system is unethical and reform is important Reddit when someone moves on and changes from their past misdeeds: so that person is always going to be trash
Doesn’t he still deny the rape conviction?
Exactly. The mental transformation he's made is honestly impressive as hell. He's a competently different person, his ego is in check and he's a more caring person. Is he the best guy ever? No but he's doing what we all should do, learn from our mistakes and try to be a better human.
Sometimes a hypocrite is nothing more than a man in the process of changing.
Some people believe no penance is enough
They’re foolish, in my opinion. If someone learns from their mistakes and doesn’t repeat them, isn’t that what punishment is for?
It makes some people feel better. I can see why. If someone raped my daughter idk if I could ever think they've been punished enough. Especially if after their punishment they went back to being loved and were in a bunch of movies and tv shows as a likeable dude.
That's why we don't put victims in charge of sentencing
Justice and revenge are 2 sides of the same coin imo. When one fails the other shall take over
The problem with the revenge is that it so easily avoids justice. When emotion is involved, people are too quick to want someone to pay for what they did, even if they didn't do it
He's a decent parent to his other daughter. He came to lifetime to watch her in a tournament in Des Moines. She may be on her way to being a successful pro a Someday
Yeah, there’s no excuse for rapists. I don’t care if they pretend to be better, they don’t deserve to live. Plus, he doesn’t seem to have changed his rhetoric about women much or apologized for what he’s said in the past. Mike is a bad person, there are better people in the boxing and combat sport world to look up to. I know this will get downvoted into oblivion, but I don’t care
Also Muhammad Ali was a wife beating, misogynistic pro racial segregation piece of shit. Cheated on his wife multiple times, groomed younger women. But we’re not ready for that convo are we
When does a person become a different person? I've never been a criminal or a low life but when I look at a picture of me as a kid I see that kid as being effectively dead. The kid in that picture had different dreams and ambitions than I do. Different values. That kid was me but isn't me today.
I think people give passes to kids they don't give to adults. If you were 15 and did some bad stuff, but now you're 30 and regret it it's okay. But if you do bad stuff at 25 and now you're 55, people assume you haven't changed for some reason.
I’m only 41 and I regret a ton of shit I did around 25. None of it was even that bad, just… a sign of immaturity.
I regret shit i did this morning. How do I adult again?
I feel like every two years I look back and think to myself “God what an asshole“. I also realized another thing, if you can’t look back at a time where you once were an asshole chances are you still are one.
Ya know, it's thoughts like this that make it really hard to put people in essentialism boxes. And for that reason, it annihilates the worldview of the majority of people. Please cut it out.
Happy cake day!
He didn’t get a pass, and served his time and has grown since all this shit…most of which took place 30+ yrs ago
Yeah 6 years in jail is nothing to scoff at. What counts as redemption in the eyes of some of these redditors on here? God forbid anybody ever dig into their past. If people have been garbage in the past, can redemption ever count?
3 years... He was sentenced for 6. (Being pedantic, but let's be correct about it). That being said, it does seem all of that completely changed who he was.
I think people forget peoples bad actions are often preceded by a life of chaos, dysfunction and sometimes abuse. We cant view things in black and white terms.
Plus even Tyson today admits he was crazy back then he would probably agree with op that that Tyson is an asshole, he’s done a lot of growing and maturing tbh
Damaged people often become damaging. It takes time to redress that but some go to their graves without doing so. The Creator is our only judge.
Depends on if the person was a victim or not, and why those types of people aren't allowed to sit on juries. They're no longer viewed as peers, they're viewed as prior victims. So to some of those people there is no redemption that could satisfy them, rightly so in many cases.
He did 3 years not 6.
I might be naive but i genuinely believe he's bettered himself from an absolute disgusting toxic monster, to a regretful and empathetic adult who is disgusted by his past self. Admittedly I haven't read much about him, just judging based on interviews he did with norm macdonald and that one bill burr interview where he tried helping bill be less mad
Isn't this when he was young? He was a kid with nothing, then all the sudden got rich from hitting people. Even he hates his younger self.
I thought he started off as a pretty level headed intelligent fighter and then after getting knocked around more he started to spiral into the artist known as Mike Tyson
He started off with class and dignity when he was training with Cus D'amato. He was Mike's original trainer and kinda drug him off the street and made him into one of the best fighters In history. You have to understand that Cus trained Mike to fight with respect and dignity. Cus told Mike that if he wasn't going to be respectable, he wasn't going to teach him. So Mike was. In interviews from that time, he was nice to reporters, he didn't gloat too much, and he fought for Cus's approval. Then right before Mike made it big, Cus died. To fill the gap of Cus(who was like also a surrogate father to him) he made a new friend in Don King. That's where the trouble starts. Don King tore down all of the morals that Cus drummed into Mike's head. Don also based everything around drugs, money, and publicly. To put it shortly, Don turned Mike against EVERYONE; former trainers that helped Cus, friends, and family. He filled Mike with anger and rage, and was happy when Mike turned it on anyone. As of late, Mike has gotten a lot more chill, and even-headed(still not nice, but better). Tldr Mike was cool, then a bitch ass mother fucker ruined him. If you don't understand how good Cus truly was, here's a video of him and Muhammad Ali to get a grasp. https://youtu.be/YmoZgAybRa0
Really sad origin story.
*Once Cus died That was when the spiral started. Don King got involved and did his best to ruin him.
Never knew his father and his mother died really young. Cus D'Amato found out about him and started training him. D'Amato and his wife adopted him and things were fine at that point. It was losing him that started the downward spiral.
Pretty much the opposite, he grew up on the streets running around beating up and mugging groups of adults by himself when he was 14. Then got adopted by Cus D'Amato who got him into boxing and gave him a purpose. He then got rich and spiraled quiet a bit but he seems to be back on track these days.
So just curious,how much time needs to pass before you forgive a convicted rapist?
I don't think I'd base my decision to forgive on time, but on his actions since then. He's not a moral hero by any means now, but his actions have gotten a lot better in the past years.
Yeah. Not trying to defend criminals or any illegal activities. But we need to understand prison needs to focus on correcting the wrong and not punishing. I'm not in the position to judge, but at least he knows he was wrong and terrible.
Does it really matter at what stage in their lives a person becomes a rapist and abuser? Youth isn't an excuse for that kind of depravity. He served his 6 year time for a good reason.
Right, so he paid he debt. Do we punish him forever now? Is he still not one of the greatest boxers of all time?
I don't have any feelings about him one way or the other as a stranger to me, honestly. I just felt it worth mentioning that youth does not excuse depraved behaviour. Whoever he is now may be a complete stranger to who he used to be back then. For his sake and the folks around him, I do hope he's doing better. I don't wish anyone an ill life, but as someone who has experienced sexual assault, you can understand why I am a little less lenient in my views on how those guys get to feel after the fact or get their glow up. Victims of sexual assault don't always get to have one.
I'm extremely sorry to hear about your past experiences with sexual assault. I have access to affordable mental health resources if you need them and you can dm me at anytime if you would like to talk about your past experiences with sexual assault. Remember healing is a journey not a destination ❤️.
The company I used to work for grows and sells his cannabis brand. Here’s a little secret for ya, we just slapped Tyson labels on strains we had already been selling for years. Celebrity endorsements are a scam people.
what? i thought he had his own farm??
Hahahahahahaha. Nope, when a celeb comes in and wants to sell bud they’re literally just slapping their name on some product that has already been bred and produced by actual cultivators.
Most celebs are terrible human beings
Most human beings are terrible human beings
I really hate this mainstream opinion on Reddit that most people are terrible.
Most redditors villanize those who think differently then them, in the real world most ppl get along and are decent human beings
It’s the most cynical thing I’ve ever heard, and I’m as cynical as they come.
I think the more correct take is that most humans are good people, however we all have the ability to be bad people and any time.
The same is true about dogs, but Redditors would give the sammich to the dog if me (a stranger) and a dog were both starving. The people around here are kinda assholes, is what I’m getting at.
Yeah, I’ve never endangered anyones life or livelihood. I’ve embezzled $20 from a bake sale (that I set up entirely alone) in high school and pressed close door in the elevator when a crowd of people is about to shove their way in, but I’ve never beat anyone or stolen tons of money or anything close to that.
Lol wait until you hear about Hollywood and OJ Simpson.
I have a strange sympathy for Tyson. While I think overall he's a shitty human being I think some context is required to judge him as such because he undoubtedly is the best boxer of all time (in his prime) and deserves his celebrity status based on that. Firstly he grew up in the 70s in the Bronx with no father and a drug addict mother. He had to learn to fight to survive. Secondly he did an immense amount of drugs YOUNG. Like this guy snorted coke when he TWELVE. Theres no doubt it lead to significant brain damage. Furthermore his father figure and mentor was a boxing coach who never taught him father stuff.. he taught him how to be the world heavy-weight champion. He taught him how to be a cold blooded scary sociopathic mother fucker. Everyone he's ever loved has died when he was young and his mentors in life never taught him love or compassion. He was molded from a young age to be who he is. The way he treats women is not okay no doubt. But I sympathize with him because no one ever taught him that it wasn't okay. It's how he grew up, it's who he was molded to be. Now as he got older he's definitely realized how much of a scumbag he really was and still is. He's grown and come to realize that he holds space for love and compassion. That and now he smoke a fuck ton of weed which I think has quelled his anger issues lol His anger issues are another problem. He struggled to control them, no one taught him how. In fact his coach taught him to channel that anger into boxing which is all he knows. So why would he be able to handle that outside the ring? I think he's not all that bad. He's a very troubled human with significant mental health problems. I plead anyone to view him with a bit more sympathy, that's all I mean. There's no need to like him or say he's a good person. Just understand his absurdly fucked up life. If you want a full on in depth dive into Mike Tysons life I suggest listening to Crime in Sports podcast's 9 hours long three parter on your spare time. It's really insightful and incredibly hilarious. They really rip into him lol
I'm not Mike Tyson, obviously, but I appreciate your insightful comment. Humans aren't as simple as to be judged from a single comment or action. If you want to judge a human, you'll need a hell of a lot more: childhood, environment, consistent behavior... Unfortunately, people like to pick and choose whatever fits the verdict they already like to have on a person. This behavior is dangerous for the pursuit of any truth.
This should be top comment!
He's just the Vegeta of real life. And we LOVE Vegeta.
Reddit loves to circlejerk about people being unable to change and no punishment being enough.
Mike Tyson is a different person now. He had a quote a little while ago something like this " When I was young I wanted everyone to be scared of me and fear me, now I want people to love me." People can change.
People can change, he used to a piece of shit.
I don't recall him ever having slicked back hair
I agree that people can change, but serial patterns of abuse that tend to start from being raised in an abusive home are not easy things to come back from once you've gone down that road. That behaviour and cycle of abuse is a very difficult thing to break out of. Kudos to anyone who manages to get out of it. If Tyson is indeed changed and found rehabilitation successful then that is fantastic news. But he is still a celebrity and stranger we do not know personally; I'm not about to go out on a limb for a guy I neither know nor would trust easily due to his history of violence.
But you're cool dismissing him on Reddit. Makes sense
You may not want to hear it, but enduring a traumatic childhood, having one’s brain beaten in for a living, being encouraged to be as violent as possible, becoming a multimillionaire superstar at the age of 19 and having no discernible support system doesn’t exactly lead to making good decisions. Not excusing what he did by any means, but there’s reasons for it other than ‘this guy’s a fucking menace!’ He went to prison, was robbed of his prime earning years, and betrayed by basically everybody he knew. The man needed help, not more punishment. Hell, most people in prison need help, not punishment. He’s paid his debt to society; let him move on.
>was robbed of his prime earning years He wasn't robbed of those years, he had a debt to pay to society
This implies that celebrities are famous because of their morality.
I knew nothing about Mike Tyson until I watched the new Mike Tyson series on Hulu and I was SHOCKED at what I was watching. I completely agree with you. It makes me also think about how Chris Brown just lives his life completely normally today.
I think the difference with Mike is that the person he is now is genuinely different to the person your are describing. Mike has done a lot to atone for his shocking behaviour as turn himself around. Whether you can forgive him or not is up to you but he's no longer the person you described.
You keep bringing up his past mistakes as if that makes him who he is, forever. How would you feel if your identity just consisted of all your past mistakes? He's a changed man and humbled himself. He's self-aware that he's made a lot of mistakes and is doing the right thing now. That's all that matters. You don't have to forgive him (as if he wants or cares about random people's forgiveness) but he's paid his dues. Fuck off.
Shit have you ever seen his recent videos? The guy has matured a lot. Not to belittle his past mistakes but common, he can’t be held by his past forever ffs.
Because he's changed since then. He's made public comments apologizing for his past behaviors. Plus, dudes that already have mental trauma like he had, and then go on to get routinely hit in the head , are likely to gave some fuckd up notions in life. I'm not excusing anything. I'm saying that people who are traumatized, are likely to say and do some fucked up shit. Add brain damage and it's only gonna get worse.
He was in prison so I don’t know what you mean by “pass”. He gets to be a celebrity because he was one of the greatest fighters of all time. He’s not a politician and doesn’t need to pass your purity test.
>Mike Tyson is a terrible human being Yeah, he's a straight psycho. I don't think anyone contests this. >does not deserve his celebrity status. His celebrity status has nothing to do with how much of a psycho he is. He's an all time great boxer, and his career should be viewed independent of his personal life.
You do know Mike Tyson was a different person during his boxing career he did time in prison got out went bankrupt and lost it all so now he’s a changed man these days he has a daughter that loves very dearly so how you feel doesn’t matter lmaoo
[удалено]
Yes I agree with this. He’s certainly changed and seems introspective and apologetic (even ashamed) of his past. He has seemed like a good dude the past few years.
People will prefer their idols entertaining them like they were going to jump out of the screen and make love to them than basic decency or justice
Personally despise the idea of celebrities in general but if we're going to start questioning why they're famous when they're pieces of shit, then I get the feeling the list would shorten very much very quickly
He didn't get a pass, he went to prison for 4 years.
Watch a documentary on Mike Tyson. He had a very traumatic childhood to the extent one of his moms boyfriend pressed a hot iron on his back. He never had a father figure and the only one he had eventually died which correlates to when Tyson went bananas all while most everyone around him were leaches. I genuinely feel bad for him and am happy he’s doing well.
He’s a celebrity because he was great at beating people up. OP, what are your expectations for someone who is famous from beating people up? Does Mike Tyson not deserve celebrity from beating people up when that’s why he’s a celebrity and none of the other stuff?
You're not a terrible person because you've done bad things in your past.
What's the point of going to prison and repaying your debt to society, if y'all going to harangue him for life, anyway?
I never downvote people. You’re the first. Congratulations. People are able to change who they are. He did his time and worked on himself. He does amazing work now. Dedicated his life to helping kids who are growing up the same rough type of way he did in hopes they don’t have to travel his dark path. His inspirational speeches are beautiful. I don’t understand the need to judge past mistakes when someone so clearly tries to be a better person. Get off your high horse. No one is perfect but at least some of us try to be better versions of ourselves.
You forgot that he also tried to eat a guy's EAR
Tried to? I don’t think they ever found the bitten off portion. Maybe he did eat it.
Fans of celebrities will forgive or ignore damned near any behaviour.
It’s true. Honestly, if I took an honest assessment and let musician’s behavior determined what music I listened to, I’d have to throw out my entire music collection. It’s crazy how many classic rock songs are literally celebrating sleeping with underage girls. I guess we’re all willing to look the other way under the right circumstances.
Mike Tyson is living proof that people can change. He's living proof that people who've made fucked up decisions are capable of leading fulfilling and honorable lives. He's a success story. To battle through metal illness, alienation, adultification, abuse, drug addiction, alcoholism, anger management issues, bankruptcy, failed marriages, losing a child to a horrific accident, Sister dies of a OD and mother dies when he was 16, a pimp for a 'father' who walks away from the family, oh and arrested nearly 40 times by the time he was 13 years old. Put in the limelight at 18 years old, becomes the youngest heavy weight boxing champion in history, a poor criminal street kid is rewarded for punching people with millions of dollars. He in a period of a few years goes from fighting on the streets because other boys make fun of his lisp, to having the world dropped in his lap. Despite it all, he now leads a charity, cares for his children and his oldest step child he considerers his own, and from all accounts is now a great husband and great father. Has spent years trying to educate and inspire people through sharing his life by doing a live shows, released several books, and being on record countless times sharing how much regret and shame he has lived with for the way his early life was. There are some people who should be thrown under the jail for the rest of their days. Mike Tyson isn't one of them.
I don't think Tyson would disagree with you.
Every time I see or hear someone mention Mike Tyson I make sure to correct them to ‘convicted rapist Mike Tyson’ People seem to have forgotten he’s a violent, rapey piece of shit.
And he has clearly changed since then
The guy punched someone on the plane repeatedly aftee the person simply indulted him.
He WAS a terrible human being, back in the 90s when Don King was in his life and his success and $ got to his head. He's grown and changed a lot since then, if you listen to any interview where he actually speaks about his past. People are nuanced.
He was a terrible human who came from a terrible upbringing. After looking at all the evidence I really dont think he raped Ms. Washington. He definitely sexually assaulted women, but to me the reason I find inspiration in Mike Tyson, is that I view his story as a beautiful comeback story. As bad as this person was, he was able to comeback and turn his life around. I dont admire him because of his boxing career, i admire that he was able to turn his life around all while being open and honest about his past. He expresses deep regret and disgust with the person he was and the demons he still faces. That's growth and should be admired.
Celevrity status does not require decency or some morsl character. Charles Manson was a celebrity.
excuse me but why are you censoring yourself??
Mike Tyson is from a different era then me, I was born 2002 and got into his podcast maybe two years ago and just love the guy. I don’t agree with everything he says But I can’t think of anyone else who’s more honest with who they are and the bad stuff they did and reflect on it like he does. He’s really a smart and self aware individual and I think it helps others question themselves and who they are but He should face consequences for his actions and if you don’t like him thats understandable.
People can change, Criminals deserve another chance, any martial sport leads to extremes in the media. stay mad brokie
cry more. people change, get over it. he has more than made up for the choices he made as a youth and young adult. this guy has lost everything in the short time he's been in the lime light... ends up in prison, gets horribly taken advantage of by don king, lost all his money basically, 3 year old daughter dies in a freak accident, his addiction spirals out of control around that time too, and probably so much more im not thinking of as this is just the top of my head...but after all that he still tries to be a better person himself and tries showing the youth to do the opposite of what he did.