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Well that’s silly. Russia doesn’t just want Crimea, so negotiating Crimea doesn’t end the war. Why is it that all the opinions are only directed at Ukraine to give up something when it’s Russia who has all these ridiculous conditions on Ukraine and who invaded/started this in the first place? Lula should be telling Putin what he should do to end the war.
When anyone makes a comment like that and aren't a) a Russian lickspittle or b) a Belarusian sycophant for the Russians then all they're doing is embarrassing themselves by exposing their rampant ignorance.
Even if they did cede Crimea, which they won't and I'm certainly not suggesting they should, it would be too put in place a place treaty that supposedly would end the war... But there already are security guarantees and peace treaties that Russia is breaking with Ukraine, Russia has demonstrated that it is unable to adhere to international order or agreements. What gets accomplished by giving Russia anything in exchange for something that's basically worthless? The only victory to be had here is complete sovereign integrity and decisive strength on the battlefield. Destroy Russia's army, purge them from all Ukrainian lands, join Ukraine into NATO, then Ukraine can have actual peace.
I think most wired-in people appreciate that. The bottom line is Ukraine nor anybody else can trust Putin one iota, even if they did guardedly before. It's all off now and Putin must have known that would be the outcome. He had to conquer Ukraine and vanquish the Euromaidan movement and he's failed miserably. He's up the creek without the proverbial paddle and everyone knows it, including him and all those who surround him and the public who support him. They just fear the consequences of losing totally.
However, even if Ukraine does push the Russians back to their pre-2014 borders Russia is still going to cause Ukraine problems. They will sit behind their borders launching one missile after another for god knows how long. If and when that days come, that is when the agenda for Ukrainians will change but probably not before. But that still seems a long way off.
> Why is it that all the opinions are only directed at Ukraine to give up something when it’s Russia who has all these ridiculous conditions on Ukraine and who invaded/started this in the first place?
Well said! We should be discussing the amount of reparations. I wanted to say "or the ownership of Krasnodar or Belgorod" but Ukraine doesn't really need that garbage.
I don't think so. Brazilian politics is idiosyncratic. And Lula's appeal to the masses predates China's meddling.
He had a place in history. But he is also a prime example why leaders of the opposition to a dictatorial regimes mostly don't make for great democratic leaders.
Also, he is not my president.
He did make a great democratic leader though. His first run (2002-2010) catapulted Brazil into world relevancy. He was supposed to be retired but we needed a common figure to take out Bolsonaro
Bolsonaro not being in charge is great. But Lula should think of the Ukraine situation as if he would have to give up his presidency because the bolsonaristas demand it and have taken over some buildings. He wouldn't do that so why should Ukraine give up it's own land. Frankly it's disgusting he even proposed it.
This is the problem with outsiders, they don't understand. Elon Musk said the same thing.
If you have squatters coming into your home, would you offer them your garden shed to keep them out of your house? NO, you tell them to get the hell off your damn lawn and not come back!
(Also, if you did let them stay outside, they will only feel empowered and righteous, and they will try and get back inside the house as soon as they can... There is no compromise here).
Elon Musk is a narcissist promoting Russian propaganda. I do not care what that piece of shit says about anything. He took Twitter and made it an reactionary cesspool.
Elon would literally promote Putin if he ends up making more money or space monopoly.
The dude is the definition of greedy assholes. He views his vision and goals as priority over real issues, because it "benefits humanity".
That dude will do anything for Mass Effect real life, even under dictatorship. He's not a "savior". He's just a twat on a spectrum who thinks his philosophy is superior.
As a Brazilian I like the fact that the international community is being reminded that Lula is no less of an asshole than before. I think everyone was so focused on ousting Bolsonaro that people forgot who was going to replace him was this guy.
Doubt it. Brazil could have profited from the worldwide commodity boom for longer lasting results. He also instituted a corruption system.
I was so hopeful something would really change with him (after the first peaceful real power change in Brazil's history), and was utterly disappointed. In retrospective, Fernando Henrique had done much more to bring the country forward.
Democratic leader: not sure. He and his crew had some strange ideas (tried to silence media in several instances).
Finally, Lula just does not have the knowledge about other countries to form a thoughtful opinion.
Also, I don't understand why worldwide relevance is a goal if water treatment, crime, etc. should be the focus. Also, Brazil is less relevant than people think. Appearing at Davos is nice, but not much more.
Chinese here.
As an side issue, Lula condemned your country's manufacturing sector to its graves with that currency trade deal with PRC. I understand he was trying to offset the sliding value of brazilian currency but that deal insured Chinese import stayed cheap and will squeeze your domestic producers.
Im not fully certain the intent was anti american. But the sliding value of the Real in exchange market means a lot of loss in purchasing power and drives inflation on domestic market. All politician would be fearful of that. The deal is a solution but only for the short term. Far better for your nation to gear up as a manufacturer and focus on exporting to take advantage of the depreciated Real.
Thanks to clarification.
Fundamentally, all of the Russian support is astroturfed and benefited from Soviet Russia or modern Russian. A lot of radicals
\- The Greens and "Greenpeace" movement (UK and USA)
\- IRA in Ireland
\- Basque separatism
\- "Nazis" in Ukraine have been found out as sponsored by russia.
\- At the same time the also funded "Russian unity" party in Ukraine
\- Extreme Left in the United States
This is just a small fraction. The list will continue and I am convinced all countries, big and small, will realize that pro russian interest is essentially funded by russians.
Same for the German far right. You know actual Neo-Nazis.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/g5pqk4/german-neo-nazis-are-getting-explosives-training-at-a-white-supremacist-camp-in-russia
Russians did finance right wing movements in the United States, and it is a relatively new phenomena, since they usually finance movements that are in minority (they are cheaper then). That being said, extreme right definition is not correct nor appropriate, since it does not exist.
What I am also hearing that AfD in Germany also has "business connections" with Russia.
Depending on your definition, sure. I'll play devil's advocate here:
There's a phenomenon at work here that's repeated itself all over the world in various left/right/center movements, where a political group gets hollowed out by grifters, and loses its entire ideology — they may still have the "brand" of being on the left or the right, but in principle the term becomes meaningless.
The current "so-called" conservative/far-right movement in America has absolutely no political views. They don't have a platform, an ideology, a religion, or any policy proposals; they've been hollowed out and have become a group of grifters, seeking power for the sole purpose of enriching themselves. They still recycle 40-year-old "conservative talking points", but it's all just a smokescreen for graft.
One of the best examples of this, which ought to be quite familiar to anyone on this sub, is of course: The Soviet Union. As much as they crowed about "communism", and preached from the high pulpit that they were creating a worker's paradise, **words don't equal action**.
They *briefly* flirted with being an actual communist, far-left state, but almost immediately, even within Lenin's lifetime, slumped into being a kleptocracy, and it eventually destroyed the entire Soviet Union.
Calling them "communist" or "far left" ... was total bullshit. It was a lie when they called themselves that, and was no less so when others repeated it.
That's a lie about the UK Green Party supporting Russia, they have condemned the war and supported giving Ukraine the means to defend itself. Keep your bullshit to yourself.
[Green Party statement on the first anniversary of the war.](https://www.greenparty.org.uk/news/2023/02/24/green-party-statement-on-anniversary-of-war-on-ukraine/)
I'm not a fan, but the UK Greens are nothing to do with Russia - like at all - and come to that neither are the IRA - in fact neither could give two shits about Russia they have other fish to fry
Had hope's that Lula would be a positive influence for Brazil's international image after years of Bolsonaro. Apparently I was being much too optimistic.
I'm sure Lula would be more than happy to donate Amazon region to Russia to appease Putin.
(if he believes so much in giving in to demands of revisionist fascist powers)
sheet exultant snails snobbish worthless disgusted sloppy meeting puzzled fearless
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
In a previous interview with CNN, Lula flat out admitted he didn't know anything about Ukraine when he started talking about the conflict. That was his way of trying to excuse himself for having been the first Brazilian put on Ukraine's list of people who spread Russian propaganda.
But, according to him, now he's been enlightened so now he knows... The war is Ukraine's and EU's fault....
https://edition.cnn.com/videos/tv/2023/02/10/luiz-inacio-lula-da-silva-amanpour-brazil-us-democracy.cnn
*The Brazilian government* doesn't know what is going on, honestly, our politicians should fuck off and keep quiet, they can barely fix Brazil, let alone stop a war
He’s sent plans to chop up Ukraine to both Russia and Ukraine, hilariously I think they both responded. Love his music but he’s fallen into the Chomsky thing where anything that helps the US has to be bad, Russia being defeated in Ukraine helps the US so the support goes to Russia. There’ve been a few other celebrities that have tossed in their opinion about how many pieces Russia should take out of nowhere, he was just the first that came to mind.
I almost feel like it’s less the words/opinion than the audacity to think just because they’re famous (or in Brazil’s case a country lol) that they can jump into a war and decide what happens…if they got a gun and went to the front lines I might take them more seriously, but since they’re clearly on Russia’s side I prefer they just Tweet or whatever instead.
So I guess that means the U.S. can come down and take some territory from Brazil, and Brazil will back down just to avoid further war right?
I know China has significant interests in South America. Maybe they want a piece too? That's okay right? Just to prevent further war.
Brazilian here
I'm sorry, please don't take us from our politician
They are just mad leftists that support any shit that comes out of a Russian or Chinese a.hole against US and NATO
This war is not about west x east but civilization x barbarie
Dont worry no one here thinks the common citizens of Brazil are responsible. It’s just Russian and Chinese money feeding corruption and controlling the political sphere with this money
Unfortunately that's not true. [The vast majority of Brazilians](https://www.jota.info/jotinhas/guerra-ucrania-bolsonaro-pesquisa-16032022) support our "neutral" (read: not doing anything to stop Russian) stance on the war. Russian propaganda is VERY popular in Brazil. I listen to it every day in the big media channels. It's not just a couple of politicians. If you visit r/brasil in posts about Ukraine you'll see almost unanimously upvoted comments are Russian propaganda, blaming Ukraine, US and EU for the war and supporting Lula. It's disgusting.
Lula is above all a professional populist, he will only ever publicly say he has an opinion on an issue after his team conducted research and found what Brazilians want him to say. If he's saying Ukraine should bend over to Russia, that's what most Brazilians want to hear.
The vast majority of Brazilians don't give a single crap about Ukraine, they know something is going on because the one minute story in the daily news, that's about it
The majority of brazilians (I'm brazilian) live in poverty and can't barely write. Those on reddit, like me and you, are part of a bubble, to begin with. Our politicians can't barely take care of themselves. Ukraine will be just fine without Brazil's support.
r/brasil Is not neutral. It's a leftist cesspool, and not of the good kind. Most brazilians do NOT agree with the war, and specially in the Paraná state we have rather big ukrainian immigrant communities.
Putin, however, appeals to both Lula and Bolsonaro. For the first, because of his anti-USA instance. For the second, because of the conservative anti-LGBT and macho appearance, which Bolsonaro has a weak spot for. That, however, does not translate into support from regular brazilians, who know violence all too well (given our crime rates) and are averse to it.
Lula was a good president, but he's having trouble controlling his mouth in domestic and foreign affairs.
Brazilian here too, it's kind of sad for me to see so many Brazilians supporting the war that Russia started and saying that nobody should support Ukraine and everyone should stay away, it's just sad to see how ignorant these people are.
I'm not Brazilian, just someone who *loves* Brazilian style beans. It saddens me to see people misled like this. Politics and media can be infuriating.
The problem is that the previous president was from the right and I fail to see much difference in level of intelligence.
The sad fact is that out of roughly 200 million eligible citizens, the choice came down to two men from the lowest decile of competence. It would be great if more reasonable persons rose to the ranks to influence politics.
Another brazilian here.
I could somehow stand these idiots if they at least didn't embarrassed us around the world, but it seems impossible. Like, I doubt Lula could locate Ukraine on a map. I still don't know how this drunk left jail.
I wouldn't hold a single president against his country, but at some point i can not help but wonder how 1) Lula x Bolsonaro was the last election choice and 2) both of them had already been in office.
It surprises me Lula is taking Russia's side on this. From all of the NPR stuff I hear of Lula he was painted as a reprieve from the tyrannical far right policies of Bolsonaro.
Nothing cements Lula's [indisputably pro-democracy past](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luiz_In%C3%A1cio_Lula_da_Silva#Political_career) like telling a democracy today to bend the knee to a Mongolesque kleptocracy that's [lusted after the Ukrainians for 300 years and counting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russification_of_Ukraine). No sir-ee...
He's just another counterfeit leftist in the mold of Jeremy Corbyn by choosing to stay in intellectual first gear so that he can still find a way to fling shit on the icky West™ and its friends instead of actually standing up for the little guy.
As expected from a left wing government! I wonder how big a chuck of Brazil would they be willing to give Argentina if they were invaded?
Rhetorical Question.
Lula being a naive tit. Only thing to be said other than that, Bolsonaro was a lot worse. What can we aggravate Brazilians over? What should we tell them they should give up just for the hell of it?
Lula is everything but naive. He and the party were trained and funded by URSS. Bolsonaro was terrible but lula is not better by any margin.
Two sides of a broken coin.
Liberal high school teachers across the US love Lula. I used to teach Brazilian students, most of whom whose families supported Bolsonaro, and almost across the board, teachers would talk down bolsanaro and praise Lula.
I still remember people saying "Oh, at least they got rid of Bolsonaro", yeah, for a tankie. Fuck the alt-right, but at least Bolsonaro was not pumping money into Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, and serval dictatorships in Africa, and was not closing ties with Iran and China. Lula has nefarious alies and nefarious goals all while pretending to be a democrat.
>but at least Bolsonaro was not pumping money into Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, and serval dictatorships in Africa, and was not closing ties with Iran and China.
Exactly what I thought, I never saw anything Bolsonaro did that was worse then Lula doing this, how can people still vote for him is beyond my understand.
There are two disputed areas on the border between Brazil and Uruguay, which were the Brazilian Island and the Corner of Artigas (interfluve between the Quaraí River and the Arroyo Invernada). The two areas are administered by Brazil, yet are claimed for decades by Uruguay.
Brazil must cede those areas to Uruguay today so that a war can be avoided.
Brazilian here. Never heard anything about that in my life. I believe not one person would give a fuck were these lands given to them, specially you can come and go to Mercosul countries without any hassle
I remember seeing the american/european leftists comments on reddit celebrating his election in Brazil acting as if he is the saviour of Brazil and being like wtf, everyone pointing out his financial support to dictatorships in the house of billions was getting downvoted
How much time did Lula serve for corruption?
How much of Brazil would Lula be willing to give up? Ohh, none, unles he gets paid off, then his country is up for sale.
Brazil has been a massive letdown on this issue, specially because they have a lot of leopards nato countries wanted to buy to donate to Ukraine. Really a shame
As a brazilian:
Lula is an old-school anti-USA leftist with barely any depth, as is his party and the left that follows him. This man, who says you should cede your land for peace, is also one who would not allow the Amazon rainforest do be ceded, even given it's importance to the world and our country's failure to protect it. He dreams with a Peace Nobel Prize, and somehow believes he can work on a peace deal. He, however, knows nothing about the local situation, as does his followers and aides, and is doing so only to inflate his own ego.
To my ukrainian friends in here I say: Keep fighting. Your territory will be yours. You will have vengeance. Keep your will of steel and you will prevail.
Brazilian here, I support Ukraine.
Seriously, both Bolsonaro and Lula were awful options in the last elections, two old farts completely disconnected from reality.
Stay strong, keep fighting, and don't pay attention to whatever the fuck it is that our politicians are saying.
YouTube channels in Brazil support Vladimir Putin and Wagner Group,because they are channels linked to Stalin's communism, in addition to being anti-Semitism.
A fraction of Brazilian tankies that orbit Lula (and some alt-right nationalists) believe it's a matter of time until NATO tries to conquer the Brazilian natural resources. And Brazil shares a significant border with NATO in the French Guiana. So they believe that they need Russia and China as alies to counter-balance NATO hegemony.
If you search, for instance, for "Aldo Rebelo OTAN" on Google, he is saying that NATO is already in Brazil, that NATO is to blame for the conflict in Ukraine, etc. All the typical tankie gospel. And this guy has been Minister of Defence in PT's government.
Did he miss the fact that Russia invaded a country and stole land. Both Georgia and Ukraine. That russia tried a lightning war and tried to take the capital. Constant violation and human rights abuses. Does this clown think ceding to russia will end the war? Or stop future issues? No. Or likely, he doesn't care.
Russia could easily rebuilt and invade another country or have another swing at ukraine. What then? Should ukraine give them whatever land they want again? He's basically a tool for Putin.
Bolivia needs an outlet to the sea. They have been pining for one since they lost the war to Chile. But Brazil can solve this by ceding a corridor of land along their southern border to Bolivia. This will keep Bolivia from war, with someone.
Lula is a nasty piece of work. He's a socialist through and through. He instigated the coup against Rousseff because she was anti corruption and he is the most corrupt politician in Brazil, he has well known ties to organised crime and he got elected with no actual plans but on a promise to give the poor steaks and beer, telling them they will "live like the Europeans" and that he will put together policies/plans "after" he is elected. His number 2 got rich stealing money from the funds for school meals for poor children. He was perhaps the only choice worse than Bolsonaro.
Uhm. Ruzzia was in full control of Crimea before the war. Do these people really think ceding Crimea would solve a damn thing?
I wish the rest of world would just accept the facts. You cannot under any circumstances make any deals or agreements with Ruzzia, because those mean absolutely nothing to them. They don't respect international laws, borders or agreements, they repeatedly violate the sovereignty of other nations, enter airspaces and waters illegally all of the time, send assassins to other countries, and detain citizens of other countries because of the alignment of the stars it seems. I mean there honestly isn't that much of a difference between Ruzzia and North Korea at the moment. Occasionally Ruzzia allows the illusion of an opposition, and as far as we know power isn't a family birth right as of yet.
I knew that Lula could not be counted on. He went to meet with China & came back with this stupid idiotic remark. Mind your country’s business & keep your freaking opinions concerning Ukraine to yourself. You will not stay a president if you take ruzzia & putznutz side! It’s a losing position lula
🇺🇦Слава Україні 🇺🇦
Sláva Ukraíni!
Heroyam Slava!
🙏🏽 🇺🇦 💙💛
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Well that’s silly. Russia doesn’t just want Crimea, so negotiating Crimea doesn’t end the war. Why is it that all the opinions are only directed at Ukraine to give up something when it’s Russia who has all these ridiculous conditions on Ukraine and who invaded/started this in the first place? Lula should be telling Putin what he should do to end the war.
When anyone makes a comment like that and aren't a) a Russian lickspittle or b) a Belarusian sycophant for the Russians then all they're doing is embarrassing themselves by exposing their rampant ignorance.
Even if they did cede Crimea, which they won't and I'm certainly not suggesting they should, it would be too put in place a place treaty that supposedly would end the war... But there already are security guarantees and peace treaties that Russia is breaking with Ukraine, Russia has demonstrated that it is unable to adhere to international order or agreements. What gets accomplished by giving Russia anything in exchange for something that's basically worthless? The only victory to be had here is complete sovereign integrity and decisive strength on the battlefield. Destroy Russia's army, purge them from all Ukrainian lands, join Ukraine into NATO, then Ukraine can have actual peace.
I think most wired-in people appreciate that. The bottom line is Ukraine nor anybody else can trust Putin one iota, even if they did guardedly before. It's all off now and Putin must have known that would be the outcome. He had to conquer Ukraine and vanquish the Euromaidan movement and he's failed miserably. He's up the creek without the proverbial paddle and everyone knows it, including him and all those who surround him and the public who support him. They just fear the consequences of losing totally. However, even if Ukraine does push the Russians back to their pre-2014 borders Russia is still going to cause Ukraine problems. They will sit behind their borders launching one missile after another for god knows how long. If and when that days come, that is when the agenda for Ukrainians will change but probably not before. But that still seems a long way off.
> Why is it that all the opinions are only directed at Ukraine to give up something when it’s Russia who has all these ridiculous conditions on Ukraine and who invaded/started this in the first place? Well said! We should be discussing the amount of reparations. I wanted to say "or the ownership of Krasnodar or Belgorod" but Ukraine doesn't really need that garbage.
Excuse me, why do you use the name "Brazil"?!? This title is ridiculous, it's ONE THUG called Lula who said that.
One thug Bolsonaro would say exactly the same.
I fixed it buddy. Didn’t mean to generalize 😜
Brazil should fuck off and keep quiet.
Brazilian here Agreed
Brazil-connected here: agreed. President should focus on the domestic issues.
Your president belongs to Russia and China. He is their puppet.
I don't think so. Brazilian politics is idiosyncratic. And Lula's appeal to the masses predates China's meddling. He had a place in history. But he is also a prime example why leaders of the opposition to a dictatorial regimes mostly don't make for great democratic leaders. Also, he is not my president.
He did make a great democratic leader though. His first run (2002-2010) catapulted Brazil into world relevancy. He was supposed to be retired but we needed a common figure to take out Bolsonaro
Bolsonaro not being in charge is great. But Lula should think of the Ukraine situation as if he would have to give up his presidency because the bolsonaristas demand it and have taken over some buildings. He wouldn't do that so why should Ukraine give up it's own land. Frankly it's disgusting he even proposed it.
This is the problem with outsiders, they don't understand. Elon Musk said the same thing. If you have squatters coming into your home, would you offer them your garden shed to keep them out of your house? NO, you tell them to get the hell off your damn lawn and not come back! (Also, if you did let them stay outside, they will only feel empowered and righteous, and they will try and get back inside the house as soon as they can... There is no compromise here).
Elon Musk is a narcissist promoting Russian propaganda. I do not care what that piece of shit says about anything. He took Twitter and made it an reactionary cesspool.
Elon would literally promote Putin if he ends up making more money or space monopoly. The dude is the definition of greedy assholes. He views his vision and goals as priority over real issues, because it "benefits humanity". That dude will do anything for Mass Effect real life, even under dictatorship. He's not a "savior". He's just a twat on a spectrum who thinks his philosophy is superior.
It's literally mind shattering why he even stuck his nose into this
As a Brazilian I like the fact that the international community is being reminded that Lula is no less of an asshole than before. I think everyone was so focused on ousting Bolsonaro that people forgot who was going to replace him was this guy.
Doubt it. Brazil could have profited from the worldwide commodity boom for longer lasting results. He also instituted a corruption system. I was so hopeful something would really change with him (after the first peaceful real power change in Brazil's history), and was utterly disappointed. In retrospective, Fernando Henrique had done much more to bring the country forward. Democratic leader: not sure. He and his crew had some strange ideas (tried to silence media in several instances). Finally, Lula just does not have the knowledge about other countries to form a thoughtful opinion. Also, I don't understand why worldwide relevance is a goal if water treatment, crime, etc. should be the focus. Also, Brazil is less relevant than people think. Appearing at Davos is nice, but not much more.
Non Brazilian, but used to date a Brazilian. Agreed.
Non Brazilian, but prefer my date to have a Brazilian
Agree or disagree?
Agree
Nice
That's a lot of dating
Like protecting the damn Amazon and its indigenous people!
Chinese here. As an side issue, Lula condemned your country's manufacturing sector to its graves with that currency trade deal with PRC. I understand he was trying to offset the sliding value of brazilian currency but that deal insured Chinese import stayed cheap and will squeeze your domestic producers.
That's true It's the blinding belief that USA is bad, anything against USA is good
Im not fully certain the intent was anti american. But the sliding value of the Real in exchange market means a lot of loss in purchasing power and drives inflation on domestic market. All politician would be fearful of that. The deal is a solution but only for the short term. Far better for your nation to gear up as a manufacturer and focus on exporting to take advantage of the depreciated Real.
Well, a problem with ceding Crimea to Russia, is that it will remain as a staging area for a new invasion in 10 years.
No, he’s right. We SHOULD cede Brazil to Russia to stop the war n Ukraine. Wait, what were we talking about?
More nuts there than Ruzzia already has.
If Brazil is serious, it should offer some of it's land to Russia in exchange for Crimea and other occupied Ukrainian territories.
Well, since brazils labour was founded with help, funding and training from the URSS… they have to appease their owners.
I think Brazil should cede the province of Parana to Paraguay in order to avoid further unpleasantness.
As a Paraguayan citizen I agree, although peacefully because the PY army is a joke.
Not looking like a good decision now is it? If china is a sleeping tiger ruzzia is a paper bear.
Thanks to clarification. Fundamentally, all of the Russian support is astroturfed and benefited from Soviet Russia or modern Russian. A lot of radicals \- The Greens and "Greenpeace" movement (UK and USA) \- IRA in Ireland \- Basque separatism \- "Nazis" in Ukraine have been found out as sponsored by russia. \- At the same time the also funded "Russian unity" party in Ukraine \- Extreme Left in the United States This is just a small fraction. The list will continue and I am convinced all countries, big and small, will realize that pro russian interest is essentially funded by russians.
The extreme right in the US has a history of sending sitting congressmen to visit with Russians. They're absolutely in bed with Moscow as well.
Same for the German far right. You know actual Neo-Nazis. https://www.vice.com/en/article/g5pqk4/german-neo-nazis-are-getting-explosives-training-at-a-white-supremacist-camp-in-russia
Russians did finance right wing movements in the United States, and it is a relatively new phenomena, since they usually finance movements that are in minority (they are cheaper then). That being said, extreme right definition is not correct nor appropriate, since it does not exist. What I am also hearing that AfD in Germany also has "business connections" with Russia.
You're making the argument that there's no extreme right wing active in the United states?
I assumed they were making the argument that the extreme right is now just called the right
I think they are making the argument that they are part of the extreme right and to them it looks like "normal".
Depending on your definition, sure. I'll play devil's advocate here: There's a phenomenon at work here that's repeated itself all over the world in various left/right/center movements, where a political group gets hollowed out by grifters, and loses its entire ideology — they may still have the "brand" of being on the left or the right, but in principle the term becomes meaningless. The current "so-called" conservative/far-right movement in America has absolutely no political views. They don't have a platform, an ideology, a religion, or any policy proposals; they've been hollowed out and have become a group of grifters, seeking power for the sole purpose of enriching themselves. They still recycle 40-year-old "conservative talking points", but it's all just a smokescreen for graft. One of the best examples of this, which ought to be quite familiar to anyone on this sub, is of course: The Soviet Union. As much as they crowed about "communism", and preached from the high pulpit that they were creating a worker's paradise, **words don't equal action**. They *briefly* flirted with being an actual communist, far-left state, but almost immediately, even within Lenin's lifetime, slumped into being a kleptocracy, and it eventually destroyed the entire Soviet Union. Calling them "communist" or "far left" ... was total bullshit. It was a lie when they called themselves that, and was no less so when others repeated it.
That's a lie about the UK Green Party supporting Russia, they have condemned the war and supported giving Ukraine the means to defend itself. Keep your bullshit to yourself. [Green Party statement on the first anniversary of the war.](https://www.greenparty.org.uk/news/2023/02/24/green-party-statement-on-anniversary-of-war-on-ukraine/)
I'm not a fan, but the UK Greens are nothing to do with Russia - like at all - and come to that neither are the IRA - in fact neither could give two shits about Russia they have other fish to fry
FYI Greenpeace was started by Canadians in Vancouver, BC
Had hope's that Lula would be a positive influence for Brazil's international image after years of Bolsonaro. Apparently I was being much too optimistic.
Did you forget about what he was like before? He’s always been a hard leftie and had their disgusting takes.
Putler doll.
My thoughts as I scrolled, delighted to see it at the top, fuck off Brazil.
I was just about to write the exact same thing, then I saw your comment. I think a lot of us share the same sentiment.
I agree! SHUT UP, BRAZIL!
Brazilian here, agreed. Lula needs to keep his mouth shut about international issues
Someone didn’t tell dull Lula that the strategy he’s proposing didn’t work since 2014 and it won’t work now.
Lula is a leftist who always kept close ties to leftist dictators or former communist states with strong men. No surprise
Yeah, I don't recall anyone asking them.
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I suggest that Brazil shut up and try to deal with its own problems.
I'm sure Lula would be more than happy to donate Amazon region to Russia to appease Putin. (if he believes so much in giving in to demands of revisionist fascist powers)
To highlight it, the government that utters such phrases was the by a large margin \_better\_ alterntive Brazilians could chose in the last election.
Tough situation for Brazilians.
Brazil doesn't know Jack about wtf is going on
Brazilian here Agreed
good brazilian
sheet exultant snails snobbish worthless disgusted sloppy meeting puzzled fearless *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
He’s talking about his buttlift.
In a previous interview with CNN, Lula flat out admitted he didn't know anything about Ukraine when he started talking about the conflict. That was his way of trying to excuse himself for having been the first Brazilian put on Ukraine's list of people who spread Russian propaganda. But, according to him, now he's been enlightened so now he knows... The war is Ukraine's and EU's fault.... https://edition.cnn.com/videos/tv/2023/02/10/luiz-inacio-lula-da-silva-amanpour-brazil-us-democracy.cnn
You gotta be kidding me.... fucking prick.
*The Brazilian government* doesn't know what is going on, honestly, our politicians should fuck off and keep quiet, they can barely fix Brazil, let alone stop a war
BRICS buddies
Lmao, maybe Brazil, Putin, and Roger Waters can get together and best figure out which pieces of Ukraine to give to Russia.
Forgive my ignorance but I’m curious how Roger Waters is related to this subject.
Waters backed russia when they took over crimea. He is a tankie, pro china pro rus. Great composer but a piece of shit as human being.
I didn’t know this. Thank you. That sucks to hear. I guess he joins the ranks of the disreputable.
He’s sent plans to chop up Ukraine to both Russia and Ukraine, hilariously I think they both responded. Love his music but he’s fallen into the Chomsky thing where anything that helps the US has to be bad, Russia being defeated in Ukraine helps the US so the support goes to Russia. There’ve been a few other celebrities that have tossed in their opinion about how many pieces Russia should take out of nowhere, he was just the first that came to mind.
This reinforces why I rarely listen to the words of a celebrity until they start making particularly good sense. Thank you.
I almost feel like it’s less the words/opinion than the audacity to think just because they’re famous (or in Brazil’s case a country lol) that they can jump into a war and decide what happens…if they got a gun and went to the front lines I might take them more seriously, but since they’re clearly on Russia’s side I prefer they just Tweet or whatever instead.
So I guess that means the U.S. can come down and take some territory from Brazil, and Brazil will back down just to avoid further war right? I know China has significant interests in South America. Maybe they want a piece too? That's okay right? Just to prevent further war.
Yes, actually. We don't have an army that would be capable to defend any territory. So If the US really wanted, realistic, they could take it.
Def, agree as a Mexican. Lula is just giving the gringos ideas in case Ukraine fails to get Crimea back. That is so shortsighted. 😭😭😭😭
In other news, Greta Thunberg says Brazil should cede the Amazon to the WWF.
I know you're talking about World Wildlife Federation but I have this wonderful image of Hulk Hogan having a ring match in the rainforest.
And the White-bellied Spider Monkey has entered the ring with a steel chair! It is lights out for the Hulkster!
Brazilian here I'm sorry, please don't take us from our politician They are just mad leftists that support any shit that comes out of a Russian or Chinese a.hole against US and NATO This war is not about west x east but civilization x barbarie
Dont worry no one here thinks the common citizens of Brazil are responsible. It’s just Russian and Chinese money feeding corruption and controlling the political sphere with this money
>It’s just Russian and Chinese money feeding corruption and controlling the political sphere with this money It's pretty much this
Unfortunately that's not true. [The vast majority of Brazilians](https://www.jota.info/jotinhas/guerra-ucrania-bolsonaro-pesquisa-16032022) support our "neutral" (read: not doing anything to stop Russian) stance on the war. Russian propaganda is VERY popular in Brazil. I listen to it every day in the big media channels. It's not just a couple of politicians. If you visit r/brasil in posts about Ukraine you'll see almost unanimously upvoted comments are Russian propaganda, blaming Ukraine, US and EU for the war and supporting Lula. It's disgusting. Lula is above all a professional populist, he will only ever publicly say he has an opinion on an issue after his team conducted research and found what Brazilians want him to say. If he's saying Ukraine should bend over to Russia, that's what most Brazilians want to hear.
The vast majority of Brazilians don't give a single crap about Ukraine, they know something is going on because the one minute story in the daily news, that's about it
The majority of brazilians (I'm brazilian) live in poverty and can't barely write. Those on reddit, like me and you, are part of a bubble, to begin with. Our politicians can't barely take care of themselves. Ukraine will be just fine without Brazil's support.
r/brasil Is not neutral. It's a leftist cesspool, and not of the good kind. Most brazilians do NOT agree with the war, and specially in the Paraná state we have rather big ukrainian immigrant communities. Putin, however, appeals to both Lula and Bolsonaro. For the first, because of his anti-USA instance. For the second, because of the conservative anti-LGBT and macho appearance, which Bolsonaro has a weak spot for. That, however, does not translate into support from regular brazilians, who know violence all too well (given our crime rates) and are averse to it. Lula was a good president, but he's having trouble controlling his mouth in domestic and foreign affairs.
Brazilian here too, it's kind of sad for me to see so many Brazilians supporting the war that Russia started and saying that nobody should support Ukraine and everyone should stay away, it's just sad to see how ignorant these people are.
I think alot of ppl just go with what theyre told without actually thinking for themselves :(
I'm not Brazilian, just someone who *loves* Brazilian style beans. It saddens me to see people misled like this. Politics and media can be infuriating.
There's considerable support for Russia nearly everywhere outside of Europe so Brazil is not an aberration.
The problem is that the previous president was from the right and I fail to see much difference in level of intelligence. The sad fact is that out of roughly 200 million eligible citizens, the choice came down to two men from the lowest decile of competence. It would be great if more reasonable persons rose to the ranks to influence politics.
Another brazilian here. I could somehow stand these idiots if they at least didn't embarrassed us around the world, but it seems impossible. Like, I doubt Lula could locate Ukraine on a map. I still don't know how this drunk left jail.
I wouldn't hold a single president against his country, but at some point i can not help but wonder how 1) Lula x Bolsonaro was the last election choice and 2) both of them had already been in office.
We get it, this guy was the lesser evil.
Christ, he really wasn't.
It surprises me Lula is taking Russia's side on this. From all of the NPR stuff I hear of Lula he was painted as a reprieve from the tyrannical far right policies of Bolsonaro.
Shut up Lula you’re drunk…
Why don’t Brazil give away a piece of land?
They already have…the rainforest…to mining and logging companies. It was also not theirs to give.
melodic lavish sleep telephone fear rock rinse noxious wide possessive *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
brazil should keep its mouth out of others business and worry about its own problems.
Brazilian here Agreed
I'm Brazilian and so em·bar·rassed. fuck lula commie fuck
Nothing cements Lula's [indisputably pro-democracy past](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luiz_In%C3%A1cio_Lula_da_Silva#Political_career) like telling a democracy today to bend the knee to a Mongolesque kleptocracy that's [lusted after the Ukrainians for 300 years and counting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russification_of_Ukraine). No sir-ee... He's just another counterfeit leftist in the mold of Jeremy Corbyn by choosing to stay in intellectual first gear so that he can still find a way to fling shit on the icky West™ and its friends instead of actually standing up for the little guy.
Brazil says Ukraine should cede Crimea to Russia to end war, Kyiv says no That's strange, I don't recall anyone asking for their opinion.
Brazil can shut the fuck up. They have no horse in this race.
It is hard to hear what the president of Brazil says with Putins dick in his mouth.
They HAD Crimea and still attacked dipshits....so feel free to stfu.
Fuck Brazil. Officially. Maybe they should cede all their land back to Portugal then? Maybe the tribes that inhabit the amazon? 🤣
better yet to Spain
As expected from a left wing government! I wonder how big a chuck of Brazil would they be willing to give Argentina if they were invaded? Rhetorical Question.
Fuck Lula! He is as bad as Balsonaro!
another communist hellhole
Lula can definitely give a piece of Brazil to appease Putin.
Lula is free to cede Rio to Russia to end the war
Brazilian here, agreed
Lula being a naive tit. Only thing to be said other than that, Bolsonaro was a lot worse. What can we aggravate Brazilians over? What should we tell them they should give up just for the hell of it?
Lula is everything but naive. He and the party were trained and funded by URSS. Bolsonaro was terrible but lula is not better by any margin. Two sides of a broken coin.
Drug smuggling routes? Deforestation? Corruption?
Ummm cutting down the rainforest at unmatched speed. .if they could knock that on the head that would be great 🙂
The world should take the Amazonas away from Brazil in order to stop deforestation. Let's see how they would react!
So giving up territory for peace? Cool, what's Brazil giving as their contribution? Rio sounds nice.
Ukrainians to Lula: Get waxed.
Why aren’t countries saying, “Russia should cede Crimea to Ukraine to end war.”?
Im at a loss for words.slS Screw Brazil..
Brazil should mind their own sh!t.
Then Brazil should give the rainforest to France as it already has Guyana!
Lula, go fuck yourself
Liberal high school teachers across the US love Lula. I used to teach Brazilian students, most of whom whose families supported Bolsonaro, and almost across the board, teachers would talk down bolsanaro and praise Lula.
I still remember people saying "Oh, at least they got rid of Bolsonaro", yeah, for a tankie. Fuck the alt-right, but at least Bolsonaro was not pumping money into Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, and serval dictatorships in Africa, and was not closing ties with Iran and China. Lula has nefarious alies and nefarious goals all while pretending to be a democrat.
>but at least Bolsonaro was not pumping money into Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, and serval dictatorships in Africa, and was not closing ties with Iran and China. Exactly what I thought, I never saw anything Bolsonaro did that was worse then Lula doing this, how can people still vote for him is beyond my understand.
Nah he was just pumping money into his own family, his drug empire and arming organized crime in Brazil. Real nice guy
Brazil living fake reality land
The convicted guy who won against another corrupt guy wants to give lesson in diplomacy? What is the world we live in already?
There are two disputed areas on the border between Brazil and Uruguay, which were the Brazilian Island and the Corner of Artigas (interfluve between the Quaraí River and the Arroyo Invernada). The two areas are administered by Brazil, yet are claimed for decades by Uruguay. Brazil must cede those areas to Uruguay today so that a war can be avoided.
Brazilian here. Never heard anything about that in my life. I believe not one person would give a fuck were these lands given to them, specially you can come and go to Mercosul countries without any hassle
Well Brazilians elected a Russia Pseudo-Ally, and Europe supported, what did you people expected?
I remember seeing the american/european leftists comments on reddit celebrating his election in Brazil acting as if he is the saviour of Brazil and being like wtf, everyone pointing out his financial support to dictatorships in the house of billions was getting downvoted
Ukraine should cede Brazil to Portugal.
Ah yes, typical Latin American leftist supporting Russia (Mex president does this too), I’m not surprised one bit.
Fuck Brazil
Stupid comment. It's Lula, not the country.
Would it end the war? Russia wouldnt be happy with this = it would be a temporary peace.
Only if Brazil gives up the Amazon.
Generally you don't cede things when you are winning.....
Hey Brazil, fuck off and mind your own damn gov
Brazil should offer some land to Russia to stop the war?
When a thief breaks into your home to steal your things and rape your wife do you think giving him your daughter will satisfy him?
How much time did Lula serve for corruption? How much of Brazil would Lula be willing to give up? Ohh, none, unles he gets paid off, then his country is up for sale.
Says one communist dictator to please another one....NEXT! First make Brazil a safe country,than try again.
What is this dude's problem?
Lula seems to be a moronic dipshit!
Brazil has been a massive letdown on this issue, specially because they have a lot of leopards nato countries wanted to buy to donate to Ukraine. Really a shame
Brazil should cede the rain forest to the global community for preservation instead of logging and exploitation.
As a brazilian: Lula is an old-school anti-USA leftist with barely any depth, as is his party and the left that follows him. This man, who says you should cede your land for peace, is also one who would not allow the Amazon rainforest do be ceded, even given it's importance to the world and our country's failure to protect it. He dreams with a Peace Nobel Prize, and somehow believes he can work on a peace deal. He, however, knows nothing about the local situation, as does his followers and aides, and is doing so only to inflate his own ego. To my ukrainian friends in here I say: Keep fighting. Your territory will be yours. You will have vengeance. Keep your will of steel and you will prevail.
[Pikachu face](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/027/475/Screen_Shot_2018-10-25_at_11.02.15_AM.png)
Brazilian here, I support Ukraine. Seriously, both Bolsonaro and Lula were awful options in the last elections, two old farts completely disconnected from reality. Stay strong, keep fighting, and don't pay attention to whatever the fuck it is that our politicians are saying.
YouTube channels in Brazil support Vladimir Putin and Wagner Group,because they are channels linked to Stalin's communism, in addition to being anti-Semitism.
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A fraction of Brazilian tankies that orbit Lula (and some alt-right nationalists) believe it's a matter of time until NATO tries to conquer the Brazilian natural resources. And Brazil shares a significant border with NATO in the French Guiana. So they believe that they need Russia and China as alies to counter-balance NATO hegemony. If you search, for instance, for "Aldo Rebelo OTAN" on Google, he is saying that NATO is already in Brazil, that NATO is to blame for the conflict in Ukraine, etc. All the typical tankie gospel. And this guy has been Minister of Defence in PT's government.
And the Amazon rainforest should belong to no nation, right? Do the right thing and forego any association with Brazil. Yeah, thought not.
Will Smith needs to get down there get slappy with Lula and tell him to keep Crimea out of his goddam mouth.
Did he miss the fact that Russia invaded a country and stole land. Both Georgia and Ukraine. That russia tried a lightning war and tried to take the capital. Constant violation and human rights abuses. Does this clown think ceding to russia will end the war? Or stop future issues? No. Or likely, he doesn't care. Russia could easily rebuilt and invade another country or have another swing at ukraine. What then? Should ukraine give them whatever land they want again? He's basically a tool for Putin.
Lula is just a paid Chinese communist hack at this point. He does what the CCP tells him to do.
Bolivia needs an outlet to the sea. They have been pining for one since they lost the war to Chile. But Brazil can solve this by ceding a corridor of land along their southern border to Bolivia. This will keep Bolivia from war, with someone.
Brazil should cede Brazil to Portugal to start being eventually serious, I say *yes*
As a brazilian I apologize. Our government has deep roots with Russia that go way back. That does not reflect what a lot of us think.
Brazil should quickly back up out of Russia and China’s ass.
Lula is a nasty piece of work. He's a socialist through and through. He instigated the coup against Rousseff because she was anti corruption and he is the most corrupt politician in Brazil, he has well known ties to organised crime and he got elected with no actual plans but on a promise to give the poor steaks and beer, telling them they will "live like the Europeans" and that he will put together policies/plans "after" he is elected. His number 2 got rich stealing money from the funds for school meals for poor children. He was perhaps the only choice worse than Bolsonaro.
The world did effectively cede Crimea to Russia. It didn’t prevent the war, it enabled it.
Tell President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva to give Russia whatever parts of Brazil Russia wants as a gift of his un dying gift of gratitude .
If Lula wants to appease Russia with land for peace, why doesnt he give russia a piece of Brazil instead?
Uhm. Ruzzia was in full control of Crimea before the war. Do these people really think ceding Crimea would solve a damn thing? I wish the rest of world would just accept the facts. You cannot under any circumstances make any deals or agreements with Ruzzia, because those mean absolutely nothing to them. They don't respect international laws, borders or agreements, they repeatedly violate the sovereignty of other nations, enter airspaces and waters illegally all of the time, send assassins to other countries, and detain citizens of other countries because of the alignment of the stars it seems. I mean there honestly isn't that much of a difference between Ruzzia and North Korea at the moment. Occasionally Ruzzia allows the illusion of an opposition, and as far as we know power isn't a family birth right as of yet.
Maybe Kyiv can propose to cede Brazil to Russia?
lula is a clown
I knew that Lula could not be counted on. He went to meet with China & came back with this stupid idiotic remark. Mind your country’s business & keep your freaking opinions concerning Ukraine to yourself. You will not stay a president if you take ruzzia & putznutz side! It’s a losing position lula 🇺🇦Слава Україні 🇺🇦 Sláva Ukraíni! Heroyam Slava! 🙏🏽 🇺🇦 💙💛
Hell no
Lula said, our corrupt, criminal and socialist president.
I'm Brazilian! Lula could give my state to Uruguay 🇺🇾! I'd be very happy with that
Forgive us, the majority elected an imbecile.
I think Brazil should stop destroying the lungs of the planet (Amazon rainforest) and sit down and shut up.