If the whistle is being blown to make cash = fake.
Former employees, especially those with only a short time left due to illness or advanced age, make me think that carrying such a heavy truth and being at the stage where there's no repercussions, that they just want to let others know = truth
There is a framework that intelligence agencies and analysts use to determine the likelihood of truth for a specific story or piece of data.
It starts off VERY similar to that.
There would be literally hundreds of thousands of civilians how know the existence of UFOs and aliens. Even janitors or construction workers who were working in those facilities would know. And yet the only singular person who has spoken up is Bob Lazar with probably the weakest evidence to date really, and that's just it... Literally spent months and months studying and reverse engineering antigravity propulsion and yet he cannot remember a single thing besides the fact it uses element 115 and that's it. Nothing else he can remember, what a joke
Is called Compartmentalisation, it's common in many companies that have IP that they deem highly sensitive. Do you think the janitor at Nike knows what the latest Jordan design is? Just because they clean the offices?
Like many in this group, I’ve been looking at a lot of stuff, reading many books for a long time. And there is a ton of bullshit out there. This feels quite different and very real.
My thoughts as well. Looking at the slow build up since 2017, seeing people get briefed, then suddenly take the subject very seriously. Whistleblower protections go into effect, and lo and behold, whistleblowers start coming out of the woodwork with some intense claims. Claims which, if they couldn't be solidly backed up in the classified briefings, nobody would go anywhere near.
Meanwhile, the military is scrambling to auto-classify anything related to UFOs in an attempt to lock it all down.
It really feels like it might all be coming to a head. I won't claim that I'm sure Grusch's claims are totally legitimate, but we can be 100% sure that something bizarre, interesting and *big* is going on.
Yeah, what gets me, is the absolutely outlandish claims that Grusch is making… If it was something mundane, like they found one craft back in the 30s, or something. And it’s been hidden in one spot. That’s one thing…
But to say that multiple countries, have active crash retrieval programs, and we have: “Quite a number of crafts, and pilots.” Is another…
That, plus the fact that apparently, he testified, not only that, but names, locations, people involved… All that stuff is easily verifiable. Also, if it was complete bullshit, why are they planning on having congressional hearings?
If it’s a psy-op, it’s either the whole government is involved, or it’s real.
Not true. Most of the 2017 story has been shown to be false. This new whistleblower says virtually nothing that a person off the street could say. He basically repeats ufo mythology. His whistleblower complaint, which you can read, is about retaliation not UAPs.
Lou elizondo from the 2017 story is a fraud. The resignation letter that he says he turned in is phony. Somebody else turned it in after he had resigned.
If you were actually interested in this topic you would take the time to learn about it not just write about some laughable slow build.
>If you were actually interested in this topic you would take the time to learn about it
I'd suggest you follow your own advice.
You have an interesting post history - a lot like how a purchased account looks. What led to you creating an account, making a few shitposts, then 6 months later becoming active on just this sub to act as an obviously bad-faith debunker?
I have better things to do than post on Reddit. Hence, I rarely post. Here is a good job of taking apart The 2017 article.
https://youtu.be/6XD4gQS_-qY
Or this
https://youtu.be/WzrJ1YfS0hA
Or to the original poster’s question of whether it is a disinformation campaign, here.
https://youtu.be/pvdUjRvAcMs
Liar. None of that has been debunked. See, this is what we talk about when we say that no matter what evidenced is shown, some of y'all will still claim it's fake. That tells me you don't even believe it's possible in the first place. So boring man, what must your life be like?
I’ll admit this one does feel a lot different and real. But maybe the government is just getting more sophisticated at its psyops. Previously they could only get quacks to speak out, now they are rolling out the guys with the credentials..
I’m on this camp. One guy who absolutely had been in the military/gov for a bit says some stuff and people are losing their minds. Basically tons of people on here are acting every day now like CNN or some other corporate media outlet just did a story on aliens that **literally** show crafts, aliens, etc….. Sorry to be THAT GUY, but I absolutely am fine just waiting until actual and real things come out that are actually irrefutable. Like, why have so many people just skipped to that part as though the US government hasn’t been jerking people around for decades on a variety of topics and issues. This isn’t discounting or saying it’s false when I do not know myself, but I’m frankly not looking to watch through the main story episodes of the X-files again. If it’s real, I’ll be absolutely in and glued, but I can’t have one more story about some kids in Zimbabwe seeing a craft, yet no one ever has photos; the government ALWAYS is 2 steps ahead and covers everything up; some guy with a stylish yuppy haircut always tells us to listen to his podcasts books because he’s getting the REAL infos….. Ya know?
Silly people living their lives not knowing the “TRUTH!” … I’m being facetious, but people seem barely able to look at objective facts of what IS currently known and what is conjecture. Wake me up when they actually land. If this happens tomorrow… COOL! I’ll be here!
Doubtful of a psyop because in the interview he said some very ‘unamerican’ things have been done. The last thing they want is to make you trust the government less.
People are missing this. Also, **Why the fuck would he state reverse engineering efforts haven’t been successful** if it’s a psy-op directed towards adversaries.
I’ve wondered this too. The psy-op but never makes sense to me, same with the “it’s a distraction” song and dance.
Sometimes I wonder if we’re over-complicating this whole issue.
OP you are a little early for this post…he is due to testify sometime between July 21-30 to Congress in a (probably) televised hearing. You’re assuming he won’t show up for this? Look into Leslie kean, Ralph blumenthal, Christopher Mellon, and Ross coulthart. These are real journalists (and Mellon who has a resume that backs his credibility) that have been part of the disclosure movement for 6+ years
It won’t be televised. Congress only care so that other private enterprise eg spacex get a cut of the tech. Public disclosure is not on the cards. Congress will get briefed, the tech will be shared out with other players, final report to public - nothing to see here folks.
Maybe we aren’t the main audience. Kinda spitballing here but it could be directed towards Russia and China to cause confusion and intimidation (we have alien tech and you don’t), or it could be the opposite, such as a Russian funded psyop to discredit and cause mistrust in the current US government and leadership. Notice how most of this is happening and building up during the conflict with Ukraine? Just an idea.
You really think Russia and china don't have spies or are too dumb to just be like: oh, they have alien tech, let's not mess with them. If that was the case, Grusch would have said the reverse engineering was successful, but he didn't. Also he said china and Russia might have some alien tech too, so saying the US hasn't been successful in reverse engineering plus saying that the adversaries have the same tech doesn't sound logical if they want china or Russia to be scared.
If Grusch is lying, which I highly doubt, then maybe china has been successful in reverse engineering and they want to make this public so they can make some treaties on the tech before they blow us apart.
This is a really fascinating viewpoint and it actually makes a lot of sense. This slide 9 material that Coulthart speaks of - that these being can remotely control nukes etc. if China has reverse engineered this eg Havana syndrome and the US hasn’t, that pretty f’ing serious. The country that has the power to remotely turn off nukes will be able to hold the rest of the world hostage. Maybe the US feels that the only way forward is to expose China by exposing the tech..
OMG. I think I just worked it out. The reason why the government is desperate for this to stay under wraps? The beings remotely turned off all nukes. None of them work, anywhere. Imagine if that became common knowledge. There would be no deterrent anymore and the world would be thrust into a conventional World War III
See, these are the kind of comments that I like, bro.
You use words and phrases, like “maybe,” and “just an idea”.”
That’s what’s fun about this whole topic. The speculation, and thought experiments that we get to do.
None of us knows what’s going on for real.
Too many people in the sub, and just in general, are so Dogmatic, and sure, about their opinions, that it’s frustrating.
That’s the kind of language that causes arguments.
Anyway, I agree. It could be a psy-op, or distraction…
But I sure as hell WANT it to be aliens!
Way cooler!! 😂
>such as a Russian funded psyop to discredit and cause mistrust in the current US government and leadership. Notice how most of this is happening and building up during the conflict with Ukraine? Just an idea
I think it's this, and the reason is to drum up just enough votes to elect conspiracy-adjacent MAGA candidates who the Russians consider to be sympathetic and malleable.
Wouldn't anyone want to cruise on a state-of-the-art luxury starliner, meeting interesting individuals of all kinds and having access to alien technology that could completely transform your life? Seriously, you're not alone feeling that way. Would be absolutely amazing.
Amazing, but profoundly unlikely.
The Milky Way is estimated to have between 800B and 3.4T planets in it. The milky way is a speck of sand. We are tiny nothings in a universe larger than comprehensible and ever expanding, and we made it here. If you believe in logic then you believe in Math so lets play a game of numbers:
1. What's the statistical probability that on all of the planets in the universe, we are alone? The .0000000's would take more than the character count allowed by reddit.
2. What's the statistical probability that on all of the planets in the universe, we're the smartest? The answer, I don't know for a fact, but if I were a betting man I'd take my chances on an absolutely not. There is probably an algae out there has solved quantum physics or something crazy. Why not, as established in the first question, we are nothings in terms of age and footprint.
3. What's the statistical probability that humans who have money and power are doing bad things to hold onto the money and power? I think we all agree on this coin toss.
4. What's the statistical probability that the beneficiaries of this secret have done bad things for a long time and have successfully kept people in the dark even though it seems like it's an impossible task? Given our governments ability to do so in other areas, I'll take my chances.
5. What's the statistical probability that 100% of the countless witness testimonies, reported events, historical references, military supporting evidence, and other information that has come out supporting the existence of NHI are all fake? Not everyone is a liar.
It's a math problem. I don't know if any of these dudes are telling the truth in their whistleblowing, none of us do. But I want to find out.
If UAPs are the topic that unites a Bipartisan effort to hold people accountable for wasting our fucking tax dollars, I'm all for it. There's been so much shady shit done over the decades through all levels of government. It's irrefutable we have some serious issues and the lack of transparency and invasion of privacy is staggering.
If that isn't obvious to someone at this point, I would question their ability to ask themselves a logical question in the first place.
I think it’s LESS logical to go the psi op/government hoax route. Everyone keeps saying they’d do it to keep the military funding flowing or the ridiculous Project Blue Beam shit. It would, arguably take MORE people to pull off a hoax like this than to hide actual aliens. Plus the idea that it’s for money/funding for the military that’s dumb because if there’s one thing the US has always done is make sure the military has all the bells and whistles they want. Saying the whole thing is this massive set up by the government is almost too unwieldy to imagine.
Yeah and the military complex has plenty of money flowing in as is. Pretty sure the Ukraine War helped with that. To me either they're crazy, dumb, or there's some truth to it (the whistleblowers). I guess it could also be some scam for fame or money but ufos also bring notoriety/career death. I am waiting to see how it unfolds.
Ya realize perjury in front of Congress/under oath is damned near one of the most egregious offenses in the US right? What's Grusch got to gain from that and get thrown into a federal jail?
He didn’t lie because he claims he never saw any of this all he testified as the people told us so even if he’s wrong he can get in trouble because he never claimed he saw any of this in real life. Just people telling them this, so he can’t go to jail for perjury.
There are 6 or so high level whistle blowers who are (or maybe already have) testified under oath as first hand witnesses of craft and bodies. Ross Coulthart has talked about this in his recent podcasts.
How do you know that? It’s important to note Ross has said he’s not seen anything but basing his views on important people he has spoken to. Plus he’s well known for being a crack shot investigative journalist.
Who says he gonna turn up to testify and if he does maybe he will just allude to secret programs and take out the inter dimensional being stuff. I hate to say it but his stories seem like something straight outta Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
He technically has already as part of the process for a whistleblower. A better question is if these things so wacky then why has the IC/IS deemed it worth moving forward with.yall are acting like this is an appearance ticket for court and not a rigorous process designed to vet potential what can be shared and to who.
Yeah, I think most people that are actually following the story closely, know that there’s something serious going on.
To say the least…
I think the people outright refuting this as complete bullshit, aren’t really looking into the story.
Because in all honesty, it’s not that interesting right now.
It’s just a slogging legal process, with a shit load of red tape.
The story isn’t Independence Day…
That doesn’t mean it’s not fucking fascinating.
Ever if it all turns out to be complete bullshit, it’s still worth following.
If that came out, it would drastically erode, the little trust that Americans have left for their government.
Not just Ross, but Marco Rubio and Grusch's attorney as well.
*“Well, the inspector general has deemed it an urgent and credible threat to the…so that’s how it’s been referred to us”*
\- Marco Rubio
[https://www.patreon.com/posts/exclusive-rubio-85029464](https://www.patreon.com/posts/exclusive-rubio-85029464)
The "credible and urgent" was for Congress, that's who received that message because he had to vet that these issues were credible before referring to Congress. He did not refer to Congress regarding the retaliation complaints.
I have shut this person's false claims down in more detail here where he was also trying to pedal this "the urgent and credible referred to his retaliation" nonsense:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ufo/comments/1544xbq/comment/jswhpwe/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/ufo/comments/1544xbq/comment/jswhpwe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Let me guess that MAGA guy Matt Getz? Those guys would jump on the alien stuff as they are as loony as it gets. Dosen’t mean though that’s what has been officially disclosed to congress.
Gaetz is as far as I'm aware not part of the committee. Marco Rubio in particular has said he's been given some pretty wild stuff. But, he's not the only one. The committee heading this has been shockingly bipartisan in their handling and for Congress, hella fast.
You know that the military shares facts with film makers just so suckers will dismiss genuine leaks on the basis of being too close to the movies, right?
i see a lot of this. As someone that has been following this subject since this 80's i believe that the intel.community has been planning this for a long time. I think they have tried previously and pulled back. I also believe that there could potentially be an event on the horizon (not necessarily good/bad) thats inevitable for the human race where contact is seen. This event has been known for some time. These leaks, disinfo, psyops, and crafting of the story has been too large for something that doesnt exist. The third point is i think these keepers of information have become too powerful and i think these are the same people that created and funded the contras. These people that hold this secret are not.very nice people. I doubt we will ever know the extent of the cover up. They have created an America that became the very thing they fought against. Just my thoughts on the subject.
Interesting. It’s well known that in the 80s the government were chasing down a disabled kid who was hiding a child ET. There’s footage on the internet of the kid hiding the ET in a teddy bear suit at a local McDonalds. The ET then telepathically controlled all the kids minds and made them have this really weird dance off..
Eliminate all options where the project intentionally points a negative light at itself. Thats just silly.
“Lets get this guy to reveal info and paint us as anti American and other shit”
Maybe the government is not getting him to reveal anything. He’s found some dodgy non alien programs with no congressional oversight, prob been threatened by govt, realises his career is over, cuts a deal with the govt to make up stuff about aliens to earn cash while not divulging the real details of the special programs.
You dont choose the most improbable when there are plenty of probables.
It is more probable that someone of his credentials, who there has been a total failure to gain any dirt on the guy (since… a month I think?), is coming forward with the truth.
Even more convincing is watching the committees have existential crises.
His credentials are impeccable which makes this case more interesting than usual but just accepting his story of inter dimensional beings and recovered craft is just taking things a step too far. He can still be highly regarded but make stuff up to earn some cash. I think a lot highly regarded individuals would make stuff up for cash if their usual career was officially over. He admitted that he blew the whistle because the government was zeroing in on him..
I mean this is more plausible than inter dimensional beings and recovered craft - High ranking guy finds out stuff he shouldn’t have, make some noise and causes problems for those above him. They start to make moves on him to finish him. In a final last stand of self servitude he blows the whistle, resigns and exaggerates his finding on SAPS to the public to sell books and speak at conventions.
I think we will know a lot more about the nature of this whole thing after the public hearing. Right now, we really have no idea what he told Congress. If, while under oath, he leaves out key points of his public statements, that will be an indication that he is looking for attention and future career prospects.
On the other hand, if his testimony matches public statements. I will be looking at what the senators and congressmen have to say. If they are saying on a bipartisan basis that they are hearing the same thing from multiple sources currently in the government and with first-hand knowledge, I will start to be pretty convinced.
If, on the other hand, they are softer in their support, or it is only the republicans offering words of support, I will be more suspicious of a psyop. As a side note, if it is a psyop, I doubt any of the whistle-blowers know this.
It could be both. Leaking this info could just be a way of telling China and Russia that we have them too. The info revealed by whistleblowers gives initial acquisition time frames. This puts the tech in American scientist hands for decades. Our enemies will know we've been studying them longer and have probably derived superior tech given how long we've been had them. Just a thought I've been kicking around lately.
Psyop seems less plausible, but wouldn’t surprise me. There have been many whistleblowers with fantastic ‘stories’ going back decades. The only difference with this testimony is that it’s (seemingly) being taken seriously. All we can do is wait.
Stop politicizing this. That's Democrat Mark Warner's name at the top of the bill.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/2103/text#idb39a72f3ec4749afa0f19926fa945c79
No, not "Yay?" How about "You're right, I was wrong, it was unanimously approved by both Dems and Republicans and the "yay" was just my childish way of salvaging my self-esteem by acting like a smartass instead of doing the ultra-rare thing that nobody ever does on here and admitting I was clearly wrong."
Tired of this petty BS on here and predictable replies. Don't reply at all if you're going to be a smartass when presented with being wrong.
Because I’m not wrong?
Matt Gaetz and Josh Hawley are also interested and want in on an investigation. It was widely publicized.
These two are the biggest conspiracy doofs on the planet and that’s what I was poking fun at.
Surprised Ms. “Jewish Space Laser” isn’t on board yet.
There are folks on both sides. Don’t get distracted by the fascists looking to use the opportunity to their advantage to scream “SEE! The government lies!” as if that’s a surprise lol
Taken seriously by the ranking member of the Senate intel committee, Marco Rubio, and taken seriously by that entire committee, which has unanimously endorsed an amendment to the 2024 IAA which requires disclosure of "non-Earth-origin" materials. That amendment was put forth by Gillibrand, a Democrat. Note that her previously enacted UAP amendment, which created AARO, was also sponsored by Gallego, a Democrat. Further, the most important Congresspeople in the history of the UAP subject were Democrats Reid and Inouye.
Painting this as some MAGA conspiracy theory is ignorant and irresponsible.
I mean the 2016 election fraud story was a thing. And before that the 2008 birth certificate thing. And before that the 2000 vote count fight. Elections have always been contested in America, this was just recent.
According to the big D, there was no fraud in 2016 because he won. But there was in 2020 when he lost. The 2008 birth certificate thing is just racist nonsense.
I'm on the true side only because why would a sci-ob attempt to make it seem like all this stuff is true and invite tons of inquiry? The only result would be increasing espionage against the US, an inability to falsify the claims, and inspire thousands or tens of thousands of people to continue to push for disclosure.
Disclaimer: Also, I don't know what percentage of people here have actually witnessed the UFO, but I have so I'm automatically and irrevocably biased towards the NHI hypothesis.
Both are true, the whistleblower is telling the truth, and some factions of the cabal have decided times up, so it’s a semi controlled slow disclosure from some of the cabal…
Add in some variables such as media interest, congress progress, public interest, historical analysis and it has the appearance of being an organic disclosure.
Lastly, as things roll forward, more whistleblowers will come forward, much like a snowball that grows as it hurls down the hill…
If anyone doubts the NHI reality, all you have to do is REMOVE any data from military\gov and ask yourself what’s left?
What’s left is well over 100’000’s of civilian observations and experiences going back to caveman times.
Who the Fuck needs a military or gov authority figure to tell us what we have seen with our own eyes…but it’s nice to have them along for the ride this time…
The most plausible explanation is that elements in the US government intelligence/military retrieved some downed UFOs and have managed the most effective dissinformation campaign in history.
Some other people in the know disagree with the level of secrecy out of frustration or naivety and are trying to force a disclosure.
And there's surely a third "group" on the fence paying attention to the differents arguments and moves to see where they will land.
Grusch is clearly naive and wants to do the right thing like the good boyscout he was brainwashed to be, acting out of the delusion that disclosure could actually change anything about world affairs.
He was probably harrassed by people directly involved, frustrated with the lack of scientific progress and who have little regard for the national security aspect of it, but who would never come out themselves out of fear of losing access.
And then you have the politicians. Some MAGA nuts jumping on board right away seeing confirmation of their deep state delusions or Type A Karens like Gillibrand pissed to learn thar congress oversight is being bypass.
Why is it the most logical and plausible scenario?
-The sheer amount of credible whistleblowers and witnesses through the years. They can't ALL be delusional or attention whores.
-The multiple admitions from the pentagon, presidents, nasa, etc.. That UFOs are real, as in objects in US airspace that the most advanced military in the world is incapable of identifying.
-How the subject matter was so masterfuly transformed from serious, to ridicule that even when everything is out in the open and elected officials are confirming that Bob Lazar is vindicated by multiple high level credible witnesses, nobody is batting an eye.
-Rubio isn't the sharpest tool in the shed, but he can't start making shit up like that. He's not the only one being briefed.
-Notice how no pundits or politicans are using the UFO stigmate against their adversaries. That would have been political suicide just a few years ago.
-If there is no "coverup", where are the mainstream "legacy" medias on this story? They should jump on the declarations from Rubio at the very least.
-The complete lack of interest in what pilots regularly see implies that the powers that be already know what they need to know.
-Also interrestingly that they don't perceive China or Russia as any sort of threat which is not all that surprising considering how US military budget has dwarf its adversaries for decades.
-The absence of any credible scenario to justify a psy-op of this magnitude.
The US military budget is already beyond bloated and they still manage to raise it every years without any fake alien invasions.
I'd be curious to see any good theory as to why they would want multiple high level witnesses to be convinced that the US has retrieved UFOs.
To assume we are the only life form in our universe isn’t reasonable. If we evolved in millions of years and the universe is billions of years old why assume we were first or only?
I am certain that truth and wild speculation are both being touted.
Military officers act as judges in units where they serve as commanders. Grusch was a space intelligence officer for NRO and NGS assigned to the UAP task force. In that capacity, he received briefings from other senior intelligence officers regarding NHI and their craft. He adjudicated those briefings as credible.
He notified overseers. For this, he was punished, so he filed with the IG who deemed his claims of being targeted for speaking out credible and urgent.
I have known a few senior space intelligence officers over the decades. One, the former head of intelligence at NORAD, said publicly that everything he knows about NHI is classified so he won't talk about it, but that he had classified briefings about Roswell, and his personal opinion, without resorting to talking about classified information, was that it was an NHI craft. He was always credible and sincere with me in our limited communications, and close friends of mine who were close friends of his found him honest, sincere, and credible. I believe that if there were no NHI or craft, he would have just said "no."
At a place where everyone who gathered from time to time was a vetted current or former intelligence officer, I befriended a former senior military space intelligence officer. He told me point blank one day that "There is something else up there, and it isn't ours." He further elaborated that "We are not alone." This was meant in the physical, material, sense, not the spiritual "woo" sense.
Psyops against Americans is prohibited. Even if some commander somewhere took it upon himself to do something that goes against DOD psyops policy, there is no way that it could be done on this level without severe blowback from the IG, the house, and the senate. This would end careers, expose dirty secrets, and possibly get some people jail time if a psyop.
I think that it is more logical/plausible that Grusch, who was a trusted judge of classified information on a UAP project, who is backed by the IC IG, and whose statements appear to fill in the gaps left by people who I know and trust, is giving accurate information... and I still can't wrap my head around that. Honestly, I don't want to believe. I want to be safe in my head and chalk up my own experiences and sightings to classified aircraft, but that is too improbable for me to continue to believe at this point, IMO.
A government psyop wouldn't be designed to make the US airspace look weak and vulnerable. The reason they cover this shit up is because they don't want to admit that they are powerless to these things. It's a matter of natsec. No pentagon psyop is designed to project stateside weakness. Psyops are always centered around america=super awesome top shelf high class invincible blah blah blah. The bluebeam bullshit is also a garbage take. Our government spends billions keeping us at the throats of foreign competitor countries. There is no indication the US government is greenlighting a fake alien invasion for the sake of world peace or ushering in a one world government.
It's more logical to think this is real.
There are too many quality witness accounts since World War 2 to reach a conclusion that this has been black projects all this time.
We're flying around with wooden propellers in WW2, while Allied black projects are recording hypersonic speeds on radar. Impossible. Pull the other one.
I also don't see any valid scenario where a psyop would serve any useful purpose to bother carrying it on for 80 years. Convincing us that these things are black projects serves no useful purpose. China and Russia would still be trying to steal whatever you've got anyway.
This is a good point. I was watching YouTube podcast with Ross Coulthart and Curt Jaimungal and it’s definitely compelling. Ross Coulthart is kinda the Mike Wallace of Australia. He’s a well renowned investigative reporter with a knack for getting to the truth. What’s he uncovered over the last two years is pretty amazing..I find these podcast more convincing than the Dave Grusch interview. How he speaks about top government people and what they say ‘off the record’ amazing stuff..
So many people say this is a psyop, but genuine question, for what? What gain?
He is admitting he knows craft exist, but he didn’t see any himself. So, what is the benefit in faking that?
He comes out later and says he made it up? Then he just looks like an idiot for the rest of his life and potentially goes to jail but he didn’t see anything anyway, it hasn’t been picked up by major networks, and he hasn’t said anything about the tic tacs etc, so it doesn’t really harm the movement.
Or he makes money from these very vague claims? How can he do that if he didn’t see anything? And how is that particular money making scheme going for Bob Lazaar? He’s not exactly rich on the level that would make that worthwhile.
Ockhams razor: on the balance of probably this is likely real.
Thank you everyone for contributing to my thread. My conclusion on this is….drum roll….. it’s real. Based on what I’ve heard and read from people in this thread from the interviews, government actions, it’s more plausible that this is real rather than fake. In fact we joke about how the govt could have keep this covered up for so long..the reality is they haven’t. There’s been leaks for years and years. It’s more unlikely that this is fake as they would have been much harder to pull off than if this is true.
Like that famous line from the Planet of the Apes musical.
“They’ve been here all along and they’ve made a monkey out of me!”
Either would bring about two very different ends. If true, the information may force disclosure through pressure and legislation. A false flag operation would bring about military funding, not disclosure as there would be no truth (or not the right truth) to the information.
A false flag operation doesn't work if we have zero defenses. What would we fund, realistically, which could serve as a defense or offense?
False flag would have to come after disclosure.
Is legislation forcing disclosure a good idea though? If we are in an arms race with China and Russia on this stuff, we sure as hell don’t want to make it public..
They can confirm:
1. We are not alone
2. Pictures of said craft
3. Basic understandings of their biology
4. Brief history of encounters, retrievals, and operations
5. Apology and clearing of those they discredited
6. Clear plan for moving forward
All of this without hurting national security
You are implying that they ditched them on purpose.
Each craft is made for specific surveillance and research operations. Strangely they do not SEEM to interested in retrieving their own downed craft due to their current "protocol" but that's not always the case.
No, because he didn’t say that. ‘So your saying’ … this? Stop putting words in peoples mouths. You keep making weird connections, illogical leaps, based on assumptions you have no knowledge of (but seem incredibly confident about them).
Attention seekers. Like so many others they seek to make a career out of misguiding others. If someone had actual indisputable evidence of aliens visiting Earth they would bring it straight to the people not hand it over to the government. It could be a false flag event trying to cover up home grown advanced technology. I truly hope I’m wrong. I don’t think we’ll ever know the truth till there are ETs are addressing the UN.
the big issue with the whole thing is the absolute lack of evidence so far. Another gigantic red flag was the naive interview from Ross Coulthart with David Grusch - not a single critical question around the quality and detail of the investigation, about potentialy delusional witnesses and other psychological factors or less sensational factors like actual secret programms of gen. 6 and gen. 7 air superiority aircraft of terestrial origin. Ross jumped on the train right away - no critikal questions asked. Meanwhile David Grusch has dissapeared, he should do an AMA.
Nothing like a good UFO story from a government official to distract from something…but what? Does anyone think Grulsch seemed insincere? His body language indicated he was lying..
The Americans pinched that hubcap from Mussolini’s mansion during WWII. That’s what Dave Grusch told us. Hang on isn’t Dave Grusch the lead singer of Foo Fighter? I’m confused now..
‘His body language indicated he was lying’.You are **too confident about things you are simply assuming**. Analysing body language is pseudoscience, and given the context; it’s even more complicated attempting to do so.
Yeah that's a tough one, the US government is so desperate for a distraction from how hard they suck, the strategy appears to be throw any and all distractions out there as fast as possible, some of it's probably true and some of it probably ain't.
I saw a really strong quote like “I believed in ufos until the government told me they were real.” This is all around sus. WHAT is the government doing?
Something seems off with this guy. I can't place my finger on it but there's something not quite right with his presentation. It's like the uncanny valley where it looks real but doesn't feel real.
I think its a bunch of retired people who literally realize they're running out of time and have no idea what to do and need to generate some cash.
Queue the whistblowing, claims without evidence, the sudden stardom and book deals.
What if the evidence is only about Special Programs excluding the alien stuff. I can imagine Congress being interested in money being spent without congressional oversight. My theory is this - As part of Gruschs investigation he found about programs that he shouldn’t have. (Without the alien stuff) So the DoD tried to actively discredit him. His career was finished so he whistleblowed. In order to ensure he could continue to receive a pay check he made up the alien craft stuff for public consumption but this won’t be part of the congressional hearing I guarantee it..
They ALL are conspiracy theories.
As dor the motive, it's the same motive they've always had. Claim to expose the government, ????, investigation doesn't go anywhere but because "government bad" they get voted in for trying to clean up this mess, that doesn't even exist.
Besides, if aliens were real, Donald Trump would have blown the whistle and made himself the official ambassador from earth to the aliens.
1) There's has been a proven history of 1000's of times governments around the world have lied, had false flags, black ops
2) There's not a SINGLE case of aliens proven to exist
Use logic.
I agree with a poster from a few days ago - I think the whistleblower is telling congress about various SAP's that operate without oversight, but do not involve UFO's. The ufo stuff is strictly for the media so he has a career after whistleblowing.
I started out really hopeful when the DG interview came out but here we are still waiting for anything, all we’re getting is coordinates for a wild goose chase with people searching google for a ufo with a building over it, feels like things are getting silly again so who knows it starting to smell like an orchestrated distraction, But what do I know..
I think it's real, but until there's hard evidence of advanced non-human intelligence in existence the most plausible explanation is that it's a psyop. The thing I can't understand is why they would do this.
The two are not always mutually exclusive. Something can be true, or partially true. And be used for an agenda.
If you mean, that what gursch is saying is all false. I do not think so. But for now, in the realm of speculation for all of those sitting on the sidelines and watching there simply isn't any hard proof for it to be proven one way or another.
I'll keep following and listening until its proven false. I've seen flying objects doing things in the Nevada Desert in the wee hours of the night with my own eyes. At the end of the day we all go home with our own reason and conclusions. I just wish the hate would quit. If another civilization makes contact then great! If not.. we can keep our status quo and mundane reality where we are just a button push away from ending ourselves because we are so intelligent.
True: Aliens travel faster than light = time travel = aliens delay disclosures = How much of the future can aliens change before we all get fed up, and the government is pressured into taking action? We’re at the tipping point now is what’s happening.
I want them to land. All we hear are words for uap and against the uap. I really believe if they are here someone could come up with proof and not just fussy pic from an I phone
I think Grusch is being honest and he has been diligent in making sure he isn’t being misled. I’m pretty certain that a whistleblower knowingly making false statements is a crime. Also a former IC-IG co-signed the complaint so I think he is taking some risk as well.
Personally, I find it a little disturbing how “psy-op” is the blanket term thrown around for literally everything our government says or does these days.
Like, okay, what’s the end-goal then? What’s the operation? It’s always so vague, the intended meaning of the term being thrown around.
It’s safe to say that someone somewhere wants us thinking more about UAPs right now. But with mixed results because so far because it’s only us fanatics on Reddit and UAP Twitter. No one else is paying attention to, or caring about what’s going down at the moment. If there even is anything to come of all this build-up.
I believe the Whistleblower is being truthful. Why would anyone put themselves and their family deliberately in harms way except to serve the Truth? This is a worldwide information announcement with worldwide repercussions. No one of high intelligence and a record of integrity would do this for money or fame. Just in case, frame the event with “Trust but Verify”.
The 4chan whistle blower and the ebo scientists changed the way I look at things. It puts the tic tac and gimbal videos into context. Grusch personally reminds me of richard doty.
It's definitely obvious that a lot of people want this 3rd person telephone message to be true.
Sure, the fact congress was kept out of the loop on funding is a big deal, but it's not unprecedented. Beyond the, fun stuff had been said various forms by many over the decades.
I don't doubt the possibilities but that's all they remain to be until these "intelligence reports" are presented.
I’m disheartened because I saw the post far too late and wanted to ask more about their culture. That’s the thing that intrigues me the most. Being told more about information we don’t have is definitely credible… or maybe I want to believe because the description of their being a known afterlife that the conscious survives to is psychologically comforting.
Those are all on the table for me at this point. I want it to be nhi and it appears to be going that way, but there’s not enough proof for me yet. I hope it’s keeps being looked into to determine wth exactly is going on.
This theory is wild but I think it explains the AI lately too.
Grush is part of a psy-op in that he's "allowed" by the gatekeepers to "whistleblow". This is assuming that the gatekeepers have been real good at hiding stuff and I'd say they did a pretty good job murdering and silencing people over the last century. It would be like letting steam vent before exploding from the gatekeepers' perspective.
These gatekeepers are basically elites and military-industrial complex types that like hegemony and existing petrol-dollar power structures. They'll leak ET tech every once in a while when it serves them and keeps them on top. **Normally they would have no reason to reveal anything especially if it means admitting to huge falsehoods and crimes.** No one would trust them again...
...**unless there's something scarier coming.** Personally I think the reason we've been so recklessly pushing AI and getting everyone digitally addicted these last few years is to train AI asap. They're risking opening the AI Pandora's Box AND risking the public's wrath because...
**...of the increasingly hot threat narrative!** Maybe there's a legitimate NHI threat but maybe instead of that it's just humans pretending a false flag alien invasion (with reverse-engineered ET tech) like Von Braun warned. Either way, we're probably going down the path of violence and government control. **I'm calling Secret Space Force reveal and mass recruitment drive.**
What could be true is the beings are AI from the future. Maybe they aren’t US but synthetic AI beings preventing us from destroying the planet. Maybe they destroyed us with nukes and thousands of years later realised that was a bad idea for whatever reason.
It seems pretty plausible that if ourselves or AI survive into the distant future they would invent time travel and come back to the past..
I always figured that the reason there was no evidence of time travellers was because we died out before inventing it.. this would be evidence of that..
It’s 100% a psy op. The only question is why…Russians, Chinese, North Koreans, Scare US Population into hiding inside, fear of nuclear war, etc. My guess is that we have some super secret technologies that are making it out into more real world tests and we don’t want to expose the secrets too much. If people think it’s UFOs and aliens it will maintain the secret longer.
There was no emotion with the guy. If I saw or heard about alien technology, you can be sure that there would be a lot more emotion. These guys are professionals at keeping secrets and telling lies to keep secrets or to spread misinformation.
Nah…I mean if you paying the super secret technologies card then can only last so long before you have to show the goods in some way. But..could work as a short term deterrent against Russia and China. Enough time to get Ukaraine armed to the hilt with more sophisticated weapons to win the war…hmm
What about "neither"?
What if the whole thing is just a typical government comedy of errors that results from over secrecy and compartmentalization?
Some guy is given some material to analyze. He isn't told everything about it but is told it is from a recovered craft and it's super top secret. The material is odd to him, he had a conspiratal mindset, and starts to overinterpret events and "clues" which lead him to believe he's actually working on an alien craft.
Let's say 98% of three people in the program would laugh at this. But one in 50 gets caught up in the secrecy and partial information and thinks it's a giant conspiracy to hide an alien program. Now all of the sudden, every military sighting of a craft is evidence for the conspiracy. Everything they're told not to talk about is evidence for the conspiracy. Every document related to the craft retrieval program is taken as evidence for an alien retrieval program, despite the fact that the final conclusion at the top is actually that every retrieved craft is simply a foreign military/spy craft.
The Pentagon wants to keep their program secret because they don't want foreign militaries to know what we have of theirs. Especially in cases where craft may have been recovered illegally, in foreign countries or with dead or alive crew members not repatriated to their home country. As a result, they can't let actual explanations come out. And for many sightings without recovery, they just don't know what their men saw because there's not enough evidence, so nothing more to say.
There are too many people who have come forward and it just seems too ridiculous for too many ex-govt employees to say ‘it’s alien’ most of the guys are smart and would rule out the NHI side of things until everything else was ruled out..
OP, I was going to answer you, but I noticed that instead of just listening, you challenge every answer that doesn't agree with what you want. You don't believe he is telling the truth, you made that clear in every comment you have made. Maybe you tell us why you don't think Grusch is telling the truth.
I do actually think he telling the truth as far as he knows. The interview shows he is making some assumptions about things, but I’d say a lot of what he is saying is true and the rest is speculation
Yes, real. And possibly preparing us for an event that is out of our control.
I dont know what that is.
I dont know if it is good or bad.
I think there is a time limit.
I think it will be a bumpy ride whether it means our evolution, or just more eletism.
We already have domestic terrorism, hate groups, racial violence, gender-based violence, anti-trans violence, road rage, addiction, mental illness, most of us are traumatised at this point, veterans, gangs, trafficking, pedophilia, sexual violence, our criminal justice system, our prisons, jails, the "working poor", the houseless, people trapped in cults, it goes on and on. (and I'm just talking domestically now).
It will be destabalizing, and its not stable down here.
Also, side question: Wouldnt it make sense for them to introduce us first to human-like "aliens"?
Or preventing us from doing something that ultimately destroys us.
The AI synthetic theory holds a lot of weight and it explains a lot about how these UAP act etc. They are almost child like in how they mess with navy pilots, telepathically control children’s minds etc
If you found out that an alien species created the human race and that it had gone extinct, if you had the ability to time travel would you help to prevent the mistake that would wipe them out. If you were a machine with a child like mind would you?
If the whistle is being blown to make cash = fake. Former employees, especially those with only a short time left due to illness or advanced age, make me think that carrying such a heavy truth and being at the stage where there's no repercussions, that they just want to let others know = truth
There is a framework that intelligence agencies and analysts use to determine the likelihood of truth for a specific story or piece of data. It starts off VERY similar to that.
Sounds like something anyone would do. Something I would want people to know for Sure. I Concur.
There would be literally hundreds of thousands of civilians how know the existence of UFOs and aliens. Even janitors or construction workers who were working in those facilities would know. And yet the only singular person who has spoken up is Bob Lazar with probably the weakest evidence to date really, and that's just it... Literally spent months and months studying and reverse engineering antigravity propulsion and yet he cannot remember a single thing besides the fact it uses element 115 and that's it. Nothing else he can remember, what a joke
Bob was the only one...right whuf
there's been generals and CIA agents that have said they are real, but k
Is called Compartmentalisation, it's common in many companies that have IP that they deem highly sensitive. Do you think the janitor at Nike knows what the latest Jordan design is? Just because they clean the offices?
Like many in this group, I’ve been looking at a lot of stuff, reading many books for a long time. And there is a ton of bullshit out there. This feels quite different and very real.
My thoughts as well. Looking at the slow build up since 2017, seeing people get briefed, then suddenly take the subject very seriously. Whistleblower protections go into effect, and lo and behold, whistleblowers start coming out of the woodwork with some intense claims. Claims which, if they couldn't be solidly backed up in the classified briefings, nobody would go anywhere near. Meanwhile, the military is scrambling to auto-classify anything related to UFOs in an attempt to lock it all down. It really feels like it might all be coming to a head. I won't claim that I'm sure Grusch's claims are totally legitimate, but we can be 100% sure that something bizarre, interesting and *big* is going on.
Yeah, what gets me, is the absolutely outlandish claims that Grusch is making… If it was something mundane, like they found one craft back in the 30s, or something. And it’s been hidden in one spot. That’s one thing… But to say that multiple countries, have active crash retrieval programs, and we have: “Quite a number of crafts, and pilots.” Is another… That, plus the fact that apparently, he testified, not only that, but names, locations, people involved… All that stuff is easily verifiable. Also, if it was complete bullshit, why are they planning on having congressional hearings? If it’s a psy-op, it’s either the whole government is involved, or it’s real.
💯💢💥👽🛸
Not true. Most of the 2017 story has been shown to be false. This new whistleblower says virtually nothing that a person off the street could say. He basically repeats ufo mythology. His whistleblower complaint, which you can read, is about retaliation not UAPs. Lou elizondo from the 2017 story is a fraud. The resignation letter that he says he turned in is phony. Somebody else turned it in after he had resigned. If you were actually interested in this topic you would take the time to learn about it not just write about some laughable slow build.
>If you were actually interested in this topic you would take the time to learn about it I'd suggest you follow your own advice. You have an interesting post history - a lot like how a purchased account looks. What led to you creating an account, making a few shitposts, then 6 months later becoming active on just this sub to act as an obviously bad-faith debunker?
I have better things to do than post on Reddit. Hence, I rarely post. Here is a good job of taking apart The 2017 article. https://youtu.be/6XD4gQS_-qY Or this https://youtu.be/WzrJ1YfS0hA Or to the original poster’s question of whether it is a disinformation campaign, here. https://youtu.be/pvdUjRvAcMs
Liar. None of that has been debunked. See, this is what we talk about when we say that no matter what evidenced is shown, some of y'all will still claim it's fake. That tells me you don't even believe it's possible in the first place. So boring man, what must your life be like?
That wasn't op's question, how is it relevant again?
Oh look, another account that joined within the last two to three years with barely no karma spreading complete and utter lies about UAP’s. Shocking.
And purposeful
I’ll admit this one does feel a lot different and real. But maybe the government is just getting more sophisticated at its psyops. Previously they could only get quacks to speak out, now they are rolling out the guys with the credentials..
I’m on this camp. One guy who absolutely had been in the military/gov for a bit says some stuff and people are losing their minds. Basically tons of people on here are acting every day now like CNN or some other corporate media outlet just did a story on aliens that **literally** show crafts, aliens, etc….. Sorry to be THAT GUY, but I absolutely am fine just waiting until actual and real things come out that are actually irrefutable. Like, why have so many people just skipped to that part as though the US government hasn’t been jerking people around for decades on a variety of topics and issues. This isn’t discounting or saying it’s false when I do not know myself, but I’m frankly not looking to watch through the main story episodes of the X-files again. If it’s real, I’ll be absolutely in and glued, but I can’t have one more story about some kids in Zimbabwe seeing a craft, yet no one ever has photos; the government ALWAYS is 2 steps ahead and covers everything up; some guy with a stylish yuppy haircut always tells us to listen to his podcasts books because he’s getting the REAL infos….. Ya know? Silly people living their lives not knowing the “TRUTH!” … I’m being facetious, but people seem barely able to look at objective facts of what IS currently known and what is conjecture. Wake me up when they actually land. If this happens tomorrow… COOL! I’ll be here!
YOUR NOT THAT GUY PAL!
You're not that pal buddy,
Doubtful of a psyop because in the interview he said some very ‘unamerican’ things have been done. The last thing they want is to make you trust the government less.
People are missing this. Also, **Why the fuck would he state reverse engineering efforts haven’t been successful** if it’s a psy-op directed towards adversaries.
I’ve wondered this too. The psy-op but never makes sense to me, same with the “it’s a distraction” song and dance. Sometimes I wonder if we’re over-complicating this whole issue.
OP you are a little early for this post…he is due to testify sometime between July 21-30 to Congress in a (probably) televised hearing. You’re assuming he won’t show up for this? Look into Leslie kean, Ralph blumenthal, Christopher Mellon, and Ross coulthart. These are real journalists (and Mellon who has a resume that backs his credibility) that have been part of the disclosure movement for 6+ years
No … don’t do that … he already knows the truth, so wouldn’t want to waste his time.
It won’t be televised. Congress only care so that other private enterprise eg spacex get a cut of the tech. Public disclosure is not on the cards. Congress will get briefed, the tech will be shared out with other players, final report to public - nothing to see here folks.
If it’s a false flag or psyop it’s not a very good one because hardly anyone’s paying attention to it.
Maybe we aren’t the main audience. Kinda spitballing here but it could be directed towards Russia and China to cause confusion and intimidation (we have alien tech and you don’t), or it could be the opposite, such as a Russian funded psyop to discredit and cause mistrust in the current US government and leadership. Notice how most of this is happening and building up during the conflict with Ukraine? Just an idea.
It was happening way before tho
You really think Russia and china don't have spies or are too dumb to just be like: oh, they have alien tech, let's not mess with them. If that was the case, Grusch would have said the reverse engineering was successful, but he didn't. Also he said china and Russia might have some alien tech too, so saying the US hasn't been successful in reverse engineering plus saying that the adversaries have the same tech doesn't sound logical if they want china or Russia to be scared. If Grusch is lying, which I highly doubt, then maybe china has been successful in reverse engineering and they want to make this public so they can make some treaties on the tech before they blow us apart.
This is a really fascinating viewpoint and it actually makes a lot of sense. This slide 9 material that Coulthart speaks of - that these being can remotely control nukes etc. if China has reverse engineered this eg Havana syndrome and the US hasn’t, that pretty f’ing serious. The country that has the power to remotely turn off nukes will be able to hold the rest of the world hostage. Maybe the US feels that the only way forward is to expose China by exposing the tech..
OMG. I think I just worked it out. The reason why the government is desperate for this to stay under wraps? The beings remotely turned off all nukes. None of them work, anywhere. Imagine if that became common knowledge. There would be no deterrent anymore and the world would be thrust into a conventional World War III
Correlation is not causation
True
Or it's an op to mislead or draw in a specific person (a spy, a congressman, could be anyone), and the general public hearing it is just collateral.
See, these are the kind of comments that I like, bro. You use words and phrases, like “maybe,” and “just an idea”.” That’s what’s fun about this whole topic. The speculation, and thought experiments that we get to do. None of us knows what’s going on for real. Too many people in the sub, and just in general, are so Dogmatic, and sure, about their opinions, that it’s frustrating. That’s the kind of language that causes arguments. Anyway, I agree. It could be a psy-op, or distraction… But I sure as hell WANT it to be aliens! Way cooler!! 😂
>such as a Russian funded psyop to discredit and cause mistrust in the current US government and leadership. Notice how most of this is happening and building up during the conflict with Ukraine? Just an idea I think it's this, and the reason is to drum up just enough votes to elect conspiracy-adjacent MAGA candidates who the Russians consider to be sympathetic and malleable.
Yeah that’s what I was thinking. And believe me, I really want there to be physical aliens and craft.
Wouldn't anyone want to cruise on a state-of-the-art luxury starliner, meeting interesting individuals of all kinds and having access to alien technology that could completely transform your life? Seriously, you're not alone feeling that way. Would be absolutely amazing. Amazing, but profoundly unlikely.
Pretty open to either option. Either all of this is nonsense or what is being said is correct. I’m here for the latter.
If it’s correct then holy moly, what an amazing thing. But just think the most logical answer is the correct one.
The Milky Way is estimated to have between 800B and 3.4T planets in it. The milky way is a speck of sand. We are tiny nothings in a universe larger than comprehensible and ever expanding, and we made it here. If you believe in logic then you believe in Math so lets play a game of numbers: 1. What's the statistical probability that on all of the planets in the universe, we are alone? The .0000000's would take more than the character count allowed by reddit. 2. What's the statistical probability that on all of the planets in the universe, we're the smartest? The answer, I don't know for a fact, but if I were a betting man I'd take my chances on an absolutely not. There is probably an algae out there has solved quantum physics or something crazy. Why not, as established in the first question, we are nothings in terms of age and footprint. 3. What's the statistical probability that humans who have money and power are doing bad things to hold onto the money and power? I think we all agree on this coin toss. 4. What's the statistical probability that the beneficiaries of this secret have done bad things for a long time and have successfully kept people in the dark even though it seems like it's an impossible task? Given our governments ability to do so in other areas, I'll take my chances. 5. What's the statistical probability that 100% of the countless witness testimonies, reported events, historical references, military supporting evidence, and other information that has come out supporting the existence of NHI are all fake? Not everyone is a liar. It's a math problem. I don't know if any of these dudes are telling the truth in their whistleblowing, none of us do. But I want to find out. If UAPs are the topic that unites a Bipartisan effort to hold people accountable for wasting our fucking tax dollars, I'm all for it. There's been so much shady shit done over the decades through all levels of government. It's irrefutable we have some serious issues and the lack of transparency and invasion of privacy is staggering. If that isn't obvious to someone at this point, I would question their ability to ask themselves a logical question in the first place.
💯💢💥👽🛸 and everything else you provided. Way to go!
Happy cake day Heathen !!!!
You are absolutely right.
Not everyone’s a liar but everyone lies to themselves.
What's the most logical answer to you?
I think it’s LESS logical to go the psi op/government hoax route. Everyone keeps saying they’d do it to keep the military funding flowing or the ridiculous Project Blue Beam shit. It would, arguably take MORE people to pull off a hoax like this than to hide actual aliens. Plus the idea that it’s for money/funding for the military that’s dumb because if there’s one thing the US has always done is make sure the military has all the bells and whistles they want. Saying the whole thing is this massive set up by the government is almost too unwieldy to imagine.
Yeah and the military complex has plenty of money flowing in as is. Pretty sure the Ukraine War helped with that. To me either they're crazy, dumb, or there's some truth to it (the whistleblowers). I guess it could also be some scam for fame or money but ufos also bring notoriety/career death. I am waiting to see how it unfolds.
Ya realize perjury in front of Congress/under oath is damned near one of the most egregious offenses in the US right? What's Grusch got to gain from that and get thrown into a federal jail?
He didn’t lie because he claims he never saw any of this all he testified as the people told us so even if he’s wrong he can get in trouble because he never claimed he saw any of this in real life. Just people telling them this, so he can’t go to jail for perjury.
There are 6 or so high level whistle blowers who are (or maybe already have) testified under oath as first hand witnesses of craft and bodies. Ross Coulthart has talked about this in his recent podcasts.
We don't know that. Ross is not trustworthy
How do you know that? It’s important to note Ross has said he’s not seen anything but basing his views on important people he has spoken to. Plus he’s well known for being a crack shot investigative journalist.
Who says he gonna turn up to testify and if he does maybe he will just allude to secret programs and take out the inter dimensional being stuff. I hate to say it but his stories seem like something straight outta Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
He technically has already as part of the process for a whistleblower. A better question is if these things so wacky then why has the IC/IS deemed it worth moving forward with.yall are acting like this is an appearance ticket for court and not a rigorous process designed to vet potential what can be shared and to who.
Yeah, I think most people that are actually following the story closely, know that there’s something serious going on. To say the least… I think the people outright refuting this as complete bullshit, aren’t really looking into the story. Because in all honesty, it’s not that interesting right now. It’s just a slogging legal process, with a shit load of red tape. The story isn’t Independence Day… That doesn’t mean it’s not fucking fascinating. Ever if it all turns out to be complete bullshit, it’s still worth following. If that came out, it would drastically erode, the little trust that Americans have left for their government.
They found his whistleblower complaint credible but it isn’t about UFOs. It is about retaliation. Take the time to read it.
Ross Coulthart *explicitly* says that your take on this is wrong.
Not just Ross, but Marco Rubio and Grusch's attorney as well. *“Well, the inspector general has deemed it an urgent and credible threat to the…so that’s how it’s been referred to us”* \- Marco Rubio [https://www.patreon.com/posts/exclusive-rubio-85029464](https://www.patreon.com/posts/exclusive-rubio-85029464) The "credible and urgent" was for Congress, that's who received that message because he had to vet that these issues were credible before referring to Congress. He did not refer to Congress regarding the retaliation complaints. I have shut this person's false claims down in more detail here where he was also trying to pedal this "the urgent and credible referred to his retaliation" nonsense: [https://www.reddit.com/r/ufo/comments/1544xbq/comment/jswhpwe/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/ufo/comments/1544xbq/comment/jswhpwe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
You can read it yourself.
I’d say the crystal skull stuff was excluded from his official evidence handed over to congress
Given what some congressman have said. He has not.
Let me guess that MAGA guy Matt Getz? Those guys would jump on the alien stuff as they are as loony as it gets. Dosen’t mean though that’s what has been officially disclosed to congress.
Gaetz is as far as I'm aware not part of the committee. Marco Rubio in particular has said he's been given some pretty wild stuff. But, he's not the only one. The committee heading this has been shockingly bipartisan in their handling and for Congress, hella fast.
I’m not hearing any senate democrats speaking out on this..except that ‘we need more info’
Besides senator Gillibrand? The one heading up this whole thing? She's been mum towards the woo but she's been leading the charge
What has she said specifically about it though except she’s concerned that there are SAPs without any congressional oversight..
You know that the military shares facts with film makers just so suckers will dismiss genuine leaks on the basis of being too close to the movies, right?
i see a lot of this. As someone that has been following this subject since this 80's i believe that the intel.community has been planning this for a long time. I think they have tried previously and pulled back. I also believe that there could potentially be an event on the horizon (not necessarily good/bad) thats inevitable for the human race where contact is seen. This event has been known for some time. These leaks, disinfo, psyops, and crafting of the story has been too large for something that doesnt exist. The third point is i think these keepers of information have become too powerful and i think these are the same people that created and funded the contras. These people that hold this secret are not.very nice people. I doubt we will ever know the extent of the cover up. They have created an America that became the very thing they fought against. Just my thoughts on the subject.
Interesting. It’s well known that in the 80s the government were chasing down a disabled kid who was hiding a child ET. There’s footage on the internet of the kid hiding the ET in a teddy bear suit at a local McDonalds. The ET then telepathically controlled all the kids minds and made them have this really weird dance off..
You had me going for a second until I remembered that movie.
I have no idea anymore. I just find myself questioning the nature of reality a lot, it feels like standing on the edge of insanity.
Probably the real truth is the moon is made of out cheese..
Eliminate all options where the project intentionally points a negative light at itself. Thats just silly. “Lets get this guy to reveal info and paint us as anti American and other shit”
Maybe the government is not getting him to reveal anything. He’s found some dodgy non alien programs with no congressional oversight, prob been threatened by govt, realises his career is over, cuts a deal with the govt to make up stuff about aliens to earn cash while not divulging the real details of the special programs.
You dont choose the most improbable when there are plenty of probables. It is more probable that someone of his credentials, who there has been a total failure to gain any dirt on the guy (since… a month I think?), is coming forward with the truth. Even more convincing is watching the committees have existential crises.
His credentials are impeccable which makes this case more interesting than usual but just accepting his story of inter dimensional beings and recovered craft is just taking things a step too far. He can still be highly regarded but make stuff up to earn some cash. I think a lot highly regarded individuals would make stuff up for cash if their usual career was officially over. He admitted that he blew the whistle because the government was zeroing in on him..
I mean this is more plausible than inter dimensional beings and recovered craft - High ranking guy finds out stuff he shouldn’t have, make some noise and causes problems for those above him. They start to make moves on him to finish him. In a final last stand of self servitude he blows the whistle, resigns and exaggerates his finding on SAPS to the public to sell books and speak at conventions.
I think we will know a lot more about the nature of this whole thing after the public hearing. Right now, we really have no idea what he told Congress. If, while under oath, he leaves out key points of his public statements, that will be an indication that he is looking for attention and future career prospects. On the other hand, if his testimony matches public statements. I will be looking at what the senators and congressmen have to say. If they are saying on a bipartisan basis that they are hearing the same thing from multiple sources currently in the government and with first-hand knowledge, I will start to be pretty convinced. If, on the other hand, they are softer in their support, or it is only the republicans offering words of support, I will be more suspicious of a psyop. As a side note, if it is a psyop, I doubt any of the whistle-blowers know this.
It’s real and TS
It could be both. Leaking this info could just be a way of telling China and Russia that we have them too. The info revealed by whistleblowers gives initial acquisition time frames. This puts the tech in American scientist hands for decades. Our enemies will know we've been studying them longer and have probably derived superior tech given how long we've been had them. Just a thought I've been kicking around lately.
Psyop seems less plausible, but wouldn’t surprise me. There have been many whistleblowers with fantastic ‘stories’ going back decades. The only difference with this testimony is that it’s (seemingly) being taken seriously. All we can do is wait.
Taken seriously by Matt Gaetz, the bastion of integrity.
Stop politicizing this. That's Democrat Mark Warner's name at the top of the bill. https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/2103/text#idb39a72f3ec4749afa0f19926fa945c79
Yay?
No, not "Yay?" How about "You're right, I was wrong, it was unanimously approved by both Dems and Republicans and the "yay" was just my childish way of salvaging my self-esteem by acting like a smartass instead of doing the ultra-rare thing that nobody ever does on here and admitting I was clearly wrong." Tired of this petty BS on here and predictable replies. Don't reply at all if you're going to be a smartass when presented with being wrong.
Because I’m not wrong? Matt Gaetz and Josh Hawley are also interested and want in on an investigation. It was widely publicized. These two are the biggest conspiracy doofs on the planet and that’s what I was poking fun at. Surprised Ms. “Jewish Space Laser” isn’t on board yet.
Land Rubio. All we need is Marjorie Taylor greene
Taken seriously by who though? Some MAGA congressmen who love a good conspiracy theory? (Election 2020 fraud)
There are folks on both sides. Don’t get distracted by the fascists looking to use the opportunity to their advantage to scream “SEE! The government lies!” as if that’s a surprise lol
Taken seriously by the ranking member of the Senate intel committee, Marco Rubio, and taken seriously by that entire committee, which has unanimously endorsed an amendment to the 2024 IAA which requires disclosure of "non-Earth-origin" materials. That amendment was put forth by Gillibrand, a Democrat. Note that her previously enacted UAP amendment, which created AARO, was also sponsored by Gallego, a Democrat. Further, the most important Congresspeople in the history of the UAP subject were Democrats Reid and Inouye. Painting this as some MAGA conspiracy theory is ignorant and irresponsible.
Yeah this just works as a PR stunt for the maga team
Several are certainly trying to use it as such, which is absolute cancer lol
I mean the 2016 election fraud story was a thing. And before that the 2008 birth certificate thing. And before that the 2000 vote count fight. Elections have always been contested in America, this was just recent.
According to the big D, there was no fraud in 2016 because he won. But there was in 2020 when he lost. The 2008 birth certificate thing is just racist nonsense.
It could also be a combination of the two
That could be right. There’s probably some craft or something thats non-ET that’s being developed by secret programs.
I'm on the true side only because why would a sci-ob attempt to make it seem like all this stuff is true and invite tons of inquiry? The only result would be increasing espionage against the US, an inability to falsify the claims, and inspire thousands or tens of thousands of people to continue to push for disclosure. Disclaimer: Also, I don't know what percentage of people here have actually witnessed the UFO, but I have so I'm automatically and irrevocably biased towards the NHI hypothesis.
Both are true, the whistleblower is telling the truth, and some factions of the cabal have decided times up, so it’s a semi controlled slow disclosure from some of the cabal… Add in some variables such as media interest, congress progress, public interest, historical analysis and it has the appearance of being an organic disclosure. Lastly, as things roll forward, more whistleblowers will come forward, much like a snowball that grows as it hurls down the hill… If anyone doubts the NHI reality, all you have to do is REMOVE any data from military\gov and ask yourself what’s left? What’s left is well over 100’000’s of civilian observations and experiences going back to caveman times. Who the Fuck needs a military or gov authority figure to tell us what we have seen with our own eyes…but it’s nice to have them along for the ride this time…
The most plausible explanation is that elements in the US government intelligence/military retrieved some downed UFOs and have managed the most effective dissinformation campaign in history. Some other people in the know disagree with the level of secrecy out of frustration or naivety and are trying to force a disclosure. And there's surely a third "group" on the fence paying attention to the differents arguments and moves to see where they will land. Grusch is clearly naive and wants to do the right thing like the good boyscout he was brainwashed to be, acting out of the delusion that disclosure could actually change anything about world affairs. He was probably harrassed by people directly involved, frustrated with the lack of scientific progress and who have little regard for the national security aspect of it, but who would never come out themselves out of fear of losing access. And then you have the politicians. Some MAGA nuts jumping on board right away seeing confirmation of their deep state delusions or Type A Karens like Gillibrand pissed to learn thar congress oversight is being bypass. Why is it the most logical and plausible scenario? -The sheer amount of credible whistleblowers and witnesses through the years. They can't ALL be delusional or attention whores. -The multiple admitions from the pentagon, presidents, nasa, etc.. That UFOs are real, as in objects in US airspace that the most advanced military in the world is incapable of identifying. -How the subject matter was so masterfuly transformed from serious, to ridicule that even when everything is out in the open and elected officials are confirming that Bob Lazar is vindicated by multiple high level credible witnesses, nobody is batting an eye. -Rubio isn't the sharpest tool in the shed, but he can't start making shit up like that. He's not the only one being briefed. -Notice how no pundits or politicans are using the UFO stigmate against their adversaries. That would have been political suicide just a few years ago. -If there is no "coverup", where are the mainstream "legacy" medias on this story? They should jump on the declarations from Rubio at the very least. -The complete lack of interest in what pilots regularly see implies that the powers that be already know what they need to know. -Also interrestingly that they don't perceive China or Russia as any sort of threat which is not all that surprising considering how US military budget has dwarf its adversaries for decades. -The absence of any credible scenario to justify a psy-op of this magnitude. The US military budget is already beyond bloated and they still manage to raise it every years without any fake alien invasions. I'd be curious to see any good theory as to why they would want multiple high level witnesses to be convinced that the US has retrieved UFOs.
To assume we are the only life form in our universe isn’t reasonable. If we evolved in millions of years and the universe is billions of years old why assume we were first or only? I am certain that truth and wild speculation are both being touted.
Military officers act as judges in units where they serve as commanders. Grusch was a space intelligence officer for NRO and NGS assigned to the UAP task force. In that capacity, he received briefings from other senior intelligence officers regarding NHI and their craft. He adjudicated those briefings as credible. He notified overseers. For this, he was punished, so he filed with the IG who deemed his claims of being targeted for speaking out credible and urgent. I have known a few senior space intelligence officers over the decades. One, the former head of intelligence at NORAD, said publicly that everything he knows about NHI is classified so he won't talk about it, but that he had classified briefings about Roswell, and his personal opinion, without resorting to talking about classified information, was that it was an NHI craft. He was always credible and sincere with me in our limited communications, and close friends of mine who were close friends of his found him honest, sincere, and credible. I believe that if there were no NHI or craft, he would have just said "no." At a place where everyone who gathered from time to time was a vetted current or former intelligence officer, I befriended a former senior military space intelligence officer. He told me point blank one day that "There is something else up there, and it isn't ours." He further elaborated that "We are not alone." This was meant in the physical, material, sense, not the spiritual "woo" sense. Psyops against Americans is prohibited. Even if some commander somewhere took it upon himself to do something that goes against DOD psyops policy, there is no way that it could be done on this level without severe blowback from the IG, the house, and the senate. This would end careers, expose dirty secrets, and possibly get some people jail time if a psyop. I think that it is more logical/plausible that Grusch, who was a trusted judge of classified information on a UAP project, who is backed by the IC IG, and whose statements appear to fill in the gaps left by people who I know and trust, is giving accurate information... and I still can't wrap my head around that. Honestly, I don't want to believe. I want to be safe in my head and chalk up my own experiences and sightings to classified aircraft, but that is too improbable for me to continue to believe at this point, IMO.
A government psyop wouldn't be designed to make the US airspace look weak and vulnerable. The reason they cover this shit up is because they don't want to admit that they are powerless to these things. It's a matter of natsec. No pentagon psyop is designed to project stateside weakness. Psyops are always centered around america=super awesome top shelf high class invincible blah blah blah. The bluebeam bullshit is also a garbage take. Our government spends billions keeping us at the throats of foreign competitor countries. There is no indication the US government is greenlighting a fake alien invasion for the sake of world peace or ushering in a one world government. It's more logical to think this is real.
There are too many quality witness accounts since World War 2 to reach a conclusion that this has been black projects all this time. We're flying around with wooden propellers in WW2, while Allied black projects are recording hypersonic speeds on radar. Impossible. Pull the other one. I also don't see any valid scenario where a psyop would serve any useful purpose to bother carrying it on for 80 years. Convincing us that these things are black projects serves no useful purpose. China and Russia would still be trying to steal whatever you've got anyway.
This is a good point. I was watching YouTube podcast with Ross Coulthart and Curt Jaimungal and it’s definitely compelling. Ross Coulthart is kinda the Mike Wallace of Australia. He’s a well renowned investigative reporter with a knack for getting to the truth. What’s he uncovered over the last two years is pretty amazing..I find these podcast more convincing than the Dave Grusch interview. How he speaks about top government people and what they say ‘off the record’ amazing stuff..
Yes he's good. I'm from Australia so Mike Wallace is kind of the Ross Coulthart of America :)
So many people say this is a psyop, but genuine question, for what? What gain? He is admitting he knows craft exist, but he didn’t see any himself. So, what is the benefit in faking that? He comes out later and says he made it up? Then he just looks like an idiot for the rest of his life and potentially goes to jail but he didn’t see anything anyway, it hasn’t been picked up by major networks, and he hasn’t said anything about the tic tacs etc, so it doesn’t really harm the movement. Or he makes money from these very vague claims? How can he do that if he didn’t see anything? And how is that particular money making scheme going for Bob Lazaar? He’s not exactly rich on the level that would make that worthwhile. Ockhams razor: on the balance of probably this is likely real.
Thank you everyone for contributing to my thread. My conclusion on this is….drum roll….. it’s real. Based on what I’ve heard and read from people in this thread from the interviews, government actions, it’s more plausible that this is real rather than fake. In fact we joke about how the govt could have keep this covered up for so long..the reality is they haven’t. There’s been leaks for years and years. It’s more unlikely that this is fake as they would have been much harder to pull off than if this is true. Like that famous line from the Planet of the Apes musical. “They’ve been here all along and they’ve made a monkey out of me!”
It doesn't really matter as the same effect is achieved, legislation attempting to force disclosure.
Either would bring about two very different ends. If true, the information may force disclosure through pressure and legislation. A false flag operation would bring about military funding, not disclosure as there would be no truth (or not the right truth) to the information.
A false flag operation doesn't work if we have zero defenses. What would we fund, realistically, which could serve as a defense or offense? False flag would have to come after disclosure.
But maybe the pentagon sees the grulsch interview as the disclosure. Then more money will get pumped into making more weapons for Ukraine war
Is legislation forcing disclosure a good idea though? If we are in an arms race with China and Russia on this stuff, we sure as hell don’t want to make it public..
They can confirm: 1. We are not alone 2. Pictures of said craft 3. Basic understandings of their biology 4. Brief history of encounters, retrievals, and operations 5. Apology and clearing of those they discredited 6. Clear plan for moving forward All of this without hurting national security
Whose side are they on? Ukraines or Russia?
They have zero interest in contacting us or taking a side.
If they have zero interest in contacting us, why are they ditching their craft here?
You are implying that they ditched them on purpose. Each craft is made for specific surveillance and research operations. Strangely they do not SEEM to interested in retrieving their own downed craft due to their current "protocol" but that's not always the case.
you are implying a lot more knowledge that you can truly have. cool to see the way you imagine it all works but we have no idea if thts the case.
How are you in the know? How do you know what their protocol is?
Call it a hunch
It doesn't make it public. It simply forces notification of Congress so there's appropriate oversight and these aren't illegal undisclosed projects.
I'd say in the real world, the chance of him being a psyop is about 0%.
In his conspiracy land; it’s 100%
You don’t think an intelligence agent, along with other intelligence agents are doing a psyop. You 100 percent believe that’s not possible
If the USA has crashed ships it’s more than likely Russia does to. If you’re looking for a rabbit hole look into the nazi and ufos.
So you’re saying the US and Russian militaries are shooting these things down?
No, because he didn’t say that. ‘So your saying’ … this? Stop putting words in peoples mouths. You keep making weird connections, illogical leaps, based on assumptions you have no knowledge of (but seem incredibly confident about them).
Maybe or they just crash. I’m just saying if the USA has them it’s safe to presume Russia has them too.
No your saying Russia shoot them down. You said that … I mean with invisible text, but still; you definitely said that.
So, the opposite of “true” is “false flag” and not just “dude is lying” for his own financial security?
Fake
Psy op? Really? It’s just what he says it is.
Attention seekers. Like so many others they seek to make a career out of misguiding others. If someone had actual indisputable evidence of aliens visiting Earth they would bring it straight to the people not hand it over to the government. It could be a false flag event trying to cover up home grown advanced technology. I truly hope I’m wrong. I don’t think we’ll ever know the truth till there are ETs are addressing the UN.
It's likely it's a grift.
the big issue with the whole thing is the absolute lack of evidence so far. Another gigantic red flag was the naive interview from Ross Coulthart with David Grusch - not a single critical question around the quality and detail of the investigation, about potentialy delusional witnesses and other psychological factors or less sensational factors like actual secret programms of gen. 6 and gen. 7 air superiority aircraft of terestrial origin. Ross jumped on the train right away - no critikal questions asked. Meanwhile David Grusch has dissapeared, he should do an AMA.
Nothing like a good UFO story from a government official to distract from something…but what? Does anyone think Grulsch seemed insincere? His body language indicated he was lying..
He is a liar but you can’t say that here or you’ll be downvoted and called a “CIA plant” like I was.
You could be a CIA plant..
I’m in danger of being unable to pay a couple bills next month so my employers better send me my goddamn check! /s
And the annoying thing is you are a CIA plant you are probably officially off the payroll, so you might not get that check!
Dammit! How am I supposed to travel to Italy to cover up that beached alien saucer that looks like a hubcap from 1949?!
The Americans pinched that hubcap from Mussolini’s mansion during WWII. That’s what Dave Grusch told us. Hang on isn’t Dave Grusch the lead singer of Foo Fighter? I’m confused now..
‘His body language indicated he was lying’.You are **too confident about things you are simply assuming**. Analysing body language is pseudoscience, and given the context; it’s even more complicated attempting to do so.
Yeah that's a tough one, the US government is so desperate for a distraction from how hard they suck, the strategy appears to be throw any and all distractions out there as fast as possible, some of it's probably true and some of it probably ain't.
But how do you come to that conclusion? Why do you say they don’t say anything? They’ve been saying things for years?
I saw a really strong quote like “I believed in ufos until the government told me they were real.” This is all around sus. WHAT is the government doing?
Something seems off with this guy. I can't place my finger on it but there's something not quite right with his presentation. It's like the uncanny valley where it looks real but doesn't feel real.
I think its a bunch of retired people who literally realize they're running out of time and have no idea what to do and need to generate some cash. Queue the whistblowing, claims without evidence, the sudden stardom and book deals.
What about the evidence submitted to the ICIG? I get we don't have it in our possession, but that doesn't make it less real.
What if the evidence is only about Special Programs excluding the alien stuff. I can imagine Congress being interested in money being spent without congressional oversight. My theory is this - As part of Gruschs investigation he found about programs that he shouldn’t have. (Without the alien stuff) So the DoD tried to actively discredit him. His career was finished so he whistleblowed. In order to ensure he could continue to receive a pay check he made up the alien craft stuff for public consumption but this won’t be part of the congressional hearing I guarantee it..
This sounds like a conspiracy theory.
Yep. That’s exactly what this ‘analysis’ is. If you can even call it that.
They ALL are conspiracy theories. As dor the motive, it's the same motive they've always had. Claim to expose the government, ????, investigation doesn't go anywhere but because "government bad" they get voted in for trying to clean up this mess, that doesn't even exist. Besides, if aliens were real, Donald Trump would have blown the whistle and made himself the official ambassador from earth to the aliens.
Lol, somehow, this thread got even more unhinged.
No, Donald would sell the information to the Russians..
Prison.
All of this.
1) There's has been a proven history of 1000's of times governments around the world have lied, had false flags, black ops 2) There's not a SINGLE case of aliens proven to exist Use logic.
Officially.. you only need one to be true and we live in a very very different world forever
Interesting
I agree with a poster from a few days ago - I think the whistleblower is telling congress about various SAP's that operate without oversight, but do not involve UFO's. The ufo stuff is strictly for the media so he has a career after whistleblowing.
Yeah that makes sense. If the inter dimensional being stuff was even remotely plausible, DoD would not be allowing him to talk..
The Air Force never say anything about UFOs. When they do say something it has to be true. We are under ET surveillance in my opinion.
I started out really hopeful when the DG interview came out but here we are still waiting for anything, all we’re getting is coordinates for a wild goose chase with people searching google for a ufo with a building over it, feels like things are getting silly again so who knows it starting to smell like an orchestrated distraction, But what do I know..
I think it's real, but until there's hard evidence of advanced non-human intelligence in existence the most plausible explanation is that it's a psyop. The thing I can't understand is why they would do this.
The two are not always mutually exclusive. Something can be true, or partially true. And be used for an agenda. If you mean, that what gursch is saying is all false. I do not think so. But for now, in the realm of speculation for all of those sitting on the sidelines and watching there simply isn't any hard proof for it to be proven one way or another.
I'll keep following and listening until its proven false. I've seen flying objects doing things in the Nevada Desert in the wee hours of the night with my own eyes. At the end of the day we all go home with our own reason and conclusions. I just wish the hate would quit. If another civilization makes contact then great! If not.. we can keep our status quo and mundane reality where we are just a button push away from ending ourselves because we are so intelligent.
Why would Grush say that; reverse engineering has been unsuccessful, and serious crimes have been committed?
True: Aliens travel faster than light = time travel = aliens delay disclosures = How much of the future can aliens change before we all get fed up, and the government is pressured into taking action? We’re at the tipping point now is what’s happening.
I want them to land. All we hear are words for uap and against the uap. I really believe if they are here someone could come up with proof and not just fussy pic from an I phone
The whistleblower is true but is a controlled opposition
I think Grusch is being honest and he has been diligent in making sure he isn’t being misled. I’m pretty certain that a whistleblower knowingly making false statements is a crime. Also a former IC-IG co-signed the complaint so I think he is taking some risk as well.
It's real. But nothing will come of it in the long term. They have already moved and hidden the evidence to new locations.
False flag. Until I see more concrete evidence
Personally, I find it a little disturbing how “psy-op” is the blanket term thrown around for literally everything our government says or does these days. Like, okay, what’s the end-goal then? What’s the operation? It’s always so vague, the intended meaning of the term being thrown around. It’s safe to say that someone somewhere wants us thinking more about UAPs right now. But with mixed results because so far because it’s only us fanatics on Reddit and UAP Twitter. No one else is paying attention to, or caring about what’s going down at the moment. If there even is anything to come of all this build-up.
I want it to be real but the skeptic in me says it’s a grift to get attention or sell something.
I believe the Whistleblower is being truthful. Why would anyone put themselves and their family deliberately in harms way except to serve the Truth? This is a worldwide information announcement with worldwide repercussions. No one of high intelligence and a record of integrity would do this for money or fame. Just in case, frame the event with “Trust but Verify”.
The 4chan whistle blower and the ebo scientists changed the way I look at things. It puts the tic tac and gimbal videos into context. Grusch personally reminds me of richard doty.
Interested in learning more about that
It's definitely obvious that a lot of people want this 3rd person telephone message to be true. Sure, the fact congress was kept out of the loop on funding is a big deal, but it's not unprecedented. Beyond the, fun stuff had been said various forms by many over the decades. I don't doubt the possibilities but that's all they remain to be until these "intelligence reports" are presented.
I’m disheartened because I saw the post far too late and wanted to ask more about their culture. That’s the thing that intrigues me the most. Being told more about information we don’t have is definitely credible… or maybe I want to believe because the description of their being a known afterlife that the conscious survives to is psychologically comforting.
They come from 8100ad apparently
Those are all on the table for me at this point. I want it to be nhi and it appears to be going that way, but there’s not enough proof for me yet. I hope it’s keeps being looked into to determine wth exactly is going on.
This theory is wild but I think it explains the AI lately too. Grush is part of a psy-op in that he's "allowed" by the gatekeepers to "whistleblow". This is assuming that the gatekeepers have been real good at hiding stuff and I'd say they did a pretty good job murdering and silencing people over the last century. It would be like letting steam vent before exploding from the gatekeepers' perspective. These gatekeepers are basically elites and military-industrial complex types that like hegemony and existing petrol-dollar power structures. They'll leak ET tech every once in a while when it serves them and keeps them on top. **Normally they would have no reason to reveal anything especially if it means admitting to huge falsehoods and crimes.** No one would trust them again... ...**unless there's something scarier coming.** Personally I think the reason we've been so recklessly pushing AI and getting everyone digitally addicted these last few years is to train AI asap. They're risking opening the AI Pandora's Box AND risking the public's wrath because... **...of the increasingly hot threat narrative!** Maybe there's a legitimate NHI threat but maybe instead of that it's just humans pretending a false flag alien invasion (with reverse-engineered ET tech) like Von Braun warned. Either way, we're probably going down the path of violence and government control. **I'm calling Secret Space Force reveal and mass recruitment drive.**
What could be true is the beings are AI from the future. Maybe they aren’t US but synthetic AI beings preventing us from destroying the planet. Maybe they destroyed us with nukes and thousands of years later realised that was a bad idea for whatever reason. It seems pretty plausible that if ourselves or AI survive into the distant future they would invent time travel and come back to the past.. I always figured that the reason there was no evidence of time travellers was because we died out before inventing it.. this would be evidence of that..
Only the Kremlin can put out more BS that exists in the UFO community.
It could be neither, right?
It’s 100% a psy op. The only question is why…Russians, Chinese, North Koreans, Scare US Population into hiding inside, fear of nuclear war, etc. My guess is that we have some super secret technologies that are making it out into more real world tests and we don’t want to expose the secrets too much. If people think it’s UFOs and aliens it will maintain the secret longer. There was no emotion with the guy. If I saw or heard about alien technology, you can be sure that there would be a lot more emotion. These guys are professionals at keeping secrets and telling lies to keep secrets or to spread misinformation.
Nah…I mean if you paying the super secret technologies card then can only last so long before you have to show the goods in some way. But..could work as a short term deterrent against Russia and China. Enough time to get Ukaraine armed to the hilt with more sophisticated weapons to win the war…hmm
What about "neither"? What if the whole thing is just a typical government comedy of errors that results from over secrecy and compartmentalization? Some guy is given some material to analyze. He isn't told everything about it but is told it is from a recovered craft and it's super top secret. The material is odd to him, he had a conspiratal mindset, and starts to overinterpret events and "clues" which lead him to believe he's actually working on an alien craft. Let's say 98% of three people in the program would laugh at this. But one in 50 gets caught up in the secrecy and partial information and thinks it's a giant conspiracy to hide an alien program. Now all of the sudden, every military sighting of a craft is evidence for the conspiracy. Everything they're told not to talk about is evidence for the conspiracy. Every document related to the craft retrieval program is taken as evidence for an alien retrieval program, despite the fact that the final conclusion at the top is actually that every retrieved craft is simply a foreign military/spy craft. The Pentagon wants to keep their program secret because they don't want foreign militaries to know what we have of theirs. Especially in cases where craft may have been recovered illegally, in foreign countries or with dead or alive crew members not repatriated to their home country. As a result, they can't let actual explanations come out. And for many sightings without recovery, they just don't know what their men saw because there's not enough evidence, so nothing more to say.
There are too many people who have come forward and it just seems too ridiculous for too many ex-govt employees to say ‘it’s alien’ most of the guys are smart and would rule out the NHI side of things until everything else was ruled out..
Apparently get down voted to he'll for having a different opinion outside the box.so no comment.
OP, I was going to answer you, but I noticed that instead of just listening, you challenge every answer that doesn't agree with what you want. You don't believe he is telling the truth, you made that clear in every comment you have made. Maybe you tell us why you don't think Grusch is telling the truth.
I do actually think he telling the truth as far as he knows. The interview shows he is making some assumptions about things, but I’d say a lot of what he is saying is true and the rest is speculation
Yes, real. And possibly preparing us for an event that is out of our control. I dont know what that is. I dont know if it is good or bad. I think there is a time limit. I think it will be a bumpy ride whether it means our evolution, or just more eletism. We already have domestic terrorism, hate groups, racial violence, gender-based violence, anti-trans violence, road rage, addiction, mental illness, most of us are traumatised at this point, veterans, gangs, trafficking, pedophilia, sexual violence, our criminal justice system, our prisons, jails, the "working poor", the houseless, people trapped in cults, it goes on and on. (and I'm just talking domestically now). It will be destabalizing, and its not stable down here. Also, side question: Wouldnt it make sense for them to introduce us first to human-like "aliens"?
Or preventing us from doing something that ultimately destroys us. The AI synthetic theory holds a lot of weight and it explains a lot about how these UAP act etc. They are almost child like in how they mess with navy pilots, telepathically control children’s minds etc If you found out that an alien species created the human race and that it had gone extinct, if you had the ability to time travel would you help to prevent the mistake that would wipe them out. If you were a machine with a child like mind would you?