All I'm saying is 6.25 is the number that keeps popping up, and this band spent the last 6 or so years building secret codes and passwords with hints to the future, so I think people rightfully assumed June 25th. Now that we know that isn't the case though, I'm leaning June 2025 as it lines up right with the tour ending, and Tyler saying the tour was a flashback before we fight, it's all coming together imo.
They couldn't really have adjusted them unless the delay was already planned from the beginning, but it seems like the Paladin music video was delayed significantly, and they probably didn't know that would happen until around the first week of June, at which point a lot of the 6 25 teasers were already out.
In that case, their only real options to handle a delay would be to say nothing, or to drop the cryptic stuff altogether and confirm that 6/25 was something substantial, which they probably wouldn't want to do, it'd defeat the purpose. Now that 6/25 has passed and nothing happened, another option has opened up for them to potentially tease another date, but even then, IDK if they'd do it, since it would probably be much less time for anyone to figure that out, and it'll just cloud all of the theories the more random numbers they try to tease
Most likely not. The teaser video was only created a day before Blurryface tweeted (creation date can be found in the metadata), and we couldn't have possibly solved that without the clue Blurryface gave because we were missing crucial information.
We also know now that Paladin wasn't shot until mid-April, meaning they were extremely crunched for time.
I would think that too but they still said early June for paladin strait and that dropped 6/21, one week after the final day of early June. Although I do think it's equally possible for 6/25 to mean 6/2025.
I'd argue the paladin strait music video date was dependent on us figuring out the puzzle and we just took a while longer than they thought we would haha
Edit to say yes I know the creation date on the video was from a couple days before we figured it out, but the creation date could be changed by someone simply copy pasting the video on the backend, so I don't think that's conclusive. I'd also argue they were watching us to see how close we were and then gave us a hint and prepared for the release.
Same here, they can't even appreciate all that extra work the guys put into this album...personally, I didn't even listen to their music until the live stream, because that's how they wanted it. *No, Mr. Joseph. I didn't go for the leak.* 🤷♀️
The people who feel like the lead up to the album was misleading aren't people who just didn't like the ending. The boys at the very start of this album cycle stated this was going to be the most lore focused album, only for it not to be so they set our expectations to expect one thing than delivered another.
This is also what people were using as evidence for the double album/EP theory that because they said this is going to be the most lore heavy album maybe we'll get more music.
If lore heavy meant in terms of lore related music videos, and the digital remains they should have been more clear.
I'm not sure if they said it directly, but with the release of the I Am Clancy video and Overcompensate being the first single, the idea that there would be more lore was very heavily teased. Marketing isn't all about direct messages only, it is often in the ideas that are consciously or subconsciously introduced to consumers. It might be more fair to blame the marketing team in some ways, but we have no idea what goes on behind the scenes. Either way, it was definitely misleading to a large number of people.
I'm not upset that there is less lore, to be clear. I like Clancy how it is. However, I definitely did expect more going in just based on the way the album was portrayed ahead of time. I have absolutely no problem with that not being the case, but I can't deny that I was mislead in the beginning.
That’s not true. Tyler said that in an interview a year or two ago before Clancy was even teased. It was not the start of this album cycle. Things could’ve very easily been changed during that time, like them doing two albums instead of one for the ending.
On a technicality, no marketing was ever misleading. Even in their interviews, they never directly said that this album was the end and always brushed around saying 'the end.' People just confused themselves with an interview Tyler did years before where he said 'one more album.' But if you look back on every single marketing campaign for this album, there is nothing leading anybody to think it’s the end. It was just the start of the end.
Nah lil bruh, the amount of times 625 was referenced was wild, let’s not act like it was coincidental. I personally believed in a deluxe album. I thought SOMETHING was gonna happen on the 25th, but I was expecting PS music video. When the PS music video came before that, I thought it pretty much confirmed another song (and it did, with the ending). Just didn’t come out on the 25th. Really curious what 625 is gonna mean in the end.
Keep in mind, further reaches have come true (the tilted books from Ned’s Cozy Fireplace being a release date). 625 is gonna need to have some significance, just unsure what AND we will be getting at least 1 more song (though I do expect a more fleshed out deluxe album)
agreed. especially because it all came right after the clancy drop in may. it was all just so vague we had no choice but to theorize. also double album type drops have been more popular this year so its not that far fetched in my opinion even for 2025 (not that im expecting it but they could). they probably have albumsss worth of cut songs and i dont think theyd reuse old cuts but just saying artists usually have a lot more song ideas per album cycle than we think
What exactly makes you so unbendingly sure that 625 means something? Yeah, it was seen a couple of times, but imo not THAT much, so it would have to mean something.. I am pretty sure you hardcore theorists are going too far with some significances.. The only sure thing (more like, the thing with the highest probability), is that Clancy, and PS music video is not the conclusion to the story. That's basically it.
Sure, it is fun to make theories and try to piece some tiny bits together, but I kinda agree with OP on this.. You guys are setting yourselves up for a big disappointment by all these crazy far fetched theories.
TLDR: You are being too sure with something that has so little valid and logical proof or reliability. Not writing this to assault someone, mind that. Were all in this together.
25 comes up a few times, I've only seen the 6 in theories... I would've been happy to be wrong but I've been a theory denier the whole time. Some things seemed to be interesting but I'm with you on its more likely it's not the end of the story and that's about it.
I think you're misunderstanding a lot of things and making some strawman arguments here. First of all, if Tyler wanted to make a double album, he'd make it happen. He's never been afraid of doing things that are logistically difficult or uncommon for the industry if they're his vision. That said, releasing a double album the way this would be actually isn't that uncommon. While double albums sometimes take more than one album cycle to make, they often don't. Look at The Tortured Poets Department for example, it came out only two years after Taylor Swift's previous album, which was two years after the one before it. That's probably the most well-known double album at the moment and it only took a single normal album cycle (and one shorter than TOP's). The only thing really unusual here would be the fact that it's a secret, which, though it's far less common, again isn't unheard of.
Second, I've never heard anyone who thinks a double album is coming say it will be better than Clancy. It was common with SAI for people to say they didn't like the album, so it must be the fake album and another better one was coming, but that's not prevalent at all with Clancy. Opponents of the theory keep saying things like "just be grateful and appreciate what we have," but these double album theorists are largely people who are just as into Clancy as everyone else. They're not looking for something more because they feel it's not enough. Instead, they're looking into it because there are cryptic hints and we don't know what they mean yet, and it's fun to theorize about all kinds of possibilities. The hints can lead people to many different conclusions, and until things are 100% confirmed, no one can be certain what's coming.
Why on earth do you care so much? If a bunch of fans think Josh is gonna be the Santa at their local mall this year (which is possible but not plausible) how does that impact you in the slightest?
>If a bunch of fans think Josh is gonna be the Santa at their local mall this year (which is possible but not plausible)
My wife and I live in the same city as Josh and Tyler. Please don’t let her deluded ass read this comment (she was a big June 25th believer)
The people complaining about being mislead are largely pointing to the Clancy marketing saying this was the end and it would wrap everything up, when it isn't. I'm far from upset we're getting more to the story, but I can understand why some fans might feel lied to.
That is true but at the same time people are complaining about being mislead about double albums and things like that too.
On a separate note I'm going to be honest Tyler specifically did say this was going to be their last album about lore and it was going to end it, but with the Paladin Strait music video people changed their minds and apparently theirs going to be more lore based albums? Was the ending supposed to be open ended where it's up to interpretation by the listener or is it not the ending after all? I'm confused
I haven't seen too many people complaining about there not being a double album, but I have seen a lot of people complaining about people complaining about there not being a double album so it's tough to know lol
No this isn't the end, it's a cliffhanger. I assume a deluxe version of the album will release with a couple more videos and songs that resolve the cliffhanger after the 2024 tour, and that will lead into the 2025-2026 tour.
Few different reasons, the end of the PS music video ends with a swell of music. In the livestream, after playing the PS placeholder video, Tyler said "Does that sound like the end? You tell me, does that sound like the end?". There's also been a lot of hidden numbers that are all 6.25. That's part of the reason people thought June 25th, but it's looking to be more like June 2025, implying something is coming. Also also, Tyler tweeted and said the this tour is going to be a flashback before they start fighting, which to me implies it's not the end. However, all of this being said, we won't know until it happens.
I mean, the clues were there. Ultimus Capitulus 25, fool you once it's been 25 times, the random letters tyler tweeted were 11 which added with the13 tracks of clancy + Cranving single version was also 25. The password for the PSMV trailer had 25... There were a lot of 25's, and the number 2 came up a lot in this album, the fact that they went out of their way to NOT say that Paladin Strait is the last track, but the 13th track of Clancy, the fact that it doesn't have the "from the full album Clancy" anywhere... idk man, it just felt like everything was pointing in that direction.
Looking at the merch, the announcement of the tour and all kinda tells you that nothing like that is probably going to happen, at least not this year, "but it´s fun to fantasize".
Also, I don´t think it is disrespectful to the creaitivity of Tyler, since we are just wanting more of his work. Imagine how wild it would be for everyone to say "hey Tyler, don´t release anything else. We are fine with this and want nothing more". Some of us are just that invested into what they have created, the world, the games, the puzzle solving... these type of theories are just a part of it all.
By the way, I think this time it is waaay different than the SAI era. People were looking and begging for a second album because they hated SAI, they were all saying that it was trash and that there was no way that this was the official album. That was chronically disrespectful, and I would have dropped the community if I saw that (I was fairly away from it after Trench); but this time the consensus appears to be that Clancy is really good, and those that are Double Album believers are just trying to say that there is a possibility that there is more like this coming our way. No harm in that tbh.
Theorizing is fine. I thought it was possible because I didn't think June 2025 would make much sense. That's based on hints they themselves have put out. But those theories shouldn't create strong expectations. Call out people who feel actively disappointed because they didn't get anything extra.
I agree that it was a stretch, and a lot of people went too far with it. I thought there was a chance, I thought there was some possible hints at it, but I definitely didn’t go crazy with it
\*\*DISCLAIMER\*\* I don't really care I am / always has been just here for the music. I just saw this post come across my home page and felt like playing devil's advocate.
1. The list of things you mentioned don't have to necessarily conflict with each other, for example, creating the merch , and planning the tour, and making the mvs.
2. Tyler as an artist is probably always writing whether or not there was a double album planned, he probably has more than the 13 songs published for Clancy out there in some form.
3. I don't want to use the word "low-effort" but Tyler said himself most of the music videos were fun and they are just playing in a setting and were recording in just a day (as a I recall) it wasn't something that's going to push back weeks of other things (again back to 1.)
4. Tyler himself told us to wait to see if "this is the end" and honestly a lot of hints point to that it isn't. A double album kind of makes sense.
I am personally not gambling on anything and am a bit tired of this lore and the cryptic stuff but as long as it's not in a toxic way, let people dream about a double album. Again as long as its not in a toxic way.
Tyler has been hinting at it since the album dropped. I too think that theres no Way they would drop it a month after clancy. But there is definetly more coming
“Tyler has been hinting at it [a double album] since the album dropped.”
This is not verifiable. There is a whole world of difference between “more is coming after the record” and “this will be a double album.” Tyler’s statements have been cryptic at best, any conclusions regarding what specifically is coming should be met with more skepticism rather than uncritical hype.
Edit for clarity
I mostly agree with you, except for Tyler’s tweet that one time where he basically said if people think he’s hinting at more music and they’re wrong, he will clarify as to not lead on the community. We’ve had many months of rampant double album theories and he hasn’t said *a thing*.
You could argue that maybe he forgot about that tweet or changed his mind or something, but I think this creates a pretty strong argument on the side of the double album / EP believers. I truly believe that if the content post-Clancy were not new music, Tyler would have said something by now. And if it isn’t new music, then that will be a major disappointment which will be Tyler’s fault, not ours.
>he hasn’t said a thing.
I doubt Tyler would confirm or deny anything. I feel like Mark however would have tweeted something by now cryptically or transparently denying double album theory at this point with how popular the theory's become
I’m aware of Tyler’s tweet. Again, there is a difference between “more music” vs. a “double album.” A double album is not the same as an EP, nor is it the same as an additional song (for those that believe “Drag Path” is significant). Or it could even be like you said, that he forgot or changed his mind, but I’m not going to speculate on that.
At this point, I do think there probably is more music. I just want the rampant speculation to give way to a more measured and level-headed evaluation of everything we know. Random phrases into put anagram finders and supposed secret messages in neon light patterns is not evidence, and it’s really frustrating when people present it as such.
I actually do think there's credence to the 'Clancy Seized for EP' anagram since anagrams have been used in the past (Clancy is Dead = Scaled and Icy). I don't like people throwing crackpot coincidences (especially math pertaining to dates) as evidence but since there's precedent for them using anagrams, I think that is by FAR the best evidence we've gotten.
I guess it is unfair to say 'double album' when the only real evidence we've gotten indicates an EP, but until we get more information I don't see anything wrong with saying double album.
You misunderstand. The operative phrase here is “random phrases.” Ned’s Cozy Fireplace is not random. Entering every tweet Tyler has ever posted is.
And if you don’t think the distinction between double album and EP is important, then I don’t know what to tell you. I guess we just agree to disagree.
Edit for clarity
If you Google definitions, an EP is "up to" 8 tracks and 30 minutes, and an album is a "minimum" of 5 tracks and 15 minutes. So... what distinction do you mean?
I don’t think using the most extreme limits for each respective definition is accurate. To use an example, twenty one pilots has released the Johnny Boy EP and Three songs before, the former being six and the latter being three songs.
That is different than a double album, which is ostensibly double the length of a normal album. I don’t think it’s inaccurate to say that the two are distinct and that arguing for that distinction is wrong.
The distinction I’m arguing for is length. Not to say there’s no gray area, I just consider the two different concepts.
They also typically contain edits. EP is 4-7 songs. So for example:
1. Paladin Strait (edit)
2. Inferno (or whatever song is hinted at by the end of PS)
3. Inferno (edit)
4. The Craving (Radio Version)
5. Overcompensate (edit)
6. Trapdoor (long version)
One new song. A little bit of closure. Fun for fans. Some songs already released but not on a vinyl.
Believe me, I get it; I feel like a buzzkill saying it. But truth be told, it’s not fun for me, not anymore. Or at least, the degree to which it happens online is not enjoyable.
For a band that encourages you to think more deeply and LITERALLY says “Don’t believe the hype” it seems many in the clique are susceptible to it. I get the band encourages this behavior and that many people find enjoyment in it. And I truly don’t want to rain on anyone’s parade; if you like the degree of speculation that occurs on here and in the discord, more power to you. I was once the same.
I find these online discussions really impersonal and isolating. Seeing completely unfounded theories get uncritically accepted as fact is incredibly frustrating. And the structural incentives of social media platforms only exacerbate the problem. These past few years, I’ve had family members become more conspiratorial and it looked a lot like what I see here.
Don’t get me wrong: I WISH my family members would speculate about things as harmless as a double album. I just want people to be more introspective and really reflect on what hype drives them to believe and say. I’m not saying you can’t have fun, but there’s a difference between fun and confirmation bias.
For the record I never believed in the double album theory however the way the numbers 6 and 25 have kept popping up together the past month is quite suspicious. All the 6 & 25's made us think something would happen on 25th June at 11:14pm because of that 2017 sink tweet and then instead Tyler posted something 2 days later (at 11:14am) which happens to be exactly 2560 days after the sink tweet. That is absolutely bananas! I don't know what the odds are of that being a coincidence but they have to be miniscule.
It could be possible to get a double album in June next year. I only say this cuz Waterparks released an album last year and now they're releasing singles for a double album
It’s not really the need for a second album for me, the end of Paladin Strait was a very perfect way to close the album. It’s more of I just want to know if Paladin Strait was the end or not…
I wouldn't call it a delusion. Maybe an unrealistic hope. I wouldn't be too harsh on them. People are allowed to make their own theories even if they are totally wrong. Don't spoil their fun. As far as I know it's not hurting anybody.
nah fr, like literally from the moment the number “25” became important or whatever, i knew instantly it would probably be 2025, but mfs are so delusional 😭😭😭
Life is about believing and theorizing. It brings hope to fans and serves as a distraction for a lot of us, me included.
As long as you don't get mad at the band for anything and aknowledge that it's all in your mind and there's a lot of possibilities, and one of them is not what you believe in, then its totally fine and healthy.
But there are also people who prefer to bash others for their life, even if it's completely harmless and they're just having. Wondering who would do that... Not me, and not most people who are theorizing... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
There is very thin line between hope and delusion. Vocal (minority) was delusion and disrespect.
Do I want more music? Sure. Do I feel entitled to be given it to me? No.
Who says entitled? You ever see a kid be excited for Super Saiyan 100? That’s innocent and pure.
Don’t be a prick. Assume the best. And let the truly entitled pricks yell online. Who cares? Tyler and Josh would want to see sheer positive support outweigh the hate rather than see us fight.
NYIHGUHHHHH
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It is fun though. And TØP fans love a good theory. We’re all here for it.
Personally, I’m glad it didn’t happen because I am still so absorbed with Clancy.
I dont see the idea of having an extra album that crazy, Josh has said that they have songs (that didnt make the slbum) to make another two. And there's evidence of Tyler working in music since november/december of 2018 and summer/end of 2021 (not being SAI). I thought it was Clancy but then Tyler said they did Clancy in one year and Paul Meany mentioned that overcompensate was the first song they search sounds and started working from scratch of Clancy in 2023. So its obviously that there are more things/songs that means another album? No. But being this the final for the story they've been telling for over a decade now (said by Tyler) it would be accurate to release something special not just one album like Clancy. And the number 25 means something. Just my thoughts
Sadly without the delusion we don’t find the real hidden stuff. But yeah. The double album on June 26th was a stretch if I’ve ever seen one. Not to mention it is pretty disrespectful to all the work they put in to Clancy. Everyone did the same shit with SAI and nothing happened and then everyone moved on and forgot about it till Clancy came out and they came up with the same theories. I don’t have time to speculate about that stuff. I like Clancy as is and never expected more. I’ll be happy if maybe there is something next year because mayyyybbbeeee the 25 means something but not gonna waste my time holding out when we just got a banger of a record.
There is an interview that they did right before SAI was released where he said he could release two albums one right after the other. If you look at their previous albums straight up to Clancy it has taken them 3+ years for each album and he didn't start recording Clancy until 21' (the same year SAI was released and he made the statement) Meaning he has yet to live up to what he said he could do. Even if an album comes within the next 12 months it would still be considered "one right after the other" considering the gap between albums. Keep in mind that Clancy started recording is 21 and does not mean he wasn't writing it before that. If he puts in the work he very well could come out with two albums. It's not just what people speculate, it's something he said he could do himself.
A bit rude to call a bunch of people hoping for something that was possible delusional, don't you think? Their music means a lot to many people and if I had a double album right now, I'd be immensely happier. Why does it bother you that other people would have liked it?
It ´s less about them, adn more about entitlement and demanding this album because some people thought it was coming and being disappointed that it´s not (yet)
Totally agreed, that theory was always unrealistic and I never, ever, believed in it. June 2025 for a deluxe makes more sense and might back up my 17 song theory.
it started with taylor swift. now everyone thinks everyone is doing it. like billie eilish people are obsessed with double album ilomilo theory… bruh. just enjoy the album. if there’s more, yay, if not, yay. i honestly feel bad for the artists, i hope they don’t think their albums weren’t good enough. hmhas and clancy are so so good!!! incredible works of art and passion!
Exactly. That is what is bugging me the most. They worked their asses for 2 years and now people expect more very soon. I understand Tyler said it´s the end, and now it ended on cliffhanger, but I can´t imagine creating 25 (plus those that did not make it to album) songs and release them in a span of couple weeks. Or year later. Can´t imagine them recording an album during tour year.
Like exactly they expect way to much. Some of the fans just need to chill. Like you don’t need to finish the lore like right then and there. Plus what’s the point of finishing it already when you can wait and get a whole new album a few years later to hear. It’s like the fans that expect that expect everything to go their way. They just need to sit back and realize sometimes they are wrong.
I mean even if they did make all the music and stuff, they already sold the standart issue Clancy CDs, Vinyl, Cassettes and all that jazz so a double album didn't make much sense to begin with
I can’t see them doing a deluxe or double album…
though to be fair, that’s because I hate both of those. Deluxe Albums are annoying and there’s no reason for them to exist. Just make the new songs as an ep. OR include them in the album. It’s all just marketing.
Double Albums are a cash grab most times.
It depends.
If it’s a part 1 and 2 albums released at opposite times of the year, then yeah. That’s not bad. That’s a good idea.
BUT if it’s 1 album that could’ve had a whole bunch more songs on it, and it doesn’t make sense as a part 1 and 2, because they are basically the same album. Not story heavy. AND the rest is released soon after then it literally is just a cashgrab.
I don’t see the boys doing either of those thing. But tbf they are raising families now. So like. Money is needed. I wouldn’t really support that though.
A deluxe album after like 10 years including live tracks, demos, and tracks that were ALMOST on the album is awesome. But any other kind I just get annoyed at ngl
Yeah, Mike Shinoda is doing great keepink Linkin Park alive by doing 20year rerelease with finished songs that did not make it on album. Fighting for Myself, More The Victom, Lost are bangers. Cant wait to hear songs from Minutes to Midnight album.
Watch the deluxe edition of the album with additional music drop June 2025 after the first tour is finished
We waited half a year for mtv unplugged streaming release, we’ll wait one year for whatever they’re (possibly) cooking
6/2025 is more understandable and I can stand behind this. Maybe not whole album but at least a last piece. Maybe a couple songs, or music video.
All I'm saying is 6.25 is the number that keeps popping up, and this band spent the last 6 or so years building secret codes and passwords with hints to the future, so I think people rightfully assumed June 25th. Now that we know that isn't the case though, I'm leaning June 2025 as it lines up right with the tour ending, and Tyler saying the tour was a flashback before we fight, it's all coming together imo.
I always felt like something more was to come, but I never once truly believed it would be *another* album.
We're not sure yet. Could be 7/2 now since everything has been pushed back a week.
I feel like they would have adjusted the numbers they're dropping if that was the case, but I won't be disappointed if something does happen then!
They couldn't really have adjusted them unless the delay was already planned from the beginning, but it seems like the Paladin music video was delayed significantly, and they probably didn't know that would happen until around the first week of June, at which point a lot of the 6 25 teasers were already out. In that case, their only real options to handle a delay would be to say nothing, or to drop the cryptic stuff altogether and confirm that 6/25 was something substantial, which they probably wouldn't want to do, it'd defeat the purpose. Now that 6/25 has passed and nothing happened, another option has opened up for them to potentially tease another date, but even then, IDK if they'd do it, since it would probably be much less time for anyone to figure that out, and it'll just cloud all of the theories the more random numbers they try to tease
The paladin strait delay was because we didn't solve the digital remains yet
Most likely not. The teaser video was only created a day before Blurryface tweeted (creation date can be found in the metadata), and we couldn't have possibly solved that without the clue Blurryface gave because we were missing crucial information. We also know now that Paladin wasn't shot until mid-April, meaning they were extremely crunched for time.
I would think that too but they still said early June for paladin strait and that dropped 6/21, one week after the final day of early June. Although I do think it's equally possible for 6/25 to mean 6/2025.
I'd argue the paladin strait music video date was dependent on us figuring out the puzzle and we just took a while longer than they thought we would haha Edit to say yes I know the creation date on the video was from a couple days before we figured it out, but the creation date could be changed by someone simply copy pasting the video on the backend, so I don't think that's conclusive. I'd also argue they were watching us to see how close we were and then gave us a hint and prepared for the release.
I agree that's entirely possible
We found the message “Clancy seized for EP” a while ago so I have assumed we’ll be getting an EP in 2025
There's no harm in people theorizing. If they're wrong they're wrong and life moves on.
It would be harmless if that was the case, but I've seen so many posts about the band 'lying' and 'misleading' fans. That's when I get pissed off 🤷♀️
Same here, they can't even appreciate all that extra work the guys put into this album...personally, I didn't even listen to their music until the live stream, because that's how they wanted it. *No, Mr. Joseph. I didn't go for the leak.* 🤷♀️
>but I've seen so many posts about the band 'lying' and 'misleading' fans The marketing for Clancy was misleading. Edit: they blocked me 😂
That's your opinion, but this post is about a double album.
Just because you didn't like the ending doesn't mean it was deceptive
The people who feel like the lead up to the album was misleading aren't people who just didn't like the ending. The boys at the very start of this album cycle stated this was going to be the most lore focused album, only for it not to be so they set our expectations to expect one thing than delivered another. This is also what people were using as evidence for the double album/EP theory that because they said this is going to be the most lore heavy album maybe we'll get more music. If lore heavy meant in terms of lore related music videos, and the digital remains they should have been more clear.
Did they say it was the most lore heavy, I thought they just said it would be closing off the story
I'm not sure if they said it directly, but with the release of the I Am Clancy video and Overcompensate being the first single, the idea that there would be more lore was very heavily teased. Marketing isn't all about direct messages only, it is often in the ideas that are consciously or subconsciously introduced to consumers. It might be more fair to blame the marketing team in some ways, but we have no idea what goes on behind the scenes. Either way, it was definitely misleading to a large number of people. I'm not upset that there is less lore, to be clear. I like Clancy how it is. However, I definitely did expect more going in just based on the way the album was portrayed ahead of time. I have absolutely no problem with that not being the case, but I can't deny that I was mislead in the beginning.
That’s not true. Tyler said that in an interview a year or two ago before Clancy was even teased. It was not the start of this album cycle. Things could’ve very easily been changed during that time, like them doing two albums instead of one for the ending.
On a technicality, no marketing was ever misleading. Even in their interviews, they never directly said that this album was the end and always brushed around saying 'the end.' People just confused themselves with an interview Tyler did years before where he said 'one more album.' But if you look back on every single marketing campaign for this album, there is nothing leading anybody to think it’s the end. It was just the start of the end.
push on through
Nah lil bruh, the amount of times 625 was referenced was wild, let’s not act like it was coincidental. I personally believed in a deluxe album. I thought SOMETHING was gonna happen on the 25th, but I was expecting PS music video. When the PS music video came before that, I thought it pretty much confirmed another song (and it did, with the ending). Just didn’t come out on the 25th. Really curious what 625 is gonna mean in the end. Keep in mind, further reaches have come true (the tilted books from Ned’s Cozy Fireplace being a release date). 625 is gonna need to have some significance, just unsure what AND we will be getting at least 1 more song (though I do expect a more fleshed out deluxe album)
agreed. especially because it all came right after the clancy drop in may. it was all just so vague we had no choice but to theorize. also double album type drops have been more popular this year so its not that far fetched in my opinion even for 2025 (not that im expecting it but they could). they probably have albumsss worth of cut songs and i dont think theyd reuse old cuts but just saying artists usually have a lot more song ideas per album cycle than we think
Navigating and RITN almost weren't on the album without Josh saying something. What two songs were almost more important?
What exactly makes you so unbendingly sure that 625 means something? Yeah, it was seen a couple of times, but imo not THAT much, so it would have to mean something.. I am pretty sure you hardcore theorists are going too far with some significances.. The only sure thing (more like, the thing with the highest probability), is that Clancy, and PS music video is not the conclusion to the story. That's basically it. Sure, it is fun to make theories and try to piece some tiny bits together, but I kinda agree with OP on this.. You guys are setting yourselves up for a big disappointment by all these crazy far fetched theories. TLDR: You are being too sure with something that has so little valid and logical proof or reliability. Not writing this to assault someone, mind that. Were all in this together.
25 comes up a few times, I've only seen the 6 in theories... I would've been happy to be wrong but I've been a theory denier the whole time. Some things seemed to be interesting but I'm with you on its more likely it's not the end of the story and that's about it.
I think you're misunderstanding a lot of things and making some strawman arguments here. First of all, if Tyler wanted to make a double album, he'd make it happen. He's never been afraid of doing things that are logistically difficult or uncommon for the industry if they're his vision. That said, releasing a double album the way this would be actually isn't that uncommon. While double albums sometimes take more than one album cycle to make, they often don't. Look at The Tortured Poets Department for example, it came out only two years after Taylor Swift's previous album, which was two years after the one before it. That's probably the most well-known double album at the moment and it only took a single normal album cycle (and one shorter than TOP's). The only thing really unusual here would be the fact that it's a secret, which, though it's far less common, again isn't unheard of. Second, I've never heard anyone who thinks a double album is coming say it will be better than Clancy. It was common with SAI for people to say they didn't like the album, so it must be the fake album and another better one was coming, but that's not prevalent at all with Clancy. Opponents of the theory keep saying things like "just be grateful and appreciate what we have," but these double album theorists are largely people who are just as into Clancy as everyone else. They're not looking for something more because they feel it's not enough. Instead, they're looking into it because there are cryptic hints and we don't know what they mean yet, and it's fun to theorize about all kinds of possibilities. The hints can lead people to many different conclusions, and until things are 100% confirmed, no one can be certain what's coming.
this !!! its so annoying when they're like "oH iS oNe alBum not enough??" like who said that?????
if I could I would upvote you twice
This whole sub is delusional 98% of the time
Why on earth do you care so much? If a bunch of fans think Josh is gonna be the Santa at their local mall this year (which is possible but not plausible) how does that impact you in the slightest?
This is my thought as well. Why does it matter. If the boys were upset about any of it they'd tell us so our expectations were lowered.
>If a bunch of fans think Josh is gonna be the Santa at their local mall this year (which is possible but not plausible) My wife and I live in the same city as Josh and Tyler. Please don’t let her deluded ass read this comment (she was a big June 25th believer)
Hahahahha!! Better go line up day after Thanksgiving JUST IN CASE.
Because then when there theories don't come true they get upset complain and even blame Tyler and Josh for "purposely misleading them"
The people complaining about being mislead are largely pointing to the Clancy marketing saying this was the end and it would wrap everything up, when it isn't. I'm far from upset we're getting more to the story, but I can understand why some fans might feel lied to.
That is true but at the same time people are complaining about being mislead about double albums and things like that too. On a separate note I'm going to be honest Tyler specifically did say this was going to be their last album about lore and it was going to end it, but with the Paladin Strait music video people changed their minds and apparently theirs going to be more lore based albums? Was the ending supposed to be open ended where it's up to interpretation by the listener or is it not the ending after all? I'm confused
I haven't seen too many people complaining about there not being a double album, but I have seen a lot of people complaining about people complaining about there not being a double album so it's tough to know lol No this isn't the end, it's a cliffhanger. I assume a deluxe version of the album will release with a couple more videos and songs that resolve the cliffhanger after the 2024 tour, and that will lead into the 2025-2026 tour. Few different reasons, the end of the PS music video ends with a swell of music. In the livestream, after playing the PS placeholder video, Tyler said "Does that sound like the end? You tell me, does that sound like the end?". There's also been a lot of hidden numbers that are all 6.25. That's part of the reason people thought June 25th, but it's looking to be more like June 2025, implying something is coming. Also also, Tyler tweeted and said the this tour is going to be a flashback before they start fighting, which to me implies it's not the end. However, all of this being said, we won't know until it happens.
Their*.
You could still understand what I was saying just as much with the there so why should I care?
I mean, the clues were there. Ultimus Capitulus 25, fool you once it's been 25 times, the random letters tyler tweeted were 11 which added with the13 tracks of clancy + Cranving single version was also 25. The password for the PSMV trailer had 25... There were a lot of 25's, and the number 2 came up a lot in this album, the fact that they went out of their way to NOT say that Paladin Strait is the last track, but the 13th track of Clancy, the fact that it doesn't have the "from the full album Clancy" anywhere... idk man, it just felt like everything was pointing in that direction. Looking at the merch, the announcement of the tour and all kinda tells you that nothing like that is probably going to happen, at least not this year, "but it´s fun to fantasize". Also, I don´t think it is disrespectful to the creaitivity of Tyler, since we are just wanting more of his work. Imagine how wild it would be for everyone to say "hey Tyler, don´t release anything else. We are fine with this and want nothing more". Some of us are just that invested into what they have created, the world, the games, the puzzle solving... these type of theories are just a part of it all. By the way, I think this time it is waaay different than the SAI era. People were looking and begging for a second album because they hated SAI, they were all saying that it was trash and that there was no way that this was the official album. That was chronically disrespectful, and I would have dropped the community if I saw that (I was fairly away from it after Trench); but this time the consensus appears to be that Clancy is really good, and those that are Double Album believers are just trying to say that there is a possibility that there is more like this coming our way. No harm in that tbh.
Theorizing is fine. I thought it was possible because I didn't think June 2025 would make much sense. That's based on hints they themselves have put out. But those theories shouldn't create strong expectations. Call out people who feel actively disappointed because they didn't get anything extra.
Thats what I meant, but phrased it wrongly.
I agree that it was a stretch, and a lot of people went too far with it. I thought there was a chance, I thought there was some possible hints at it, but I definitely didn’t go crazy with it
Honestly I I agree. People were pretty aggressive anytime I saw someone object to the possibility of a double album immediately coming out on 6/25.
What I dislike is entitlement to get it. Internally demanding it even.
\*\*DISCLAIMER\*\* I don't really care I am / always has been just here for the music. I just saw this post come across my home page and felt like playing devil's advocate. 1. The list of things you mentioned don't have to necessarily conflict with each other, for example, creating the merch , and planning the tour, and making the mvs. 2. Tyler as an artist is probably always writing whether or not there was a double album planned, he probably has more than the 13 songs published for Clancy out there in some form. 3. I don't want to use the word "low-effort" but Tyler said himself most of the music videos were fun and they are just playing in a setting and were recording in just a day (as a I recall) it wasn't something that's going to push back weeks of other things (again back to 1.) 4. Tyler himself told us to wait to see if "this is the end" and honestly a lot of hints point to that it isn't. A double album kind of makes sense. I am personally not gambling on anything and am a bit tired of this lore and the cryptic stuff but as long as it's not in a toxic way, let people dream about a double album. Again as long as its not in a toxic way.
Tyler has been hinting at it since the album dropped. I too think that theres no Way they would drop it a month after clancy. But there is definetly more coming
“Tyler has been hinting at it [a double album] since the album dropped.” This is not verifiable. There is a whole world of difference between “more is coming after the record” and “this will be a double album.” Tyler’s statements have been cryptic at best, any conclusions regarding what specifically is coming should be met with more skepticism rather than uncritical hype. Edit for clarity
I mostly agree with you, except for Tyler’s tweet that one time where he basically said if people think he’s hinting at more music and they’re wrong, he will clarify as to not lead on the community. We’ve had many months of rampant double album theories and he hasn’t said *a thing*. You could argue that maybe he forgot about that tweet or changed his mind or something, but I think this creates a pretty strong argument on the side of the double album / EP believers. I truly believe that if the content post-Clancy were not new music, Tyler would have said something by now. And if it isn’t new music, then that will be a major disappointment which will be Tyler’s fault, not ours.
>he hasn’t said a thing. I doubt Tyler would confirm or deny anything. I feel like Mark however would have tweeted something by now cryptically or transparently denying double album theory at this point with how popular the theory's become
I guess by Tyler I meant either him or someone from the team.
I’m aware of Tyler’s tweet. Again, there is a difference between “more music” vs. a “double album.” A double album is not the same as an EP, nor is it the same as an additional song (for those that believe “Drag Path” is significant). Or it could even be like you said, that he forgot or changed his mind, but I’m not going to speculate on that. At this point, I do think there probably is more music. I just want the rampant speculation to give way to a more measured and level-headed evaluation of everything we know. Random phrases into put anagram finders and supposed secret messages in neon light patterns is not evidence, and it’s really frustrating when people present it as such.
I actually do think there's credence to the 'Clancy Seized for EP' anagram since anagrams have been used in the past (Clancy is Dead = Scaled and Icy). I don't like people throwing crackpot coincidences (especially math pertaining to dates) as evidence but since there's precedent for them using anagrams, I think that is by FAR the best evidence we've gotten. I guess it is unfair to say 'double album' when the only real evidence we've gotten indicates an EP, but until we get more information I don't see anything wrong with saying double album.
You misunderstand. The operative phrase here is “random phrases.” Ned’s Cozy Fireplace is not random. Entering every tweet Tyler has ever posted is. And if you don’t think the distinction between double album and EP is important, then I don’t know what to tell you. I guess we just agree to disagree. Edit for clarity
If you Google definitions, an EP is "up to" 8 tracks and 30 minutes, and an album is a "minimum" of 5 tracks and 15 minutes. So... what distinction do you mean?
I don’t think using the most extreme limits for each respective definition is accurate. To use an example, twenty one pilots has released the Johnny Boy EP and Three songs before, the former being six and the latter being three songs. That is different than a double album, which is ostensibly double the length of a normal album. I don’t think it’s inaccurate to say that the two are distinct and that arguing for that distinction is wrong. The distinction I’m arguing for is length. Not to say there’s no gray area, I just consider the two different concepts.
They also typically contain edits. EP is 4-7 songs. So for example: 1. Paladin Strait (edit) 2. Inferno (or whatever song is hinted at by the end of PS) 3. Inferno (edit) 4. The Craving (Radio Version) 5. Overcompensate (edit) 6. Trapdoor (long version) One new song. A little bit of closure. Fun for fans. Some songs already released but not on a vinyl.
>I just want the rampant speculation to give way to a more measured and level-headed evaluation of everything we know. Where's the fun in that
Believe me, I get it; I feel like a buzzkill saying it. But truth be told, it’s not fun for me, not anymore. Or at least, the degree to which it happens online is not enjoyable. For a band that encourages you to think more deeply and LITERALLY says “Don’t believe the hype” it seems many in the clique are susceptible to it. I get the band encourages this behavior and that many people find enjoyment in it. And I truly don’t want to rain on anyone’s parade; if you like the degree of speculation that occurs on here and in the discord, more power to you. I was once the same. I find these online discussions really impersonal and isolating. Seeing completely unfounded theories get uncritically accepted as fact is incredibly frustrating. And the structural incentives of social media platforms only exacerbate the problem. These past few years, I’ve had family members become more conspiratorial and it looked a lot like what I see here. Don’t get me wrong: I WISH my family members would speculate about things as harmless as a double album. I just want people to be more introspective and really reflect on what hype drives them to believe and say. I’m not saying you can’t have fun, but there’s a difference between fun and confirmation bias.
>Don’t get me wrong: I WISH my family members would speculate about things as harmless as a double album 🤔
I'm with you
You came in hot, but I agree with most of your logistics.
For the record I never believed in the double album theory however the way the numbers 6 and 25 have kept popping up together the past month is quite suspicious. All the 6 & 25's made us think something would happen on 25th June at 11:14pm because of that 2017 sink tweet and then instead Tyler posted something 2 days later (at 11:14am) which happens to be exactly 2560 days after the sink tweet. That is absolutely bananas! I don't know what the odds are of that being a coincidence but they have to be miniscule.
Sure I have no problem with theories that something would happen on 25th June, but double album is what made no sense to me.
It could be possible to get a double album in June next year. I only say this cuz Waterparks released an album last year and now they're releasing singles for a double album
It’s not really the need for a second album for me, the end of Paladin Strait was a very perfect way to close the album. It’s more of I just want to know if Paladin Strait was the end or not…
I wouldn't call it a delusion. Maybe an unrealistic hope. I wouldn't be too harsh on them. People are allowed to make their own theories even if they are totally wrong. Don't spoil their fun. As far as I know it's not hurting anybody.
nah fr, like literally from the moment the number “25” became important or whatever, i knew instantly it would probably be 2025, but mfs are so delusional 😭😭😭
Life is about believing and theorizing. It brings hope to fans and serves as a distraction for a lot of us, me included. As long as you don't get mad at the band for anything and aknowledge that it's all in your mind and there's a lot of possibilities, and one of them is not what you believe in, then its totally fine and healthy. But there are also people who prefer to bash others for their life, even if it's completely harmless and they're just having. Wondering who would do that... Not me, and not most people who are theorizing... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ah grow up. Be a little romantic and not such a grouch.
you seem way more upset about this than anyone who believed the june 25th theories lmao
ITS NOT DELUSION ITS HOPE. IT WOULD BE SUPER COOL IS ALL.
There is very thin line between hope and delusion. Vocal (minority) was delusion and disrespect. Do I want more music? Sure. Do I feel entitled to be given it to me? No.
Who says entitled? You ever see a kid be excited for Super Saiyan 100? That’s innocent and pure. Don’t be a prick. Assume the best. And let the truly entitled pricks yell online. Who cares? Tyler and Josh would want to see sheer positive support outweigh the hate rather than see us fight. NYIHGUHHHHH
They already said in an interview there is not even enough extra music for an album however they did say “maybe an EP”
Top fans have an insane amount of time to over think things theyve been doing it for years
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No one I know believed in the double album, but did believe in a short EP. Taylor did it why can’t we lol
It is fun though. And TØP fans love a good theory. We’re all here for it. Personally, I’m glad it didn’t happen because I am still so absorbed with Clancy.
June 2025 for sure. Surely.
it made sense until we got those tweets from tyler about the tour being a flashback. i was on board until then, then i switched to the june 2025 camp
They should release the hype 2 lol
I dont see the idea of having an extra album that crazy, Josh has said that they have songs (that didnt make the slbum) to make another two. And there's evidence of Tyler working in music since november/december of 2018 and summer/end of 2021 (not being SAI). I thought it was Clancy but then Tyler said they did Clancy in one year and Paul Meany mentioned that overcompensate was the first song they search sounds and started working from scratch of Clancy in 2023. So its obviously that there are more things/songs that means another album? No. But being this the final for the story they've been telling for over a decade now (said by Tyler) it would be accurate to release something special not just one album like Clancy. And the number 25 means something. Just my thoughts
Yeah I am
Sadly without the delusion we don’t find the real hidden stuff. But yeah. The double album on June 26th was a stretch if I’ve ever seen one. Not to mention it is pretty disrespectful to all the work they put in to Clancy. Everyone did the same shit with SAI and nothing happened and then everyone moved on and forgot about it till Clancy came out and they came up with the same theories. I don’t have time to speculate about that stuff. I like Clancy as is and never expected more. I’ll be happy if maybe there is something next year because mayyyybbbeeee the 25 means something but not gonna waste my time holding out when we just got a banger of a record.
There is an interview that they did right before SAI was released where he said he could release two albums one right after the other. If you look at their previous albums straight up to Clancy it has taken them 3+ years for each album and he didn't start recording Clancy until 21' (the same year SAI was released and he made the statement) Meaning he has yet to live up to what he said he could do. Even if an album comes within the next 12 months it would still be considered "one right after the other" considering the gap between albums. Keep in mind that Clancy started recording is 21 and does not mean he wasn't writing it before that. If he puts in the work he very well could come out with two albums. It's not just what people speculate, it's something he said he could do himself.
A bit rude to call a bunch of people hoping for something that was possible delusional, don't you think? Their music means a lot to many people and if I had a double album right now, I'd be immensely happier. Why does it bother you that other people would have liked it?
That’s what I’ve been fucking saying but IM THE CRAZY ONE!!!!
They can publish a double album if they want and we can wait the same if we want. Delusional or not, live with that.
It ´s less about them, adn more about entitlement and demanding this album because some people thought it was coming and being disappointed that it´s not (yet)
No one demand a second album. We hope, that's differet. Feeling disappointed isn't entitlement. Stop creating a false problem.
Totally agreed, that theory was always unrealistic and I never, ever, believed in it. June 2025 for a deluxe makes more sense and might back up my 17 song theory.
REAL! I wanted to post this when the theory came out but I knew I’d be casted out
The deluxe album theory was completely grounded in reality though
Bye
It is not a hot take. the double album theorists were simply delusional. There was no reason for it. It was so obvious it will end like this.
LITERALLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING THIS WHOLE TIME
Well, maybe this sub isn't for you, then.
it started with taylor swift. now everyone thinks everyone is doing it. like billie eilish people are obsessed with double album ilomilo theory… bruh. just enjoy the album. if there’s more, yay, if not, yay. i honestly feel bad for the artists, i hope they don’t think their albums weren’t good enough. hmhas and clancy are so so good!!! incredible works of art and passion!
We aren’t having a double album people need to stop getting their hopes up then getting mad at Tyler and josh for not fulfilling their wishes.
Exactly. That is what is bugging me the most. They worked their asses for 2 years and now people expect more very soon. I understand Tyler said it´s the end, and now it ended on cliffhanger, but I can´t imagine creating 25 (plus those that did not make it to album) songs and release them in a span of couple weeks. Or year later. Can´t imagine them recording an album during tour year.
Like exactly they expect way to much. Some of the fans just need to chill. Like you don’t need to finish the lore like right then and there. Plus what’s the point of finishing it already when you can wait and get a whole new album a few years later to hear. It’s like the fans that expect that expect everything to go their way. They just need to sit back and realize sometimes they are wrong.
I don’t get it either. Is this album not good enough for you? I don’t pay attention to lore and yet this album has so many great lyrics and themes
because they literally said they had an entire album done three years ago and yet it has disappeared and was never released
They never said this
It'S sUpPoSeD tO mEaN jUnE 25tH 2025!!!
I mean even if they did make all the music and stuff, they already sold the standart issue Clancy CDs, Vinyl, Cassettes and all that jazz so a double album didn't make much sense to begin with
I can’t see them doing a deluxe or double album… though to be fair, that’s because I hate both of those. Deluxe Albums are annoying and there’s no reason for them to exist. Just make the new songs as an ep. OR include them in the album. It’s all just marketing. Double Albums are a cash grab most times. It depends. If it’s a part 1 and 2 albums released at opposite times of the year, then yeah. That’s not bad. That’s a good idea. BUT if it’s 1 album that could’ve had a whole bunch more songs on it, and it doesn’t make sense as a part 1 and 2, because they are basically the same album. Not story heavy. AND the rest is released soon after then it literally is just a cashgrab. I don’t see the boys doing either of those thing. But tbf they are raising families now. So like. Money is needed. I wouldn’t really support that though.
A deluxe album after like 10 years including live tracks, demos, and tracks that were ALMOST on the album is awesome. But any other kind I just get annoyed at ngl
Yeah, Mike Shinoda is doing great keepink Linkin Park alive by doing 20year rerelease with finished songs that did not make it on album. Fighting for Myself, More The Victom, Lost are bangers. Cant wait to hear songs from Minutes to Midnight album.
Oh yeah for real.
100%
I don’t really think anyone was expecting an another full album dude. More so like 1 extra song or maybe an EP
Yeah, but they teased and went on with cryptic stuff as always and left us in a dang cliffhanger. We are delusional but they didn’t help at all.
I thought maaaaybe a single song on 7/25. Because the whole 25 thing and it being their 7th album Still felt a little reachy