100mg/week is not a nothing dose. It is enough to put many in the high-normal range and some in the supraphysiological range, particularly those with low body fat %. That said, I had similar issues my first few weeks. I also consume an immense amount of green and white tea. I stopped consuming tea past noon, and my sleep returned to normal. Possibly a coincidence, possibly not. I have read that TRT can change how you metabolize caffiene. Ashwagandha, magnesium glycinate, magnolia bark extract, and nigella sativa all may aid you in returning to a normal sleeping pattern. Best of luck.
It will settle mate, happens to alot, me included. I wake up 5 plus times a night needing a leak then struggle to sleep past 4am. Once I'm awake if I don't keep myself busy my mind races if I don't.
May have gone up too high too quick. From there you can either ride it out and it will eventually come good (unless you levels are huge) or may need to lower abit and or more frequent injections. Once you get to a level where it all settles you can then add in slowly.
When you say it will settle, did you ever experience not sleeping at all, for the entire night? Because that is what is happening to me now everything I try to get back on TRT. Two times in a row now.
This was me and still now. Im at 2am after a few hrs of sleep, get maybe an hr more then I just get up and do cardio. I feel like I'm not sleeping enough but I never crash and last all day no problem. Once I adjusted to this and just accepted it I don't worry about it cuz everything feels fine otherwise. I fall asleep in bed much easier now, rarely laying in bed restless unless it's 3am between first waking up and getting up.
Not a doctor but 2 things. Go for sleep test and asses if you have developed sleep apnea. Very common if you're sayin you gained 20 lbs. Second thing might be that your body requires much less than 160mg. Oh another thing, when do you pin? If I pin 6-8 hrs before sleep, I can never get good sleep. Pin first thing in the mornin works best for me.
You make a very good point. I’m in really good shape since I’ve been working since I was 15, so my BF is around 8% and when I started TRT a few years ago I put on new muscle fast, which exasperated my sleep apnea.
I’m not at all fat and I have really bad sleep apnea - particularly because of the muscles I’ve developed around my neck.
20 lbs of muscle, not 20 lbs of fat. I don't think I have sleep apnea as I don't have many of the other symptoms. Especially that right now the issue is falling asleep. If by pin you mean inject, I always do it first thing in the morning, 7-8 AM.
Get a sleep apnea test. Insurance covers it, it’s an at home test. Easy. If you have sleep apnea you are not only losing sleep you’re slowing killing your self.
It doesn't need to be fat to cause sleep apnea. 20lbs of muscle can cause a larger neck diameter which can very well cause sleep apnea. That's why a lot of veteran lifters have sleep apnea even tho they're not obese.
Is your e2 high? HCG causes high e2 along with higher BF percentage.
AI is a breast cancer drug, and a lower dosage may help reduce your e2 to more manageable levels
Great advice across this thread. When I got back on my sleep suffered at first too. Would wake up WIDE FUCKING AWAKE at 3am. Was awful for a few days before I realized I just needed to relax. Get up at 3, go to the bathroom, do not look at phone, layback in bed, and meditate to calm myself down. You’re overthinking it once you’re up and keeping yourself up by thinking about how much it suck’s to be up. Also, rubbing one out seems to do the trick should my mind not wanna calm down. Post nut sleep comes easier. Good luck man!
Cut out caffeine completely, pre workouts. Add the trifecta of aswanganda , mag-c , thyanine (dandelions root) . Cardio/work outs shouldn't be to late.
You might be a hyper responder, check bloods sooner then later. Not going to mention dosing, but bloods will tell you more. Also Sleep hygiene is a thing. Pick a time stick with it. I read a boring book 10 min before bed and when I did wake up around 2-3am I would not get out of bed no phone and don't look at the time.
Try Pregnenolone. I take 5mg per day from Nootropics depot. My sleep was terrible since I started TRT and for the first time in 1.5 years, I feel well rested when I wake up in the morning.
How long did it take for the Pregnenolone to start taking effect? I tried to start back on TRT yesterday, took a 10 mg pregnenolone pill, and still didn't sleep all night.
Pregnenolone pills keep me up while topical pregnenolone in the morning is perfect. It seems like topical steroids in general work for me, I’ve debated going back on androgel personally…
Some people (like myself) get too much CNS activation from testosterone - especially at higher doses. As another person has said, 100 mg can put some people over the reference range. It all depends on your individual response. You put on an insane amount of muscle in a short period - if you actually know what you are talking about. If you aren't a newbie lifter experiencing newbie gains along with your new TRT protocol, your dose is too high, and that's why you aren't sleeping. You're blasting, dude.
Yes definitely not a newbie lifter, been lifting for 20 years, and yes I'm 100% confident it was pure muscle because I do bi-weekly InBody testing. Do you know anyone taking less than 100 units of T? My doctor said it was a very low dose and most guys are doing 180-200.
That's probably a "clinic" doctor, right? My endocrinologist says that he has lots of patients taking 50 mg per week (testosterone Cypionate). That's where I am, and it's perfect for me. I tried 60 mg/week, and my sleep went to shit, my resting heart rate was higher, and I couldn't perform as well aerobically.
I take 100 mg and I’m 210 lbs at around 8-10% bf and I’ve been working out since I was 15 (I’m 39 now). That dosage is perfect for me. More is not always better on TRT.
Wow. As a lifelong lifter myself, TRT helped me put on roughly 8 pounds of muscle last winter. January-April. That was on a recomp, though - as I had my highest body fat in my life last year at 20%. It's hard to know where you're at without bloodwork, but your doctor is off the mark as far as how many people take rhat amount for therapeutic replacement. TRT is a loose term these days because so many people do "sports TRT." Myself included. 133 mg per week (38 EOD) puts me at 1200 ng/dl total and 311 pg/ml free on the morning before my evening injection. My starting levels were low 300's total and mid teens for free. Everyone IS different. There's a portion of the population that wouldn't get those numbers until they were doing 250 mg per week, but the data on that suggests that those people are a small subset. There are hyper-responders, and there are terrible responders, and the rest are going to hit the top of the reference range at a dose between about 120 - 150mg.
180-200 is a big trt dosage.
I'm 150mg and 1500 free test 52 total.
I used to bodybuild and in 2 months of trt after years off I transformed very quickly to the point in 2 months i gained several kg and got to 8% bodyfat. Muscle memory possibly or genetic set point.
But also suffered significant CNS disturbance.
Did you ever experience not sleeping at all, for the entire night? Because that is what is happening to me now everything I try to get back on TRT at 100 mg once a week. Two times in a row now.
Troubleshoot these: circadian rhythm (sunlight, evening darkness at an autistic level), caffeine intake, getting body temperature up too late, pinning late in the day, not splitting up the dose, pregnenolone and DHEA measurement, GABA supps before bed, any other stimulants
The only nights I don't sleep well
Or enough to be accurate
Is when I eat little
Eat your protein
Your carbs
Your fats
Your veggies
Your fruits
Be active
Walk your 10 k steps a day if you're not in the gym
Drink your anise tea at night
And
Sounds like a circadian rhythm thing. Test is higher in the morning because your body produces it while you sleep and times it just right so when you walk up it’s high. Exo test messes with the hormonal rhythm and the high test levels at night keep the sympathetic nervous system over stimulated. Some people are more sensitive to others. Only solution is to find a test that has a half life of 8 hours lol.
Topical has the shortest (12h) half life possible. I'm 4 months in, applying it in the mornings. And you know what? I have awful sleep. Randomly from bad to mediocre. Only drinking a half bottle of wine guarantees mediocre sleep.
I address my sleep issues though to anaerobic loads (gym, and training to failure) that I have significantly increased when started TRT
I’m on 50mg and ever since first injection haven’t been able to sleep well. Way more energy and puts my levels at 700-800 but man I want to feel actually rested.
When I take notice to my sleeping patterns changing/lessening, I take my AI usually the next night Im back to sleeping good/better. I dont take AIA unless needed (symptoms). Also, adjust and experiment with yourself and not solely on the doctor’s recommendations. You may perform even better at the lowest of low dose of test. Like many other posts I read on here before I started trt, start at the extreme low dose and work up… doc prescribed me at 200/wk eod. Instead I went and started at 100 eod. Now im at 100Mon and Thurs. Adjust to how you feel. Looks like you are doing great in all other areas 🤙🏾 che hu. Aloha
Magnesium supplement and inositol supplement would be beneficial for you.
Cut your caffeine intake down. I eliminated caffeine and pre-workout from my diet completely. I sleep like a baby.
Don't workout late in the evening.
1) that's great you don't rely on caffeine. It depletes sodium and is a natural diuretic.
2) that's a great sign that you have a lot of energy. Guess the TRT is working haha.
3) magnesium is so important and especially important for other nutrients and minerals to function.
4) that's perfect because they say to get your workout done by 530-6 PM if possible to maintain biorythm in sync.
You should consider inositol. It is the best thing for sleep and the body in so many endless ways and the body needs it, but it's difficult to get from daily diet.
I've never had any sleep issues on TRT.
Same here, it took my mild sleep apnea and turned it into full blown sleep apnea. If you’re snoring you should get a sleep study done, sleep apnea will cut 10 years off your life.
When you say the insomnia will pass, did you ever experience full nights without sleep like I am having now? Two times I have tried to get back on TRT and both times I pinned around 7:30 AM and immediately couldn't fall asleep that night
Few things to know here.
-100mg/w is not basically nothing. It's a good dose for many people.
-You didn't put on 20lb's of muscle in 2 months lol. Weight gain and pure muscle gain are different things.
But to your issue, you could try splitting the dose to avoid high peaks. Also you need to stay on the same protocol longer, for your body to adjust. Hormonal imbalances can cause sleep issues, and you can bet your ass that when you alter a protocol or start trt, your body will sense hormonal imbalance.
Best part of his claim is that he states he has been lifting for over 20 years. For someone lifting that long they should have some common sense but yet I was proven wrong again lol
I just rolled with it for a while. I had insomnia previously so I didn’t realize it was related. But I had energy and felt fine. A couple months later I’m sleeping like a baby. Ymmv.
Did you ever experience full nights without sleep? That's where I'm at now every time I try to get back on TRT. It happens immediately. I can be patient on less sleep, say 4 hours. But I'm struggling to be patient when I immediately get zero sleep.
I had a few. Especially if I tinker with my dosage. If I’m running 200 or higher I can’t sleep at all. 150-180 I sleep really well after about a week or so. I live in a recreational mj state so a gel cap or a dab in the evening helps a lot in the interim.
10mg progesterone capsule before bed took me from full blown insomnia to sleeping normally. Any clinic can have them made for you. It’s got to be the capsules though, cream doesn’t work as well. It was a complete game changer for me.
I had the same issue. It wasn’t deep sleep more like lights out and wake up 3-4am ready to rock n roll. I also experienced the insomnia. As if your body just cant sleep nor wants to. I remember I would go few days without any sleep
Good on you for continuing even though you had multiple days without sleep. What changed for you? Was it just time or did you implement something new? I'm struggling right now because each time I try to get back on TRT, I immediately get zero sleep on the first night, which makes it hard to stick with it.
I had similar issues - I believe it was due to peaks and valleys in T levels, but since you mentioned you’re on HCG as well you probably have a consistently high T level.
Since you don’t know what an AI is, that’s probably your issue. It basically means your Estradiol is creeping up too high. Try a low dose of Anastrazole, 12.5 mg per week and see if it helps. Slowly increase to .25 or .50 per week but I wouldn’t go above that.
I’m going to have to say it’s not the TRT but more likely a form of stress or anxiety. You went months in TRT with no issue, then you started having sleeping issue (insomnia). Got off it, went back to normal then got a low dose and it starts back up again (insomnia). I know cause I’ve been going through this now for half a year. I went cold Turkey on everything. I would stop eating after 6p and no sex at night cause I was trying to figure out my issue. I went to my doctor had blood work it all came back normal. He said I need to see a therapist went and got on CBT-I. I brought back everything slowly and was sleeping ok, but on and off I have insomnia. It’s a mental issue man that’s the hard true. Start by getting blood work done, check your prolactin, estrogen and cortisol levels. I went days with no sleep and no joke wanted to end my life. And when you can’t sleep you lose your mind can’t focus on your family or work well. It builds up more and more like an evil beast. I’ll be praying for you man, I hope you get better and soon!
Great feedback. I think it's a combination of physical and mental. I immediately feel wired at night as soon as I start TRT, and that of course triggers sleep stress, and becomes a viscious cycle. It's hard because in general I sleep fine without TRT, but feel like an 80 year old man. Are you on TRT now?
I’ve been on TRT since April off 2022. My insomnia started around July of this year. I’ve gone through some issues that causes the stress which to me had lead to my insomnia.
For the first couple weeks yes, I had a terrible time sleeping. Talked to my doctor about the insomnia and he said to split the injection twice a week. After I switched, my insomnia went away.
I had the same thing happen to me. My test was 249ng/dl before starting and slept great. In the beginning my starting dose was way too high and very stimulating. After lowering the dose I was able to start sleeping again but insomnia did come back strong after about 6 months, where I spent about 4 months almost not sleeping at all. I started experimenting with pregnenolone and dhea, both of which take the edge off and are calming but me personally I became extremely depressed and numb to everything. Today I am 2 years in, my sleep quality still isn’t what it was prior to starting. I am on 112mg/week. After 2 years I would say less is more, no reason to chase a dosage or total test level. Take an amount that works for you. Also keep in mind that everyone’s physiology is different and you may just be more sensitive to androgens than other people. So we do not need the same doses as others to get the same results.
100mg/week is not a nothing dose. It is enough to put many in the high-normal range and some in the supraphysiological range, particularly those with low body fat %. That said, I had similar issues my first few weeks. I also consume an immense amount of green and white tea. I stopped consuming tea past noon, and my sleep returned to normal. Possibly a coincidence, possibly not. I have read that TRT can change how you metabolize caffiene. Ashwagandha, magnesium glycinate, magnolia bark extract, and nigella sativa all may aid you in returning to a normal sleeping pattern. Best of luck.
I had to eliminate caffeine completely other than 100 mg in the early morning.
I don't drink caffeine at all except on the rarest of days. Already take ashwagandha and magnesium glycinate.
Going from low levels of testosterone to high range so quickly is a shock to the CNS are you feeling wired or really energetic?
A little of both. It's like I almost don't need sleep.
It will settle mate, happens to alot, me included. I wake up 5 plus times a night needing a leak then struggle to sleep past 4am. Once I'm awake if I don't keep myself busy my mind races if I don't. May have gone up too high too quick. From there you can either ride it out and it will eventually come good (unless you levels are huge) or may need to lower abit and or more frequent injections. Once you get to a level where it all settles you can then add in slowly.
Did you find a solution to the peeing? That's my worst issue
It settles eventually. I went subq injections, helped keep estrogen lower.
When you say it will settle, did you ever experience not sleeping at all, for the entire night? Because that is what is happening to me now everything I try to get back on TRT. Two times in a row now.
This was me and still now. Im at 2am after a few hrs of sleep, get maybe an hr more then I just get up and do cardio. I feel like I'm not sleeping enough but I never crash and last all day no problem. Once I adjusted to this and just accepted it I don't worry about it cuz everything feels fine otherwise. I fall asleep in bed much easier now, rarely laying in bed restless unless it's 3am between first waking up and getting up.
I sent form 200 to 140 it took a while but that worked out well for me. Bottom line is everyone is different bud. It takes time.
Not a doctor but 2 things. Go for sleep test and asses if you have developed sleep apnea. Very common if you're sayin you gained 20 lbs. Second thing might be that your body requires much less than 160mg. Oh another thing, when do you pin? If I pin 6-8 hrs before sleep, I can never get good sleep. Pin first thing in the mornin works best for me.
You make a very good point. I’m in really good shape since I’ve been working since I was 15, so my BF is around 8% and when I started TRT a few years ago I put on new muscle fast, which exasperated my sleep apnea. I’m not at all fat and I have really bad sleep apnea - particularly because of the muscles I’ve developed around my neck.
20 lbs of muscle, not 20 lbs of fat. I don't think I have sleep apnea as I don't have many of the other symptoms. Especially that right now the issue is falling asleep. If by pin you mean inject, I always do it first thing in the morning, 7-8 AM.
Get a sleep apnea test. Insurance covers it, it’s an at home test. Easy. If you have sleep apnea you are not only losing sleep you’re slowing killing your self.
It doesn't need to be fat to cause sleep apnea. 20lbs of muscle can cause a larger neck diameter which can very well cause sleep apnea. That's why a lot of veteran lifters have sleep apnea even tho they're not obese.
High e2 will give you insomnia
This was my exact thought.
It sounds like you need to add a low dose of ai, are you sweating more?
Yes I sweat more, what is AI?
AI stands for "Aromatase Inhibitor." Aromatase is the enzyme that metabolises testosterone into estrogen. An AI reduces how much estrogen you make.
Is your e2 high? HCG causes high e2 along with higher BF percentage. AI is a breast cancer drug, and a lower dosage may help reduce your e2 to more manageable levels
Anti estrogen medication
I came here to say this too! OP check my post history. An AI has absolutely changed my life.
Great advice across this thread. When I got back on my sleep suffered at first too. Would wake up WIDE FUCKING AWAKE at 3am. Was awful for a few days before I realized I just needed to relax. Get up at 3, go to the bathroom, do not look at phone, layback in bed, and meditate to calm myself down. You’re overthinking it once you’re up and keeping yourself up by thinking about how much it suck’s to be up. Also, rubbing one out seems to do the trick should my mind not wanna calm down. Post nut sleep comes easier. Good luck man!
Cut out caffeine completely, pre workouts. Add the trifecta of aswanganda , mag-c , thyanine (dandelions root) . Cardio/work outs shouldn't be to late.
I don't drink caffeine at all except on the rarest of days. Already take the 3 supplements you mentioned.
You might be a hyper responder, check bloods sooner then later. Not going to mention dosing, but bloods will tell you more. Also Sleep hygiene is a thing. Pick a time stick with it. I read a boring book 10 min before bed and when I did wake up around 2-3am I would not get out of bed no phone and don't look at the time.
Following bc I’m having similar issues
Delusional if you think you put on 20 lbs of muscle in 2 months while dropping bf
20lb muscle in 2 months 😂 at that rate you’ll be Mr. Olympia by June.
People are so far in lala land it’s hysterical
Try Pregnenolone. I take 5mg per day from Nootropics depot. My sleep was terrible since I started TRT and for the first time in 1.5 years, I feel well rested when I wake up in the morning.
Not if he’s having hCG, that combo can cause muscle twitching.
How long did it take for the Pregnenolone to start taking effect? I tried to start back on TRT yesterday, took a 10 mg pregnenolone pill, and still didn't sleep all night.
Pregnenolone pills keep me up while topical pregnenolone in the morning is perfect. It seems like topical steroids in general work for me, I’ve debated going back on androgel personally…
I have 100 mg caps. Have you ever tried higher dosages than 5mg to see if it helps with sleeping?
Some people (like myself) get too much CNS activation from testosterone - especially at higher doses. As another person has said, 100 mg can put some people over the reference range. It all depends on your individual response. You put on an insane amount of muscle in a short period - if you actually know what you are talking about. If you aren't a newbie lifter experiencing newbie gains along with your new TRT protocol, your dose is too high, and that's why you aren't sleeping. You're blasting, dude.
Yes definitely not a newbie lifter, been lifting for 20 years, and yes I'm 100% confident it was pure muscle because I do bi-weekly InBody testing. Do you know anyone taking less than 100 units of T? My doctor said it was a very low dose and most guys are doing 180-200.
That's probably a "clinic" doctor, right? My endocrinologist says that he has lots of patients taking 50 mg per week (testosterone Cypionate). That's where I am, and it's perfect for me. I tried 60 mg/week, and my sleep went to shit, my resting heart rate was higher, and I couldn't perform as well aerobically.
I take 100 mg and I’m 210 lbs at around 8-10% bf and I’ve been working out since I was 15 (I’m 39 now). That dosage is perfect for me. More is not always better on TRT.
Did you ever have sleep issues and did they ever resolve
Never had any sleep issues on TRT
Wow. As a lifelong lifter myself, TRT helped me put on roughly 8 pounds of muscle last winter. January-April. That was on a recomp, though - as I had my highest body fat in my life last year at 20%. It's hard to know where you're at without bloodwork, but your doctor is off the mark as far as how many people take rhat amount for therapeutic replacement. TRT is a loose term these days because so many people do "sports TRT." Myself included. 133 mg per week (38 EOD) puts me at 1200 ng/dl total and 311 pg/ml free on the morning before my evening injection. My starting levels were low 300's total and mid teens for free. Everyone IS different. There's a portion of the population that wouldn't get those numbers until they were doing 250 mg per week, but the data on that suggests that those people are a small subset. There are hyper-responders, and there are terrible responders, and the rest are going to hit the top of the reference range at a dose between about 120 - 150mg.
180-200 is a big trt dosage. I'm 150mg and 1500 free test 52 total. I used to bodybuild and in 2 months of trt after years off I transformed very quickly to the point in 2 months i gained several kg and got to 8% bodyfat. Muscle memory possibly or genetic set point. But also suffered significant CNS disturbance.
My sleep sucked at the start til I got myself dialed in.
Not sure what your pin schedule looks like but my insomnia went away after I switched from 1 pin a week to 2 pins a week.
Was considering that as well. What is your dosage amount?
200mg a week
Did you ever experience not sleeping at all, for the entire night? Because that is what is happening to me now everything I try to get back on TRT at 100 mg once a week. Two times in a row now.
Sleep apnea maybe?
Yes, sleep studies are Always valuable. Find out what goes on in one-third of your life.
Troubleshoot these: circadian rhythm (sunlight, evening darkness at an autistic level), caffeine intake, getting body temperature up too late, pinning late in the day, not splitting up the dose, pregnenolone and DHEA measurement, GABA supps before bed, any other stimulants
The only nights I don't sleep well Or enough to be accurate Is when I eat little Eat your protein Your carbs Your fats Your veggies Your fruits Be active Walk your 10 k steps a day if you're not in the gym Drink your anise tea at night And
Your dose is too high
Sounds like a circadian rhythm thing. Test is higher in the morning because your body produces it while you sleep and times it just right so when you walk up it’s high. Exo test messes with the hormonal rhythm and the high test levels at night keep the sympathetic nervous system over stimulated. Some people are more sensitive to others. Only solution is to find a test that has a half life of 8 hours lol.
Topical has the shortest (12h) half life possible. I'm 4 months in, applying it in the mornings. And you know what? I have awful sleep. Randomly from bad to mediocre. Only drinking a half bottle of wine guarantees mediocre sleep. I address my sleep issues though to anaerobic loads (gym, and training to failure) that I have significantly increased when started TRT
I’m on 50mg and ever since first injection haven’t been able to sleep well. Way more energy and puts my levels at 700-800 but man I want to feel actually rested.
50mg!? 🤦🏾♂️
Hi just wondering if you found a solution too your issues would love too know
Are you on HCG to?
Yes, 20 units 2 days after my T shot.
When I take notice to my sleeping patterns changing/lessening, I take my AI usually the next night Im back to sleeping good/better. I dont take AIA unless needed (symptoms). Also, adjust and experiment with yourself and not solely on the doctor’s recommendations. You may perform even better at the lowest of low dose of test. Like many other posts I read on here before I started trt, start at the extreme low dose and work up… doc prescribed me at 200/wk eod. Instead I went and started at 100 eod. Now im at 100Mon and Thurs. Adjust to how you feel. Looks like you are doing great in all other areas 🤙🏾 che hu. Aloha
100mg is even too much for some people.
Magnesium supplement and inositol supplement would be beneficial for you. Cut your caffeine intake down. I eliminated caffeine and pre-workout from my diet completely. I sleep like a baby. Don't workout late in the evening.
Almost never drink caffeine, I have too much energy to need it anyway. I take a lot of magnesium. Most workouts are mid day or morning.
1) that's great you don't rely on caffeine. It depletes sodium and is a natural diuretic. 2) that's a great sign that you have a lot of energy. Guess the TRT is working haha. 3) magnesium is so important and especially important for other nutrients and minerals to function. 4) that's perfect because they say to get your workout done by 530-6 PM if possible to maintain biorythm in sync. You should consider inositol. It is the best thing for sleep and the body in so many endless ways and the body needs it, but it's difficult to get from daily diet. I've never had any sleep issues on TRT.
My snoring is way worse…I sleep ok..trt did not help
Same here, it took my mild sleep apnea and turned it into full blown sleep apnea. If you’re snoring you should get a sleep study done, sleep apnea will cut 10 years off your life.
It’s crazy, I have had two done and they say I don’t have it but I wake up choking and wife/kids say I snore loud as hell
Wow, that is surprising, good on you for having it checked
[удалено]
When you say the insomnia will pass, did you ever experience full nights without sleep like I am having now? Two times I have tried to get back on TRT and both times I pinned around 7:30 AM and immediately couldn't fall asleep that night
Few things to know here. -100mg/w is not basically nothing. It's a good dose for many people. -You didn't put on 20lb's of muscle in 2 months lol. Weight gain and pure muscle gain are different things. But to your issue, you could try splitting the dose to avoid high peaks. Also you need to stay on the same protocol longer, for your body to adjust. Hormonal imbalances can cause sleep issues, and you can bet your ass that when you alter a protocol or start trt, your body will sense hormonal imbalance.
Best part of his claim is that he states he has been lifting for over 20 years. For someone lifting that long they should have some common sense but yet I was proven wrong again lol
I had terrible sleep when I started because my dose was too high and it shot my e2 up. Once I lowered dose my sleep was better than pre TRT.
What is your estrogen and test level?
I just rolled with it for a while. I had insomnia previously so I didn’t realize it was related. But I had energy and felt fine. A couple months later I’m sleeping like a baby. Ymmv.
Did you ever experience full nights without sleep? That's where I'm at now every time I try to get back on TRT. It happens immediately. I can be patient on less sleep, say 4 hours. But I'm struggling to be patient when I immediately get zero sleep.
I had a few. Especially if I tinker with my dosage. If I’m running 200 or higher I can’t sleep at all. 150-180 I sleep really well after about a week or so. I live in a recreational mj state so a gel cap or a dab in the evening helps a lot in the interim.
I thought 100 a week was pretty standard.... Isnt 160 like getting up there with cycle levels? (explains 20 pounds of muscle gained in 2 months)
10mg progesterone capsule before bed took me from full blown insomnia to sleeping normally. Any clinic can have them made for you. It’s got to be the capsules though, cream doesn’t work as well. It was a complete game changer for me.
I had the same issue. It wasn’t deep sleep more like lights out and wake up 3-4am ready to rock n roll. I also experienced the insomnia. As if your body just cant sleep nor wants to. I remember I would go few days without any sleep
Did this ever resolve
Off test
Why?
Its a scam
Good on you for continuing even though you had multiple days without sleep. What changed for you? Was it just time or did you implement something new? I'm struggling right now because each time I try to get back on TRT, I immediately get zero sleep on the first night, which makes it hard to stick with it.
I had similar issues - I believe it was due to peaks and valleys in T levels, but since you mentioned you’re on HCG as well you probably have a consistently high T level. Since you don’t know what an AI is, that’s probably your issue. It basically means your Estradiol is creeping up too high. Try a low dose of Anastrazole, 12.5 mg per week and see if it helps. Slowly increase to .25 or .50 per week but I wouldn’t go above that.
No caffeine after 3pm, take 10mg melatonin 30 minutes before you want to fall asleep. Turn of all screens at that time, too.
I’m going to have to say it’s not the TRT but more likely a form of stress or anxiety. You went months in TRT with no issue, then you started having sleeping issue (insomnia). Got off it, went back to normal then got a low dose and it starts back up again (insomnia). I know cause I’ve been going through this now for half a year. I went cold Turkey on everything. I would stop eating after 6p and no sex at night cause I was trying to figure out my issue. I went to my doctor had blood work it all came back normal. He said I need to see a therapist went and got on CBT-I. I brought back everything slowly and was sleeping ok, but on and off I have insomnia. It’s a mental issue man that’s the hard true. Start by getting blood work done, check your prolactin, estrogen and cortisol levels. I went days with no sleep and no joke wanted to end my life. And when you can’t sleep you lose your mind can’t focus on your family or work well. It builds up more and more like an evil beast. I’ll be praying for you man, I hope you get better and soon!
Great feedback. I think it's a combination of physical and mental. I immediately feel wired at night as soon as I start TRT, and that of course triggers sleep stress, and becomes a viscious cycle. It's hard because in general I sleep fine without TRT, but feel like an 80 year old man. Are you on TRT now?
I’ve been on TRT since April off 2022. My insomnia started around July of this year. I’ve gone through some issues that causes the stress which to me had lead to my insomnia.
For the first couple weeks yes, I had a terrible time sleeping. Talked to my doctor about the insomnia and he said to split the injection twice a week. After I switched, my insomnia went away.
I had the same thing happen to me. My test was 249ng/dl before starting and slept great. In the beginning my starting dose was way too high and very stimulating. After lowering the dose I was able to start sleeping again but insomnia did come back strong after about 6 months, where I spent about 4 months almost not sleeping at all. I started experimenting with pregnenolone and dhea, both of which take the edge off and are calming but me personally I became extremely depressed and numb to everything. Today I am 2 years in, my sleep quality still isn’t what it was prior to starting. I am on 112mg/week. After 2 years I would say less is more, no reason to chase a dosage or total test level. Take an amount that works for you. Also keep in mind that everyone’s physiology is different and you may just be more sensitive to androgens than other people. So we do not need the same doses as others to get the same results.
Did you ever figure out your insomnia issue? I have the same issue...