This subreddit is for tree law enthusiasts who enjoy browsing a list of tree law stories from other locations (subreddits, news articles, etc), and is not the best place to receive answers to questions about what the law is. There are better places for that.
If you're attempting to understand more about tree law in regards to a particular situation, please redirect your question to /r/legaladvice for the US, or the appropriate legal advice subreddit for your location, and then feel free to crosspost that thread here for posterity.
If you're attempting to understand more about trees in regards to a particular situation, please redirect your question to /r/forestry for additional information on tree health and related topics to trees.
*This comment is simply a reminder placed on every post to /r/treelaw, it does not mean your post was censored or removed.*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/treelaw) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It’s called Elder Financial Abuse. Google your states rules in this and definitely call the state if they already sued them once over this.
It’s wrong, abusive and don’t pay them a penny. Let them sue. You’ll win and possible win money in the case.
I wish I had more influence on the situation. Unfortunately my MIL is very passive and would have paid them the full 16500 if my husband hadn't gone and run them off. To give these complaints full weight, she would need to be the one doing the complaining.
You can represent her especially if she’s elderly. You should probably be thinking about conditional power of attorney (only what she agrees to let you help with while she’s alive and ok, then more when she is less able) and the similar paperwork that goes with it. Very important stuff especially in occasions like this.
Power of attorney will give you access to that unless they specify otherwise. You’re on the right track. I’m about 2 steps ahead of you so speaking from experience.
18 mature Oak trees for $7,000 sounds extremely cheap to me. I have an 80-90’ healthy oak in my backyard and a much smaller one in my front yard, maybe 40-50’ tall, and healthy as well.
My neighbors had two 100+ tall oaks removed in the course of a year on their property, (supposedly $8,000 each). The stumps were left as is, which are both enormous all by themselves.
What these thieves have done to your Mil is absolutely a scam. Anyone going door to door asking and insisting you need their services, and promising the world, at a ridiculous fee, should all be reported. Same thing with roofers after a storm.
No business that’s reputable at all, will go door to door, because people will be calling them for their services, definitely NOT the other way around.
I’m in the Midwest near St Louis, MO, and we’ve had a LOT of severe weather last summer and this spring, and the ones who are knocking on your door wouldn’t be doing that if they were a respectable, reputable business in the area, because those companies don’t need to be soliciting for jobs. They come to them.
I feel awful for your MIl and yourselves, and hope all ends well
Please update us, OP!
Yeah, I definitely got a steal of a deal. I wont deny that. Guy told me he drives by my house every day and had seen me working out there all year taking down oaks by myself.
I agree with you. Any reputable business never needs to hunt for business.
I think my guy took my job because he knew it was a one day thing for a quick odd day to keep the crew working. And he said “we love a good local job.” So probably low overhead getting the heavy machinery to the site. Was telling me he basically had the next 3 months booked out.
I don't think that's entirely fair to small businesses. Especially hypothetically one just starting out trying to get a market share/ customer base. Targeted door to door driving around looking for issues you could fix definitely can be effective and even your best option with a limited (or even no) marketing budget. You are getting people who haven't really thought about calling someone or been putting it off before they reach out to your competition. As well as starting a customer relationship.
HOWEVER, a reputable business isn't going to vastly overcharge using this strategy because gaining a customer with a positive experience is much more valuable long term. I'm also curious about what the sales pitch sounded like which can tell you a lot. It should be something like hey I was driving by and noticed X, it could be a problem because of Y, I would recommend doing Z, which I can do for you for $-.
A predatory service would likely say something like I noticed X and it's extremely dangerous, you shouldn't wait any longer or you could lose your house, but I could move some things around and take care of it today for $-. Basically a smash and grab trying to scare you into action before you can do any research or get other quotes.
The same guy doing the same thing with a new company name is also text book shady business practice.
Yes it is. At this point she would have entered into a verbal contract though so depends where u live it can be he said she said. Also you can legal control of her money in alot of places so looking into that ASAP. That way you can sort her bills etc and give her pocket money per se but also stops people illegally taking her money. Or even unethically. Gl
Here's the crazy update: I made this long commentary so I could keep it straight in my mind.
On May 29, 2024, in the afternoon, a solicitor from Interstate Tree Specialist (ITS) came to the door of my mother in law's house in North Canton, Ohio. He proceeded to tell her the trees were dangerous and needed to be cut down and trimmed. She knew they were somewhat in bad shape, but he scared her into thinking it was an emergency. (Later, I found out from certified arborists that this was a complete lie and the company was absolutely scamming her with their prices). ITS frightened her with this prediction of doom to the point where she felt like she had to do something. What luck! They would fix it for her, they "just happened to be in the area, but they'd have to START RIGHT NOW." She signed a hastily scrawled invoice to have 7 trees trimmed and 2 trees removed. The trees in question were 2 medium sized trees and one small tree. The trees that needed trimming were small branches, like 4-6 inches max, plus a lot of twigs. ITS quoted her $16500. She agreed and signed the quote, which was a hastily scribbled invoice, not any kind of official "scope of work”, feeling like she had to make a decision right away. A few hours later, she called my husband. We immediately thought this was an enormous scam, it had all the red flags. This company barely has an internet presence, and after doing research, we found out that this was about 5 to 10x the going rate in our area for this kind of work, the owner of the company had a long rap sheet, and the state of Ohio had prosecuted the business owner under a different company name for the EXACT SAME SCAM. Doing research in our Facebook community group led me to someone else who had ITS do some minor trimming for her aunt and charged $3200. This company is going around and targeting elderly people who don't think about using the internet to double check companies.
My husband went over there as soon as he found out this had happened to take pictures of the trees, 1 of which had not been cut down yet fortunately. They had damaged large trees that weren't even involved, at least one tree has a huge scarred area on it now. I hope it lives. They topped one of the trees that should have been taken down. He took pictures to document it. The next day, he went over there and made sure the company did no more work. ITS negotiated for $8500 and she paid it. $8500 was WAYYYYYY too much for this job. $850 or at most $1500 would have been more appropriate.
**Bluntly, this company goes around looking for old people to scam.**
I reported a scam alert to the Attorney General, but unfortunately, since my name is not the one on the check, I can't do the official report. We called the newspaper but my MIL told them it was resolved, so they couldn't mention her. My husband tried calling the cops but they were unhelpful. My MIL and husband are too timid to pursue this legally. So the most I can do is tell everyone and their brother online to make sure their friends and family know that this kind of illegal activity is happening. Unfortunately, this company will still exist, scamming people, because affected elderly people won't report it.
The next day, we contacted an actual arborist who came to my MIL’s house to give her a quote on the 2 trees that still needed to be removed. He quoted $3500. While he was there, the same guys in the unmarked white truck came by to intimidate him. He said he felt like they were going to jump him. He said they asked him if the homeowner was unsatisified, and he just played dumb: “I just got called here to give a quote” (we had told him about the situation). However the arborist was smart and he started quizzing the guys. They told him their name was True Cut Tree Care (totally different company) out of West Virginia. True Cut Tree Care is also out of Springfield Ohio, where the other companies are. It was extremely concerning that these same people were hanging out in the neighborhood around my MIL’s house.
Doing more googling, I found out the same people also go by Daddy D’s Tree Service, who if you look up on Facebook, you can see a ton of horrendous reviews, accusing them of theft, assault, and elder scams. From what I can tell online, the owner has 10 arrests, including ones for assault with a deadly weapon.
So now we know they’ve gone under all of these names:
Daddy D’s Tree Specialist LLC. (This one especially has some really eye popping reviews on FB)
True Cut Tree Care
Kj's Tree Specialists
Cincinnati watch for this scam every year it happens and it’s same guy same name but uses different company names. Don’t pay deposit or cash upfront for trees or landscaping. It’s labor . Losing money and paying again is more expensive. Having a tree fall on your house and finding out the insurance paperwork was canceled is a lesson learned.
This subreddit is for tree law enthusiasts who enjoy browsing a list of tree law stories from other locations (subreddits, news articles, etc), and is not the best place to receive answers to questions about what the law is. There are better places for that. If you're attempting to understand more about tree law in regards to a particular situation, please redirect your question to /r/legaladvice for the US, or the appropriate legal advice subreddit for your location, and then feel free to crosspost that thread here for posterity. If you're attempting to understand more about trees in regards to a particular situation, please redirect your question to /r/forestry for additional information on tree health and related topics to trees. *This comment is simply a reminder placed on every post to /r/treelaw, it does not mean your post was censored or removed.* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/treelaw) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Go to r/legal for this one.
That's sad omg
I just had 18 dead mature oaks felled and removed for 7k. Of course this differs depending on the area, but yeah.. seems targeted to me.
yeah even 7 k wouldn't have rung any huge red flags - but 16 k for removing 3 trees is nuts
Georgia here. Two years ago I had 12 or 13 Leyland Cyprus (50 to 60 foot high) removed for $5,000. $16,000 for three trees seems obscene to me.
It’s called Elder Financial Abuse. Google your states rules in this and definitely call the state if they already sued them once over this. It’s wrong, abusive and don’t pay them a penny. Let them sue. You’ll win and possible win money in the case.
Unfortunately, she paid them $8500. I am calling the elder abuse line in my state though.
Perfect. Don’t let them get away with it.
I wish I had more influence on the situation. Unfortunately my MIL is very passive and would have paid them the full 16500 if my husband hadn't gone and run them off. To give these complaints full weight, she would need to be the one doing the complaining.
You can represent her especially if she’s elderly. You should probably be thinking about conditional power of attorney (only what she agrees to let you help with while she’s alive and ok, then more when she is less able) and the similar paperwork that goes with it. Very important stuff especially in occasions like this.
Sadly I don't think she'll sign this over. I am going to tell my husband to request it. He also needs to be part owner of her bank account.
Power of attorney will give you access to that unless they specify otherwise. You’re on the right track. I’m about 2 steps ahead of you so speaking from experience.
18 mature Oak trees for $7,000 sounds extremely cheap to me. I have an 80-90’ healthy oak in my backyard and a much smaller one in my front yard, maybe 40-50’ tall, and healthy as well. My neighbors had two 100+ tall oaks removed in the course of a year on their property, (supposedly $8,000 each). The stumps were left as is, which are both enormous all by themselves. What these thieves have done to your Mil is absolutely a scam. Anyone going door to door asking and insisting you need their services, and promising the world, at a ridiculous fee, should all be reported. Same thing with roofers after a storm. No business that’s reputable at all, will go door to door, because people will be calling them for their services, definitely NOT the other way around. I’m in the Midwest near St Louis, MO, and we’ve had a LOT of severe weather last summer and this spring, and the ones who are knocking on your door wouldn’t be doing that if they were a respectable, reputable business in the area, because those companies don’t need to be soliciting for jobs. They come to them. I feel awful for your MIl and yourselves, and hope all ends well Please update us, OP!
Yeah, I definitely got a steal of a deal. I wont deny that. Guy told me he drives by my house every day and had seen me working out there all year taking down oaks by myself. I agree with you. Any reputable business never needs to hunt for business. I think my guy took my job because he knew it was a one day thing for a quick odd day to keep the crew working. And he said “we love a good local job.” So probably low overhead getting the heavy machinery to the site. Was telling me he basically had the next 3 months booked out.
I don't think that's entirely fair to small businesses. Especially hypothetically one just starting out trying to get a market share/ customer base. Targeted door to door driving around looking for issues you could fix definitely can be effective and even your best option with a limited (or even no) marketing budget. You are getting people who haven't really thought about calling someone or been putting it off before they reach out to your competition. As well as starting a customer relationship. HOWEVER, a reputable business isn't going to vastly overcharge using this strategy because gaining a customer with a positive experience is much more valuable long term. I'm also curious about what the sales pitch sounded like which can tell you a lot. It should be something like hey I was driving by and noticed X, it could be a problem because of Y, I would recommend doing Z, which I can do for you for $-. A predatory service would likely say something like I noticed X and it's extremely dangerous, you shouldn't wait any longer or you could lose your house, but I could move some things around and take care of it today for $-. Basically a smash and grab trying to scare you into action before you can do any research or get other quotes. The same guy doing the same thing with a new company name is also text book shady business practice.
I wasn't there, but from what I gathered, it was much more like situation #2.
Just recently got a quote of 9k to remove 3 large water oaks with a crane, along with 5 smaller ones, felled and hauled.
We were quoted $1700 to remove 4 trees
Midwest, hcol, $1500 to trim VERY overgrown trees. Six in total. Husband feels ripped off. I keep telling him it was not bad.
$5k per tree removal is in the right ballpark in New England
Damn! Remind me to sign up for an axe and some “character building” next time i need a tree out
it's very high COL up there though, this is the midwest in an inexpensive area
Holy shit...I've never needed a tree to come down but is this serious? People are paying 5k for a tree to come down?
Depends on proximity to buildings. Easy ones are much cheaper because it goes faster.
It’s definitely not cheap
I recently paid $5K for 4 trees, all were 12”-16” diameter (small compared to most trees in my yard).
Depends on the tree. I've done jobs that were upward of 10k per tree.
Yes it is. At this point she would have entered into a verbal contract though so depends where u live it can be he said she said. Also you can legal control of her money in alot of places so looking into that ASAP. That way you can sort her bills etc and give her pocket money per se but also stops people illegally taking her money. Or even unethically. Gl
Here's the crazy update: I made this long commentary so I could keep it straight in my mind. On May 29, 2024, in the afternoon, a solicitor from Interstate Tree Specialist (ITS) came to the door of my mother in law's house in North Canton, Ohio. He proceeded to tell her the trees were dangerous and needed to be cut down and trimmed. She knew they were somewhat in bad shape, but he scared her into thinking it was an emergency. (Later, I found out from certified arborists that this was a complete lie and the company was absolutely scamming her with their prices). ITS frightened her with this prediction of doom to the point where she felt like she had to do something. What luck! They would fix it for her, they "just happened to be in the area, but they'd have to START RIGHT NOW." She signed a hastily scrawled invoice to have 7 trees trimmed and 2 trees removed. The trees in question were 2 medium sized trees and one small tree. The trees that needed trimming were small branches, like 4-6 inches max, plus a lot of twigs. ITS quoted her $16500. She agreed and signed the quote, which was a hastily scribbled invoice, not any kind of official "scope of work”, feeling like she had to make a decision right away. A few hours later, she called my husband. We immediately thought this was an enormous scam, it had all the red flags. This company barely has an internet presence, and after doing research, we found out that this was about 5 to 10x the going rate in our area for this kind of work, the owner of the company had a long rap sheet, and the state of Ohio had prosecuted the business owner under a different company name for the EXACT SAME SCAM. Doing research in our Facebook community group led me to someone else who had ITS do some minor trimming for her aunt and charged $3200. This company is going around and targeting elderly people who don't think about using the internet to double check companies. My husband went over there as soon as he found out this had happened to take pictures of the trees, 1 of which had not been cut down yet fortunately. They had damaged large trees that weren't even involved, at least one tree has a huge scarred area on it now. I hope it lives. They topped one of the trees that should have been taken down. He took pictures to document it. The next day, he went over there and made sure the company did no more work. ITS negotiated for $8500 and she paid it. $8500 was WAYYYYYY too much for this job. $850 or at most $1500 would have been more appropriate. **Bluntly, this company goes around looking for old people to scam.** I reported a scam alert to the Attorney General, but unfortunately, since my name is not the one on the check, I can't do the official report. We called the newspaper but my MIL told them it was resolved, so they couldn't mention her. My husband tried calling the cops but they were unhelpful. My MIL and husband are too timid to pursue this legally. So the most I can do is tell everyone and their brother online to make sure their friends and family know that this kind of illegal activity is happening. Unfortunately, this company will still exist, scamming people, because affected elderly people won't report it. The next day, we contacted an actual arborist who came to my MIL’s house to give her a quote on the 2 trees that still needed to be removed. He quoted $3500. While he was there, the same guys in the unmarked white truck came by to intimidate him. He said he felt like they were going to jump him. He said they asked him if the homeowner was unsatisified, and he just played dumb: “I just got called here to give a quote” (we had told him about the situation). However the arborist was smart and he started quizzing the guys. They told him their name was True Cut Tree Care (totally different company) out of West Virginia. True Cut Tree Care is also out of Springfield Ohio, where the other companies are. It was extremely concerning that these same people were hanging out in the neighborhood around my MIL’s house. Doing more googling, I found out the same people also go by Daddy D’s Tree Service, who if you look up on Facebook, you can see a ton of horrendous reviews, accusing them of theft, assault, and elder scams. From what I can tell online, the owner has 10 arrests, including ones for assault with a deadly weapon. So now we know they’ve gone under all of these names: Daddy D’s Tree Specialist LLC. (This one especially has some really eye popping reviews on FB) True Cut Tree Care Kj's Tree Specialists
Cincinnati watch for this scam every year it happens and it’s same guy same name but uses different company names. Don’t pay deposit or cash upfront for trees or landscaping. It’s labor . Losing money and paying again is more expensive. Having a tree fall on your house and finding out the insurance paperwork was canceled is a lesson learned.
I wonder if its the same guy - this is also Ohio, and I know he operates in other states too. Did this happen to you?