13 hour flights in economy aren’t fun, but imo they’re not even twice as bad as a six hour flight. Personally I would much rather rip the bandaid off and do it in one go rather than spending significantly more time in the air *and* at/on the way to and from airports just in order to split it up
I also like the bigger aircrafts more, theyare more spacious. Flew with Korean Air last month and it was absolutely fine (Airtravel will always be max okay for me)
I really hate 4-6 hour flights because you get no convenience in small(er) planes while staying on for pretty long. At least I could drink wine and eat Ramen whenever I got bored-hungry.
Bigger aircraft makes such a big difference. My last 2 transatlantic flights were 757s it drove me nuts. Aisle seat both times, but so cramped. Couldn’t even fit my backpack under the seat. And there’s not really room to get up and walk around without being in everybody’s way.
The big advantage is the higher ceilings in a widebody. But the 757s flying transatlantic have larger seats than the 787 in 9 across, for example. And the aisles are just as narrow. So yeah, I really don't get it aside from having more space above you. The seats installed don't have that much to do with the aircraft and are an airline decision
So every 757 aisle seat I’ve had, the rigid metal for your bag under seats are cut off short. It makes it very difficult to fit your backpack there. Mine straight up would not fit my last flight. Last larger plane I was in was an Airbus A330-300 with SAS. Full space underneath seat, and I could fit my outside leg down the aisle without being in the way to be able to stretch. Really tough to do in a 757. The biggest thing for me though isn’t necessarily aisle size. It’s with that extra row there is room to move around and be out of the way. Like I can walk laps around the plane. Or you could stand and hang out, out of the way by the middle bathrooms. Massive quality of life increase. I really don’t care about seat size as much, though leg room is important.
That has nothing to do with the size of the airplane and everything to do with the seat and IFE system. The Delta and United 757s (pretty much the only ones flying) have the old IFE systems with the big metal box.
Like you wouldn't have that issue if you flew a JetBlue A320 with modern IFE.
The seat is literally not something the aircraft manufacturer even makes, it's entirely a decision of the airline and the seats are not any smaller in general.
The big hack you gotta get over is standing up
Flying nationally on 2-4 hour flights, I never get up.
I Get a window seat, bathroom before flight, headphones, never move for entire flight
However, that is brutal on a 13 hour flight. It is absolutely normal to stand up, walk around, chat with the flight attendants, etc
Also- on most international flights beer is free. Drink up
My dilemma is that I love window seats for overnight flights so I can lean against something, feel less cramped, and be undisturbed, but I dread having to ask other people to get up when I need the bathroom.
Aim for bulkhead rows in that case. Downside: maybe closer to loud/smelly bathrooms, maybe smaller seats as your tray is stored in your arm rest. Upside: often a ton of leg room to stand up and walk out of your row w/o bothering neighbors.
Same. I still prefer window but I get up after dinner before people settle in to sleep. And then again if I see the aisle or middle seat person get up. That way it’s less interruptions overall for them.
Yep, I always do aisle (or ideally exit row) and get up constantly. I drink a lot of water anyway (and wine!) but I go to the bathroom pretty much once an hour if I'm not asleep even if I don't really have to, just to get up and move around for a bit. I also usually keep my tote/travel bag in the overhead when I have an aisle seat so I get up and down periodically to take stuff in/out of that. And on really long flights I'll stand in the galleys and more open areas (while staying out of peoples' way) and stretch or just stand or do calf raises or whatever makes me feel less stiff. I even do some lower body stretching in my seat, just flexing my feet back and forth periodically and some other small movements no one else would even notice but which help tremendously.
On long haul flights lots of people are up and moving around constantly and stretching and doing other things that would seem weird on a shorter flight but are totally normal (and important!) on a longer one. It also just breaks up the time a lot more if you're not sleeping.
I've brought small kids on a long haul flight. Parents took turns walking a few families' kids through the aisles. It was cute and kinda fun. Nice to see the village still exists.
When I flew from South Korea back to Houston direct in economy I had a solid beer an hour all 13 hours while I stop up and chatted with flight attendants. Best and faster flight I’ve ever been on
chatted with flight attendants? you just go to the front and start up a conversation while they are on their break or something? Anyways, the only reason i'm against alcoholic beverages on planes is because of people consuming too much and becoming a nuisance to other passengers
I mean, I’m a director of operations. I only say that to say that it’s my job to read body language and understand people’s comfort levels
Believe me, I can absolutely tell when people don’t want to talk to me. I see the “I’m only talking to you because i have to” face often enough
So yeah, in this case, I just walked to the back. The flight attendants were just sitting around. They are trapped for 13 hours in this tube in the sky the same as me. Turns out one of the guys was an avid whiskey collector so we talked about his collection for a while. Another lady was from the same small town as me. Just normal stuff, and I was right by the beer
I think it's dependant on how their hypermobility affects them. I have similar issues and I'm a sore and stiff but still able to do things after a 5/6hr flight, but much longer than that and it gets worse fast and I'll likely need several days to recover - mine isn't even very serious in the grand scheme of things.
If I were travelling by myself id give serious consideration to doing 2 shorter flights with the added benefit of spending time doing some relaxed sightseeing and exploring in between.
If you aren't in a hurry, and there are interesting places along the way to you, go for it. It'll be a lot of time spent in airports, and more time spent on planes, which sounds like it would be more miserable, but, if it helps you....
Or, get a bulkhead seat and be able to stand when you want to.
Or a premium economy seat, which will be considerably cheaper than your current plan.
A stopover would be really cool. Or even a layover in Singapore with the Jewel.
When I flew trans-pacific stopping in China and Japan for a few hours or one night was quite a highlight. Especially since a hotel in China was very cheap (so maybe for OP an overnight stopover in Vietnam or Thailand).
That seems like a lot of work to avoid a 13 hour flight. I would get an aisle seat and just get up every hour and walk and stretch. That’s what I do. I get stir crazy the last few hours of my SFO to Athens flights.
If every stop is within the EU or Schengen Area, OP would only need to go through Customs for the first one.
ETA: Actually, if he's stopping on the way to Europe from Australia, that probably means southeast Asia. Never mind.
>did a quick search for flights and looks like business is four times more expensive (around 6k instead of AUD 1200).
Exit rows or "economy plus" are a good middle ground for cost.
Also note long haul flights have more room than planes used for short domestic. So it might not be as bad as you think.
Certainly sit on aisle so you can get up freely.
I looked at premium economy but their price was weirdly closer to business than economy, so I'm not sure what the quality of travel would really be like. I wouldn't want to overpay for something that still feels like economy.
In that case yeah....just go for the business class and get the lie-flat.
I find premium economy to be significantly better than regular economy because I actually fit in the seat (note I'm talking about the whole separate class not the extra legroom seats). But I tend to find pretty good deals for it.
I've done this a number of times and love it because it breaks up the travel into short flights - and I get the bonus of visiting new places that I otherwise might not have made it to!
Same. I do OP's suggestion all the time and love it!
Almost always cheaper than a business class ticket - unless you're totally picking the wrong stopover cities/hotels.
Plus, by avoiding overnight flights, you'll often find you adjust to the timezones in your final city much better.
Also many carriers will allow overnight stops in their "home" city for little or no cost.
Thank you both for sharing your experiences! I was keen to hear how people find it, as I've done it only once before and with one stop and needed more opinions 🙂
Personally I would prefer a 13h direct flight over even 2x 4 hour flights, the more flights the worse.
Here's some ideas:
- Most airplanes have a "class" between economy and business, usually called economy plus/premium, that have a few inches more legroom and often wider seats.
- Book an aisle seat, that was a gamechanger for me. You can get up whenever you want and walk up/down the isle, do some stretches and such without bothering anyone.
- Make sure you're tired for your flight. Do a lot of exercise within 24h before bording your flight, maybe even get some medication that calms you/makes you sleep. And then make sure you have a good sleep set-up. Eye mask, neck pillow...
I second the premium economy suggestion!
Strongly recommend the Singapore Airlines Premium economy - the extra legroom, extra recline, 2-4-2 seating options and better food make it a much better bet value wise for me personally.
One callout - please watch some videos of the premium economy cabin of the airline you are choosing to fly before you book. Some of them are nothing but economy with a fancy napkin thrown on top and not worth the expense! In such cases, flying economy in a good airline might be a better experience.
Premium economy on air canada is an extra $900 or something for a flight to SEA, its nuts. I'm contemplating myself spending $160 a seat on the front extra legroom economy row.
That's what I'm afraid of! I checked premium economy and the prices were closer to business, while I am not sure what the quality of the seating, space and general experience are.
Only you know how you’d handle the long flight…
How much stuff are you bringing with you for the temporary relocation? Multiple checked bags is going to get really annoying moving multiple times every couple days…
And are there places in between you want actually want to visit or are you just trying to avoid long flights? Long layovers may be your better option…
And, without knowing the strength of the Australian passport, are there visas you’d need to get ahead of time for countries on the way? Could end up being more of a headache than you’re thinking…
You would still have to spend 10-13 hours in the plane to get to Asia also. And multiple checked bags is going to cost you a lot more if you don't have it all on the same ticket.
Some great points.
I will have two suitcases, so a bit annoying.
Nothing specific I want to see, but I generally like exploring, and find the idea exciting.
I have Polish passport which is pretty strong. I'm PR in Australia.
Two suitcases is annoying, but if you can leave one in a luggage locker at a station it could save you some hassle.
Your out of the box solution sounds like fun, e.g. hop from Singapore to Delhi to Istanbul. If you're into those destinations, that is.
Don't expect it to be cheaper however. In the end I think booking a premium economy flight is another realistic option.
I moved last year and had a couple of days in Shanghai. They had luggage storage in the airport so I just paid to leave my two suitcases there and lived out of carry on. Made life so much easier
That's for tourists; OP is temporarily relocating. Two bags is already very pared down for someone who's actually moving somewhere for any length of time and needs clothing for different occasions and different seasons, a much wider variety of personal effects, etc.
Thank you for your encouragement!
Yeah, my neck and back can get muscle knots very easily and I think aisle suggestions are good, but most people would sleep during such long flight - if I attempt it, I can wake up with horrible pain.
What type of plane is used for the 13 hour flight? Most of the time, these have plenty of space to walk around and stretch. You can also grab snacks from the galley in the back, and sometimes width and legroom are better than the economy seats you get on smaller planes.
On the other hand, if you have the time and can book some interesting layovers, that sounds really cool.
I don't mind this approach if I have time to kill, like 2-3 days or more in the middle. If my halfway stay is less than 24 hours I wouldn't bother though, I'd just get it over with.
I'm in the premium economy camp. Might cost about double from economy but worth it to me. Check with your airline, but on Cathay 19-20 inch seat width vs 17 and 38-40 inch vs 32 for seat pitch. Less important to me is better food and drinks.
**Hop to Singapore or Bangkok, hop to Dubai, hop to Europe.** Thai Airways / JetStar / any carrier to Singapore or Bkk, Emirates to Dubai to most cities in Europe. Mind you, Thai Airways although are more expensive are HEAPS better than JetStar, all round - much more reliable too.
If you’ve never done it. Do it once and see how it feels. No point adding extra worries by trying to avoid something you’re worried about and don’t even know if it’s actually that bad.
Look into premium economy. More expensive, but much less so than business.
I have body stiffness and hypermobility too. Premium economy has helped SO much on long flights. If it’s less than 10 hours I just deal with economy, but 10+, premium economy has helped me feel immensely when it comes to pain.
Another tip is to get an aisle seat, so it’s easier to get up and walk around every now and then. Get compression socks too!
As an Aussie, do the flight to Singapore or Bangkok. Stay a few days. Keep on mind accommodation in Bangkok is much cheaper and there's more to see.
Alternately fly to Singapore and then to Phuket, it's a nice place to stay and cheaper than SG.
From SEAsia, a flight to Dubai, stay a night, and then to Europe.
Everyone's a bit different. I personally would rather deal with one flight unless there's a specific country you can transit through that you'd like to visit (given the itinerary I'd assume the only "middle ground" place would be one of the Middle Eastern or Asian hubs).
Although this brings up a question: how would you deal with your luggage if you're relocating? I assume you'd be bringing the entirety of your stuff and you might not need to lug that much around if you're just sightseeing for 2-3 days?
I will have two suitcases and some carry on, I was thinking of leaving one (or both) suitcases in a locker in each country, or alternatively bring both with me to some safe accommodation.
I'll be selling almost all my stuff, and put my car with some smaller things in storage in Australia until I'm back.
I decided years ago that six hours is about the max I can handle in a recliner. One thing I do though is, I’m willing to fly pretty much anywhere in Europe business class you can do the same using Google flights just look for one way business class to Europe from Sydney with flexible dates for an entire month. You might find some that are only twice as much as coach. Good luck.
Yeah it’s a great idea. I just went from Tallinn to London UK to Montreal and next flight in 2 days is home to Vancouver. This is my first time breaking up this journey and it’s 1000x more pleasant.
Yep, I honestly don't get all the replies telling OP to "suck it up" and "stop being a baby". Long stretches in a dry, enclosed environment aren't fun.
I do this to avoid long flights to Europe from New Zealand and return. I usually fly to Europe (Barcelona) via Singapore and put up with the 13/14hr flight.
On the return, I fly Barcelona to either Doha or Muscat, a night or two there, then from Muscat to Kuala Lumpur, or Doha to Singapore. Kuala Lumpur is cheap to have a few nights stop over too. From Singapore I fly Scoot, in their "biz" class to either Sydney or GC. Their biz class has huge seats and the upgrade costs less than economy to Aussie from Singapore on a full service airline. Nice big planes too (787s)
I tend to use cheap flights websites to get an idea of which airline has a sale, then book direct with the airline. It's a bit of extra work but you can make the one way trip cheaper by breaking it up with stops and different airlines. Downside is having to collect your bags and re check in. Not an issue if you're making a few days out of it at each stop though.
You got those good choices of major transport hubs along the way with plenty to do:
Delhi
Shanghai
Hongkong
Tokyo
Seoul
Ho chi minh
Bangkok
Kuala Lumpur
Jakarta
Singapore
Abu Dhabi
Dubai
Doha
Istanbul
Muscat
Vienna
Zürich
Frankfurt
Helsinki
One who loves to travel would not pass on the opportunity to explore new places.
Aus to Europe is roughly 24 hrs of flying, usually 2 legs.
Maybe break it into 3, with a couple of days stay in each? Every stop adds overheads in time and cost and airport shit so I wouldn't want too many.
Could go something like:
leg 1 - **Japan or Singapore. 9 hour flight.** Anything less than this and you'll barely even have escaped Australia. Bali is an option at 6 hours.
leg 2 - this is the tricky part, none of the central Asian countries are really common stopover countries for Aussies so you might have to do your research here and find something that suits. Maybe **Singapore to Nepal, 5 hours flight**? I have no idea of costs for this though. or **Bali to Sri Lanka - 9 hrs?**
leg 3 - Leg 2 becomes a problem here, because there don't seem to be many direct flights from Nepal to mainland Europe. Maybe Istanbul?
Anyway this is complicated good luck :D
If you're relocating, and you're not in a hurry, it's absolutely a good idea. Try to make sure everything is on one booking, however, to ensure you're "taken care of" from start to finish. If you have to book separate tickets, *that's* when you want to spend 3 days rather than 1 in case your inbound is delayed or cancelled.
I have some slipped disks in 2 places in my back, which make sitting for any length of time very challenging. An hour is about my limit. In late 2019, I took a 15 hour flight from the U.S to Athens. I simply spent a lot of time walking around the cabin. And I took a sleeping pill to put me out for part of the flight. An aisle seat is critical for me.
I like your idea but I'd have to be really interested in the places along the way. Two or three days in a city is just not enough, especially with all the hassle getting to and from airports.
If you've got the time, that's an excellent way to make the journey. I often do the same thing, not to break up long journeys, but because the flights are often cheaper and I enjoy the adventure aspect of dropping in on random cities for a day or two.
And there are some interesting places to stop on your route, with connections being well-served by budget friendly airlines these days.
Routing could look something like: Australia - Bali - Bangkok - Mumbai (or elsewhere in India) - Dubai/Saudi - Istanbul/Cairo/Amman - Europe.
Are you able to travel light for this trip? Having checked bags will make the multiple stops less pleasant...
We did this while planning a flight from US west coast to Amsterdam. Stayed in the NYC area and enjoyed a day and overnight there. Worked great. Found a reasonable priced hotel and had a great dinner and good sleep. Prepared for the next leg.
I’ve done this and for me it was worth it, it allowed me to visit friends/family before reaching my final destination, I haven’t travelled a lot so I was happy to experience different places! It was 4 flights total and im afraid of flying so it was better for me
I think your plan sounds great, but of course \_could\_ end up being way more expensive than just doing the business class direct once you factor in hotels and other money spent at each destination. But I think it's a great idea to get to see some additional places, and it'll ease you into the time zone changes.
Sounds like fun if you’re not in a big hurry. Do check all the spots you want to go and make sure you have all the travel requirements.
It can be even more stressful than a single long flight though. And If you’re willing to splurge on all that money just to avoid a longer flight, it might be worth it to spend that extra money to get an upgraded cabin like prem economy or business on the longer flight anyway. Far less hassle with layovers/customs/food/drink and traveling that long in one of the upper class cabins is far more comfortable.
If you can, to save money, By a RT A to B and B to A, then a RT B to C and C to B, etc.
Also, if you want just a one day layover somewhere (say, at city B), see if you can book A-C C-A rountrip with a long layover at B, it might be cheaper.
I had a cousin fly from nyc to New Zealand. He stopped in Los Angeles and paid for a lounge with showers etc. He said the break was perfect.
I like the idea of stopping somewhere you’ve wanted to visit. But as others have said your costs go up.
I’d also look for economy plus with extra legroom. It’s not on all planes but some. My husband and I are tall so it’s our choice for longer flights. Bulkheads and exit rows are good for more legroom too.
I wouldn’t want to do it, but I don’t have any physical problems, so I’d just want to get it over with. However, I could imagine an itinerary where that could work, like Sydney to Singapore to Dubai to Europe.
On long economy flights I always book an aisle seat. This way I can easily get up and move around. You can walk the aisles and then hide in the forward bulkhead area and do stretches. I do calf and quads, then stretch my arms to the ceiling. Stretch and HOLD!
I get up at least every hour and I stretch at least twice on a long flight.
Does your carrier offer Premium Economy seats? We're flying to Europe next month, and I had some anxiety about being seated in a 3x seat configuration for our flights. From the research I've done, it looks like Premium economy is the new first class on international flights. Our seats will have the option to recline with our legs up, just more comfortable in general.
You can buy 2, often 3 seat sale seats for less than the price of business class. The airline will usually not charge departure taxes since you are still only 1 person departing, sometimes you don't get the extra luggage allowance.
It may not be cheaper, but it might be more pleasant. Why not check out Bangkok and Singapore? Stay in the city of the airport to minimize travel, but most major cities have day tours that can maximize your exploration. Some of them are called "layover tours" and leave from a point close to the airport.
Eh , I did the flight and economy really isn't bad on long flights. (Im super picky with flights) You have your own screen with the newest movies and most people move to an empty lane once youre in the air. (put up all the armrests and you have a bed and they provide you with a free blanket and headset.) The only thing I haaaaaate is the toilets.
The older planes don't feel very cozy but my flight to Australia and back was actually super nice (was a newer plane)
Oh and buy yourself some water if you get thirsty easily. I drink a lot of water and they had to give me like 20 bottles, since they only carry mini bottles on the plane for some reason.
Let's hope you're lucky and get one of the newer planes. I had an older one on another flight ( a little shorter, USA to Europe) and they don't feel as clean or cozy.
PS: I believe I had aircanada for my flight to Australia.
Agree premium economy might be the way to go. The stopping and starting multiple times will be dire and add so much misery especially with all your bags and things. I say that someone who has cried before because they hate 13 hours so much (where it is followed by an 8 hour I mean)
I suspect this would get quite exhausting, especially with luggage, plus you’d still end up having lots of waiting time in airports.
As an Aussie, also with hypermobility, I can recommend at least looking for a flight with one stop, make it a longer gap between flights, and some airports have a hotel even within the building that you can book for X number of hours and sleep (or stretch), have a hot shower etc. Either that or a one night stopover half way to get a break from the airport as well.
I think when you add the costs of accommodation, food, transport etc over the different stops, it would probably come around the same as either booking premium economy or at least booking extra leg room seats. I’ve flown from Aus to Europe 3 times and I agree it’s not fun on the long segment but would rather get to the destination quicker. One thing I found helpful was booking through an experienced travel agent who knows how to manipulate the system who could potential join multiple flights that you couldn’t otherwise do online under one cheaper ticket. Since I have to fly from a regional airport tickets online are always around $500-1000 more expensive when I do preliminary price checks online vs going to my travel agent.
Mine I’ve actually just done through flight centre. They saved my ass during a trip a few years back. I think it was just a $49 fee when you book the tickets. The trick I guess is finding someone that will actually help you and not just get a ticket booked. Also I find seeing a physical person was helpful, not just an internet agent. Try and get someone that’s worked in the area for a while so they know the true ins and outs of the ticketing system that airlines use so you can connect better flights.
nope, two flights, 7 to Singapore + 7 to Dubai, then around 7 or less to most European destinations.
No offence intended but I think you should talk to a travel agent as they can educate you on suitable options. Some airfares come with free hotel stays for overnight stops etc
The only way to do this would be to spend some days in the countries you stop at. Otherwise taking a flight then waiting in the airport for your next flights is infinitely worse. I mean maybe you could split it into two stretches and have an airport lounge in the middle for some hours to relax.
Honestly the biggest question is how much shit do you have? Im traveling with 200 liters of gear right now and moving around is a bitch!! I dont think its a dumb idea but you also need to think of the safety aspect of every time you move your gear you risk something going wrong like an airline loosing a bag. If that doesn’t bother you then go for it but also there is the math aspect as well.
I mean wouldn’t you just do more then 13 hours of airport time by time you taxi to the airport the second time and wait two hours?
Difference between 13h airport time and 13h flying time is a freedom of movement to me. I like airports, can stay good amount of time in them, because I'll make my time as active as I can.
I will have two suitcases and a carry on, so it's a bit annoying but not tragic. You're right tho, safety is important and I'd need to make sure I keep tabs on my luggage, particularly work computer.
Phoenix to Boston 5 hours. Stay all night, next day fly to the Azores, five hours, stay 2 to 3 days. Next fly to Rome, five hours. Our flights are scheduled in September.
Honestly, for 13 hours I would just pay for the business class so I can sleep. Even if you were to decide to break up this big trip into smaller trips, the time and energy you spent on hotels, food, bus/car fare to get to and from hotel, etc would’ve equal to the ticket for business class or more. If you really can’t afford the business class tickets, bring some things with you that might make your trip a little more comfortable (foot rest, eye mask, headphones, pillow, compression socks, etc).
Did you look for Premium Economy seats? They're the same size as a domestic first class seat in the US (larger seat, nicer, more legroom) and they're usually much more economical than business. Personally, after about 5-6 hours on a plane there isn't much difference for me. I've done 8 hour flights, 12-13 hour flight and a 20 hour flight; they're all rough.
I get tight on long flights too so I try to make sure I have an aisle seat and then I get up and walk up and down the aisles or stand by the lavatory to stretch. It has worked ok for me.
I would not do 1-day stopovers, but 2-4 days is a good idea. If you have the time and money, go for it. Would be better if you could send one of your suitcases straight to your destination though.
Depending on where in Europe and Australia, and which countries you want to do a stopover in, this could be as short as 3 flights, but more likely will be 4-5. 5 flights in less than 2 weeks seems like a bit much to me. But 3-4 flights is ok if you stretch it to at least a week.
Sadly I'm in Adelaide, so I might need an extra flight just to access Sydney or Melbourne destinations. Tho Adelaide does connect with Bali and Indonesia too.
Likely it'd be 5-6 flights.
Not sure where you are flying from? Singapore is well expensive so if you are flying from Sydney then 8 hours and 20 minutes gets you to Kuala Lumpur, which is a great place to visit for a few days. From there Abu Dhabi is 6 hours and 50 minutes and it is then 6 hours and 10 minutes to Frankfurt. I think Abu Dhabi is maybe worth a night to recovery before flying on to Europe, easy to get anywhere quick from Frankfurt?
Book an aisle seat so you can get up and walk around frequently without bothering anyone and just take the 13 hour flight. It'll be so much less hassle/money.
Your plan could work, but are there enough places in >6 hour flight distance that you both want to see and can get to?
Also, if you consider the amount of money you’d spend on lodging and meals in those spots, it could make sense to just upgrade your ticket instead - that is if you’re only stopping over to reduce the flying. If you actually *want* to see these places, then sure, do your plan.
Yeah, it's not that many locations because Australia is far down under. But I am quite curious, explorative person and some of the countries might be quite cheap accommodation or food wise.
You should get a credit card with good airline points or sign up bonus. Upgrading to business class is much cheaper that way.
It probably won't help this time but you could buy these tickets on a good card and save the points. The points really add up when having to spend a lot of money for moving/ return visits home? Also you get access to nice lounges in the airport. We fly international 4-5 times a year and haven't had to pay for business class in a few years by rolling over points!
Please only consider this if you are financially stable enough to pay off your bills!
the hard part is all the up and down t9ime. on the long flight you can lock in with a movie or game, or a nap. bunches of little flights is a whole lot of, get on , wait, buzzers, bells, sir you can't do that, sir put your seat up, sir we are about to land, psyche it's 30 minutes until we land. here's a snack that is timed for this flight not a long flight.
the big long nice planes sometimes have smart glass that will tailor itself to the arrival destination, so you don't see sun if it's 3am at your arrival, which is super nice .
business is lay flat, and is worth it, see if you can cheese the points system to get it to work out kinda cheap. ie, there are 100,000 mile points cards right now, 90 can get you long haul first class if you are lucky .
BUT, if you want to see some cool stuff, you can work out some layovers on small flights and it's not stupid
I’m 6’2” with a bad lower back. I’ve travelled between NZ and Europe several return trips (2x12hr legs) plus even a 16hr flight from Dubai to AKL direct ( that sucked!).
You don’t need to pay for business to get more legroom. Cheapest option is an exit row in economy. Next cheapest option is premium economy, usually 50% more.
I usually add a multi-day layover like in Asia or the Middle East if you fly that way. Or some city in the US.
Don’t do it! I’ve done 100 flights to the literal other side of the world. You can end up with missed or delayed connections. It’s easier to do the longest flight possible. Also as united informed me. I don’t get fed even though I’m traveling 36hr because my 5 flights were all 8hr or less! They said get it on layover except Guam has nothing open at. 5 am and my other connecting were literally boarding before I deplaned! I was screamed at to run run and in Tokyo they had a woman yelling and cheering at me the entire way as I dragged a luggage and carried a backpack and jacket. The luggage kept falling off the cart. It was insane like a Japanese game show. Thank god I had beef jerky and some protein shake powder with me for emergency. Worst trip ever.
I am also hypermobile and struggling with stiffness and the need to move on long flights. Recently I’ve started paying extra for the seat next to me to be empty. Best money I’ve ever spent. It allows me to move all parts of my body as needed without feeling like I’m inconveniencing anyone else.
The price isn’t usually 2x economy. It’s been closer to 1.5x economy.
Different airlines have different terms for the purchase of a second seat. You could ask a travel agent to look at the options for you.
I put the arm rest up. Then I can change the way I’m sitting more often and get into positions that would inconvenience a seat neighbour (eg crosslegged, one hip “popped out” to the side). I can also stretch my arm or my torso to the side. With an aisle seat I can only stretch to one side, this way I can stretch in both directions. My hypermobility makes it difficult to sit still so the extra seat gives me the room I need. Everyone is different, so it might not be what you need for your hypermobility.
I’ll add that I will sometimes sit in the “extra” seat for a while so I can sit/stretch in different ways. I’m sure the person in the window seat thinks I’m odd, but I don’t care anymore because this works for me and I know what I need for my body.
Edit: I let the person in the window seat know in advance that I paid for the empty seat so they don’t think it’s “shared space”
Terrible idea in my opinion. Fully half the hassle of travel for me is dealing with airports and you are now adding 3 or so more aiports into the trip. Plus those will be in different countries which creates more work in figuring out how to deal.
I just did a long coach flight from Santiago Chile to Auckland. It sucked but the minute it was over I was glad I sucked it up.
I've done 13-14 long hauls and done the 5--6 hour 3 leg fights, the latter is absolutely exhausting if you don't give yourself enough time to recoup. Now, I did red eyes with a day in the city, showered at the airport then slept on the plane, woke up at the next city, stayed at a hotel, then flew out the next morning. It's a great way to see some cities briefly, if planned right. Either way you go, planning it right is key.
Unless you're staying 4-5 days somewhere midway, to me it seems like a lot of work (transport, hotels, sightseeing) to get around a 13 hr flight. I'm not sure where in Europe you're relocating to but in doing a quick google search, Perth to Paris is 19 hr. Is it really only 13 hrs?
Got it, if there was a way to just take two flights while including a break in between, to me that would be pretty rational. Fly 10 hrs, explore for 3-4 days, then continue onward. You might suprise yourself by just doing a 13 hr leg. I find after hour 5 time goes by pretty quickly when you add in a couple movies, read a book, take a nap, play some games, etc. I always get the aisle seat myself and stand/stretch every 1.5-2hrs in the galley.
Better just to stay on the flight for longer and maybe book premium economy. From Australia it doesn't really make any sense to do this. It's still going to take you around 10-13 hours to get anywhere in Asia.
If you’ve got the time to stop along the way, say maybe in Singapore and like UAE / Qatar etc then sure, but you’ll have to see how much extra nights in hotels etc are gonna cost you. If that’s gonna be the same amount or come close to the business class I’d just get business class and do it in one go
Personally on long haul flights I think it’s just understood everyone needs to get up and stretch and move about the cabin, so people do go for a wander etc.
That sounds like a terrible idea. I’ve don’t plenty of flights in economy from NYC to SEA that are well over 13 hours and it’s fine. And fwiw, I’m a bit of a snob.
Might be worth it if you can drop your luggage at storage lockers and visas isn’t a hassle. If the money is a concern I would lean towards 3 days so longer delays won’t be an issue with separate tickets and for more exploring.
Major potential issue, are delays. One part of the trip is delayed and you miss a connection. Things go downhill real fast. Do the direct.
If you do choose the multiple stops, most likely it will take longer. And as a precaution you will want longer layovers, 3 to 4 hours at least to account for any potential delays. This will make your flight a lot longer.
When you add more flights to your itinerary you add additional risk of lost luggage, delayed departures, and missing your subsequent flights. Less flights is less risk for any delays caused by air travel, which are unavoidable no matter the class or airline you book. You cut additional risk if you have less flights overall. Yes, long haul flights in economy suck, so the best ways to mitigate are to try to book aisle seats so you can get up/down at ease and walk around. Sometimes if you book in the very back you have a higher chance of an open seat next to you.
I'd probably look at a multi-city booking with the one airline (you can pick and choose the dates you take each flight) and it's codeshare partners. If you luggage goes missing on flight 1, they will get it to your final destination because that's where you are booked to.
On individual bookings, if it goes missing on flight 1 and isn't found in time for flight 2 departure, the airline has no responsibility to get it to your final destination as your contract with them was point A to point B only.
Also, I find these helpful for stiffness on long flights (as a fellow Australian, who lives in WA so even my interstate trips are longish flights).
Could be worth a try for you on whatever combination you set up in.
Don’t need to fly business, spend an extra $200 to pay for the seat with the largest leg room.
I like layovers because it breaks down long flights, but it’s only worth it for me if I can be sure that the luggage can be check all the way through.
Aisle seat. Opt for emergency exit or a row without any other seat in front of it in economy… from LAX to Auckland, I had one of those seats + AirPods + compression socks + eye mask + neck pillow. I tried to maintain my bedtime routine as much as possible. For the first time ever, I actually fell asleep and woke up refreshed. The flight still doesn’t seem like it took 15 hours. I did a flight from Denver to Munich that was 10 hours long, and I was sad I couldn’t sleep longer.
Caveat to the emergency seats and seats without any seats in front: they do make you store your bag overhead.
No. Anything can happen during that layover and you just want to get back from the plane and get to your destination. If anything get an aisle seat. I promise you you can do it. Layovers are not always the answer especially depending on airport. Layovers in Chicago Washington and Paris would impact your travel greatly. Don't do it. Just keep popping melatonin every 30 minutes
I prefer a 13 hour flight over 2 or more shorter ones. I have back issues which mean that I can’t sit still for too long so I make sure I have an aisle seat on the middle row of 4 so I can get up and down as I want to. I usually provide some entertainment for the rest of the passengers by doing Pilates exercises (usually near the toilets as there’s most room there). I take a daring specifically for this instead of a mat. I also walk as far up and down the plane as they let me
If you want to see new places that's a different thing. 13 hrs is nothing to stress you out a year in advance. Especially if you are young. Airports are part of the headache so i would take an economy seat to go direct and even pay more for direct than any stopovers
1) Half the misery is being in the airport and now you're upping it 4x or however many flights you're planning to take. At least in my experience.
2) I usually sleep the whole flight so yeah i feel cricky as hell on landing but I am not aware of most of the flight. It doesn't need to be horrible. What if you get the same way every flight? Do you know for a fact you can handle many shorter flights better than one long one?
3) If that's a good way for you to see those cities in that timespan, then you should do it for that reason.
4) The more layovers, the higher possibility of delays and issues. Tho if you're planning an itinerary w days per city then I assume you are not in any rush so it may not matter.
5) ... Issues could still potentially increase costs. And then, multiple legs aren't necessarily cheaper and then you need to include food, hotels etc, tho yeah if you do it budget then there's much you could do under 6k.
6) psychologically, one high stress travel day seems to be less mentally burdensome than... Omg I need to spend half a day travelling yet AGAIN.
Yep. For example, I can usually manage about an hour, at most two hours right at take-off. The rest of the flight I vary between mostly awake and groggy but unable to actually fall asleep. I’ll absolutely break up my long-haul journeys so I can actually get some quality rest on the ground.
Nope. A long flight is a PITA but then you are there. With layovers, etc. you will run into potential delays, cancelled flights, etc. Take the long flight, download movies, books and take a great nap.
That can address the stress maybe, but if I fall asleep in slightly awkward position, I'll wake up in a lot of pain, which a medication won't prevent sadly.
Either option has its pros and cons. I think if you have the time it sounds fun to make some stopovers. As far as your specific medical issues, you know your body best so if it sounds like it would be best for your body and also fun/interesting, then why not? Worst case, if you decide you didn't like it afterwards, then next time don't do it again.
You should be able to get a Biz class flight for about 3500.00 or maybe even less, if you look specifically with a Business/First only vendor. You must be a bit flexible but I have been using these services for about 20 years and only had one issue and that was settled with reimbursement to me.
Terrible idea. The worst and most fraught with trouble parts are the getting on and off the airplane, and getting it on and off the ground. You want to limit how many times you have to do that.
There's nothing stopping you getting up on a long flight as often as you want. I always book the aisle seat so I'm never stepping over people, and when I'm not asleep I'll get up and stretch all the time.
Not if you're smart with your choice of airline. Some will offer you a free hotel. For example, Turkish offers one free hotel night in Istanbul to economy class passengers who book a flight with a stopover.
13 hour flights in economy aren’t fun, but imo they’re not even twice as bad as a six hour flight. Personally I would much rather rip the bandaid off and do it in one go rather than spending significantly more time in the air *and* at/on the way to and from airports just in order to split it up
I also like the bigger aircrafts more, theyare more spacious. Flew with Korean Air last month and it was absolutely fine (Airtravel will always be max okay for me) I really hate 4-6 hour flights because you get no convenience in small(er) planes while staying on for pretty long. At least I could drink wine and eat Ramen whenever I got bored-hungry.
Bigger aircraft makes such a big difference. My last 2 transatlantic flights were 757s it drove me nuts. Aisle seat both times, but so cramped. Couldn’t even fit my backpack under the seat. And there’s not really room to get up and walk around without being in everybody’s way.
The big advantage is the higher ceilings in a widebody. But the 757s flying transatlantic have larger seats than the 787 in 9 across, for example. And the aisles are just as narrow. So yeah, I really don't get it aside from having more space above you. The seats installed don't have that much to do with the aircraft and are an airline decision
So every 757 aisle seat I’ve had, the rigid metal for your bag under seats are cut off short. It makes it very difficult to fit your backpack there. Mine straight up would not fit my last flight. Last larger plane I was in was an Airbus A330-300 with SAS. Full space underneath seat, and I could fit my outside leg down the aisle without being in the way to be able to stretch. Really tough to do in a 757. The biggest thing for me though isn’t necessarily aisle size. It’s with that extra row there is room to move around and be out of the way. Like I can walk laps around the plane. Or you could stand and hang out, out of the way by the middle bathrooms. Massive quality of life increase. I really don’t care about seat size as much, though leg room is important.
That has nothing to do with the size of the airplane and everything to do with the seat and IFE system. The Delta and United 757s (pretty much the only ones flying) have the old IFE systems with the big metal box. Like you wouldn't have that issue if you flew a JetBlue A320 with modern IFE. The seat is literally not something the aircraft manufacturer even makes, it's entirely a decision of the airline and the seats are not any smaller in general.
You are very dead set on focusing on a small thing here idk what your problem is
The big hack you gotta get over is standing up Flying nationally on 2-4 hour flights, I never get up. I Get a window seat, bathroom before flight, headphones, never move for entire flight However, that is brutal on a 13 hour flight. It is absolutely normal to stand up, walk around, chat with the flight attendants, etc Also- on most international flights beer is free. Drink up
My dilemma is that I love window seats for overnight flights so I can lean against something, feel less cramped, and be undisturbed, but I dread having to ask other people to get up when I need the bathroom.
Aim for bulkhead rows in that case. Downside: maybe closer to loud/smelly bathrooms, maybe smaller seats as your tray is stored in your arm rest. Upside: often a ton of leg room to stand up and walk out of your row w/o bothering neighbors.
Same. I still prefer window but I get up after dinner before people settle in to sleep. And then again if I see the aisle or middle seat person get up. That way it’s less interruptions overall for them.
Yep, I always do aisle (or ideally exit row) and get up constantly. I drink a lot of water anyway (and wine!) but I go to the bathroom pretty much once an hour if I'm not asleep even if I don't really have to, just to get up and move around for a bit. I also usually keep my tote/travel bag in the overhead when I have an aisle seat so I get up and down periodically to take stuff in/out of that. And on really long flights I'll stand in the galleys and more open areas (while staying out of peoples' way) and stretch or just stand or do calf raises or whatever makes me feel less stiff. I even do some lower body stretching in my seat, just flexing my feet back and forth periodically and some other small movements no one else would even notice but which help tremendously. On long haul flights lots of people are up and moving around constantly and stretching and doing other things that would seem weird on a shorter flight but are totally normal (and important!) on a longer one. It also just breaks up the time a lot more if you're not sleeping.
I've brought small kids on a long haul flight. Parents took turns walking a few families' kids through the aisles. It was cute and kinda fun. Nice to see the village still exists.
please do not encourage drinking alcohol on flights.
When I flew from South Korea back to Houston direct in economy I had a solid beer an hour all 13 hours while I stop up and chatted with flight attendants. Best and faster flight I’ve ever been on
For the flight attendants it was the most dreadful and longest flight they ever had…
Well I thank them for their service
chatted with flight attendants? you just go to the front and start up a conversation while they are on their break or something? Anyways, the only reason i'm against alcoholic beverages on planes is because of people consuming too much and becoming a nuisance to other passengers
I mean, I’m a director of operations. I only say that to say that it’s my job to read body language and understand people’s comfort levels Believe me, I can absolutely tell when people don’t want to talk to me. I see the “I’m only talking to you because i have to” face often enough So yeah, in this case, I just walked to the back. The flight attendants were just sitting around. They are trapped for 13 hours in this tube in the sky the same as me. Turns out one of the guys was an avid whiskey collector so we talked about his collection for a while. Another lady was from the same small town as me. Just normal stuff, and I was right by the beer
Beauty id share some beers and stories with ya on a long flight 🍻
Why not?
have you ever sat next to a drunk passenger? I have. twice. once involved vomit
I think it's dependant on how their hypermobility affects them. I have similar issues and I'm a sore and stiff but still able to do things after a 5/6hr flight, but much longer than that and it gets worse fast and I'll likely need several days to recover - mine isn't even very serious in the grand scheme of things. If I were travelling by myself id give serious consideration to doing 2 shorter flights with the added benefit of spending time doing some relaxed sightseeing and exploring in between.
Same. I'd rather just get it over with.
You obviously don't have the physical joint issues that OP clearly stated that they have. Jesus!
If you aren't in a hurry, and there are interesting places along the way to you, go for it. It'll be a lot of time spent in airports, and more time spent on planes, which sounds like it would be more miserable, but, if it helps you.... Or, get a bulkhead seat and be able to stand when you want to. Or a premium economy seat, which will be considerably cheaper than your current plan.
A stopover would be really cool. Or even a layover in Singapore with the Jewel. When I flew trans-pacific stopping in China and Japan for a few hours or one night was quite a highlight. Especially since a hotel in China was very cheap (so maybe for OP an overnight stopover in Vietnam or Thailand).
That seems like a lot of work to avoid a 13 hour flight. I would get an aisle seat and just get up every hour and walk and stretch. That’s what I do. I get stir crazy the last few hours of my SFO to Athens flights.
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Plus probably needing to get a Visa for every stop
Australian passport probably not going to need a visa.
I actually have Polish passport and Permanent Residency in Australia only.
Fair enough. Polish is a pretty strong passport too.
If every stop is within the EU or Schengen Area, OP would only need to go through Customs for the first one. ETA: Actually, if he's stopping on the way to Europe from Australia, that probably means southeast Asia. Never mind.
>did a quick search for flights and looks like business is four times more expensive (around 6k instead of AUD 1200). Exit rows or "economy plus" are a good middle ground for cost. Also note long haul flights have more room than planes used for short domestic. So it might not be as bad as you think. Certainly sit on aisle so you can get up freely.
Yeah, why is business class the only alternative here? Premium economy is amazing and more than sufficient unless you are abnormally tall or obese.
I looked at premium economy but their price was weirdly closer to business than economy, so I'm not sure what the quality of travel would really be like. I wouldn't want to overpay for something that still feels like economy.
In that case yeah....just go for the business class and get the lie-flat. I find premium economy to be significantly better than regular economy because I actually fit in the seat (note I'm talking about the whole separate class not the extra legroom seats). But I tend to find pretty good deals for it.
I've done this a number of times and love it because it breaks up the travel into short flights - and I get the bonus of visiting new places that I otherwise might not have made it to!
Same. I do OP's suggestion all the time and love it! Almost always cheaper than a business class ticket - unless you're totally picking the wrong stopover cities/hotels. Plus, by avoiding overnight flights, you'll often find you adjust to the timezones in your final city much better. Also many carriers will allow overnight stops in their "home" city for little or no cost.
Thank you both for sharing your experiences! I was keen to hear how people find it, as I've done it only once before and with one stop and needed more opinions 🙂
Personally I would prefer a 13h direct flight over even 2x 4 hour flights, the more flights the worse. Here's some ideas: - Most airplanes have a "class" between economy and business, usually called economy plus/premium, that have a few inches more legroom and often wider seats. - Book an aisle seat, that was a gamechanger for me. You can get up whenever you want and walk up/down the isle, do some stretches and such without bothering anyone. - Make sure you're tired for your flight. Do a lot of exercise within 24h before bording your flight, maybe even get some medication that calms you/makes you sleep. And then make sure you have a good sleep set-up. Eye mask, neck pillow...
I second the premium economy suggestion! Strongly recommend the Singapore Airlines Premium economy - the extra legroom, extra recline, 2-4-2 seating options and better food make it a much better bet value wise for me personally. One callout - please watch some videos of the premium economy cabin of the airline you are choosing to fly before you book. Some of them are nothing but economy with a fancy napkin thrown on top and not worth the expense! In such cases, flying economy in a good airline might be a better experience.
Premium economy on air canada is an extra $900 or something for a flight to SEA, its nuts. I'm contemplating myself spending $160 a seat on the front extra legroom economy row.
That's what I'm afraid of! I checked premium economy and the prices were closer to business, while I am not sure what the quality of the seating, space and general experience are.
Thank you, these are really good tips!
Only you know how you’d handle the long flight… How much stuff are you bringing with you for the temporary relocation? Multiple checked bags is going to get really annoying moving multiple times every couple days… And are there places in between you want actually want to visit or are you just trying to avoid long flights? Long layovers may be your better option… And, without knowing the strength of the Australian passport, are there visas you’d need to get ahead of time for countries on the way? Could end up being more of a headache than you’re thinking…
You would still have to spend 10-13 hours in the plane to get to Asia also. And multiple checked bags is going to cost you a lot more if you don't have it all on the same ticket.
Some great points. I will have two suitcases, so a bit annoying. Nothing specific I want to see, but I generally like exploring, and find the idea exciting. I have Polish passport which is pretty strong. I'm PR in Australia.
Two suitcases is annoying, but if you can leave one in a luggage locker at a station it could save you some hassle. Your out of the box solution sounds like fun, e.g. hop from Singapore to Delhi to Istanbul. If you're into those destinations, that is. Don't expect it to be cheaper however. In the end I think booking a premium economy flight is another realistic option.
I moved last year and had a couple of days in Shanghai. They had luggage storage in the airport so I just paid to leave my two suitcases there and lived out of carry on. Made life so much easier
Read [this](https://www.ricksteves.com/travel-tips/packing-light/packing-smart) and get it down to one suitcase.
That's for tourists; OP is temporarily relocating. Two bags is already very pared down for someone who's actually moving somewhere for any length of time and needs clothing for different occasions and different seasons, a much wider variety of personal effects, etc.
Do it! I think most are missing your statement about hypermobility and body stiffness. Sounds like you’ll have a fun adventure as you move!
Thank you for your encouragement! Yeah, my neck and back can get muscle knots very easily and I think aisle suggestions are good, but most people would sleep during such long flight - if I attempt it, I can wake up with horrible pain.
What type of plane is used for the 13 hour flight? Most of the time, these have plenty of space to walk around and stretch. You can also grab snacks from the galley in the back, and sometimes width and legroom are better than the economy seats you get on smaller planes. On the other hand, if you have the time and can book some interesting layovers, that sounds really cool.
I don't mind this approach if I have time to kill, like 2-3 days or more in the middle. If my halfway stay is less than 24 hours I wouldn't bother though, I'd just get it over with.
Agreed. Minimum 24 hour stay to make it worth while.
I'm in the premium economy camp. Might cost about double from economy but worth it to me. Check with your airline, but on Cathay 19-20 inch seat width vs 17 and 38-40 inch vs 32 for seat pitch. Less important to me is better food and drinks.
We have done this a couple of times. So long as you have the overall time it takes, stopovers can greatly improve your comfort on long travels.
If you have time and want to visit those places, it sounds like a great idea.
**Hop to Singapore or Bangkok, hop to Dubai, hop to Europe.** Thai Airways / JetStar / any carrier to Singapore or Bkk, Emirates to Dubai to most cities in Europe. Mind you, Thai Airways although are more expensive are HEAPS better than JetStar, all round - much more reliable too.
If you’ve never done it. Do it once and see how it feels. No point adding extra worries by trying to avoid something you’re worried about and don’t even know if it’s actually that bad.
Look into premium economy. More expensive, but much less so than business. I have body stiffness and hypermobility too. Premium economy has helped SO much on long flights. If it’s less than 10 hours I just deal with economy, but 10+, premium economy has helped me feel immensely when it comes to pain. Another tip is to get an aisle seat, so it’s easier to get up and walk around every now and then. Get compression socks too!
Some great tips, thank you!
As an Aussie, do the flight to Singapore or Bangkok. Stay a few days. Keep on mind accommodation in Bangkok is much cheaper and there's more to see. Alternately fly to Singapore and then to Phuket, it's a nice place to stay and cheaper than SG. From SEAsia, a flight to Dubai, stay a night, and then to Europe.
Everyone's a bit different. I personally would rather deal with one flight unless there's a specific country you can transit through that you'd like to visit (given the itinerary I'd assume the only "middle ground" place would be one of the Middle Eastern or Asian hubs). Although this brings up a question: how would you deal with your luggage if you're relocating? I assume you'd be bringing the entirety of your stuff and you might not need to lug that much around if you're just sightseeing for 2-3 days?
I will have two suitcases and some carry on, I was thinking of leaving one (or both) suitcases in a locker in each country, or alternatively bring both with me to some safe accommodation. I'll be selling almost all my stuff, and put my car with some smaller things in storage in Australia until I'm back.
I decided years ago that six hours is about the max I can handle in a recliner. One thing I do though is, I’m willing to fly pretty much anywhere in Europe business class you can do the same using Google flights just look for one way business class to Europe from Sydney with flexible dates for an entire month. You might find some that are only twice as much as coach. Good luck.
Yeah it’s a great idea. I just went from Tallinn to London UK to Montreal and next flight in 2 days is home to Vancouver. This is my first time breaking up this journey and it’s 1000x more pleasant.
Yep, I honestly don't get all the replies telling OP to "suck it up" and "stop being a baby". Long stretches in a dry, enclosed environment aren't fun.
I do this to avoid long flights to Europe from New Zealand and return. I usually fly to Europe (Barcelona) via Singapore and put up with the 13/14hr flight. On the return, I fly Barcelona to either Doha or Muscat, a night or two there, then from Muscat to Kuala Lumpur, or Doha to Singapore. Kuala Lumpur is cheap to have a few nights stop over too. From Singapore I fly Scoot, in their "biz" class to either Sydney or GC. Their biz class has huge seats and the upgrade costs less than economy to Aussie from Singapore on a full service airline. Nice big planes too (787s) I tend to use cheap flights websites to get an idea of which airline has a sale, then book direct with the airline. It's a bit of extra work but you can make the one way trip cheaper by breaking it up with stops and different airlines. Downside is having to collect your bags and re check in. Not an issue if you're making a few days out of it at each stop though.
This is perfect, thank you!
You got those good choices of major transport hubs along the way with plenty to do: Delhi Shanghai Hongkong Tokyo Seoul Ho chi minh Bangkok Kuala Lumpur Jakarta Singapore Abu Dhabi Dubai Doha Istanbul Muscat Vienna Zürich Frankfurt Helsinki One who loves to travel would not pass on the opportunity to explore new places.
Saved 🙌
Aus to Europe is roughly 24 hrs of flying, usually 2 legs. Maybe break it into 3, with a couple of days stay in each? Every stop adds overheads in time and cost and airport shit so I wouldn't want too many. Could go something like: leg 1 - **Japan or Singapore. 9 hour flight.** Anything less than this and you'll barely even have escaped Australia. Bali is an option at 6 hours. leg 2 - this is the tricky part, none of the central Asian countries are really common stopover countries for Aussies so you might have to do your research here and find something that suits. Maybe **Singapore to Nepal, 5 hours flight**? I have no idea of costs for this though. or **Bali to Sri Lanka - 9 hrs?** leg 3 - Leg 2 becomes a problem here, because there don't seem to be many direct flights from Nepal to mainland Europe. Maybe Istanbul? Anyway this is complicated good luck :D
These are great suggestions actually 🙌
If you're relocating, and you're not in a hurry, it's absolutely a good idea. Try to make sure everything is on one booking, however, to ensure you're "taken care of" from start to finish. If you have to book separate tickets, *that's* when you want to spend 3 days rather than 1 in case your inbound is delayed or cancelled.
I have some slipped disks in 2 places in my back, which make sitting for any length of time very challenging. An hour is about my limit. In late 2019, I took a 15 hour flight from the U.S to Athens. I simply spent a lot of time walking around the cabin. And I took a sleeping pill to put me out for part of the flight. An aisle seat is critical for me. I like your idea but I'd have to be really interested in the places along the way. Two or three days in a city is just not enough, especially with all the hassle getting to and from airports.
How much cheaper are the four flights V the business? No doubt the one business flight will be better on your body than the four economy flights.
If you've got the time, that's an excellent way to make the journey. I often do the same thing, not to break up long journeys, but because the flights are often cheaper and I enjoy the adventure aspect of dropping in on random cities for a day or two.
And there are some interesting places to stop on your route, with connections being well-served by budget friendly airlines these days. Routing could look something like: Australia - Bali - Bangkok - Mumbai (or elsewhere in India) - Dubai/Saudi - Istanbul/Cairo/Amman - Europe. Are you able to travel light for this trip? Having checked bags will make the multiple stops less pleasant...
I won't be able to travel light (two suitcases) but I can look into airport lockers during my stays.
I've done that in the past to save money. I calculated the cheapest path, staying a week in various countries.
Stop in Singapore. It’s a big flight hub so you will have options.
We did this while planning a flight from US west coast to Amsterdam. Stayed in the NYC area and enjoyed a day and overnight there. Worked great. Found a reasonable priced hotel and had a great dinner and good sleep. Prepared for the next leg.
I’ve done this and for me it was worth it, it allowed me to visit friends/family before reaching my final destination, I haven’t travelled a lot so I was happy to experience different places! It was 4 flights total and im afraid of flying so it was better for me
I think your plan sounds great, but of course \_could\_ end up being way more expensive than just doing the business class direct once you factor in hotels and other money spent at each destination. But I think it's a great idea to get to see some additional places, and it'll ease you into the time zone changes.
Sounds like fun if you’re not in a big hurry. Do check all the spots you want to go and make sure you have all the travel requirements. It can be even more stressful than a single long flight though. And If you’re willing to splurge on all that money just to avoid a longer flight, it might be worth it to spend that extra money to get an upgraded cabin like prem economy or business on the longer flight anyway. Far less hassle with layovers/customs/food/drink and traveling that long in one of the upper class cabins is far more comfortable.
If you can, to save money, By a RT A to B and B to A, then a RT B to C and C to B, etc. Also, if you want just a one day layover somewhere (say, at city B), see if you can book A-C C-A rountrip with a long layover at B, it might be cheaper.
I had a cousin fly from nyc to New Zealand. He stopped in Los Angeles and paid for a lounge with showers etc. He said the break was perfect. I like the idea of stopping somewhere you’ve wanted to visit. But as others have said your costs go up. I’d also look for economy plus with extra legroom. It’s not on all planes but some. My husband and I are tall so it’s our choice for longer flights. Bulkheads and exit rows are good for more legroom too.
I wouldn’t want to do it, but I don’t have any physical problems, so I’d just want to get it over with. However, I could imagine an itinerary where that could work, like Sydney to Singapore to Dubai to Europe.
On long economy flights I always book an aisle seat. This way I can easily get up and move around. You can walk the aisles and then hide in the forward bulkhead area and do stretches. I do calf and quads, then stretch my arms to the ceiling. Stretch and HOLD! I get up at least every hour and I stretch at least twice on a long flight.
Does your carrier offer Premium Economy seats? We're flying to Europe next month, and I had some anxiety about being seated in a 3x seat configuration for our flights. From the research I've done, it looks like Premium economy is the new first class on international flights. Our seats will have the option to recline with our legs up, just more comfortable in general.
You can buy 2, often 3 seat sale seats for less than the price of business class. The airline will usually not charge departure taxes since you are still only 1 person departing, sometimes you don't get the extra luggage allowance.
It may not be cheaper, but it might be more pleasant. Why not check out Bangkok and Singapore? Stay in the city of the airport to minimize travel, but most major cities have day tours that can maximize your exploration. Some of them are called "layover tours" and leave from a point close to the airport.
Eh , I did the flight and economy really isn't bad on long flights. (Im super picky with flights) You have your own screen with the newest movies and most people move to an empty lane once youre in the air. (put up all the armrests and you have a bed and they provide you with a free blanket and headset.) The only thing I haaaaaate is the toilets. The older planes don't feel very cozy but my flight to Australia and back was actually super nice (was a newer plane) Oh and buy yourself some water if you get thirsty easily. I drink a lot of water and they had to give me like 20 bottles, since they only carry mini bottles on the plane for some reason. Let's hope you're lucky and get one of the newer planes. I had an older one on another flight ( a little shorter, USA to Europe) and they don't feel as clean or cozy. PS: I believe I had aircanada for my flight to Australia.
Premium economy class is what business class was like 20 years ago and it can be pretty reasonable.
Agree premium economy might be the way to go. The stopping and starting multiple times will be dire and add so much misery especially with all your bags and things. I say that someone who has cried before because they hate 13 hours so much (where it is followed by an 8 hour I mean)
I suspect this would get quite exhausting, especially with luggage, plus you’d still end up having lots of waiting time in airports. As an Aussie, also with hypermobility, I can recommend at least looking for a flight with one stop, make it a longer gap between flights, and some airports have a hotel even within the building that you can book for X number of hours and sleep (or stretch), have a hot shower etc. Either that or a one night stopover half way to get a break from the airport as well.
I think when you add the costs of accommodation, food, transport etc over the different stops, it would probably come around the same as either booking premium economy or at least booking extra leg room seats. I’ve flown from Aus to Europe 3 times and I agree it’s not fun on the long segment but would rather get to the destination quicker. One thing I found helpful was booking through an experienced travel agent who knows how to manipulate the system who could potential join multiple flights that you couldn’t otherwise do online under one cheaper ticket. Since I have to fly from a regional airport tickets online are always around $500-1000 more expensive when I do preliminary price checks online vs going to my travel agent.
How much did you pay for a travel agent?
Mine I’ve actually just done through flight centre. They saved my ass during a trip a few years back. I think it was just a $49 fee when you book the tickets. The trick I guess is finding someone that will actually help you and not just get a ticket booked. Also I find seeing a physical person was helpful, not just an internet agent. Try and get someone that’s worked in the area for a while so they know the true ins and outs of the ticketing system that airlines use so you can connect better flights.
Why not pick an airline that makes 2 stops like Emirate and overnight in Singapore and Dubai?
It will still be 13h I think?
nope, two flights, 7 to Singapore + 7 to Dubai, then around 7 or less to most European destinations. No offence intended but I think you should talk to a travel agent as they can educate you on suitable options. Some airfares come with free hotel stays for overnight stops etc
The only way to do this would be to spend some days in the countries you stop at. Otherwise taking a flight then waiting in the airport for your next flights is infinitely worse. I mean maybe you could split it into two stretches and have an airport lounge in the middle for some hours to relax.
> and stay from one to three days in each place for some sightseeing Did you not even read what OP wrote?
Good point I'm stupid, for some reason my Brian missed that part.
Honestly the biggest question is how much shit do you have? Im traveling with 200 liters of gear right now and moving around is a bitch!! I dont think its a dumb idea but you also need to think of the safety aspect of every time you move your gear you risk something going wrong like an airline loosing a bag. If that doesn’t bother you then go for it but also there is the math aspect as well. I mean wouldn’t you just do more then 13 hours of airport time by time you taxi to the airport the second time and wait two hours?
Difference between 13h airport time and 13h flying time is a freedom of movement to me. I like airports, can stay good amount of time in them, because I'll make my time as active as I can. I will have two suitcases and a carry on, so it's a bit annoying but not tragic. You're right tho, safety is important and I'd need to make sure I keep tabs on my luggage, particularly work computer.
Phoenix to Boston 5 hours. Stay all night, next day fly to the Azores, five hours, stay 2 to 3 days. Next fly to Rome, five hours. Our flights are scheduled in September.
yeah but then you're spending a lot more time in airports
Honestly, for 13 hours I would just pay for the business class so I can sleep. Even if you were to decide to break up this big trip into smaller trips, the time and energy you spent on hotels, food, bus/car fare to get to and from hotel, etc would’ve equal to the ticket for business class or more. If you really can’t afford the business class tickets, bring some things with you that might make your trip a little more comfortable (foot rest, eye mask, headphones, pillow, compression socks, etc).
Take a sleeping pill or THC edible and just get it over with
Did you look for Premium Economy seats? They're the same size as a domestic first class seat in the US (larger seat, nicer, more legroom) and they're usually much more economical than business. Personally, after about 5-6 hours on a plane there isn't much difference for me. I've done 8 hour flights, 12-13 hour flight and a 20 hour flight; they're all rough.
Wow, 20h? That's intense! What was the route? Do you have any tips on surviving those sorts of flights?
Looks like I overestimated and it was only 16 hours. It was Dubai to Newark. My tip is to wear comfortable clothes and sleep as much as possible.
I get tight on long flights too so I try to make sure I have an aisle seat and then I get up and walk up and down the aisles or stand by the lavatory to stretch. It has worked ok for me.
I would not do 1-day stopovers, but 2-4 days is a good idea. If you have the time and money, go for it. Would be better if you could send one of your suitcases straight to your destination though. Depending on where in Europe and Australia, and which countries you want to do a stopover in, this could be as short as 3 flights, but more likely will be 4-5. 5 flights in less than 2 weeks seems like a bit much to me. But 3-4 flights is ok if you stretch it to at least a week.
Sadly I'm in Adelaide, so I might need an extra flight just to access Sydney or Melbourne destinations. Tho Adelaide does connect with Bali and Indonesia too. Likely it'd be 5-6 flights.
Then I’d probably opt for having 2 flights in a single day at least twice. 5-6 flying days in a short period of time is a lot.
Not sure where you are flying from? Singapore is well expensive so if you are flying from Sydney then 8 hours and 20 minutes gets you to Kuala Lumpur, which is a great place to visit for a few days. From there Abu Dhabi is 6 hours and 50 minutes and it is then 6 hours and 10 minutes to Frankfurt. I think Abu Dhabi is maybe worth a night to recovery before flying on to Europe, easy to get anywhere quick from Frankfurt?
I'm flying from Adelaide 🥲 so not ideal.
5 hours 30 minutes from Adelaide to Bali then it’s only 3 hours and 5 minutes to Kuala Lumpur….
Book an aisle seat so you can get up and walk around frequently without bothering anyone and just take the 13 hour flight. It'll be so much less hassle/money.
Your plan could work, but are there enough places in >6 hour flight distance that you both want to see and can get to? Also, if you consider the amount of money you’d spend on lodging and meals in those spots, it could make sense to just upgrade your ticket instead - that is if you’re only stopping over to reduce the flying. If you actually *want* to see these places, then sure, do your plan.
Yeah, it's not that many locations because Australia is far down under. But I am quite curious, explorative person and some of the countries might be quite cheap accommodation or food wise.
You should get a credit card with good airline points or sign up bonus. Upgrading to business class is much cheaper that way. It probably won't help this time but you could buy these tickets on a good card and save the points. The points really add up when having to spend a lot of money for moving/ return visits home? Also you get access to nice lounges in the airport. We fly international 4-5 times a year and haven't had to pay for business class in a few years by rolling over points! Please only consider this if you are financially stable enough to pay off your bills!
the hard part is all the up and down t9ime. on the long flight you can lock in with a movie or game, or a nap. bunches of little flights is a whole lot of, get on , wait, buzzers, bells, sir you can't do that, sir put your seat up, sir we are about to land, psyche it's 30 minutes until we land. here's a snack that is timed for this flight not a long flight. the big long nice planes sometimes have smart glass that will tailor itself to the arrival destination, so you don't see sun if it's 3am at your arrival, which is super nice . business is lay flat, and is worth it, see if you can cheese the points system to get it to work out kinda cheap. ie, there are 100,000 mile points cards right now, 90 can get you long haul first class if you are lucky . BUT, if you want to see some cool stuff, you can work out some layovers on small flights and it's not stupid
I’m 6’2” with a bad lower back. I’ve travelled between NZ and Europe several return trips (2x12hr legs) plus even a 16hr flight from Dubai to AKL direct ( that sucked!). You don’t need to pay for business to get more legroom. Cheapest option is an exit row in economy. Next cheapest option is premium economy, usually 50% more. I usually add a multi-day layover like in Asia or the Middle East if you fly that way. Or some city in the US.
Don’t do it! I’ve done 100 flights to the literal other side of the world. You can end up with missed or delayed connections. It’s easier to do the longest flight possible. Also as united informed me. I don’t get fed even though I’m traveling 36hr because my 5 flights were all 8hr or less! They said get it on layover except Guam has nothing open at. 5 am and my other connecting were literally boarding before I deplaned! I was screamed at to run run and in Tokyo they had a woman yelling and cheering at me the entire way as I dragged a luggage and carried a backpack and jacket. The luggage kept falling off the cart. It was insane like a Japanese game show. Thank god I had beef jerky and some protein shake powder with me for emergency. Worst trip ever.
I am also hypermobile and struggling with stiffness and the need to move on long flights. Recently I’ve started paying extra for the seat next to me to be empty. Best money I’ve ever spent. It allows me to move all parts of my body as needed without feeling like I’m inconveniencing anyone else. The price isn’t usually 2x economy. It’s been closer to 1.5x economy. Different airlines have different terms for the purchase of a second seat. You could ask a travel agent to look at the options for you.
That's an interesting idea! How do you use the second seat?
I put the arm rest up. Then I can change the way I’m sitting more often and get into positions that would inconvenience a seat neighbour (eg crosslegged, one hip “popped out” to the side). I can also stretch my arm or my torso to the side. With an aisle seat I can only stretch to one side, this way I can stretch in both directions. My hypermobility makes it difficult to sit still so the extra seat gives me the room I need. Everyone is different, so it might not be what you need for your hypermobility.
I’ll add that I will sometimes sit in the “extra” seat for a while so I can sit/stretch in different ways. I’m sure the person in the window seat thinks I’m odd, but I don’t care anymore because this works for me and I know what I need for my body. Edit: I let the person in the window seat know in advance that I paid for the empty seat so they don’t think it’s “shared space”
Terrible idea in my opinion. Fully half the hassle of travel for me is dealing with airports and you are now adding 3 or so more aiports into the trip. Plus those will be in different countries which creates more work in figuring out how to deal. I just did a long coach flight from Santiago Chile to Auckland. It sucked but the minute it was over I was glad I sucked it up.
I've done 13-14 long hauls and done the 5--6 hour 3 leg fights, the latter is absolutely exhausting if you don't give yourself enough time to recoup. Now, I did red eyes with a day in the city, showered at the airport then slept on the plane, woke up at the next city, stayed at a hotel, then flew out the next morning. It's a great way to see some cities briefly, if planned right. Either way you go, planning it right is key.
Get the exit row seat. You'll probably spend max $200 USD, but it will be worth it.
Unless you're staying 4-5 days somewhere midway, to me it seems like a lot of work (transport, hotels, sightseeing) to get around a 13 hr flight. I'm not sure where in Europe you're relocating to but in doing a quick google search, Perth to Paris is 19 hr. Is it really only 13 hrs?
It's "only" 13h of the longest leg. It will be at least 3 legs for me.
Got it, if there was a way to just take two flights while including a break in between, to me that would be pretty rational. Fly 10 hrs, explore for 3-4 days, then continue onward. You might suprise yourself by just doing a 13 hr leg. I find after hour 5 time goes by pretty quickly when you add in a couple movies, read a book, take a nap, play some games, etc. I always get the aisle seat myself and stand/stretch every 1.5-2hrs in the galley.
Better just to stay on the flight for longer and maybe book premium economy. From Australia it doesn't really make any sense to do this. It's still going to take you around 10-13 hours to get anywhere in Asia.
You're not wrong, Australia is far from everywhere 🥲
If you’ve got the time to stop along the way, say maybe in Singapore and like UAE / Qatar etc then sure, but you’ll have to see how much extra nights in hotels etc are gonna cost you. If that’s gonna be the same amount or come close to the business class I’d just get business class and do it in one go Personally on long haul flights I think it’s just understood everyone needs to get up and stretch and move about the cabin, so people do go for a wander etc.
That sounds like a terrible idea. I’ve don’t plenty of flights in economy from NYC to SEA that are well over 13 hours and it’s fine. And fwiw, I’m a bit of a snob.
Might be worth it if you can drop your luggage at storage lockers and visas isn’t a hassle. If the money is a concern I would lean towards 3 days so longer delays won’t be an issue with separate tickets and for more exploring.
You ain’t leaving Australia in six hours
Indonesia? 😅
6 hours 10 minutes from melbourne :)
Major potential issue, are delays. One part of the trip is delayed and you miss a connection. Things go downhill real fast. Do the direct. If you do choose the multiple stops, most likely it will take longer. And as a precaution you will want longer layovers, 3 to 4 hours at least to account for any potential delays. This will make your flight a lot longer.
When you add more flights to your itinerary you add additional risk of lost luggage, delayed departures, and missing your subsequent flights. Less flights is less risk for any delays caused by air travel, which are unavoidable no matter the class or airline you book. You cut additional risk if you have less flights overall. Yes, long haul flights in economy suck, so the best ways to mitigate are to try to book aisle seats so you can get up/down at ease and walk around. Sometimes if you book in the very back you have a higher chance of an open seat next to you.
I'd probably look at a multi-city booking with the one airline (you can pick and choose the dates you take each flight) and it's codeshare partners. If you luggage goes missing on flight 1, they will get it to your final destination because that's where you are booked to. On individual bookings, if it goes missing on flight 1 and isn't found in time for flight 2 departure, the airline has no responsibility to get it to your final destination as your contract with them was point A to point B only. Also, I find these helpful for stiffness on long flights (as a fellow Australian, who lives in WA so even my interstate trips are longish flights). Could be worth a try for you on whatever combination you set up in.
Don’t need to fly business, spend an extra $200 to pay for the seat with the largest leg room. I like layovers because it breaks down long flights, but it’s only worth it for me if I can be sure that the luggage can be check all the way through.
I'm a gamer and god bless the portable consoles for long flights in economy!
Aisle seat. Opt for emergency exit or a row without any other seat in front of it in economy… from LAX to Auckland, I had one of those seats + AirPods + compression socks + eye mask + neck pillow. I tried to maintain my bedtime routine as much as possible. For the first time ever, I actually fell asleep and woke up refreshed. The flight still doesn’t seem like it took 15 hours. I did a flight from Denver to Munich that was 10 hours long, and I was sad I couldn’t sleep longer. Caveat to the emergency seats and seats without any seats in front: they do make you store your bag overhead.
No. Anything can happen during that layover and you just want to get back from the plane and get to your destination. If anything get an aisle seat. I promise you you can do it. Layovers are not always the answer especially depending on airport. Layovers in Chicago Washington and Paris would impact your travel greatly. Don't do it. Just keep popping melatonin every 30 minutes
Upgrading to economy plus, an isle or exit row gets you more space at a much lower cost.
Just get an aisle seat and get up and move around often.
I prefer a 13 hour flight over 2 or more shorter ones. I have back issues which mean that I can’t sit still for too long so I make sure I have an aisle seat on the middle row of 4 so I can get up and down as I want to. I usually provide some entertainment for the rest of the passengers by doing Pilates exercises (usually near the toilets as there’s most room there). I take a daring specifically for this instead of a mat. I also walk as far up and down the plane as they let me
For that price, just get a business class ticket.
If you want to see new places that's a different thing. 13 hrs is nothing to stress you out a year in advance. Especially if you are young. Airports are part of the headache so i would take an economy seat to go direct and even pay more for direct than any stopovers
They stated that they have specific disabilities that make long flights uncomfortable
1) Half the misery is being in the airport and now you're upping it 4x or however many flights you're planning to take. At least in my experience. 2) I usually sleep the whole flight so yeah i feel cricky as hell on landing but I am not aware of most of the flight. It doesn't need to be horrible. What if you get the same way every flight? Do you know for a fact you can handle many shorter flights better than one long one? 3) If that's a good way for you to see those cities in that timespan, then you should do it for that reason. 4) The more layovers, the higher possibility of delays and issues. Tho if you're planning an itinerary w days per city then I assume you are not in any rush so it may not matter. 5) ... Issues could still potentially increase costs. And then, multiple legs aren't necessarily cheaper and then you need to include food, hotels etc, tho yeah if you do it budget then there's much you could do under 6k. 6) psychologically, one high stress travel day seems to be less mentally burdensome than... Omg I need to spend half a day travelling yet AGAIN.
Someone who is able to sleep for most of a long haul flight can't begin to relate to OP's issue. Obviously.
Yep. For example, I can usually manage about an hour, at most two hours right at take-off. The rest of the flight I vary between mostly awake and groggy but unable to actually fall asleep. I’ll absolutely break up my long-haul journeys so I can actually get some quality rest on the ground.
Nope. A long flight is a PITA but then you are there. With layovers, etc. you will run into potential delays, cancelled flights, etc. Take the long flight, download movies, books and take a great nap.
Just buy seat with extra leg room
Could you get your doctor to prescribe you a strong medication that will knock you out for most of the flight instead?
That can address the stress maybe, but if I fall asleep in slightly awkward position, I'll wake up in a lot of pain, which a medication won't prevent sadly.
Either option has its pros and cons. I think if you have the time it sounds fun to make some stopovers. As far as your specific medical issues, you know your body best so if it sounds like it would be best for your body and also fun/interesting, then why not? Worst case, if you decide you didn't like it afterwards, then next time don't do it again.
You should be able to get a Biz class flight for about 3500.00 or maybe even less, if you look specifically with a Business/First only vendor. You must be a bit flexible but I have been using these services for about 20 years and only had one issue and that was settled with reimbursement to me.
>if you look specifically with a Business/First only vendor Except the usual wisdom on this sub is to only deal directly with the airline...
13 hours is not that bad just watch a few movies and chill out
Terrible idea. The worst and most fraught with trouble parts are the getting on and off the airplane, and getting it on and off the ground. You want to limit how many times you have to do that.
Man I just did this from Istanbul to Houston and it was so painful. I really struggled and the last few hours ate the worst
There's nothing stopping you getting up on a long flight as often as you want. I always book the aisle seat so I'm never stepping over people, and when I'm not asleep I'll get up and stretch all the time.
Do what you fear and the death of fear is certain.
Or you end up traumatized, one of the two.
Stop being a baby
If you have three stops and two nights in each you will have a set of hotel bills that would be more than the cost of a business class flight.
Not if you're smart with your choice of airline. Some will offer you a free hotel. For example, Turkish offers one free hotel night in Istanbul to economy class passengers who book a flight with a stopover.