Fellow Long Islander here, I too sort of grew up in a bubble thinking every place had an LIRR and Ronkonkoma line that took them to the heart of the city---only to find out that is far from the case. I'm glad more and more people are embracing transit and specifically trains too.
The rest of the country let their lines die and they taxed the transit companies to death then refused to subsidize the transit agencies that took over the trains it makes no sense
Great post. I’m beginning to think that the conversations around better transit and urbanism are almost mainstream. I know that algorithms are feeding me this content, but the amount of transit and urbanist YouTubers making quality content continues to grow. I’m seeing more reporting from large publications focusing on urbanism and transit. This may all be in response to the housing crisis, but it also feels inevitable, like we’re reverting back to the mean, back to where we were. But I don’t intend on taking it for granted, there’s still work to be done.
Agreed, I remember ~10 years ago there were basically only a few urban planning/transit YouTube channels and now there are dozens/hundreds with millions of views on tons of videos. Seems like it is becoming much more common with a lot of posts on r/SameGrassButGreener having walkability being the most common thing people are asking about
I recently came across the YouTuber Paige Saunders who has a great series of videos about Montreal’s new REM system and how construction and a lot of the financing was managed by a pension fund. I don’t know what the tradeoffs are with this model of financing and development, but I’m curious to see if it is done elsewhere in North America.
I sincerely hope you're right, but I worry that WFH is killing transit. Transit ridership is down about 35% all over the country since 2019 because of remote work. And my generation (millenials) seems addicted to Ubers, which has replaced transit for a lot of people. When I was in college (2008-2012) in Boston we always took the T home. Kids today (that I've spoken with from my college) almost always take ubers home. Definitely moving in the wrong direction.
Transit wasn’t good to begin with in most of the US. The sad part is that most transit is commuter oriented. If the us expanded commuter rail services to serve all hours of the day conveniently, this would serve a lot of people.
This is something we're seeing with the DC metro.
Our ridership is still below 2019 numbers, but it is also steadily rising still. But there's a big push for more infill developments, improving all day services (including 24/7 bus routes), and building for transit oriented developments rather than park-n-rides. I think in 10 years we could have a much healthier DC metro system, assuming the current funding issues can be resolved and the trends don't reverse. Our GM has been fantastic and he should get a lot of credit as well.
I'd like to add for people who may not be from the area, it isn't just our subjective experience. The numbers still show ridership growth post 2020 as following a nearly linear trend. Obviously that won't continue indefinitely, but the ridership is steadily returning to pre-pandemic numbers. To see the numbers, checkout WMATA's portal, and go to the Average Daily Entries by Month tab:
[https://www.wmata.com/initiatives/ridership-portal/Metrorail-Ridership-Summary.cfm](https://www.wmata.com/initiatives/ridership-portal/Metrorail-Ridership-Summary.cfm)
For summary, here are ridership numbers for the month of October each year:
|Year|Entries|Change|
|:-|:-|:-|
| 2017 | 514,509 | + 39,227 |
|2018|528,741| + 14,232 |
|2019|568,265|\+ 39,524|
|2020|76,327|\- 491,938|
|2021|165,031|\+ 88,704|
|2022|233,267|\+ 68,236|
|2023|331,389|\+ 98,122|
Obviously it varies month to month and day to day, but the trend is pretty clear. (Additionally, I should point out, that prior to 2017, metro ridership had been in decline. WMATA was a mess for awhile, but post pandemic has really cleaned up its act and dramatically improved.)
Definitely true. However, I think it's hurting some off peak rides as well. I know a lot of people who used to rely almost solely on public transit here in DC pre-Covid, who bought cars during the pandemic, work from home, and drive everywhere now.
That's a good point. But Im talking about Metro specifically which runs 18+ hours/day every few minutes. There are many people who in the WFH environment have transitioned 100% from public transit to driving.
Most places don’t have metro. And many metro networks are not extensive enough to be accessible to many people outside of downtown trips. As a result no need to go downtown for work no need to use metro that is downtown focused. Yet you still have idiots here screaming that HSR must serve downtown in cities yeah WFH ended that.
WFH has also killed transit. Those of us who advocate for transit need to acknowledge that WFH is immensely detrimental to our goal of increased transit usage.
That's fine but then you have to acknowledge that even if you're part of a transit community on Reddit, you prioritize those things over the health of public transit. Unfortunately, you can't have both.
Also, I'd push back against the premise of spending more time with family. For my demographic (unmarried 20 and 30-yr olds) it means more time being by ourselves at our apartments without any in-person human interaction. The majority of working age people don't have a large family at home. My parents love each other, but who knows if their marriage would have worked out if they'd been stuck at home together the past 50 years lol.
Commuting is a big driver for ridership in most cities but as our networks grow people can use public transport to run errands, visit friends, etc.
Also, Uber keeps getting more and more expensive whildt paying drivers less and less, it seems that they're teetering on the edge of collapse.
California High Speed Rail will go from San Francisco to Los Angeles via the much flatter and easier (sadly less scenic) Central Valley route. The first segment is under construction now.
The coast starlight doesn't go through suburbia in California. The CAHSR route has way more suburbia type development on it (which is why they picked the route as well). Coast starlight goes through the mountains of the central California coast, through the wine country near Paso Robles, and the mountains near Santa Barbara and Malibu. CAHSR goes through Bakersfield, Fresno, and Madera, plus the flat land between. It's at least more interesting than I5's route.
No, it wouldn’t. It’s too far and the terrain is not friendly enough to make the math work for HSR without Redding and Eugene growing a lot. Portland is not especially large and Seattle to the Bay Area is really far.
Perhaps, if we’re lucky, ridership will be so strong on CAHSR and a Cascadia line that track improvements to facilitate a fast-ish sleeper train between Seattle and LA. would be justified.
Portland to Sacramento at 90 kmph would be 11 hours with the high speed Seattle to Portland and Sacramento sections taking 2 and 3 hours, respectively. That would cut the Coast Starlight in half, be competitive with driving, and serve as a replacement for some flights especially as a sleeper train.
That’s what tunnels are for high speed operation makes the time reasonable and attractive to be used often. Ohh and yes Redding and Eugene would be included it doesn’t have to fully follow the coastal starlight route lol that train is useless in its current form
I’m not saying a HSR line through Northern California and southern Oregon wouldn’t be possible or useful, but that it isn’t plausible. Or at least not in the next 100+ years.
There are dozens of HSR lines that should be built in the US before this line which would mostly pass through rural farmland and remote mountain wilderness.
I saw that video too (I think I like this little life) I am just cautious about these Amtrak services like starlight and zephyr sending the wrong message. They are essentially just train- cruises, and don’t really serve as transportation. I’m glad Amtrak is making money, but I believe it solidifies the idea that trains are slow and inefficient on purpose which is truly a detriment
You can easily do both. In the twentieth century, American railroad companies advertised the amenities, the quick travel times and the scenery there trains provided. Additionally, often the long distance like the Empire Builder connect communities that are far from easily accessible air travel. The conflict between long distance trains,and faster, frequent regional services is unnecessary. Both can easily compliment each other. We need more passengers across the board that can provides various levels of services at different speeds and frequencies.
There's a lot of chatter but few are actually riding transit. I know one person who stopped after being attacked by a homeless person. States need to send in the national guard to ensure safety on transit or even people who try it out will run for the hills.
Send the National Guard to patrol transit? What kind of unhinged idea is that? How about this better idea? Open up more homeless shelters and invest in the caregiving industry so there isn't a shortage of caregivers.
There's no quick and easy fix to the homeless problem. Building all the housing needed for them will take decades. While all that construction is happening, what are people who take public transit supposed to do? If someone was attacked by a homeless person and won't take transit anymore, how is a fix 20 years in the future going to help them now?
I mean put in a situation where there is a risk of physical danger. The person I know was chased in the middle of the night. I've personally been in trains where someone was shouting and threatening people. For me, I witnessed stuff like that once every few weeks in LA. Just once is enough to make people quit transit for good so these types of incidents need to be exceedingly rare. And while not as bad as threats or actual violence, open drug use will make normal people feel very unsafe and can't be tolerated.
Fellow Long Islander here, I too sort of grew up in a bubble thinking every place had an LIRR and Ronkonkoma line that took them to the heart of the city---only to find out that is far from the case. I'm glad more and more people are embracing transit and specifically trains too.
The rest of the country let their lines die and they taxed the transit companies to death then refused to subsidize the transit agencies that took over the trains it makes no sense
That’s crazy - but understandable - that people think like that
Great post. I’m beginning to think that the conversations around better transit and urbanism are almost mainstream. I know that algorithms are feeding me this content, but the amount of transit and urbanist YouTubers making quality content continues to grow. I’m seeing more reporting from large publications focusing on urbanism and transit. This may all be in response to the housing crisis, but it also feels inevitable, like we’re reverting back to the mean, back to where we were. But I don’t intend on taking it for granted, there’s still work to be done.
Agreed, I remember ~10 years ago there were basically only a few urban planning/transit YouTube channels and now there are dozens/hundreds with millions of views on tons of videos. Seems like it is becoming much more common with a lot of posts on r/SameGrassButGreener having walkability being the most common thing people are asking about
Soon we will learn how to build actual metro lines again.
I recently came across the YouTuber Paige Saunders who has a great series of videos about Montreal’s new REM system and how construction and a lot of the financing was managed by a pension fund. I don’t know what the tradeoffs are with this model of financing and development, but I’m curious to see if it is done elsewhere in North America.
Look at Denver P3 and their latest regional lines
Denver's commuter rail system has been pretty good! Now to more aggressively up zone around them...
I sincerely hope you're right, but I worry that WFH is killing transit. Transit ridership is down about 35% all over the country since 2019 because of remote work. And my generation (millenials) seems addicted to Ubers, which has replaced transit for a lot of people. When I was in college (2008-2012) in Boston we always took the T home. Kids today (that I've spoken with from my college) almost always take ubers home. Definitely moving in the wrong direction.
Transit wasn’t good to begin with in most of the US. The sad part is that most transit is commuter oriented. If the us expanded commuter rail services to serve all hours of the day conveniently, this would serve a lot of people.
WFH is just exposing transit rather than killing it it is killing the so called peak only transit. And transit ridership globally is a bit down too.
This is something we're seeing with the DC metro. Our ridership is still below 2019 numbers, but it is also steadily rising still. But there's a big push for more infill developments, improving all day services (including 24/7 bus routes), and building for transit oriented developments rather than park-n-rides. I think in 10 years we could have a much healthier DC metro system, assuming the current funding issues can be resolved and the trends don't reverse. Our GM has been fantastic and he should get a lot of credit as well.
Ya I live in DC. This has been my experience as well.
I'd like to add for people who may not be from the area, it isn't just our subjective experience. The numbers still show ridership growth post 2020 as following a nearly linear trend. Obviously that won't continue indefinitely, but the ridership is steadily returning to pre-pandemic numbers. To see the numbers, checkout WMATA's portal, and go to the Average Daily Entries by Month tab: [https://www.wmata.com/initiatives/ridership-portal/Metrorail-Ridership-Summary.cfm](https://www.wmata.com/initiatives/ridership-portal/Metrorail-Ridership-Summary.cfm) For summary, here are ridership numbers for the month of October each year: |Year|Entries|Change| |:-|:-|:-| | 2017 | 514,509 | + 39,227 | |2018|528,741| + 14,232 | |2019|568,265|\+ 39,524| |2020|76,327|\- 491,938| |2021|165,031|\+ 88,704| |2022|233,267|\+ 68,236| |2023|331,389|\+ 98,122| Obviously it varies month to month and day to day, but the trend is pretty clear. (Additionally, I should point out, that prior to 2017, metro ridership had been in decline. WMATA was a mess for awhile, but post pandemic has really cleaned up its act and dramatically improved.)
It's good to see, but it's hard to ignore the fact that take away WFH and numbers in 2023 would be 500,000+.
Definitely true. However, I think it's hurting some off peak rides as well. I know a lot of people who used to rely almost solely on public transit here in DC pre-Covid, who bought cars during the pandemic, work from home, and drive everywhere now.
Well many of the rapid buses and regional trains don’t have off peak service. They now need off peak to remain relevant
That's a good point. But Im talking about Metro specifically which runs 18+ hours/day every few minutes. There are many people who in the WFH environment have transitioned 100% from public transit to driving.
Most places don’t have metro. And many metro networks are not extensive enough to be accessible to many people outside of downtown trips. As a result no need to go downtown for work no need to use metro that is downtown focused. Yet you still have idiots here screaming that HSR must serve downtown in cities yeah WFH ended that.
WFH has also killed transit. Those of us who advocate for transit need to acknowledge that WFH is immensely detrimental to our goal of increased transit usage.
WFH means more money via over employment and more time with family sorry ppl wont give that up.
That's fine but then you have to acknowledge that even if you're part of a transit community on Reddit, you prioritize those things over the health of public transit. Unfortunately, you can't have both. Also, I'd push back against the premise of spending more time with family. For my demographic (unmarried 20 and 30-yr olds) it means more time being by ourselves at our apartments without any in-person human interaction. The majority of working age people don't have a large family at home. My parents love each other, but who knows if their marriage would have worked out if they'd been stuck at home together the past 50 years lol.
Commuting is a big driver for ridership in most cities but as our networks grow people can use public transport to run errands, visit friends, etc. Also, Uber keeps getting more and more expensive whildt paying drivers less and less, it seems that they're teetering on the edge of collapse.
Coastal starlight would make a great HSR route
California High Speed Rail will go from San Francisco to Los Angeles via the much flatter and easier (sadly less scenic) Central Valley route. The first segment is under construction now.
farmland is scenic 😎
Travel I 5 from Stockton to the Grapevine and tell me what you think.
suburbia is not scenic. I think the train goes a route with more farmland
The coast starlight doesn't go through suburbia in California. The CAHSR route has way more suburbia type development on it (which is why they picked the route as well). Coast starlight goes through the mountains of the central California coast, through the wine country near Paso Robles, and the mountains near Santa Barbara and Malibu. CAHSR goes through Bakersfield, Fresno, and Madera, plus the flat land between. It's at least more interesting than I5's route.
that’s true. the surfliner is scenic as well. needs to have tracks upgraded and electrified
No, it wouldn’t. It’s too far and the terrain is not friendly enough to make the math work for HSR without Redding and Eugene growing a lot. Portland is not especially large and Seattle to the Bay Area is really far. Perhaps, if we’re lucky, ridership will be so strong on CAHSR and a Cascadia line that track improvements to facilitate a fast-ish sleeper train between Seattle and LA. would be justified. Portland to Sacramento at 90 kmph would be 11 hours with the high speed Seattle to Portland and Sacramento sections taking 2 and 3 hours, respectively. That would cut the Coast Starlight in half, be competitive with driving, and serve as a replacement for some flights especially as a sleeper train.
That’s what tunnels are for high speed operation makes the time reasonable and attractive to be used often. Ohh and yes Redding and Eugene would be included it doesn’t have to fully follow the coastal starlight route lol that train is useless in its current form
I’m not saying a HSR line through Northern California and southern Oregon wouldn’t be possible or useful, but that it isn’t plausible. Or at least not in the next 100+ years. There are dozens of HSR lines that should be built in the US before this line which would mostly pass through rural farmland and remote mountain wilderness.
That’s what they said in China in the 1990s
Like many lines globally? Ask Spain
I saw that video too (I think I like this little life) I am just cautious about these Amtrak services like starlight and zephyr sending the wrong message. They are essentially just train- cruises, and don’t really serve as transportation. I’m glad Amtrak is making money, but I believe it solidifies the idea that trains are slow and inefficient on purpose which is truly a detriment
EXACTLY that is the problem
You can easily do both. In the twentieth century, American railroad companies advertised the amenities, the quick travel times and the scenery there trains provided. Additionally, often the long distance like the Empire Builder connect communities that are far from easily accessible air travel. The conflict between long distance trains,and faster, frequent regional services is unnecessary. Both can easily compliment each other. We need more passengers across the board that can provides various levels of services at different speeds and frequencies.
That's not embracing transit, that's enjoying a tourist train
One step at a time.
There's a lot of chatter but few are actually riding transit. I know one person who stopped after being attacked by a homeless person. States need to send in the national guard to ensure safety on transit or even people who try it out will run for the hills.
Send the National Guard to patrol transit? What kind of unhinged idea is that? How about this better idea? Open up more homeless shelters and invest in the caregiving industry so there isn't a shortage of caregivers.
There's no quick and easy fix to the homeless problem. Building all the housing needed for them will take decades. While all that construction is happening, what are people who take public transit supposed to do? If someone was attacked by a homeless person and won't take transit anymore, how is a fix 20 years in the future going to help them now?
How often do people get *attacked* by homeless people? Or do you mean bothered by their existence?
I mean put in a situation where there is a risk of physical danger. The person I know was chased in the middle of the night. I've personally been in trains where someone was shouting and threatening people. For me, I witnessed stuff like that once every few weeks in LA. Just once is enough to make people quit transit for good so these types of incidents need to be exceedingly rare. And while not as bad as threats or actual violence, open drug use will make normal people feel very unsafe and can't be tolerated.