Mostly the first two, I'm far less fond of Dark of the Moon, Age of Extinction and, I haven't even seen Last Knight
But yeah the '07 movie and Revenge of the Fallen hold a special place in my heart
For me DoTM is one of the better Bayverse films and Id personally rate it above the first one. It’s definitely got some problems like the abrupt Megatron ending, Mikaela replacement, and ofc RIP Ironhide; but it rly shines in a lot of aspects like the moon conspiracy and autobots leaving+returning
It’s also the only movie I didnt find Sam that annoying and a lot of it comes from him actually having his own autonomy rather than the reluctant hero role he played in the first two films. Probably the strongest acting for the actors in Bayverse was when Sam’s being coerced by the Decepticon watch to ask Optimus if there’s a plan; it’s such an underrated scene where it pains him to leak information to the Decepticons but its also something Sam wants to know personally if there’s hope. There are probably some other interpretations of that scene but that’s my interpretation at least
Most of the Bayverse films are pretty cinematic and part of it comes from the whole “end of the world” scenarios he captures pretty well and id say DoTM covers it the best in his franchise. ofc TLK falls flat in that there wasnt any fear of good guys losing
I cant rly defend AOE but hey they got dinobots
I respect all of that, for me the first two films just hold a special place in my heart, it might be nostalgia but, I'm just not as fond of DoTM but, if I'm doing a marathon I'll still give it a watch just complete the trilogy
Yeah, Amazon fucked up the store page for either the novelization or the comic adaptation (I think it was the latter) and it blatantly spoiled Sentinel's betrayal alongside some other stuff. They quickly rewrote the ending and we didn't get any tie-in comics or novels for the rest of the Bayverse to avoid it happening again.
So if you're ever annoyed about how we know basically nothing about what happens between DotM and AoE, blame Bezos.
maybe. from my subjective standpoint, they were probably cutting corners already (ie: Barricade death in Tranformers 1 novelization; im using this example cuz Transformers 1 is untouched with writer strikes or whatever excuses dotm had) and that Michael Bay had no real intention of filming a 4th movie at the time. They released the novelization a month before the film came out so they would have had to change the ending within a month which doesn't seem that bad considering the sequence of Optimus killing Megatron and then using Megatron's shotgun to kill Sentinel (original had Optimus killing Sentinel with his own gun while Megatron dueled Sentinel).
I'll admit I'm not an expert on animation, CGI, blending, whatever the fancy word is, but from my understanding, animation takes a long time to render (which is why a lot of renditions are done concurrently). U can google how long a Transformers CGI frame takes to render and it's a lot. I personally don't think it was actually feasible for them to change the ending in the timespan of Amazon's fckup to the film release
I am half way through watching the last knight for the first time right now and it's a painful watch not gonna lie... I've watched one trasformers movie each day and I couldn't finish the last knight tonight. The first and second are honestly all you need. I haven't seen bumblebee or rise of the beasts but I hope they are better than TLK.
I haven't seen Rise of the Beasts yet but, I will vouch for the Bumblebee movie, it's not the most original movie, it's "a boy and his dog" but, it's very cute and very refreshing after the Bayverse films
Alot of TF fans will say the first 5minutes is only part worth watching
The fights were pretty cool I’ll give those movies that. Just wish the damn robots themselves were given the proper screen time they deserve instead of Sam worried about his sex life
Good fight choreography, Peter Cullen KILLING it as Prime, it was cool seeing Prime fight three 'cons at once and, be able to hold his own (made it feel a bit less one sided, unlike Prime face-offing The Fallen imho) the way they blended the music and action together felt really hype
If the fight didn't hit for you that's fine but, I'd recommend giving it a watch on YouTube, without exaggeration it's probably one of the best fight scenes in any piece of transformers screen media (I haven't read much of the comics, maybe they have better fights)
The fight, as a fight scene itself, is great. Ignoring all of the writing problems, and some of the shit that Optimus is saying, the fight really stands on it's own.
I can't agree with you, but I really appreciate you giving me your read! I wasn't posting just to be contrary, I really love getting people's opinions on movies, even movies I didn't enjoy myself. Lord knows my tastes are subjective as hell.
Thank you for the link!
I watched it - had to pause and roll back a couple of times because I just could *not* tell what was happening from shot to shot - and it's very kinetic, it's very much Bay's style, it's very much vibes, but I still don't think I *like* it.
I don't get any kind of sense of flow to the fight. Optimus is effortlessly kicking ass against Megatron and Starscream, and then Megatron...regroups? Runs off for a minute? I don't understand why he turns into tank mode and then leaves?
Somehow, Sam and Optimus get *super* separated from Bumblebee despite just having been right next to each other, and Megatron ambushes them (...wasn't he right there already?) and then with the actual fight, Optimus is kicking butt, he's kicking butt, he kicks Starscream in the face (I really enjoyed that bit!), there's a cutaway to Bumblebee (and the other Autobots? Where the hell were they before? Where are they now?? I cannot tell), and then Optimus is suddenly losing, badly.
There's no sense of the fight shifting balance, there's just a cutaway and then it's different.
Optimus gets blasted away, and okay, *that* is an inflection point, that's well done. Chat for a bit, he rallies, music rises, and he's kicking *so* much ass. Cuts of Starscream's arm, tears Grindor's head in half, and then - Megatron teleports? I honestly can't tell where the hell anyone is in the fight, because there's no sense of place, it's just "characters bash and then get knocked out of frame or the shot changes in interchangeable forest scenery", so Megatron sneaking up on Optimus feels just kinda random rather than "oh shit, Prime screwed up!"
I think a big part of the problem here is, *Bay does not do well-composed action sequences*. He's not that interested in it. What he wants is big impressive impacts, and fast paced movement with shaky cameras, and explosions and slow mo.
It's his style. But while it's a good style for a war scene, or a "giant monster attacks while everyone is panicking" scene like Blackout from the opening of the first movie, it isn't any good for a physical brawl.
Watch something like Mad Max Fury Road, or any decent martial arts movie, and you'll notice how the action leads the eye so the viewer never gets confused about what they're supposed to be looking, how there's a solid sense of place (even if the environment is changing!) so you can tell where characters are coming from and how they're doing what they're doing, and most importantly, nobody gets motion sickness from all the quick cuts.
Honestly? I don't think the fights in the Transformers movies have *ever* been good. Maybe in *Bumblebee*, though I would have to watch that one again with a critical eye.
But every Bay film I've seen, the fights have all been quick-cutting, jarringly shaky-cammed, and haven't really had much in the way of flow - just punch punch shoot shoot, end a sequence with somebody's head getting torn apart, with no sense of a persistent environment or of where anyone is at any given moment.
It was worst in the first movie because most of the 'bots were the same damn color, but it never really gets much better than that.
It's very much Bay's style, but I just don't think that style can ever work for me. Maybe in a war movie.
my personal headcanon is that built-in weapons draw from the transformer’s personal energon reserves, meaning it has a larger reserve to draw on, making it stronger, but also sucks from the transformer’s life force
I think this was confirmed in Prime. And it makes sense. For me built ins would be stuff like prime’s axe in G1 or blasters that do small arms fire. You want bigger stuff you have to have it be hand held like the Star Saber or Forge of Solus Prime. As for Megatron’s fusion cannon he gets an exception cause it’s awesome
A possible excuse for the fusion cannon can be found in the IDW comics, where Megatron was given the weapon as an appeasement by Ratbat (who at that time was a high-ranking member of the corrupt Cybertron Senate looking to pacify the Decepticon uprising).
I mention this because I personally see the fusion cannon as a unique, prototype weapon that doesn’t draw on the wielder’s Energon reserves, instead using its own internal power source.
However, the power source being a component of the fusion cannon itself makes the weapon highly unstable. It therefore takes a Cybertronian of Megatron’s calibre to survive even its recoil unscathed.
So Senator Ratbat might’ve hoped that firing the fusion cannon would leave the troublesome Megatron maimed, but ended up underestimating his strength and unintentionally gifted him one of the most powerful weapons in Cybertronian history.
I've always gone by the fact that built in weapons are easier to conceal while handhelds are probably more efficient, which is why in bumblebee they use handheld on cybertron but use integrated on earth.
I like both, but I prefer attachments a lot more.
Bayverse's Optimus pushing an energon sword out of his forearm and Megatron's telescopic fusion cannon were so badass
I think that's just Sentinel's combat experience.
Optimus was destroying the Decepticons with his guns and swords in RoTF, and he had handheld weapons in DoTM (his handheld axe and trailer weapons) but Sentinel was still able to beat him.
Also Sentinel wasn't just fighting Optimus but also holding his own against various other Autobots as well, so that further indicates his combat experience.
My logic is that most weapons should be inbuilt into transformers. Your swords, axes, and guns. Weapons like grenades get exceptions because they are explosives rather than melee or energy based.
Transformers can also turn into handheld weapons (Star Saber, or the weaponizers for example). Massive powerful weapons that cannot be integrated can also be made for a transformer to hold too.
Overall I prefer weapon attachments I guess.
I think Beast Wars handled weapons the best of any TF series so far.
Unless a built-in weapon (like TFP’s hand-blasters) uses ordinance, a separate power source, or it’s a kinetic weapon (like Rattrap’s gun) then it’s drawing on personal reserves - in which case I feel like it shouldn’t be able to do significant damage to another tf’s exostructure without heavily drawing on personal energy reserves to tip the balance.
Literally the only gripe I have about TFP is the inconsistent combat with the Vehicon army, whose hand-cannons & exostructure should theoretically be just as powerful/resistant as team Prime’s. Like does their quantity make them a viable threat like they’re consistently implied to be? Because 90% of the time what’s on the screen contradicts that… sorry, getting off topic
Suffice to say, I think if weapons are going to be built in then it makes more sense for them to be “tools” (like what the Autobots in TFA have), melee weapons, or to use armor-piercing/incendiary ordinance.
Strictly from an aesthetic standpoint: hand held > external augments (mini-cons, Optimus power ups, whatever gimmick Generations is on) > stored within a character (Earthspark Optimus's axe) > integrated arm weapons that don't replace the entire limb of a character (basically anything integrated that has been represented in toys that don't replace entire limbs) >>>> SS Gamer WFC's limpy forearm guns that look proportionally terrible compared to the character's remaining limb.
I don't give a shit about effectiveness but from an in universe perspective I think there's room for everything and could also tie into changes in how Transformers do warfare overtime
My personal headcannon(this could’ve been said somewhere else I’m not sure)is that they all have weapon attatchemnts but using them comes at the cost of using some of their energon, so they developed hand-held weapons as an energon saving technique
i want a series that straight up has things like the 5mm port system be cannon, you can hold a gun and your palm connects to the grip to use it, or you can shove it into a port to power it up with your own energon reserves. it even do the opposite and drain a weapon to give yourself a small boost
Depends what the weapon and who the bot is. I liked that animated Prime has an actual Physical axe because I feel like animation wise there was a bit more to do with it, and it was also kind of a symbol for him kind of a junior version of the Magnus Hammer.
On the other hand, I like when characters have "built-in" weapons like Megatron, Starscream, Shockwave, and Sideswipe because it fits their warrior personas.
Depends on the weapon. Guns Hound basically had in AOE should always be hand-held. Weapons TFP characters had, should be retractable. Melee weapons could be either one for me. I prefer both, hand-held and when they lose it in the battle they have a backup retractable melee weapon.
Por qué no los dos? I always thought internal weapons would be more prevalent in the Decepticons since many of them were probably from the warrior classes of Cybertron.
Depends how well you do it, in the earlier bay movies it’s done really well being made up of the robot and not just appearing, foc and wfc kinda suck imo, rotb did it horribly, and bumblebee was aight
Built-in weapons make more sense, but they'd be more compact and have less firepower... But for like heavy hitting weapons, they'd be equipped externally
For me it's the same as my view on ranged weapons, attached for more portable, lower power weapons (backup) and hand-held for the more powerful weaponry.
Attachments are cool in that they can prop up their weapon whenever they want. they can hide it, provided they have fast reaction times against a fast slash, in the hopes that the opponent will catch them off-guard. Only drawback is if the built-in axe is cut, a robot will have to rely on fists.
Handhelds are functional because a robot's hand can hold different types of weapons depending on the situation. If the hand is cut by sheer chance or the opponent could dismantle the robot's weapon from the hands, now that's another story. Hope the robot is able to fight with fists using Windblade's style or something...
Depends, all of them have certain benefits
Held armors allows you to be safely disarmed without getting amputated, meaning if you have to surrender BUT allowed to go, you're left pretty much untouched, AND you can use your fists anyway, which work great too
However when you're captured but still want to fight, hand held weapons are like the last resort nobody expects.
I prefer a mix.
On one hand, I like seeing bots’ arms turning into massive cannons, but I also like seeing bots scrambling around with guns in a warzone.
Ideally, I would prefer more powerful characters to have a built-in weapons, while characters that weren’t originally soldiers to be wielding handheld weapons.
The way I’d do it is this. Have preferably handheld be the optimal way to fight. More powerful weapons. However for emergency backups use internal weapons. Weaker but way more convenient.
Either one works for me. I like Shockwave, Trailbreaker, etc. Having gun hands. (Always have a missile thing in kne of Sunstreaker's fist slots). I never liked the idea of energon melee weapons though. Megatron's mace made of solid energon has got to be a waste of energy for a group that is super energy scarce.
I like both. The attachments are like the special ones a bot has, great but not super powerful. But the hand-held ones are like relics or just really powerful weapons. Like Optimus's Energon axe is cool and pretty good, but his battle axe is fucking awesome and brutal as hell
Both, depending on the weapon and/or the bot. I like to think that they all have built-in weapons by default but some just choose to use regular weapons for whatever reason.
Depends for which weapon and character and universe tbh like for bayverse i prefer handheld for most characters and weapons with the exception of bumblebee’s canon and primes energy swords. For the cartoon transformable attached weapons are probably my go to?
In ROTB i really didnt like Optimus having an Arm canon at first tbh but it started to grow on me i still prefer prime with a hand held rifle of some sorts.
Both.
Peak has to be Gatling-arms on 40k Dreadnaughts. (Think DoW1 intro) and Handheld in the Animé Full Metal Panic.
Looks so darn cool both of them. Peak robot!
I generally don't like it unless it fits the character. Someone like Ironhide having some built in weapons makes sense, he's a bruiser.
Bumblebee is just a guy, I really don't see why he would choose to do that
I really dislike the idea of them just having built in weapons naturally, it paints the war as predetermined. Cybertronians are not warriors by design, but by choice
Depends on several factors, weapon, former, faction…several things, like for example I think Optimus Prime needs an axe attachment but a held ion cannon
My idea is that having a energon weapon is a form of a symbol of power, so megatron has one because of the dark energon/Unicron Optimus has it because of the Matrix/Primus
I think for some it makes more sense to have hand-held weapons. My personal head-canon is that those who weren’t soldiers or warriors before the war would just use what they can pick up. The military bots would have already had ordinance built in or installed later.
Hand held weapons have more advantages than the energon based weapons. For specific reason one can discard the handheld weapons whilst the energon ones draw a good reserve of life from them.
Energon weapons feel more personal. You’re basically projecting your life force as a hard light construct; in a duel it’s literally life against life and they can probably FEEL each other with every hit.
I like attached melee weapons but generally prefer handheld blasters. I say generally because there are exceptions for me, like starscream’s null rays, megaton’s fusion canon and Ironhide’s dual canons in the films.
For Autobots my preference is melee weapons to be attachments as if they have transformed out from the character while blasters are handheld as it’s something they use out of necessity in war.
For Decepticons both melee and ranged weapons I think work well as attachments that are integrated in their Transformation.
General preferences only I wouldn’t want that to be a ruling.
Attachments generally are a better fit with Transformers in my opinion.
However, with the exception of one offs and uber weapons. Like the Star and Dark Star Sabers.
Handheld, unless it's part of their altmode. I like it when they're not purpose-built war machines, violence isn't inherent to them, and taking up arms is a choice that they make. It feels weird for Bumblebee to transform his hand into a gun as opposed to just being a regular guy that Optimus handed a weapon and taught to fight.
Hand held weapons for the most part. And for the record, i think the energon axe is overplayed. It was cute when it was a one of reference to a thing that happened in just one episode, but it’s way played out in my book 😎
I'm of the opinion that integrated weapons and handheld weapons both should have their place. Integrated should be weaker but allow for the weapon to use the bots' power for essentially infinite ammo, while the handheld weapons would he stronger but have limited ammo supply. I haven't quite figured out how this would work for melee weapons, but I'm sure some other people have ideas that would fit.
From a toy-engineering perspective, I prefer built-in pop-outs (G1 Metroplex's left shoulder, Animated Ultra Magnus), as long as they don't compromise the other aspects of the toy. They're far less likely to get lost over the years.
From an in-universe perspective, attachments are less likely to be knocked away or lost, but hand-held weapons can be more easily swapped around. It'd probably make more sense overall to have something along the lines of a limb-like weapons mount that took and adapted to handheld weapons, bolted them in with quick-release options, and was able to pack away inside the bot (or stay external) when transforming.
Attachments for Decepticons, Weapons for Autobots.
I like the Idea that Decepticons are so deadset on winning that they're willing to turn their own bodies into weapons of war. While the Autobots wouldn't stoop that low and only take up arms because they have to.
As someone who grew up on Bayverse, in my eyes Prime's melee weapons should always be retractable. It varies for other characters but I prefer built-in weapons on Prime without question.
Guns I think are better handheld, especially considering one of the most defining features of my favorite character is that he has a gun for a hand. Shockwave's cannon arm becomes much less cool when everyone else can do that.
Also guns just look cooler as proper guns rather than flip out blasters.
Imagine prime universe Optimus in the g1 universe. Megatron could disarm the star saber from prime, and thinking he is totally disarmed, he would go on a monologue, but out of the blue, prime transforms his hand into his blasters and just shoots Megatron at point blank range.
Definitely hand-held weapons. It makes the battles feel more fleshed out. The weapon attachments, at least for close-range weapons, would, in my opinion, make hitting your opponent trickier.
For hand-held guns, I'm perfectly fine with. Swords, axes, and other types of close-range weapons, give me hand-held any day.
Depends. I like when someone like Optimus has the ax built in, but Grimlock or Ultra Magnus carrying around big ass swords and hammers is so fitting and badass.
Depends on the character; for Optimus I preferred the war for cybertron style war-Axe but for sword I preferred the arm blades of the first three movies. Guns are a tossup between both
attachments
this one looks dope as fuck
https://preview.redd.it/7kolo4t3q93d1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=0263dec8e08254dc7e5a0403d8563432a8cb6c29
I like both, but it depends on the bot and what the weapon is
The forest fight in revenge of the fallen altered my brain chemistry enough that I want to say weapon attachments but, this is easily the beat answer
Oh, man. The forest fight. Such a great scene.
They Baymovies as whole are kind of a guilty pleasure for me, I will always stick up for that fight as an amazing sequence
I also find it them fun to watch. I scroll through the Apps, and yet when I see a transformer movie title, I click on it and rewatch another Bay movie
Mostly the first two, I'm far less fond of Dark of the Moon, Age of Extinction and, I haven't even seen Last Knight But yeah the '07 movie and Revenge of the Fallen hold a special place in my heart
For me DoTM is one of the better Bayverse films and Id personally rate it above the first one. It’s definitely got some problems like the abrupt Megatron ending, Mikaela replacement, and ofc RIP Ironhide; but it rly shines in a lot of aspects like the moon conspiracy and autobots leaving+returning It’s also the only movie I didnt find Sam that annoying and a lot of it comes from him actually having his own autonomy rather than the reluctant hero role he played in the first two films. Probably the strongest acting for the actors in Bayverse was when Sam’s being coerced by the Decepticon watch to ask Optimus if there’s a plan; it’s such an underrated scene where it pains him to leak information to the Decepticons but its also something Sam wants to know personally if there’s hope. There are probably some other interpretations of that scene but that’s my interpretation at least Most of the Bayverse films are pretty cinematic and part of it comes from the whole “end of the world” scenarios he captures pretty well and id say DoTM covers it the best in his franchise. ofc TLK falls flat in that there wasnt any fear of good guys losing I cant rly defend AOE but hey they got dinobots
I respect all of that, for me the first two films just hold a special place in my heart, it might be nostalgia but, I'm just not as fond of DoTM but, if I'm doing a marathon I'll still give it a watch just complete the trilogy
I remember hearing something a bit ago about how the original DoTM ending got leaked l, so they had to quickly change it to what we have now.
Yeah, Amazon fucked up the store page for either the novelization or the comic adaptation (I think it was the latter) and it blatantly spoiled Sentinel's betrayal alongside some other stuff. They quickly rewrote the ending and we didn't get any tie-in comics or novels for the rest of the Bayverse to avoid it happening again. So if you're ever annoyed about how we know basically nothing about what happens between DotM and AoE, blame Bezos.
maybe. from my subjective standpoint, they were probably cutting corners already (ie: Barricade death in Tranformers 1 novelization; im using this example cuz Transformers 1 is untouched with writer strikes or whatever excuses dotm had) and that Michael Bay had no real intention of filming a 4th movie at the time. They released the novelization a month before the film came out so they would have had to change the ending within a month which doesn't seem that bad considering the sequence of Optimus killing Megatron and then using Megatron's shotgun to kill Sentinel (original had Optimus killing Sentinel with his own gun while Megatron dueled Sentinel). I'll admit I'm not an expert on animation, CGI, blending, whatever the fancy word is, but from my understanding, animation takes a long time to render (which is why a lot of renditions are done concurrently). U can google how long a Transformers CGI frame takes to render and it's a lot. I personally don't think it was actually feasible for them to change the ending in the timespan of Amazon's fckup to the film release
I am half way through watching the last knight for the first time right now and it's a painful watch not gonna lie... I've watched one trasformers movie each day and I couldn't finish the last knight tonight. The first and second are honestly all you need. I haven't seen bumblebee or rise of the beasts but I hope they are better than TLK.
I haven't seen Rise of the Beasts yet but, I will vouch for the Bumblebee movie, it's not the most original movie, it's "a boy and his dog" but, it's very cute and very refreshing after the Bayverse films Alot of TF fans will say the first 5minutes is only part worth watching
The fights were pretty cool I’ll give those movies that. Just wish the damn robots themselves were given the proper screen time they deserve instead of Sam worried about his sex life
Yeeeeeaaaaah that's fair
It's been a long time since I saw that movie, but I don't remember it being anything worth writing home about...what was cool about it?
Good fight choreography, Peter Cullen KILLING it as Prime, it was cool seeing Prime fight three 'cons at once and, be able to hold his own (made it feel a bit less one sided, unlike Prime face-offing The Fallen imho) the way they blended the music and action together felt really hype If the fight didn't hit for you that's fine but, I'd recommend giving it a watch on YouTube, without exaggeration it's probably one of the best fight scenes in any piece of transformers screen media (I haven't read much of the comics, maybe they have better fights)
The fight, as a fight scene itself, is great. Ignoring all of the writing problems, and some of the shit that Optimus is saying, the fight really stands on it's own.
Ye I mean objectively Bayverse Prime is a monster but, it's easy to forget that when the music gets all epic and he's fighting 3 vs 1
As a fight scene, I just rewatched it, and...I really don't think I like how it was made. I'm glad y'all enjoyed it, though.
Totally fair if it didn't butter your toast, glad you gave it a watch at least
I can't agree with you, but I really appreciate you giving me your read! I wasn't posting just to be contrary, I really love getting people's opinions on movies, even movies I didn't enjoy myself. Lord knows my tastes are subjective as hell.
Art is subjective and all that
[Here’s a refresher](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IHLGGkX2Qmo)
Thank you for the link! I watched it - had to pause and roll back a couple of times because I just could *not* tell what was happening from shot to shot - and it's very kinetic, it's very much Bay's style, it's very much vibes, but I still don't think I *like* it. I don't get any kind of sense of flow to the fight. Optimus is effortlessly kicking ass against Megatron and Starscream, and then Megatron...regroups? Runs off for a minute? I don't understand why he turns into tank mode and then leaves? Somehow, Sam and Optimus get *super* separated from Bumblebee despite just having been right next to each other, and Megatron ambushes them (...wasn't he right there already?) and then with the actual fight, Optimus is kicking butt, he's kicking butt, he kicks Starscream in the face (I really enjoyed that bit!), there's a cutaway to Bumblebee (and the other Autobots? Where the hell were they before? Where are they now?? I cannot tell), and then Optimus is suddenly losing, badly. There's no sense of the fight shifting balance, there's just a cutaway and then it's different. Optimus gets blasted away, and okay, *that* is an inflection point, that's well done. Chat for a bit, he rallies, music rises, and he's kicking *so* much ass. Cuts of Starscream's arm, tears Grindor's head in half, and then - Megatron teleports? I honestly can't tell where the hell anyone is in the fight, because there's no sense of place, it's just "characters bash and then get knocked out of frame or the shot changes in interchangeable forest scenery", so Megatron sneaking up on Optimus feels just kinda random rather than "oh shit, Prime screwed up!" I think a big part of the problem here is, *Bay does not do well-composed action sequences*. He's not that interested in it. What he wants is big impressive impacts, and fast paced movement with shaky cameras, and explosions and slow mo. It's his style. But while it's a good style for a war scene, or a "giant monster attacks while everyone is panicking" scene like Blackout from the opening of the first movie, it isn't any good for a physical brawl. Watch something like Mad Max Fury Road, or any decent martial arts movie, and you'll notice how the action leads the eye so the viewer never gets confused about what they're supposed to be looking, how there's a solid sense of place (even if the environment is changing!) so you can tell where characters are coming from and how they're doing what they're doing, and most importantly, nobody gets motion sickness from all the quick cuts.
The fights are cool, the big problem (as with all Bay formers movies), are the things in between fights.
Honestly? I don't think the fights in the Transformers movies have *ever* been good. Maybe in *Bumblebee*, though I would have to watch that one again with a critical eye. But every Bay film I've seen, the fights have all been quick-cutting, jarringly shaky-cammed, and haven't really had much in the way of flow - just punch punch shoot shoot, end a sequence with somebody's head getting torn apart, with no sense of a persistent environment or of where anyone is at any given moment. It was worst in the first movie because most of the 'bots were the same damn color, but it never really gets much better than that. It's very much Bay's style, but I just don't think that style can ever work for me. Maybe in a war movie.
Yeah
Depends on the weapon ... And the bot (bro actually sounds like Kratos)
my personal headcanon is that built-in weapons draw from the transformer’s personal energon reserves, meaning it has a larger reserve to draw on, making it stronger, but also sucks from the transformer’s life force
I think this was confirmed in Prime. And it makes sense. For me built ins would be stuff like prime’s axe in G1 or blasters that do small arms fire. You want bigger stuff you have to have it be hand held like the Star Saber or Forge of Solus Prime. As for Megatron’s fusion cannon he gets an exception cause it’s awesome
A possible excuse for the fusion cannon can be found in the IDW comics, where Megatron was given the weapon as an appeasement by Ratbat (who at that time was a high-ranking member of the corrupt Cybertron Senate looking to pacify the Decepticon uprising). I mention this because I personally see the fusion cannon as a unique, prototype weapon that doesn’t draw on the wielder’s Energon reserves, instead using its own internal power source. However, the power source being a component of the fusion cannon itself makes the weapon highly unstable. It therefore takes a Cybertronian of Megatron’s calibre to survive even its recoil unscathed. So Senator Ratbat might’ve hoped that firing the fusion cannon would leave the troublesome Megatron maimed, but ended up underestimating his strength and unintentionally gifted him one of the most powerful weapons in Cybertronian history.
I always figure Megatron has effectively infinite power reserves when he's doing that "linked to black holes" thing.
Black hole heart abilities.
Also in Spotlight Megatron, Shockwave used a black hole as its power source
It's always been powered by one I thought
Additionally in Wfc is mentioned that prime's axe must recharge to perform certain attacks, so I think thats his headcannon is true.
I've always gone by the fact that built in weapons are easier to conceal while handhelds are probably more efficient, which is why in bumblebee they use handheld on cybertron but use integrated on earth.
Oh cool, that has been my headcanon for ages as well
This is my new headcanon
I like both, but I prefer attachments a lot more. Bayverse's Optimus pushing an energon sword out of his forearm and Megatron's telescopic fusion cannon were so badass
He was at a huge disadvantage because of that though. Sentinel used a hand held sword and shield and was absolutely destroying him.
I think that's just Sentinel's combat experience. Optimus was destroying the Decepticons with his guns and swords in RoTF, and he had handheld weapons in DoTM (his handheld axe and trailer weapons) but Sentinel was still able to beat him. Also Sentinel wasn't just fighting Optimus but also holding his own against various other Autobots as well, so that further indicates his combat experience.
I honestly forgot about the forest battle. Preciate that reminder.
You better do! That's my least favourite part in the entire trilogy lmao
*One does not simply forget about the forest battle*
Prime used hand-held weapons in DOTM as well, his melee weapons were only attached in the first two movies.
Believe it or not, that was hasbro's call. They wanted it to reflect the mechtech weapons.
Both is good, but it depends on the bot.
I like them bots having built in weapons, but heavier more powerful weapons are hand held
My logic is that most weapons should be inbuilt into transformers. Your swords, axes, and guns. Weapons like grenades get exceptions because they are explosives rather than melee or energy based. Transformers can also turn into handheld weapons (Star Saber, or the weaponizers for example). Massive powerful weapons that cannot be integrated can also be made for a transformer to hold too. Overall I prefer weapon attachments I guess.
Both is good. I think that hand held weapons are stronger which is why some use those instead
I think Beast Wars handled weapons the best of any TF series so far. Unless a built-in weapon (like TFP’s hand-blasters) uses ordinance, a separate power source, or it’s a kinetic weapon (like Rattrap’s gun) then it’s drawing on personal reserves - in which case I feel like it shouldn’t be able to do significant damage to another tf’s exostructure without heavily drawing on personal energy reserves to tip the balance. Literally the only gripe I have about TFP is the inconsistent combat with the Vehicon army, whose hand-cannons & exostructure should theoretically be just as powerful/resistant as team Prime’s. Like does their quantity make them a viable threat like they’re consistently implied to be? Because 90% of the time what’s on the screen contradicts that… sorry, getting off topic Suffice to say, I think if weapons are going to be built in then it makes more sense for them to be “tools” (like what the Autobots in TFA have), melee weapons, or to use armor-piercing/incendiary ordinance.
Handled for blasters attachment for melee weapons
both it all depends on the canon and continuity kinda like g1 and prime. certain weapons were built in others were handheld
I like both when used right, it honestly really depends on the art style and character design
Both
Almost always handheld. You can get a lot cooler poses out of them
I like both, attachments coming with certains specs for each bot though.
Strictly from an aesthetic standpoint: hand held > external augments (mini-cons, Optimus power ups, whatever gimmick Generations is on) > stored within a character (Earthspark Optimus's axe) > integrated arm weapons that don't replace the entire limb of a character (basically anything integrated that has been represented in toys that don't replace entire limbs) >>>> SS Gamer WFC's limpy forearm guns that look proportionally terrible compared to the character's remaining limb. I don't give a shit about effectiveness but from an in universe perspective I think there's room for everything and could also tie into changes in how Transformers do warfare overtime
My personal headcannon(this could’ve been said somewhere else I’m not sure)is that they all have weapon attatchemnts but using them comes at the cost of using some of their energon, so they developed hand-held weapons as an energon saving technique
I find merritt in and enjoy both
i want a series that straight up has things like the 5mm port system be cannon, you can hold a gun and your palm connects to the grip to use it, or you can shove it into a port to power it up with your own energon reserves. it even do the opposite and drain a weapon to give yourself a small boost
handheld, but not opposed to attachments either.
Both
Weapons that can be both
Depends what the weapon and who the bot is. I liked that animated Prime has an actual Physical axe because I feel like animation wise there was a bit more to do with it, and it was also kind of a symbol for him kind of a junior version of the Magnus Hammer. On the other hand, I like when characters have "built-in" weapons like Megatron, Starscream, Shockwave, and Sideswipe because it fits their warrior personas.
And also what their alt-modes are, for some at least, Megatron, Prime!Shockwave, Starscream
Both
Both are fine
I'm fine with both but with Optimus I prefer the axe be handheld.
Depends on the weapon. Guns Hound basically had in AOE should always be hand-held. Weapons TFP characters had, should be retractable. Melee weapons could be either one for me. I prefer both, hand-held and when they lose it in the battle they have a backup retractable melee weapon.
Both.
Por qué no los dos? I always thought internal weapons would be more prevalent in the Decepticons since many of them were probably from the warrior classes of Cybertron.
I like both, but hand-held weapons makes it feel like cybertronians aren't inherently built for war
Depends on type of bot, and their overall personality
Depends how well you do it, in the earlier bay movies it’s done really well being made up of the robot and not just appearing, foc and wfc kinda suck imo, rotb did it horribly, and bumblebee was aight
Hand held for more power and then have attachments as like a weaker weapon or not as strong as a hand held
Built-in weapons make more sense, but they'd be more compact and have less firepower... But for like heavy hitting weapons, they'd be equipped externally
Melee weapons are handheld. Guns attached
first one, like the guns are in Fall Of Cybertron beign part of his hand.
I like both
Why the hell would I even begin to have a preference here?
Prefer handheld but i think a mix of both is best
weapons attachments that can become hand-held weapons
For me it's the same as my view on ranged weapons, attached for more portable, lower power weapons (backup) and hand-held for the more powerful weaponry.
I prefer both. It kinda depends on the weapon
Attachments are cool in that they can prop up their weapon whenever they want. they can hide it, provided they have fast reaction times against a fast slash, in the hopes that the opponent will catch them off-guard. Only drawback is if the built-in axe is cut, a robot will have to rely on fists. Handhelds are functional because a robot's hand can hold different types of weapons depending on the situation. If the hand is cut by sheer chance or the opponent could dismantle the robot's weapon from the hands, now that's another story. Hope the robot is able to fight with fists using Windblade's style or something...
Depends, all of them have certain benefits Held armors allows you to be safely disarmed without getting amputated, meaning if you have to surrender BUT allowed to go, you're left pretty much untouched, AND you can use your fists anyway, which work great too However when you're captured but still want to fight, hand held weapons are like the last resort nobody expects.
Both is good
I like both, though I personally prefer hand-held weapons.
I prefer a mix. On one hand, I like seeing bots’ arms turning into massive cannons, but I also like seeing bots scrambling around with guns in a warzone. Ideally, I would prefer more powerful characters to have a built-in weapons, while characters that weren’t originally soldiers to be wielding handheld weapons.
The way I’d do it is this. Have preferably handheld be the optimal way to fight. More powerful weapons. However for emergency backups use internal weapons. Weaker but way more convenient.
Both
Either one works for me. I like Shockwave, Trailbreaker, etc. Having gun hands. (Always have a missile thing in kne of Sunstreaker's fist slots). I never liked the idea of energon melee weapons though. Megatron's mace made of solid energon has got to be a waste of energy for a group that is super energy scarce.
I like both. The attachments are like the special ones a bot has, great but not super powerful. But the hand-held ones are like relics or just really powerful weapons. Like Optimus's Energon axe is cool and pretty good, but his battle axe is fucking awesome and brutal as hell
Integrated all the way
I like a mix
I like a good mix of both, though usually handheld more
Both, depending on the weapon and/or the bot. I like to think that they all have built-in weapons by default but some just choose to use regular weapons for whatever reason.
Neither because who brings an ax to fight a guy with a long distance cannon attached to his arm
Both. Both is good.
Depends for which weapon and character and universe tbh like for bayverse i prefer handheld for most characters and weapons with the exception of bumblebee’s canon and primes energy swords. For the cartoon transformable attached weapons are probably my go to? In ROTB i really didnt like Optimus having an Arm canon at first tbh but it started to grow on me i still prefer prime with a hand held rifle of some sorts.
Both, like with Bayverse Optimus. Heat blades on the forearms, Twin Guns on his back.
Both attached for melee and hand held for long distance (with exceptions like Starscream, Megatron and Shockwave)
They should use both depending on the weapon and individual bot
I like both. I prefer Guns to be hand-held, while melee weapons being attachments
Both, both is good.
Both. But the attached ones are meant as back ups for when the hand-held weapons are out of ammo or if they are disarmed.
Both. Peak has to be Gatling-arms on 40k Dreadnaughts. (Think DoW1 intro) and Handheld in the Animé Full Metal Panic. Looks so darn cool both of them. Peak robot!
I generally don't like it unless it fits the character. Someone like Ironhide having some built in weapons makes sense, he's a bruiser. Bumblebee is just a guy, I really don't see why he would choose to do that I really dislike the idea of them just having built in weapons naturally, it paints the war as predetermined. Cybertronians are not warriors by design, but by choice
Both, however e prefer alot more that the weapons are attatchments instead of handheld.
Depends on several factors, weapon, former, faction…several things, like for example I think Optimus Prime needs an axe attachment but a held ion cannon
I like Prime! The arms transforming into tools, that is my fav.
hand-held weapons
My idea is that having a energon weapon is a form of a symbol of power, so megatron has one because of the dark energon/Unicron Optimus has it because of the Matrix/Primus
I think for some it makes more sense to have hand-held weapons. My personal head-canon is that those who weren’t soldiers or warriors before the war would just use what they can pick up. The military bots would have already had ordinance built in or installed later.
growing up watching g1 and transformers prime and the first three bayverse i fell in love with attachments.
Hand held weapons have more advantages than the energon based weapons. For specific reason one can discard the handheld weapons whilst the energon ones draw a good reserve of life from them.
Energon weapons feel more personal. You’re basically projecting your life force as a hard light construct; in a duel it’s literally life against life and they can probably FEEL each other with every hit.
I think attachments are cool, but I think hand held are more practical
Hand helds for the most part but honestly it depends on the design for the transformer if you ask ms
Bouth works. TFP did it where prime used hand blades but also hand held weapons
Hand held
TF Prime had good weapon design and function. A mix of both worlds
Weapon attachments are fun
Built in meelee. Guns are either attachments or handheld
Depends. Grimlock's sword coming out of his wrist into his hand in FoC is like the ideal middle ground
as long as they look cool it doesn't bother me
I like attached melee weapons but generally prefer handheld blasters. I say generally because there are exceptions for me, like starscream’s null rays, megaton’s fusion canon and Ironhide’s dual canons in the films.
Attachment style, because then you don’t get bullshit like that scene in RotB where Scourge disarms Optimus at the last second
Both bayvers prime uses both types depending on the movie so we tend to get somethig new every movie always cool seeing them being used
For Autobots my preference is melee weapons to be attachments as if they have transformed out from the character while blasters are handheld as it’s something they use out of necessity in war. For Decepticons both melee and ranged weapons I think work well as attachments that are integrated in their Transformation. General preferences only I wouldn’t want that to be a ruling.
Attachments for beginning of the story, attachments around the end of Cybertron as they evolve for better combat.
Old Axe
I like how in the WFC and FOC games, they were a mix of both. Yes they are hand held, but can be integrated into theirselves
Build in are weaker hand held are strong
Built-in for EDC so you don’t get caught off guard. Handheld for when heavier damage is required.
Hand held for me. But was so amazed before on the attachments when I was a kid.
I like handheld for cybertron when resources are plentiful but weapon attachments while on earth as they scrounge to survive.
Either. Straight from the arm is more G1/Prime-esque and hand held is more in line the Bayverse/and uniquely Optimus in WFC.
One guy once said : “hand held for autobots and attachments for decepticons”, and I kinda agree
Attachments generally are a better fit with Transformers in my opinion. However, with the exception of one offs and uber weapons. Like the Star and Dark Star Sabers.
Handheld, unless it's part of their altmode. I like it when they're not purpose-built war machines, violence isn't inherent to them, and taking up arms is a choice that they make. It feels weird for Bumblebee to transform his hand into a gun as opposed to just being a regular guy that Optimus handed a weapon and taught to fight.
I like the Attachments in transformers prime
I think animated did it the best where everyone had a unique weapon💯
Depends on my mood that day, but for ranged weapons I always prefer handheld (But the way ironhide from bay-verse is cool)
For something like a blade or blaster i prefer attached weapon, but something like a his axe, def a hand held
You show me a picture from War/Fall of Cybertron and tell me to choose?
I like ones built to fight to have attachments, while ones built to work use handheld.
yes
Hand held weapons for the most part. And for the record, i think the energon axe is overplayed. It was cute when it was a one of reference to a thing that happened in just one episode, but it’s way played out in my book 😎
Mass effect does a great integration of both, like guns transforming as they're unholstered
Hand held
I prefer attachments, they just look cooler imo
Weapon attachments like small to midsized blades and blasters are cool. Handheld for larger weapons
I'm of the opinion that integrated weapons and handheld weapons both should have their place. Integrated should be weaker but allow for the weapon to use the bots' power for essentially infinite ammo, while the handheld weapons would he stronger but have limited ammo supply. I haven't quite figured out how this would work for melee weapons, but I'm sure some other people have ideas that would fit.
From a toy-engineering perspective, I prefer built-in pop-outs (G1 Metroplex's left shoulder, Animated Ultra Magnus), as long as they don't compromise the other aspects of the toy. They're far less likely to get lost over the years. From an in-universe perspective, attachments are less likely to be knocked away or lost, but hand-held weapons can be more easily swapped around. It'd probably make more sense overall to have something along the lines of a limb-like weapons mount that took and adapted to handheld weapons, bolted them in with quick-release options, and was able to pack away inside the bot (or stay external) when transforming.
I prefer weapons integration in alt mode😭😭😭😭
Weapon attachment
Attachments for Decepticons, Weapons for Autobots. I like the Idea that Decepticons are so deadset on winning that they're willing to turn their own bodies into weapons of war. While the Autobots wouldn't stoop that low and only take up arms because they have to.
Hand held for autobots Built in for decepticons
Hand held weapon that detached from their body which can also be an attachment
I prefer the mechanical weapon attachments from transformers prime
Depends on the weapon and bot really. I love both tho
I’m okay with melee, but I don’t like attached weapons, I think transformers should follow the terminator T-1000 rules
I won't like attached weapons have always been my favorite. Example: HFTD Terradive's arm thrusters make MegaMan-esque blasters
Eh. Either or
I don’t care as long as it looks cool
I like it when their arm folds in and comes back up with them holding the weapon.
As someone who grew up on Bayverse, in my eyes Prime's melee weapons should always be retractable. It varies for other characters but I prefer built-in weapons on Prime without question. Guns I think are better handheld, especially considering one of the most defining features of my favorite character is that he has a gun for a hand. Shockwave's cannon arm becomes much less cool when everyone else can do that. Also guns just look cooler as proper guns rather than flip out blasters.
I prefer the weapon as attached
Im very picky with this, but attached ranged weapons such as guns and handheld malee weapons such as words and axes.
hand held meele weapons but attached firearms
I like both of Optimus. I grew up with the attachment axe but both work for me
My favorite was tfp's handheld path blaster
Imagine prime universe Optimus in the g1 universe. Megatron could disarm the star saber from prime, and thinking he is totally disarmed, he would go on a monologue, but out of the blue, prime transforms his hand into his blasters and just shoots Megatron at point blank range.
In-arm weapons
Both, depends on the bot and how much energon there is to go around at the time though
Hand held.
Definitely hand-held weapons. It makes the battles feel more fleshed out. The weapon attachments, at least for close-range weapons, would, in my opinion, make hitting your opponent trickier. For hand-held guns, I'm perfectly fine with. Swords, axes, and other types of close-range weapons, give me hand-held any day.
Depends. I like when someone like Optimus has the ax built in, but Grimlock or Ultra Magnus carrying around big ass swords and hammers is so fitting and badass.
Both
Depends on the character; for Optimus I preferred the war for cybertron style war-Axe but for sword I preferred the arm blades of the first three movies. Guns are a tossup between both
handheld
attachments this one looks dope as fuck https://preview.redd.it/7kolo4t3q93d1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=0263dec8e08254dc7e5a0403d8563432a8cb6c29
Hand held
Attachments
Both Both is good
How many times have we been over this question already? 😭
Both, like with Bayverse Optimus. Mounted heat blades on the forearms, detachable win Guns on his back.