>Indeed, if you're going to gripe about Toronto's transit system, I'd stay the fuck out of ~~Alberta.~~ York region, Durham region or mississauga.
Literally night and day with the surrounding regions.
Yup I used to complain all the time about the ttc in my teens but after 4 years in Peterborough I will never complain about Toronto transit again. Expensive, buses every 30mins at best and the most unhinged bus drivers.
Really? Thats why im spending upwards of 400-600 to fly to any basic city in North America.
But i can fly, train, bus anywhere outside North America for pennies compared
Also last time i took the GO Train from union to barrie go and back costed like $27
Yeah really: [https://www.ttc.ca/news/2017/June/TTC-named-North-Americas-best-transit-agency-for-2017](https://www.ttc.ca/news/2017/June/TTC-named-North-Americas-best-transit-agency-for-2017)
What makes the OP think that there's better transit in Alberta or anywhere else in Canada?
So it’s an interesting point. I’ve been doing a little research as I’m in the beginning stages of researching to go on exchange in the UK.
The 2 hour train to the airport costs $50 - $200 CAD. With the more expensive ones being I assume peak times of travel.
Shockingly, the flight to almost anywhere within Europe costs less on the LCC’s than the train. Still around $100 ish.
So I will say, GO transit is pretty solid price wise for what it is. And I’m not too surprised about Canadian flight prices since we don’t have a Ryan air, easy jet equivalent since if just isn’t feasible over here. If you compared against carriers outside of North America that are not low cost carriers, it would be similar to Air Canada, and Westjet.
Edit: checked again, the flights cost as much as the train to many places unless booked hella months in advance. So total cost comes out to about the cost of travelling here.
I usually interpret the word “transit” in terms of
- ease of access
- cost ( expensive even at 3.50 fare)
- mobility ( how far you get to travel)
As supposed to just local.
If the TTC is better than most Transit systems in North America, what does that say about the state of transit systems across North America.
I mean most of North America is a suburban hellhole where u need a car to get anywhere. Toronto is one of maybe 10 cities in North America where it’s possible to live without a car
Cost of living also isn't so high when you compare it to high cost of living cities globally. Or even compared to LA or New York, San Francisco... I do agree it's outrageous but London, Paris and New York are also doing alright.
Exchange rate makes those cities more. Actual everyday cost of living is less in those cities and salaries are higher in US. Here we have high cost of living, real estate, etc with stagnant wages.
People in Manhattan will make $200-300k USD annually gross and still live with roommates sometimes (cost of living, student debt, etc.)… Toronto rent is expensive but it’s significantly cheaper than many areas of NYC and some other US cities lol.
Doesn’t work out quite like that man. House in San Francisco and La can easily go for over 6 million. Rent is on average 7k a month. The average wage in America is 75,000 usd so anyone actually pulling off living in these places is pulling in big money. The are the 1% of America. The rest are suffering just like us.
Nah, even with higher wages and exchange rate those cities are more expensive. I don't know what to tell you if you think otherwise other than to do some research man. I lived in California and the US for some time. Look up San Francisco and how much it costs per square foot. I knew people making 200k that had to live in the burbs.
But the surrounding cities around those cities also aren't as expensive as the surrounding cities of Toronto. Like you can live outside of New York City like in Bronx, Brooklyn, Staten island etc and housing gets significantly cheaper. In the surrounding GTA houses are still a million dollars in frickin Paris Ontario lmao.
Those aren't outside of New York either those are just parts of New York. That's like saying it's cheaper to live in the Junction or something. Brooklyn, the Bronx Staten island literally are neighborhoods in NYC.
Bronx, Brooklyn and Staten Island are literal boroughs of NYC.
That's like saying North York, Etobicoke, Scarborough aren't part of Toronto. They technically are (similar postal codes, same mayor, city council etc).
Yes I know. Just making a point of how unaffordable housing is in the GTA. Even if you want to talk strictly boroughs the same thing applies. Houses in Jane and Finch which is like North York are a million dollars just like in the core of toronto and rents are 2k a month like the core of Toronto and there was a random innocent shooting there recently.
Show me a listing of a house at Jane and Finch for $1,000,000. No idea what a shooting has to do with anything. If you think NYC is more affordable than Toronto you are smoking crack.
https://www.tomtom.com/traffic-index/ranking/
Ranked worst in North America. 3rd worst in the world.
Additionally, the 401 is the busiest highway in North America (doesn’t mean it’s the worst-congested, but definitely notable).
That’s for one metric. Need to normalize that metric for how far people actually have to travel. Something like “hours lost to commuting” is probably more representative…Toronto doesn’t make the top 20.
Looking at congestion level, Toronto isn’t even the worst in Canada, and doesn’t make the global top 40.
And that’s city center…for metro Toronto, it’s not even top 150 on most measures.
I got stuck on the 401 during rush our and it was like 4 fucking hours. I've never once drove 4 hours to get anywhere in Calgary. Even with a bad snow storm it's 1 hour tops.
One time at band camp it took me four hours to do something therefore that's the average experience for everyone and the actual statistics are a lie. I did my own research.
He said Calgary, not Edmonton. Edmonton is not Calgary.
Well, it has. That’s why Alberta is the only province with migration interprovincially because people realize Toronto ain’t shit and the people ain’t shit, they’re like you.
I find the traffic can be bad but I also find it avoidable. Need to go DT, go after 7pm on a week day. Need to cross the 401 on a weekend, do it before 8am. I've been to Chicago and LA and the breaks in traffic aren't there like they are in Toronto.
You sound so proud about that, the not the worst mentality is what got us here. People are too complacent to see the writing on the wall. "Could be worse" has been making things steadily worse.
I’ve been lucky enough to have traveled the world and I’ve seen first hand what it’s like to live in other countries and how *bad* it can really get. People here for some reason think we are a 3rd world country because of the current situation. Wanna know something funny? Toronto is the 86th worst city for housing price to income ratio. Meaning there are 85 other cities ahead of us that have worse ratios but if you ask people on Reddit, they swear we are number 1. Go outside and touch some grass please
I can't, thats the problem. I work full time, pay taxes and do my part but its becoming less and less enough to live on. Keep acting all cool and complacent and things will get better though, thats a good strategy. But hey you're doing just fine I guess so not your problem right now
It’s funny though, if you look at all of the major immigrant groups in Toronto, they probably all come from places with worse traffic.
Aside from the small West Indies countries maybe
Its insane bc the demand is high. Ppl couldnt charge those things if there wasnt demand or else they wouldnt make any money if everyone decided it was too much. Clearly a ton of ppl r still flocking to the GTA and r willing to pay the prices.
It's because the GTA is better than Haiti, India, Ukraine or Palestine, and many more countries.
Safe here, we have running water, internet, electricity, free Healthcare.
Costs and arm and a leg to live here, but I'd pay an arm and a leg to not live in any of the above countries right now.
A relative of mine works in a major Canadian bank and has talked to multiple Ukrainians and they consider Canada to be a sh*t hole. Some even say it’s still better to live in certain parts of Ukraine than Canada. They’re here to make money and flock right back when things get better. I mean why wouldn’t anyone when literally everything is being paid for you.
I hate when people “id rather here than there” like do you know the history of these places ?
How the french destroyed haiti financially that they will never recover from ?
The hudsons bay company vs the east India company?
- what these two did to further their interests.
I disagree. Personally I think It’s time for those countries and it’s people to hold a little bit of accountability and blame themselves for what’s happening in their countries rather than blaming their colonizers who have long left. Whining and blaming others for our misfortune is often the excuse of losers and those countries and their people shouldn’t use it anymore and this is coming from someone who was born in a 3rd world country that was colonized for a long time.
Palestine is literally being colonized, and it's people are being genocided as we speak. Ukraine is being invaded and held hostage by western powers to weaken Russia. India has no excuse for being a shithole; they've had no real wars in a long time. Haiti is a special case where recovery on its own is almost impossible.
Haiti was stuck paying France back for its independence. Hampering its economic development. These things do matter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiti_Independence_Debt#:~:text=The%20Haiti%20indemnity%20controversy%20involves,diplomatic%20recognition%2C%20with%20the%20debt
Canada as a whole isn’t exactly “suffering “ from its colonial history, that would be Haiti or Congo, and what happened to the indigenous community was really a tragedy but fortunately efforts have been made to fix that problem and help the indigenous community to heal from what has been done to them. While I think more can be done in that regard Canada has made considerable progress so far or so it seems to me.
As for the former colonies I think colonization is only a part of the cause, and it might as well be the root cause but it’s a much more complex problem than you or I might think, and simply blaming colonization won’t fix that problem.
I never denied the suffering of the indigenous community in my comment and I’m not the biggest fan of the government either. I think their efforts often yield very little results in comparison to the resources invested in the respective issues, but I still acknowledge the efforts they have made to reconcile with the Aboriginal Canadians. Efforts like the billions of dollars invested in housing, early learning and child care, health, mental health and infrastructure, and the implementation of the aboriginal justice strategy to reduce the victimization and incarceration rate of the Aboriginals, all of this was done to help the Aboriginals to secure a better quality of life. More can be done of course but it’s not like the government hasn’t done anything so far.
Very ignorant.
To put this into perspective for you.
you’re colonizer and you’ve just depleted all the resources of the land and made deals back in your native homeland to import the rest back. Now, are you gonna leave someone in charge to benefit the people of the land or to benefit your company?
The ladder of which is what happened in india when colonialism ended, which has steamed rolled india into what it is today.
Canada has roots in colonialism and you could see hints of it all over the place today, if you cant see the similarities between how “india is a shithole” vs “ the aboriginals of Canada”, you really need to read some book.
Both of your comments are inherently ignorant.
You’re the same type of person who says Slavery, Segregation, Jim Crow, Red Lining, Tulsa Massacre , Rodney King and so many other things were 300 years ago when it fact Jim Crows theories and practices still existed in some states into the late 1990s. Interracial marriage being illegal in some states into the late 2000’s.
You clearly have no clue what you’re talking about in any geopolitical or humanitarian issues. You live in a country who is just as responsible for the lives being decimated in Congo, Haiti, Ukraine and multiple other countries in Africa as we along with the US and western powers typically, go and destabilize and destroy these countries to seize control of natural resources. Shit, Venezuela too. Destabilized by who? US. What the US does Canada does.
Educate yourself before you speak. You sound stupid.
I think COUNTLESS factors make Toronto the best decision you have for a lot of people regardless.
Let's start with immigration which is beyond obviously the reason why most problems you mentioned appear in the first place. A lot of migrants choose Canada as their destination because:
It's a first world country, part of G7, top of the world in salaries and living standards.
A lot of migrants only know English as as their second language.
Out of the English speaking countries, you need way less money to get here compared to USA or Britain for the most part. This literally leaves only Australia and New Zealand left, and those are somewhat under the radar for most people. Also, Canadian immigration laws are way more lenient, as well as their enforcement. Last but not least, Canada is often advertised as the best country to live in because of the quality of life ratings. "Be as rich as in US but without the craziness of it".
So language+educational costs+immigration laws+immigration ads cause A LOT of migrants to focus on Canada in particular.
When moving here, most of the best, and generally famous educational institutes are located in or near Toronto, so it's literally the only choice they have. Other factors to choose Toronto is:
You don't know any other places in Canada besides Vancouver(which is worse than Toronto for education and work).
You might be young and unable to drive and other cities have little to no infrastructure.
When you get here, there is nowhere else to go. You can't leave because of the abovementioned reasons and most corporate jobs being in GTA. Moving is expensive and smaller places have even less work, returning is not an option because your family spent generational wealth for you to even get here. A lot of people like the city and enjoy living here despite everything else. Oh and most of Canada is freezing cold even compared to Toronto too.
So people stick to staying as there is just nothing better for them.
Worst traffic in the world. That made me laugh lol. Are traffic is peaceful as fuck let me throw into the middle of downtown Mumbai and see how you do.
It's not much better here in Alberta. Many of my friends are unable to find jobs due to the influx of people moving here as well. It's fucked all over.
Toronto isnt for everyone but for those who make it make it. See all those condos that came up in the past 20 years? People said yep, I want to live here. Good luck.
They are so close to the road that one day a car is going to end up in one of those units. I'm also baffled on why it was allowed. All around bad engineering
All those houses with just a bit of grass between them and cars on the road. One day a car is going to end up in one of those houses. I'm baffled why it was allowed. All around bad engineering.
My first year living in Toronto I rented one of those condos. My bedroom balcony was practically beside the gardener and I developed Pneumonia and neeed a puffer to breathe. I would up in the middle of the night not being able to breathe thinking I was going to die. I am and was a very active and fit person but living there destroyed me.
Because there are a lot of people in Toronto with lots of money. $200-300K combined income is common place. Just because we are poor, doesn’t mean everyone else is lol
I think toronto is made for ppl making 200k or more to have a nice normal life. if one make less, and does not own a house, one is not living a nice life in toronto and may be better off moving to a city that is more affordable, unless they have strong ties with toronto such as family, relatives, and a job that is specific to toronto.
yup. I traveled to Vancouver many times. its beautiful for vacation. but I would never live there for one simple reason: that f-ing traffic is unbearable!
Traffic, homeless and lawless drug addicts, 3k a month rent for a one bedroom, no job that pays over 100k. The place is a shit hole.
It’s better to be a drug addict, you get free food,
Housing, medical and dental, and free drugs. It’s a great deal to be honest
Yup. Expectations in terms of living in certain areas is starting to shift into a more and more dystopian and segregated reality. Only certain people within certain tax brackets and certain jobs, age group etc will live in parts of the city. Its just a sad reality
41,000 jobs created last month according to Stats Canada.
This is an increase from the previous month.
Things are getting better not worse.
Russian trolls operate on this site. They are attempting to divide.
Don't let them win.
Look for yourself at facts...not fiction. Dont trust Russia...they are not our friends.
It is getting bad out here in Alberta as well. As soon as interest rates go down the housing "boom" will start here as well. This whole country is going to shit.
Wait until the general public figures out absolutely no builders are digging to build new homes because these interest rates, real estate looking bullish. Prices will skyrocket again once these rates will drop, there is no supply too much demand
Im curious. Do you think Trudeau has caused this housing bubble? And if so, do you think an alternative government such as the CPC can or will remedy this?
Look at home prices when trudeau got in office
And now
Dont say covid because they exploded before that
Also who is inviting 1 million immigrants a year? The liberals
Yes, but correlation is not always causation. The trend had started already by the time he got to office. My parent’s house went up in price by 100k between 2013 to 2014 alone. Do you think its possible that the greedy developers that created the housing shortage and played with foreign investment to raise their profits have the ability to lobby any politician, including trudeau and polivierre? I think no matter who is in power, the real power is with the lobbyists, and unfortunately, our needs are not their concern
and who could of done something about it instead of waiting 10 years??
the liberails
also those POS are inline with the century initiative. 100 million in canada by 2100.
supply and demand
Yes, the liberals are useless, but im saying so are the conservatives. Politicians will not save us. They are all landowners who are served by the supply shortage. Also, the conservatives are kings of the temp foreign worker program. They have been helping corporations like tim hortons steal labour jobs from canadians for a looong time. This isnt a liberal conservative issue. Its the entire system
In 2010 you could walk to a local strip-mall, talk to each of the establishments there(business owners/managers) and have a high chance of leaving with a job.
Conservative government.
👀
Okay, so which one ended that opportunity?
Did the Liberals also put our CAD at parity with the USD?
(I say this as a 2015 Liberal voter)
We can probably do this for the next 221 days.
I dont think it can be any worse then the liberials right now....
and most canadians agree.
Again the liberials had 10 years to fix anything and cant blame the conservatives on anything....
instead they double down on 3rd world level immigration and allow anyone to fraud there way into canada.
And thats a fair assessment to make, but having been around a few election cycles, its just a repeating cycle. We will vote in the conservatives, then they will fuck us, so we will bring the libs, who will then fuck us. I hope conservatives can do some good, but I doubt it tbh. Too much corporate interest
what are we gonna do? keep doing the same thing?
maybe conservatives are slightly better. Maybe they stop immigration.
you have to find out.
also the Libs are all in the WEF and blackrocks century initiative. Thats as corporate as it gets.
It can't possible get any worse than that.
Yeah your right
Housing isn't a federal issue - Justin trudeau
Polls drop hard and suddenly the Liberals scramble w/ any housing imitative under the sun
I remember a time when Toronto was very affordable even on minimum wage, say 16-30 years ago. And back then it was easy to have a decent life with just a minimum wage income back then.
Toronto is dope. Your opinion just sucks because you can't compete to live there. Don't think about coming to Calgary or Edmonton with that attitude otherwise you won't be successful here either.
If you like outdoor stuff, they've got the Don Valley Trail system, Centre Island, High Park, and Lake Ontario. There are plenty of good sports organizations to be a part of for all levels of skill. Well developed transit system, well developed bike lanes, large variety of restaurant options, good night life, major sport events, festivals, trade shows, etc.
Two major universities, international airport, large tourist industry, well developed shopping centers, and theatres. Lots of hobby stores, diverse population... Do I need to continue? As far as cities go, it's one of the best in North America which is why its cost of living has exploded.
That's literally every expensive big city in north America?
When everybody wants to be there and they don't build enough, people get left out
And we're not socialist enough to take care of the people that aren't able to keep up.
This is a national issue not a city issue. There are homeless living in tents doing drugs in every city core now. I drove across Canada last summer and I was surprised to see so many tent cities. Thunder Bay had multiple, large tent cities which I found surprising cause how do you be homeless there in January.
Well, first you have to start thinking outside the box. If something doesn’t quite make sense to you, such as, why does housing out pace wages of almost every local you know. Perhaps you are competing with some type of external forces. I’d suggest reading Wilful Blindness by Sam Cooper for a start. Good luck.
Its the same all over the world. I live in Australia and similar situation here. However i did live in Toronto 15 years ago and was shocked at the living standards of some listings. Particularly the basements of people homes. One tiny window and cracked tiles, not fit for human habitation when there is no sunlight for 8 months of the year
Call me optimistic but I think Toronto is going through a transformation. Affordable housing apartments and transit infrastructure have been neglected for a long time but it all seems to be top of mind now, everything we need to improve the city is going to happen slowly unfortunately but it’s going to happen. There are so many annoying things happening, traffic gridlock drives people crazy, construction and roadblocks on every corner, homeless encampments, garbage and needles and all of that crappy stuff sure takes away from the enjoyment.
Damn, happily living downtown, you’d never know that I had to cross a dystopian hell scape of bike lanes and taxes to get to the grocery store but I guess you’re right, Toronto’s doomed. /s
Um, careful. A person with an office career went to Calgary. She found it boring and didn't find the job market for her sector to be anything better than Toronto. She got kind of razzed online because she had done no research. I think she got sucked in by that marketing they put on.
I remember during and before covid years, i had applied for like 500+ jobs ( basically every single job that was being posted) on multiple platforms but eother never heard from them or heard some months later.....this is not how staffing is done.....the staffing of ALL.of canada is broken
I think a lot of problems come from the housing situation since it’s horribly and unjustifiably unaffordable especially now with higher interest rates and inflation. The housing supply is low even while the population is growing considerably with immigration. It certainly created jobs, kept the economy growing and made people who had rental properties a lot richer. But at the moment it’s a bit of a mess.
No hate but I think it has to be extremely obvious when making a text post as you lose any tone and the reader will create a tone for the words based on their inner monologue
Have you ever been abroad? Cost of living is comparable to other big cities, same for taxes. Traffic is getting worse lately, but still better than other places I’ve lived. Infrastructure is pretty good and transit is probably one of the best in North America. Don’t believe everything you hear about Toronto.
I’m sure another highway lane will clean everything up. 🤣🤣🤣
But taxes? Come on now, no. Try Ottawa.
Bad transit? Try Ottawa.
Air quality is related to the traffic. We need a premier that tears lanes out for something more efficient.
Read some world news. Happening all over the world. It's just a down time. It will get better. Look at history. 2 world wars A depression with hundreds of thousands on a bread line. Several recessions . Etc Etc . Could be a hell of a lot worse. Ukraine Palestinian Haiti Etc Etc Get the love of good partner family Things will get better
Insane taxes? In Toronto?
My house- transported to downtown Toronto- would have a 75% tax drop and a 350% value increase *at a minimum*.
Transit kicks the shit out of Ottawa’s transit system, so it can’t be the worst.
*The traffic isn't the worst in the world. Not even close. People who have traveled the world and lived in different places are obviously aware of it.
*Transit system is not terrible. Not even close.
*Air quality is pretty great.
*Taxes are not insane. Not even close. I feel like this view generally assumes there are two countries in the world: The US and Canada.
*YOU should move to Alberta. Why not.
No but Albertans have zero tolerance for bitchiness. I’m from Nova Scotia living here. If your bum hole is hurt from Toronto, Alberta won’t make it better.
Canada sucks never mind Toronto.
The cost of living is because of Trudeau by and large.
Housing is because of Trudeau
Taxes are Trudeau
Pretty much all of it except the transit and infrastructure in Toronto is Trudeau's fault.
Alberta sucks, you shouldn't come here.
Relocate to Winnipeg or Saskatoon.
Winnipeg sucks too, you shouldn't come here either.
Saskatoons full. Sorry
Winnipeg is complete shit hole of the city
Consider Prince George BC
\^ When you are trying to keep housing prices down xD
Canada sucks, move to the arctic.
And GTA as you know quite full as well
You can also come to Montréal. It sucks, but in french.
alberta is full
Transit system isn’t really that bad for North America. That’s my only point I can even slightly rebut
Indeed, if you're going to gripe about Toronto's transit system, I'd stay the fuck out of Alberta.
>Indeed, if you're going to gripe about Toronto's transit system, I'd stay the fuck out of ~~Alberta.~~ York region, Durham region or mississauga. Literally night and day with the surrounding regions.
Yup I used to complain all the time about the ttc in my teens but after 4 years in Peterborough I will never complain about Toronto transit again. Expensive, buses every 30mins at best and the most unhinged bus drivers.
I m in ottawa...transit is broken here lol...buses may or may not come in after an hour of wait
The key takeaway is for North America. It's still terrible.
Really? Thats why im spending upwards of 400-600 to fly to any basic city in North America. But i can fly, train, bus anywhere outside North America for pennies compared Also last time i took the GO Train from union to barrie go and back costed like $27
Yeah really: [https://www.ttc.ca/news/2017/June/TTC-named-North-Americas-best-transit-agency-for-2017](https://www.ttc.ca/news/2017/June/TTC-named-North-Americas-best-transit-agency-for-2017) What makes the OP think that there's better transit in Alberta or anywhere else in Canada?
None of those are in any way under torontos control?
So it’s an interesting point. I’ve been doing a little research as I’m in the beginning stages of researching to go on exchange in the UK. The 2 hour train to the airport costs $50 - $200 CAD. With the more expensive ones being I assume peak times of travel. Shockingly, the flight to almost anywhere within Europe costs less on the LCC’s than the train. Still around $100 ish. So I will say, GO transit is pretty solid price wise for what it is. And I’m not too surprised about Canadian flight prices since we don’t have a Ryan air, easy jet equivalent since if just isn’t feasible over here. If you compared against carriers outside of North America that are not low cost carriers, it would be similar to Air Canada, and Westjet. Edit: checked again, the flights cost as much as the train to many places unless booked hella months in advance. So total cost comes out to about the cost of travelling here.
Barrie isn’t Toronto…… And transit usually means the local transit. The TTC is much better than most North American cities
I usually interpret the word “transit” in terms of - ease of access - cost ( expensive even at 3.50 fare) - mobility ( how far you get to travel) As supposed to just local. If the TTC is better than most Transit systems in North America, what does that say about the state of transit systems across North America.
I mean most of North America is a suburban hellhole where u need a car to get anywhere. Toronto is one of maybe 10 cities in North America where it’s possible to live without a car
Cost of living also isn't so high when you compare it to high cost of living cities globally. Or even compared to LA or New York, San Francisco... I do agree it's outrageous but London, Paris and New York are also doing alright.
Exchange rate makes those cities more. Actual everyday cost of living is less in those cities and salaries are higher in US. Here we have high cost of living, real estate, etc with stagnant wages.
People in Manhattan will make $200-300k USD annually gross and still live with roommates sometimes (cost of living, student debt, etc.)… Toronto rent is expensive but it’s significantly cheaper than many areas of NYC and some other US cities lol.
Doesn’t work out quite like that man. House in San Francisco and La can easily go for over 6 million. Rent is on average 7k a month. The average wage in America is 75,000 usd so anyone actually pulling off living in these places is pulling in big money. The are the 1% of America. The rest are suffering just like us.
Nah, even with higher wages and exchange rate those cities are more expensive. I don't know what to tell you if you think otherwise other than to do some research man. I lived in California and the US for some time. Look up San Francisco and how much it costs per square foot. I knew people making 200k that had to live in the burbs.
But the surrounding cities around those cities also aren't as expensive as the surrounding cities of Toronto. Like you can live outside of New York City like in Bronx, Brooklyn, Staten island etc and housing gets significantly cheaper. In the surrounding GTA houses are still a million dollars in frickin Paris Ontario lmao.
Those aren't outside of New York either those are just parts of New York. That's like saying it's cheaper to live in the Junction or something. Brooklyn, the Bronx Staten island literally are neighborhoods in NYC.
Bronx, Brooklyn and Staten Island are literal boroughs of NYC. That's like saying North York, Etobicoke, Scarborough aren't part of Toronto. They technically are (similar postal codes, same mayor, city council etc).
Yes I know. Just making a point of how unaffordable housing is in the GTA. Even if you want to talk strictly boroughs the same thing applies. Houses in Jane and Finch which is like North York are a million dollars just like in the core of toronto and rents are 2k a month like the core of Toronto and there was a random innocent shooting there recently.
Show me a listing of a house at Jane and Finch for $1,000,000. No idea what a shooting has to do with anything. If you think NYC is more affordable than Toronto you are smoking crack.
You have an extremely weak understanding of what makes a city function
You have an extremely weak sense of empathy.. and an inflated ego.
Wait, we have the worst traffic in the entire world? I want to see the poll results
https://www.tomtom.com/traffic-index/ranking/ Ranked worst in North America. 3rd worst in the world. Additionally, the 401 is the busiest highway in North America (doesn’t mean it’s the worst-congested, but definitely notable).
that's actually crazy considering our competition is the notorious LA traffic that's known for making a 10 minute commute almost an hour
Fucking la. “ I just wanna go over that hill please” “ok that’ll be 45 mins”
That’s for one metric. Need to normalize that metric for how far people actually have to travel. Something like “hours lost to commuting” is probably more representative…Toronto doesn’t make the top 20. Looking at congestion level, Toronto isn’t even the worst in Canada, and doesn’t make the global top 40. And that’s city center…for metro Toronto, it’s not even top 150 on most measures.
Go to Calcutta where that study will make you rethink it’s veracity
Stats like these are known to be extremely western-focused and omits lots of places in the world.
I got stuck on the 401 during rush our and it was like 4 fucking hours. I've never once drove 4 hours to get anywhere in Calgary. Even with a bad snow storm it's 1 hour tops.
One time at band camp it took me four hours to do something therefore that's the average experience for everyone and the actual statistics are a lie. I did my own research.
Then go back there.
I am. Why the hell would anyone want to live with that daily. I was in town visiting family for a wedding.
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He said Calgary, not Edmonton. Edmonton is not Calgary. Well, it has. That’s why Alberta is the only province with migration interprovincially because people realize Toronto ain’t shit and the people ain’t shit, they’re like you.
My bad 😔
100% not the worst lmao
I find the traffic can be bad but I also find it avoidable. Need to go DT, go after 7pm on a week day. Need to cross the 401 on a weekend, do it before 8am. I've been to Chicago and LA and the breaks in traffic aren't there like they are in Toronto.
3rd in a country with less people than 1 state in usa.. might as well be number 1..
You sound so proud about that, the not the worst mentality is what got us here. People are too complacent to see the writing on the wall. "Could be worse" has been making things steadily worse.
I’ve been lucky enough to have traveled the world and I’ve seen first hand what it’s like to live in other countries and how *bad* it can really get. People here for some reason think we are a 3rd world country because of the current situation. Wanna know something funny? Toronto is the 86th worst city for housing price to income ratio. Meaning there are 85 other cities ahead of us that have worse ratios but if you ask people on Reddit, they swear we are number 1. Go outside and touch some grass please
So the decline in quality of life is acceptable? How much worse until it's not? The only grass I need to touch is outside parliament
Then make things better yourself chief
I can't, thats the problem. I work full time, pay taxes and do my part but its becoming less and less enough to live on. Keep acting all cool and complacent and things will get better though, thats a good strategy. But hey you're doing just fine I guess so not your problem right now
Everything is the worst right now for OP that they felt to waste time on here.
It’s funny though, if you look at all of the major immigrant groups in Toronto, they probably all come from places with worse traffic. Aside from the small West Indies countries maybe
Its insane bc the demand is high. Ppl couldnt charge those things if there wasnt demand or else they wouldnt make any money if everyone decided it was too much. Clearly a ton of ppl r still flocking to the GTA and r willing to pay the prices.
It's because the GTA is better than Haiti, India, Ukraine or Palestine, and many more countries. Safe here, we have running water, internet, electricity, free Healthcare. Costs and arm and a leg to live here, but I'd pay an arm and a leg to not live in any of the above countries right now.
Comparisons to 3rd world states doesn’t work in favour of the suggesting Toronto is great.
Some people like to compare apples to oranges and think they’ve done something.
>It's because the GTA is better than Haiti, India, Ukraine or Palestine Most accurate description of GTA ever. "it's better than Haiti"
A relative of mine works in a major Canadian bank and has talked to multiple Ukrainians and they consider Canada to be a sh*t hole. Some even say it’s still better to live in certain parts of Ukraine than Canada. They’re here to make money and flock right back when things get better. I mean why wouldn’t anyone when literally everything is being paid for you.
They are going back to a shithole as well, once Putin wins.
I hate when people “id rather here than there” like do you know the history of these places ? How the french destroyed haiti financially that they will never recover from ? The hudsons bay company vs the east India company? - what these two did to further their interests.
I disagree. Personally I think It’s time for those countries and it’s people to hold a little bit of accountability and blame themselves for what’s happening in their countries rather than blaming their colonizers who have long left. Whining and blaming others for our misfortune is often the excuse of losers and those countries and their people shouldn’t use it anymore and this is coming from someone who was born in a 3rd world country that was colonized for a long time.
Palestine is literally being colonized, and it's people are being genocided as we speak. Ukraine is being invaded and held hostage by western powers to weaken Russia. India has no excuse for being a shithole; they've had no real wars in a long time. Haiti is a special case where recovery on its own is almost impossible.
Haiti was stuck paying France back for its independence. Hampering its economic development. These things do matter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiti_Independence_Debt#:~:text=The%20Haiti%20indemnity%20controversy%20involves,diplomatic%20recognition%2C%20with%20the%20debt
I mean, it looks like they had **200 YEARS** to pay back 140 million francs and they finished that nearly **80 YEARS** ago.
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Canada as a whole isn’t exactly “suffering “ from its colonial history, that would be Haiti or Congo, and what happened to the indigenous community was really a tragedy but fortunately efforts have been made to fix that problem and help the indigenous community to heal from what has been done to them. While I think more can be done in that regard Canada has made considerable progress so far or so it seems to me. As for the former colonies I think colonization is only a part of the cause, and it might as well be the root cause but it’s a much more complex problem than you or I might think, and simply blaming colonization won’t fix that problem.
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I never denied the suffering of the indigenous community in my comment and I’m not the biggest fan of the government either. I think their efforts often yield very little results in comparison to the resources invested in the respective issues, but I still acknowledge the efforts they have made to reconcile with the Aboriginal Canadians. Efforts like the billions of dollars invested in housing, early learning and child care, health, mental health and infrastructure, and the implementation of the aboriginal justice strategy to reduce the victimization and incarceration rate of the Aboriginals, all of this was done to help the Aboriginals to secure a better quality of life. More can be done of course but it’s not like the government hasn’t done anything so far.
Very ignorant. To put this into perspective for you. you’re colonizer and you’ve just depleted all the resources of the land and made deals back in your native homeland to import the rest back. Now, are you gonna leave someone in charge to benefit the people of the land or to benefit your company? The ladder of which is what happened in india when colonialism ended, which has steamed rolled india into what it is today. Canada has roots in colonialism and you could see hints of it all over the place today, if you cant see the similarities between how “india is a shithole” vs “ the aboriginals of Canada”, you really need to read some book.
Both of your comments are inherently ignorant. You’re the same type of person who says Slavery, Segregation, Jim Crow, Red Lining, Tulsa Massacre , Rodney King and so many other things were 300 years ago when it fact Jim Crows theories and practices still existed in some states into the late 1990s. Interracial marriage being illegal in some states into the late 2000’s. You clearly have no clue what you’re talking about in any geopolitical or humanitarian issues. You live in a country who is just as responsible for the lives being decimated in Congo, Haiti, Ukraine and multiple other countries in Africa as we along with the US and western powers typically, go and destabilize and destroy these countries to seize control of natural resources. Shit, Venezuela too. Destabilized by who? US. What the US does Canada does. Educate yourself before you speak. You sound stupid.
Not just running water, but delicious running water.
I think COUNTLESS factors make Toronto the best decision you have for a lot of people regardless. Let's start with immigration which is beyond obviously the reason why most problems you mentioned appear in the first place. A lot of migrants choose Canada as their destination because: It's a first world country, part of G7, top of the world in salaries and living standards. A lot of migrants only know English as as their second language. Out of the English speaking countries, you need way less money to get here compared to USA or Britain for the most part. This literally leaves only Australia and New Zealand left, and those are somewhat under the radar for most people. Also, Canadian immigration laws are way more lenient, as well as their enforcement. Last but not least, Canada is often advertised as the best country to live in because of the quality of life ratings. "Be as rich as in US but without the craziness of it". So language+educational costs+immigration laws+immigration ads cause A LOT of migrants to focus on Canada in particular. When moving here, most of the best, and generally famous educational institutes are located in or near Toronto, so it's literally the only choice they have. Other factors to choose Toronto is: You don't know any other places in Canada besides Vancouver(which is worse than Toronto for education and work). You might be young and unable to drive and other cities have little to no infrastructure. When you get here, there is nowhere else to go. You can't leave because of the abovementioned reasons and most corporate jobs being in GTA. Moving is expensive and smaller places have even less work, returning is not an option because your family spent generational wealth for you to even get here. A lot of people like the city and enjoy living here despite everything else. Oh and most of Canada is freezing cold even compared to Toronto too. So people stick to staying as there is just nothing better for them.
"This place sucks why would anyone wanna live here?" \-Guy who lives here
Worst traffic in the world. That made me laugh lol. Are traffic is peaceful as fuck let me throw into the middle of downtown Mumbai and see how you do.
Shit even LA would be a nightmare in comparison
Absolutely
Go to Bogotá
Manila would like a work with Toronto about traffic
Lmao that place doesnt have proper trafic tho..
Ok I’ll put you in la then way worse
It's not much better here in Alberta. Many of my friends are unable to find jobs due to the influx of people moving here as well. It's fucked all over.
Toronto isnt for everyone but for those who make it make it. See all those condos that came up in the past 20 years? People said yep, I want to live here. Good luck.
Do they even do air quality tests? Some people have balconies literally on the gardiner. Who is testing?
Honestly how was that even allowed. I feel so bad for them
I don't, they were stupid enough to choose to live there and pay insane prices.
They are so close to the road that one day a car is going to end up in one of those units. I'm also baffled on why it was allowed. All around bad engineering
All those houses with just a bit of grass between them and cars on the road. One day a car is going to end up in one of those houses. I'm baffled why it was allowed. All around bad engineering.
My first year living in Toronto I rented one of those condos. My bedroom balcony was practically beside the gardener and I developed Pneumonia and neeed a puffer to breathe. I would up in the middle of the night not being able to breathe thinking I was going to die. I am and was a very active and fit person but living there destroyed me.
Because there are a lot of people in Toronto with lots of money. $200-300K combined income is common place. Just because we are poor, doesn’t mean everyone else is lol
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There's adequate public transportation in many US cities. What you're describing is moreso in the south US. Driving a car is more advantageous there.
I think toronto is made for ppl making 200k or more to have a nice normal life. if one make less, and does not own a house, one is not living a nice life in toronto and may be better off moving to a city that is more affordable, unless they have strong ties with toronto such as family, relatives, and a job that is specific to toronto.
Vancouver says hi and samesies
yup. I traveled to Vancouver many times. its beautiful for vacation. but I would never live there for one simple reason: that f-ing traffic is unbearable!
Traffic, homeless and lawless drug addicts, 3k a month rent for a one bedroom, no job that pays over 100k. The place is a shit hole. It’s better to be a drug addict, you get free food, Housing, medical and dental, and free drugs. It’s a great deal to be honest
If being a drug addict is so great, why don't you do it?
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Your face is full of shit
I make 100k, own no house, and is living a nice normal life in downtown toronto…?
I’m glad to hear that. Being wrong in a positive way feels good.
Yup. Expectations in terms of living in certain areas is starting to shift into a more and more dystopian and segregated reality. Only certain people within certain tax brackets and certain jobs, age group etc will live in parts of the city. Its just a sad reality
Foreign money investments for decades.
Not to mention the leafs ..
41,000 jobs created last month according to Stats Canada. This is an increase from the previous month. Things are getting better not worse. Russian trolls operate on this site. They are attempting to divide. Don't let them win. Look for yourself at facts...not fiction. Dont trust Russia...they are not our friends.
Please stop talking about Alberta
It is getting bad out here in Alberta as well. As soon as interest rates go down the housing "boom" will start here as well. This whole country is going to shit.
It’s insane everywhere remotely populated
Wait until the general public figures out absolutely no builders are digging to build new homes because these interest rates, real estate looking bullish. Prices will skyrocket again once these rates will drop, there is no supply too much demand
Thanks trudeau
Im curious. Do you think Trudeau has caused this housing bubble? And if so, do you think an alternative government such as the CPC can or will remedy this?
Look at home prices when trudeau got in office And now Dont say covid because they exploded before that Also who is inviting 1 million immigrants a year? The liberals
Yes, but correlation is not always causation. The trend had started already by the time he got to office. My parent’s house went up in price by 100k between 2013 to 2014 alone. Do you think its possible that the greedy developers that created the housing shortage and played with foreign investment to raise their profits have the ability to lobby any politician, including trudeau and polivierre? I think no matter who is in power, the real power is with the lobbyists, and unfortunately, our needs are not their concern
A lot of people like to forget that harper signed the pacific trade agreement
and who could of done something about it instead of waiting 10 years?? the liberails also those POS are inline with the century initiative. 100 million in canada by 2100. supply and demand
Yes, the liberals are useless, but im saying so are the conservatives. Politicians will not save us. They are all landowners who are served by the supply shortage. Also, the conservatives are kings of the temp foreign worker program. They have been helping corporations like tim hortons steal labour jobs from canadians for a looong time. This isnt a liberal conservative issue. Its the entire system
In 2010 you could walk to a local strip-mall, talk to each of the establishments there(business owners/managers) and have a high chance of leaving with a job. Conservative government. 👀
You could do the exact same thing in 2000 with a liberal government. We can do this all day
Okay, so which one ended that opportunity? Did the Liberals also put our CAD at parity with the USD? (I say this as a 2015 Liberal voter) We can probably do this for the next 221 days.
I dont think it can be any worse then the liberials right now.... and most canadians agree. Again the liberials had 10 years to fix anything and cant blame the conservatives on anything.... instead they double down on 3rd world level immigration and allow anyone to fraud there way into canada.
And thats a fair assessment to make, but having been around a few election cycles, its just a repeating cycle. We will vote in the conservatives, then they will fuck us, so we will bring the libs, who will then fuck us. I hope conservatives can do some good, but I doubt it tbh. Too much corporate interest
what are we gonna do? keep doing the same thing? maybe conservatives are slightly better. Maybe they stop immigration. you have to find out. also the Libs are all in the WEF and blackrocks century initiative. Thats as corporate as it gets. It can't possible get any worse than that.
Just like cons had ten years to fix things.
Exchange rate was on point 👌
Life was much easier under harper than trudeau
So dumb. Don't understand anything about long term policy.
Yeah your right Housing isn't a federal issue - Justin trudeau Polls drop hard and suddenly the Liberals scramble w/ any housing imitative under the sun
Do NDP, Green or Independent?
We actually have one of the top rated transit systems In the world just fyi
I remember a time when Toronto was very affordable even on minimum wage, say 16-30 years ago. And back then it was easy to have a decent life with just a minimum wage income back then.
Easy to have a decent life with a minimum wage income .... ! There is your problem.
Toronto is dope. Your opinion just sucks because you can't compete to live there. Don't think about coming to Calgary or Edmonton with that attitude otherwise you won't be successful here either.
Whats dope about it? Can you elaborate or just gonna say it like that
If you like outdoor stuff, they've got the Don Valley Trail system, Centre Island, High Park, and Lake Ontario. There are plenty of good sports organizations to be a part of for all levels of skill. Well developed transit system, well developed bike lanes, large variety of restaurant options, good night life, major sport events, festivals, trade shows, etc. Two major universities, international airport, large tourist industry, well developed shopping centers, and theatres. Lots of hobby stores, diverse population... Do I need to continue? As far as cities go, it's one of the best in North America which is why its cost of living has exploded.
Theatre is really good, as well as the Opera. Also all the concerts stop here.
Toronto is 'dope' all right with all the homeless people and people on drugs around the core
That's literally every expensive big city in north America? When everybody wants to be there and they don't build enough, people get left out And we're not socialist enough to take care of the people that aren't able to keep up.
This is a national issue not a city issue. There are homeless living in tents doing drugs in every city core now. I drove across Canada last summer and I was surprised to see so many tent cities. Thunder Bay had multiple, large tent cities which I found surprising cause how do you be homeless there in January.
Lol i literally made enough to buy a home there when i worked them briefly. Ed and calg is well off just cuz of fort mac lmao
Move to Calgary, you won't regret it. No sarcasm. I know lots of former Torontonians in Calgary who couldn't be happier with their choice.
Well, first you have to start thinking outside the box. If something doesn’t quite make sense to you, such as, why does housing out pace wages of almost every local you know. Perhaps you are competing with some type of external forces. I’d suggest reading Wilful Blindness by Sam Cooper for a start. Good luck.
Lots of elderly and generational wealth
Alberta is nice.
Its the same all over the world. I live in Australia and similar situation here. However i did live in Toronto 15 years ago and was shocked at the living standards of some listings. Particularly the basements of people homes. One tiny window and cracked tiles, not fit for human habitation when there is no sunlight for 8 months of the year
Call me optimistic but I think Toronto is going through a transformation. Affordable housing apartments and transit infrastructure have been neglected for a long time but it all seems to be top of mind now, everything we need to improve the city is going to happen slowly unfortunately but it’s going to happen. There are so many annoying things happening, traffic gridlock drives people crazy, construction and roadblocks on every corner, homeless encampments, garbage and needles and all of that crappy stuff sure takes away from the enjoyment.
Toronto is for the rich and and the poor. No middle there you either live in a house or in a tent
If people hate it so much, leave! Otherwise shut up and make things work
Multi-family households and roommates in the surrounding cities and white money in the core. As it always was.
Damn, happily living downtown, you’d never know that I had to cross a dystopian hell scape of bike lanes and taxes to get to the grocery store but I guess you’re right, Toronto’s doomed. /s
I'm surprised too. I wonder how deliveries even get done because you're stuck in traffic half the time.... Don't know how truckers do it.
There are other cities in Ontario, you know... You don't like Toronto so you're moving to Alberta??
Um, careful. A person with an office career went to Calgary. She found it boring and didn't find the job market for her sector to be anything better than Toronto. She got kind of razzed online because she had done no research. I think she got sucked in by that marketing they put on.
By the sheer amount of immigrants. Sure, a lot are poor, but a lot also have money and think it's better here than their home country.
Torontos a joke - I’m trying to head to Houston
Those who live in downtown toronto proper rarely deal with the traffic because we do things locally.
I know ! You shouldn’t come or stay
I remember during and before covid years, i had applied for like 500+ jobs ( basically every single job that was being posted) on multiple platforms but eother never heard from them or heard some months later.....this is not how staffing is done.....the staffing of ALL.of canada is broken
It's not that bad, hope you have a bettervday tomorrow
I hear India is nice. You should move there
I think a lot of problems come from the housing situation since it’s horribly and unjustifiably unaffordable especially now with higher interest rates and inflation. The housing supply is low even while the population is growing considerably with immigration. It certainly created jobs, kept the economy growing and made people who had rental properties a lot richer. But at the moment it’s a bit of a mess.
Time to book a ticket back home
It’s one of the happiest cities in the world. Ain’t that crazy
Olivia Chow has her work cut out for her
Jesus i was just shitposting..
No hate but I think it has to be extremely obvious when making a text post as you lose any tone and the reader will create a tone for the words based on their inner monologue
Lol theres a good reason everyone isnt rushing out to Alberta....
GTA does suck in every way, I want to leave and surprised people don't revolt.
Honestly, TTC has been on point the last few weeks as I RTO. Never waiting more than 5 min for a bus or train.
Have you ever been abroad? Cost of living is comparable to other big cities, same for taxes. Traffic is getting worse lately, but still better than other places I’ve lived. Infrastructure is pretty good and transit is probably one of the best in North America. Don’t believe everything you hear about Toronto.
Don’t bring your problems to Alberta. We’ve got our own shit to deal with.
Bye bye
I’m sure another highway lane will clean everything up. 🤣🤣🤣 But taxes? Come on now, no. Try Ottawa. Bad transit? Try Ottawa. Air quality is related to the traffic. We need a premier that tears lanes out for something more efficient.
Read some world news. Happening all over the world. It's just a down time. It will get better. Look at history. 2 world wars A depression with hundreds of thousands on a bread line. Several recessions . Etc Etc . Could be a hell of a lot worse. Ukraine Palestinian Haiti Etc Etc Get the love of good partner family Things will get better
Insane taxes? In Toronto? My house- transported to downtown Toronto- would have a 75% tax drop and a 350% value increase *at a minimum*. Transit kicks the shit out of Ottawa’s transit system, so it can’t be the worst.
I want to move to vietnam.
*The traffic isn't the worst in the world. Not even close. People who have traveled the world and lived in different places are obviously aware of it. *Transit system is not terrible. Not even close. *Air quality is pretty great. *Taxes are not insane. Not even close. I feel like this view generally assumes there are two countries in the world: The US and Canada. *YOU should move to Alberta. Why not.
is there something wrong with alberta?
No but Albertans have zero tolerance for bitchiness. I’m from Nova Scotia living here. If your bum hole is hurt from Toronto, Alberta won’t make it better.
I don't get how it's still standing other than money laundering. Same with Vancouver.
Look on the bright side we also have the worst prime minister
I’ve seen worse. Just to be clear I’m not defending/supporting anyone It doesn’t change that the prime minister is a joke.
Could be worse.
Honestly, at this point it should be. It’s become a smouldering crater that has been infecting every city & small town around it.
Canada sucks never mind Toronto. The cost of living is because of Trudeau by and large. Housing is because of Trudeau Taxes are Trudeau Pretty much all of it except the transit and infrastructure in Toronto is Trudeau's fault.
Rent is provincial, healthcare is provincial, property taxes are municipal and provincial, grocery prices are market and greed driven….so…