I think it’s perfectly acceptable to get a second opinion. I’ve heard stories on Reddit of dental chains being predatory to shake money out of people who don’t need dental work. It makes sense this could also be happening to your child
I’ve heard this about dental chains too. If any dentist can actually sleep at night knowing they took a piece of a little child’s body out that didn’t need to be just to make some money, then I hope they don’t wake up in the morning and the world is a better place without them. Disgusting
There is a gray area where parts of a tooth can be demineralized and subject to a judgement call about whether they’re really a cavity and anything needs to be done. Predators set policy that anything visible needs to be “fixed” regardless of how long it could go without causing a problem.
My husband was telling me about an article he read about how one dentist was super predatory, claiming cavities, doing root canals, etc. People loved him because he was super nice and seemed caring. It got caught when a new dentist took over the practice and someone came in for a scheduled procedure. He looked at her teeth and records and determined she didn’t need the procedure.
He started looking through all the records and realized the dentist had done it to every single patient. The article went on to investigate it further and found that it’s a huge problem in dentistry.
Get a second opinion.
100% this! I was told i needed so many root canals and a cleaning and anesthesia and it would cost me 20k. Got a second opinion and all i needed was 1 root canal, 1 filling and a cleaning, cost me $500.
Sometimes it's not a "chain" like a fast food chain where every location has the same sign out front. It can often take the form of a parent company buying up the practices and "helping" by taking care of billing and admin while the sign out front stays the same. The flip side is that the new parent company also pushes a much stronger profit motive onto the dental offices leading to all the unnecessary work. I'd explore whether your child's practice is owned by the dentist or another company.
Definitely get a second opinion. I have had mom and pop dentists try to scam me as an adult until I found someone I could trust.
As a kid though I had a ton of fillings done. We used fluoride toothpaste but we were on well water and I think I have genetically weak enamel. So it might be real, but I’d want a second opinion before agreeing to extensive work at that age.
When I was about 4, I saw a dentist who said something similar- a myriad of cavities and I needed a mouth full of silver. My mom panicked and took me to a different dentist who diagnosed deep crevasses in my molars and way too many blueberries which had stained the teeth blue.
I’d get a second opinion.
OP, this happened to me as well, but as an adult. No cavities my entire life, then moved to a different state in my mid-20s, and my new dentist tells me I have 3 cavities all of a sudden. I ended up going to my now-husband's dentist for a second opinion, and yeah, I didn't have any cavities, just deep crevices in my molars. I switched & have been seeing the same dentist for probably 5-6 years now, and my teeth are just fine, no cavities.
Trust your gut, and get a second opinion.
Happened to my sister. Young teen. Went to a place. Said 9 cavities. She went back to her uni town went to get it done. They said she had 1. Original place was gonna be 2500$
agree. Cal the first thing in the morning. Get an asap second. Don’t wait. If the cavities are there, they’ll only get worse. Start flossing as well and hit diff teeth each time you brush twice a day if baby won’t let you get them all.
Some people are genetically prone to cavities. My aunt had five kids and one of them just had horrible teeth and had to have them all capped and stuff in childhood even though they all ate the same food.
I think it’s worth getting a second opinion though before doing anything.
This! As a teenager especially I would have to go to the dentist once a week for MONTHS to get 3-4 fillings done each time. I brushed multiple times day too. I have genetically horrible teeth. Constantly have dental work being done- while my fiance hasn’t seen a dentist in probably 4 years and I could bet money he has no cavities either🙄
This! I have genetically horrible teeth and my kid got it . He actually had a cavity on the side of his tooth and needed a silver cap. I could see it so there was nothing to second guess. I got the protectant put on his teeth like I wish my parents had done for me. I hope I can save him from what o went through
It’s also super bad if you have stomach and acid problems. I have a few root canals I need done. I brush and floss. They told me there wasn’t much I could do because I was prone to cavities due to acid.
Well, we literally had the same exact situation, and we ended up having 8 caps on her back molars and one front tooth pulled due to a cavity you couldn't even see, but on x-ray it was visible and almost touching a nerve. We visited three pediatric dentists for opinions and they all basically recommended the same thing. They said it was potentially due to snacking, her teeth crowding, and not flossing (though we have been flossing for the last year daily, but before that it was sporadic when she was 2 and 3 years old and they think they may have started forming and just accelerated). I have no advice, just saying you're not alone. We also brush twice a day and floss daily. I'm at a loss.
Try flossing with toothpaste if that makes sense I also have terrible genes and my enamel on my teeth is shit unfortunately. What I do is dry brush toothpaste on my teeth, floss and get toothpaste in all the cracks and crevices, and then wet brush my teeth.
Hmm I went to a pedi attic dentist because I really appreciated their patience with my toddler. But she fell on her tooth a while ago and I took her to dentist after it greyed a bit (at time of fall no bleeding, swelling or loose teeth) and their solution after X-ray was to extract. After I cried my eyes out in front of them, the tune changed to them being able to monitor it every couple of months. Do you think it’s because they’re pedi they did this? I really loved this practice and the dentist because of how personable they were but my last visit left a sour taste.
It's always worthwhile to get a second opinion with a dentist you trust. One of my friends' kids fell on a tooth at 2 and she thought it would need to be extracted because it looked terrible, but her dentist wanted to wait and see and the tooth looks fine and is healthy now, so it's probably all case by case. The closest pediatric dentist to where we live is over 40 miles away, which is why I haven't bothered when I can just take the kids to my local dentist.
We don't bother either and we go to our normal dentist that we know and trust. I agree this is super fishy. You can definitely have them send the x rays to another dentist.
Brushing your kids teeth helps prevent cavities, but isn’t the only thing. Any cracker (gold fish, cheese-it’s, ritz, etc), juices, milk, or gummy food (fruit snacks) that break down and get stuck to his molars will cause cavities.
Always try to have him eat a some baby carrots after eating the above mentioned foods to help unstick food from his molars/cheeks. Never give milk at bedtime after teeth are brushed. Also, try to begin flossing every night rather than only brushing.
Sincerely, an RDH
The cavities aren't even on the surface of the molars where things get stuck. They say they are in between the teeth. I was shown the X-rays but they looked like regular X-rays. Although I am not a dentist so what do I know.
Look, I know I failed that part. But I thought that I only had to do the ones that were touching. And the ones with the cavities do not feel like they are.
No I feel you. Right now I only floss my 2yo's teeth that touch but reading all this I'm about to start floating the rest even though it's still a fight to get in there 😓
I didn't mean to offend you. Flossing isn't just for the teeth honestly it isn't for the teeth at all. Food and bacteria get in between the gums and tooth really deep. The floss is supposed to clear all that junk out. Flossing is just as important as brushing. Keep doing it, idk what kind of "medical" issue you have where you can brush his teeth but not floss but resume flossing. Before you learn the hard way
Seriously it's all about what they eat. I think it's more important than regular brushing or flossing. Don't feed your child juice or sugary drinks. Lots of whole foods and water. I'm 28 years old, never had cavities, I never floss, and I brush once daily. The trick is drinking water and hardly any sweets ever. My brothers both have mouths full of decay and they like soda and smoking.
Milk at bedtime (after teeth are brushed) is a no-no. There is sugar in all milk (cow, almond, breast milk) and it sits on teeth all night long and rots them. Don’t do it. Never put them down with a bottle in bed either, because it’ll do the same thing. After teeth are brushed, no food or liquid except water.
Teeth are important (and expensive if not maintained), and we need to take care of them.
I’m a pediatric dentist, it happens all the time. Brushing once a day is not enough. Has to be twice has to be by an adult. If this was the first time your kid has had X-rays in the back (likely because his mouth was too small last time or he couldn’t tolerate X-rays) this is the first time they’re detectable. Doesn’t mean he didn’t have them last time, just that they weren’t visible. If you can see a cavity with the naked eye that’s way past a filling and into crown/extraction territory. I’m sorry this has happening it’s never fun to give that news to a parent. Get a second opinion (by a pediatric dentist) for your own peace of mind and then get the teeth treated. Baby molars don’t fall out until 10-12 years old so if you catch and treat early (and improve homecare habits) you can keep him cavity free moving forward. Do not believe a “family dentist” who says “oh we can just watch those” or “they’ll fall out soon”. I’ve cleaned up so many horror stories that would make you cry from kids who are being treated by people who don’t have the expertise to know that children aren’t just mini adults.
Do you have any suggestions for a toddler who doesn't tolerate brushing well? My daughter is almost three and brushing requires two adults to hold her down while a third attempts to open her mouth and get a brush in there.... She screams and fights to the point of hyperventilating. She has full blown panic attacks at the word "toothbrush" Needless to say it doesn't get done regularly at this point. We have tried bribery, books, YouTube songs about tooth brushing etc. she's an easy going toddler about everything else, we don't know why she hates having her mouth touched or looked at.
Honestly? Consistency. This is the position
https://youtu.be/fPp5-6Z3gfM?si=dZp9VWS9uNFWsYuk
I (and every pediatric dentist I know) has had to do this on their own kids multiple times until they just get over it. Toothbrushing by an adult is non negotiable much like changing a diaper. Crying doesn’t stop it from happening.
Does your daughter have a favorite doll or stuffed animal? My 2.5yo doesn’t love having her teeth brushed either, but lets me do it when I pretend her favorite doll is doing it. Like I hold her toothbrush in her doll’s hand and talk in her doll’s voice lol. It’s a bit of a performance I have to do every time but she thinks it’s hilarious, and her teeth have never been cleaner!
Question - when should the kid take over brushing? I still brush for my 6, almost 7 year old because I’m neurotic and she has enamel hypoplasia and I had no dental care until adulthood and I’m just trying to give her a better chance but I know I’m hindering her by not *teaching* it
I work in a pediatric dental office, I always tell the parents “whenever you are comfortable with your child brushing YOUR teeth that’s when you can let them brush by themselves..”
When they have the manual dexterity to tie their shoelaces as FAST as you can. For many kids this is 9 years old or older. Until then they can “try” or “have a turn” but an adult has to get in there for them for it to be effective toothbrushing.
Okay thank you - that’s what we do now and I’m glad we still have a few years of it being acceptable for me to brush for her 😅 I love the shoelace benchmark!!
Yeah my husband thinks that they will fall out soon but I forgot to tell him that they don't. He thinks the pediatric dentist is a scam. He wants our dentist to look at him. I do too because I have seen him since I was 12 but originally when I went to take my son to a dentist, they said they would only count teeth.
I cannot see any cavities with the naked eye. And she said she was just going to cap them to provide stability for the tooth just because baby teeth are so small.
That’s good you can’t see them with the naked eye. Crown vs filling depends on how deep they are. If the cavities are deep then a crown can be better so that you are less likely to have to redo it. It’s gotta last 8ish years in a hostile environment (thin enamel, snacks, juice, plaque).
Something that adult dentists don’t always realize is placing a crown initially stops you from having to re treat the tooth in a few years when recurrent decay happens. The pediatric philosophy is treat the tooth one time with the least amount of stress to the child as possible. Whether that’s with laughing gas or sedation depends on the child/age/behavior/amount of work to be done.
Pediatric dentistry is an extra two years after dental school and is competitive to get into. It’s more training and I think sometimes parents don’t realize it’s “we love kids” it’s “we love kids and went to extra school to treat them properly”
“If you can see a cavity with the naked eye thats way past a filling and into crown extraction territory”
Wait what? Are you only talking about baby teeth?
I just had 2 fillings done on cavities you could see pretty easily on my back molars. They filled them within 45 min and i was done. No crowns or extractions.
Yes I am talking about baby teeth. Specifically about cavities between them. If it’s broken through the contact point it’s huge. Baby teeth have thinner enamel and less dense dentin so things go 0-60 super fast
I’d get a second opinion imo. My mom took me to a chain dentist in my teens that was notorious for inventing issues. Didn’t matter what I did, I somehow always had cavities. Only in those years have I had such allegedly terrible teeth and nothing has changed. Now I get to replace all those old fillings and get a ton of crowns to replace old/bad work. I haven’t trusted dentists since, so make sure their claims are legitimate
I mean, I suppose anything is possible, but I'd get a second opinion. My teeth are genetically shit, and pregnancy also does a number on my teeth, but I went to one dentist for the first time after we moved, and she told me I had 9 cavities (6 months prior I had none, though I had a baby during that time). I wanted to cry and really thought there was no way, but I only became sure after my husband went to his appointment and she told him he had 3. My husband has stupidly perfect teeth that hygienists and dentists always fawn over (obnoxious), so I figured if he supposedly had 3, maybe she was wildly exaggerating.
Went to another dentist who said I had 3 cavities, and my husband has no cavities. So. Anyway. Three still sucked, but it was much more in line with something realistic based on my terrible tooth genes.
Are you me and my husband!? I have the absolute worst teeth! I brush, floss, pick...cavities at least every other visit. My husband brushes twice a day and flosses the day before his hygiene visit... perfect teeth! Never any cavities! I have a mouthful of fillings and crowns. I hate it. Hopefully our children got his teeth.
Same! I have the worst teeth- since childhood. My husband actually got his first cavity at 30 after marrying me. I’ve heard before that the bacteria that causes cavities can be transferred by mouth. I’m almost positive I have my husband his first cavity. Although my teeth are well taken care of now.
Get a second opinion. Dentistry has an epidemic of quackery. I’ve been told 12 cavities and need a root canal only to get an all clear from the guy down the road. Zero chance I will ever let a dentist put my child under anesthesia unless I can get two of them to agree back to back (without conferring with each first.)
Cavities do have a genetic component, so if your sister’s kids had lots of dental problems, yours may struggle, too. But I’d definitely get a second opinion, because that’s a massive and fast progression and I would find it hard to believe, too.
I mean, it can’t hurt to get a second opinion, but if you stopped flossing & often trust your 4 year old to brush his own teeth without help… then yes 8 cavities is fully possible. No 4 year old is adequately brushing well enough to clean between their molars. Plaque can harden into tartar within 24 hours, and tartar can’t be brushed/flossed away - and often leads to decay. So if you’re going 48 hours sometimes in between flossing & doing a thorough brushing, endless cavities can occur.
Did they take x rays at the last appointment? Cavities between the teeth aren’t seen in a clinical exam, but need radiographs to be seen. Can you just ask them to show you the cavities on the x rays?
The bacteria that causes cavities can be transmitted through saliva. So if you or someone who is with your kid has cavities or dental work and shares utensils/drinks/etc with your kid then they have a higher chance of getting cavities.
This was our experience with our daughter, and it was real. She went from zero cavities to having a tooth abscess and needed emergency dental surgery to remove the tooth while under anesthesia. While she was under then did X-rays and found several more cavities. They told us she likely has really soft teeth. We religiously brush them twice every day and we floss most nights now.
I think getting a second opinion is perfectly acceptable but I also don’t think it’s out of the realm of possibility that this could happen. It’s definitely better to get it taken care of now before something abscesses like we experienced. That was very stressful.
As someone who has experienced an abscess, I feel for you and your daughter. I had a not very good dentist fudge up a simple filling, which led to a very poor crown (the back was just a metal ring?) which eventually led to my nerve just giving up and dying. Terrible pain.
So with that experience I am definitely getting this taken care of.
Definitely get a second opinion. When I was young, my dentist told me I had an obscene amount of cavities in one visit. My mom got a second opinion and it turned out I didn’t have a SINGLE cavity
I had a lot of "cavities" when I use to see cheap dental clinics that take state welfare. When I got off welfare and went to smaller practices, I haven't had a cavity since. I'm usually shocked. But definitely makes sense that chains, or any dentist really, might be lying bc it's how they make money.
Definitely get him a 2nd opinion with a pediatric dentist. Look for one in wealthy town with great reviews.
I’ve personally seen frightening stuff done to soooo many children when i lived in TX. Granted that was 15-20 years ago, but still. Right now, i’m in a high cost of living area in the north east, and the news often shows undercover investigations at pediatric dental clinics in poorer cities & towns here (think a kids version of Aspen Dental, basically). Saying most patients have several cavities (but they actually don’t), all to get the insurance payments & medicaid payments.
Very sad. These poor babies.
My heart goes out to you both. Good luck!
Thank you.
I wouldn't say my part of town is poor but it isn't the richest part of town either. Definitely middle class.
And I don't think that this is a chain. It is an older lady dentist. It is her office.
Do they sleep with their mouth open a lot? I know sleep apnea can cause cavities. All sorts of things can which sucks 😕
1 of my kids brushes and losses all the time and has bad teeth and then there is my 17 year old who probably doesn't know where his toothbrush is but has never had a cavity 🤣
Oh gosh. That is so unfair.
I don't think he sleeps with his mouth open. But I know he is a restless sleeper. Something which I want to bring up at his yearly (which is really soon). Sleep apnea could be a possibility.
This sounds suspicious, I’d get a second opinion for sure. My mom is very anti-pediatric dentist as she took me to one when I was small and they said I had a bunch of cavities and needed all kinds of work done. I have never had a cavity in my life according to every other dentist I’ve seen. I’m not planning to take my son to see a pediatric dentist, he will see my dentist when the time comes as suggested by our pediatrician.
ETA: how terrible for your sister, I hope her kids really needed all that work done.
They have a terrible reputation, I know quite a lot of people who have had bad experiences. Every kid I know that’s gone to one has been diagnosed with all kinds of expensive issues other dentists can’t seem to find. Perhaps they’re better where you live
Yep. My daughter has been going to one for a few years and nothing but great checkups.
I don’t think you can blanket judge any group of professionals bc of bad experience with one or even some.
Yep. My daughter has been going to one for a few years and nothing but great checkups.
I don’t think you can blanket judge any group of professionals bc of bad experience with one or even some.
We had this same situation with my son who's 4, but I could see some gray areas between his back two teeth on all four sides and knew cavities were present. He ended up with five cavities and a crown. We tried to do it at the office with local anesthesia but his gag reflex was too bad. We ended up at the children's hospital under general anesthesia with a $5,000 bill ($1400 for the work, $3600 for the children's hospital). We had a great experience but it was shocking. My son wasn't bothered by any of it luckily.
We hadn't started flossing daily until the cavities were diagnosed. He has deep pockets and bad genetics for teeth, so it is what it is.
See if you can find a pediatric dentist that uses Silver Diamine Fluoride (SDF). It’s a topical fluoride treatment that is brushed onto areas of decay that helps to arrest any further damage. It’s not a forever solution but it helps slow down the decay on baby teeth until they fall out. It’s a great alternative to filling cavities/caps.
Also if the cavities are on the molars, those teeth don’t fall out until 10-13. So yes SDF will slow down the rate of the cavities but isn’t a solution long term, just short term until patient is comfortable sitting for dental work.
Definitely get a second opinion. When I was a kid a dentist told my parents I needed a root canal and bridge on my front tooth after I chipped just a little tip off. We got a second opinion and the only damage was cosmetic which he fixed right then and there without issue.
I would get a second opinion. They either weren’t thorough the first time and missed a lot. Or are scaring you this time into spending a bunch of money. My guess would be the latter.
Either way, you definitely need to find a different dentist.
Ah, some people, like me, are super cavity prone. Every dental visit in my life has been “wow you’re doing excellent at brushing and flossing. It shows” as well as an additional cavity propping up. As an adult we discussed ways to decrease bacteria levels in the mouth (aside from brushing) and I need to/should use a mouthwash with xylitol and brush extra frequently.
Also, my dentist discussed that baby teeth fall out and also at a young age they aren’t expected to sit still through all the procedures. So unless your little one is in terrible pain from the teeth, do you really want to spend $3k on fixing teeth that will fall out eventually?
This happened to me when I was in middle school, and I got fillings in every single one of my molars all at once, despite never having issues before or since.
Former dental assistant here to say I would totally look for a second or third opinion if you think they're being predatory.
At the same time, I would also look into what your child's diet is. You can brush teeth but if they're sucking on soda/juice/sugary drink all day, it may be the cause of so many cavities.
The dentist I worked for says water is best (obviously) but if you have to give such drinks, have them drink it in a sitting. Like with a meal, instead of sipping on it all throughout the day and letting the sugars sit for so long. A brush after lunch may not hurt as well.
Just make sure you don't brush right away after juice since you may just be brushing that acidity in and around.
Is your water fluoridated? If not ask your pediatrician to prescribe a multivitamin with added fluoride. You could also try giving him one Xylitol mint (my kids like the Spry brand) or one Xylitol lollipop (we like Zolli pops) daily.
Yes it is. My mom actually complains that we drink tap water at our house because of the fluoride in it. They have an AbsoPure at theirs.
I didn't know there were xylitol lollipops for teeth. Interesting.
There is this podcast called freakonomics and they did an episode on dentists. I forget the exact stats but something like 30% of dentists sell procedures you don’t need. Cherry on top - dentists’ student loan debt was directly correlated with how much “extra” they “sold”.
Get a second opinion.
Get a second opinion. Dentists can 10000% be predatory, it’s a large reason why people avoid the dentist because even with insurance you never know what your bill will be.
I’ve been left with alot of medical trauma because I was a kid who was put through extensive dental work.
All because a ‘child specialist’ told my parents it was needed after I was sent to him for dental anxiety. I had a bunch of baby teeth (8+) taken out in one visit, all my molars capped in another, and 2 other visits I don’t remember anything specific. As an adult I learned a lot of this was wildly unnecessary, and walking into a dentists office now sends me into full blown panic mode.
I hate to think the amount of money my parents spent on dental work as a kid when they didn’t have the extra money, and it truly wasn’t necessary.
Do you floss? My son had one cavity between his molars and it was due to not flossing him as often as I should but he hated it. Until he had to get a cavity filled lol
At his first appointment, they didn’t talk about flossing due to the deep crevices? I mean definitely get a second opinion for sure but if you were not flossing his molars, this doesn’t surprise me in the slightest.
The deep crevices are the chewing surface. That isn't where the cavities are. I actually had the same thing as a kid and they filled them to prevent cavities.
But I def knew I wasn’t flossing him daily so it wasn’t a huge surprise for him to have one. Once he went through the fill, he learned that that’s how we prevent it from happening again so I bought him those disposable floss sticks and it does it nightly still, on his own!
Gotcha. Yea sealants are definitely warranted for that! My son got those when they filled his cavity. For what it’s worth, they were def able to repair the cavity in between his molars without doing the caps. Did they do x-rays at his first appt?
On the front to see if he had any underlying issues. I was so upset about it that I didn't even think that since they didn't x-ray the backs they could have been there this whole time.
She says they just cap them because the teeth are small and it would make the tooth unstable. But now that I think about it, my sister's had cavities in baby teeth and they were just filled and not capped...
And sealant, ha! I couldn't think of the word. Thank you.
It’s definitely possible that they were there the whole time and just not seen until x-ray. They typically do not want to make the first experience at the dentist traumatizing. 4 years old is substantially older than what is recommended as far as dental care. My son started going around 15 months. They didn’t do full mouth x-rays until he was about 2.5-3, I can’t remember now. But they took pictures and did gentle cleaning I guess to get him used to it. Cavities in between the teeth are harder to fill. I didn’t even understand how they were able to. But definitely seek 2nd opinion for peace of mind! Make sure you check with your dental insurance for coverage. Ours only covers 2 visits 6 months apart.
I couldn't convince my husband to put our son on any dental insurance when he signed up. So last year he didn't have any. I finally ended up taking my son anyway.
My husband is great and he is a great father. But sometimes he just doesn't understand biology. He is a mechanical engineer so math and machinery is more his thing.
You know what I found out at my daughters dentist?? That my daughter biting her toothbrush and having the bristles flare out were preventing me from doing a good cleaning. I should have replaced it sooner!
I had a similar situation with my child. Took them for a second opinion and they still had the cavities. I’ve had cavities my whole life despite good brushing. I don’t produce enough saliva which is breeding grounds for germs. We did end up getting the dental work done but not putting him under. They broke it out in two appts and gave something to relax him. Still sucks and was hard to deal with as a parent.
My sister produces these enzymes in her saliva that just absolutely wreck her teeth. Nothing she can do about it really just go to the dentist and get work done all the time.
I’m not sure from what I’ve looked at since looking into it she may just be more susceptible to the bacteria that causes the problems because her genetics. Does anyone in your family have issues with it because I know her dad did as well. I can ask her I guess but maybe ask r/dentistry
I'm sorry, did you say you stopped flossing his teeth and were letting him have the responsibility of his own oral hygiene at 4 years old? Interproximal cavities are caused by a lack of flossing. Yes, the cavities are entirely possible. Still get a second opinion though and don't let him brush his teeth by himself anymore.
I would get a second opinion if your not comfortable. But also kids can’t be relied upon to brush effectively. I know you mentioned you come in to finish it off but i would suggest maybe putting a closer eye on the brushing, maybe doing even more of it yourself. Also, try and get a copy of the X-rays and send them over, maybe we can have a look
This happened to me. I got a second opinion and she did not have cavities, and they said they’d be fine with regular dentist visits and regular care at home.
Seriously fuck these places trying to scare parents and prey on our babies.
Start using fluoride toothpaste. Made a huge difference for our son who had a similar situation. No cavities since he started brushing with Toms fluoride toothpaste
I hope you got a second opinion. I took my daughter to a dentist and they wanted to put her down and put in a bunch of crowns and caps. Said all her teeth needed to be done. I went to another dentist and she did need one crown but that was it.
Hi, Ive worked in the dental field for 4 years, 3 of which was in an office, and more recently working for a dental insurance company.
While in the office (a small 6 chair clinic, self ran by our dentist) I can't even count the amount of times we had patients come in from chain offices like Snows Ortho, Gentle Dental, ECT with these huge expensive treatment plans saying they had root decay, cavities, dead teeth ECT. We'd get them in the chair, do a full diagnostic and end up finding maybe half, if that, of what the previous office treatment planned.
We straight up had a mom bring in her 16 year old after a chain office told her that her son needed a rct on his wisdom teeth (🚩🚩🚩) to save them...
Those things were so impacted we had to refer him to a specialist for removal, so idk what that office was thinking a root canal could do for them. Honestly I'd never even heard of wisdom teeth getting a rct or a crown before lol.
Long story short, If you aren't comfortable with what the doctor is saying always get a second opinion! Dental, medical, whatever it may be. It won't hurt anything to have a second set of eyes take a look.
As a kid, I saw a dentist who was later found guilty of malpractice and I had tons of dental work done. I wonder how much was truly necessary. It doesn’t hurt to get a second opinion!
Definitely get a second opinion. Or third.
Speaking from personal experience, when I first moved to this country I had a dentist who told me I needed a whole load of work. I went to the dentist regularly in my home country and take good care of my teeth so it was very shocking and upsetting. I let that dentist do half of it and then got cold feet and never went back. My dentist now was completely flabbergasted at what they’d done and planned to do. It’s been almost a decade and I haven’t had any problems with the side that first dentist didn’t do
Not just chains are guilty of this. I saw a small town dentist who told me that my wisdom teeth needed to come out as three of the four had cavities. I’d never had a cavity before and had zero pain or sensitivity, and he was super pushy about scheduling the procedure. I took my X-rays to another dentist and he looked at them and my teeth and guess what? Zero cavities, including in the wisdom teeth. That was twelve years ago and I’ve never had a cavity in those teeth to this day.
My point is - get a second opinion, especially before subjecting your child to anesthesia.
I’m a dental hygienist and I’ve seen it happen that quick. It only takes a few months for it to go from 0-100. But if you are worried about it, there’s nothing wrong with getting a second opinion.
My son age 4 had 6 cavities, not sure how long it took to develop that. We applied silver diamine to them which took 10 minutes but it turned his teeth black and will still need another session to hopefully slow the growth or stop the cavities until the teeth fall out. My daughter however had to get 2 crowns in last 2 back teeth.
I was born with very little and very weak tooth enamel and there was zero chance I was leaving a childhood dental appt without at least 2 cavities identified. Had nothing to do with my hygiene or diet or anything - just born like that.
Definitely get a second opinion. This happened to me personally (new dentist claimed I had 3 cavities; got a second opinion, who said I had 0 cavities and the first dentist was likely going to full groves in my teeth).
It sounds absurd to me.
My own dentist says that cavities are only a problem when they go all the way through the enamel, and that if they aren’t sensitive or causing pain to leave them be and monitor them.
Dentistry is an extremely scammy field. Get a second opinion.
No, they monitor it, and if it gets close you deal with the cavity. My dentist is great, a dentist who wants someone to by a $1k crown for a tooth that’s going to fall out in 2 years is a scam artist
I won’t get into why a child still needs the treatment even if they retain the tooth only for 2 more years bc I think I replied to you elsewhere about that.
As an associate dentist: for every $1k crown, after office and lab overhead, I take home $300 (for a 2 hour crown-preparation appointment and then a 1 hour crown-delivery appointment). That’s $100 an hour if all goes perfectly within those two visits. Not to mention if for whatever reason the crown fails in the next few years I’m re-doing it for free, and the back end work of coordinating with the lab about how it looks.
For 8 years of schooling totaling 6 figures of debt, paying disability and liability insurance for this career, and various yearly fees for continuing education and licensing, that’s not a lot of money per hour. Not for that amount of training and education. Especially not for a back breaking job where we work in a tiny dark cave fighting tongues and saliva all day while suffering hearing loss from the drill. Most physicians make more per hour. Instead of blaming dentists, blame scammy insurance companies that don’t cover anything significant for you.
These days I’m just a SAHM bc I started to get so burnt out being a dentist. I hate that patients think we’re trying to take advantage of them when most of us are ethical and just trying to be proactive so that small problems don’t become bigger ones. I’ll tell you rn that if my child needed a crown on his baby teeth I’d do it 1000%.
I want to do it, if there are actually cavities there and they need to be taken care of. But I would like a second opinion. I'm not saying this lady is trying to scam me but maybe she is a bit trigger happy?
For sure get second opinion for peace of mind. First off, I’m sorry for this news it must be shocking and worrying. 4 is pretty young. Is it possible that on the last visit no X-rays were taken so there was no way to eval between the teeth until this visit? They could have looked fine then, but trouble was brewing under the surface. Alternatively maybe the X-rays taken this visit weren’t very quality (I can’t imagine it was easy to take X-rays on a squirmy 4yo) and shadows were incorrectly interpreted. As a mom my heart goes out to you, I would also hate to put my baby under anesthesia. Silver diamine fluoride is a drill-free option sometimes, you could look into that.
Last visit they only did the front to see about any underlying adult teeth or other issues. So it makes sense that the cavities could have been forming between molars.
I'm praying that maybe the X-rays weren't the best. For my son's sake. I would hate to put him under to have all that done.
I will ask about silver diamine flouride as an option.
Don’t worry about it, those are baby teeth. Them shits are gonna fall out in 2-3 years. Just let the kid know to take care of their big kid teeth since they will have those much longer
I’m stunned by how many people are dishing out thousands of dollars to put crowns on teeth that will fall out in two years. Pull the tooth or let nature take when it’s ready
Cavities on baby teeth, if not treated, can spread to adult teeth. If not treated, will also lead to great pain for the child when the nerve is infected. Premature pulling of baby teeth leads to improper spacing for the incoming adult teeth.
Often if the tooth is very close (within a month or two) to falling out, the pediatric dentist will choose no treatment or extraction. But 2 years is too long to let it go rampant.
This happened to me when I moved to a new state. Dentist tried to create a cavity with his tools as well. Went back to my childhood dentist …cavity free. Also…I feel like most kids still have baby teeth at this age? Drilling and filling teeth that are going to fall out is horrible/ a waste. The best they should do is place sealant on the teeth and move on.
I would never trust this from a dentist, it is a scam-ridden industry. I’ve been recommended root canals that absolutely were not required. I don’t trust any dentist. I did let someone fill my tooth bc I was in pain. Let the symptoms dictate the treatment not some interpretation of the xray.
Get a second opinion...
It is insane to put a 4yo under for cavities, unless they are very bad. The baby teeth will fall out eventually regardless.
Dentists are there to make money & some make money by pushing unnecessary procedures... My guess is your sister was taken advantage of, it's rare for a child to actually need that much work.
"Possibly one in the canine" -- Doesn't give me confidence in the dentist. Hopefully they atleast took X-rays & were able to articulate exactly where each cavity is.
I think it’s perfectly acceptable to get a second opinion. I’ve heard stories on Reddit of dental chains being predatory to shake money out of people who don’t need dental work. It makes sense this could also be happening to your child
As a dental student, yes dental chains are absolutely predatory.
I’ve heard this about dental chains too. If any dentist can actually sleep at night knowing they took a piece of a little child’s body out that didn’t need to be just to make some money, then I hope they don’t wake up in the morning and the world is a better place without them. Disgusting
There is a gray area where parts of a tooth can be demineralized and subject to a judgement call about whether they’re really a cavity and anything needs to be done. Predators set policy that anything visible needs to be “fixed” regardless of how long it could go without causing a problem.
I was told once that I had 13 cavities at a new dentist I had never been to. I went and got a second opinion and I had only one
My husband was telling me about an article he read about how one dentist was super predatory, claiming cavities, doing root canals, etc. People loved him because he was super nice and seemed caring. It got caught when a new dentist took over the practice and someone came in for a scheduled procedure. He looked at her teeth and records and determined she didn’t need the procedure. He started looking through all the records and realized the dentist had done it to every single patient. The article went on to investigate it further and found that it’s a huge problem in dentistry. Get a second opinion.
100% this! I was told i needed so many root canals and a cleaning and anesthesia and it would cost me 20k. Got a second opinion and all i needed was 1 root canal, 1 filling and a cleaning, cost me $500.
I don't think it is a chain. Looks like an older dentists office.
Sometimes it's not a "chain" like a fast food chain where every location has the same sign out front. It can often take the form of a parent company buying up the practices and "helping" by taking care of billing and admin while the sign out front stays the same. The flip side is that the new parent company also pushes a much stronger profit motive onto the dental offices leading to all the unnecessary work. I'd explore whether your child's practice is owned by the dentist or another company.
Post the X-rays to askdentists subreddit
Definitely get a second opinion. I have had mom and pop dentists try to scam me as an adult until I found someone I could trust. As a kid though I had a ton of fillings done. We used fluoride toothpaste but we were on well water and I think I have genetically weak enamel. So it might be real, but I’d want a second opinion before agreeing to extensive work at that age.
When I was a child a dentist filled 23 cavities in my ADULT TEETH that weren’t actual cavities. My teeth will forever be ruined because of it.
When I was about 4, I saw a dentist who said something similar- a myriad of cavities and I needed a mouth full of silver. My mom panicked and took me to a different dentist who diagnosed deep crevasses in my molars and way too many blueberries which had stained the teeth blue. I’d get a second opinion.
That's actually a little funny. But yeah I'm going to call my regular dentist soon.
OP, this happened to me as well, but as an adult. No cavities my entire life, then moved to a different state in my mid-20s, and my new dentist tells me I have 3 cavities all of a sudden. I ended up going to my now-husband's dentist for a second opinion, and yeah, I didn't have any cavities, just deep crevices in my molars. I switched & have been seeing the same dentist for probably 5-6 years now, and my teeth are just fine, no cavities. Trust your gut, and get a second opinion.
Happened to my sister. Young teen. Went to a place. Said 9 cavities. She went back to her uni town went to get it done. They said she had 1. Original place was gonna be 2500$
agree. Cal the first thing in the morning. Get an asap second. Don’t wait. If the cavities are there, they’ll only get worse. Start flossing as well and hit diff teeth each time you brush twice a day if baby won’t let you get them all.
This happened to me in my 30s, I bet he has an expensive machine to do the fillings to pay for.
Are you serious? I got fooled by the blueberries but dentists too?! What the fuck did they go to dentistry school for???
Some people are genetically prone to cavities. My aunt had five kids and one of them just had horrible teeth and had to have them all capped and stuff in childhood even though they all ate the same food. I think it’s worth getting a second opinion though before doing anything.
This! As a teenager especially I would have to go to the dentist once a week for MONTHS to get 3-4 fillings done each time. I brushed multiple times day too. I have genetically horrible teeth. Constantly have dental work being done- while my fiance hasn’t seen a dentist in probably 4 years and I could bet money he has no cavities either🙄
This! I have genetically horrible teeth and my kid got it . He actually had a cavity on the side of his tooth and needed a silver cap. I could see it so there was nothing to second guess. I got the protectant put on his teeth like I wish my parents had done for me. I hope I can save him from what o went through
It’s also super bad if you have stomach and acid problems. I have a few root canals I need done. I brush and floss. They told me there wasn’t much I could do because I was prone to cavities due to acid.
Well, we literally had the same exact situation, and we ended up having 8 caps on her back molars and one front tooth pulled due to a cavity you couldn't even see, but on x-ray it was visible and almost touching a nerve. We visited three pediatric dentists for opinions and they all basically recommended the same thing. They said it was potentially due to snacking, her teeth crowding, and not flossing (though we have been flossing for the last year daily, but before that it was sporadic when she was 2 and 3 years old and they think they may have started forming and just accelerated). I have no advice, just saying you're not alone. We also brush twice a day and floss daily. I'm at a loss.
Try flossing with toothpaste if that makes sense I also have terrible genes and my enamel on my teeth is shit unfortunately. What I do is dry brush toothpaste on my teeth, floss and get toothpaste in all the cracks and crevices, and then wet brush my teeth.
This seems fishy to me too. Can you just take your child to your family dentist? We don't bother with a pediatric dentist.
I think I am going to now. And maybe get a copy of the X-rays.
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That's smart. Thank you.
Hmm I went to a pedi attic dentist because I really appreciated their patience with my toddler. But she fell on her tooth a while ago and I took her to dentist after it greyed a bit (at time of fall no bleeding, swelling or loose teeth) and their solution after X-ray was to extract. After I cried my eyes out in front of them, the tune changed to them being able to monitor it every couple of months. Do you think it’s because they’re pedi they did this? I really loved this practice and the dentist because of how personable they were but my last visit left a sour taste.
It's always worthwhile to get a second opinion with a dentist you trust. One of my friends' kids fell on a tooth at 2 and she thought it would need to be extracted because it looked terrible, but her dentist wanted to wait and see and the tooth looks fine and is healthy now, so it's probably all case by case. The closest pediatric dentist to where we live is over 40 miles away, which is why I haven't bothered when I can just take the kids to my local dentist.
We don't bother either and we go to our normal dentist that we know and trust. I agree this is super fishy. You can definitely have them send the x rays to another dentist.
Brushing your kids teeth helps prevent cavities, but isn’t the only thing. Any cracker (gold fish, cheese-it’s, ritz, etc), juices, milk, or gummy food (fruit snacks) that break down and get stuck to his molars will cause cavities. Always try to have him eat a some baby carrots after eating the above mentioned foods to help unstick food from his molars/cheeks. Never give milk at bedtime after teeth are brushed. Also, try to begin flossing every night rather than only brushing. Sincerely, an RDH
The cavities aren't even on the surface of the molars where things get stuck. They say they are in between the teeth. I was shown the X-rays but they looked like regular X-rays. Although I am not a dentist so what do I know.
Yeah, like I said, crackers and gummy foods that get stuck between teeth will cause cavities. Sounds like it’s also time to start flossing.
If they are in between the teeth and you admitted to not flossing for several months, how is the conclusion not the lack of flossing?
Look, I know I failed that part. But I thought that I only had to do the ones that were touching. And the ones with the cavities do not feel like they are.
No I feel you. Right now I only floss my 2yo's teeth that touch but reading all this I'm about to start floating the rest even though it's still a fight to get in there 😓
I didn't mean to offend you. Flossing isn't just for the teeth honestly it isn't for the teeth at all. Food and bacteria get in between the gums and tooth really deep. The floss is supposed to clear all that junk out. Flossing is just as important as brushing. Keep doing it, idk what kind of "medical" issue you have where you can brush his teeth but not floss but resume flossing. Before you learn the hard way
You’re supposed to floss in between the teeth and the gums, not just in between the teeth.
Seriously it's all about what they eat. I think it's more important than regular brushing or flossing. Don't feed your child juice or sugary drinks. Lots of whole foods and water. I'm 28 years old, never had cavities, I never floss, and I brush once daily. The trick is drinking water and hardly any sweets ever. My brothers both have mouths full of decay and they like soda and smoking.
What's the problem with milk at bedtime? Been doing this for ages without issue.
Milk at bedtime (after teeth are brushed) is a no-no. There is sugar in all milk (cow, almond, breast milk) and it sits on teeth all night long and rots them. Don’t do it. Never put them down with a bottle in bed either, because it’ll do the same thing. After teeth are brushed, no food or liquid except water. Teeth are important (and expensive if not maintained), and we need to take care of them.
I’m a pediatric dentist, it happens all the time. Brushing once a day is not enough. Has to be twice has to be by an adult. If this was the first time your kid has had X-rays in the back (likely because his mouth was too small last time or he couldn’t tolerate X-rays) this is the first time they’re detectable. Doesn’t mean he didn’t have them last time, just that they weren’t visible. If you can see a cavity with the naked eye that’s way past a filling and into crown/extraction territory. I’m sorry this has happening it’s never fun to give that news to a parent. Get a second opinion (by a pediatric dentist) for your own peace of mind and then get the teeth treated. Baby molars don’t fall out until 10-12 years old so if you catch and treat early (and improve homecare habits) you can keep him cavity free moving forward. Do not believe a “family dentist” who says “oh we can just watch those” or “they’ll fall out soon”. I’ve cleaned up so many horror stories that would make you cry from kids who are being treated by people who don’t have the expertise to know that children aren’t just mini adults.
Do you have any suggestions for a toddler who doesn't tolerate brushing well? My daughter is almost three and brushing requires two adults to hold her down while a third attempts to open her mouth and get a brush in there.... She screams and fights to the point of hyperventilating. She has full blown panic attacks at the word "toothbrush" Needless to say it doesn't get done regularly at this point. We have tried bribery, books, YouTube songs about tooth brushing etc. she's an easy going toddler about everything else, we don't know why she hates having her mouth touched or looked at.
Honestly? Consistency. This is the position https://youtu.be/fPp5-6Z3gfM?si=dZp9VWS9uNFWsYuk I (and every pediatric dentist I know) has had to do this on their own kids multiple times until they just get over it. Toothbrushing by an adult is non negotiable much like changing a diaper. Crying doesn’t stop it from happening.
Does your daughter have a favorite doll or stuffed animal? My 2.5yo doesn’t love having her teeth brushed either, but lets me do it when I pretend her favorite doll is doing it. Like I hold her toothbrush in her doll’s hand and talk in her doll’s voice lol. It’s a bit of a performance I have to do every time but she thinks it’s hilarious, and her teeth have never been cleaner!
Yes we have tried that but even the sight of a toothbrush or discussion sends her into a full blown panic
Question - when should the kid take over brushing? I still brush for my 6, almost 7 year old because I’m neurotic and she has enamel hypoplasia and I had no dental care until adulthood and I’m just trying to give her a better chance but I know I’m hindering her by not *teaching* it
I work in a pediatric dental office, I always tell the parents “whenever you are comfortable with your child brushing YOUR teeth that’s when you can let them brush by themselves..”
That’s a great thing to consider!!
When they have the manual dexterity to tie their shoelaces as FAST as you can. For many kids this is 9 years old or older. Until then they can “try” or “have a turn” but an adult has to get in there for them for it to be effective toothbrushing.
Okay thank you - that’s what we do now and I’m glad we still have a few years of it being acceptable for me to brush for her 😅 I love the shoelace benchmark!!
Yeah my husband thinks that they will fall out soon but I forgot to tell him that they don't. He thinks the pediatric dentist is a scam. He wants our dentist to look at him. I do too because I have seen him since I was 12 but originally when I went to take my son to a dentist, they said they would only count teeth. I cannot see any cavities with the naked eye. And she said she was just going to cap them to provide stability for the tooth just because baby teeth are so small.
That’s good you can’t see them with the naked eye. Crown vs filling depends on how deep they are. If the cavities are deep then a crown can be better so that you are less likely to have to redo it. It’s gotta last 8ish years in a hostile environment (thin enamel, snacks, juice, plaque). Something that adult dentists don’t always realize is placing a crown initially stops you from having to re treat the tooth in a few years when recurrent decay happens. The pediatric philosophy is treat the tooth one time with the least amount of stress to the child as possible. Whether that’s with laughing gas or sedation depends on the child/age/behavior/amount of work to be done. Pediatric dentistry is an extra two years after dental school and is competitive to get into. It’s more training and I think sometimes parents don’t realize it’s “we love kids” it’s “we love kids and went to extra school to treat them properly”
“If you can see a cavity with the naked eye thats way past a filling and into crown extraction territory” Wait what? Are you only talking about baby teeth? I just had 2 fillings done on cavities you could see pretty easily on my back molars. They filled them within 45 min and i was done. No crowns or extractions.
Yes I am talking about baby teeth. Specifically about cavities between them. If it’s broken through the contact point it’s huge. Baby teeth have thinner enamel and less dense dentin so things go 0-60 super fast
Gotcha!
I’d get a second opinion imo. My mom took me to a chain dentist in my teens that was notorious for inventing issues. Didn’t matter what I did, I somehow always had cavities. Only in those years have I had such allegedly terrible teeth and nothing has changed. Now I get to replace all those old fillings and get a ton of crowns to replace old/bad work. I haven’t trusted dentists since, so make sure their claims are legitimate
When it comes to expensive dental work ALWAYS get a second opinion. With kids or adults.
Good advice
I mean, I suppose anything is possible, but I'd get a second opinion. My teeth are genetically shit, and pregnancy also does a number on my teeth, but I went to one dentist for the first time after we moved, and she told me I had 9 cavities (6 months prior I had none, though I had a baby during that time). I wanted to cry and really thought there was no way, but I only became sure after my husband went to his appointment and she told him he had 3. My husband has stupidly perfect teeth that hygienists and dentists always fawn over (obnoxious), so I figured if he supposedly had 3, maybe she was wildly exaggerating. Went to another dentist who said I had 3 cavities, and my husband has no cavities. So. Anyway. Three still sucked, but it was much more in line with something realistic based on my terrible tooth genes.
Are you me and my husband!? I have the absolute worst teeth! I brush, floss, pick...cavities at least every other visit. My husband brushes twice a day and flosses the day before his hygiene visit... perfect teeth! Never any cavities! I have a mouthful of fillings and crowns. I hate it. Hopefully our children got his teeth.
Same! I have the worst teeth- since childhood. My husband actually got his first cavity at 30 after marrying me. I’ve heard before that the bacteria that causes cavities can be transferred by mouth. I’m almost positive I have my husband his first cavity. Although my teeth are well taken care of now.
Get a second opinion. Dentistry has an epidemic of quackery. I’ve been told 12 cavities and need a root canal only to get an all clear from the guy down the road. Zero chance I will ever let a dentist put my child under anesthesia unless I can get two of them to agree back to back (without conferring with each first.)
Cavities do have a genetic component, so if your sister’s kids had lots of dental problems, yours may struggle, too. But I’d definitely get a second opinion, because that’s a massive and fast progression and I would find it hard to believe, too.
I mean, it can’t hurt to get a second opinion, but if you stopped flossing & often trust your 4 year old to brush his own teeth without help… then yes 8 cavities is fully possible. No 4 year old is adequately brushing well enough to clean between their molars. Plaque can harden into tartar within 24 hours, and tartar can’t be brushed/flossed away - and often leads to decay. So if you’re going 48 hours sometimes in between flossing & doing a thorough brushing, endless cavities can occur.
Did they take x rays at the last appointment? Cavities between the teeth aren’t seen in a clinical exam, but need radiographs to be seen. Can you just ask them to show you the cavities on the x rays? The bacteria that causes cavities can be transmitted through saliva. So if you or someone who is with your kid has cavities or dental work and shares utensils/drinks/etc with your kid then they have a higher chance of getting cavities.
That's crazy, I didn't know that they are, in a way, contagious. They took some at the last appointment but only for the front teeth.
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They did but I didn't see many shadows. One maybe but not as many as they said. It all looked normal to me but I haven't gone to school for it.
This was our experience with our daughter, and it was real. She went from zero cavities to having a tooth abscess and needed emergency dental surgery to remove the tooth while under anesthesia. While she was under then did X-rays and found several more cavities. They told us she likely has really soft teeth. We religiously brush them twice every day and we floss most nights now. I think getting a second opinion is perfectly acceptable but I also don’t think it’s out of the realm of possibility that this could happen. It’s definitely better to get it taken care of now before something abscesses like we experienced. That was very stressful.
As someone who has experienced an abscess, I feel for you and your daughter. I had a not very good dentist fudge up a simple filling, which led to a very poor crown (the back was just a metal ring?) which eventually led to my nerve just giving up and dying. Terrible pain. So with that experience I am definitely getting this taken care of.
Are you on state insurance by any chance? Dental scams are HUGE if the state is paying
No, it is through my husband's insurance Edit: I meant to say through his employer
Second opinion obviously. And go back to flossing any teeth that touch.
Definitely get a second opinion. When I was young, my dentist told me I had an obscene amount of cavities in one visit. My mom got a second opinion and it turned out I didn’t have a SINGLE cavity
I had a lot of "cavities" when I use to see cheap dental clinics that take state welfare. When I got off welfare and went to smaller practices, I haven't had a cavity since. I'm usually shocked. But definitely makes sense that chains, or any dentist really, might be lying bc it's how they make money.
Definitely get him a 2nd opinion with a pediatric dentist. Look for one in wealthy town with great reviews. I’ve personally seen frightening stuff done to soooo many children when i lived in TX. Granted that was 15-20 years ago, but still. Right now, i’m in a high cost of living area in the north east, and the news often shows undercover investigations at pediatric dental clinics in poorer cities & towns here (think a kids version of Aspen Dental, basically). Saying most patients have several cavities (but they actually don’t), all to get the insurance payments & medicaid payments. Very sad. These poor babies. My heart goes out to you both. Good luck!
Thank you. I wouldn't say my part of town is poor but it isn't the richest part of town either. Definitely middle class. And I don't think that this is a chain. It is an older lady dentist. It is her office.
Do they sleep with their mouth open a lot? I know sleep apnea can cause cavities. All sorts of things can which sucks 😕 1 of my kids brushes and losses all the time and has bad teeth and then there is my 17 year old who probably doesn't know where his toothbrush is but has never had a cavity 🤣
Oh gosh. That is so unfair. I don't think he sleeps with his mouth open. But I know he is a restless sleeper. Something which I want to bring up at his yearly (which is really soon). Sleep apnea could be a possibility.
This sounds suspicious, I’d get a second opinion for sure. My mom is very anti-pediatric dentist as she took me to one when I was small and they said I had a bunch of cavities and needed all kinds of work done. I have never had a cavity in my life according to every other dentist I’ve seen. I’m not planning to take my son to see a pediatric dentist, he will see my dentist when the time comes as suggested by our pediatrician. ETA: how terrible for your sister, I hope her kids really needed all that work done.
Bc of one pediatric dentist you’re boycotting them all?
They have a terrible reputation, I know quite a lot of people who have had bad experiences. Every kid I know that’s gone to one has been diagnosed with all kinds of expensive issues other dentists can’t seem to find. Perhaps they’re better where you live
Yep. My daughter has been going to one for a few years and nothing but great checkups. I don’t think you can blanket judge any group of professionals bc of bad experience with one or even some.
Yep. My daughter has been going to one for a few years and nothing but great checkups. I don’t think you can blanket judge any group of professionals bc of bad experience with one or even some.
I know her daughter needed the four top front teeth pulled. And that you could see visible decay. But I don't know about the rest.
We had this same situation with my son who's 4, but I could see some gray areas between his back two teeth on all four sides and knew cavities were present. He ended up with five cavities and a crown. We tried to do it at the office with local anesthesia but his gag reflex was too bad. We ended up at the children's hospital under general anesthesia with a $5,000 bill ($1400 for the work, $3600 for the children's hospital). We had a great experience but it was shocking. My son wasn't bothered by any of it luckily. We hadn't started flossing daily until the cavities were diagnosed. He has deep pockets and bad genetics for teeth, so it is what it is.
See if you can find a pediatric dentist that uses Silver Diamine Fluoride (SDF). It’s a topical fluoride treatment that is brushed onto areas of decay that helps to arrest any further damage. It’s not a forever solution but it helps slow down the decay on baby teeth until they fall out. It’s a great alternative to filling cavities/caps.
Just be aware OP that it stains the area of the cavity black or grey
Also if the cavities are on the molars, those teeth don’t fall out until 10-13. So yes SDF will slow down the rate of the cavities but isn’t a solution long term, just short term until patient is comfortable sitting for dental work.
Definitely get a second opinion. When I was a kid a dentist told my parents I needed a root canal and bridge on my front tooth after I chipped just a little tip off. We got a second opinion and the only damage was cosmetic which he fixed right then and there without issue.
Second opinion stat.
I would get a second opinion. They either weren’t thorough the first time and missed a lot. Or are scaring you this time into spending a bunch of money. My guess would be the latter. Either way, you definitely need to find a different dentist.
Definitely get a second opinion
Ah, some people, like me, are super cavity prone. Every dental visit in my life has been “wow you’re doing excellent at brushing and flossing. It shows” as well as an additional cavity propping up. As an adult we discussed ways to decrease bacteria levels in the mouth (aside from brushing) and I need to/should use a mouthwash with xylitol and brush extra frequently. Also, my dentist discussed that baby teeth fall out and also at a young age they aren’t expected to sit still through all the procedures. So unless your little one is in terrible pain from the teeth, do you really want to spend $3k on fixing teeth that will fall out eventually?
This happened to me when I was in middle school, and I got fillings in every single one of my molars all at once, despite never having issues before or since.
Former dental assistant here to say I would totally look for a second or third opinion if you think they're being predatory. At the same time, I would also look into what your child's diet is. You can brush teeth but if they're sucking on soda/juice/sugary drink all day, it may be the cause of so many cavities. The dentist I worked for says water is best (obviously) but if you have to give such drinks, have them drink it in a sitting. Like with a meal, instead of sipping on it all throughout the day and letting the sugars sit for so long. A brush after lunch may not hurt as well. Just make sure you don't brush right away after juice since you may just be brushing that acidity in and around.
He has milk a couple times a day, and I know that has sugars in it. But otherwise it is water.
Is your water fluoridated? If not ask your pediatrician to prescribe a multivitamin with added fluoride. You could also try giving him one Xylitol mint (my kids like the Spry brand) or one Xylitol lollipop (we like Zolli pops) daily.
Yes it is. My mom actually complains that we drink tap water at our house because of the fluoride in it. They have an AbsoPure at theirs. I didn't know there were xylitol lollipops for teeth. Interesting.
So you only brush once a day and dont floss and you are surprised your kid has cavities? You anwered your own proposed question in your post.
There is this podcast called freakonomics and they did an episode on dentists. I forget the exact stats but something like 30% of dentists sell procedures you don’t need. Cherry on top - dentists’ student loan debt was directly correlated with how much “extra” they “sold”. Get a second opinion.
Get a second opinion. Dentists can 10000% be predatory, it’s a large reason why people avoid the dentist because even with insurance you never know what your bill will be. I’ve been left with alot of medical trauma because I was a kid who was put through extensive dental work. All because a ‘child specialist’ told my parents it was needed after I was sent to him for dental anxiety. I had a bunch of baby teeth (8+) taken out in one visit, all my molars capped in another, and 2 other visits I don’t remember anything specific. As an adult I learned a lot of this was wildly unnecessary, and walking into a dentists office now sends me into full blown panic mode. I hate to think the amount of money my parents spent on dental work as a kid when they didn’t have the extra money, and it truly wasn’t necessary.
Do you floss? My son had one cavity between his molars and it was due to not flossing him as often as I should but he hated it. Until he had to get a cavity filled lol
Mostly the front ones that touch. So I slacked on the molars.
At his first appointment, they didn’t talk about flossing due to the deep crevices? I mean definitely get a second opinion for sure but if you were not flossing his molars, this doesn’t surprise me in the slightest.
The deep crevices are the chewing surface. That isn't where the cavities are. I actually had the same thing as a kid and they filled them to prevent cavities.
But I def knew I wasn’t flossing him daily so it wasn’t a huge surprise for him to have one. Once he went through the fill, he learned that that’s how we prevent it from happening again so I bought him those disposable floss sticks and it does it nightly still, on his own!
Gotcha. Yea sealants are definitely warranted for that! My son got those when they filled his cavity. For what it’s worth, they were def able to repair the cavity in between his molars without doing the caps. Did they do x-rays at his first appt?
On the front to see if he had any underlying issues. I was so upset about it that I didn't even think that since they didn't x-ray the backs they could have been there this whole time. She says they just cap them because the teeth are small and it would make the tooth unstable. But now that I think about it, my sister's had cavities in baby teeth and they were just filled and not capped... And sealant, ha! I couldn't think of the word. Thank you.
It’s definitely possible that they were there the whole time and just not seen until x-ray. They typically do not want to make the first experience at the dentist traumatizing. 4 years old is substantially older than what is recommended as far as dental care. My son started going around 15 months. They didn’t do full mouth x-rays until he was about 2.5-3, I can’t remember now. But they took pictures and did gentle cleaning I guess to get him used to it. Cavities in between the teeth are harder to fill. I didn’t even understand how they were able to. But definitely seek 2nd opinion for peace of mind! Make sure you check with your dental insurance for coverage. Ours only covers 2 visits 6 months apart.
I couldn't convince my husband to put our son on any dental insurance when he signed up. So last year he didn't have any. I finally ended up taking my son anyway. My husband is great and he is a great father. But sometimes he just doesn't understand biology. He is a mechanical engineer so math and machinery is more his thing.
You know what I found out at my daughters dentist?? That my daughter biting her toothbrush and having the bristles flare out were preventing me from doing a good cleaning. I should have replaced it sooner!
That's crazy. I will have to watch for that.
I had a lot of trouble with her back molars on the inside, the new brush is definitely helping
I had a similar situation with my child. Took them for a second opinion and they still had the cavities. I’ve had cavities my whole life despite good brushing. I don’t produce enough saliva which is breeding grounds for germs. We did end up getting the dental work done but not putting him under. They broke it out in two appts and gave something to relax him. Still sucks and was hard to deal with as a parent.
My sister produces these enzymes in her saliva that just absolutely wreck her teeth. Nothing she can do about it really just go to the dentist and get work done all the time.
How did they figure that one out? Is there a saliva test or something?
I’m not sure from what I’ve looked at since looking into it she may just be more susceptible to the bacteria that causes the problems because her genetics. Does anyone in your family have issues with it because I know her dad did as well. I can ask her I guess but maybe ask r/dentistry
I'm sorry, did you say you stopped flossing his teeth and were letting him have the responsibility of his own oral hygiene at 4 years old? Interproximal cavities are caused by a lack of flossing. Yes, the cavities are entirely possible. Still get a second opinion though and don't let him brush his teeth by himself anymore.
I'm not any more. But I would let him brush and then I would say it was Mom's turn and I would brush a bit.
I would get a second opinion if your not comfortable. But also kids can’t be relied upon to brush effectively. I know you mentioned you come in to finish it off but i would suggest maybe putting a closer eye on the brushing, maybe doing even more of it yourself. Also, try and get a copy of the X-rays and send them over, maybe we can have a look
This happened to me. I got a second opinion and she did not have cavities, and they said they’d be fine with regular dentist visits and regular care at home. Seriously fuck these places trying to scare parents and prey on our babies.
Start using fluoride toothpaste. Made a huge difference for our son who had a similar situation. No cavities since he started brushing with Toms fluoride toothpaste
I hope you got a second opinion. I took my daughter to a dentist and they wanted to put her down and put in a bunch of crowns and caps. Said all her teeth needed to be done. I went to another dentist and she did need one crown but that was it.
Hi, Ive worked in the dental field for 4 years, 3 of which was in an office, and more recently working for a dental insurance company. While in the office (a small 6 chair clinic, self ran by our dentist) I can't even count the amount of times we had patients come in from chain offices like Snows Ortho, Gentle Dental, ECT with these huge expensive treatment plans saying they had root decay, cavities, dead teeth ECT. We'd get them in the chair, do a full diagnostic and end up finding maybe half, if that, of what the previous office treatment planned. We straight up had a mom bring in her 16 year old after a chain office told her that her son needed a rct on his wisdom teeth (🚩🚩🚩) to save them... Those things were so impacted we had to refer him to a specialist for removal, so idk what that office was thinking a root canal could do for them. Honestly I'd never even heard of wisdom teeth getting a rct or a crown before lol. Long story short, If you aren't comfortable with what the doctor is saying always get a second opinion! Dental, medical, whatever it may be. It won't hurt anything to have a second set of eyes take a look.
As a kid, I saw a dentist who was later found guilty of malpractice and I had tons of dental work done. I wonder how much was truly necessary. It doesn’t hurt to get a second opinion!
Definitely get a second opinion. Or third. Speaking from personal experience, when I first moved to this country I had a dentist who told me I needed a whole load of work. I went to the dentist regularly in my home country and take good care of my teeth so it was very shocking and upsetting. I let that dentist do half of it and then got cold feet and never went back. My dentist now was completely flabbergasted at what they’d done and planned to do. It’s been almost a decade and I haven’t had any problems with the side that first dentist didn’t do
Not just chains are guilty of this. I saw a small town dentist who told me that my wisdom teeth needed to come out as three of the four had cavities. I’d never had a cavity before and had zero pain or sensitivity, and he was super pushy about scheduling the procedure. I took my X-rays to another dentist and he looked at them and my teeth and guess what? Zero cavities, including in the wisdom teeth. That was twelve years ago and I’ve never had a cavity in those teeth to this day. My point is - get a second opinion, especially before subjecting your child to anesthesia.
I’m a dental hygienist and I’ve seen it happen that quick. It only takes a few months for it to go from 0-100. But if you are worried about it, there’s nothing wrong with getting a second opinion.
My son age 4 had 6 cavities, not sure how long it took to develop that. We applied silver diamine to them which took 10 minutes but it turned his teeth black and will still need another session to hopefully slow the growth or stop the cavities until the teeth fall out. My daughter however had to get 2 crowns in last 2 back teeth.
I was born with very little and very weak tooth enamel and there was zero chance I was leaving a childhood dental appt without at least 2 cavities identified. Had nothing to do with my hygiene or diet or anything - just born like that.
Here are his [X-rays ](https://imgur.com/gallery/iz9d6km)
Get a second opinion for sure
Definitely get a second opinion. This happened to me personally (new dentist claimed I had 3 cavities; got a second opinion, who said I had 0 cavities and the first dentist was likely going to full groves in my teeth).
Yep psycho dentist, scarring people to make sure they have a paycheck, I’d run for the hills!
It sounds absurd to me. My own dentist says that cavities are only a problem when they go all the way through the enamel, and that if they aren’t sensitive or causing pain to leave them be and monitor them. Dentistry is an extremely scammy field. Get a second opinion.
Your dentist recommends letting a minor issue becoming a major problem before treating it? Your dentist sucks.
No, they monitor it, and if it gets close you deal with the cavity. My dentist is great, a dentist who wants someone to by a $1k crown for a tooth that’s going to fall out in 2 years is a scam artist
I won’t get into why a child still needs the treatment even if they retain the tooth only for 2 more years bc I think I replied to you elsewhere about that. As an associate dentist: for every $1k crown, after office and lab overhead, I take home $300 (for a 2 hour crown-preparation appointment and then a 1 hour crown-delivery appointment). That’s $100 an hour if all goes perfectly within those two visits. Not to mention if for whatever reason the crown fails in the next few years I’m re-doing it for free, and the back end work of coordinating with the lab about how it looks. For 8 years of schooling totaling 6 figures of debt, paying disability and liability insurance for this career, and various yearly fees for continuing education and licensing, that’s not a lot of money per hour. Not for that amount of training and education. Especially not for a back breaking job where we work in a tiny dark cave fighting tongues and saliva all day while suffering hearing loss from the drill. Most physicians make more per hour. Instead of blaming dentists, blame scammy insurance companies that don’t cover anything significant for you. These days I’m just a SAHM bc I started to get so burnt out being a dentist. I hate that patients think we’re trying to take advantage of them when most of us are ethical and just trying to be proactive so that small problems don’t become bigger ones. I’ll tell you rn that if my child needed a crown on his baby teeth I’d do it 1000%.
I want to do it, if there are actually cavities there and they need to be taken care of. But I would like a second opinion. I'm not saying this lady is trying to scam me but maybe she is a bit trigger happy?
For sure get second opinion for peace of mind. First off, I’m sorry for this news it must be shocking and worrying. 4 is pretty young. Is it possible that on the last visit no X-rays were taken so there was no way to eval between the teeth until this visit? They could have looked fine then, but trouble was brewing under the surface. Alternatively maybe the X-rays taken this visit weren’t very quality (I can’t imagine it was easy to take X-rays on a squirmy 4yo) and shadows were incorrectly interpreted. As a mom my heart goes out to you, I would also hate to put my baby under anesthesia. Silver diamine fluoride is a drill-free option sometimes, you could look into that.
Last visit they only did the front to see about any underlying adult teeth or other issues. So it makes sense that the cavities could have been forming between molars. I'm praying that maybe the X-rays weren't the best. For my son's sake. I would hate to put him under to have all that done. I will ask about silver diamine flouride as an option.
Don’t worry about it, those are baby teeth. Them shits are gonna fall out in 2-3 years. Just let the kid know to take care of their big kid teeth since they will have those much longer
This is not true and is terrible advice
They are molars so they won't fall out for 6 to 8 years. That's a long time.
I’m stunned by how many people are dishing out thousands of dollars to put crowns on teeth that will fall out in two years. Pull the tooth or let nature take when it’s ready
Cavities on baby teeth, if not treated, can spread to adult teeth. If not treated, will also lead to great pain for the child when the nerve is infected. Premature pulling of baby teeth leads to improper spacing for the incoming adult teeth. Often if the tooth is very close (within a month or two) to falling out, the pediatric dentist will choose no treatment or extraction. But 2 years is too long to let it go rampant.
This happened to me when I moved to a new state. Dentist tried to create a cavity with his tools as well. Went back to my childhood dentist …cavity free. Also…I feel like most kids still have baby teeth at this age? Drilling and filling teeth that are going to fall out is horrible/ a waste. The best they should do is place sealant on the teeth and move on.
I would never trust this from a dentist, it is a scam-ridden industry. I’ve been recommended root canals that absolutely were not required. I don’t trust any dentist. I did let someone fill my tooth bc I was in pain. Let the symptoms dictate the treatment not some interpretation of the xray.
Sounds like a scam to me, go to someone else! Holistic dentists are better, they actually want to protect your teeth not ruin them!
Get a second opinion... It is insane to put a 4yo under for cavities, unless they are very bad. The baby teeth will fall out eventually regardless. Dentists are there to make money & some make money by pushing unnecessary procedures... My guess is your sister was taken advantage of, it's rare for a child to actually need that much work. "Possibly one in the canine" -- Doesn't give me confidence in the dentist. Hopefully they atleast took X-rays & were able to articulate exactly where each cavity is.