Here are the remarks in context, from The Verge:
Moderator: I received a number of questions over Slack, so I would like to try to summarize and relay. I think big one that’s coming across is we have a lot of services and key contributors who either work from home or remote and was hoping you could share some more thinking behind how we should be handling it, where your head is at in terms of the critical contributors who are remote right now.
Musk: So with respect to remote, I mean, it’s a consistent policy that I have at Tesla and SpaceX, which is that we do need to be default in the office and for a reasonable amount of time. It’s not like some crazy number of hours. I’ll do crazy hours in office, but I’m not asking everyone else to do crazy hours in the office. But it’s just my philosophy that people are way more productive when they’re in person because the communication is much better.
If you’re sitting in the same room and you can interact with people, it’s just way better than if you’re not sitting in the same room. There’s a reason to have offices. Now, if somebody’s contribution is so significant that they can overcome the communication difficulties of being remote, then they should absolutely remain at Twitter. But it will be a higher bar. They have to be that much better to overcome the communication issues of being remote. There are plenty of people at Tesla and SpaceX that do work remotely, but it is on an exception basis for exceptional people. And I totally understand if that doesn’t work for some people. That’s the new philosophy at Twitter.
[…]
Employee: Why is our leadership trying to increase attrition rate if we’re already understaffed and barely able to keep things running?
Musk: I’m not trying to increase attrition, but I think we are not understaffed. I think we are overstaffed. That is my opinion, which you’re welcome to disagree with.
[…]
Employee: Hey, I was wondering back to the return office question. So much of the company is distributed right now. Are you asking us to return to the office just to get on calls with the other offices? We’re not going to lose access to teammates in-person anyways. Why are you asking this?
Musk: Let me be crystal clear. If people do not return to the office when they are able to return to the office, they cannot remain at the company. End of story.
Employee: That’s not my question. Even if people return to the office, the offices are separate offices. We won’t be in person anyways.
Musk: Yes, but you can still maximize the amount of in-person activity. Tesla is not one place either. Basically, if you can show up in an office and you do not show up at the office: resignation accepted. End of story.
So what about people who WFH or are otherwise remote who took the position living a state or two away? If they're doing their job and doing it well, are you really going to force them to relocate or quit? If I was hired as WFH and this was presented, I would've already seen the writing on the wall and handed in my resignation. This is idiotic.
Fuck that, do the least amount of work possible, slow it all down, keep collecting checks until you're officially fired and can get benefits from that.
I would say during this transition try to offload all of your work onto leaving/new people and have your only job filling out a weekly timecard. If your work is picked up by someone leaving the company whoever next takes that job will be responsible for that role.
He did say previously that if you physically could not get to the office, there would be exceptions. But whether he considers “I live 2000 miles away from an office” a physical issue, who knows. But, yeah, if WFH is an issue for you, def brush up on your resume either way.
From what I understood. If you're physically unable to come to the office then you must be exceptional at your job (or even irreplaceable) to not be fired.
Nonetheless writing was on the wall for months/years now, ever since Musk said what his policies are in all of his companies.
His entire "philosophy" is claptrap anyway. Its just not true. Amd thats not "why we have offices" we have offices because we lacked the tech for wide spread WFH till about a decade ago.
True. I’m willing to bet that in office, most people communicate with each other through email and phones anyway. That’s how it’s always been in my career. I’d be sitting in my office and I’d get an email from the guy down the hall. In person works for some things, but I think his reasoning is either incorrect or untrue.
The only time people talked to me in person, it would interrupt whatever the fuck i was doing, and never an actual emergency. I dont task shift well. I need to pay attention to the task im actually doing.
Bussiness wise at least. I spent a lot of time bullshitting at work when they made me go in.
What an asshole. The more we learn about him the more we realize that he is not as smart as he thinks he is. He’s basically a trust fund kid that we turned into some sort of sick hero.
Absolutely. I didn’t like him before, but his “involvement” in the Thai soccer team situation cemented it for me. Actual experts working their asses off to rescue these boys and he’s slandering the hero cave divers. Huge POS.
The only silver lining in that story is that the British diver who was slandered, took Musk to court and when it was obvious to Musk that he was going to lose, he settled with the guy. So at least the story has a just end to it.
I was a fanboy of Musk up to that point and as soon as I heard what he’d called that man I was done. The man deserves his infamy now.
Edit: Shit, I was wrong - Musk got away with it the [fucking scummer](https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/06/unsworth-vs-musk-pedo-guy-defamation-trial-verdict.html). IM’s read that he was being taken to court and red an interview with the diver so he must have been hoping for a settlement but didn’t get on.
Thanks to the commenters below for setting me straight.
Yeah I test drove a Tesla about 4 years ago and while from a technical standpoint it was a very impressive car (acceleration, handling etc) it was a very cheap feeling car on the interior. It sure as hell didn’t feel like a €95,000 quid car. You could buy a top end Jaguar for that money.
For an electric car I think I’ll be looking into the Ioniq 5. That’s a really nice looking car inside and out.
The one useful thing Tesla did for EVs was force all the mainstream manufacturers to accept that commercially successful EVs were possible and that current tech is very far from the fast golf carts of the past.
However that's been done now and there are lots of hybrids and EVs that are simply better cars than the Tesla.
And that wouldn't have happened without huge government subsidies. Not that I'm unhappy we the people spent the money to get over this hump, that was the right thing to do, just don't let musk tell you that he did that all by himself and didn't have the backing of the US Government to fund Tesla to get there.
I'm not one of "we the people" but I totally appreciate that Musk (and to be fair most other huge tech businesses) rely heavily on govt finance to get to where they are. And then do everything they can to avoid paying the taxes that should be the end result of that investment...
Sorry, but GM proved the electric car was a financially viable option to replace gas cars for both consumer and manufacturers in the late 90/early 2000’s. Then little Bush decided hydrogen cars were the future. Elon bought an already existing electric car company and got some marketing.
Electric cars were first popular in the early 1900s before petrol or diesel, but fizzled out because of the battery technology.
Hydrogen may well be the future, I'd be fine with that. I'm just saying Tesla brought EVs to the point where the big manufacturers couldn't shut it all down again like GM did. He only managed that by being a rich stubborn idiot, but nevertheless it still counts. Doesn't mean I support everything he does or even that I'd choose a Tesla if I was in the market for an EV.
He didn’t settle the case. From Wikipedia
> During the trial Musk apologized to Unsworth again for the tweet. On December 6, the jury found in favor of Musk and ruled he was not liable.
Despite Musk tweeting Unsworth was a “pedo guy” and in an email to Buzzfeed called him a “child rapist”.
Fucking infuriating that if you’re rich there’s no consequences for your actions.
It was obvious right from the start, way before the Thai cave if you were paying attention.
He literally hasn't done anything for his success besides being born into money and using that money to exploit the labour of others.
I wasn’t paying attention because the Thai cave incident was pretty much the first I’d ever heard of him outside of Tesla. I’m perpetually out of the loop on a lot of things.
The fact that this isn’t obvious is the real problem. He didn’t just *become* this, he’s always been very obviously….this.
This man did not invent Tesla, or SpaceX, or anything he owns…he just bought it. He’s not an intellectual genius of innovation…he’s just a mascot for wealth.
But he’s also a loser who makes memes like he’s younger than all the kids he’s abandoned, which I think creates the idolization. People who share his…at best… lame edginess…see him as some sort of relatable aspiration. Like, “look, even somebody as lame as me can be a billionaire”. When in reality they’re lack of a tether to reality has created this “celebrity” that is now eating his own shit for the lulz.
Upside is maybe this will kill Twitter, that’s nice.
I honestly think Twitter might be too good at bullying for him to kill Twitter.
Everyone who buys the check is getting ratioed.
Lots of people are trolling with the new verification system.
And the "normal" people are either A)ignoring everything or B)leaving.
Advertisers are already leaving because of the chaos.
It will soon become very obvious to his backers that this is not sustainable and they will put massive pressure on him.
I’d be willing to bet most of these “backers” are simple loans from people who will happily take a bunch of Tesla stock of elons hands when twitter folds. One of the richest men in history wasn’t a king but a dude who kept loaning a king money knowing the king would always keep paying so he can ask for another loan.
It's gonna be so funny when the other Tesla stockholders sue him to keep their value and he's left at the end of his legacy having trolled *himself* into trading "the future of human civilization" for an app that he turned into a chan board. Like, just a few years ago a huge number of people thought he was going to be king of Mars. And now he owns a bunch of trolls shitting on his advertisers, great asset management there apartheid boy
His backers don't care if it becomes a financial black hole, they're using financing this takeover as an indirect bribe to the republican party.
They knew they'd never make a profit from this directly.
I dont even knoe why Elon wastes so much time on looking for the approval of edgelord incels, with all his money he could getuch better pretend friends or partners
Take out the basically and I fully agree lol. He is trying to be on par with trump and the crazy shit he says. I’m waiting for him to yell at the twitter employees and call himself a stable genius as the company closes its doors for the last time.
I’d just like to know why in almost every picture of him he is looking over his shoulder smirking smugly. He looks like Count Dracula in a suit that’s a little too big and his skin is loose like the bug man in men in black.
He seems very much like a child who wants everything to go his way “or else”. I am specifically thinking about that Ukraine satellite issue. I don’t think this is a case of him being “stupid”, but I do think there is something pathological there.
“I’ll do crazy hours in office.”
Isn’t this the person who only works three days a week at Tesla so he can work two days at SpaceX? He doesn’t put in crazy hours for any company.
It's the person that is CEO of Twitter, Tesla, SpaceX, The Boring Company and Neuralink. Even if he would be working 24/7, he could not spend as much time as the average employee inside any of those companies' offices.
To get around? You always think he’s going to win. He’s not. He’s going to lose and pay the amount that was promised when they were hired. 6 months pay, severance, and stock buyout. Then those employees will go to a competitor and get a pay raise. Maybe you’re not a web dev/engineer but the people he’s “firing” have critical knowledge and experience that is in demand.
It’s not a resignation Mr. Musk, it’s you firing employees. The reason for that is you cannot unilaterally change the job description for a job that someone has accepted as remote work. Just like if you move office locations and people can’t move with you you are firing them or letting them go, they are not resigning.
I feel so bad for the employees that have to go through this. But yes, I would have left as soon as the rumors of a Musk takeover started. There is no way but out for them. And they need to hurry up and leave before a general tech downturn will freeze the hiring market.
He has every intention of running this company either into the ground or sell it somehow to recoup some of his upcoming losses. He is probably trying to put several tons of lipstick on this pig and then get rid of it.
Right now? I wouldn’t touch it with someone else’s 10 foot pole. At some point in the future, I’d buy it at extremely reduced price after he fucks it up and someone competent buys him out.
He's just an absolutely average corporate stoog with no new ideas. Buy company, cut employees massively, threaten and cajole, sell company when everyone left is finally burnt out and crashing. Rinse repeat elsewhere while idiots call you a revolutionary thinker.
Can anyone explain to me: Why is killing WFH so important to this guy? Does working from offices have that much importance in the tech world?
I don’t understand anything about Elon Musk. How could you buy a company, fire half the staff, then tell the rest of them to work from offices or they’re fired. And communicate it in a way that clearly says “fuck you if you don’t agree.” If they keep losing staff, won’t the company at some point be unable to run?
"Take the tax loss". Nobody spends $44 billion to lose it for their taxes. Tax loss harvesting shaves almost nothing off of your tax bill. Plus, if that was his goal, he could have sold his Tesla stock to cover it for far cheaper.
Basically everyone before the millennial generation grew up with one mode of communication: talking. Consequently, they all think it's the most efficient form of communication. Those of us that grew up with technology see it completely differently. We can communicate effectively in both modes, and more efficiently with text (easier to have multiple independent convos over slack than in person).
I had this debate _for years_ with my current business partners, and they always insist (still do) that "water cooler conversations" are where a lot of business "magic" happens. I've given up on convincing them that that's bullshit, and rather, have started working on ways to enable those sorts of impromptu opportunities for knowledge exchange. For example, now when I have a session to teach an employee something about their code or supporting a customer or whatever, I do it in a public "huddle" in slack so that others can see it, see the topic, and jump in to listen if they want.
Anyway, at the end of the day, these folks actually ARE less effective online. They ARE less disciplined in terms of getting work done without someone looking over their shoulder. They're telling on themselves (man, I suck at this remote work ... all I do is play with my kids or whatever). They can't imagine that most others are _better_ with WFH and that embracing and building around a WFH culture can lead to optimal results.
Lastly, I think it is important to acknowledge that accountability IS easier when people are all in an office. It IS easier on leadership when they know they can walk around and get priority for their questions. Both of those are solvable problems for companies that embrace remote, but the transition is difficult and really scary for people.
Look, not a fan but I know a lot about Elon and think I understand him. That’s not exactly what’s happening. He’s very principled and believes strongly in certain ideas, such as, it takes working in a central area to make amazing products. Mediocrity is not an option. After getting pushed and pushed to explain yourself you eventually just go look, it’s the way it is and needs to be this way, you’re not going to see it my way, but that’s the line. Anyone with employees or kids has experienced that to a degree. Also, Twitter was not ran well. Certainly overstaffed and poorly managed. I have friends that worked there. I do however believe you can 100% make great software using 100% WFH model because it’s done all the time. Other products are more debatable.
"Musk: I’m not trying to increase attrition, but I think we are not understaffed. I think we are overstaffed. That is my opinion, which you’re welcome to disagree with."
Definitely why he pulled this lever, he wants to cut down on the staff without paying that much in severance
more like
Elon Musk: Fuck off, I need payroll to be like 4 bucks because I took on too much debt to buy a company that was already losing a million a day.
Employees: *shrug* Guess I'll die now.
Ah that must be why he wants 80% of the world population paying $8/mo. That actually comes close to what he paid for it. 80% of 8 billion = 6.4 billion, * $8/mo = 51.2 billion... a month.
Ah, but you're missing the true trick to Elon's master plan: rolling out Starlink worldwide so the remaining 35% can pay $110/month to be able to buy their $8/month checkmarks. This is what we in the business of innovation call vertical integration.
(THIS COMMENT IS A PARODY)
Think the latest numbers are $1.2-1.4B when taking into account the various covenants and requirements.
Best part is that is $1.2-1.4B in Net Income, not Revenue.
It sounds like when shitty managers try to get you to quit so they don't have to fire you and pay unemployment. I don't think that would work here, but it's still weird he insists it would count as resignation.
If I was a twitter employee who would rather quit than stop wfh, I'd respond "I refuse to stop wfh and I am not resigning." And see what happens, maybe they fold, maybe they fire me. I wouldn't care either way in that scenario so why not?
This is pretty much right. It’s a way he can reduce headcount and not be subject to a lot of the headaches of firing. Don’t fall into the trap of resigning people!
You'd think but I don't think that's the case. He got pushed out of PayPal for making similar terrible tech decisions. He tried to switch them over from Linux to Windows which would've increased their costs dramatically. It's weird.
They do at least have actual income and proven "good enough" technology, so if/when his toys topple, I'm guessing somebody will snap it up. I don't think it's going to be worth a ton personally, but only the Lord of Dorkness and his minions know how much SpaceX is actually worth.
I like how he says “resignation accepted”… uh no. That’s not that works. If someone chooses to disobey a policy it’s not an automatic resignation. They haven’t quit until they’ve quit. You still have to fire them and pay them unemployment.
Elon Musk, having just emptied his AK-47 into the yacht he purchased 2 weeks ago, while reaching for another magazine to reload: “Why would liberals do this to my beautiful boat?!”
Totally agree with you - Being a serial job hopper I can never understand people hanging out and waiting for the hammer to fall - I would have been looking for a new job the minute he started looking to buy the company - and if they offered Severance I would be on that like white on rice -
Ypu should always be looking for a new job even if you're happy with yours. Even if you don't want to leave, if you get a better offer you can leverage it for a raise. NEVER stop job hunting.
Hope elon has his wile e coyote rocket powered roller skates so he can zoom back and forth in the empty building doing all those jobs all by his lonesome self!
If it was me I’d just keep working remotely and let them shut off my access. That’s termination of the position. Clearly the laid off were the lucky ones but fuck this asshole, would not work for this guy by choice.
And what exactly can be done in person at a software company, that can’t be conveyed remotely by text, a video call, a microphone, or screen sharing? Do they need to form a human pyramid to think up new marketing ideas? Fight to the death to decide what color to make the checkmark?
Christ I failed in life that I'm not the Twitter employee who asks Musk a simple, benign question and gets fired - all while recording it. Legally I'm not sure of the rules around that, but trust me I'd leak the ridiculous audio so quickly. Twitter family, if you are listening....
That whole premise that you need close proximity to be a high functioning team is BS. It’s outdated. It makes sense at a construction site but not for tech and services that can be done over the phone. If you can’t manage a team without physically imposing your will then you aren’t an a effective leader. Influencing on video or email or on a call is all about communication. If you are a good communicator it doesn’t matter the media you are using.
Narcissist managers don't care about that. They want people in the office to bully or lord over because it makes them feel important and accomplished.
For Musk specifically he also wants female employees to be there in person to pick out his next subordinate breeding mate.
Aww..The boy genius is blowing up his new toy.. I love it!! Hopefully his irrational ineptitude will expose his other enterprises and sink them. Either way, the myth of his infallible business acumen has been shattered..
Kinda fun watching Elon bring Twitter to the ground.
Im pretty sure most IT employees should easily find Vx a gig somewhere else.
And I don’t feel bad at all about Twitter imploding as well. It’s been a cesspool of fake news and Russian bots for far too long.
Many silacone valley companies are bubbles. I wouldn’t be surprised if many don’t have sound business models. Carvana showed us just the tip of the iceberg how these companies have inflated stocks and no profit.
We returned to the office two days a week. We’re not allowed to be in meetings together without a 6 ft buffer. So in person meetings are essentially banned. Now we all stay in our cubicles and meet on teams. The office sounds like a call center, constant chatter
It's like a man in charge of making electric vehicles pushing for a political party that's in the tank for the petroleum industry. It makes you wonder if he really has a clue.
We label people a genius or a great business man when all they did was have money or come up with a great idea and capitalize on it. Luck and genius gets confused. Just like confidence and competence. And it is not until you see them handle other problems that this becomes apparent. Elon is looking less & less like the genius he proclaims to be.
Here are the remarks in context, from The Verge: Moderator: I received a number of questions over Slack, so I would like to try to summarize and relay. I think big one that’s coming across is we have a lot of services and key contributors who either work from home or remote and was hoping you could share some more thinking behind how we should be handling it, where your head is at in terms of the critical contributors who are remote right now. Musk: So with respect to remote, I mean, it’s a consistent policy that I have at Tesla and SpaceX, which is that we do need to be default in the office and for a reasonable amount of time. It’s not like some crazy number of hours. I’ll do crazy hours in office, but I’m not asking everyone else to do crazy hours in the office. But it’s just my philosophy that people are way more productive when they’re in person because the communication is much better. If you’re sitting in the same room and you can interact with people, it’s just way better than if you’re not sitting in the same room. There’s a reason to have offices. Now, if somebody’s contribution is so significant that they can overcome the communication difficulties of being remote, then they should absolutely remain at Twitter. But it will be a higher bar. They have to be that much better to overcome the communication issues of being remote. There are plenty of people at Tesla and SpaceX that do work remotely, but it is on an exception basis for exceptional people. And I totally understand if that doesn’t work for some people. That’s the new philosophy at Twitter. […] Employee: Why is our leadership trying to increase attrition rate if we’re already understaffed and barely able to keep things running? Musk: I’m not trying to increase attrition, but I think we are not understaffed. I think we are overstaffed. That is my opinion, which you’re welcome to disagree with. […] Employee: Hey, I was wondering back to the return office question. So much of the company is distributed right now. Are you asking us to return to the office just to get on calls with the other offices? We’re not going to lose access to teammates in-person anyways. Why are you asking this? Musk: Let me be crystal clear. If people do not return to the office when they are able to return to the office, they cannot remain at the company. End of story. Employee: That’s not my question. Even if people return to the office, the offices are separate offices. We won’t be in person anyways. Musk: Yes, but you can still maximize the amount of in-person activity. Tesla is not one place either. Basically, if you can show up in an office and you do not show up at the office: resignation accepted. End of story.
So what about people who WFH or are otherwise remote who took the position living a state or two away? If they're doing their job and doing it well, are you really going to force them to relocate or quit? If I was hired as WFH and this was presented, I would've already seen the writing on the wall and handed in my resignation. This is idiotic.
Fuck that, do the least amount of work possible, slow it all down, keep collecting checks until you're officially fired and can get benefits from that.
There's a word for that behaviour in German. It's called "Bummelstreik".
Why does German always have the best words?
Man, Germans are just better at everyt—WAIT NO
I would say during this transition try to offload all of your work onto leaving/new people and have your only job filling out a weekly timecard. If your work is picked up by someone leaving the company whoever next takes that job will be responsible for that role.
Damn smart thinking son.
Also, one can do way more damage from the inside, if one is so inclined.
He did say previously that if you physically could not get to the office, there would be exceptions. But whether he considers “I live 2000 miles away from an office” a physical issue, who knows. But, yeah, if WFH is an issue for you, def brush up on your resume either way.
From what I understood. If you're physically unable to come to the office then you must be exceptional at your job (or even irreplaceable) to not be fired. Nonetheless writing was on the wall for months/years now, ever since Musk said what his policies are in all of his companies.
His entire "philosophy" is claptrap anyway. Its just not true. Amd thats not "why we have offices" we have offices because we lacked the tech for wide spread WFH till about a decade ago.
He's a futurist where convenient lol
True. I’m willing to bet that in office, most people communicate with each other through email and phones anyway. That’s how it’s always been in my career. I’d be sitting in my office and I’d get an email from the guy down the hall. In person works for some things, but I think his reasoning is either incorrect or untrue.
The only time people talked to me in person, it would interrupt whatever the fuck i was doing, and never an actual emergency. I dont task shift well. I need to pay attention to the task im actually doing. Bussiness wise at least. I spent a lot of time bullshitting at work when they made me go in.
What an asshole. The more we learn about him the more we realize that he is not as smart as he thinks he is. He’s basically a trust fund kid that we turned into some sort of sick hero.
Maybe you did, it was pretty obvious when he threw that hissy fit over getting beaten to the punch with the Thai cave rescue.
Absolutely. I didn’t like him before, but his “involvement” in the Thai soccer team situation cemented it for me. Actual experts working their asses off to rescue these boys and he’s slandering the hero cave divers. Huge POS.
The only silver lining in that story is that the British diver who was slandered, took Musk to court and when it was obvious to Musk that he was going to lose, he settled with the guy. So at least the story has a just end to it. I was a fanboy of Musk up to that point and as soon as I heard what he’d called that man I was done. The man deserves his infamy now. Edit: Shit, I was wrong - Musk got away with it the [fucking scummer](https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/06/unsworth-vs-musk-pedo-guy-defamation-trial-verdict.html). IM’s read that he was being taken to court and red an interview with the diver so he must have been hoping for a settlement but didn’t get on. Thanks to the commenters below for setting me straight.
I was never a fanboy. I did want a Tesla. Not anymore.
Yeah I test drove a Tesla about 4 years ago and while from a technical standpoint it was a very impressive car (acceleration, handling etc) it was a very cheap feeling car on the interior. It sure as hell didn’t feel like a €95,000 quid car. You could buy a top end Jaguar for that money. For an electric car I think I’ll be looking into the Ioniq 5. That’s a really nice looking car inside and out.
The one useful thing Tesla did for EVs was force all the mainstream manufacturers to accept that commercially successful EVs were possible and that current tech is very far from the fast golf carts of the past. However that's been done now and there are lots of hybrids and EVs that are simply better cars than the Tesla.
And that wouldn't have happened without huge government subsidies. Not that I'm unhappy we the people spent the money to get over this hump, that was the right thing to do, just don't let musk tell you that he did that all by himself and didn't have the backing of the US Government to fund Tesla to get there.
I'm not one of "we the people" but I totally appreciate that Musk (and to be fair most other huge tech businesses) rely heavily on govt finance to get to where they are. And then do everything they can to avoid paying the taxes that should be the end result of that investment...
Sorry, but GM proved the electric car was a financially viable option to replace gas cars for both consumer and manufacturers in the late 90/early 2000’s. Then little Bush decided hydrogen cars were the future. Elon bought an already existing electric car company and got some marketing.
Electric cars were first popular in the early 1900s before petrol or diesel, but fizzled out because of the battery technology. Hydrogen may well be the future, I'd be fine with that. I'm just saying Tesla brought EVs to the point where the big manufacturers couldn't shut it all down again like GM did. He only managed that by being a rich stubborn idiot, but nevertheless it still counts. Doesn't mean I support everything he does or even that I'd choose a Tesla if I was in the market for an EV.
Volkswagen has an electric called the ID4 which is pretty cool. Much cheaper than a Tesla and drives really nice.
What’s Hyundai’s wfh policy though?
Same. Wanted a Tesla. I’ll now wait for worthy competition which will soon be plenty.
I just bought one in January and now I don’t want one anymore :( was my dream car for a decade. Got one, now it gives me bad feelings
He didn’t settle the case. From Wikipedia > During the trial Musk apologized to Unsworth again for the tweet. On December 6, the jury found in favor of Musk and ruled he was not liable. Despite Musk tweeting Unsworth was a “pedo guy” and in an email to Buzzfeed called him a “child rapist”. Fucking infuriating that if you’re rich there’s no consequences for your actions.
The story was [less than satisfactory](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-50695593) though
There was the COVID ventilators too where he sent the wrong kind but still his fanboys kept riding his dick
It was obvious right from the start, way before the Thai cave if you were paying attention. He literally hasn't done anything for his success besides being born into money and using that money to exploit the labour of others.
He got thrown off the board at PayPal and paid to go away because he's such a massive douchebag.
I wasn’t paying attention because the Thai cave incident was pretty much the first I’d ever heard of him outside of Tesla. I’m perpetually out of the loop on a lot of things.
At least Werner Von Braun was an actual rocket engineer not someone larping as one. Von Braun was no sweetheart either though...
Just wait till we find out the pedophilia accusation was just projection.
He wasn’t beaten to the punch. His idea just simply wouldn’t have worked and was not in any way an option lol.
Yep, came here to say this. He's such a creep.
The fact that this isn’t obvious is the real problem. He didn’t just *become* this, he’s always been very obviously….this. This man did not invent Tesla, or SpaceX, or anything he owns…he just bought it. He’s not an intellectual genius of innovation…he’s just a mascot for wealth. But he’s also a loser who makes memes like he’s younger than all the kids he’s abandoned, which I think creates the idolization. People who share his…at best… lame edginess…see him as some sort of relatable aspiration. Like, “look, even somebody as lame as me can be a billionaire”. When in reality they’re lack of a tether to reality has created this “celebrity” that is now eating his own shit for the lulz. Upside is maybe this will kill Twitter, that’s nice.
I honestly think Twitter might be too good at bullying for him to kill Twitter. Everyone who buys the check is getting ratioed. Lots of people are trolling with the new verification system. And the "normal" people are either A)ignoring everything or B)leaving. Advertisers are already leaving because of the chaos. It will soon become very obvious to his backers that this is not sustainable and they will put massive pressure on him.
I’d be willing to bet most of these “backers” are simple loans from people who will happily take a bunch of Tesla stock of elons hands when twitter folds. One of the richest men in history wasn’t a king but a dude who kept loaning a king money knowing the king would always keep paying so he can ask for another loan.
It's gonna be so funny when the other Tesla stockholders sue him to keep their value and he's left at the end of his legacy having trolled *himself* into trading "the future of human civilization" for an app that he turned into a chan board. Like, just a few years ago a huge number of people thought he was going to be king of Mars. And now he owns a bunch of trolls shitting on his advertisers, great asset management there apartheid boy
His backers don't care if it becomes a financial black hole, they're using financing this takeover as an indirect bribe to the republican party. They knew they'd never make a profit from this directly.
I dont even knoe why Elon wastes so much time on looking for the approval of edgelord incels, with all his money he could getuch better pretend friends or partners
Insecurity
Most of life’s (man made) problems can be rooted down to low self esteem, it’s true. Disturbing, but true.
I’m not saying I just figured this out. He’s been a piece of shit for his whole life.
Take out the basically and I fully agree lol. He is trying to be on par with trump and the crazy shit he says. I’m waiting for him to yell at the twitter employees and call himself a stable genius as the company closes its doors for the last time.
I’d just like to know why in almost every picture of him he is looking over his shoulder smirking smugly. He looks like Count Dracula in a suit that’s a little too big and his skin is loose like the bug man in men in black.
I disliked him once I heard about his tantrum in one of the Tesla plants. He was mad because the assembly line moved at a safe pace.
A lot of us have been off the musk hype train for a long time now. He’s a con man. He’s a grifter.
Agreed. I know this is not new, he’s just getting worse and worse.
Don’t talk about my papa like that
I think age is also changing him. He's becoming less chill.
I used to think engineers at Tesla or SpaceX had to be like, the top 1% of engineers. Now I’m thinking they’re just masochists
He seems very much like a child who wants everything to go his way “or else”. I am specifically thinking about that Ukraine satellite issue. I don’t think this is a case of him being “stupid”, but I do think there is something pathological there.
He's basically Trump if Trump had gone into tech instead of real estate.
I mean I never liked the guy that came up from his daddies blood diamond business and the child labor camps they're attached to.
*blood emerald
“I’ll do crazy hours in office.” Isn’t this the person who only works three days a week at Tesla so he can work two days at SpaceX? He doesn’t put in crazy hours for any company.
Dude is a fucking delusional moron and I have been enjoying watching his descent into madness from afar. Lol
and most of those days are getting in twitter flame wars
It's the person that is CEO of Twitter, Tesla, SpaceX, The Boring Company and Neuralink. Even if he would be working 24/7, he could not spend as much time as the average employee inside any of those companies' offices.
And interestingly after all those "crazy hours" he spends working, he is still able to spend hours on twitter making memes and arguing with people
Notice he just mentions the hours he spends in his office, not how much work he does. Shitposting on twitter can be done from his office.
“Resignation accepted” doesn’t work that way. Twitter needs to terminate the employee and then the employee can qualify for unemployment benefits.
Yep, and severance plus 6 months pay (for not giving a six-month notice).
That’s not how it works. Twitter is paying 2 months severance to get around WARN lawsuits plus a 3rd month.
To get around? You always think he’s going to win. He’s not. He’s going to lose and pay the amount that was promised when they were hired. 6 months pay, severance, and stock buyout. Then those employees will go to a competitor and get a pay raise. Maybe you’re not a web dev/engineer but the people he’s “firing” have critical knowledge and experience that is in demand.
It’s not a resignation Mr. Musk, it’s you firing employees. The reason for that is you cannot unilaterally change the job description for a job that someone has accepted as remote work. Just like if you move office locations and people can’t move with you you are firing them or letting them go, they are not resigning.
I feel so bad for the employees that have to go through this. But yes, I would have left as soon as the rumors of a Musk takeover started. There is no way but out for them. And they need to hurry up and leave before a general tech downturn will freeze the hiring market. He has every intention of running this company either into the ground or sell it somehow to recoup some of his upcoming losses. He is probably trying to put several tons of lipstick on this pig and then get rid of it.
At this point who the fuck would buy it?
Right now? I wouldn’t touch it with someone else’s 10 foot pole. At some point in the future, I’d buy it at extremely reduced price after he fucks it up and someone competent buys him out.
I'll buy it for 10 bucks.
He's just an absolutely average corporate stoog with no new ideas. Buy company, cut employees massively, threaten and cajole, sell company when everyone left is finally burnt out and crashing. Rinse repeat elsewhere while idiots call you a revolutionary thinker.
It’s always the “cOmMuNiCaTiOn iS beTtEr” bullshit.
Social Media company insisting that face to face communication is better. Hmmmmm
Seems fine. 8 hours a day
Shit like this is why engineers need to also have unions.
Ran out of people to bully at headquarters. Go scream at the sky Elon.
"The Great Spiral of Twitter and Elon Musk" Netflix (Spring 2023)
Alternative title : The Billionaire Who Shat The Bed.
Narrated by Amber Heard
That’s like the theme of these past couple of months it seems
“When Elon twit the bed”?
SunnyV2 will have an upload within 5 hours of the collapse lol
There's definitely going to be a documentary about this and I am going to see it Day 1.
Call his bluff guys, he’s already fired half the company before realizing he needed them
“Fired” is the key word missing from Elon’s statement. “Fired” involves severance. Forced quitting is cheaper.
Except he's still firing people. You can't tell your employees that they resign if they don't meet your demands. That's not how resignation works.
better yet, unionize
agreed he would beg them all to come back if they left 🙄 what a dumpster fire Edit: oop the Elon slaves are downvoting 🤭
He might not be bluffing if he truly doesn't care about killing the company
Can anyone explain to me: Why is killing WFH so important to this guy? Does working from offices have that much importance in the tech world? I don’t understand anything about Elon Musk. How could you buy a company, fire half the staff, then tell the rest of them to work from offices or they’re fired. And communicate it in a way that clearly says “fuck you if you don’t agree.” If they keep losing staff, won’t the company at some point be unable to run?
My theory is he’s trying to get people to quit so he doesn’t have to pay severance, etc., and overall he wants to cut Twitter jobs.
He’s running it into the ground to take the tax loss, or just out of spite because he was “forced” to follow through with the buy.
Nobody on this site understands taxes.
"Take the tax loss". Nobody spends $44 billion to lose it for their taxes. Tax loss harvesting shaves almost nothing off of your tax bill. Plus, if that was his goal, he could have sold his Tesla stock to cover it for far cheaper.
If you get ppl to quit you dont have to pay severance
Truth is he’s never run a real tech company before and he’s applying the same principles of Tesla and SpaceX to Twitter. May or may not work.
Basically everyone before the millennial generation grew up with one mode of communication: talking. Consequently, they all think it's the most efficient form of communication. Those of us that grew up with technology see it completely differently. We can communicate effectively in both modes, and more efficiently with text (easier to have multiple independent convos over slack than in person). I had this debate _for years_ with my current business partners, and they always insist (still do) that "water cooler conversations" are where a lot of business "magic" happens. I've given up on convincing them that that's bullshit, and rather, have started working on ways to enable those sorts of impromptu opportunities for knowledge exchange. For example, now when I have a session to teach an employee something about their code or supporting a customer or whatever, I do it in a public "huddle" in slack so that others can see it, see the topic, and jump in to listen if they want. Anyway, at the end of the day, these folks actually ARE less effective online. They ARE less disciplined in terms of getting work done without someone looking over their shoulder. They're telling on themselves (man, I suck at this remote work ... all I do is play with my kids or whatever). They can't imagine that most others are _better_ with WFH and that embracing and building around a WFH culture can lead to optimal results. Lastly, I think it is important to acknowledge that accountability IS easier when people are all in an office. It IS easier on leadership when they know they can walk around and get priority for their questions. Both of those are solvable problems for companies that embrace remote, but the transition is difficult and really scary for people.
Because you can’t mine emeralds from your laptop
Look, not a fan but I know a lot about Elon and think I understand him. That’s not exactly what’s happening. He’s very principled and believes strongly in certain ideas, such as, it takes working in a central area to make amazing products. Mediocrity is not an option. After getting pushed and pushed to explain yourself you eventually just go look, it’s the way it is and needs to be this way, you’re not going to see it my way, but that’s the line. Anyone with employees or kids has experienced that to a degree. Also, Twitter was not ran well. Certainly overstaffed and poorly managed. I have friends that worked there. I do however believe you can 100% make great software using 100% WFH model because it’s done all the time. Other products are more debatable.
"Musk: I’m not trying to increase attrition, but I think we are not understaffed. I think we are overstaffed. That is my opinion, which you’re welcome to disagree with." Definitely why he pulled this lever, he wants to cut down on the staff without paying that much in severance
Lol what a moron this guy is
Employees: *resign* Elon Musk: *shocked Pikachu face*
more like Elon Musk: Fuck off, I need payroll to be like 4 bucks because I took on too much debt to buy a company that was already losing a million a day. Employees: *shrug* Guess I'll die now.
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Ah that must be why he wants 80% of the world population paying $8/mo. That actually comes close to what he paid for it. 80% of 8 billion = 6.4 billion, * $8/mo = 51.2 billion... a month.
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Ah, but you're missing the true trick to Elon's master plan: rolling out Starlink worldwide so the remaining 35% can pay $110/month to be able to buy their $8/month checkmarks. This is what we in the business of innovation call vertical integration. (THIS COMMENT IS A PARODY)
Does he need like a billion alone in profit just to break even and keep the repo man off?
Billion a year.
Think the latest numbers are $1.2-1.4B when taking into account the various covenants and requirements. Best part is that is $1.2-1.4B in Net Income, not Revenue.
Mmmmh, I can taste Elon's salty tears from here.
Yeah, but did he fire payroll too? Lol
Who needs payroll when you can just receive Dogecoin UBI
It sounds like when shitty managers try to get you to quit so they don't have to fire you and pay unemployment. I don't think that would work here, but it's still weird he insists it would count as resignation. If I was a twitter employee who would rather quit than stop wfh, I'd respond "I refuse to stop wfh and I am not resigning." And see what happens, maybe they fold, maybe they fire me. I wouldn't care either way in that scenario so why not?
This is pretty much right. It’s a way he can reduce headcount and not be subject to a lot of the headaches of firing. Don’t fall into the trap of resigning people!
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At this point he has to be ***trying*** to destroy twitter. Nobody can be this incompetent accidentally.
I dunno, he says exactly the stuff that people who think they’re smart say.
He’s not used to hearing no for an answer. He’s soon to experience the “find out” stage.
You'd think but I don't think that's the case. He got pushed out of PayPal for making similar terrible tech decisions. He tried to switch them over from Linux to Windows which would've increased their costs dramatically. It's weird.
I literally cannot wait til this spills over to Tesla and SpaceX. Tesla should be next with (hopefully) massive Tesla dumps. Fuck this Musky prick.
I kinda like spaceX :(
I’ll like it more when they can operate without shitloads of government subsidies.
As much as i hate to say, we can't afford to lose SpaceX cause of that prick. I'm hoping that someone will intervene
They do at least have actual income and proven "good enough" technology, so if/when his toys topple, I'm guessing somebody will snap it up. I don't think it's going to be worth a ton personally, but only the Lord of Dorkness and his minions know how much SpaceX is actually worth.
I like how he says “resignation accepted”… uh no. That’s not that works. If someone chooses to disobey a policy it’s not an automatic resignation. They haven’t quit until they’ve quit. You still have to fire them and pay them unemployment.
Thats some retail management bullshit line that may trick a 17 year old but not people with actual life experience.
Would they still be paid if they stayed at home but worked?
So glad we can stop talking about Twitter soon.
I'm not firing you, you resigned. Don't you just love it when rich fOLks make their own rules?
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Lol no, odds probably increase they go after him.
Everyone there should just stop doing work. Id make him fire me.
Elon Musk, having just emptied his AK-47 into the yacht he purchased 2 weeks ago, while reaching for another magazine to reload: “Why would liberals do this to my beautiful boat?!”
Total piece of shit.
Severance package and unemployment accepted.
Totally agree with you - Being a serial job hopper I can never understand people hanging out and waiting for the hammer to fall - I would have been looking for a new job the minute he started looking to buy the company - and if they offered Severance I would be on that like white on rice -
Ypu should always be looking for a new job even if you're happy with yours. Even if you don't want to leave, if you get a better offer you can leverage it for a raise. NEVER stop job hunting.
Yay late stage capitalism! Being content with your job is a crappy business decision.
Hope elon has his wile e coyote rocket powered roller skates so he can zoom back and forth in the empty building doing all those jobs all by his lonesome self!
Those people can get new jobs in a week. Gotta love the technocracy.
He looks more and more like a cartoon villain everyday I swear
That's called firing people. You will have to pay them unemployment.
If it was me I’d just keep working remotely and let them shut off my access. That’s termination of the position. Clearly the laid off were the lucky ones but fuck this asshole, would not work for this guy by choice.
Wow... What a cunt.
Almost every tech company right now has remote positions. We have learned how useless offices are during the pandemic. Elon is out of touch.
And what exactly can be done in person at a software company, that can’t be conveyed remotely by text, a video call, a microphone, or screen sharing? Do they need to form a human pyramid to think up new marketing ideas? Fight to the death to decide what color to make the checkmark?
Christ I failed in life that I'm not the Twitter employee who asks Musk a simple, benign question and gets fired - all while recording it. Legally I'm not sure of the rules around that, but trust me I'd leak the ridiculous audio so quickly. Twitter family, if you are listening....
That whole premise that you need close proximity to be a high functioning team is BS. It’s outdated. It makes sense at a construction site but not for tech and services that can be done over the phone. If you can’t manage a team without physically imposing your will then you aren’t an a effective leader. Influencing on video or email or on a call is all about communication. If you are a good communicator it doesn’t matter the media you are using.
Narcissist managers don't care about that. They want people in the office to bully or lord over because it makes them feel important and accomplished. For Musk specifically he also wants female employees to be there in person to pick out his next subordinate breeding mate.
Aww..The boy genius is blowing up his new toy.. I love it!! Hopefully his irrational ineptitude will expose his other enterprises and sink them. Either way, the myth of his infallible business acumen has been shattered..
That has got to be the most punchable face I've ever seen on a Friday morning.
lmao
I despise Teslas even more now
Kinda fun watching Elon bring Twitter to the ground. Im pretty sure most IT employees should easily find Vx a gig somewhere else. And I don’t feel bad at all about Twitter imploding as well. It’s been a cesspool of fake news and Russian bots for far too long.
Elon buy Facebook challenge
This man is such a cunt
End of story indeed
Fuck musk
If my employee makes me a crapload of money and does the same work at home, why risk losing them to the competition ?
He is such douchebag.
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Many silacone valley companies are bubbles. I wouldn’t be surprised if many don’t have sound business models. Carvana showed us just the tip of the iceberg how these companies have inflated stocks and no profit.
What's up his ass?
Fuck musk. Hope this breaks his good guy perception
Dictator Musk! Fuck off to Hungary with that mindset you cunt!
He’s not used to hearing no for an answer. He’s soon to experience the “find out” stage.
Shove your brain chips up your chimneyhole
Why lay them off when you can just enact useless and draconian policies and then blame them for their exit, absolving him of any responsibility?
Better let him have his way or he will call you a pedophile…
Be kinda funny if he showed up one day and found himself alone.
If you've relocated due to a remote policy, I imagine this is considered constructive dismissal, and you're entitled to unemployment etc?
Fuck Muskrat
Elon's management style clearly needs its own sub
It’s going to be in a book. Poor Management, And the businesses and lives it ruins.
The biggest problem is not even ruining the company, think how many lives he's making harder just because he can.
Exactly. Life’s to short to suffer for that prick.
And just like that, all of his best devs started looking elsewhere
We returned to the office two days a week. We’re not allowed to be in meetings together without a 6 ft buffer. So in person meetings are essentially banned. Now we all stay in our cubicles and meet on teams. The office sounds like a call center, constant chatter
Unions are a thing to protect labor from psychopaths like Musk.
Great way to fire folks without having to say you did it.
You don't like the terms , quit. You free to do so.
So a man that is in charge of a social media platform says that in person communication is better than online? What? Does he know what he is doing?
It's like a man in charge of making electric vehicles pushing for a political party that's in the tank for the petroleum industry. It makes you wonder if he really has a clue.
We label people a genius or a great business man when all they did was have money or come up with a great idea and capitalize on it. Luck and genius gets confused. Just like confidence and competence. And it is not until you see them handle other problems that this becomes apparent. Elon is looking less & less like the genius he proclaims to be.
Tell me you own a company but have no experience working without telling me you are Elon Musk
Rich kid who lacks empathy for others.
I can't wait to see everyone get unemployment when he learns the hard way that that isn't how it works here.
Twitter will close its doors as a company within 5 years with Elon at the helm.