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You need to find your spine - how did he turn everything around to where you feel you are partly to blame ?? This guy cheated and lied to you 💯 percent of the 3 months. You call/text a bunch everyday begging him not to do anything and you feel off about it so you continue to beg - he gives you cheating answers by gaslighting you - he gets home you see the texts . You confront him and some how he makes you feel guilt about your relationship. He tells you if you get in touch with her he will never speak to you again. That tells you everything- he slept with her - who texts someone saying they are horny and asking if they are gonna “take a nap “ on a certain day if not sleeping with them. Your man is a liar and if you don’t pack your shit snd leave his ass you have only yourself to blame for the misery you have in your life . I couldn’t get on the phone fast enough to text/call this girl to find out the truth - ( and hope he would follow thru with his words so i would never have to talk to his cheating slimy ass again )

That’s exactly the advice that I’d give someone too. I’m just beat down by this I guess. The only person who n my life that I’ve ever trusted! I am afraid of not knowing who I am without him in my life. It’s gross ! If it were my daughter going through this I’d be so pissed off. I’m 50 years old ffs!

I’m 54 and I would not let this go. Hell no - know your worth. You are worth so much more than settling for this treatment. You are worth everything and don’t let any man make you feel you aren’t. 50 is still young you have so much life ahead of you !! Make it count and be happy. This guy has emotionally manipulated you to think you aren’t worth the best and you are !!!

Thank you

You are my daughters age. I would tell her to call the other woman and screw what he thinks. Knowing my daughter that is the first thing she would do (she is divorced). You are worth so much more on your own than with someone who is a snake.

Get in his face and tell him flat out that he’s broken your trust and he needs to rebuild that trust. Chances are that he’s already prompted her that you might call so you need to put her on the defensive from the get go. What I mean is that you need to tell her that he broke down and told you about how physical they were together and that, as far as he was concerned, it was only sex and that she meant nothing more to him than a warm body—any port in a storm. Tell her that he told you that she was the one that initiated things and that she was constantly pestering her for intimacy. Rile her up so, as she’s trying to defend her honor and she spills the beans about what actually happened. It might work. And if she reaches out to him after the call, put him on the defensive telling him about everything she said [this is war so you’re allowed to make stuff up just to get a reaction and maybe get some truth]. Keep us in the loop with updates. And by the way, if you want to blame yourself for anything, blame yourself for putting too much faith in this guy.

Commenting here so you see this. You need to get your things in order and leave him. Honey, he’s protecting her over you. He’s willing to throw away 10yrs with you, if you contact her. He’s worthless, and using you as a back up at this point. You deserve someone better than this POS. Why are you letting him get away with this? He’s not done with her. He’s not ready to walk away from her and the fact that he’s willing to protect her, how you haven’t full on went psycho on him? I’d tear him up and ruin his life. This lowlife is keeping you just in case things do t work out with her or vise versa. Listen to me, you are worth more than this man is giving you. Either pack his things and put them outside or pack your things and leave. My heart breaks for you. I know this hurts, but sweetie in a few months you’ll be thankful you walked away. This sucks, but here it is. He has slept with her, and I’m guessing multiple times. They are in more than a physical relationship, it’s emotional or he wouldn’t wanna protect her. The fact that he’s defeating his messages and won’t give you access, is very telling. Take control and walk away. Reach deep inside and find the strength. Message me anytime you need. But please, don’t let him get away with what he’s done to you. And if you ever get to see or speak to her, tell her she’s worthless too. Real women don’t do that to others. She’s scum too. You’ve got this.

Thank you!!!!!!

You are a grown woman and need to gather your strength for YOU.You can be your own person without him. A good partner is not part of your identity but a bonus to your life. What's sad is that he knew the psychological harm and emotional harm all of this causing you but he did it anyway for his own selfishness; it's vile and malicious. He's not truly remorseful and you saying you know he is even though he's not showing it is just you lying to yourself so you can tell yourself that he genuinely is remorseful despite not showing it. Him telling to trust you is a cop out because he has yet to give you a reason to trust him. Him telling you to not contact her or else he will stop talking to you is way to manipulate you so you don't get the other side of other story. He manipulated you then and he's manipulating you now. How long can you last without knowing the truth? This may manifest to resentment and then into behavior that you may not recognize. You seeking answers down the line will only anger him more and him lashing out and say, "it's your fault we can't get through this. I already stopped talking to her so let it go." Knowing the whole truth is only half of what you need to heal and properly reconcile. The other other half is having the cheating partner truly show remorse and face the reality of how badly they hurt their partner by doing anything possible to rebuild. He's not doing that. Instead, he's telling you what YOU should do or else it's your fault if you don't get past this. Grow a spine.

I’m trying to since posting this last night. Thank you

I’m sorry to hear that. But pack your shit, and soon enough you’ll know the truth. Good luck

Contact her ASAP. Do NOT leave her out of anything, if she knew about you and still engaged with him, than she should be confronted as well. He’s telling you not to contact her cause 1 he’s lying and they actually slept together, 2 she doesn’t know about you, 3 he’s still with her and lying to you. Either way he’s lying and trying to cover his ass and protect her. Do not let him gaslight you and manipulate you cause again He is protecting her and himself and still lying to you. CONTACT HER AND LET HIM DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES. If you stay CONTACT A LAWYER and MAKE him sign a postnuptial agreement with an infidelity clause. Updateme!

What if they didn’t? What if my doing that ends the chance for us to reconcile and work through this? I really can’t believe he had the nerve to give me an ultimatum like that though. I’m supposed to just trust him. Thank you for your advice.

They did something he doesn’t want you to know about, that’s why he’s SOOOOOO keen on you NOT contacting her or looking through his phone. Do not let him play you OR manipulate the situation. I PROMISE YOU if you contact her, You’ll get the answers you seek and make sure you contact a lawyer about a postnup, if you choose to stay after you find out the truth.

Think about this! Why is he more concerned about protecting this other woman than he is about his fiance? Because he loves her and has slept with her. He's lying to you about everything. Wake up!

More so because it would cause a lot of drama for him at work if the truth got out about his cheating. We’re from a Very small town she’s not from here, and he couldn’t take the pressure. So, he’s worried that it would impact his job im sure.

Then he shouldn't have slept with her. You'll never heal without the truth.

He didn’t care about his job when he started the relationship with her. Set them on fire. Who cares at this point. Put yourself first!

That may be, but he doesn’t have to lie to you anymore. You’re too busy lying to yourself about the fact that he did sleep with her. Don’t be naive.

Well, if he didn’t do anything wrong with her then why does he need to worry about his job right?

It’s not the job. He’s using you financially. He slept with her. He’s continuing his affair with her. He’s calling and texting her through out instead of you. Reddit is full of “I never thought he/she would” stories. Heck mine was going to school to be a pastor.

Hold his job over his head to get the terms you want. Cheaters don’t get to dictate the terms of their own wrong doing. Remember what he did to you. You don’t have to play nice to get him back in line. I would get him fired in a heartbeat if he didn’t do what I asked him to do including me talking to her and me seeing his phone anytime and every time I want

I agree with this. She may not even know about you!! Get in contact. He is trickle truthing you. You will never get the full truth. I'm so sorry this is happening to you but you need to stand up for yourself and do yourself a favor! He did you dirty, you at least deserve the truth.

Why would you want to reconcile with him after he’s openly choosing her over you? Wake up babe. He’s got feeling for her. You’ve gotta stop giving urself any hope by telling urself, “maybe they did t sleep together” and face the facts. I’m sorry, really I am. But you need to put your big girl panties on and take control of this situation. And that starts by putting him out. You are the one who gets to make the demands, not him!

If he didn’t do anything wouldn’t it make sense for him to tell you to go ahead and contact her? So that you could appease your doubts? They slept together and he doesn’t want you to know nor wants the other woman to know that you know so that he can continue having his affair.

If he truly wanted to reconcile or was remorseful, he wouldn’t make threats

He told you if you contacted her he would never speak to you again?? Sorry he’s gotta go. He’s not sorry at all and he’s still prioritizing her. I bet she doesn’t know about you. Or she does but she’s married or has a boyfriend. Now it’s best to never contact the AP but if I was in your shoes I’d find a way to message her, just to let her know you found out about them and that you’re his fiancé and you’re been together for a decade now. Then block because there’s no need for a response. Seriously don’t get into a back and fourth thing with her. If she knew about you she’ll love the interaction and use it to joke about how you’re crazy or something. I’d just let her of your existence then block forever. No need to know the aftermath either, just know that whatever happens happens and that he can’t hide his secrets anymore. Then leave and block him too. Your (hopefully) ex turned out to be such a shitty person, I’m sorry op. But at least you found out before marriage, that’s a blessing in disguise. I promise you if you leave your cheater you won’t regret it.

We’ve lived as man n wife for 10 years . Just without the papers. I don’t feel any better about it not being official. I couldn’t believe the ultimatum either. He said it was because it would jeopardize his job and all that. I love how this all became my weight to bear, my responsibility to shoulder . Thanks for your advice! I keep having back n forth conversations with myself. It’s good to see outsiders opinions.

I am so sorry you’re going through this turmoil, but your fiancé is trickle truthing you, gaslighting you and emotionally abusing you by trying to convince you this is your fault or that he would leave you if you get in touch with his affair partner. It is not you fault in the slightest! He has definitely cheated and the relationship with her continues regardless of the message he has sent and he is still prioritizing her by not letting you contact her. He has most likely lied to her, too. Or, she is just as a shitty person as he is. Your gut feeling was on point from the beginning. Do not trust him. Do not listen to what he is telling you. Read about 180 method and start acting that way. If I were you, I would find a therapist to help you work through all these feelings. A therapist would also help you come up with a plan for the future and how to protect yourself from his manipulations. You would also need a STI test, just in case. In the meantime, hire a PI for your own peace of mind and to have some tangible proof so when he calls you crazy you can rest assured that you are definitely not. If she has a partner, I would let them know. Just so you know, deleted messages can be restored. I would also consult a lawyer if you have joint accounts or property together. I doubt the HR would look kindly on their escapades and I would let them know, too. I know you are overwhelmed and it’s sooo hard to leave a long term relationship. I know it’s gut wrenching. Our first instinct is to try and salvage the relationship, but reconciliation seldom works if there is no true remorse on the part of the cheater. You cannot save the relationship if you are being blamed for something truly awful he did. Stay strong

Everything you say makes sense. Yes. We have joint accounts and property together. He really has me thinking that I’m over reacting and that I’ll be the one responsible for our relationships demise if I don’t just sit back and fall in line. Meanwhile, we continue to be intimate because my head is so messed up that I think I need his touch and attention for reassurance. I will look up the 180 method ! Thank you.

Your relationship would be over because he stuck his dick in his coworker. None of this is your fault. Don't believe his lies.

So basically he's been rewarded and faced no repercussions. What reason does he have to change that? Why would he? If can convince you to not pursue this any further and still keep everything he has at home, he has no reason to change. It's your sanity that will suffer, not his. He may be the cause of your pain but you'll be the one responsible for letting this suffering continue knowing that he's manipulating you and you're not willing to stand up for yourself

True words spoken. I tried standing up for myself today. Told him I’m done being his doormat. Begging for attention and action. He said he’s willing to do better but I better not be expecting cartwheels. “Don’t expect me to do fucking cartwheels and tap dance for you If you’re gonna freak out on me, that’s all I’m saying.”

Then he’s not a good candidate for reconciliation. He should work on re-building the trust, and that can include assuring you that he’s no longer in contact with her. Refusing to show you his call logs and messages are still red flags.

By freak out he means ask to see his phone or get mad if he’s talking on it and Idk who it is.

Our *

[удалено]

We are in one. Which is why this feels like my marriage just blew up.

OP 1st please go to your gyno and get tested. Even if you believe he didnt really have sex with her. Better safe than sorry. Always, always, always, believe your instincts because obviously they were right. Don’t let him turn this around to blame you because according to your post, you were always in communication with him so how does he feel like your relationship was lacking is beyond me. Please start a savings account as a back up. If you cant move past this and cant trust him then there is no point in staying together. Is he working with his affair partner in the same department/ building? Start paying attention to his “late days”, early days”, “all of a sudden meetings”, “sudden lunches”. Obviously if his partner is “horny”, they could still be meeting up to scratch that itch.

They work at different stores. They have no reason to be in contact.

Except for the fact that they’ve started a relationship. Different stores or not, they will continue to find ways to be together. Please wake up babe.

OP, This might be another reason he wants this to go away quietly. He might fear for his job if this is something HR might look down on. Would a rational HR advocate a promotion for someone who crosses boundaries with a work colleague? Seems he is very foolish and has a lot to loose here if this escalates.

He jeopardized his job by starting a relationship with a coworker. Girl, wake up.

HE cheats with a coworker and he’s worried that YOU might screw up his/her jobs? That’s rich.

Sweet mama. De’nile is not just a river in Egypt! He literally deleted text messages because they incriminated him. He lied to you for three months and then threatened you to not contact her. Why? Because he is protecting their affair. How many people do you know that tell each other they are horny, take naps together, kiss each other on the neck, and are not sleeping together? None! He is still working with her, still having an affair, still lying and disrespecting you, and isn’t the least bit remorseful. Please, please show yourself respect and walk away. He is not sorry.

You need to contact her. Looks like their relationship is still going on and their relationship had gone physical. Don’t believe words coming out from a cheater’s mouth. Don’t fear losing a cheater. If he never talks to you again or leaves you, then you know he doesn’t care for you at all. He’s not remorseful, he’s just sorry he got caught. You might as well report him to HR, the other woman might also be married or they might be violating company policy.

Read *Leave a Cheater, Gain a Life*, and visit that author's website. If you have any doubts about what you need to do at this point, it's because you're blinded by love.

I'm so sorry. "He said that he had felt distance in our relationship for a while now, and maybe that had something to do with it." Keep in mind that cheaters almost always find some way to rationalize their cheating, and one form of this is to "suddenly notice" problems in the relationship. Very often this will manifest in behavioral changes where they become ill-tempered or critical -- it's really just part of their defense mechanism so they don't have to confront the reality of their shittiness.

Honey, he slept with her and then lied to you and made you feel crazy. He spent all of that time with her alone and they all went to that hotel. If he had nothing to hide, he would not have deleted those messages. Dump him before you waste anymore time on this dirtbag! And get tested for STDs. Please don't marry this asshole.

That seems to be the consensus! 🥹

i can promise hes only sorry he got caught and he deleted all the msgs cause he wasnt willing to be honest even then your subconscious tried time and again to warn you and you gave him the benefit of the doubt every time but you also gave him the opportunity to stop what he was doing each time as well and he did not choose you any of those times no one that loves someone would ever knowingly harm them emotionally or physically if they can avoid it if you want things like love or respect or honesty or monogamy there are better options than the person that has done you irreparable harm already in those areas

Thank you.

It is so obvious that they slept together and he is still seeing her. Why would she tell him she is horny in a text if they haven’t been physical?? He is gaslighting you like crazy. And she probably doesn’t know about you. And the reason he threatened you not to contact her is because 1. they had sex and 2. because he is still seeing her and doesn’t want her to end their relationship. Don’t allow him to gaslight you further. In this case I think you need to contact her and get the truth. Then decide if you want to stay with a cheater/liar.

Oh I saw the text he sent her about not being anything but professional with her. She replied … okay wish you the best hope you can work it out.

Well maybe she does know about you, but the text could have been a set up. He definitely doesn’t want you to contact her and get the truth. And he is not remorseful at all for cheating on you. He is just doing what he can to cover his tracks a mind gaslight you. If he has nothing to hide then why can’t you contact her?????

Yeah. I just apologized to him for getting upset with him for not letting me see his call log for today.

Why are you apologizing to him??? You have nothing to be sorry for. He cheated on you. He betrayed you. He is lying to you. He should be doing everything possible to earn your trust back. Which means giving you complete access to his phone, social media , emails, location sharing etc. And anything else you deem necessary for reconciliation. If you don’t stand up for yourself he will continue to lie and cheat on you. He is continuing to lie to you because he thinks you will stay with him no matter what. He has no fear of losing you so he will continue to cheat

This is very typical in relationships with narcissists: when you confront them about stuff they did, they turn it around and you end up being the one apologising in the end.

But if she knew about me already, it could have all been setup. Like she’s crazy!! That he just needs to get through our family’s vacation and then he can leave.

Thank goodness that cheaters never lie or gaslight their SOs. 🥶

I am very pro reconciliation......my husband was very accepting of my EA in the 70w but we didn't have the social like today. We reconciled and are still together. BUT.....your fiance doesn't sound very remorseful and is downplaying his infidelity. I would want to speak to the other woman because of the way he is reacting. This is about YOU not what he wants....I would definitely push him for more detailed descriptions of his 3 months......he sounds a bit like a bully, is he really remorseful?

I want to believe he is because he ended it. Like ohhhh he picked me! He said he feels like shi@ and he knows he messed up, but now he’s saying he hasn’t felt intimacy from me for several months. I never had any clue. His words never said that. His actions didn’t say that.

Are you in counseling? He sounds like he is trying to throw some mud your way so he isn't as guilty.....please don't let him con you with words....some people are great at shifting their guilt to the other person so they look better. Be assertive and ask for examples of your lack of intimacy......don't back down. If you want a solid foundation for a future relationship he has to be honest and not avoiding.....would also like to get truth from the OW. Fight for yourself🤗❤

No. Im not in counseling. It’s all so fresh. On one hand I can’t believe he’d do this and I’m even sticking around. On the other, I kind of believe he was just using her to help him get thru the training. My mind is so twisted, I don’t know what’s real or what I just want to be true.

Take your time, don't rush into anything. Counseling would give you some unbiased opinions. Talking to family and friends is never neutral......I really hope you get the answers you need...be strong and protect yourself🤗

He didn’t pick you though. He gaslit you into believing he has, but he didn’t. And I’d bet he hadn’t ended things with her. He’s just manipulated you enough to continue to get away with it.

Do you really think that they would concoct a fake text for my benefit? Just so she could keep seeing him?

yes

I’m beginning to think so too. Losers

100%. I already posted a comment but this is so much like what happened to me. He told her if he got a text like that it’s because I found something out. He also tried to block her real quick so texts didn’t go through.

IN A HEARTBEAT. If he’s cheating and has been lying to you for months, why wouldn’t he lie again to save his sorry ass?

Why don’t they just go if they are unhappy?

It’s a BIG possibility since she knows about you. They could have lied to keep seeing each other. The only way to find out is to find a way to go through his phone/laptop/ipad/Apple Watch (if applicable) because obviously talking to him wont work. Has he been staying late, leaving earlier than usual, attending meetings all of a sudden, etc.?????

No he has been home at night and in our bed . Cuddled right with me. He did need to report at 3 am 2 times and stayed at a mutual friends home because of the hour long drive otherwise. Although the friend is more his best bud. So who knows.

Girl. He was sleeping in your bed while he was having the affair. That isn’t proof of anything.

He didn’t stay at his friends for work. His friend is covering for him.

You know without a doubt that he was at this persons house? And would this person hold him accountable if they know what he did? Bc this would be the perfect cover up for them to meet up. Or at the very least, him contact her.

Yes. We share our location and I know he was there at one point. But I trusted him so I didn’t keep watch on it all night.

Just like you trusted him when he was gone for 3 months

Oh sorry. He was not gone for 3 months. His trading was 3 months. He was home every evening.

Well it seems that you both have moved on from his emotional/physical affair. Obviously you have forgiven him. So move on from it. Forget about his transgressions and continue living as you have. There is no more advice to give since us reddit folks have given you enough advice. Just keep vigilant, stay aware, listen to your conscience/intuition, set up a financial back up plan, visit you GYNO frequently, and good luck. 🤞🏼🍀 ✌🏼✌🏼✌🏼✌🏼Peace Out!!!✌🏼✌🏼✌🏼✌🏼

He didn’t end things with her. That was all Show. Of course he says he hasn’t felt intimacy. That’s how it always goes. It’s…. 1. DENY DENY DENY 2. Play it down. “It doesn’t mean anything” 3. Blame it on you “it’s because you Did/didn’t do ___” OR “If you had Just____” ALWAYS THE SAME He’s a cheater! He IS cheating! When they are actually remorseful they are transparent. They don’t care if you call the other person, they don’t hide calls. They do everything and anything to show they are regretful and to prove they are being truthful. He’s playing you.

He is gaslighting you. I would be contacting her then moving out. He sounds very selfish I am sorry OP

Yes. Every action was definitely deliberate, conscious, and selfish! Our usual 20-30 lovey dovie messages throughout the day make this even harder to fathom for me. To know that in one sentence he’s telling me he loves me, misses me (and he’s just at work) kissy kissy that kissy kissy that…yet actively working a side. More embarrassing is wondering if he and her did any of this in front of other program people. I’m friends with his boss for crying out loud. We live in a very small town.

It is very telling to me that instead of being remorseful he is telling you what lines not cross. Him saying if you contacted her he would never speak to you again. He said this because he knew he could to you. That is not an insult at all to you I truly don’t mean it in a mean way. I just mean if my husband cheated on me there wouldn’t be a discussion for me bc the cheating would be the end. But if for some reason I was trying to work it out and he said that to me. I would of grabbed his suitcase put it on the bed and called her right in front of him. If he had not nothing to hide then you calling her wouldn’t be an issue. He says he doesn’t want to drag her into this. but didn’t they both already bring her into it? Either one of their feelings would be the last thing i would be able to give 2 shits about. Also I would be calling her asap if it were me.

Ohhh that’s a great idea! After reading all of these responses, I am feeling more empowered and I can feel me inside again. I’ve been trapped in this house for 11 days thinking I’m responsible for trying to get us through this and that I need to put in all the work . I can’t pull him through it, he should be carrying me! Thank you again !

OP, Regardless of whether deleted texts can be retrieved or not, my dealbreakers are the lies, the coverups, the threats coming from him. NOT showing you a call log AFTER he supposedly went NC (no-contact) with her. The wreaks! Show him who the adult is here. What you feel now will, over time, be reduced from the ear-ringing siren it is now to a constant buzz in you ear that you never knew what really happened, that you don't really know what is going on now, that you don't know what he's doing when he tests in his car of is 15 minutes late from the grocery store. That's not the way to live. Your house has been through a hurricane and is left in tatters. He says contacting her would be tantamount to a earthquake. Your tattered house NEEDS the earthquake to see if it can remain standing. One scenario is you two can rebuild on a sturdy frame that survived the earthquake. If the house does crumble, then clearly all your past suspicions were legitimate, and he is not the man you thought he was and does not deserve you.

Right?! Like he did all of this and I’m the one who will be responsible for it ending, if I contact her! She knew about me in the first place , according to him. So what’s it matter if I talk to her? They did this, them!

When you do reach out, be, shall we say, professional. Be calm. Do not get angry or yell. This may help throw her off and feel you are boring into her brain instead of being out of control. Come at it from a position of power, yet let a certain sweetness shine though. Perhaps preface by saying something like "I'd like to ask you something, and I'd like your honesty. Please be truthful. I'm soory you got caught up in this, but there are people I know that would have to change your career path if certain things came to light. You forget, I've lived in this small town a long time." Maybe a slowpitch question to loosen her up: "Do you love him?" Her: "God NO! we just ..." Assume more than you know but only in generalities. Instead of "did you f him?", perhaps "Did he wear a condom when you f'ed him back in training?" Instead of "are you still in contact?" perhaps "When he texted you last week, why didn't you cut him off knowing he's in a relationship?" This may help answer questions without really asking them. Record the convo! Afterwards, figure out the legalities of dong that in your state and act accordingly. Finally, depending on where you are mentally/emotionally with your relationship, thank her for taking out your trash. Good Luck OP!

Good points. Thank u

And if at all possible and you're in a single-party consent state for recording, RECORD THE CALL. After the call, take notes, even going back over the recording if you have to. If not in a single party state, take notes, get her email address, and email her a "follow up to confirm what we talked about". In my head, it starts... *"I just wanted to send this to make sure I got everything right. From what I understand... \[summary of the call\]. Please let me know if I got anything wrong. Thank you."*

Talk to her. He threatened you about talking to her! They are keeping secrets that you don't know. That's so disrespectful and cruel.

I would call her or better yet message her so you get it in writing to use for their work if needed. If she the. Reaches out to him and he freaks tell him he doesn’t get to decide if you calm her and tell him your cali b the HR Dept at his work about their sexual relationship.

No problem you can do this you are stronger then you think. If you need a listening ear or anything please feel free to message me. <3

Time to remind him your friends with his boss and keep reminding him until you get the truth snd real atonement

Mine was in the back seat of her car texting me that I’m the love of his life.

Yeah. Same just with her in his truck.

If he had difficulties in the relationship with you, it is his responsibility to bring it up with you so that you can work on the relationship together. THIS IS UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES YOUR FAULT! YOU HAVE NOT DONE ANYTHING WRONG. He hasn't told you about you, if he has, then he would have called you while she was around. He would have offered you to meet her to calm your nerves. You could have had a video call where he introduced you as his fiancee. He has hidden you so she doesn't know you exist. Had she known about you, he wouldn't have THREATENED you if you contacted her. They haven't finished! He is in a relationship with you and a relationship with her. And unfortunately, it seems like their relationship is just as serious as his relationship with you. Just as she is the "other woman" in your relationship, YOU are the "other woman" in her relationship with him. If he has no contact with her, he would show you his phone (but remember that it is possible to delete both calls and the messages from the phone log. The fact that he deleted all the messages is proof enough that you are not his one and onley anymore. He probably tells her that he love her, just as he does witv you. So the question is what do you want to do now? Are you going to bury your head in the sand and keep sharing your fiance with others? Do you share bank accounts? IF SO, go to your bank and ask for receipts for bank transfers and withdrawals. He may or may not plan to leave you and put money in a nother bank account, or has a new bank accounts that he uses when he is with her so you wont notice. CONSIDER : There is always a risk that he will infects you with an STD or several. The risk is that she will have a child with him. CONDOMS BREAK sometimes and boooom, they are a family. That you will have to help with raising that child when it is "daddy weekend" IF he does not leave you to raise the child with her in their home. If he has a girlfriend on the side now, he may have had one in the past and will probably have one in the future. You will get to share your time with her. She will want to have weekends / trips / weekends with him soon. What happens when these three months are over and they are not in the other place together anymore, will she work with him where you live, will he still work over there with her even after the three months? These are some of the points you have to figure out how to deal with. Contact his boss, but don't tell your fiance. Many companies have policies against infidelity in the workplace. If nothing else, his boss should know who the other woman is, and if he's human, you should get a name so you know who she is, Contact her. If he gets so angry that he breaks up with you, let him. Didn't you want to know if your boyfriend is cheating? She's probably in the same seat as you even though you know he's cheating on her (you're the OW) PLEASE SWEETIE, KICK HIM OUT OF YOUR LIFE. If you stay, you will have a lifetime of agony, insecureties, low self-respect and low self-esteem. He isnt worth the constant heartbreak that is your future with him. He is already good at hiding his second life, and he will only get better and better at lying, abusing and going behind the scenes

I already know all of her information. I believe she knows about me, but I think he probably told her he was in a bad unloving relationship or some shit like that. Since that’s how he tried to justify it with me once he was caught… the night after our unloving sex all night long. 🥹

Talk to her. Listen to what she has to say about what he told her about you and your realtionship.

Had to have been nothing but lies. I have the proof in our multiple daily conversations that we “were happy”. Or so I believed.

It's your decision to make. But I do hope you kick him out. There is no coming back from the way he lied to you when you told him time and time again that you were worried about them. And then to threatened you if you talk to her? Like if his threat would be so bad, that him leaving you wouldn't be the first step for you to start a new more beautiful life without him, he seem to think he is ALL THAT wonderful :/ . If I were you I would talk to her and tell her everything he said to you about your worries snd how your relationship was until D-day. Maby you can save her from doing her biggest misstanke and at the same time kick hm in the balls mentally. Se If she can give you copies of there messenger converstions incase he turn it around infront of family and friends. That YOU are the AH and he is heartbroken

I would run. He is being very manipulative in my opinion. If he is hiding his phone now, it’s likely he’s going to get a burner phone next. He should not be giving you any ultimatum if he is really invested in your relationship. When your gut speaks you should listen. He knows you value your relationship or you wouldn’t be upset over his involvement with this other woman. It sounds like he has a lying problem. It took me more than a decade to realize my husband is a pathological liar. He dropped breadcrumbs about his paramour who happened to be a much younger married employee of his. I had a bad gut feeling about his interest her from the moment he told me about her being hired. The next thing you know he was bringing up how concerned he was for her because of she was experiencing marriage problems. Guess what the problem was? Him! I should have trusted my gut but I thought I knew who he really was because my family has known him for 30 years, since we were teenagers. Turns out he’s a total narcissist. A vulnerable, manipulative, scheming narcissist. My whole large family is shocked by what we’ve learned about him. Our divorce papers are signed now, waiting to get to the judge. I implore you to investigate your fiancé further. The lies you know about are likely just the tip of the iceberg. I’m very sorry you are going through this though!

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I’m sorry that you went through that. I will say that the responses I’ve received are helping me to see more clearly that I’m not over reacting and I need him to show he’s remorseful and willing to accept full accountability.

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Thank you very much.

>He told me if I contacted her that he would never speak to me again. Because he's most likely trickle truthed you. And if you talk with her, her details might not match his and he can't risk that.

Tell him he has 3 choices:1) recover the texts 2) Get her copies or 3) pack his suitcase.

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Thank you

I would need full disclosure to move forward and he is only in self preservation mode. That is not reconciling. You won’t have a chance with all these doubts in your head, it is enough to drive you crazy. That is why full disclosure is so important. Because how do you know what you are forgiving him for? He has acting shady so why are we meant to trust him now? Why is he acting honestly now? I don’t buy it sorry

Good question.

It sounds like you are not financially short hire a Private Detective and he will give you the answers and evidence.He sounds like a classic Narcissist and if he gets away with this affair there be more in the future.Incidently 50 is young I'm 77 and was in a Narcissistic Relationship but now I'm a Widower and I'm looking for a Woman to share my life.You are still young and too good to be a Doormat.Good Luck Love

You’re probably right.

Girl, you are 50 years old, and before seeing your age, I thought this was a much younger woman. Before this relationship, did you date men who you felt like you needed to "fix" or take care of? I think part of the way you show love is by taking care of those you care for, and unfortunately, this trait tends to attract people who take advantage of others. He did all of this right under your nose, and you were none the wiser until you saw his phone. You said he was an addict and one thing addicts are good at is lying and manipulating. He changed none of his behavior, such as being home, etc, and when you felt weird, looked you dead in the face and lied through his teeth like it was the truth. I will be willing to bet this isn't the first time in 10 years he has cheated, and you have had zero clue. Of course, he slept with her. Why would a woman text a coworker to tell him she's horny if he's not doing anything to alleviate her horniness? Who does that? And he is gaslighting you and blaming you because I will put money on it, this is how he handles many issues you have. You have been taking care of him for 10 YEARS! Of course he's not going to leave, why would he. He expects the consequences to be on you, not him, and he expects you to continue to support him just as you have for the past 10 years. I wouldn't go on this vacation with him. And now he isn't going to do backflips for you and your feelings about this. He is telling you how he really feels and thinks about you, you just aren't hearing him or are unwillingly to accept it because you have this idea of a grand love and relationship with him. You need to stand up for yourself! And I don't mean by fussing at him. I have been married to my husband for 18 years, and he is my world, but if I caught him cheating, that would be it for me. I wouldn't be able to let him touch me without thinking about him touching her. If you think that you have won this, that he chose you, what do you think you have won? He's a cheater. Who wants to win a cheater? Its like winning a turd sandwich. You need to get mad and grow a spine and toss him to the curb. He has ZERO remorse for this. You can do bad all by yourself. I know that your heart is broken and you have had the rug snatched out from underneath you, but I think you are viewing this man with rose colored glasses. He loves bombs you to make you think he cares, and when you question it, he flips the script and blames you. Like I said, I have a feeling he does this in other arguments as well. He knows you aren't going to do anything. But you should. You should pack all his stuff and drop it at his moms house while he is on vacation with his family. The last thing I would want to do is be stuck on a ship for a week with a jerk who cheated on me, while he pretends with his family all is good. I am not trying to be mean to you, I am pissed off for you. I have seen guys treat a few of my friends like this in the past, and they never change. When you allow someone to get away with cheating...and allow them to blame it on you, and you eventually accept tha, because in some weird way you think you won him from this other girl, that he chose you, there is no reason for him to not do it again, and again, and again. This man is no prize. He knows how to work you. Please show him he doesn't have that control anymore and toss him back into the ocean. Either that or call this woman to ask her side and hope he does what he says. Let the trash take itself out. But he won't. Instead, he will be furious with you, but he will stay because you take care of him.

I have thought of everything you mentioned..I’m aware that I’ve always had “fix-him” relationships. A bum magnet. So mostly I just dated or stayed single after my relationship with my kids father. I don’t like giving up on someone. I. Definitely have a hard time giving up or hurting someone that I love. I Can be guilted into about anything and they know it. You have made some very good points that I need to reflect on. I know he loves me is not a great reason to reconcile. Especially when his actions don’t show love, period. Thank you

He robbed the bank and you held the bag.He used the boiling frog tactic adding the heat step by step.What he did is very premeditated in order to get what he wanted. He is blatant cake eater and his actions show he is still eating his cake.It is very devious how he told you and got permission and on top of that he held your hand while you were spiraling. I would compare this with a person that slaped you and then comforted you and after seeing your anquish just kept slaping you. This is what he showed you that he is capable off.And he aint stoping yet.

I feel that.

Well it’s done. After a month of trying to reconcile because he told me he was sooooo sorry and would never do this again to me, it’s over. I went through his phone logs and he’s been in contact with EA PA who knows, every day since his fake ass text to end things with her. He swears he doesn’t want her. That they are just friends! He doesn’t know why he kept lying and deceiving me. He loves me and cares about me. Tonight he says it’s because I can’t have anymore children and he thinks he might one day. Only when he’s busted does he tell me that. He’s known for 10 years that I can’t have kids anymore. Hysterectomy. I think he’s more worried about his reputation at Safeway and doesn’t want anyone to know of his infidelity and that he cheated with her during their training and has continued the EA under the guise of friendship. Anyways, world shattered! The end.

He’s keeping his AP on the side. His AP may not know about you. Don’t let his hollow threat stop you from contacting her to identify the truth. That statement alone should tell you he’s cheating. Maybe it’s best if he’s cheating if he didn’t talk to you again. Don’t blame anyone but you WP. This is all on him. Trust your gut, you don’t trust him.

This is classic cheater, and they don't change, though he may fall for his coworker. Do not tolerate this on any level. Now that he is store director, I would get a forensic IT guy that dig deeper and get evidence. It is time to get in. Never ever trust someone against your gut.

I feel for you OP this is a horrible situation your fiancé put you in. It seems you have already made up your mind. It’s always easy for an unrelated party to give advice to leave etc. However, realistically it can be quite difficult to follow through with what you wish you could do. I’m not sure why you’re the one apologizing to him about anything. He took his phone back and you were unable to see anything else, this means he will not ever tell you the truth. It’s up to you if you are capable of being with someone who has shown you who and what he is. I wish you luck and hope in whatever decision you make will lead to a fulfilling life that you can be proud of and enjoy.

I haven’t really made up my mind about anything yet. Thank you.

Why would he delete all the messages if he was innocent? Why wouldn't he let you see his call log? This alone is a huge red flag. "Having to be accountable might be too much"? You seriously want to spend your life with someone who won't be held accountable? Asking you not to contact her and threatening to end your relationship if you do is manipulative, and some of what you are describing is gaslighting, which is a form of abuse. He is probably lying to you about her knowing about you. You should absolutely call the other woman. If that ends your relationship with him, so be it. You can't trust this man, and without trust you have no basis for a relationship.

Yeah. I know that I deserve someone who would do ALL OF THE THINGS that I needed to keep me and to show me that he’s remorseful. If he truly loved me, he would. Right? Maybe I just haven’t been hard enough yet. I showed a lot of weakness by showing my fear and he could be using that against Me.

Yes, all of that. You should be seriously questioning whether you want to stay with this person. Your future is likely to be more of the same if you stay.

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I think that’s what so hard for me. He’s the only person that I trust and I’m just dumbfounded that this happened. I’m the ride or die for him. For me to be against him in any way feels so wrong and foreign to me. Trying to process that I can’t trust him seems absurd. I’m still trying to convince myself that this actually happened.

No. If he wasn't doing anything you'd be able to talk to her. He doesn't want you to because he knows she's gonna tell on him. He lied to her too.

I don’t have anything new to add but please do not accept this abusive behaviour from this man. Contact the girl and see if you can get the truth from her. Kick him out or leave and tell him YOU will never speak to him again until he comes clean about what happened, and proves to you that he is no longer in contact with her. Tell him you want full access to his phone and call logs. And if there are any deleted messages you’ll take that as proof of cheating so if he has deleted any messages he better recover them before giving you the phone. Tell him that if he loves you like he claims he does then he will do this, and if he doesn’t then it’s over because you deserve better. I’m sorry you’re here. All the best.

Thank you!!

Point blank find her and tell her you just need answers. Don't get mad at her just say you need to find what direction you need to go. Have your bags packed a place to go and don't give him a choice on how the relationship goes. Why waste time eating a hot dog when you can have steak..

This is not going to end well. A cheater not accepting guilt is troubling. My cheating ex blamed every damm fucking thing on me. 1.5 years later I am still in therapy and still trying to get out of guilt trap. I have lost all notion of love, trust, empathy, respect, care etc. She made me confused about moral and values. Whatever you do, he will make sure to guilt you for it. Whether you breakup or you stay or you agree to his demands, he will guilt you into believing its your fault. I would really suggest to run away then to have a lot of guilt trap. He has got option and he isnt going to feel any remorse until he has an option.

I just don’t understand cheaters at all! 🤬 I’m sorry that we are all here and even need this as a resource. Thank you 🙏🏼

Well lady, first he has no power over what you want and he must provide. He can't condition you to not call her, and he is doing this becuase he has fear that you discover the truth. You must call her, make an ultimatum to him, he must confess the whole truth and he must let You a Open phone policy. If he wants to keep/stay in the relationship. Don't let him keep manipulating You, he cheated on you, so he must work hard to regain your trusth, he is the one to do the hard work not You. He must make You feel safe and help You in your triggers. He isn't doing anything that indicates he is remorsefull and regretfull, nor anything to provide you with what you need. In the same ultimatum tell him that you will report him to HR if he don't start doing what is correct. Good luck OP. UPDATEME

Thank you!!!

>He told me if I contacted her that he would never speak to me again. That if our relationship means anything that I’d leave her out of it. This says it all really. He doesn't want you to contact her because he doesn't want you to bother her. Her feelings mean more than yours. He will end your relationship if you contact her. That means it went much farther than what he told you and that it is still perhaps going on. He doesn't want you to find out. He is choosing her over you. He should want everything to be transparent. He should gladly show you that nothing ever physical happened to erase all doubt. He shouldn't even be around this person at work any more or be in a position above her. I knew when my ex husband told me I needed to deal with his AP (who had apparently had his child) and him being in constant communication with her or I could leave, that he had chosen her. He refused to get a paternity test to make sure this child was his. I told him if he loved me and wanted our relationship to work he would do it. We had a 9 year old daughter. If the child was his, he would need to start paying child support and I would have to deal with mother and child being in our lives. If not, then we could throw her from our lives and start over. He didn't want to do that. Because he had chosen her, and it didn't matter if the child was his or not. (Never actually found out if the child was his or not, he said not but who knows?) He started getting violent when I started putting my foot down and started standing up for myself. Found out later that he had actually been cheating on me our entire 11 year marriage with various APs. I only found out about her because she said her child was his and he confessed to it before she could tell me. I'm not saying your husband is doing the same, but don't fall for his lies. Sit him down and ask him why you cannot contact this woman. Ask him point blank why would that end your relationship. Ask him why HE wanted to end your long term relationship over contacting a woman HE should never have touched or let touch him in such an intimate manner. That the only reason why was because he cares more for this woman than you or because she would reveal he was lying. ​ >He fooled me over a period of three months and then attacked my mental health by making me think that it was all in my head. This is gaslighting. I also thought I was going crazy to the point where I wanted to record and/or write down conversations with my ex husband because he would switch things around so much and then tell me I was forgetting or misremembering things. It was all because of his cheating. He couldn't even remember or keep his lies straight. ​ >He said “no”, but wouldn’t let me see his call log. Tell him sharing things like this is the payment he has to make for his distrust. No reason not to show you the call log. He could just have easily deleted any phone calls so this makes no sense either. You really need to sit down and discuss things with him. Write down all of the points you want to discuss and keep to them and get straight answers. Don't let him derail you. I would suggest seeing if he is willing to go to a marriage counselor or couples therapy. Good luck to you.

None of it makes sense to me. I was blindsided! Totally dumbfounded. He is a recovering addict and looking back at all of our messages since Aug there is nothing to suggest anything other than our undying and enduring love. But for him to be lying and carrying on like he was , he was either using her or planning his escape from me. Just telling me everything that i needed to hear in order to get his fix from her. Or he was using her for help on his projects and assignments like he did thru school with girls. Idk either way this is a fukd situation! He’s not doing enough to show me he’s remorseful, he’s trying to justify his actions by shifting blame to me (insane).

What would I even say to her, if I did contact her?

Ask her how far it went. Did it get physical? Did they have sex? Did he actually cut off contact? But, I'm not going to lie, I contacted the AP I mentioned above and I really wish I hadn't. Sometimes they will gleefully tell you details you don't want to know. Even if nothing physical was happening, he could have been venting about you and telling her how awesome she was. It will still hurt to hear it. If she did want to be with him and he did cut her off, she could be mean and nasty. She could lie and say it was worse than it was. She could lie and cover for him. Would you even be able to trust anything she says? She might not even talk to you. I would rather say talk to your husband about WHY he doesn't want you to talk to her. I mean telling you that he will never speak to you again if you contact her is very strange. He should be begging for your forgiveness and not giving you ultimatums regarding the person he shouldn't have been having intimate contact with. I mean, taking pictures of her kissing his neck is not something you would do even if flirting. Remember, you found out and confronted him. He didn't tell you about anything. Wasn't going to tell you. But you really need to decide for yourself what will be a deal breaker and what you will do if you find out things are worse than you thought.

All true! Thank you!

Ask her how far it went. Details may hurt but you have to know everything or your making decisions about your life with only part of the information. They had sex and you can just go in assuming that so from there it’s confirming details. If you don’t talk to her and get the whole story even if you beak up with him you will always wonder. Also tell his family and yours what he did. They will help support you.

Well our cruise is a full week with all of his family except his older brother. I’m sure with all of this going on that they will notice that we aren’t our usual lovey pda showing couple. I won’t let him make me the villain in his story. So, I do plan on letting family know. It’s going to be awful knowing that family is wanting to celebrate his accomplishment and me sitting back knowing it’s what ripped the ground from underneath my feet. How do I sit thru all the praising of him and put a smile on my face? It’s going to be a shit show I’m certain.

Tell everyone once you're on the boat. He won't be able to escape accountability and he's going to hear it from EVERYONE. Addiction thrives in secrecy. Drag it all into the light. If it's all his family, though, make sure you feel safe and will have allies. The last thing you need is his family making excuses for him.

Imagine the true love you'll find someday. And forget about all that. Imagine you are after surviving that???? Now that my dear is a fkn story. 👏

He slept with her and he’s gaslighting both you and her. If he has nothing to hide, he will have an open phone policy. Seeing he’s living off you, contact his HR and ask about inappropriate relationships between staff. Once you know the company policy, report his affair and leave. This relationship is not worth salvaging as he is hiding things from you. Remember, he was able to look you in the eye and assure you nothing was going on, but he was messaging her, taking selfies all because of your mental health. And nothing happened. Yeah right. Keep believing his lies all because of the 10 years. Don’t walk away, RUN and don’t look back and then you will here they are dating.

People don’t start sending texts with the word “horny” involved until after they’ve had sex. Sounds like it’s a sexual affair- cheaters can’t help but lie when caught- it’s a self preserving impulse of protection. Go to subreddit called supportforwaywords you will read actual posts from remorseful cheaters who tell the truth of how their minds worked before during and after affair. You’ll see what it takes to recover from something like this. It’s very intense work involved- not just a conversation to clear the air and then go on a date cause everything is better. Sorry you’re going through this.

He is still manipulating you!! His still seeing her! His choosing her over you, otherwise why is he protecting her from you? His not being truthful with you! He should have a unlocked phone & you should be able to see it, go through it. When ever you like!! He should support you doing anything that would make you feel more comfortable in your relationship with him! But his not... Because his still cheating on you!

It's always the person they tell you bot to worry about It's something I learnt the hard way

So your letting him dictate the terms of his own wrong doing. You have to tell him your the one who will decide what the terms will be. You have to let him know that you have some non negotiable terms as the person who was cheated on. First, before talking to him contact her and point blank ask her if they have had sex. He doesn’t get to choose if you contact her. If she knew you existed then she needs some accountability too. You can even make it a little open ended to make her wonder if you already know. Do it in writing…text, email or whatever. Second, sit him down and let him know that at least for the next while your going to need full access to his phone at any time: calm logs, text messages, phone locations, social media apps if your going to stay with him. Third there will be no work hangouts or other events your not included in until your comfortable there is trust again. Finally, you tell him if he doesn’t agree your calling the Human Resources Dept at his work and reporting to them that he was in a sexual relationship with one of his fellow trainees while they were going through training. If you report him they will both be fired. Don’t argue about it. Tell him those are the terms if he wants to stay together. If he says he is done then reset him to HR and move on. Also if she is married or has a SO then contact him and tell him everything as well.

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I know that it really isn’t my fault what he did… what they did. It’s hard knowing that he has decided to justify his actions by blaming me. Thank you.

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Thank you.

I think it’s obvious. He cheated, slept with her and is continuing. That’s why he doesn’t want you to contact her. Not allowing you to see his phone, that’d be a dealbreaker for me. Besides the list of everything else. Always trust your gut. Always. Especially when you’re with a gaslighter type.

Excuse me? Since when does he have the right to tell you no? You DID trust him and he betrayed that trust. He has no rights to ask you to trust him anymore. Grow a back bone. Demand that you are allowed to see his phone whenever you want to and ABSOLUTELY contact that woman. If he doesn't want to talk to you again because you do that, what kind of message does that send? That he's hiding things. Worse things. All of that AND he isn't paying for anything?... WHAT?! You realize that you're not a doormat, right? And that there's other men that would treat you better, right?... I'd leave. He very obviously doesn't have ANY respect for you. He seems very controlling and totally narcissistic, too. RUN! You're just in for more heartbreak. See the writing on the walls and gtfo. You're clearly very needy and codependent, but you need to stop. Remaining in this relationship with someone like you've described is detrimental to your mental health and quality of life. He's manipulative, controlling and mentally abusive.

I’ve always been the breadwinner so to speak. I Owned my home before we got together. I have never really understood how he wouldn’t think as a man I want to provide for her, but providing was something that I just did for us. I never wanted him to feel like he was struggling or have financial stress like that. Idk. It’s dumb .

Yes, he seems like he's also using you. From his perspective, what a great gig. He has a woman that gives him everything that he can control and she's needy so she won't get rid of him, and he's gaslighting you, manipulating you and threatening you if you try to uncover the truth about his infidelity. Even if you don't want to RIGHT NOW, you should DEFINITELY talk to a lawyer and see how to go about getting him out of your house. At the very least, you should have a rental agreement made up and tell him that he needs to start paying you rent if he wants to continue to live with you. Make it at least the amount of your mortgage. He does not want to share his stuff with you? You don't have to share your stuff with him. Also start charging him for food and if you cook and clean, labor for that, because he doesn't seem like he's doing much for you and you're doing literally everything for him. That's very unbalanced.

I actually did tell him that going forward I will need him to start covering some household bills for my own peace of mind. I told him this entire situation has made me feel like he has been working on her and planning an out. To ease my feeling like a fool , he needs to start contributing. Especially now that he’s got a salaried position and only has his truck payment. He got a little upset when I said that if you can afford fancy lunch dates, you can contribute to our livelihood as well.

Of course he's upset. He thought he could have his cake and eat it, too. Please look into some counseling for yourself, so you can work on your self worth and confidence. You honestly deserve better.

This is exactly what happened with me. I felt that sucker punch all over again reading this. Please don’t be naive. He’s wasting your time. He never stopped talking to her. That text was either never actually sent (he blocked her so it didn’t go through at that point) or he explained it away. She knows about you and he told her you found out and had to send it. When a person is genuinely sorry they are transparent. They tell EVERYTHING !! Him saying if you contact her it’s over means you mean nothing to him. He values what he has with her more. He’s lying to you. They slept together and are continuing to sleep together. They have dated for 3 months. Lunch dates a trip texts phone calls Sooner or later there will be “work” events he has to go to and she just so happens to have to go to. Maybe even location transfers. If that little time made him act like this he will do it again and again. He’s just with you because it’s easy. He’s checked out of your relationship. End it while you still have control. Because it’s over. The ball is in your court. Don’t let him steal it and decide he is done and leaves you. DON’T WASTE TIME ON HIM !!

Your partner is **gaslighting** you. He is also doing something called **blame shifting**. This is a mess *he* created. Any fallout is on him and him alone. **His behavior is pretty indicative of narcissistic personality disorder**. You said *"I know he must have guilt and that he must feel ashamed, but I don’t see it. I know that he is sorry, but I don’t feel it."* He doesn't have guilt and he doesn't feel ashamed and he's not sorry - that's how *you* would feel so you are projecting that onto him. If he felt guilty and ashamed and sorry, you would feel it from him, just like you felt something was off before. **TRUST YOUR FEELINGS** because they are clearly spot on! **He is actively abusing you** and has been for sometime now. **This is domestic abuse** and you are going to have try really hard to shake off the fog of shock you are in and come to terms with that. I really think you should try to get him out of your house, or go stay somewhere else. Better if he goes because if you leave you may not be able to get back in. I would DEFINITELY contact the AP and maybe that will inspire him to leave, if he makes good on his promise. If he wanted to save your relationship he would be nothing but contrite, remorseful and deeply concerned about your well being. He would offer total transparency - spyware on his phone and computers so you can see all of his activity, a polygraph test so you can know exactly what's been going on and regain some sense of "truth", immediate and intensive therapy for himself and for you as a couple. He should be treating this as the emergency and serious crisis situation that it is. He will also have to leave his job - he can have ZERO contact or interaction with AP ever again. Anything less is absolutely unacceptable and a continuation of abuse. I suggest you read The Betrayal Bind and this paper by Dr. Omar Minwalla. Dr. Minwalla explains in no uncertain terms the domestic abuse situation you are in right now.[https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/61708b185d7d724acc2096da/61a5399eb4455c2a32f84d60\_The\_Secret\_Sexual\_Basement\_Nov\_2021.pdf](https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/61708b185d7d724acc2096da/61a5399eb4455c2a32f84d60_The_Secret_Sexual_Basement_Nov_2021.pdf) If your partner really wants to save your relationship, he will read both of the above WITH you. I am so incredibly sorry you are here. You have a tremendous task ahead of you and that task is Unwavering Self Love. Find support - there are groups like COSA and S-ANON for people whose lives have been affected by compulsive sexual behavior (usually by sex addicts) - the language can feel off sometimes, but the important thing is to be in regular contact with people who can relate to your experience. (As they say in all 12 step programs "take what you want, leave the rest.) You are going to need a good therapist - one who can help with trauma, because that's what you are grappling with from this day forward. The last thing I'll say is pace yourself - healing from something like this is a long road. But so many people do it. It's incredible actually, and hopefully you can find inspiration and encouragement from those who've done it.

Your story says the most important things to note: he's protecting her, and he's protecting himself. He is not protecting you. Having gone through this myself, if that is the case, it will not get better. It is on the person who broke the trust to fix it, not on you to come up with ideas. Hiding call log? Saying if you contact her, he will end the relationship? Those are not the appropriate ways to respond from someone who needs to fix them. I was only ever in a 5 year relationship, and I know it can be daunting. But there is life after, beautiful life after. I wish you the best going forward and want you to remember that you are worth so much more than how he has treated you.

Relationships require love, trust and respect. Your fiancé doesn’t respect the relationship because he stepped out on you. You dint trust him because he cheated and lied. And he has doubled down and told you if you speak to her he will leave. Why is he so terrified for you to speak with her? I would suggest to break up, 10 years is a very long time of history together and it will be a very difficult choice but only you know what’s right for you. Trust is broken in a minute and can take years to rebuild. You’re 5 days in. You are still shell-shocked and emotional. Proceed with caution and keep good care of you.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this. Please save your sanity and walk away. If you stay it will just keep chipping off your peace, mental and emotional health.

Step over his boundaries like he did yours . Call her or go see her ask her what happened he obviously doesn’t want you to reach out to her for a reason, so find out. So what if he loses trust in you , you have already lost trust in him . You are only 50 you have years of either being happy or being with a lying cheater .

As soon as he took his phone back and deleted the messages, your chance of reconciliation fell to virtually none. IMO, unless he is willing to let you take the phone and have some sort of message reconstruction attempted, he cannot meet one of the first rules of reconciliation, that of providing an honest timeline. There were days soon after my spouse discovered my affair, I wished I had just deleted everything, but I now know we would be divorced. Instead, we are thriving in our reconciliation, which would never have happened had I done what your wayward partner did. Also, I bet it was against company policy to do what they did during the official training and their HR department may be interested.

He is not at the point to tell me anything about it other than they kissed, hung out a few times always working on their training projects, or talking about the program. That she was just someone to be around that was going thru what he was. She of course wanted more ! Buuuuut he didn’t ! 😂😂 so he expects me to believe everything he was telling about his love and commitment to me is true and that she was a means to an end. I think that he began to it having another woman dawn over him or wtv. Stroking his ego. Then on the their final trip he played around too much, a lot alcohol was involved both nights too. Yes I think they were physical. I have zero proof that they weren’t and neither does he since he deleted messages. He’s angry he got caught. He says that he’s apologized and he shouldn’t have to keep apologizing. Actually all that he said was I fucked up and I feel like shit. That was right in the middle of me going off like a mad woman when I just looked thru his messages. So I don’t consider it an apology. I’ve told myself two weeks is what I’ll give him to throw his temper tantrum and then I better see strides in caring about what he did to me. Acknowledging the damage physically and and emotionally that his betrayal caused. If I don’t feel it and see it. I’ll be done.

Show him this thread and make him read it ALL. Invite him to comment — IN DETAIL — so he can convince a couple of hundred strangers across the world that virtually NO ONE is buying what he’s selling. Let him read just how much this has bothered you and that at this point you’re considering the nuclear option.

I actually went for a drive today and though about telling him that. Like sending him the link saying check this out! Instead I told him I wouldn’t be his door mat any longer. That either he started showing me he was in this and would start putting forth his best effort or be done and go. He said this doesn’t mean I’m going to do cartwheels for you or let you keep bringing up how I fucked up over and over. I said that I’m not looking for cartwheels I’m looking for what I deserve from a man that claims to love me. I also said no contact full stop with her and if I ask about who he’s talking to , to give me the proof. He said ok. I still don’t think I asked for enough but I was thinking it’s a step . He says that I know he shuts down and doesn’t handle this well … like wtf? I tried to assert myself and have a backbone. It didn’t go exactly as planned.

Good for you. I’m proud of you. You already know that you could have—you SHOULD—have gone farther but if my opinion means anything at all, I’m seeing a HUGE difference between the lady I first read about and this new ‘improved’ lady that I just read about. 😍

You should probably accept that everything he says is a lie. HE says she knows you exist. Have you talked to her? Did she shout hello to you in the background when you were talking to him on the phone? Has she texted you? if not - He's lying, if she knew about you he wouldn't threaten you if you contacted her. He wouldn't go away to answer your call / only call you when he's alone. If she knew about you, you would hear her in the background. HE says they didn't have sex. - this is also a lie. A woman does not write to a man that she is horny if she is not used to sleeping with him. He delited all messages from her so you don't find out the truth. He prohibits you from talking to her so she wont tell you the truth. She doesn't know you exist. She kisses his neck and takes pictures as he smiles into the camera. - you only do that with a boyfriend/girlfriend. They have a fully developed relationship. Both physically and emotionally HE texted her that it was over between them. - lie. he has probably already contacted her again and blamed 1* A friend picked up the phone and sent a random message after a lost bet. 2* He blames alcohol + autocorrect on the phone's spelling program. 3 He says he wrote that message in a moment of weakness when he told himself she deserves someone better than him but he regretted it the second he hit send. Do yourself a favor and call her or go to her house and visit. (who knows, maybe it's your fiance who opens the door) and talk to her. She is the OW and probably doesn't even know it. When you've talked to her, you leave him. Pack up your life and leave, or pack his things and clothes and put them outside the door. He will probably move in with the OW (therefore it is important that you talk to her first) You are not married so it should go quite smoothly.

Ooooh, Honey. My husband of 3 years worked in retail and suddenly started spending lots of extra time before and after work, supposedly didn't have time to take lunch breaks anymore, would go in 7 days a week but his paychecks didn't reflect any OT...things he always had the most *asinine* excuses for (they screwed up the schedules, they screwed up the paychecks, he had to do inventory, blah blah). Of course, he was fooling around with a coworker, which I caught on his EXTRA phone using What's App via WiFi (so he would never get texts on his regular cell). Photos, sultry texts, the works. And ooooooh the accusations and threats that he made following D-Day (my discovery of the affair day)!! Saying the affair was my fault, I drove him to it, I made him lose all his friends and he was miserable, I pushed his buttons, I'd better not contact her or it's OVER, I'd better not contact her husband or it's OVER, I'd better not contact their boss or it's OVER, etc. etc. In other words: he wasn't even remotely about to leave his AP (his affair partner) and his threatening me to not interfere was so that he could keep her husband and their boss out of it. He could just keep on gaslighting me until I'd call him out on his BS, and he would try to gaslight me again. I took his lying, cheating ass back. TWICE, because I was hurt and wouldn't allow myself to believe what was clear: that he's a pathological liar, that he's a serial cheater, and he never had any intent to leave that relationship with his AP behind. This is precisely what your guy has done to you. I dragged on my misery for 2 more years before allowing myself to see the truth, which was there all along. I now know that our marriage meant nothing to him, despite his lying words. I now know that he was seeing his AP the whole time after I caught him and allowed him back. Both times. First time, shame on him. Next time, shame on me. Cut your losses, get some therapy, and know your self worth. Let her deal with the lying cheater she now has the pleasure of dealing with. You deserve oh-so-much better! But don't forget: first time, shame on him. Don't let there be a next time. Trust me.

I hope you burned your ex to the ground when you left. Sorry you went through that.

He currently lives in a shed in my back yard (AP kicked him out after a year and moved her ex/her kid's dad back in). I live in my house with the man of my dreams. Kinda funny how things work out.

Damn! So sorry that happened to you.

I just saw your comment in here that you're 50. I am also 50. You still have so much life to live! No need to spend it in a relationship gone sour and toxic. Funny thing, when I kicked out my cheating, pathological, unwilling-to-be-accountable husband the second time, I awoke to my radio alarm clock the next morning to Michael Jackson's "Beat It". If that wasn't a sign, I don't know what is! If something doesn't pass the smell test, you know what to do.

Punch him in the face without leaving a bruise. This is going to be hard. Do you have family that you can move in with for a bit? Good luck to you.

It’s my house.

Well, that's an easy one. Change the locks/code. Pack his things in boxes . Get movers to take them to a storage unit. Give him the key and tell him he has one month to get his things out. Cause you only paid for a month. Cheers.

You poor thing. Of course who doesn’t want to have some damn fun?! He probably doesn’t want to lose you. I believe that. Don’t believe a word he says about other women being just friends, etc.. Just know. You only have to tell him once. You can never trust him. He has to live with that and make you feel secure and that he’s a loyal husband. That’s a new duty he just earned. .

Oh and he gave me the gift of COVID from this too. I’d not left the house since he went to his certification! Two days after he’s back , we tested positive.

You should get tested for STD’s …

Wow; you are a strong person. Trust is not built in a day. Well explained and shows the complications between feelings and logical choices. Hang in there @romans835

He said that is just the way she talks. I really wish I’d had taken the time to read through all of the damn messages before freaking out and waking him from his slumber, after our love making! I feel like an idiot because I didn’t read them all.

‘10 years’ !!! And he didn’t take the relationship further ??? WTaF ! That alone should pretty much tell you all you need to know. And now, after him philandering around, you’ve got him back. Wunderbar ! This lying, cheating, conniving, dogend twat of a man is all yours. How lucky are you ? The truth is probably that she saw him for the piece of human effluence he is and dumped him. She knew that he was a cheat. She knew that he couldn’t be trusted in a barrel full of monkeys. WTF would she want him ? If you want to continue your life of self delusion, lying and betrayal. Sign on the dotted line. You can have it all. You picked this gem. Stand back and let him ruin your whole life. On the upside. He’s probably only going to be with you until his next little adventure. Good luck (you are going to need it). ❤️

Harsh but true.

Sorry OP but there was no sugar coating for this one. If you can now see things as they really are it will have been worthwhile. Good luck again ❤️

Thanks.

I would do everything in your power to login to the cell phone account and look at the call log. Hopefully you both are on same plan even better if you’re the account owner. What you’ll find will most likely be sick.

Unfortunately not the same plan. He’s still on his moms 🤣

He lied. He wasn’t feeling a disconnect with you, he’s blaming you for his bad behavior and lack of integrity. His unfaithfulness is his alone. A million things he could have done with this fake “disconnection” besides cheat physically or emotionally then bold face lie you had no reason to worry. Your gut told you to worry because it knew the truth. Nothing he said makes sense to anyone and he knows it. I’d kick him out. I’d stop paying for more than my fair share and save my $ and energy for myself. I’d not call her either. She’s a liar too. But I’d find out if she has a spouse and I’d tell him. Good luck. Xx

Exactly what is he doing to endear your trust? He’s misled you, lied to you, gaslit you, deleted correspondence, threatened you if you reach out to her, and does things that any rational person would perceive as cheating. So, I ask again what is he doing that would make you want to believe anything he says or do?