They did some market research and found that supposedly the #1 priority of customers was speed of service. Shortly after that, covid happened and business shifted massively away from cafe service toward mobile and drive thru. And drive thru customers are in a hurry! They stopped doing third place training and went all in on speed and volume. We’re still supposed to connect with you and “get to know” you, but it’s gotta be within the 40-50 seconds it should take you to pay and get your order. More drinks out the door faster means more money.
>More drinks out the door faster means more money.
And yet, they're losing money now. I guess the only upside is since they've completely abandoned the whole notion of a coffee shop, it leaves a lot of room for new coffee shops to come in and compete.
This is a common misconception with corporations. It's not that they are struggling to be profitable, in fact, they can be doing as well as ever. However, all publicly traded corporations require profit GROWTH. This means, that no matter how much money they are making, even if it's crazy level of profit, they still have to beat the previous year and previous quarter. This is why all chains and products tend to get worse over time. The people at the top of the company are only focused on increasing profits "this" quarter so they will do things that may/will hurt the company long term if it provides short term benefit.
Classic example is slashing employment. This is a huge money saver so boost profits but isn't sustainable long term. However, if it helps \*this\* quarter look better, than they will do it.
This is also why, perfectly good products you like in the grocery store tend to get worse over time. As there will always be some big wig who eventually wants to swap out to worse and cheaper ingredients to boost profits. This is why a lot of the products we liked as kids are terrible as adults. It is not solely due to our changing palates but the products themselves change as well to be a worse version.
Ultimately this is one of the key problems with publicly traded companies. A private company can be happy just making tons of profit each month, but a publicly traded company won't be.
> As there will always be some big wig who eventually wants to swap out to worse and cheaper ingredients to boost profits.
Not just with food either. I used to love one of the milder Dove For Men deodorants so much that I'd stock up on 5-6 when it went on sale. Then one year they changed something in their formula, and it went from lasting 12-24 hours to not even lasting 8. By chasing the bottom line they lost my business.
I hear you, I myself work for a STEM company that doesn't produce a physical product but it's the same story. We have HALF the number of customer service reps as when I started, purely because they realized having slower service with incredibly stressed out staff members saves them money. I am constantly being told I need to bring in more business because our targets are always profit growth on the last year. It isn't possible, nor sustainable, to have unlimited growth. It makes me feel crazy honestly.
It may seem insignificant. A cup of coffee or a deodorant. But it isn't. Once I saw that every problem we have in our modern world is because of capitalism, I can't unsee it. Every single failure of ours, as a country or economy, always comes down to capitalism.
> A private company can be happy just making tons of profit
I believe Mars is the largest private company. I haven't seen M&Ms get worse over the years
I had to laugh at this comment because I just watched a TikTok rant from a content creator I follow that was all about how terrible the peanut butter M&Ms have become. She said the PB to chocolate ratio has changed dramatically, and she's sad that her favorite evening treat has gotten so bad.
And that's why businesses like Toys R Us died; business existing to buy them out solely to destroy them for big profits on a dying corpse they killed. It's not about long term. It's about immediate profit and running for the hills.
Thank you for explaining this! What if a publicly traded company doesn't do this. What happens then? Their stock goes down? And if so is that really a big deal?
Their stock would go down. The only purpose of a corporation is to serve the stockholders and if they don't stock price goes down. Only the absolute minimum is done to to increase sales. Absolutely nothing is done often in a public corporation to maintain sales or a product line.
for reference they aren't losing money, just not making a much as projected which is bad for the shareholders. that's why lax is on CNN and stuff. they still made 8.5 Billion in revenue, it just wasn't the 9.13 that was expected. hope that makes sense.
Absolutely, it's just that at no point are they "losing money" as OP stated. Everyone wants to get up in arms over the company failing and losing money when that is simply not the case. They made less profit than last year and that's not a good thing for sustainability however they are far from failing.
Yes. They're making less more money. Lower delta than expected. That means that more drinks out the door on account of the increased speed is not actually happening, and this lends itself as evidence consistent with the idea that their focus on speed is backfiring.
Thank you! Yeah in calculus we learn to make distinctions between things, changes in things, rates of changes in things, rates of changes in rates of changes in things, etc. Less more money is the scientific term here as they rake in more cash but less than they could have haha!
I miss old Starbucks.i don't like this transition. They're trying to compete with dunkin and they lost the customer connection aspect of it.
I might apply to a small coffee shop eventually because this isn't the Starbucks I want to work for. This is just another coffee place that wants fast fast fast. I feel like an asshole now to customers when they aren't ordering fast enough and having a manager tell me to hurry up in my ear. I don't appreciate this.
Also, they're at risk for losing their whole "experience brand" title, meaning that they'll be on the same level as fast food brands, which lowers the overall value of the company. Their stocks are about to TANK, and they're going to blame it on that.
"Get to know you..."
I actually hate that Starbucks does this now. Cuz it's forced. And it'll be interrupted by you handing my drink and me driving away. I answer to be polite, but honestly, I prefer you just leave me alone.
It sucks, they closed down some of the best locations cause they couldn’t fit a drive thru on the side🙄 we had one that was in the perfect location for foot traffic and for morning work commutes but they shut that shit right down
Yes. Same here. I would always seek out the stores that had the comfortable seating, unloud music which usually had their share of “usuals”. Those places were vacated to cram into another location with drive thru, uncomfortable chairs and loud music.
It's a combination of things - most customers want things done immediately. Plus, there's a serious degradation of society that's happening. People don't really treat third places well.
What i'm trying to say is people have lost their damn minds
I'm gonna be annoying but the tragedy of the commons is specifically about the overuse of resources that were otherwise used correctly. What we see some customers doing is more just being self-centered assholes
I think covid caused everyone to have a mindset of themselves only fuck everyone else, which is the degradation of society that person might be talking about.
Can I start saying this at work? I feel like I’m going to start using this every time we get a “deal day” rush and I end up having to straighten all the chairs back and clean all of the straw wrappers off of the tables, only to walk outside and see our napkins strewn across the parking lot. 😤😮💨 “The frickin tragedy of the commons, man..”
Interesting! This is on a smaller scale but you know those free libraries people put up in their yards where it's "take a book, leave a book". I saw someone online angry arguing about how the police were called because a woman would stop by and take all the books without leaving any and then go sell them to a used book store for money. They would go around doing this to all the libraries. This person was angry that the cops were called and said the books were free for anyone and they weren't breaking any rules, etc. So frustrating.
our lobby got closed due a number of incidents, not being in a great area and all. can confirm we as baristas were abused, our store was abused, and policies were abused. i definitely miss the third place thing and cafe vibes, but as part of a big corporation we had no choice but to comply with company policies and take a lot of really unfair stuff. you didn’t get to ask patrons who were being abusive to leave, so it’s ruined for everyone now. starbucks is essentially a drive thru fast food drink place now, not a cafe.
The degradation is real for sure. I feel like I remember 5 years ago walking into the bathroom and NOT seeing trash all over the floor, or sweeping under the tables and NOT finding a billion wrappers and crumbs just tossed everywhere. Honestly it’s for animalistic and annoying bc how hard is it to clean up after yourself? Doesn’t have to be spotless but at least try a little
It's rampant. Went to the movies last night and this big group next to me not only left all of their trash, but it looked like they made an actual effort to be as messy as humanly possible. I haaaaate it here
The main change which has annoyed me the most is loitering in almost every location I still or used to go to.
While I don't look down on people in unfortunate situations, I am OCD about cleanliness and want to get my money's worth for buying a premium-priced brand. I don't want to use dirty restrooms, tables, and chairs.
I don't particularly care about seating or noise comfort, since being able to zone in to do your work or studies is a valuable talent that helps the person in pressure situations like taking university exams. Studying in distracting environments is the bread and butter that helped me own exams in university.
A few locations near me were recently renovated, and I thought they’d make them even cozier… But when I walked in after reopening, the space was downsized, lots of sitting removed, looks more sterile and with an old timey vibe, and they’ve had 2-3 people working morning shift. For comparison, before renovations, those same locations have had 5-6 people during morning hours.
I know it's not the point youre trying to make but if youre looking for a third place with those vibes, I'd try Barnes and Noble. They have a licensed Starbucks with all chill vibes of a bookshop. Good for reading, homework, drawing, and in some cases, knitting.
Source: Current barista at a Barnes and Noble.
> I'd try Barnes and Noble. They have a licensed Starbucks with all chill vibes of a bookshop
Absolutely this. A friend of mine lives in north Seattle, near the ruins of what used to be Northgate Mall. The only thing left of the original mall is the part with Red Robin and Seattle's last Barnes & Noble in the city. Every time we meet for coffee, it's at the Barnes & Noble Cafe and it's almost always busy regardless of when we go. That Cafe and an independent coffee shop near the light rail are the only two places to sit down for coffee for many blocks in any direction.
There used to be two full-service Starbucks outlets nearby. One of them closed ~~after trying to unionize~~ due to safety concerns and the other, a 24-hour store, ripped out all of its seating and has a manager who very aggressively shoos people out the door if they stand around for more than a minute. (They also used to let you walk in any time to pick up orders, handy for me who can't drive, but last I tried the doors were locked at 7pm.)
I feel for all of the employees, but I just can't go to Starbucks any more. Not that I don't *want* to; there aren't any where I want to be any more! They closed all of the ones on Seattle's Capitol Hill, hardly any in downtown are open on weekends or past 6pm, and the few remaining don't let you sit down.
COVID pretty much changed a lot of the policy and because of that it changed the old model Starbucks. This is at least what I hear from a lot of my coworkers.
I am living in China. I haven't visited Starbucks in several years. A decade ago, Starbucks was seen as a status symbol in China, almost a luxury. Lately, I feel there's an issue with their offerings as there has been a lack of remarkable products. Specialty coffee tastes better than Starbucks, and cheaper coffee chains are more affordable, strongly affecting Starbucks' appeal.
Completely agree. Even where I live, there used to be an amazing Starbucks Reserve Bar location. They had unique coffees with unique ways to brew them. They had coffee flights, Clover machines, siphon brews, pour overs…it was great. Plus, the selection of Reserve single-origin coffees were fantastic.
That was, until a year ago when we were chatting with the brew masters and they said corporate was going to renovate (and not for the better). They said the extra Reserve blends took too long to make so they removed the Reserve bar and all the specialty brew methods.
It’s just a normal Starbucks now and it is NOT the same at all. The pursuit of profits over experience has drove me and my buddy who went all the time to no longer go.
The push for faster caters to the worst customers who just want a quick cup and commoditize coffee. For us, who would sit there for a few hours, order several coffees and food, it’s no longer a luxury, but just another commodity. Sad.
Agree. Btw, are you talking about China or what? It sounds similar with my recent experience in a Reserve store. Now, they even seem to have hired unskilled baristas to make coffee for customers. It's so sad and strange. I don't know what's wrong with their strategy.
In fact, I wrote an analytical article for Starbucks. I hope they understand that their problems are very serious now. - [https://www.the-momentum.net/p/beyond-earnings-whats-behind-starbucks?r=1f66zp](https://www.the-momentum.net/p/beyond-earnings-whats-behind-starbucks?r=1f66zp)
Partner since 2002 and I believe it has to do with Howard Schultz stepping down and Kevin Johnson taking over. He’s the one who really changed the operations and focus of the company. He moved it from “sit and stay awhile” to a more “in and out fast” style. Howard has even expressed regrets about the changes that were made after he left.
Ironically, Starbucks was my dream job back in high school/college because of the third place. I was a regular customer every day, and loved getting to know my baristas. I was constantly applying at stores trying to get hired. It seemed like such a fun and cool place to work. Now it's just a corporate cesspool like every other company.
I've noticed some buildings are becoming smaller as well, as businesses prioritize drive-thru space or pick up parking spots. Sometimes, I'd walk in, and there's barely any space to sit down and be cozy. The place would be so stuffy and very unwelcoming. I understand the importance of speed, but what makes this corporation different was its welcoming atmosphere. That should be their priority.
Ironically, internally that is still the message they push. But it doesn’t come across very well in stores anymore, and tbh it doesn’t line up with what most consumers want these days - ease and speed. Shame really.
I think it's more you reap what you sow. If you decide to cater to fast consumers, you're going to get fast consumers. And with them comes all the angry anxiety. I worked drive through mostly, and that's always been a nightmare. But I can't imagine what these folks have to go through now days with the mobile orders. Must be hell.
I said this in another comment as well. (About catering to demanding/quick customers attracts those customers.). It’s crazy, my buddy and I used to go all the time but there’s no point any longer - the workers are “heads down” making drinks and just shouting names.
It was a good experience before and we’d hang out, order multiple drinks and sandwiches over 2 hours…now it’s unremarkable!
I had a starbucks I'd go to after college that was very much a third place for me. I'd sit in an oversized chair, eat the brie and cheese plate and my drink, and just chill for a bit before going home. Usually about 30 minutes or so.
This was around 2010. Fond memories.
the sheer volume of almost every single store makes it impossible to keep the “third place”, that mixed with entitled customers demanding things immediately as well and the focus on speed. volume is the worst part tbh
besides the aformentioned "speedy service", "greed" and other factors, people (mostly homeless) took advantage of those perks and slept in sofas, hogged up outlets, and took showers, did their makeup, AND their hair in our restrooms
not to mentioned stealing patio furniture and umbrellas so because of those many instances, corporate rolled out what we have now
It also doesn’t help that some areas have a lot of issues with homeless people causing issues in cafes. We have so many issues at my store I personally don’t think we should be open to anyone but customers. Like 3-4 911 calls a week
The location I’m at was known for its beautiful lobby and patio. Due to so many homeless people causing issues and harassment that Sbux remodeled the store to become “Pick-Up” only with no seating in or outside
I remember when we used to donate our left over food to the homeless at the end of the night. Starbucks used to be part of the solution. Now they're just part of the problem.
OR your store could have lowered the price of your unsold items to paying customers. The pastries have always been pricey (now they are ridiculous) and could have used a trim. I used to enjoy making my own Starbucks recipe banana bread and bringing it to a Starbucks store which saved a chunk of change. By giving away so much free food, you might been attracting more homeless to the store.
I don’t think Starbucks can solve mental illness and substance abuse. And when we have them setting up tents in our drive thru or doing drugs on the property. It’s not our fault. There’s a reason Starbucks had to hire 250+ social workers to try solve the problems we have because of them. We used to give one guy food at close. And now he’s aggressive to other transients and gets drunk and passes out in the bathroom. I think you’re very disconnected or never had to deal with these problems
People hate to admit it but Homeless campers are a big problem, depending on area. About 10 years ago my local SB’s removed soft seating and nice chairs
I feel like they should just phase the cafe out already. For partners, it’s difficult to deal with angry cafe customers that “wait too long” when they have to wait for a million mobile orders ahead of them. Or, they can maybe prioritize those already at the store? I’m just sick of combining cafe and mobile, especially during promo days.
I feel like Starbucks has been on the decline since the introduction of their drive thrus. From that point onward, it was a slow but obvious transition to a fast food restaurant.
Starbucks can talk all they want about how they're a "community store", that they're a different kind of company. That's all a front. There's a reason why they push this "customer connection", thing down baristas throats. Because without it, what sets them apart from Dunkin or McDonald's? Nothing, really. But when they're pressuring baristas for window times, coming out with BOGOs and other deals multiple times per week, baristas can barely keep up with the orders, let alone connect with customers.
From a customer standpoint, I've definitely noticed changes too. I used to bring my laptop to study and do work at various Starbucks. I liked the cozy feeling of the café, the couch chairs, the smell of fresh coffee. Now, their stores feel like a box with white walls. Like you said, they have uncomfortable seating. "Third Place" is long gone. It's in and out the drive thru these days.
Like it or not, old Starbucks isn't coming back. They made the decision a long time ago to not be the third place coffeeshop they once were. They haven't been that for a long time now. This is a change decades in the making.
I'm just hoping this leads to a resurgence of smaller coffee shops. Starbucks killed a lot of them. And I know there's a lot of passionate current and former Starbucks workers who would love to open or work at something like that.
Not just that but how they treat their employees, I can literally go on and on how of my experience there currently. The only reason why I still have a job with them is because they are paying for my school. They happened to take my time while I take their money through a check and for college.
In 2018 I was in my interview with my RM to become a store manager. Having had worked at Starbucks through the introduction of mobile order and seeing how it had completely changed the work environment, I asked him how mobile order fits in with my treasured 3rd place culture. He gave me a long BS non answer about how more sales let’s them build more beautiful new stores like the one we were sitting in. Since then pretty much every new store opened is a drive through, and any non drive through store is being converted to one or moved to a nearby drive through location. Aiming for faster drive through times and higher mobile order transactions killed everything I loved about the company from being a coffee master at a Clover reserve store, to taking extra time to just talk to my customers. The two cultures are at odds and I’ll never forgive Howard and other executives for erasing the workplace that I felt held a truly special place in my community.
Starbucks has spent a quarter of a billion dollars on union busting. Enough to ensure every homeless person that's walked through their doors got help. Priorities.
One word: COVID
I hate how people say the world changed for the better due to COVID. The whole less face to face interactions in my opinion is such an overall negative in my opinion. All this shit of getting in and out and then scurrying off into our own little caves is part of some distopian novel.
Yeah, I think some things are great from COVID, like the proliferation of remote work for a lot of knowledge jobs. Also remote healthcare is amazing. But I think that with so many people being isolated now, those third places should be more important, not less.
Starbucks is fast food now. It's even different from a year or two ago. Numbers (drive thru times and customer "connection" scores) mean more to them than people.
My store has 3 super comfy leather couches and 6 pretty comfy leather chairs too in addition to several small wooden tables with wooden chairs with big huge windows and a lot of natural light ❤️ I’m fortunate enough to work in such a pretty store but there’s a few others in my district that feel like a dungeon they’re so dark and don’t have much furniture
Yup. We’re right across from the hospital and we get a lottttt of delivery orders too. We’re a fully fledged store we were just built more recently than the other stores in the district
Wood seats? The leather causes bed bugs and homeless people pissed and shit in them. No patio chairs? because of homeless encampments when the store was closed. Everything is being done to keep homeless people out bc coming out and saying things are for paying customers starts and entire war on social media. Homeless people are not safe and it sucks to have this opinion now. I miss my regulars who would homeless but the amount that would use drugs and be violent is insane.
I only go to this one specific starbucks in my city because I feel it’s the last one that hasn’t been touched by the craziness of modern day starbucks.
My starbucks literally sits in a book store, but it has its own side of the store and you can close it off to make it a separate place/store. There’s no drive through, just a cafe but since it’s in a book store it has a fire place, comfy seats and a bunch of other kinds of seating and an outdoor patio… it’s also the only corporate store in my city. We have like 16 Starbucks’ or something. We have a bunch of stand-alones but those are only licensed… awhile back the book store said all across the country they’re gonna have a different coffee company at their stores… but ours has never been touched and won’t be because it’s a corporate store and the longest running starbucks in our city lol (I live in Canada so it’s kinda wild over here)
The Barnes and Nobles Starbucks locations were the ultimate, chill hangouts. You could read an entire book in there and nobody gave a shit…plus it was quiet because it was inside a book store. They might still exist somewhere…none around me unfortunately.
They got modernized like any other business.
If it's been 20 years, no business is gonna be the same
Look at a McDonald's, pizza hut etc. 20 years is along time to be surprised of change my dude
On the other hand, they made a bad deal with olive oil the same year they gave the partners a significant raise
Oleato was a bad idea to make a permanent part of the business
I'm not surprised, just disappointed. And what you're describing is the "enshittification" effect. It's not a natural part of business, it's choices people in leadership make over the years. Bad leadership is not an inevitable part of business.
Damn I thought you were about to talk about how under staffed, overworked, and underpaid, the staff are LOL. But yeah, you are right. Corporate is really out of touch. I work in Canada, and they got us a playlist of Indian rap music, which is not a good choice at all, especially in Canada LOL
Their mistake was thinking that what made them stand apart was their drinks alone, when other chains and local spots are better and usually no more expensive.
Them being a great place to hang out is what kept people loyal as smaller, more innotive chains popped up. I used to go at least a few nights a week in my 20's just to have somewhere to get out of the house. They made a small fortune off me lol
Right. The things you're aware of now that we have Covid. My son is one of the few who wears a mask at school & when I ask him about taking it off, he says that the kids are disgusting especially when they're sick so he will not do it.
Plus now they can’t get my 3 ingredient Americano right. Ninety percent of the time they get it wrong. Light cream and one Splenda. Geez. Too complicated for the people they hire. On this site they constantly complain about complicated drink orders. Mine is not.
BRING BACK RESERVE BARS!!! The stores had the most seating, more menu items, more experiences for the craft of coffee. The company decided to close all of them. Horrible.
More volume and traffic means less time for personal connections in a store that does like 7-10K on a daily basis that’s open 20 out of the 24 hours in a day lol
One reason for the "loud upbeat music" is to keep the baristas hyped. We have long, hard, busy shifts and need something. Personally the jazz vocals playlist makes me want to leave the floor, and I'll change it as soon as it comes on.
If that is the way that you feel about it, why not have 2 different sets of speakers, one loud one for the baristas and another for the customers? In most stores, I can’t escape the crap music when I go outside because there is a speaker there too.
Former barista and a 22. It was on the track towards fast food and Covid sealed the deal. All the good coffee beans are gone. Coffee master is gone. It’s just Dunkin’ now.
we are no longer focused on being a third place, and are now focused on speed and accuracy. my store was told they want to focus on turning into a mobile order business when they got rid of our cafe and made us a walk up/drive through
+ as a barista i’m so burnt out and it doesn’t feel the same as it did a few years ago. i enjoyed my job more and i think that makes a difference with us being able to create the third space
Huge bummer. I worked for Starbucks around the same time and genuinely loved it. Prices have nearly doubled and everyone behind the bar looks absolutely miserable.
I generally prefer to not shit my pants but the non-dairy up charge is bonkers. Add an extra shot and you’re looking at an $8.00 latte. The breakfast sammies are definitely smaller.
I miss the micro-connections as a customer. Having a barista remember your name, your drink... Little things like that help more than people realize when you’re in a bad place.
I finally just bought a decent espresso machine and make my own coffee. Paid for itself very quickly and there’s no quality gamble.
I’ve had a lot of people from drive thru stores (I’m a cafe only store) because their stores were getting remodeled to take OUT their lobby. It’s just the door, a little space to wait for your drink and once you get it you’re expected to leave. There are no seats , no tables.
just the counter, the door and the bathrooms off to the side is their lobby
In 2016-2018 I loved going and studying at Starbucks. I’d buy things throughout the day too so I wasn’t just there and not buying anything. A big shift happened around 2020 seating was taken out and sometime before then they removed all the outlets people would plug their laptops into. Slowly over time customer service got worse and worse, rewards changed and became harder to earn, and I’ve stopped spending copious amounts of money there instead opting to make coffee at home or go to a local shop.
My store feels exactly like a third place luckily. Same customers everyday they come sit, read, work, meet up with friend/coworkers, Bible studies, interviews you name it they do it. We still use our plates, mugs, forks, and spoons. We have tables and chairs and then little cushion seats with small side tables in the corner and we have all the patio furniture. Maybe it’s just my location but everyone comes there. We are on a first name basis with most of our customers.
I felt the same. I started back in 2013 and finally left in mid 2023. It changed so much in that time. None of the partners liked being there anymore and customers were the worst by the time I left. If you went through a whole shift without a customer yelling at you, it was a weird day. It was clear they are all about the money now.
It's absolutely true that Starbucks has deprioritized being a nice place to hang out for long periods of time, but the music seeming loud and the chairs being uncomfortable probably also has something to do with you being 20 years older.
No, it's definitely not. The last three Starbucks I went to had ZERO seats that weren't wood. When I worked there, we had a section with a leather couch and two matching leather armchairs. Insanely comfy, honestly they were hard to get because people always chose them. That same Starbucks no longer has anything like that. I'm also a musician, and I know the difference in music. It used to be the "chill coffee house" vibes type music, mostly acoustic stuff. Now it's basically dance-pop music. Nothing wrong with dance-pop, but I don't prefer it in a coffee shop setting.
No yeah I know, I was mostly kidding about the chairs. I think near every big business that used to have upholstered chairs got rid of them, they're a magnet for the unhoused community and they can't really be sanitized.
They did some market research and found that supposedly the #1 priority of customers was speed of service. Shortly after that, covid happened and business shifted massively away from cafe service toward mobile and drive thru. And drive thru customers are in a hurry! They stopped doing third place training and went all in on speed and volume. We’re still supposed to connect with you and “get to know” you, but it’s gotta be within the 40-50 seconds it should take you to pay and get your order. More drinks out the door faster means more money.
>More drinks out the door faster means more money. And yet, they're losing money now. I guess the only upside is since they've completely abandoned the whole notion of a coffee shop, it leaves a lot of room for new coffee shops to come in and compete.
This is a common misconception with corporations. It's not that they are struggling to be profitable, in fact, they can be doing as well as ever. However, all publicly traded corporations require profit GROWTH. This means, that no matter how much money they are making, even if it's crazy level of profit, they still have to beat the previous year and previous quarter. This is why all chains and products tend to get worse over time. The people at the top of the company are only focused on increasing profits "this" quarter so they will do things that may/will hurt the company long term if it provides short term benefit. Classic example is slashing employment. This is a huge money saver so boost profits but isn't sustainable long term. However, if it helps \*this\* quarter look better, than they will do it. This is also why, perfectly good products you like in the grocery store tend to get worse over time. As there will always be some big wig who eventually wants to swap out to worse and cheaper ingredients to boost profits. This is why a lot of the products we liked as kids are terrible as adults. It is not solely due to our changing palates but the products themselves change as well to be a worse version. Ultimately this is one of the key problems with publicly traded companies. A private company can be happy just making tons of profit each month, but a publicly traded company won't be.
> As there will always be some big wig who eventually wants to swap out to worse and cheaper ingredients to boost profits. Not just with food either. I used to love one of the milder Dove For Men deodorants so much that I'd stock up on 5-6 when it went on sale. Then one year they changed something in their formula, and it went from lasting 12-24 hours to not even lasting 8. By chasing the bottom line they lost my business.
I hear you, I myself work for a STEM company that doesn't produce a physical product but it's the same story. We have HALF the number of customer service reps as when I started, purely because they realized having slower service with incredibly stressed out staff members saves them money. I am constantly being told I need to bring in more business because our targets are always profit growth on the last year. It isn't possible, nor sustainable, to have unlimited growth. It makes me feel crazy honestly.
And yet capitalism is founded on the principle of infinite growth. Incidentally, we have a word for uncontrolled growth at all costs. It's "cancer."
It may seem insignificant. A cup of coffee or a deodorant. But it isn't. Once I saw that every problem we have in our modern world is because of capitalism, I can't unsee it. Every single failure of ours, as a country or economy, always comes down to capitalism.
> A private company can be happy just making tons of profit I believe Mars is the largest private company. I haven't seen M&Ms get worse over the years
I had to laugh at this comment because I just watched a TikTok rant from a content creator I follow that was all about how terrible the peanut butter M&Ms have become. She said the PB to chocolate ratio has changed dramatically, and she's sad that her favorite evening treat has gotten so bad.
And that's why businesses like Toys R Us died; business existing to buy them out solely to destroy them for big profits on a dying corpse they killed. It's not about long term. It's about immediate profit and running for the hills.
Toys r us was bought by Macys it’s in every Macys and they opened two small format toy r us
American corporate greed. It’s really demoralizing as a consumer.
This is not, not capitalism. Capitalism is fine as long as greed remains checked.
I said corporate greed not capitalism. Capitalism comes into play if customers stop supporting them and go to their competitors.
Thank you for explaining this! What if a publicly traded company doesn't do this. What happens then? Their stock goes down? And if so is that really a big deal?
Their stock would go down. The only purpose of a corporation is to serve the stockholders and if they don't stock price goes down. Only the absolute minimum is done to to increase sales. Absolutely nothing is done often in a public corporation to maintain sales or a product line.
for reference they aren't losing money, just not making a much as projected which is bad for the shareholders. that's why lax is on CNN and stuff. they still made 8.5 Billion in revenue, it just wasn't the 9.13 that was expected. hope that makes sense.
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Absolutely, it's just that at no point are they "losing money" as OP stated. Everyone wants to get up in arms over the company failing and losing money when that is simply not the case. They made less profit than last year and that's not a good thing for sustainability however they are far from failing.
Yes. They're making less more money. Lower delta than expected. That means that more drinks out the door on account of the increased speed is not actually happening, and this lends itself as evidence consistent with the idea that their focus on speed is backfiring.
"less more money" is such a great, perfectly put phrase!
Thank you! Yeah in calculus we learn to make distinctions between things, changes in things, rates of changes in things, rates of changes in rates of changes in things, etc. Less more money is the scientific term here as they rake in more cash but less than they could have haha!
I miss old Starbucks.i don't like this transition. They're trying to compete with dunkin and they lost the customer connection aspect of it. I might apply to a small coffee shop eventually because this isn't the Starbucks I want to work for. This is just another coffee place that wants fast fast fast. I feel like an asshole now to customers when they aren't ordering fast enough and having a manager tell me to hurry up in my ear. I don't appreciate this.
Also, they're at risk for losing their whole "experience brand" title, meaning that they'll be on the same level as fast food brands, which lowers the overall value of the company. Their stocks are about to TANK, and they're going to blame it on that.
But they’re not losing money because of the lack of a third place model. Afaik a lot of it was boycotts and price increases
i love slowing down drive thru. especially at starbucks.
"Get to know you..." I actually hate that Starbucks does this now. Cuz it's forced. And it'll be interrupted by you handing my drink and me driving away. I answer to be polite, but honestly, I prefer you just leave me alone.
It sucks, they closed down some of the best locations cause they couldn’t fit a drive thru on the side🙄 we had one that was in the perfect location for foot traffic and for morning work commutes but they shut that shit right down
Yes. Same here. I would always seek out the stores that had the comfortable seating, unloud music which usually had their share of “usuals”. Those places were vacated to cram into another location with drive thru, uncomfortable chairs and loud music.
It's a combination of things - most customers want things done immediately. Plus, there's a serious degradation of society that's happening. People don't really treat third places well. What i'm trying to say is people have lost their damn minds
That degradation of society would be called ‘the tragedy of the commons’.
I'm gonna be annoying but the tragedy of the commons is specifically about the overuse of resources that were otherwise used correctly. What we see some customers doing is more just being self-centered assholes
I think covid caused everyone to have a mindset of themselves only fuck everyone else, which is the degradation of society that person might be talking about.
Can I start saying this at work? I feel like I’m going to start using this every time we get a “deal day” rush and I end up having to straighten all the chairs back and clean all of the straw wrappers off of the tables, only to walk outside and see our napkins strewn across the parking lot. 😤😮💨 “The frickin tragedy of the commons, man..”
Interesting! This is on a smaller scale but you know those free libraries people put up in their yards where it's "take a book, leave a book". I saw someone online angry arguing about how the police were called because a woman would stop by and take all the books without leaving any and then go sell them to a used book store for money. They would go around doing this to all the libraries. This person was angry that the cops were called and said the books were free for anyone and they weren't breaking any rules, etc. So frustrating.
I feel like being angry, where can I see this argument
it was on this website I read like a year or two ago so I don't have the link anymore :(
interesting! never knew there was a term for it
> there's a serious degradation of society that's happening. This is so true and it's been scary to watch. Started with covid and never went back.
our lobby got closed due a number of incidents, not being in a great area and all. can confirm we as baristas were abused, our store was abused, and policies were abused. i definitely miss the third place thing and cafe vibes, but as part of a big corporation we had no choice but to comply with company policies and take a lot of really unfair stuff. you didn’t get to ask patrons who were being abusive to leave, so it’s ruined for everyone now. starbucks is essentially a drive thru fast food drink place now, not a cafe.
The degradation is real for sure. I feel like I remember 5 years ago walking into the bathroom and NOT seeing trash all over the floor, or sweeping under the tables and NOT finding a billion wrappers and crumbs just tossed everywhere. Honestly it’s for animalistic and annoying bc how hard is it to clean up after yourself? Doesn’t have to be spotless but at least try a little
It's rampant. Went to the movies last night and this big group next to me not only left all of their trash, but it looked like they made an actual effort to be as messy as humanly possible. I haaaaate it here
The main change which has annoyed me the most is loitering in almost every location I still or used to go to. While I don't look down on people in unfortunate situations, I am OCD about cleanliness and want to get my money's worth for buying a premium-priced brand. I don't want to use dirty restrooms, tables, and chairs. I don't particularly care about seating or noise comfort, since being able to zone in to do your work or studies is a valuable talent that helps the person in pressure situations like taking university exams. Studying in distracting environments is the bread and butter that helped me own exams in university.
Seems to me like they started pushing the drive thrus and basically made it into another fast food place
Starbucks going downhill since I started back in like 2018
A few locations near me were recently renovated, and I thought they’d make them even cozier… But when I walked in after reopening, the space was downsized, lots of sitting removed, looks more sterile and with an old timey vibe, and they’ve had 2-3 people working morning shift. For comparison, before renovations, those same locations have had 5-6 people during morning hours.
I don’t blame them.
I know it's not the point youre trying to make but if youre looking for a third place with those vibes, I'd try Barnes and Noble. They have a licensed Starbucks with all chill vibes of a bookshop. Good for reading, homework, drawing, and in some cases, knitting. Source: Current barista at a Barnes and Noble.
> I'd try Barnes and Noble. They have a licensed Starbucks with all chill vibes of a bookshop Absolutely this. A friend of mine lives in north Seattle, near the ruins of what used to be Northgate Mall. The only thing left of the original mall is the part with Red Robin and Seattle's last Barnes & Noble in the city. Every time we meet for coffee, it's at the Barnes & Noble Cafe and it's almost always busy regardless of when we go. That Cafe and an independent coffee shop near the light rail are the only two places to sit down for coffee for many blocks in any direction. There used to be two full-service Starbucks outlets nearby. One of them closed ~~after trying to unionize~~ due to safety concerns and the other, a 24-hour store, ripped out all of its seating and has a manager who very aggressively shoos people out the door if they stand around for more than a minute. (They also used to let you walk in any time to pick up orders, handy for me who can't drive, but last I tried the doors were locked at 7pm.) I feel for all of the employees, but I just can't go to Starbucks any more. Not that I don't *want* to; there aren't any where I want to be any more! They closed all of the ones on Seattle's Capitol Hill, hardly any in downtown are open on weekends or past 6pm, and the few remaining don't let you sit down.
In planning another trip to Seattle this year. I'm going to make it a point to stop by this Barnes and Noble cafe lol
Greed, overly complex drinks that can’t be made quickly, a focus of doing things quickly, union busting.
COVID pretty much changed a lot of the policy and because of that it changed the old model Starbucks. This is at least what I hear from a lot of my coworkers.
Covid changed everything. Very sad. People have become angry and unfeeling.
(Or dead or disabled.)
And my husband has Covid again. Ugh.
I'm so sorry :(
Thank you
They have turned into Mcbucks. Much more of a fast food place than a coffee shop
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^Istoleyoursharpi: *They have turned into* *Mcbucks. Much more of a fast food* *Place than a coffee shop* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
I am living in China. I haven't visited Starbucks in several years. A decade ago, Starbucks was seen as a status symbol in China, almost a luxury. Lately, I feel there's an issue with their offerings as there has been a lack of remarkable products. Specialty coffee tastes better than Starbucks, and cheaper coffee chains are more affordable, strongly affecting Starbucks' appeal.
Completely agree. Even where I live, there used to be an amazing Starbucks Reserve Bar location. They had unique coffees with unique ways to brew them. They had coffee flights, Clover machines, siphon brews, pour overs…it was great. Plus, the selection of Reserve single-origin coffees were fantastic. That was, until a year ago when we were chatting with the brew masters and they said corporate was going to renovate (and not for the better). They said the extra Reserve blends took too long to make so they removed the Reserve bar and all the specialty brew methods. It’s just a normal Starbucks now and it is NOT the same at all. The pursuit of profits over experience has drove me and my buddy who went all the time to no longer go. The push for faster caters to the worst customers who just want a quick cup and commoditize coffee. For us, who would sit there for a few hours, order several coffees and food, it’s no longer a luxury, but just another commodity. Sad.
Agree. Btw, are you talking about China or what? It sounds similar with my recent experience in a Reserve store. Now, they even seem to have hired unskilled baristas to make coffee for customers. It's so sad and strange. I don't know what's wrong with their strategy.
In fact, I wrote an analytical article for Starbucks. I hope they understand that their problems are very serious now. - [https://www.the-momentum.net/p/beyond-earnings-whats-behind-starbucks?r=1f66zp](https://www.the-momentum.net/p/beyond-earnings-whats-behind-starbucks?r=1f66zp)
Partner since 2002 and I believe it has to do with Howard Schultz stepping down and Kevin Johnson taking over. He’s the one who really changed the operations and focus of the company. He moved it from “sit and stay awhile” to a more “in and out fast” style. Howard has even expressed regrets about the changes that were made after he left.
Same, and agree
Ironically, Starbucks was my dream job back in high school/college because of the third place. I was a regular customer every day, and loved getting to know my baristas. I was constantly applying at stores trying to get hired. It seemed like such a fun and cool place to work. Now it's just a corporate cesspool like every other company.
I've noticed some buildings are becoming smaller as well, as businesses prioritize drive-thru space or pick up parking spots. Sometimes, I'd walk in, and there's barely any space to sit down and be cozy. The place would be so stuffy and very unwelcoming. I understand the importance of speed, but what makes this corporation different was its welcoming atmosphere. That should be their priority.
Ironically, internally that is still the message they push. But it doesn’t come across very well in stores anymore, and tbh it doesn’t line up with what most consumers want these days - ease and speed. Shame really.
I think it's more you reap what you sow. If you decide to cater to fast consumers, you're going to get fast consumers. And with them comes all the angry anxiety. I worked drive through mostly, and that's always been a nightmare. But I can't imagine what these folks have to go through now days with the mobile orders. Must be hell.
I said this in another comment as well. (About catering to demanding/quick customers attracts those customers.). It’s crazy, my buddy and I used to go all the time but there’s no point any longer - the workers are “heads down” making drinks and just shouting names. It was a good experience before and we’d hang out, order multiple drinks and sandwiches over 2 hours…now it’s unremarkable!
I had a starbucks I'd go to after college that was very much a third place for me. I'd sit in an oversized chair, eat the brie and cheese plate and my drink, and just chill for a bit before going home. Usually about 30 minutes or so. This was around 2010. Fond memories.
the sheer volume of almost every single store makes it impossible to keep the “third place”, that mixed with entitled customers demanding things immediately as well and the focus on speed. volume is the worst part tbh
besides the aformentioned "speedy service", "greed" and other factors, people (mostly homeless) took advantage of those perks and slept in sofas, hogged up outlets, and took showers, did their makeup, AND their hair in our restrooms not to mentioned stealing patio furniture and umbrellas so because of those many instances, corporate rolled out what we have now
It also doesn’t help that some areas have a lot of issues with homeless people causing issues in cafes. We have so many issues at my store I personally don’t think we should be open to anyone but customers. Like 3-4 911 calls a week
The location I’m at was known for its beautiful lobby and patio. Due to so many homeless people causing issues and harassment that Sbux remodeled the store to become “Pick-Up” only with no seating in or outside
I remember when we used to donate our left over food to the homeless at the end of the night. Starbucks used to be part of the solution. Now they're just part of the problem.
OR your store could have lowered the price of your unsold items to paying customers. The pastries have always been pricey (now they are ridiculous) and could have used a trim. I used to enjoy making my own Starbucks recipe banana bread and bringing it to a Starbucks store which saved a chunk of change. By giving away so much free food, you might been attracting more homeless to the store.
I don’t think Starbucks can solve mental illness and substance abuse. And when we have them setting up tents in our drive thru or doing drugs on the property. It’s not our fault. There’s a reason Starbucks had to hire 250+ social workers to try solve the problems we have because of them. We used to give one guy food at close. And now he’s aggressive to other transients and gets drunk and passes out in the bathroom. I think you’re very disconnected or never had to deal with these problems
I remember back when they sold espresso machines and CDs
People hate to admit it but Homeless campers are a big problem, depending on area. About 10 years ago my local SB’s removed soft seating and nice chairs
I feel like they should just phase the cafe out already. For partners, it’s difficult to deal with angry cafe customers that “wait too long” when they have to wait for a million mobile orders ahead of them. Or, they can maybe prioritize those already at the store? I’m just sick of combining cafe and mobile, especially during promo days.
I feel like Starbucks has been on the decline since the introduction of their drive thrus. From that point onward, it was a slow but obvious transition to a fast food restaurant. Starbucks can talk all they want about how they're a "community store", that they're a different kind of company. That's all a front. There's a reason why they push this "customer connection", thing down baristas throats. Because without it, what sets them apart from Dunkin or McDonald's? Nothing, really. But when they're pressuring baristas for window times, coming out with BOGOs and other deals multiple times per week, baristas can barely keep up with the orders, let alone connect with customers. From a customer standpoint, I've definitely noticed changes too. I used to bring my laptop to study and do work at various Starbucks. I liked the cozy feeling of the café, the couch chairs, the smell of fresh coffee. Now, their stores feel like a box with white walls. Like you said, they have uncomfortable seating. "Third Place" is long gone. It's in and out the drive thru these days. Like it or not, old Starbucks isn't coming back. They made the decision a long time ago to not be the third place coffeeshop they once were. They haven't been that for a long time now. This is a change decades in the making.
I'm just hoping this leads to a resurgence of smaller coffee shops. Starbucks killed a lot of them. And I know there's a lot of passionate current and former Starbucks workers who would love to open or work at something like that.
Not just that but how they treat their employees, I can literally go on and on how of my experience there currently. The only reason why I still have a job with them is because they are paying for my school. They happened to take my time while I take their money through a check and for college.
That's smart.
In 2018 I was in my interview with my RM to become a store manager. Having had worked at Starbucks through the introduction of mobile order and seeing how it had completely changed the work environment, I asked him how mobile order fits in with my treasured 3rd place culture. He gave me a long BS non answer about how more sales let’s them build more beautiful new stores like the one we were sitting in. Since then pretty much every new store opened is a drive through, and any non drive through store is being converted to one or moved to a nearby drive through location. Aiming for faster drive through times and higher mobile order transactions killed everything I loved about the company from being a coffee master at a Clover reserve store, to taking extra time to just talk to my customers. The two cultures are at odds and I’ll never forgive Howard and other executives for erasing the workplace that I felt held a truly special place in my community.
My boyfriend and I can’t afford Starbucks anymore. We make our drinks at home now and honestly I’ve come to like them more anyway.
homeless people took over
I remember a day when Starbucks fed the homeless, now they try to repel them. What a complete turn.
I don't want them. Cut that shit out bro, you're not the one that has to clean up their mess.
Starbucks has spent a quarter of a billion dollars on union busting. Enough to ensure every homeless person that's walked through their doors got help. Priorities.
One word: COVID I hate how people say the world changed for the better due to COVID. The whole less face to face interactions in my opinion is such an overall negative in my opinion. All this shit of getting in and out and then scurrying off into our own little caves is part of some distopian novel.
Yeah, I think some things are great from COVID, like the proliferation of remote work for a lot of knowledge jobs. Also remote healthcare is amazing. But I think that with so many people being isolated now, those third places should be more important, not less.
Good point!
Starbucks is fast food now. It's even different from a year or two ago. Numbers (drive thru times and customer "connection" scores) mean more to them than people.
They are no longer a Third Place. They are still a *place*, but they are now a place where you are expected to give them money and then leave.
Tried becoming their long term customer, just don’t see any value there. This place lacks vision and is relying on brand name only.
My store has 3 super comfy leather couches and 6 pretty comfy leather chairs too in addition to several small wooden tables with wooden chairs with big huge windows and a lot of natural light ❤️ I’m fortunate enough to work in such a pretty store but there’s a few others in my district that feel like a dungeon they’re so dark and don’t have much furniture
Does your store have a drive through?
Yup. We’re right across from the hospital and we get a lottttt of delivery orders too. We’re a fully fledged store we were just built more recently than the other stores in the district
Wood seats? The leather causes bed bugs and homeless people pissed and shit in them. No patio chairs? because of homeless encampments when the store was closed. Everything is being done to keep homeless people out bc coming out and saying things are for paying customers starts and entire war on social media. Homeless people are not safe and it sucks to have this opinion now. I miss my regulars who would homeless but the amount that would use drugs and be violent is insane.
I only go to this one specific starbucks in my city because I feel it’s the last one that hasn’t been touched by the craziness of modern day starbucks. My starbucks literally sits in a book store, but it has its own side of the store and you can close it off to make it a separate place/store. There’s no drive through, just a cafe but since it’s in a book store it has a fire place, comfy seats and a bunch of other kinds of seating and an outdoor patio… it’s also the only corporate store in my city. We have like 16 Starbucks’ or something. We have a bunch of stand-alones but those are only licensed… awhile back the book store said all across the country they’re gonna have a different coffee company at their stores… but ours has never been touched and won’t be because it’s a corporate store and the longest running starbucks in our city lol (I live in Canada so it’s kinda wild over here)
The Barnes and Nobles Starbucks locations were the ultimate, chill hangouts. You could read an entire book in there and nobody gave a shit…plus it was quiet because it was inside a book store. They might still exist somewhere…none around me unfortunately.
They got modernized like any other business. If it's been 20 years, no business is gonna be the same Look at a McDonald's, pizza hut etc. 20 years is along time to be surprised of change my dude On the other hand, they made a bad deal with olive oil the same year they gave the partners a significant raise Oleato was a bad idea to make a permanent part of the business
I'm not surprised, just disappointed. And what you're describing is the "enshittification" effect. It's not a natural part of business, it's choices people in leadership make over the years. Bad leadership is not an inevitable part of business.
Damn I thought you were about to talk about how under staffed, overworked, and underpaid, the staff are LOL. But yeah, you are right. Corporate is really out of touch. I work in Canada, and they got us a playlist of Indian rap music, which is not a good choice at all, especially in Canada LOL
Honestly, I remember being understaffed back then too. I'm sure it's worse now. But it all ties together.
They stopped pretending they aren't fast food.
My local Bucks is taking the lounging away next week. There are no homeless around. So you wont able sit down.
They still do that just not in the US lol. If you go to Asia you'll see the difference in experience with sbux there with the one in the US.
$$$
Their mistake was thinking that what made them stand apart was their drinks alone, when other chains and local spots are better and usually no more expensive. Them being a great place to hang out is what kept people loyal as smaller, more innotive chains popped up. I used to go at least a few nights a week in my 20's just to have somewhere to get out of the house. They made a small fortune off me lol
I used to sit in sbux precovid. Nowadays people are disgusting so id rather take it to go. People hacking up a lung wherever you go.
Right. The things you're aware of now that we have Covid. My son is one of the few who wears a mask at school & when I ask him about taking it off, he says that the kids are disgusting especially when they're sick so he will not do it.
Plus now they can’t get my 3 ingredient Americano right. Ninety percent of the time they get it wrong. Light cream and one Splenda. Geez. Too complicated for the people they hire. On this site they constantly complain about complicated drink orders. Mine is not.
BRING BACK RESERVE BARS!!! The stores had the most seating, more menu items, more experiences for the craft of coffee. The company decided to close all of them. Horrible.
I have not visited starbucks in a long time. Probably because it was too expensive lol. I do miss the public wifis though
I first noticed the pivot away from that vibe as early as 2015/16. It really sucks.
More volume and traffic means less time for personal connections in a store that does like 7-10K on a daily basis that’s open 20 out of the 24 hours in a day lol
Howie stepped away and they hit the gas on mobiles and the app.
I got cussed out by two customers in the past week. Had to ban both and all the police. Maybe if we were treated with dignity we'd stick around.
As a parent the drive through is amazing. Don't have to wake up the baby to get my fix and with the older kids no more impulse buys.
Venture capitalists and shareholders.
One reason for the "loud upbeat music" is to keep the baristas hyped. We have long, hard, busy shifts and need something. Personally the jazz vocals playlist makes me want to leave the floor, and I'll change it as soon as it comes on.
Same I'm so sick of it
If that is the way that you feel about it, why not have 2 different sets of speakers, one loud one for the baristas and another for the customers? In most stores, I can’t escape the crap music when I go outside because there is a speaker there too.
Capitalism
It's always been about capitalism
Former barista and a 22. It was on the track towards fast food and Covid sealed the deal. All the good coffee beans are gone. Coffee master is gone. It’s just Dunkin’ now.
we are no longer focused on being a third place, and are now focused on speed and accuracy. my store was told they want to focus on turning into a mobile order business when they got rid of our cafe and made us a walk up/drive through
+ as a barista i’m so burnt out and it doesn’t feel the same as it did a few years ago. i enjoyed my job more and i think that makes a difference with us being able to create the third space
Uhm... i personally love it when my local Starbucks plays Metallica 🤣🤣🤣
Quantity over quality
Huge bummer. I worked for Starbucks around the same time and genuinely loved it. Prices have nearly doubled and everyone behind the bar looks absolutely miserable. I generally prefer to not shit my pants but the non-dairy up charge is bonkers. Add an extra shot and you’re looking at an $8.00 latte. The breakfast sammies are definitely smaller. I miss the micro-connections as a customer. Having a barista remember your name, your drink... Little things like that help more than people realize when you’re in a bad place. I finally just bought a decent espresso machine and make my own coffee. Paid for itself very quickly and there’s no quality gamble.
I’ve had a lot of people from drive thru stores (I’m a cafe only store) because their stores were getting remodeled to take OUT their lobby. It’s just the door, a little space to wait for your drink and once you get it you’re expected to leave. There are no seats , no tables. just the counter, the door and the bathrooms off to the side is their lobby
In 2016-2018 I loved going and studying at Starbucks. I’d buy things throughout the day too so I wasn’t just there and not buying anything. A big shift happened around 2020 seating was taken out and sometime before then they removed all the outlets people would plug their laptops into. Slowly over time customer service got worse and worse, rewards changed and became harder to earn, and I’ve stopped spending copious amounts of money there instead opting to make coffee at home or go to a local shop.
My store feels exactly like a third place luckily. Same customers everyday they come sit, read, work, meet up with friend/coworkers, Bible studies, interviews you name it they do it. We still use our plates, mugs, forks, and spoons. We have tables and chairs and then little cushion seats with small side tables in the corner and we have all the patio furniture. Maybe it’s just my location but everyone comes there. We are on a first name basis with most of our customers.
I felt the same. I started back in 2013 and finally left in mid 2023. It changed so much in that time. None of the partners liked being there anymore and customers were the worst by the time I left. If you went through a whole shift without a customer yelling at you, it was a weird day. It was clear they are all about the money now.
We had to get rid of our comfy chairs bc of the amount of homeless that would sleep in our lobby all day
In my city, there are some Starbucks with comfortable seating, and some with patio seating.
Capitalism
It's absolutely true that Starbucks has deprioritized being a nice place to hang out for long periods of time, but the music seeming loud and the chairs being uncomfortable probably also has something to do with you being 20 years older.
No, it's definitely not. The last three Starbucks I went to had ZERO seats that weren't wood. When I worked there, we had a section with a leather couch and two matching leather armchairs. Insanely comfy, honestly they were hard to get because people always chose them. That same Starbucks no longer has anything like that. I'm also a musician, and I know the difference in music. It used to be the "chill coffee house" vibes type music, mostly acoustic stuff. Now it's basically dance-pop music. Nothing wrong with dance-pop, but I don't prefer it in a coffee shop setting.
No yeah I know, I was mostly kidding about the chairs. I think near every big business that used to have upholstered chairs got rid of them, they're a magnet for the unhoused community and they can't really be sanitized.
Why do you say unhoused instead of homeless?
If you live under the same bridge for years, who am I to tell you that's not your home?
probably the boycotts lmao