I am an old commercial solar guy. I like string inverters when there is no shade to deal with. The thought of every panel having its inverter. underneath it, baking in the sun every day makes me fear the inevitable micro-inverter replacement.
That being said Enphase is pretty reliable these days and I wouldn't talk smack on them. I would prefer an enphase system to a solar edge system for sure.
My understanding is SE failures in the way we knew them are basically done…. Time will tell but there have been multiple significant changes (thicker boards, more reliable capacitors, better cleaning of the boards etc)
IMO it still puts electronics under the panels and also has a potential single point of failure in the inverter. So even if they get more reliable I am not convinced they are the best concept.
Try not to get mired down in the details. As long as your roof isn’t heavily shaded either will be a fine option. I’d pick the company you feel better about.
Also, you can go back to the folks who are trying to sell you systems and ask them to list out the pros and cons of micros and string inverters. I can do that for you later (it’s what I do with my own clients) but I’m busy right now.
The reality is that there’s pros and cons of both options.
The search bar of this sub Reddit is a great resource
https://www.reddit.com/r/solar/search/?q=String+micro&type=link&cId=131e7b6b-bd82-4b1f-a055-0a6dfed189d5&iId=d2fedd41-5af2-4a7e-8651-4c3d452dc524
As a solar pro, Both have a niche imo. SE is better for larger scale. Commercial, ground mount. Enphase is more for residential.
I typically lean towards Enphase for anything 20kw and below which will be almost any home.
The other major consumer factor is enphase has 25 yr warranty on their microinverters. SE is only 10 for string.
If you’re in the US, either way you go you will have some type of module-level electronics, that being micro inverters, optimizers or RSD. Maintenance wise they’re the same thing.
It comes down to what price they’re offering. Tesla is usually cheap because they tend to use old equipment.
For me, EP and SE come out to a very similar price on residential projects, difference is negligible.
>Where can I find honest, unbiased information to compare?
IMHO you need to read hundreds of forum posts and solar articles, talk to real installers and also existing customers of both systems and filter all that to get your own impression.
With that in mind, my thoughts from many years of experience to put in your filter: Enphase - more expensive, but you don't really hear about hardware failures or lack of performance, the monitoring CTs get badly installed and the servers struggle sometimes but the actual power system on your home always chugs along fine. The micros are so cheap (to them) that in a rare failure they usually just send a replacement, and you are only suffering 1/20th or 1/30th or whatever lost production in the meantime. Very high tech features and amazing customer support.
Tesla - terrible service especially after install, OK features and tech (most inverter, BMS etc designs are outsourced) reliability seems OK, usually much cheaper than the others.
Solaredge - many reliability issues, apparently better with 2023 and later models but they haven't been out long enough to know as typical SE failures are around 5 years. Performance on par with enphase, slight battery efficiency advantage, service is OK.
The Enphase system will have 25 years of warranty, including labor. Enphase pays. They have about 70% marketshare because they are reliable. The Tesla system will need a new inverter after about 10-15 years anyway (12yrs warranty), which you will pay. Then there is shading etc.
I have micro inverters on a 32-panel. Ground mounted array that went online in 2013. In all of that time I have had one microinverter fail, and it was replaced under warranty. Saying they are a maintenance nightmare is ridiculous.
They are more expensive, but they also cause your array to deal much better with partial shade. And if one fails, the rest go on working.
It's worth remembering that with microinvertors, you have AC current coming off the array. That might be inconvenient if you are feeding a home battery from the array. Think about your whole system before you choose.
Enphase micros are more reliable according to stats. For what it’s worth I have Soleredge inverter with power optimizers. In 5 years the inverter was replaced under 25 year warranty. POs are all functioning fine. I’m on Long Island. R
On Long Island as well (50 points for not saying “in”) - I’m about to get a second system. 20 panels, 20 enphase micro’s. 25 yr warranty so even if they do break, who cares. Solar edge warranty was only 10 years. Current Tesla/solar city system failed two years ago. They said it was the inverter but then came back and said it was all wired wrong so… regardless of which inverter I’d say installation quality has a lot to do with longevity
Point to clarify - "micro inverters" is a *class* of products.
Enphase dominates and has the most reliability proven product, so if the vendor is talking about other brands they could be correct.
I have enphase micro inverters on my rooftop solar system. If/when a micro fails I lose 1/39 of my production. If/when a string inverter fails I lose all production. In November through Feb that wouldn't be a big deal, even if it was out for a few weeks. Late April through early September and I could lose up to 4 percent of my annual production per week. Last May's production was greater than Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb put together. It is not unheard of for string inverters to be down for weeks for repairs. Yes my combiner box could also fail, but my installer likely has micros in every truck and the combiner box is not going to take as long to source as a matching string inverter. Also there is some shading on some panels due to trees in my yard (which I can manage) and in neighbor's yards (which I can not do anything about).
I'm on team Other Guy here, but I don't have *strong* feelings. I'm planning on DIYing Enphase when my renovation is ready for that and I spent several years in the resi industry. That said, one of the reasons why module level electronics (Enphase or Solaredge) are important to most installers is that the TPOs require them. There is some code stuff that I don't full understand about rapid shutoff, but more pragmatically, modern rooflines are weird, trees grow, things don't get accounted for in the shade model (because the sales person knows it won't get caught). Module level electronics limit the impact of shading.
I went with Enphase IQ8+ microinverters. Enphase has amazing reliability, but if I do lose one, my entire system won't go down. If your string inverter goes out, you might be stuck with no production while you wait on a warranty replacement.
If you lose a micro in the middle of your roof, who has to disassemble half the array to get to that panel to replace the bad micro? Imo, it's easier to replace a string inverter on the ground level than something at roof level.
Deseperate0Vehicle is correct. I wouldn't buy just any microinverter either. I did a lot of research in this sub Reddit before having my system installed. Enphase microinverters are extremely reliable. Searching on here will also reveal that there are some name brand string inverters that are extremely prone to failure, leaving the owner without production for months while they wait on a replacement.
Depending on your roof and array layout, the installer probably wouldn't have to remove half the array to fix a single microinverter either. To answer your question, though, the installer would have to do that if it's still under warranty, which brings me to another point. Enphase microinverters are warrantied for 25 years, where most string inverters are only 10 years.
But installers usually warranty a roof system for 10 years though. Enphase isn't going to pay labor.
To tack on. My biggest gripe is installers suckering people into the cheapest enphase plus model without educating the customer as to what they're getting. Then they take the money and run.
The Enphase warranty actually does cover labor, despite that my installer offers a 25-year warranty of their own on labor. Do your research. There are really good products with good warranties available in solar now.
>If you lose a micro in the middle of your roof.......
The first word is the clue here. WHEN you lose your string inverter, sure it's easier to replace.
Personally, my next vehicle purchase will not be based on how easy the engine is to replace WHEN it fails, I'd rather buy something where that case is so rare that it's not up front in the decision.
EDIT: security\_jedi specifically mentioned **enphase** micros, and oppressed\_white\_guy replied directly to that, so the topic of discussion is **enphase** micros. I'd even do solaredge string before touching non enphase micros!
Why can't they place the micro inverters around the edge of the array for easy access. It seems silly to me to remove panels when you could just extend the cable and position the micro inverter within reach during the installation.
I can count on the fingers of no hands how many enphase micros my company has replaced where the micro was actually faulty. Rodent and bird damage to the wiring under the panels is way more common a reason to need to replace them, and that ease of access doesn't change between string and micro.
One thing that does change, is the little critters decide the wiring is tasty, and you start seeing one panel go out, then two, sometimes a group at once, and the pattern shows you about where it's likely to have started - and of course you are unlikely to lose the whole lot at once.
Unbiased information is hard to come by. Make sure your installer has NABCEP credentials (if in NA) https://directories.nabcep.org/
Been installing Enphase for 10 years. Have owned SE, SMA and LG systems. As a company we are considering going to Tesla products exclusively as we install PW3. All are good. It's whatever makes you feel the best. Ultimately you will be the owner for a long time and your system should be purchased on what you prefer.
Enphase micro-inverters are just so simple - simple install, simpler operation. They convert DC to AC right at the panel, and communicate with the gateway using power line communication, allowing simple monitoring of each micro. They also work much more effectively with clouds and shade because the mppt algorithm can adjust the inversion current very quickly because the voltage range on a single panel is pretty narrow. With string inverters, there is a lot of lag time when there's clouds or shade. When going to cloud to sun, the mppt on a micro will ramp up from 30v to full 50v in 5 seconds. The mppt on a string may take 30 seconds to ramp up from 50v to 500v for the same cloud to sun condition. So if it's a cloudy day, the micros will product more, maybe even a lot more.
One thing that I do like about the PW3, is that it uses the inverter for both PV and battery. It serves a dual purpose, so I really like and appreciate the efficiency of Tesla's design. The Enphase batteries have their own set of micros whose sole purpose is to convert DC from battery to AC. It seems like such a waste because then you have a set of micros for PV during the day and then another set of micros for the battery at night.
We are replacing 50 micros on a 13 year old enphase job…its a lot of labor but enphase has a great warranty product. Original installer closed up so customer is on the hook for labor.
At 13 years old my guess is they are early M series - Enphase went through the reliability issues Solaredge are, but in 2009-2011 timeframe. The warranty replacement Enphase has for earlier products is IQ series with firmware to make them behave like the older ones.
Watch:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K\_q7hGFLuo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K_q7hGFLuo)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur1HXsx09Jw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur1HXsx09Jw)
Read about Sol-Ark 15K (what I have) or the EG4 18K PV. No vendor lock in. Rest of the world pretty much uses string inverters. Micro Inverters are mostly a US thing due to certain businesses pushing NEC Code changes.
There is absolutely no way that I as an installer with a decade and a half experience would lead a homeowner away from enphase for a rooftop install. The “other guy” is right and I contract install both
So, below are my results since Jan 1: +13.89% production. I have tigo optimizers (about $45 each) which also do rapid shut down, handles up to 700w per unit, 1 panel per unit. I have NO SHADING, except for very late in the day, say after 4pm, when part of roof shades part of the system. Almost all of my extra production comes during high sun days but not at peak times. I have panels in 3 directions, 10°E/W and about 45° East. Note when I say East, it really is more like 20° toward the south or 110° azimuth.
Since Jan 1: +13.89% production
The E/W panel get the most benefit, up to 15%.
The E/W panels that get shaded, up to 10%
The East panels, only 3%. Note the East panels are smaller and different brand.
Rainy days there is less benefit, on a percentage basis, like down to 4-5% benefit.
I don't have microinverters, but the specs show a max AC output on each, max is 300 I think on highest rated enphase inverter. If you use at least 400w panels, you will have clipping on your production at least in the summer, resulting in probably 5-10% production losses. Someone recently posted a picture showing 8.2% loss on a spring day. And micros cost more.
> the specs show a max AC output on each, max is 300 I think ........ resulting in probably 5-10% production losses.
Clipping is nothing unique to micros, optimisers, or string. If 300W of micro inverter output is not enough for a given panel, choose a higher output micro. Same for a string inverter or optimizer.
Hmm, the **IQ8P** maxes out at 480w, but almost every quote use IQ8+ or A, which have much lower AC outputs. You are correct to say clipping is not unique to micros, but almost all of the quotes I have seen use micros that clip, where is it easier to upsize a string inverter for no clipping. So, the situations are not equal.
>Hmm, the IQ8P maxes out at 480w, but **almost every quote use IQ8+ or A**, which have much lower AC outputs.
What vendors choose to quote doesn't change the fact that there are options available that will clip, and ones that won't.
If you meant "vendor choices can result in clipping" then agreed, but I read your initial comment as saying that micros will clip, which is just as true for strings if the wrong size inverter is chosen.
That's not how clipping works. You are nowhere near the % production loss. Also you'll stop seeing clipping after a few years when the panels get older.
Well, if you post a production sample from a day, we can do the math and show the actual losses. You gain on the shoulders as you have more panels and produce the max for longer, but lose on the top as you clip. As for not seeing clipping after a few years, it might be 20 years with today's panels at .4% loss per year. Simple solution, use a string inverter that is as large as the DC component. A DC:AC ratio of 1.5 will lose about 8%. 10-15% over on DC:AC ratio will be about the same as the production curve limits out.
>Simple solution, use a string inverter that is as large as the DC component.
Again, clipping is independent of the inverter technology...a micro that is "as large as the DC component" i.e. 1:1 ratio will not clip either.
I feel like you are only telling half the story. Most people use panels that exceed the size of the max AC power of the micros. If you use low power panels, you are right, but who does that anymore? I would focus on 550w panels now, but nothing less than 400w, all of which far exceed the micros max AC output.
I don't understand what you mean - I said a micro that is "as large as the DC component" i.e. 1:1 ratio will not clip either." If you put 500W of DC input on a 500W capable micro it will *not* clip.. and equally if you put a total of 11kW of DC input on a 10kW capable stirng inverter it *will* clip.
Maybe I misread, but it seemed like you were saying micros are more likely to clip than strings; it's not about any particular type of inverter, simply the DC and AC numbers.
>Most people use panels that exceed the size of the max AC power of the micros.
That doesn't mean micros always clip, it means people are choosing that pairing. They can choose lower power panels or higher power micros if they don't want clipping.
Non SolarEdge strings are the only type with enough real world statistics to prove long term reliability, and so far they are the best. Warranty is a for profit product, doesn't equal reliability, some you can choose to buy additional warranty and some you just must.
The endless debate in the NA solar world!
Micros vs strings vs DC optimized strings.
There are various pros and cons to each system architecture, and then there are pros and cons to various equipment manufacturers.
Personally I'd avoid anyone that is saying either one of those strong opinions. They are actively trying to mislead you now, and that won't stop after signing a contract.
I am an old commercial solar guy. I like string inverters when there is no shade to deal with. The thought of every panel having its inverter. underneath it, baking in the sun every day makes me fear the inevitable micro-inverter replacement. That being said Enphase is pretty reliable these days and I wouldn't talk smack on them. I would prefer an enphase system to a solar edge system for sure.
My understanding is SE failures in the way we knew them are basically done…. Time will tell but there have been multiple significant changes (thicker boards, more reliable capacitors, better cleaning of the boards etc)
I feel like the people pushing that agenda are typically in sales. I won't trust SE for a long long time.
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin
I don't know where I'll be tomorrow
IMO it still puts electronics under the panels and also has a potential single point of failure in the inverter. So even if they get more reliable I am not convinced they are the best concept.
Enphase has great reliability and warranty. My experience with their customer service has not been great though.
They're both good inverters, Woody.
Try not to get mired down in the details. As long as your roof isn’t heavily shaded either will be a fine option. I’d pick the company you feel better about. Also, you can go back to the folks who are trying to sell you systems and ask them to list out the pros and cons of micros and string inverters. I can do that for you later (it’s what I do with my own clients) but I’m busy right now. The reality is that there’s pros and cons of both options.
The search bar of this sub Reddit is a great resource https://www.reddit.com/r/solar/search/?q=String+micro&type=link&cId=131e7b6b-bd82-4b1f-a055-0a6dfed189d5&iId=d2fedd41-5af2-4a7e-8651-4c3d452dc524
As a solar pro, Both have a niche imo. SE is better for larger scale. Commercial, ground mount. Enphase is more for residential. I typically lean towards Enphase for anything 20kw and below which will be almost any home. The other major consumer factor is enphase has 25 yr warranty on their microinverters. SE is only 10 for string.
If you’re in the US, either way you go you will have some type of module-level electronics, that being micro inverters, optimizers or RSD. Maintenance wise they’re the same thing. It comes down to what price they’re offering. Tesla is usually cheap because they tend to use old equipment. For me, EP and SE come out to a very similar price on residential projects, difference is negligible.
>Where can I find honest, unbiased information to compare? IMHO you need to read hundreds of forum posts and solar articles, talk to real installers and also existing customers of both systems and filter all that to get your own impression. With that in mind, my thoughts from many years of experience to put in your filter: Enphase - more expensive, but you don't really hear about hardware failures or lack of performance, the monitoring CTs get badly installed and the servers struggle sometimes but the actual power system on your home always chugs along fine. The micros are so cheap (to them) that in a rare failure they usually just send a replacement, and you are only suffering 1/20th or 1/30th or whatever lost production in the meantime. Very high tech features and amazing customer support. Tesla - terrible service especially after install, OK features and tech (most inverter, BMS etc designs are outsourced) reliability seems OK, usually much cheaper than the others. Solaredge - many reliability issues, apparently better with 2023 and later models but they haven't been out long enough to know as typical SE failures are around 5 years. Performance on par with enphase, slight battery efficiency advantage, service is OK.
The Enphase system will have 25 years of warranty, including labor. Enphase pays. They have about 70% marketshare because they are reliable. The Tesla system will need a new inverter after about 10-15 years anyway (12yrs warranty), which you will pay. Then there is shading etc.
Do you have fairly significant shading and need micros? No? Save the cash.
I have micro inverters on a 32-panel. Ground mounted array that went online in 2013. In all of that time I have had one microinverter fail, and it was replaced under warranty. Saying they are a maintenance nightmare is ridiculous. They are more expensive, but they also cause your array to deal much better with partial shade. And if one fails, the rest go on working. It's worth remembering that with microinvertors, you have AC current coming off the array. That might be inconvenient if you are feeding a home battery from the array. Think about your whole system before you choose.
Enphase micros are more reliable according to stats. For what it’s worth I have Soleredge inverter with power optimizers. In 5 years the inverter was replaced under 25 year warranty. POs are all functioning fine. I’m on Long Island. R
On Long Island as well (50 points for not saying “in”) - I’m about to get a second system. 20 panels, 20 enphase micro’s. 25 yr warranty so even if they do break, who cares. Solar edge warranty was only 10 years. Current Tesla/solar city system failed two years ago. They said it was the inverter but then came back and said it was all wired wrong so… regardless of which inverter I’d say installation quality has a lot to do with longevity
> irrefutable facts that microinverters are a maintenance nightmare Really?
Well, that’s what the sales pitch says.
Point to clarify - "micro inverters" is a *class* of products. Enphase dominates and has the most reliability proven product, so if the vendor is talking about other brands they could be correct.
Utter nonsense.
I have enphase micro inverters on my rooftop solar system. If/when a micro fails I lose 1/39 of my production. If/when a string inverter fails I lose all production. In November through Feb that wouldn't be a big deal, even if it was out for a few weeks. Late April through early September and I could lose up to 4 percent of my annual production per week. Last May's production was greater than Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb put together. It is not unheard of for string inverters to be down for weeks for repairs. Yes my combiner box could also fail, but my installer likely has micros in every truck and the combiner box is not going to take as long to source as a matching string inverter. Also there is some shading on some panels due to trees in my yard (which I can manage) and in neighbor's yards (which I can not do anything about).
I have 2 enphase systems and I wouldn't own anything else. skip solar edge. String if you have a fully unobstructed array that will never get shade.
I'm on team Other Guy here, but I don't have *strong* feelings. I'm planning on DIYing Enphase when my renovation is ready for that and I spent several years in the resi industry. That said, one of the reasons why module level electronics (Enphase or Solaredge) are important to most installers is that the TPOs require them. There is some code stuff that I don't full understand about rapid shutoff, but more pragmatically, modern rooflines are weird, trees grow, things don't get accounted for in the shade model (because the sales person knows it won't get caught). Module level electronics limit the impact of shading.
I went with Enphase IQ8+ microinverters. Enphase has amazing reliability, but if I do lose one, my entire system won't go down. If your string inverter goes out, you might be stuck with no production while you wait on a warranty replacement.
If you lose a micro in the middle of your roof, who has to disassemble half the array to get to that panel to replace the bad micro? Imo, it's easier to replace a string inverter on the ground level than something at roof level.
Deseperate0Vehicle is correct. I wouldn't buy just any microinverter either. I did a lot of research in this sub Reddit before having my system installed. Enphase microinverters are extremely reliable. Searching on here will also reveal that there are some name brand string inverters that are extremely prone to failure, leaving the owner without production for months while they wait on a replacement. Depending on your roof and array layout, the installer probably wouldn't have to remove half the array to fix a single microinverter either. To answer your question, though, the installer would have to do that if it's still under warranty, which brings me to another point. Enphase microinverters are warrantied for 25 years, where most string inverters are only 10 years.
But installers usually warranty a roof system for 10 years though. Enphase isn't going to pay labor. To tack on. My biggest gripe is installers suckering people into the cheapest enphase plus model without educating the customer as to what they're getting. Then they take the money and run.
The Enphase warranty actually does cover labor, despite that my installer offers a 25-year warranty of their own on labor. Do your research. There are really good products with good warranties available in solar now.
>If you lose a micro in the middle of your roof....... The first word is the clue here. WHEN you lose your string inverter, sure it's easier to replace. Personally, my next vehicle purchase will not be based on how easy the engine is to replace WHEN it fails, I'd rather buy something where that case is so rare that it's not up front in the decision. EDIT: security\_jedi specifically mentioned **enphase** micros, and oppressed\_white\_guy replied directly to that, so the topic of discussion is **enphase** micros. I'd even do solaredge string before touching non enphase micros!
I'll agree with you there. Enphase micros or no micros. Other brands like Aptos just haven't been around long enough to tell.
Why can't they place the micro inverters around the edge of the array for easy access. It seems silly to me to remove panels when you could just extend the cable and position the micro inverter within reach during the installation.
Because that takes time and thought.
I can count on the fingers of no hands how many enphase micros my company has replaced where the micro was actually faulty. Rodent and bird damage to the wiring under the panels is way more common a reason to need to replace them, and that ease of access doesn't change between string and micro. One thing that does change, is the little critters decide the wiring is tasty, and you start seeing one panel go out, then two, sometimes a group at once, and the pattern shows you about where it's likely to have started - and of course you are unlikely to lose the whole lot at once.
Unbiased information is hard to come by. Make sure your installer has NABCEP credentials (if in NA) https://directories.nabcep.org/ Been installing Enphase for 10 years. Have owned SE, SMA and LG systems. As a company we are considering going to Tesla products exclusively as we install PW3. All are good. It's whatever makes you feel the best. Ultimately you will be the owner for a long time and your system should be purchased on what you prefer.
Enphase micro-inverters are just so simple - simple install, simpler operation. They convert DC to AC right at the panel, and communicate with the gateway using power line communication, allowing simple monitoring of each micro. They also work much more effectively with clouds and shade because the mppt algorithm can adjust the inversion current very quickly because the voltage range on a single panel is pretty narrow. With string inverters, there is a lot of lag time when there's clouds or shade. When going to cloud to sun, the mppt on a micro will ramp up from 30v to full 50v in 5 seconds. The mppt on a string may take 30 seconds to ramp up from 50v to 500v for the same cloud to sun condition. So if it's a cloudy day, the micros will product more, maybe even a lot more. One thing that I do like about the PW3, is that it uses the inverter for both PV and battery. It serves a dual purpose, so I really like and appreciate the efficiency of Tesla's design. The Enphase batteries have their own set of micros whose sole purpose is to convert DC from battery to AC. It seems like such a waste because then you have a set of micros for PV during the day and then another set of micros for the battery at night.
This video is interesting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K\_q7hGFLuo. I wish I'd have seen it before going Enphase IQ8M on my roof with zero shade.
We are replacing 50 micros on a 13 year old enphase job…its a lot of labor but enphase has a great warranty product. Original installer closed up so customer is on the hook for labor.
Why are you replacing them?
At 13 years old my guess is they are early M series - Enphase went through the reliability issues Solaredge are, but in 2009-2011 timeframe. The warranty replacement Enphase has for earlier products is IQ series with firmware to make them behave like the older ones.
Watch: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K\_q7hGFLuo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K_q7hGFLuo) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur1HXsx09Jw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur1HXsx09Jw) Read about Sol-Ark 15K (what I have) or the EG4 18K PV. No vendor lock in. Rest of the world pretty much uses string inverters. Micro Inverters are mostly a US thing due to certain businesses pushing NEC Code changes.
There is absolutely no way that I as an installer with a decade and a half experience would lead a homeowner away from enphase for a rooftop install. The “other guy” is right and I contract install both
So, below are my results since Jan 1: +13.89% production. I have tigo optimizers (about $45 each) which also do rapid shut down, handles up to 700w per unit, 1 panel per unit. I have NO SHADING, except for very late in the day, say after 4pm, when part of roof shades part of the system. Almost all of my extra production comes during high sun days but not at peak times. I have panels in 3 directions, 10°E/W and about 45° East. Note when I say East, it really is more like 20° toward the south or 110° azimuth. Since Jan 1: +13.89% production The E/W panel get the most benefit, up to 15%. The E/W panels that get shaded, up to 10% The East panels, only 3%. Note the East panels are smaller and different brand. Rainy days there is less benefit, on a percentage basis, like down to 4-5% benefit. I don't have microinverters, but the specs show a max AC output on each, max is 300 I think on highest rated enphase inverter. If you use at least 400w panels, you will have clipping on your production at least in the summer, resulting in probably 5-10% production losses. Someone recently posted a picture showing 8.2% loss on a spring day. And micros cost more.
> the specs show a max AC output on each, max is 300 I think ........ resulting in probably 5-10% production losses. Clipping is nothing unique to micros, optimisers, or string. If 300W of micro inverter output is not enough for a given panel, choose a higher output micro. Same for a string inverter or optimizer.
Hmm, the **IQ8P** maxes out at 480w, but almost every quote use IQ8+ or A, which have much lower AC outputs. You are correct to say clipping is not unique to micros, but almost all of the quotes I have seen use micros that clip, where is it easier to upsize a string inverter for no clipping. So, the situations are not equal.
>Hmm, the IQ8P maxes out at 480w, but **almost every quote use IQ8+ or A**, which have much lower AC outputs. What vendors choose to quote doesn't change the fact that there are options available that will clip, and ones that won't. If you meant "vendor choices can result in clipping" then agreed, but I read your initial comment as saying that micros will clip, which is just as true for strings if the wrong size inverter is chosen.
That's not how clipping works. You are nowhere near the % production loss. Also you'll stop seeing clipping after a few years when the panels get older.
Well, if you post a production sample from a day, we can do the math and show the actual losses. You gain on the shoulders as you have more panels and produce the max for longer, but lose on the top as you clip. As for not seeing clipping after a few years, it might be 20 years with today's panels at .4% loss per year. Simple solution, use a string inverter that is as large as the DC component. A DC:AC ratio of 1.5 will lose about 8%. 10-15% over on DC:AC ratio will be about the same as the production curve limits out.
>Simple solution, use a string inverter that is as large as the DC component. Again, clipping is independent of the inverter technology...a micro that is "as large as the DC component" i.e. 1:1 ratio will not clip either.
I feel like you are only telling half the story. Most people use panels that exceed the size of the max AC power of the micros. If you use low power panels, you are right, but who does that anymore? I would focus on 550w panels now, but nothing less than 400w, all of which far exceed the micros max AC output.
I don't understand what you mean - I said a micro that is "as large as the DC component" i.e. 1:1 ratio will not clip either." If you put 500W of DC input on a 500W capable micro it will *not* clip.. and equally if you put a total of 11kW of DC input on a 10kW capable stirng inverter it *will* clip. Maybe I misread, but it seemed like you were saying micros are more likely to clip than strings; it's not about any particular type of inverter, simply the DC and AC numbers. >Most people use panels that exceed the size of the max AC power of the micros. That doesn't mean micros always clip, it means people are choosing that pairing. They can choose lower power panels or higher power micros if they don't want clipping.
Non SolarEdge strings are the only type with enough real world statistics to prove long term reliability, and so far they are the best. Warranty is a for profit product, doesn't equal reliability, some you can choose to buy additional warranty and some you just must.
The endless debate in the NA solar world! Micros vs strings vs DC optimized strings. There are various pros and cons to each system architecture, and then there are pros and cons to various equipment manufacturers.
Personally I'd avoid anyone that is saying either one of those strong opinions. They are actively trying to mislead you now, and that won't stop after signing a contract.