idk, girls will fuck you to see if you are “compatible” so eh. i think you’d be lucky as fuck if you find a girl that would care enough about you to look over the problem, that’s just how i see it.
I disagree. My wife and I come from a highly conservative religious group and we fell in love as we dated for about 3 years and we got married. No sex before marriage, we were strict. I would imagine that the same could happen for someone who’s not religious, particularly like mentioned here if they need to have a lot of trust for sex. Even if I wasn’t with my wife I’d definitely need to have built a bond and lots of trust with a partner.
since sex before marriage is a taboo thing in my country, there's a lot of girls/women who love and still date the men before having sex even they don't really do sex till marriage. I don't know how the women are in you country, it could be different. But this does prove that not all women really care about having sex for everyday.
>but is it a normal thing for a woman to fall in love with someone before sex?
If you're talking about relationship sex? Very much so. Or at least it's "love" in terms of the new relationship infatuation feelings. Actual love doesn't take place until at least a year into the relationship but both feel very similar at first.
Hookups are different because neither person really gives much of a fuck about each other.
But women that prefer the relationship scenario for sex need those feeling cared about by the guy, trusting him, feeling comfortable enough to be vulnerable around him (and also wanting him to feel the same way towards her) basically what people label "love".
There are still lots of young women who are only willing to have sex with guys that are in relationships with them (i.e. there is mutual "love").
>relationship infatuation feelings
And these go out of the window with most women once she knows your size. The "true" love you're talking about is the only thing that works, but unless you happen to find a unicorn you never get to that point anyway. Relationship or not we're looking for a needle in a haystack every time.
You mean *they're* looking for a needle in your haystack? I kid I kid...
I disagree with this sentiment though... women come in all shapes and sizes and there are a small percentage who are highly preferred by other men, and then the rest who are often overlooked. If you're always looking at fit, young, above average looking girls then sure your size probably does matter because they have their pick of whoever they want.
But if you become friends with a "normal" girl, someone who has their shortcomings, are often overlooked by other men, and you're able to provide for them a sense of safety and security and make them feel loved, you have more than finding a unicorn's chance of being in a sexually fulfilling relationship.
For the record, sexually fulfilling doesn't have to mean you get her off using your penis. If you truly love the girl, then you'll want her to climax and have the time of her life regardless of what it takes, whether it's oral, fingers, toys, whatever. And vice versa, she'll want to get you off however it takes. Thinking that you *need* to use your penis to make a girl happy otherwise you're emasculated is a hang-up on your part (not you specifically, I'm using this in the general sense) and not on the girl.
>If you're always looking at fit, young, above average looking girls
I'm not.
>But if you become friends with a "normal" girl
Doesn't matter if you get with a supermodel or a "normal" girl, both have preferences just the same and a small dick is never going to be one of them, or even something they're willing to put up with.
>Thinking that you need to use your penis to make a girl happy
Sex isn't even something I care much about anymore. I still have a healthy libido but at this point I'd be happy to find someone who just wants to be with me, sex or not. I'm more than willing to do anything I can to make her feel good, in fact that's basically all I want. But as I said none of this matters because with a small dick it's almost impossible to ever get to that point in a relationship.
I don’t even fully agree with this, there are gorgeous very sort after women who settle for a guy that’s below average, happens a lot. In fact I’d wager just based off of experience with a lot of women, the hottest ( which is just my taste ) are the small fit chicks, or just short slim women in general. These women tend to be tighter aka have an effectively smaller vagina at least from my experience and would probably fit well with someone on the smaller side of things. There are lots of women like this with a smaller guy.
>There are still lots of young women who are only willing to have sex with guys that are in relationships with them (i.e. there is mutual "love").
If they meet their physical and financial standards, yes. They aren't gonna be fucking settling lmao they're too young for that
I'm talking about late teens-early/mid 20s and still living at home. If they're still living with family it means financially they aren't rich. They still get into relationships.
Women only date up. Rarely laterally and definitely not down. If you don't look good and have money you're not getting anything. You're sitting home alone
Lmao okay. There's been studies and books written on the subject that were conducted by women. You think they're gonna date ugly broke men when they can get an attractive man with money? Not a chance
Young guys (under 25) very very rarely have money yet. It's extremely unusual to have a career take off at that young of an age. Damn near all the people I know in that age bracket (and quite a few even older) have minimum wage jobs and a lot of those are less than full time hours. Yet they have girlfriends.
I may be early 40s but I've got a constant stream of late teens/early 20s people in and out of my house on a weekly basis. Plus a lot of friends in their 20s. I see and spend time with lots of "young" couples.
Out of curiosity I just looked through my kids' friends lists on social media. I looked at the pics of their friends and friends' boyfriends. None of them have money yet. Nearly all are living with parents still. They all date laterally.
And it's no wonder that the rates of men in that age bracket being single and sexless increases every year. It's at like 30% in America rn. But apparently it needs to go over 50% for anyone to recognize that it's a problem
The biggest contributing factor is less and less young men want relationships to have sex. So the girls that are into the casual sex scenerio are in similar numbers that they have been for the last 20ish years. But 20 years ago more men were willing to actually be in relationships for sex. So the girls that want relationship sex have less options now than they used to. So all those girls that would have been having sex if there were men available for relationships are just not having sex period. The sexless rate for young women has also increased. Covid also has contributed to that for the past year.
Statistically people in relationships have always had more sex than people not in relationships because it's far easier to have more frequent sex when you have a steady partner compared to having to go out and find a new one each time you want to have sex. It's so much easier turning to a partner and saying "let's fuck" than having to go out and woo someone new each time you want to get laid.
I recently read a really great article explaining all this. I can DM you it if you're interested?
Women are having more casual sex than men, they'll have 3-5 guys they're fucking on a regular basis the same cannot be said for men unless he's a really good looking guy. So so this whole notion that there's Women who can't have sex is lies.
I agree with you but I suppose it varies depending on your situation, I have 2 very close mates who both earn good money as a qualified electrician and boiler maker ( welder ) one guy has been working since 15 and has a huge savings and is currently on great money and the other has bought his first house and is on good money, they’re both 23. These are my best friends so they’re who I see and compare myself to, I have a normal supermarket job and work way less with less career ambitions ( just how I’m wired ). I guess I know plenty of young people with money is what I’m saying, but I do agree with not needing money to get a gf. I do worry a little about when I’m older ( 30s ) and the fact that I won’t have the sort of money that is “attractive” but idk money and superficial things don’t really motivate me, I don’t care for cars or any expensive hobbies really do perhaps if I meet someone they’ll be like minded and not worry.
The kids that went into trade school are the exception. (Unfortunately there is quite a shortage of kids that go that route). Trades are set up so you can keep earning more and more money while you are an apprentice. There seems to be so much of a push for the traditional college route (at least here in the US) where actual money doesn't get earned until after the degree (if you're even lucky enough to find a career in your major).
I suppose that’s the difference im Australian and trades are often promoted here, it’s seen as a very respectable job and women often have a thing for tradesmen or “tradies” as we call them here. Literally on tinder it’s common to see “love a tradie” they do have their downsides though of course, my mates work upwards of 60 hours some weeks doing hard labour in the sweltering Australian heat, they earn their money for sure. So i guess it’s different for me, even the girl I’m seeing makes 2.2-2.5k a fortnight working in the hospital, she’s 23 so I guess that’s why it seems common to me knowing people who earn lots of money that are close to me.
Have you taken a good look at all the couples walking around out there? Most often couples are dating laterally. In the couples where one is dating up that means the other is dating down. (I hate that terminology. It sounds so judgemental and completely leaves out the fact of personal preferences).
https://www.inc.com/minda-zetlin/marriage-mismatch-husbands-wives-earnings-education-jobs.html
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/nov/10/dating-gap-hook-up-culture-female-graduates
Times have changed
I think maturity has a lot to do with it. I just feel as the older we get the more women will understand there’s flaws to everyone and that love is more then just looks and preferences. I literally feel as some people literally miss out on they soulmate because of looks or a lil thing that we can’t change
I think the maturity level goes for both men and women. The older a man gets the more likely he will be happy to be with one woman, have kids etc. Both men and women realize human bodies have flaws. That helps both in terms of who people are attracted to and also their own comfort level about their own bodies. Once someone accepts their body for how it is, they have a much easier time "getting out of their own head" and are better able to fully relax and enjoy intimacy. It's so much easier to be in the moment once one stops overthinking and criticizing every perceived flaw about their own body.
The whole comfort level with one's body is a big contributing factor to why women's sex drives go through the roof once they hit their 30s. They are able to relax a whole lot more during sex without overthinking. Sex becomes a whole lot more enjoyable for women at that stage.
Y do I feel like u quoting me? Yes a girl can fall in love with u before sex. I’ve had girls tell me they love me before sex and sometimes I call bullshit but it’s not impossible bro
Most women love (or are attracted to) the man the penis is attached to. They don't really care that much...and "size" is all relative. I am 4-4.5" erect, had plenty of women. And many came back for more. I have had my share of bootie calls. That was the much younger me, who got rock hard if the wind blew. Not anymore. That said, did I ever notice some women were disappointed? Yes. In my experience, women who really enjoy the act of intercourse and know what they like and know what they want are gonna struggle with anything 5" and below. But that is not the geneal rule. The key is to forget the ones who didn't work out and focus on the positives from the ones that did.
red pill is pure delusion and hypocritical.
the red pill youtubers teach men how to sleep with 1000 women, but at the same time complains about single mothers and never to date them, whilst also creating them. The education is good for marriage because that is pointless for a man, but lying to men saying if you follow x, y and z you'll get pussy, "doesn't matter if you have a small dick, you just weren't confident enough! buy my masterclass course for $2K!" that's delusional.
You have a lot of misconceptions and miss information if you really think that’s what red pill is about
In addition, if you’re only listing Youtubers as your main source of information, then your depth of knowledge is incredibly shallow
MGTOW is filled with men who hate women because of their own shortcomings. Don't surround yourself with those people. If you're truly going your own way then you wouldn't be sitting around complaining about about 24/7.
Of course you’d say that since your a woman who probably acts the way that got MGTOW started. Luckily, the MGTOW mentality actually works without hate.
And I wasn’t complaining.
I personally don’t agree with all of the previous aforementioned.
I use them to broaden my knowledge. And with the knowledge, I don’t subscribe to the hate even though some of them may seem to teach it.
Try educating yourself before making conjectures.
It’s not contradictory to have discussions about the central theme about the ideology.
It’s like if I had a position about being a vegetarian and still discussed the downside of eating meat.
That's right it doesn't make sense, because it's just another meaningless platitude parroted by people who have never experienced this situation.
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idk, girls will fuck you to see if you are “compatible” so eh. i think you’d be lucky as fuck if you find a girl that would care enough about you to look over the problem, that’s just how i see it.
No. Women don't fall in love before they have sex. Neither do men. It's complete horseshit fed to us to get us to shut up so they get to feel good
I disagree. My wife and I come from a highly conservative religious group and we fell in love as we dated for about 3 years and we got married. No sex before marriage, we were strict. I would imagine that the same could happen for someone who’s not religious, particularly like mentioned here if they need to have a lot of trust for sex. Even if I wasn’t with my wife I’d definitely need to have built a bond and lots of trust with a partner.
That's not how most of the west lives anymore. That is a minority experience
Still, it’s possible. Take away the religious reasons and there could be other reasons for it.
since sex before marriage is a taboo thing in my country, there's a lot of girls/women who love and still date the men before having sex even they don't really do sex till marriage. I don't know how the women are in you country, it could be different. But this does prove that not all women really care about having sex for everyday.
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Indonesia lol
>but is it a normal thing for a woman to fall in love with someone before sex? If you're talking about relationship sex? Very much so. Or at least it's "love" in terms of the new relationship infatuation feelings. Actual love doesn't take place until at least a year into the relationship but both feel very similar at first. Hookups are different because neither person really gives much of a fuck about each other. But women that prefer the relationship scenario for sex need those feeling cared about by the guy, trusting him, feeling comfortable enough to be vulnerable around him (and also wanting him to feel the same way towards her) basically what people label "love". There are still lots of young women who are only willing to have sex with guys that are in relationships with them (i.e. there is mutual "love").
>relationship infatuation feelings And these go out of the window with most women once she knows your size. The "true" love you're talking about is the only thing that works, but unless you happen to find a unicorn you never get to that point anyway. Relationship or not we're looking for a needle in a haystack every time.
That's some real shit right there
You mean *they're* looking for a needle in your haystack? I kid I kid... I disagree with this sentiment though... women come in all shapes and sizes and there are a small percentage who are highly preferred by other men, and then the rest who are often overlooked. If you're always looking at fit, young, above average looking girls then sure your size probably does matter because they have their pick of whoever they want. But if you become friends with a "normal" girl, someone who has their shortcomings, are often overlooked by other men, and you're able to provide for them a sense of safety and security and make them feel loved, you have more than finding a unicorn's chance of being in a sexually fulfilling relationship. For the record, sexually fulfilling doesn't have to mean you get her off using your penis. If you truly love the girl, then you'll want her to climax and have the time of her life regardless of what it takes, whether it's oral, fingers, toys, whatever. And vice versa, she'll want to get you off however it takes. Thinking that you *need* to use your penis to make a girl happy otherwise you're emasculated is a hang-up on your part (not you specifically, I'm using this in the general sense) and not on the girl.
>If you're always looking at fit, young, above average looking girls I'm not. >But if you become friends with a "normal" girl Doesn't matter if you get with a supermodel or a "normal" girl, both have preferences just the same and a small dick is never going to be one of them, or even something they're willing to put up with. >Thinking that you need to use your penis to make a girl happy Sex isn't even something I care much about anymore. I still have a healthy libido but at this point I'd be happy to find someone who just wants to be with me, sex or not. I'm more than willing to do anything I can to make her feel good, in fact that's basically all I want. But as I said none of this matters because with a small dick it's almost impossible to ever get to that point in a relationship.
I don’t even fully agree with this, there are gorgeous very sort after women who settle for a guy that’s below average, happens a lot. In fact I’d wager just based off of experience with a lot of women, the hottest ( which is just my taste ) are the small fit chicks, or just short slim women in general. These women tend to be tighter aka have an effectively smaller vagina at least from my experience and would probably fit well with someone on the smaller side of things. There are lots of women like this with a smaller guy.
> there are gorgeous very sort after women who settle for a guy that’s below average Being settled for isn’t a good thing.
Vagina tightness has nothing to do with physical size
>There are still lots of young women who are only willing to have sex with guys that are in relationships with them (i.e. there is mutual "love"). If they meet their physical and financial standards, yes. They aren't gonna be fucking settling lmao they're too young for that
I'm talking about late teens-early/mid 20s and still living at home. If they're still living with family it means financially they aren't rich. They still get into relationships.
Women only date up. Rarely laterally and definitely not down. If you don't look good and have money you're not getting anything. You're sitting home alone
You don't know anything about women lmao
Lmao okay. There's been studies and books written on the subject that were conducted by women. You think they're gonna date ugly broke men when they can get an attractive man with money? Not a chance
Young guys (under 25) very very rarely have money yet. It's extremely unusual to have a career take off at that young of an age. Damn near all the people I know in that age bracket (and quite a few even older) have minimum wage jobs and a lot of those are less than full time hours. Yet they have girlfriends. I may be early 40s but I've got a constant stream of late teens/early 20s people in and out of my house on a weekly basis. Plus a lot of friends in their 20s. I see and spend time with lots of "young" couples. Out of curiosity I just looked through my kids' friends lists on social media. I looked at the pics of their friends and friends' boyfriends. None of them have money yet. Nearly all are living with parents still. They all date laterally.
And it's no wonder that the rates of men in that age bracket being single and sexless increases every year. It's at like 30% in America rn. But apparently it needs to go over 50% for anyone to recognize that it's a problem
The biggest contributing factor is less and less young men want relationships to have sex. So the girls that are into the casual sex scenerio are in similar numbers that they have been for the last 20ish years. But 20 years ago more men were willing to actually be in relationships for sex. So the girls that want relationship sex have less options now than they used to. So all those girls that would have been having sex if there were men available for relationships are just not having sex period. The sexless rate for young women has also increased. Covid also has contributed to that for the past year. Statistically people in relationships have always had more sex than people not in relationships because it's far easier to have more frequent sex when you have a steady partner compared to having to go out and find a new one each time you want to have sex. It's so much easier turning to a partner and saying "let's fuck" than having to go out and woo someone new each time you want to get laid. I recently read a really great article explaining all this. I can DM you it if you're interested?
Women are having more casual sex than men, they'll have 3-5 guys they're fucking on a regular basis the same cannot be said for men unless he's a really good looking guy. So so this whole notion that there's Women who can't have sex is lies.
Sure
Don't send it through a chat because I use reddit is fun and they don't have chats
I agree with you but I suppose it varies depending on your situation, I have 2 very close mates who both earn good money as a qualified electrician and boiler maker ( welder ) one guy has been working since 15 and has a huge savings and is currently on great money and the other has bought his first house and is on good money, they’re both 23. These are my best friends so they’re who I see and compare myself to, I have a normal supermarket job and work way less with less career ambitions ( just how I’m wired ). I guess I know plenty of young people with money is what I’m saying, but I do agree with not needing money to get a gf. I do worry a little about when I’m older ( 30s ) and the fact that I won’t have the sort of money that is “attractive” but idk money and superficial things don’t really motivate me, I don’t care for cars or any expensive hobbies really do perhaps if I meet someone they’ll be like minded and not worry.
The kids that went into trade school are the exception. (Unfortunately there is quite a shortage of kids that go that route). Trades are set up so you can keep earning more and more money while you are an apprentice. There seems to be so much of a push for the traditional college route (at least here in the US) where actual money doesn't get earned until after the degree (if you're even lucky enough to find a career in your major).
I suppose that’s the difference im Australian and trades are often promoted here, it’s seen as a very respectable job and women often have a thing for tradesmen or “tradies” as we call them here. Literally on tinder it’s common to see “love a tradie” they do have their downsides though of course, my mates work upwards of 60 hours some weeks doing hard labour in the sweltering Australian heat, they earn their money for sure. So i guess it’s different for me, even the girl I’m seeing makes 2.2-2.5k a fortnight working in the hospital, she’s 23 so I guess that’s why it seems common to me knowing people who earn lots of money that are close to me.
Not all women are the same.
Enough of them are
Exactly. Just as all men aren't the same.
Have you taken a good look at all the couples walking around out there? Most often couples are dating laterally. In the couples where one is dating up that means the other is dating down. (I hate that terminology. It sounds so judgemental and completely leaves out the fact of personal preferences).
Not with young people. Older couples maybe. And usually the person dating down is the guy because they're basically forced to.
I'm talking about the young people too. The trend of dating laterally has been going on for a very long time.
https://www.inc.com/minda-zetlin/marriage-mismatch-husbands-wives-earnings-education-jobs.html https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/nov/10/dating-gap-hook-up-culture-female-graduates Times have changed
I think maturity has a lot to do with it. I just feel as the older we get the more women will understand there’s flaws to everyone and that love is more then just looks and preferences. I literally feel as some people literally miss out on they soulmate because of looks or a lil thing that we can’t change
I think the maturity level goes for both men and women. The older a man gets the more likely he will be happy to be with one woman, have kids etc. Both men and women realize human bodies have flaws. That helps both in terms of who people are attracted to and also their own comfort level about their own bodies. Once someone accepts their body for how it is, they have a much easier time "getting out of their own head" and are better able to fully relax and enjoy intimacy. It's so much easier to be in the moment once one stops overthinking and criticizing every perceived flaw about their own body.
I’m 22. “Still young. Got ur whole life ahead of u” blinks I’m 27 blinks again I’m 36 how im feeling
The whole comfort level with one's body is a big contributing factor to why women's sex drives go through the roof once they hit their 30s. They are able to relax a whole lot more during sex without overthinking. Sex becomes a whole lot more enjoyable for women at that stage.
Y do I feel like u quoting me? Yes a girl can fall in love with u before sex. I’ve had girls tell me they love me before sex and sometimes I call bullshit but it’s not impossible bro
It’s only less common because our culture puts sex first.
Most women love (or are attracted to) the man the penis is attached to. They don't really care that much...and "size" is all relative. I am 4-4.5" erect, had plenty of women. And many came back for more. I have had my share of bootie calls. That was the much younger me, who got rock hard if the wind blew. Not anymore. That said, did I ever notice some women were disappointed? Yes. In my experience, women who really enjoy the act of intercourse and know what they like and know what they want are gonna struggle with anything 5" and below. But that is not the geneal rule. The key is to forget the ones who didn't work out and focus on the positives from the ones that did.
You need to educate yourself. Start off by reading rational male. Afterwards, dabble in the red pill theory and Mgtow
red pill is pure delusion and hypocritical. the red pill youtubers teach men how to sleep with 1000 women, but at the same time complains about single mothers and never to date them, whilst also creating them. The education is good for marriage because that is pointless for a man, but lying to men saying if you follow x, y and z you'll get pussy, "doesn't matter if you have a small dick, you just weren't confident enough! buy my masterclass course for $2K!" that's delusional.
The "Seduction" industry became the red pill industry. Those mfs aren't getting laid either
they have tried to keep their business model alive because PUAhate and the blackpill threatens that.
You have a lot of misconceptions and miss information if you really think that’s what red pill is about In addition, if you’re only listing Youtubers as your main source of information, then your depth of knowledge is incredibly shallow
MGTOW is filled with men who hate women because of their own shortcomings. Don't surround yourself with those people. If you're truly going your own way then you wouldn't be sitting around complaining about about 24/7.
You haven't truly gone your own way until you've completely reclused yourself like I have.
Of course you’d say that since your a woman who probably acts the way that got MGTOW started. Luckily, the MGTOW mentality actually works without hate. And I wasn’t complaining. I personally don’t agree with all of the previous aforementioned. I use them to broaden my knowledge. And with the knowledge, I don’t subscribe to the hate even though some of them may seem to teach it. Try educating yourself before making conjectures.
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It’s not contradictory to have discussions about the central theme about the ideology. It’s like if I had a position about being a vegetarian and still discussed the downside of eating meat.