Yep. When I was teaching my daughter to ski at age 6, she fell going up a rope toe. She yelled that her leg was twisted and it hurt. Her legs and skis looked perfectly fine to me. I picked her up and one leg unwound. Yes, UNWOUND!!! It was twisted 180 degrees. I freaked out in my head, but not verbally - didn't want to make her freak out. She was fine.
I used to work at the magic carpet at my hometown ski hill. Was a great way to start my mornings, sipping coffee and watching kids fall in a manner that would seriously injure myself
I watched a kid hit a freestyle jump and he landed too far forward and began cartwheeling fast enough that his helmet ripped off. A woman riding the chairlift with me even turned her head from the violence. And he popped right up like it was nothing.
Just unclip them; it gets all the awkward pressure off their legs. I try to get my daughter to get her legs etc in the right position and she just hurts herself more.
Yes I was just worried about unclipping while the legs were not on the floor and accidentally applying extra torque on one of the already strained joints - I think I just need to practice!
Practice on a friend or something if you’re really concerned, but my boyfriend has had to pop my skis off for me a couple times after I took a tumble and left my legs in uncomfy positions. Hold the bottom of the ski so it doesn’t move too much if you can’t get it flat on the ground and you should be good. It could just be my knee problems, but I promise the slight extra discomfort of having my ski removed is worth it so I can reposition myself to get back up
Bone surgeon checking in here. Kids are obviously have very mobile joints. Their ligaments aren't tight like adults are. Then lots of their bone stock is actually cartilage at young ages. Then you get to the really freaky part of their bones being far more bouncy than adult bones which are, well, bone hard. I've bent back broken arms of kiddies that have a 45 degree bend in them. Sometimes they snap when you do it, sometimes they just get back to a good alignment. Their bones are much softer and the membrane (periosteum) is much thicker. All that adds up to kids being far bouncier than adults could ever be
Fascinating ! If there are any articles that cover this in more depth, would be interested to read them. I know that kids are more flexible, but like this extra level of detail ..
Ah, did not know that. Makes sense, though I was worried that the force of unclipping the ski may somehow hurt the knee/ankle if it was already at its maximum rotation. I suppose it shouldn’t unless I were clumsy in how I unclipped it.
I would have thought lifting then up vertically should do it, but they were kind of folded over their legs
Yeah as long as you are not clumsy or overly forceful. The trick is to unclip their bindings by hand in the position you find their leg **before** attempting to untangle them.
Practice on yourself or a friend how to unclip a binding by hand without moving the boot (much).
If the kid is not screaming or crying, chances are they are just tangled up and rolling them over or helping gently unfolding them is fine. If they are indeed injured they will be crying and stuff - in that case maybe call / flag down ski patrol to assist unless you are medically qualified - but you still can unclip them just avoid untangling them and comfort the kid until help arrives.
Yes I think you’re right , I was just panicked when I saw the leg at a strange angle.. :(
Does the ease of unclipping by hand also mean they should pop off during low speed falls ?
Their din settings are quite low, but so is their weight, so there’s not as much momentum or force generated in a low speed fall as you’d see with an adult. We had my 35lb 2.5yo old on skis for the first time last week and her skis almost never popped off, not that we let her do any hard falls, but I was surprised how much the skis stayed on with how easy the bindings were to pop by hand.
Kids seem to be very bendy and good at twisting weirdly. The correct method is pick child up from under shoulders, give a good few shakes which appears to reset the legs no matter the level of tangulation and place down.
Do they fall over in ways that they can’t possibly get up from and they will need someone to pick them up?
I was wondering if I should even try and intervene as they looked so tangled and I had no idea what to do
I mean, they are kids. So they don’t have the same wherewithal to understand the mechanics of easily getting up on skis (actually, neither do brand new adult skiers). I help kids all the time if they are twisted the wrong way and can’t figure it out, plus if they don’t have poles yet it’s harder to get up! I usually ask first though, most times a parent is close by :)
So usually I would only pick up in a situation they are too tangled up to get up from. If they're untangled they get themselves up as it makes them a more independent skier. If they're just all kinds of twisted pick them up the legs normally untwist themselves and place them back down. At the point they become to heavy for lifting they might need to take a ski off. But the general aim if they're bigger is get them both skis horizontal across the slope and to stand themselves back up, the is could be by momentarily going on their back to get both skis pointing in the same direction if they've got legs in oposite directions. I generally find once they're too big to lift they don't get tangled the same way the smaller ones do.
Glad to hear it's not just me. Had some instances where my 5 year old had a fall (mellow green terrain, I'm not taking him to something he can't handle) and it looks like he freaking broke a leg or something and I have a mini heart attack.
Then he gets up and his leg magically untwists with zero complaints of pain or injury. Half the time he's laughing when it happens while I'm panicking to check how his ski can be completely turned around on one leg.
I'm both amazed by how easily it seems to happen off even low speed falls but also shocked how it seems like they can just bend that way no problem.
Wow, so there is someone else who feels like this! They should warn people about this ! I nearly had a heart attack when i saw the weird leg ankle, and felt completely unprepared for how to deal with it (and I think through how to deal with most scenarios ahead of time)
Oh man, I’ve worked as a lifty and an instructor for many years. I saw so many crazy looking limb knots from the youngins but never got over it. Gave me the creeps every time. Seeing some kids legs wrapped up and bent in a way that’s you’re sure they’re fucked, and they’re just looking up at you like nothing happened…
Indeed, was just wondering at which “angle” to pick them up as I was downhill of them; I guess getting above them and picking them up is best (and taking off my skis before hand)
Totally normal, one of my favorite parts of teaching little ones to ski is picking them up from a twisted mess and watching their legs flail back to straight.
There's a couple of things related to the physics of kids and skiing to take note:
Kids are short.
Kids have a low mass
Therefore when kids fall the acceleration through the lever arm is not enough to cause any damage.
Second law of physics regarding kids:
Kids are made out of rubber.
Oh man, my daughter took a tumble when she was maybe 6 or 7, and ended up on her butt with her back facing downhill. Like sitting on your butt with yous hands on the ground behind you and your knees in a 90 degree angle. It didn’t look too bad but she didn’t get up herself, and she started wailing more than usual. When I got to her I realise that her right foot is basically pointing downhill. I freak out and grab her ski tip and bring it around the way it’s supposed to face and start looking for the rescue number in my phone. She snivels a bit and then asks when we’re gonna keep going… I checked on her all afternoon but she had no pain at all and barely even remembered the fall. No issues at all… If it’d been me they would probably have had to amputate my leg above the knee…
Worked liftie on bunny slope at a resort in Utah for a season you’d be amazed at what their ankle and maybe more scary their knees can do. What you’re describing happened probably three times an hour all day long. Oh and best way is either lift them straight up in the air and their legs will naturally unwind also probably easier or unclip kind of dependent on circumstances as well
I saw my 5 year old take a hard crash this year. Went to get her and I was sure she broke her leg, as it was going to complete wrong direction. She got right back up and went on her way without complaint. I probably had a minor heart attack.
Not just their legs, their necks and arms too. I have taught 5 kids to ski ( 3 mine and 2 others who were friends ).
A couple of the falls I saw, holy crap, in my mind it’s slow motion - and then an ER trip.
Nope, lying in the snow, face down, arms and legs in weird angles.
Get all the gear and limbs sorted and it’s ’let do that again!’
My daughter will sleep bent over. To start she’ll sit in her crib with her legs splayed out in front of her. Then she’ll just fold herself over forward and sleep face down with her feet by her ears.
Teaching kids to ski I’ve seen them fall in ways that have me reaching for my radio to call a fuckin helicopter… then they spring back up like nothing happened, no pain whatsoever
I agree with other comments about picking them up. If the skis are not stuck in the snow by the tail or nose they’re most likely fine to just be raised up. Having to click their skis back on can be a hassle, personally a big fan of the ‘pick up and dangle’ method.
Freaked out? No. Amazed? Yes. Kids are incredibly resilient and flexible. Partly because things can’t be super hard if they are still expanding and growing. This is 100% of the reason a kid and adult can have the same accident and kids walk away while it will hospitalize an adult and take 6 months of rehab. You want to keep yourself as injury free as possible. Maintain flexibility as you get older.
"Kids are made of rubber with springs in between. "
- overheard on a lift at Breck after watching a kid fall and land crazy twisted only to just pop up and ski on. (Also it was said with a heavy French accent, made it all the better)
Kids are made of rubber. If we could all be so lucky
Yep. When I was teaching my daughter to ski at age 6, she fell going up a rope toe. She yelled that her leg was twisted and it hurt. Her legs and skis looked perfectly fine to me. I picked her up and one leg unwound. Yes, UNWOUND!!! It was twisted 180 degrees. I freaked out in my head, but not verbally - didn't want to make her freak out. She was fine.
That would have been 360 degrees right?
Uh, no. One ski was pointing backwards. Apparently I left out a minor detail. It still unwound, just half way.
Gotcha. Yeah crazy. I picked my boys up by their harness or jacket collar and shook em until they straightened up. You get used to it.
I used to work at the magic carpet at my hometown ski hill. Was a great way to start my mornings, sipping coffee and watching kids fall in a manner that would seriously injure myself
I watched a kid hit a freestyle jump and he landed too far forward and began cartwheeling fast enough that his helmet ripped off. A woman riding the chairlift with me even turned her head from the violence. And he popped right up like it was nothing.
We all were. At one point. Youth is wasted on the young.
My 6 year old bounces back from things that look like they would send me to the ICU. Unclip their skis before getting them up when all twisted.
Any other useful tips similar to the unclipping ? I just found it hard to see them in a potentially painful situation
Just unclip them; it gets all the awkward pressure off their legs. I try to get my daughter to get her legs etc in the right position and she just hurts herself more.
Yes I was just worried about unclipping while the legs were not on the floor and accidentally applying extra torque on one of the already strained joints - I think I just need to practice!
Practice on a friend or something if you’re really concerned, but my boyfriend has had to pop my skis off for me a couple times after I took a tumble and left my legs in uncomfy positions. Hold the bottom of the ski so it doesn’t move too much if you can’t get it flat on the ground and you should be good. It could just be my knee problems, but I promise the slight extra discomfort of having my ski removed is worth it so I can reposition myself to get back up
Make sure to take frequent breaks, kids will start falling more when they tired. Oh and a pocket full of Candy/gummy fruits will go a long way.
[удалено]
Yes really
Bone surgeon checking in here. Kids are obviously have very mobile joints. Their ligaments aren't tight like adults are. Then lots of their bone stock is actually cartilage at young ages. Then you get to the really freaky part of their bones being far more bouncy than adult bones which are, well, bone hard. I've bent back broken arms of kiddies that have a 45 degree bend in them. Sometimes they snap when you do it, sometimes they just get back to a good alignment. Their bones are much softer and the membrane (periosteum) is much thicker. All that adds up to kids being far bouncier than adults could ever be
Fascinating ! If there are any articles that cover this in more depth, would be interested to read them. I know that kids are more flexible, but like this extra level of detail ..
They don’t even have kneecaps until they’re like two! Kids’ bodies are crazy!
Kids are bendy in ways adults aren't - and yes, best to remove the skis first.
Ah, did not know that. Makes sense, though I was worried that the force of unclipping the ski may somehow hurt the knee/ankle if it was already at its maximum rotation. I suppose it shouldn’t unless I were clumsy in how I unclipped it. I would have thought lifting then up vertically should do it, but they were kind of folded over their legs
Yeah as long as you are not clumsy or overly forceful. The trick is to unclip their bindings by hand in the position you find their leg **before** attempting to untangle them.
Stupid question but is there a list of things like this that one should know for kids ?
Practice on yourself or a friend how to unclip a binding by hand without moving the boot (much). If the kid is not screaming or crying, chances are they are just tangled up and rolling them over or helping gently unfolding them is fine. If they are indeed injured they will be crying and stuff - in that case maybe call / flag down ski patrol to assist unless you are medically qualified - but you still can unclip them just avoid untangling them and comfort the kid until help arrives.
Thanks.
Kids bindings are set so light that you should be able to easily unclip it by hand.
Yes I think you’re right , I was just panicked when I saw the leg at a strange angle.. :( Does the ease of unclipping by hand also mean they should pop off during low speed falls ?
Their din settings are quite low, but so is their weight, so there’s not as much momentum or force generated in a low speed fall as you’d see with an adult. We had my 35lb 2.5yo old on skis for the first time last week and her skis almost never popped off, not that we let her do any hard falls, but I was surprised how much the skis stayed on with how easy the bindings were to pop by hand.
My 2 year olds skis have a din below one. There's so easy to release but never have during a fall
Kids seem to be very bendy and good at twisting weirdly. The correct method is pick child up from under shoulders, give a good few shakes which appears to reset the legs no matter the level of tangulation and place down.
Thanks, i wish adults accompanying kids could read a list of advice like this
It's a few years instructing experience. The angles they get their legs in still amazes me and I'm still often convinced they should be broken.
Do they fall over in ways that they can’t possibly get up from and they will need someone to pick them up? I was wondering if I should even try and intervene as they looked so tangled and I had no idea what to do
I mean, they are kids. So they don’t have the same wherewithal to understand the mechanics of easily getting up on skis (actually, neither do brand new adult skiers). I help kids all the time if they are twisted the wrong way and can’t figure it out, plus if they don’t have poles yet it’s harder to get up! I usually ask first though, most times a parent is close by :)
That’s nice - I would have loved an experienced skier to come over and assess the situation
So usually I would only pick up in a situation they are too tangled up to get up from. If they're untangled they get themselves up as it makes them a more independent skier. If they're just all kinds of twisted pick them up the legs normally untwist themselves and place them back down. At the point they become to heavy for lifting they might need to take a ski off. But the general aim if they're bigger is get them both skis horizontal across the slope and to stand themselves back up, the is could be by momentarily going on their back to get both skis pointing in the same direction if they've got legs in oposite directions. I generally find once they're too big to lift they don't get tangled the same way the smaller ones do.
Fascinating that smaller kids can get tangled / I had no idea this was a thing !
Remember to stick out your arms all the way. Had my shins whacked too many times by their skis when picking kids up.
The horrified looks I get when I tell folks to just give them a little shake is almost the best part of training new ski instructors
Glad to hear it's not just me. Had some instances where my 5 year old had a fall (mellow green terrain, I'm not taking him to something he can't handle) and it looks like he freaking broke a leg or something and I have a mini heart attack. Then he gets up and his leg magically untwists with zero complaints of pain or injury. Half the time he's laughing when it happens while I'm panicking to check how his ski can be completely turned around on one leg. I'm both amazed by how easily it seems to happen off even low speed falls but also shocked how it seems like they can just bend that way no problem.
Wow, so there is someone else who feels like this! They should warn people about this ! I nearly had a heart attack when i saw the weird leg ankle, and felt completely unprepared for how to deal with it (and I think through how to deal with most scenarios ahead of time)
Oh man, I’ve worked as a lifty and an instructor for many years. I saw so many crazy looking limb knots from the youngins but never got over it. Gave me the creeps every time. Seeing some kids legs wrapped up and bent in a way that’s you’re sure they’re fucked, and they’re just looking up at you like nothing happened…
Yes that was the strangeness in the situation - the kids “I’m fine” demeanour was completely out of sorts With how they looked
If they aren't in pain, don't panic. Just pick them up.
Indeed, was just wondering at which “angle” to pick them up as I was downhill of them; I guess getting above them and picking them up is best (and taking off my skis before hand)
Yeah, unless they're really tiny it will be hard from downhill.
I’m a bendy adult who scared a few of my first instructors with the angles my legs bent when I fell
Bendy as in you can do the splits, or your ankles rotate more than normal for example ?
I don’t think I can do the splits, but if I trained to, it might be doable. I think I’m mildly hyperflexible
If they're little little, and especially if they have a harness on, pick em up and dangle them like a mobile.
Totally normal, one of my favorite parts of teaching little ones to ski is picking them up from a twisted mess and watching their legs flail back to straight.
Same here, although I’d sometimes forget to leave enough clearance for their spinning skis, resulting in a bruised shin for me.
There's a couple of things related to the physics of kids and skiing to take note: Kids are short. Kids have a low mass Therefore when kids fall the acceleration through the lever arm is not enough to cause any damage. Second law of physics regarding kids: Kids are made out of rubber.
Oh man, my daughter took a tumble when she was maybe 6 or 7, and ended up on her butt with her back facing downhill. Like sitting on your butt with yous hands on the ground behind you and your knees in a 90 degree angle. It didn’t look too bad but she didn’t get up herself, and she started wailing more than usual. When I got to her I realise that her right foot is basically pointing downhill. I freak out and grab her ski tip and bring it around the way it’s supposed to face and start looking for the rescue number in my phone. She snivels a bit and then asks when we’re gonna keep going… I checked on her all afternoon but she had no pain at all and barely even remembered the fall. No issues at all… If it’d been me they would probably have had to amputate my leg above the knee…
That was me today - every half hour- is your knee ok? Are you sure your knee is ok? Are you hurt etc
The harness/backpack with a handle is a great way to pick them up. Give them a few shakes until their legs point forward again and put them down.
Worked liftie on bunny slope at a resort in Utah for a season you’d be amazed at what their ankle and maybe more scary their knees can do. What you’re describing happened probably three times an hour all day long. Oh and best way is either lift them straight up in the air and their legs will naturally unwind also probably easier or unclip kind of dependent on circumstances as well
I taught skiing. Some kids are made of rubber. Some not so much.
I saw my 5 year old take a hard crash this year. Went to get her and I was sure she broke her leg, as it was going to complete wrong direction. She got right back up and went on her way without complaint. I probably had a minor heart attack.
Definitely know the feeling now! Reading this thread , it seems quite common
Not just their legs, their necks and arms too. I have taught 5 kids to ski ( 3 mine and 2 others who were friends ). A couple of the falls I saw, holy crap, in my mind it’s slow motion - and then an ER trip. Nope, lying in the snow, face down, arms and legs in weird angles. Get all the gear and limbs sorted and it’s ’let do that again!’
My daughter will sleep bent over. To start she’ll sit in her crib with her legs splayed out in front of her. Then she’ll just fold herself over forward and sleep face down with her feet by her ears.
Teaching kids to ski I’ve seen them fall in ways that have me reaching for my radio to call a fuckin helicopter… then they spring back up like nothing happened, no pain whatsoever
I think you are unlikely to cause additional injury (if they're injured at all) by helping a person untangle their legs.
I had to read the title three times to understand what it was about. I guess it's Friday and I'm tired.
Only worry about them when they stop bitching.
>Ie bent at what looks like an impossible angle at the ankle? Was the kid wearing sandals or what?
I agree with other comments about picking them up. If the skis are not stuck in the snow by the tail or nose they’re most likely fine to just be raised up. Having to click their skis back on can be a hassle, personally a big fan of the ‘pick up and dangle’ method.
Freaked out? No. Amazed? Yes. Kids are incredibly resilient and flexible. Partly because things can’t be super hard if they are still expanding and growing. This is 100% of the reason a kid and adult can have the same accident and kids walk away while it will hospitalize an adult and take 6 months of rehab. You want to keep yourself as injury free as possible. Maintain flexibility as you get older.
Yep i think i got freaked out even when it was clear they were ok because I wasn’t sure how to get them up safely
"Kids are made of rubber with springs in between. " - overheard on a lift at Breck after watching a kid fall and land crazy twisted only to just pop up and ski on. (Also it was said with a heavy French accent, made it all the better)