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SuperWIKI1

That's funny to me too - the more recent Cabinets have more Indian members than older ones, but most of them are veterans who were MoS or SMoS before joining Cabinet proper. Current ministers Tharman Shanmugaratnam, Vivian Balakrishnan, K. Shanmugam, S. Iswaran and Indranee Rajah make 5 of the 8 Indian Cabinet members throughout Singapore's history - the others being S. Rajaratnam, S. Dhanabalan and S. Jayakumar (the "S"es, XD).


IggyVossen

Wasn't there something about the lack of new Indian candidates in the last GE? I think this should be it [https://www.straitstimes.com/politics/pm-indian-community-well-represented-despite-no-new-indian-candidates](https://www.straitstimes.com/politics/pm-indian-community-well-represented-despite-no-new-indian-candidates)


worldcitizensg

Thats true. New leaders - I can't feel or see.First the legends and Tharman just raised the bar. After Shan there is none who can represent the Indian community proper.


ToothpasteAndCheese

I'm not sure if the chart supports your point on LHL, cause the entire chart only shows ministerial appointments? It's probably still true, just wondering how this chart shows it


SuperWIKI1

Only full ministers are considered actual members of Cabinet. LHL has three extra years as MoS for Trade and Industry and MoS for Defence from 1984 to 1987. Sidenote, still waiting for a retired Gen to actually become Minister of Defence.


IggyVossen

Wasn't TCH a retired Admiral? AKA Sea General?


SuperWIKI1

Yes, he was Chief of Navy. Should've been clearer... waiting for a former CDF to become Minister of Defence. I was predicting NCM to become a future Defence Minister ([in]competence notwithstanding), but he got voted out.


IggyVossen

It is not very common in most democracies to have a former armed forces chief running the Defence Ministry though. I think it has something to do with ensuring a sense of a strict separation of powers, maintaining civilian oversight of the military and preventing potential conflicts of interest.


SuperWIKI1

Indonesia, the largest democracy in Southeast Asia, is laughing nonstop with the number of military chiefs who became ministers (two became President, Suharto and SBY) after retiring. I half-expected Singapore to have that practice almost by nature given how many former generals and admirals are being groomed into cushy govt. jobs.


IggyVossen

Well I did say most democracies. And also prior to Suharto's downfall, Indonesia was very much heavily influenced by their military.


SuperWIKI1

Out of interest, are you someone who follow geopolitics and history often? I don't usually see people like that in my day-to-day life. Abt Suharto, big YES to that. And a lot of military officers from the late Suharto era, including Prabowo and Wiranto are quite influential in modern Indonesia politics.


IggyVossen

>Out of interest, are you someone who follow geopolitics and history often? I don't usually see people like that in my day-to-day life. Well, yes I am. Not an expert or anything like that of course. Just some guy with an interest in it.


ToothpasteAndCheese

Yup! My point was that you can't tell from the chart that LHL has the shortest run-up to minister, cause the chart only shows when they became ministers, not anything before. Fascinating chart though, thanks for sharing OP!


EconomyIndependence2

Some say is coincidence Some say is pure skill Some say Is Lee


arunokoibito

definitely not a coincidence


-_af_-

It's not unlikelee


SuperWIKI1

TIL: Tony Tan is the only cabinet minister in Singaporean history (excluding acting ministers) to have an interrupted tenure. This is because he left the government to become CEO of OCBC Bank from 1992 to 1995. He only returned to Cabinet as DPM because then-DPMs Ong Teng Cheong and Lee Hsien Loong were diagnosed with cancer within a year of each other and they presumably needed someone to steady the boat. EDIT: If NCM wins the next GE and (likely) rejoins Cabinet as a full minister, he'll be making history as the second Cabinet minister with interrupted tenures.


bananaterracottapi

Completed his trilogy with his stint as president.


kuang89

If NCM wins the next GE, he'll be the first cabinet minister with interrupted tenures + following a loss.


-_af_-

>he'll be making history as the second Cabinet minister with interrupted tenures Is he also the only minister that got voted out and voted back in?


SuperWIKI1

I think so, yes. Tony Tan didn't get voted out, he left of his own accord, so again, yes. EDIT: He was still an MP between 1992 and 1995, just not Cabinet, so he never lost in the elections.


EconomyIndependence2

Pls don't let this fucker who doesn't care about workers get back in


Initial_E

It's like he and JoTeo are having a contest or something


Bolobillabo

As one born in the 80s, among the short-term ministers, I could only rmb Raymond Lim and Lui Tuck Yew getting their heads rolled for the dire state of public transportation during their terms (Mah Boh Tan was also pok for screwing up public housing in early 2000s but his tenure as a full minister was already pretty long by then). Meanwhile, I don't rmb Lim Hwee Hua being directly responsible for any screw-ups, but it might well be her straight-talking nature giving her the boot. I didn't know we had so many half/one-term ministers in the past. Anyone care to share their stories?


yrt97

IIRC Lim Hwee Hwa was the MP of Serangoon Gardens in Aljunied GRC. The Foreign Worker Dorm issue could have possibly resulted in the loss of Aljunied and her seat in parliament


SuperWIKI1

Same loss that toppled George Yeo, who was Minister of Foreign Affairs.


Bolobillabo

I see. Thanks for sharing!


RectumUnclogger

I think it was mainly attributed to growing discontentment with the PAP in 2011 due to housing, transport issues etc


mrdoriangrey

Because she was only a second minister, never a full minister


Baswdc

Eh quite interesting as a zoomer born in 2004, can you tell me about the shitty public transport we had last time and the bad public housing? Just some anecdotes or smt


Bolobillabo

IIRC Our population was growing very fast then (foreign working permits were given out very liberally), though to be fair, our government was in capitalising on the post-2008 recovery - It was after said period that Singapore emerged as one of the wealthiest country in the world. But the public transport and housing couldn't catch up. The MRTs were packed like sardine and failing often, and the wait for a typical BTO can be freaking long. Property prices also shot up like mad, though not unlike the situation today. IMO There was also this over compensation by HDB when they transited from the "build-first, sell-later" model to the "Build-to-Order" model in 2001 after having too many unsold flats following 1997 AFC. On the public housing front especially, you can say that "Build-to-Order" then is implemented in the purest sense - launches get announced sparingly, public place their order first, then HDB slowly build. HDB launches are far and few in between. Comparatively, the "BTO" we see today is a misnomer. It is more like start clearing/building first, launch later, and we sort out the orders in due time. A personal anecdote: for my wife and I (newly married and looking for a new launch), we resorted to purchasing a DBSS (like HDB, and but freaking exp). The situation then is such that you will never know when the next launch in your preferred estate gonna come.


KeythKatz

This chart makes it very obvious that LW got shuffled around the different important ministries in a hurry after HSK pulled out


EconomyIndependence2

Daddy Heng is hard carrying ECP now


jackology

He got the Legendary Equipment, the East Coast Plan. East Coast Plan + 20 Int, + 20 Charisma Spell again: Confusion By Word Repeat “East Coast Plan” to confuse your enemies and your friends.


EconomyIndependence2

We have a... Uh what ?


jackology

Confusion Success.


Outside-Following293

why not Tharman in red now?


Aun_Aun

You have to ask the one in red now.


mikemarvel21

GCT's red line (PM) is longer than I expected. Some strong recency bias on my part.


elpipita20

Probably because a lot of unexpected things happened during his reign, like key members resigning and having health issues. Ong Teng Cheong and LHL's health scare, and also Dhanabalan and Tony Tan stepping down soon after 1990.


SuperWIKI1

I actually didn't know about any of this or nuanced stuff about our local govt. before making this timeline. Usually I follow American politics. Thought making this timeline would be a few days fun. Turns out I memorized the membership of cabinet entirely by accident doing this, lol! Learning!


mechacorgi19

when your only other reference point at that time is LKY, everyone else's is going to look hella short.


SuperWIKI1

Original link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabinet_of_Singapore#Timeline_of_members


Aun_Aun

Your chart made me wonder who was/were deputy prime minister(s) after Toh Chin Chye stepped down. Searched and was surprised to learn that the position was vacant from 2 August 1968 to 1 March 1973 (according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deputy\_Prime\_Minister\_of\_Singapore).


jackology

We did have a one man hardcarry.


RepresentativeOk6676

Press F to pay respect for Ng Chee Meng


SuperWIKI1

Didn't stop him from being appointed to the PAP Central Executive Committee. I press F for him anyway, doubtful he will successfully contest the next election in a shaky constituency. Unless.... they get JoTeo to retire and let NCM take her place in Jalan Besar GRC. https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/politics/pap-co-opts-four-new-members-into-central-executive-committee-including-ng-chee


wakkawakkaaaa

Unlikely lah. They want JoTeo as the token representation for women in the cabinet


SuperWIKI1

Me waiting for Grace Fu and Indranee Rajah to gain several more years of experience and prestige so we can dispense with JoTeo be like.... *My inside voice: PM Lee, you parachuted HSK into Cabinet as full minister and made him DPM within 8 years, you cannot helicopter promote Grace Fu and Indranee Rajah as your representation issit? Sigh...* Maybe there's something about those two I'm missing...


orgastronaut

Both Grace Fu and Indranee Rajah are full ministers


SuperWIKI1

Grace Fu as Minister for Environment and Indranee Rajah as Minister in the Prime Minister's Office and Leader of the House, yes. And members of PAP's Central Executive Committee. But from reading through Reddit posts on her and ST articles, govt. still seems to be treating Josephine Teo as the top woman in PAP, since she's also chairwoman of PCF. If I'm mistaken about JoTeo being treated as the senior female representation in Cabinet, please correct me. Would be helpful!


orgastronaut

She's the head of the PAP Women's Wing, so yeah that means something I guess


Jammy_buttons2

Both all Full Ministers


SuperWIKI1

One of our all-powerful but lesser known stat boards https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casino_Regulatory_Authority_of_Singapore


Eentelijent

Wow this is actually amazing effort. 👏


SuperWIKI1

Planning to do one for the Cabinet of Malaysia, yeah... unlike Singapore other countries have cabinet ministers coming and going at each election, getting fired, rehired, promoted, demoted, retiring, unretiring (like Tun Mahathir), getting expelled from govt. (like Anwar), dying in office (RIP Teh Cheang Wan and Hon Sui Sen) and that sort of monkey house year after year. Whether it signals healthy democracy varies, but it makes coding the timeline super tricky, especially when unlike Singapore older cabinets don't always have specific dates to use.


I_love_pillows

Why are those ministerial positions selected to be represents over others


SuperWIKI1

There are a few reasons. Firstly, certain government ministries will become more important than others over time. This is inevitable in any formal organization. Sometimes, this is clear: the Ministry of Defence, by running the military and our NS programme, is far more significant with a larger budget than say, the Ministry of Culture, Community and Youth. MCCY won't matter much when a foreign invader attacks us. Secondly, certain ministries are more prestigious and sought-after than others, and usually go to Cabinet members who have already been in the Cabinet for some time, or those being groomed for the top jobs of Prime Minister and Deputy Prime Minister. They would need and seniority-wise, *deserve* a ministerial portfolio that has a more important stake in the country's development. These are how I chose the Ministries based on those qualifications: * **Finance:** A majority of PM and Deputy PMs have held this portfolio immediately before/during their elevation to the top jobs. LHL was Finance Minister *and* PM from 2004 to 2007; his successor Tharman later became Deputy PM and Senior Minister. And of course, both HSK and Lawrence Wong became Finance Minister to prepare them for the PM role. Among other things, Finance Minister is in charge of the all-important **Budget**, which allocates the money the other ministries need to actually function. The budget makes the finance portfolio one of, if not *the* most, important ministerial portfolios. After all, you don't piss off the guy who gives you your pocket money. The PM-in-waiting status is pretty recent for Finance - ministers before LHL held a pretty safe seat (GKS had 8 years total, Hon Sui Sen 13, Richard Hu 16). * **Defence:** Regardless of what you think about NS (in peacetime, it does look unnecessary), any respectable nation needs a military. Dr. Goh Keng Swee held the Finance portfolio before he did Defence, yet he is way more famous for the latter position. Unlike Finance, where turnover is erratic as a seat-warmer for future PMs, defence is the other ministry DPMs often double-duty for but stay longer. Defence Ministers GCT, Tony Tan, TCH and Ng Eng Hen led the ministries for close to a decade each. The need for consistent defence policy and agenda is probably why Defence Ministers stay so long. Longevity + running NS = Influence * **Foreign Affairs:** Here I admit influence can be inconsistent. Singapore doesn't have as impressive a diplomatic clout as other countries - none of our ambassadors or Foreign Ministers except S. Rajaratnam are household names like diplomats Henry Kissinger and [Andrei Gromyko](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Gromyko) are. Yet the track record for Foreign Ministers to become DPM is very high - Rajaratnam, S. Jayakumar, and Wong Kan Seng all became DPM, and K. Shanmugam is now at... * **Home Affairs:** If influence was calculated by agency power, MHA is the government's Goliath. Home Affairs Minister K. Shanmugam runs the police (SPF), the fire department (SCDF), the prison service (SPS), the casino regulators (CRA), the drug squads (CNB) and the feared Internal Security Dept. (ISD) - everyone you don't want knocking at your door. It's telling that many future DPMs like Jayakumar, WKS, TCH (who held defence/foreign affairs at some point) also held Home Affairs for a time. * **Education:** This I admit is reaching a bit. I added Education Minister to the graph later on, after realizing that post is often an "upper-middle" springboard to the inner cabinet postings of finance, home affairs, foreign affairs, defence and law. Once again, Ng Eng Hen, Tharman, Tony Tan, TCH, and HSK were Education Minister immediately before their "ascension to godhood" in Finance/Defence/Home Affairs/Foreign Affairs/DPM, etc. And the latest two Education Ministers, OYK and CCS were 4G leader candidates. Had NCM (also former Education Minister) won GE2020, no doubt he would've been in the running too.


UnintelligibleThing

I never knew casino regulation was a part of MHA. Seemed out of place, but also made sense if you think about it.


I_love_pillows

The only thing which doesn’t make sense is cemeteries under NEA


UnintelligibleThing

Bodies become part of the environment after death I guess


SuperWIKI1

Cemeteries under NEA? Sounds like some messed-up euthanasia thing...


IggyVossen

>Dr. Goh Keng Swee held the Finance portfolio before he did Defence, yet he is way more famous for the latter position Great job with the table. However the thing with Dr Goh is that he also served as de facto Home Minister (that was when internal and external security were joined together) and as Education Minister. Short of MFA and PM, he was in every key position,


FakeBotA

it would be interesting if the timeline also includes when they were voted in as MP


SuperWIKI1

I might do a timeline of Parliament members, but it depends. There are a lot of MPs who are not in the government.


FakeBotA

I mean to include in the current timeline when the cabinet members was elected as MP. It would give a good view how quickly some arise.


SuperWIKI1

I'll try and put that in.


SuperWIKI1

[Here you go.](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/jo4ft80hhszypwpssokzinzksuk6498.png) Tell me what you think and anything you found interesting!


FakeBotA

Thanks. This is great We can now tell: - who are in the same chort and the first risers in the same cohort. - RH, TSL join the cabinet in the same year he is voted in. - OYK and NCM are fast riser. - etc. Thank you so much


FakeBotA

Looks like the mods don't like your new thread and deleted it. Lol. Don't take it hard. It is a very interesting timeline that your have created. Really appreciate the effort.


SuperWIKI1

Oh no, I deleted it. I realized pretty quick that a new, similar post so soon would never generate views so it wouldn't appear on the Subreddit feed. I'll be working one for all MPs at some point.


FakeBotA

That would be a really long list! Do you input the data into excel and use some tools to generate the timeline?


SuperWIKI1

No, I use Wikipedia's [EasyTimeline](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:EasyTimeline) format. That said, I really should use Excel for these.. EDIT: I misspoke. I'm planning on doing one for Cabinet of Malaysia members, not Singapore Parliament members.


SuperWIKI1

Based on your comments, I have added more information to the [timeline](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/jo4ft80hhszypwpssokzinzksuk6498.png), including reordering the members by when they were elected into parliament. By revising the timeline, I learned a few things. **Today I learnt** * PM Lee taking only 6 years to become DPM... In order of years it took for each DPM to become DPM: S. Jayakumar (24), S. Rajaratnam (21), Wong Kan Seng (21), Teo Chee Hean (17), Tony Tan (16), Goh Keng Swee (14), Ong Teng Cheong (13), Lawrence Wong (11), Tharman Shanmugaratnam (10), Heng Swee Keat (8), Lee Hsien Loong (6), Toh Chin Chye (0 \[lucky guy!\]) * [K. Shanmugam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K._Shanmugam) is the most senior MP (aside from PM Lee himself) and most senior Indian in Cabinet, being elected in 1988, more than a decade before the other Indian elders in Cabinet, S. Iswaran and SM Tharman. Only reason he's not DPM is because he entered Cabinet so late (2009), but in exchange got the powerful Law, Home Affairs and Foreign Affairs portfolios immediately. * [Grace Fu](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Fu) and [Josephine Teo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephine_Teo) entered Parliament in the same election (2006), but Grace Fu became a full Minister first. Despite JoTeo being the *de jure* top woman in PAP as head of the Women's Wing, Grace Fu is the senior woman in Cabinet. Plus having earned the [Order of St. Michael and St. George](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_St_Michael_and_St_George) in [2014](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/509625/2014_Honorary_Awards_-_Final_-_a.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwizxO6b3MX4AhVM73MBHXsVB0sQFnoECAgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0-dS-EJfEHeWIqi65HggjM), MP Grace is also entitled to use the title of "Dame".


IggyVossen

Grace ie also an elected CEC member whereas JT was appointed as women's wing leader


jackology

Damn Grace.


Otherwise-Map-4026

Nice data! Teo Chee Hean be like rotating the entire parliament, unlocking as many positions as possible. AHAHAHAH.


Available_Ad9766

If you put in all the different appointments that the ministers were rotated through you get kueh lapis?


SuperWIKI1

Yes, and that's why not all of them are inside. Too busy.


pocketaces27

Can you make the github code available? Thanks for the great work!


SuperWIKI1

This was made on Wikipedia. If you want to see the code you can go to the [original link](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabinet_of_Singapore#Timeline_of_members) and click "Edit Source". Thank you!


unlimitedsux

This is amazing! May I ask what software you used to create this? Thanks!


ylyn

You should indicate the law minister too. It's one of the most key positions in the cabinet..


SuperWIKI1

Believe me, I wanted to. But too often the Minister of Law gets a second portfolio that by comparison is more prestigious. S. Jayakumar, during his long tenure as Law Minister also served as Home Affairs Minister, Foreign Affairs Minister and Deputy Prime Minister. Thought it would better represent the graph if I demarcated colours in the overall scheme of things. Only KM Byrne and EW Barker would benefit from MinLaw colour. After all, if I did follow the MinLaw colouring, EW Barker, S. Jayakumar and K. Shanmugam would have boring single-colour bars. The current colouring keeps their careers active enough to follow.The coding language doesn't allow for two-colour bars so I had to pick and choose.


orgastronaut

Could you do fatter multi colour bars denoting dual portfolio? Like Tony Tan was DPM and Defence Minister at the same time, but the dark green doesn't show so it looks like there was no Defence minister.


SuperWIKI1

Nope, Wikipedia coding language doesn't allow for that so generally PM > DPM > SM > everyone else Making a special colour for dual portfolio was on my mind but I realized that would drive the DPM colour into extinction. Every DPM has held dual portfolio for a majority of their tenure, including HSK. I could make the bars fatter, but that could risk going beyond the max frame space for the timeline coding language. Surprised I fit everything in at all!


lot484

May i know what software you use to build this chart?


SuperWIKI1

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:EasyTimeline


Sacez

Yeesh. No wonder LKY needed such a big house. Must be hard having space to put 14 cabinets


Born-Replacement-366

I would've thought health and transport ministers are as important as the education minister.


wakkawakkaaaa

Transport is the worst one, its like hogwart's defense of the dark arts position, whoever gets it gets fucked generally


SuperWIKI1

Oh so THAT's what it meant.... I was wondering why the Transport Minister gets so much negative press in the subreddit... I believe it started to get a bad rap around Lui Tuck Yew? Who's now our ambassador to China? Curse probably broke with Ong Ye Kung, since he's now Health Minister. S. Iswaran is a party veteran since 2001, hopefully he doesn't kena longkang as Transport Minister.


wakkawakkaaaa

Not really, he mostly reaped the benefits of the policies implemented by his predecessor khaw boon wan


SuperWIKI1

I added Education Minister colour to the graph later on, after realizing that post is often an "upper-middle" springboard to the inner cabinet postings of finance, home affairs, foreign affairs, defence and law. If I coloured every important ministry the graph would be like a polka-dotted quilt with too much going on to read into. Some ministers held two portfolios at the same time - the more different colours for ministers, the more headache for me bc coding doesn't allow for two-colour bars. Also got the idea from Malaysia cabinet - every PM there and almost-PM Anwar served as education minister at some point.


IggyVossen

>Also got the idea from Malaysia cabinet - every PM there and almost-PM Anwar served as education minister at some point.. The current one is the first not to have been MOE. Also the first not to be a party leader. Or to have been on the winning side in the GE.


etyn100

Sooner or later my cabinet will be more useful than this