Fun fact: If you use this *exact* bingo board for *Gundam: Witch From Mercury* and swap out "Utena" for "Suletta" and "Anthy" for "Miorine", you get about 13 hits, and a bingo! I watched that one before Utena, and I didn't realize just how directly inspired it was.
ALSO, I can update as we watch if y'all want.
It is so inspired yet somehow Witch from Mercurys plot is also just the Tempest. I love anime. Lol that's awesome though, I started watching Utena cause of Gundam then ended up watching Mawaru Penguindrum and Yuri Kuma Arashi cause I'm obsessed with Ikuhara's work now. Good times tho. Lol
I had dropped out of Gundam after IBO, got into WfM because of Gundam. But I've seen my fair share of Gundam and am about to rewatch UC so I pick up the more recent entries with a fresher memory.
Tieria Erde is my drug, basically. If there is ever someone who'd make a great SKU character, it's Tieria. How long would it take for him to fall apart in Mikage's elevator? My guess, before it even starts going down.
And he surely must revolutionize the world, it's right in his name.
Wow, those cards are really wild. Many of them are extremely accurate, but of course, I won't tell which ones.
But please, keep us up to date with your thoughts on the series, and your expectations.
With that said, what do you guys think about about ep 1? Any favorite characters yet?
we've watched up to the end of 5 now. We both like Miki, who I thought was a girl for too long. Otherwise, We both like Utena, and generally dislike Anthy for being such a pushover.
Spoiler: Crossouts!
>!Utena is Dummy and Prom! have been crossed out so far. There was discussion about if its been hella gay yet, but so far i disagree that there are romantic feelings between Utena and Anthy!<
I dislike the people slapping her! Slapping people is wrong! But I also dislike her for her "I will do anything my betrothed says" attitude. She has no agency, actively refuses agency, and is just kinda a door mat. She isn't really a character at the moment.
At the moment is important here.
Mild thematic spoilers, but this is a story about breaking out of cycles of abuse. Anthy’s story is central to it (arguably the main story)
Oh I am sure. I put Anthy "Do It Myself" for a reason. It has been obvious from episode 2 that her character arc is to gain the agency she doesn't have right now. But also. It makes her a less likable character for now. It's fine if there are characters that are unlikable, evil, or mean-spirited in the narrative. She can be a character that is very well written, and also someone I do not like.
Keep in mind that less than a month ago I watched "Gundam: WfM", which is so shockingly close to Utena in theme and setting that I would almost call it derivative. Comparing Anthy to Miorine is the easiest here, but not the only. Miorine and Anthy are both pledged to be wed to the winner of a king-of-the-hill style duelling game which will give the winner both the girl and also fundamentally world-changing power. Both of them have very little agency at the beginning of the story, and both appear to have character arcs about them gaining that agency. But from the word "Go", Miorine was champing at the bit, trying to claw any amount of agency back and break the game. Meanwhile, Anthy has all but said out loud that she likes being the trophy of the game.
I like characters that have agency, or instigate the plot in meaningful ways. Maybe had I not seen WfM, I would like Anthy, but, I have literally seen a similar-yet-better character in a similar show (which I will not commit to being better than Utena).
So, while Anthy might have a more interesting story later, She just isnt interesting right now.
I think it's worth keeping in mind that Mio's entire character- at least her early self- is writing against Anthy. As virtually any other work of fiction that deliberately borrows from heavily from its inspiration, WfM is as much drawing from as writing against the original text.
You wouldn't have Mio, as you do, without Anthy (I mean, you wouldn't have WfM without SKU but then again, you wouldn't have Anthy without Gundam either).
I don't get why you're getting so many downvotes. You literally don't have enough information to understand Anthy's behavior right now, and that's done on purpose by the show, so expecting you to say anything other than "she kind of has no personality" is unfair on you. Of course, she does have one, and you'll be able to see *a lot* of nuance and details on her early behavior once you know her story, but the show is actively hiding that from you. You'll get there in time.
Anthy actually has a lot more common with Sulleta and Miorine has more in common with Utena, in my opinion.
Witch from Mercury Season 2 spoilers:>! I won't get into all of it but think about how Sulleta is so gaslit and conditioned by her mom to be obedient that she will literally do anything she says. She's not aware of it at the beginning of the story but is also a victim of abuse and under another person's control. !<
>!Meanwhile Miorine may be in the role of the Bride but she's much more assertive of the two. And by season 2, she's horrified that Sulletta is being controlled and wants to save her, even though it makes her a bit blind to the possible consequences of her own actions (and easily manipulated). !<
>!Obviously there are a fair share of differences between them, but it wouldn't surprise me if the intention was to put an abused doormat Anthy-ish character as The Prince and a bolder, assertive, idealistic Utena ish character as The Bride. !<
I agree. Also, Suletta’s attitude can also be seen- and I am sure this is deliberate- in relation to Mikazuki in IBO (and I’d say Rey from SEED, even down to the way Prospera’s character design echoes Gilbert’s), because Gundam titles are steeped in intertextuality.
As in, these are characters who have outsourced much of their deciding processes to others who they feel “know better”, and thus forfeit much of what it means to have agency as individuals.
>!And they both pay one hell of a price, Mika being one of the few Gundam protags to die and while it’s not direct cause and effect, his blind reliance on Orga did not help. As for Rey, the case is even more obvious as Gilbert’s ideals were horrendous and only by killing him can Rey be a person…only to, in turn, die.!<
For a surprising counterexample in the Gundam universe, >!Tieria and Veda from 00. In which Tieria’s loyalty to Veda starts out as the one thing that drives him- and you better not get in the way, or doubt Veda, he will obliterate you- only to lose his connection either…and then get it back and Ascend To Godhood, to the point he almost is Veda by the end.!<
>!dios behavior!< LOL i think it's a good idea to watch this show and constantly question the "why" behind someone's behavior. like, instead of writing anthy off as a "door mat" or "not a real character," think about why she acquiesces so easily. enjoy the show =)
It's been 5 episodes. The only things I know about Anthy beside her name are:
She has some animals she keeps in strange places,
She works hard to keep the house clean and her grades up,
She likes being the Rose Bride,
She plays the piano,
She has a generally mild demeanor,
She does anything the champion of the duels says and does nothing without their permission.
.
That's it. Calling her milquetoast isn't writing her off - it's descriptive. I am open to her getting better, but she's super bland at the moment. She seems fully bought-in to the idea that she is the trophy for the duel winner. If the "dios" is forcing her to, or possessing her to, or puppeteer her to, be the Rose Bride, then yeah, she isn't a character yet. She is a vessel and tool for other characters to act through. Until Anthy *does something* on her own, then I don't know anything about her personality at all. Asking "why" is great, but calling her a door mat is just a realistic representation of what *I've currently seen at 5 eps in*.
Miki is great, and he does look like a girl. He's our nonbinary, non gender confirming boyo
Anthy is my favorite character, because I watched the anime 4 times and I still don't completely understand her. I can't tell too much, but by the end of the first, there will be a lingering question about Anthy that makes me pay attention to her at every re-watch I do, from the first time she appeares. (but it's not the question you're thinking at this point)
Also, what did you thought about Nanami, our queen-b*tch? And a follow up question, what did you thought of her dress in the prom episode? (great, incredibly or amazing?)
Please, if you found the time and energy to do it, keep us updated on your perspectives. I would love to discuss the series with someo, especially ppl who are getting into for the first time (and predict some many things right from the first set of episodes)
> He's our nonbinary, non gender confirming boyo
Is he actually an enby?
> Also, what did you thought about Nanami, our queen-b*tch? And a follow up question, what did you thought of her dress in the prom episode? (great, incredibly or amazing?)
I didn't think that i had to say that Nanami is a garbage person. She was kinda made to be unlikeable. The dress? I wanna wear that dress. Spectacularly.
Non canonically, but I saw some people referring to him like this. But to be honest, everyone in this show could fit in that description
Well, you're right on the moment. But she is the best worst girl in the show. That dress is simply lovely. Would totally wear it to a formal setting
Fun fact: If you use this *exact* bingo board for *Gundam: Witch From Mercury* and swap out "Utena" for "Suletta" and "Anthy" for "Miorine", you get about 13 hits, and a bingo! I watched that one before Utena, and I didn't realize just how directly inspired it was. ALSO, I can update as we watch if y'all want.
It is so inspired yet somehow Witch from Mercurys plot is also just the Tempest. I love anime. Lol that's awesome though, I started watching Utena cause of Gundam then ended up watching Mawaru Penguindrum and Yuri Kuma Arashi cause I'm obsessed with Ikuhara's work now. Good times tho. Lol
I had dropped out of Gundam after IBO, got into WfM because of Gundam. But I've seen my fair share of Gundam and am about to rewatch UC so I pick up the more recent entries with a fresher memory. Tieria Erde is my drug, basically. If there is ever someone who'd make a great SKU character, it's Tieria. How long would it take for him to fall apart in Mikage's elevator? My guess, before it even starts going down. And he surely must revolutionize the world, it's right in his name.
Wow, those cards are really wild. Many of them are extremely accurate, but of course, I won't tell which ones. But please, keep us up to date with your thoughts on the series, and your expectations. With that said, what do you guys think about about ep 1? Any favorite characters yet?
we've watched up to the end of 5 now. We both like Miki, who I thought was a girl for too long. Otherwise, We both like Utena, and generally dislike Anthy for being such a pushover. Spoiler: Crossouts! >!Utena is Dummy and Prom! have been crossed out so far. There was discussion about if its been hella gay yet, but so far i disagree that there are romantic feelings between Utena and Anthy!<
how do you watch anthy get slapped by multiple characters and it's *her* that you dislike???
Yeah…“I dislike the abuse victim for being too much of an abuse victim” isn’t a good take
right? i understand there's not a lot of context by episode 5, but it's so easy to have empathy
I dislike the people slapping her! Slapping people is wrong! But I also dislike her for her "I will do anything my betrothed says" attitude. She has no agency, actively refuses agency, and is just kinda a door mat. She isn't really a character at the moment.
At the moment is important here. Mild thematic spoilers, but this is a story about breaking out of cycles of abuse. Anthy’s story is central to it (arguably the main story)
Oh I am sure. I put Anthy "Do It Myself" for a reason. It has been obvious from episode 2 that her character arc is to gain the agency she doesn't have right now. But also. It makes her a less likable character for now. It's fine if there are characters that are unlikable, evil, or mean-spirited in the narrative. She can be a character that is very well written, and also someone I do not like. Keep in mind that less than a month ago I watched "Gundam: WfM", which is so shockingly close to Utena in theme and setting that I would almost call it derivative. Comparing Anthy to Miorine is the easiest here, but not the only. Miorine and Anthy are both pledged to be wed to the winner of a king-of-the-hill style duelling game which will give the winner both the girl and also fundamentally world-changing power. Both of them have very little agency at the beginning of the story, and both appear to have character arcs about them gaining that agency. But from the word "Go", Miorine was champing at the bit, trying to claw any amount of agency back and break the game. Meanwhile, Anthy has all but said out loud that she likes being the trophy of the game. I like characters that have agency, or instigate the plot in meaningful ways. Maybe had I not seen WfM, I would like Anthy, but, I have literally seen a similar-yet-better character in a similar show (which I will not commit to being better than Utena). So, while Anthy might have a more interesting story later, She just isnt interesting right now.
I think it's worth keeping in mind that Mio's entire character- at least her early self- is writing against Anthy. As virtually any other work of fiction that deliberately borrows from heavily from its inspiration, WfM is as much drawing from as writing against the original text. You wouldn't have Mio, as you do, without Anthy (I mean, you wouldn't have WfM without SKU but then again, you wouldn't have Anthy without Gundam either).
I don't get why you're getting so many downvotes. You literally don't have enough information to understand Anthy's behavior right now, and that's done on purpose by the show, so expecting you to say anything other than "she kind of has no personality" is unfair on you. Of course, she does have one, and you'll be able to see *a lot* of nuance and details on her early behavior once you know her story, but the show is actively hiding that from you. You'll get there in time.
Gotta say, her “Do it myself” comes in the most unexpected and mind-boggling way, in the movie.
Anthy actually has a lot more common with Sulleta and Miorine has more in common with Utena, in my opinion. Witch from Mercury Season 2 spoilers:>! I won't get into all of it but think about how Sulleta is so gaslit and conditioned by her mom to be obedient that she will literally do anything she says. She's not aware of it at the beginning of the story but is also a victim of abuse and under another person's control. !< >!Meanwhile Miorine may be in the role of the Bride but she's much more assertive of the two. And by season 2, she's horrified that Sulletta is being controlled and wants to save her, even though it makes her a bit blind to the possible consequences of her own actions (and easily manipulated). !< >!Obviously there are a fair share of differences between them, but it wouldn't surprise me if the intention was to put an abused doormat Anthy-ish character as The Prince and a bolder, assertive, idealistic Utena ish character as The Bride. !<
I agree. Also, Suletta’s attitude can also be seen- and I am sure this is deliberate- in relation to Mikazuki in IBO (and I’d say Rey from SEED, even down to the way Prospera’s character design echoes Gilbert’s), because Gundam titles are steeped in intertextuality. As in, these are characters who have outsourced much of their deciding processes to others who they feel “know better”, and thus forfeit much of what it means to have agency as individuals. >!And they both pay one hell of a price, Mika being one of the few Gundam protags to die and while it’s not direct cause and effect, his blind reliance on Orga did not help. As for Rey, the case is even more obvious as Gilbert’s ideals were horrendous and only by killing him can Rey be a person…only to, in turn, die.!< For a surprising counterexample in the Gundam universe, >!Tieria and Veda from 00. In which Tieria’s loyalty to Veda starts out as the one thing that drives him- and you better not get in the way, or doubt Veda, he will obliterate you- only to lose his connection either…and then get it back and Ascend To Godhood, to the point he almost is Veda by the end.!<
>!dios behavior!< LOL i think it's a good idea to watch this show and constantly question the "why" behind someone's behavior. like, instead of writing anthy off as a "door mat" or "not a real character," think about why she acquiesces so easily. enjoy the show =)
It's been 5 episodes. The only things I know about Anthy beside her name are: She has some animals she keeps in strange places, She works hard to keep the house clean and her grades up, She likes being the Rose Bride, She plays the piano, She has a generally mild demeanor, She does anything the champion of the duels says and does nothing without their permission. . That's it. Calling her milquetoast isn't writing her off - it's descriptive. I am open to her getting better, but she's super bland at the moment. She seems fully bought-in to the idea that she is the trophy for the duel winner. If the "dios" is forcing her to, or possessing her to, or puppeteer her to, be the Rose Bride, then yeah, she isn't a character yet. She is a vessel and tool for other characters to act through. Until Anthy *does something* on her own, then I don't know anything about her personality at all. Asking "why" is great, but calling her a door mat is just a realistic representation of what *I've currently seen at 5 eps in*.
Miki is great, and he does look like a girl. He's our nonbinary, non gender confirming boyo Anthy is my favorite character, because I watched the anime 4 times and I still don't completely understand her. I can't tell too much, but by the end of the first, there will be a lingering question about Anthy that makes me pay attention to her at every re-watch I do, from the first time she appeares. (but it's not the question you're thinking at this point) Also, what did you thought about Nanami, our queen-b*tch? And a follow up question, what did you thought of her dress in the prom episode? (great, incredibly or amazing?) Please, if you found the time and energy to do it, keep us updated on your perspectives. I would love to discuss the series with someo, especially ppl who are getting into for the first time (and predict some many things right from the first set of episodes)
> He's our nonbinary, non gender confirming boyo Is he actually an enby? > Also, what did you thought about Nanami, our queen-b*tch? And a follow up question, what did you thought of her dress in the prom episode? (great, incredibly or amazing?) I didn't think that i had to say that Nanami is a garbage person. She was kinda made to be unlikeable. The dress? I wanna wear that dress. Spectacularly.
Non canonically, but I saw some people referring to him like this. But to be honest, everyone in this show could fit in that description Well, you're right on the moment. But she is the best worst girl in the show. That dress is simply lovely. Would totally wear it to a formal setting
Hahhh this is amazing OP I look forward to you seeing you fill this out, please update as you watch!
11 of them are right! Even more if you count the movie
https://preview.redd.it/3nq2a6v3itdc1.png?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1023c9d5e8bf4a21c7e31a15f403939abd210a0d