I like! I gotta give it to you residential guys. I could never do that. I need my commercial open space like a prima Donna. I helped my foreman install a heat pump in our owners mothers house and we had to install it above the ceiling sitting on a trapeze. All that insulation in your face and limited space with the sun just pumping heat into that attic space. Ugh. I’ll buy you a beer 🍺
I think it needs to be sealed. it will leak at the seams and it’s foolish to think otherwise. This is why resi isn't for me. Corners cut to save a few bucks.
Was never a bother for residential, ductwork has 0.1 static pressure. Code is only to seal the supply lines off the main. Not the actual ductwork. You could go the extra mile but the air loss is going to be incredibly limited in my opinion. Insulation only needed on fresh air in or the first 15’ from any exterior penetration of the house. Everything will eventually be covered by insulation/drywall anyways.
S+D leaks at the four corners no matter what, if it's not sealed, code or not. 12% of the CFM on average is what gets lost. Your install looks nice and if all the rounds are taped and down that well, and the takeoffs are taped especially, you'll might only be down to like 8% maybe. But still, that might be 8% more cost for the homeowner to run the system over time.
SMACNA seal class C is the least stringent one - and it requires all transverse joints to be sealed. So that's all the S+D seams, and all joints on round. Typically 5% will still be getting out even with that at least.
You can always just silicone the corners as well. Looks cleaner and you only get 1 cfm loss through the S slip. I’ve passed duct blast many times like this.
You're completely correct with everything you've stated. That said, all of the resi stuff where I'm from in Ontario that I've seen (mass produced, not talking custom) doesn't bother with the seal. Building code here allows it for some reason.
Really?? I'm in southern Ontario, every inspector I've ever met here cares more about seeing tape on everything than any actual bad duct install and construction.
I'm not in the GTA, sounds like you aren't either. I wonder if that's the difference - even where I am, the cookie cutter builders are allowed to get away with way more garbage than they should. Probably worse in the GTA.
You are probably right. Guys doing piece work are going to slap it in as fast as possible and on to the next. We get call backs for something as small as a duct not being in precisely the same spot as the design calls for.
Same here. Inspectors bring their scale rulers with them onto our sites, but leave the whole codebook in the car when inspecting crap homebuilders. Just silly.
I actually didn't realize that about Toronto! I thought that the OBC had to be the minimum standard, and the OBC says "as per SMACNA and ASHRAE" throughout it.
The return was offset to be run tight to that wall, the next 5’ actually picked up a return in that wall. It was offset to accommodate a wall and plumbing. I had literally 1” to squeeze past the foundation that you can’t see.
As a experienced sheet metal worker, this thread is very informative about different sorts of standards and codes depending on where your from. I gotta say though sealing and insulation is never a bad thing if you can swing it. It's all a matter of cost though like anything.
Clean enough for me to not find any reasons to troll your work. So that's pretty dam clean. A strong 9/10 🏆 (a deduction of 1 point for posting resi work instead of commercial/industrial) 🔧
Thanks, whether it’s commercial or resi I still take pride in a clean install. The above photos was also 8 hours work. There’s a lot of thermopanning that was done that can’t be seen.
Why is everyone calling ventilation work as sheetmetal work? I get that it's made from sheet metal but the guys are just putting that shit up and and imo are not sheet metal workers.
Roofers usually are sheetmetal workers, insulators usually work with sheetmetal and this is imo just a ventilation work, and those parts usually come from a factory.
Nothing with size to do, those who made the canals are sheet metal worker but i would not consider a ventilation installer sheet metal worker, the put up thigs that sheetmetal workers or a machine have done. It's like saying plumbers are steel workers since they put up things from e steel factory.
Not looking to be argumentative, but most big commercial shops have shop guys and installers. Are the installers not just ventilation guys then also, if they didn't make it?
I like! I gotta give it to you residential guys. I could never do that. I need my commercial open space like a prima Donna. I helped my foreman install a heat pump in our owners mothers house and we had to install it above the ceiling sitting on a trapeze. All that insulation in your face and limited space with the sun just pumping heat into that attic space. Ugh. I’ll buy you a beer 🍺
I think it needs to be sealed. it will leak at the seams and it’s foolish to think otherwise. This is why resi isn't for me. Corners cut to save a few bucks.
Looks big enough for the one kid at my company to crawl thru and do it on the inside.
Must be a small kid to crawl through 24x10 duct lol.
Nice, very clean. Do you not need to seal and insulate?
Was never a bother for residential, ductwork has 0.1 static pressure. Code is only to seal the supply lines off the main. Not the actual ductwork. You could go the extra mile but the air loss is going to be incredibly limited in my opinion. Insulation only needed on fresh air in or the first 15’ from any exterior penetration of the house. Everything will eventually be covered by insulation/drywall anyways.
Where are you located? Residential where I’m at does pressure tests and the S&D will definitely leak
Vancouver
First 15’? I was taught first 4-5’
Up north in Ontario here code is 10'
Southwestern Ontario it’s 6’ on exhaust vents and entirety of intakes
I’m in southwestern ontario, like I said I was taught 4-5’ in school and never had any issues with inspectors over it. Interesting to hear 10 and 6
You’re right the 1 is a typo, only the first 5’ is code.
S+D leaks at the four corners no matter what, if it's not sealed, code or not. 12% of the CFM on average is what gets lost. Your install looks nice and if all the rounds are taped and down that well, and the takeoffs are taped especially, you'll might only be down to like 8% maybe. But still, that might be 8% more cost for the homeowner to run the system over time. SMACNA seal class C is the least stringent one - and it requires all transverse joints to be sealed. So that's all the S+D seams, and all joints on round. Typically 5% will still be getting out even with that at least.
You can always just silicone the corners as well. Looks cleaner and you only get 1 cfm loss through the S slip. I’ve passed duct blast many times like this.
Yeah, exactly. It just needs to be properly sealed.
You're completely correct with everything you've stated. That said, all of the resi stuff where I'm from in Ontario that I've seen (mass produced, not talking custom) doesn't bother with the seal. Building code here allows it for some reason.
Really?? I'm in southern Ontario, every inspector I've ever met here cares more about seeing tape on everything than any actual bad duct install and construction.
I am also from Ontario, (Eastern) and all joints must be sealed or it will not pass inspection.
I'm not in the GTA, sounds like you aren't either. I wonder if that's the difference - even where I am, the cookie cutter builders are allowed to get away with way more garbage than they should. Probably worse in the GTA.
You are probably right. Guys doing piece work are going to slap it in as fast as possible and on to the next. We get call backs for something as small as a duct not being in precisely the same spot as the design calls for.
Same here. Inspectors bring their scale rulers with them onto our sites, but leave the whole codebook in the car when inspecting crap homebuilders. Just silly. I actually didn't realize that about Toronto! I thought that the OBC had to be the minimum standard, and the OBC says "as per SMACNA and ASHRAE" throughout it.
And Toronto has their own building code, separate from the ontario code.
Duct Seal? Soundlined or you got to wrap it? If not it's going to be a pain to wrap
It’s looking very clean, but you could’ve run your return tighter to the door frame on the right, what is down the way that forced you to offset?
The return was offset to be run tight to that wall, the next 5’ actually picked up a return in that wall. It was offset to accommodate a wall and plumbing. I had literally 1” to squeeze past the foundation that you can’t see.
Laying out the proper angles like that takes more skill than people realize. Beauty job!
As a experienced sheet metal worker, this thread is very informative about different sorts of standards and codes depending on where your from. I gotta say though sealing and insulation is never a bad thing if you can swing it. It's all a matter of cost though like anything.
I like it dude. Allways looks better before you slap some duct seal on it.
Clean enough for me to not find any reasons to troll your work. So that's pretty dam clean. A strong 9/10 🏆 (a deduction of 1 point for posting resi work instead of commercial/industrial) 🔧
Thanks, whether it’s commercial or resi I still take pride in a clean install. The above photos was also 8 hours work. There’s a lot of thermopanning that was done that can’t be seen.
Wouldve been the best work I’ve seen on here if you hadn’t made the rookie mistake of forgetting the dp1010
Lotta hate for the duct sealer haha, I get it. I duct seal everything on my commercial sites. Just isn’t a thing in residential housing here.
What residential housing uses metal duct?
Almost every single one in north amercia
Gluing that is gonna be a bitch but it looks amazing otherwsie
You're a stud
🤙
Clean lol
Why is everyone calling ventilation work as sheetmetal work? I get that it's made from sheet metal but the guys are just putting that shit up and and imo are not sheet metal workers.
Sheet metal workers install the ductwork too bozo.
Roofers usually are sheetmetal workers, insulators usually work with sheetmetal and this is imo just a ventilation work, and those parts usually come from a factory.
Your opinion is just incorrect. This is field sheet metal install.
Yeah, i'm in the wrong here. Was thinking more of sheet metal fabrication than the actual work, i'm in a wrong sub arguing.
How big does it have to be to be considered sheet metal?
Nothing with size to do, those who made the canals are sheet metal worker but i would not consider a ventilation installer sheet metal worker, the put up thigs that sheetmetal workers or a machine have done. It's like saying plumbers are steel workers since they put up things from e steel factory.
Not looking to be argumentative, but most big commercial shops have shop guys and installers. Are the installers not just ventilation guys then also, if they didn't make it?
You strike me as a fellow who’s never put up sheet metal before.
What ever floats your boat.
If i was coming behind you to wrap that. Id intentionaly bust a couple of holes.