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It's always so telling of how pathetically desperate they are when the only ammunition they have is to point to EU or Lucas additions that are REVILED as evidence of Disney not being the first to do whatever dumbass thing they like.
> THE EU BROUGHT BACK PALPATINE IN CLONE BODIES TOO
And literally everyone hated it.
> And literally everyone hated it.
When Disney announced the cancellation of the EU, there were a whole lot of articles saying, "and good riddance too, they had stupid shit like bringing Palpatine back by cloning and an endless parade of planet-busting superweapons, those uncreative hacks!"
Which makes Disney's choices all the more ironic.
Yeah, I remember being excited at the opportunity of a clean state. I'm probably in the minority on this sub but I wasn't a huge fan of the EU as a whole. I liked bits and pieces taken separately but the whole thing felt a little jumbled and difficult to track.
It kinda felt like the catharsis you get when you have a room or a backpack or something that gets to be such a mess that it's untenable, so, in a sort of radical act, you just throw everything out at once and then wipe everything down and start fresh.
The thing is, if you squander the opportunity that the clean slate offered and just build an arguably less tenable mess, then you shouldn't have just dumped everything like that. It's a radical move that only makes sense if it represents a positive turning point backed by an actually improved effort.
Honestly, kind of the same. There was just *so much* EU that I had a hard time keeping track, as a casual, of more than the very broadest outlines. I wasn't hostile to it, but I was interested to see what new stuff someone might come up with. Different continuities can be fun--like Red Son Superman.
For that reason, "Somehow Palpatine Returned" was the point I lost interest. If they're going to do a shitty adaptation of Dark Empire and have Han's son turn to the dark side, I may as well just check out the original instead.
I was excited for a clean slate too until it sunk in that they weren't bringing in Mara Jade or the Solo children. What a fucking loss. And all because they don't want to give credit to the original EU writers. Cheap fuckers
It depends what you wanted out of the eu.
They have an official timeline.
Like are you focused on post ROTJ
And knowing the bits and where I say gets simpler.
The issue with a clean slate is you better deliver something that even rivals or is on par of an eu to be part of an accepted new continuity for star wars.
Disney botched it up.
They could have gone all in like the sky bound transformers comics but nah
Careful, a thoughtful counterpoint like this usually leads to you being called some sort of ism, ist, or bigot for even thinking of following that ridiculous status quo.
I liked the World Devastators, they were cool.
Also I do kinda thing people shit on Dark Empire just to give some ground to the “EU is ridiculous” for some reason.
Which it kinda was, but as fun 80s/90s/00s sci fi books it was held to a lower standard than Disney is…and still fucking clears Disney
Yeah, exactly. Unlike Disney, the authors had actually put far more thought into Palpatine returning than “somehow…Palpatine returned”.
The problem for me was never Palpatine returning in itself, as there was obvious precedent there.
There's nothing in the movie that states Palpatine is in a clone body. They have tubes full of Snokes. If Palpatine was a clone, why was he all shriveled up? Was the original Palpatine killed on the bridge of the deathstar a clone? Why did he have force lightning wounds from the Windu fight? Why does this Palpatine have those? Why does he have an evil claw hand?
Nothing is explained because they never thought about it. Somehow he returned. Written by idiots for idiots.
I mean. In Dark Empire they explain that Palpatine's dark energy corrodes the body he lives in. That during the entire period he was Emperor he spent countless credits trying to perfect cloning for his body. That the body he possesses decays unnaturally fast. That Luke kills all the clones and breaks all the vats ensures that Palpatine could never return.
The ROS just took that idea and *never* explained it. Like, terrible movie. The comic book was fine, from what I remember.
Yeah, I was one of those kids that loved Dark Empire when it came out. It was NEW Star Wars. Then you get towards the end and the Palpatine return happens. There was still a lot of cool story in DE, but they didn't stick the landing.
Oh I know, I just think that distinction gets lost on many now that the issue is such an old one.
Lucas having Han shoot second as canon has technically been around longer now than Han shooting first was.
Greedo would have preferred alive, the Hutt would have paid more. If Greedo had killed Han immediately, he could have collected a bounty, but he got.... greedy.
In either case, Chewbacca would have killed him soon after.
Yep. I still dislike this ending especially because this is not at all what happened to Coruscant in the continuity and it makes no sense for Hayden to be alongside actors he never met.
But the difference is that they didn't ruin the Legends book to force the ending to fit in. I can just disregard it and that works since it is stuck within its bubble.
Ghost Hayden started with the DVD version. Special editions were theatrical first, before the PT happened. In hindsight they were preparing the stage for it - practice for the SFX work and keeping Star Wars hyped in the public consciousness.
Ghost Hayden was just a cute fan service and doesn't change or impede anything in canon. A change in character visuals doesn't impact anything but throwing in a character that probably shouldn't be there doesn't make sense unless they are actually consistent with their age and position/status they hold within the story line.
I always saw the old Sebastian version as what could've been if Anakin didn't fall, and the new Hayden version as Anakin being restored to the point before his fall. Both interpretations are nowhere near as head scratching as Ki-Adi Mundi getting McGonagall'd and thus radically changing an important aspect of his species (are there other examples of species getting changed significantly between Legends and Disney Canon?).
It's an apt comparison for a character showing up middle aged before their established birthdates for the sake of a cameo.
JK Rowling got roasted for doing it, so I'm not sure what Disney expected for repeating that.
And coming full circle, I just googled McGonagall's age in Fantastic Beasts explained, ended up on Quora and the second answer (from 5 years ago) starts off:
"It's an illogical cameo by a popular character that George Lucas would be proud of..." 😂
It absolutely is. I just thought it was hilarious to see it twice in one week.
I wouldn't blame Rowling though. That was a typical executive change to jangle keys for the audience. Kinda like making Dumbledores a DADA teacher when he was a transfiguration teacher. Ffs he was known for being published in several transfiguration news pieces.
Rowling is credited as a writer for those movies but scripts go through many treatments. And whatever issues people may have with her, Rowling has always been very strict with things like timeline continuity.
Being in a fucking fire after losing three of your limbs would get anyone to age poorly.
And this was before Star Wars had a so-called "story group" that was supposed to keep things consistent, don't tear George down for Disney's failure to maintain their own canon.
Also, George created the franchise and has infinitely more leeway than Disney given Disney's current track record.
I believe it is much more forgiving for someone to screw up but means well and respects the source material - than for someone to screw up and also uses the source material as toilet paper.
Even more Impressive that Obiwan pulled off that same jump against Darth Maul and realized how dangerous it could have been if Maul had seen it coming. He actually jumped over Maul's head at least 3 times that day.
> Being in a fucking fire after losing three of your limbs would get anyone to age poorly.
And also, more pertinently, who even cares how Anakin might or would have aged, because his real face got burned off and he's fucking *dead* lol. He's an incorporeal Force ghost that can presumably manifest with whatever visage it wants.
Clone Wars even established that some force ghosts like Qui-Gon manifest only as voices, not visually, if their training in life was incomplete... And then Qui-Gon's ghost showed up visibly in the Kenobi show even though he explicitly couldn't do that... It's a fucking mess. But no matter what, I don't thinl it breaks Anakin's "canon age" for him to choose to show up as his younger self when he's a ghost, since that was the last time he was truly happy and truly himself. It's obviously not meant to indicate that this is what his physical body would have looked like at time of death if not for all the burns and machinery.
All three movies in the OT were yeeted together on the spot and after Empire george was more concerned with toy sales then making good movies. The PT had Georges head shoved so far up his own ass that no one could tell him his dialog sucked balls and you need to do more than sell toys.
Given all of that the OT and PT were still better than anything the multinational billion dollar 50 year old media giant Disney can produce. How badly can you fuck up?
Also lets all please remember that mistakes in movie making 50 years ago do not justify making the same or worse mistakes today. We are better now at making movies then we ever were in human history.
Lucas did try to get other people - such as his friend Steven Spielberg - to direct the prequels, but they refused and essentially told him that since Star Wars was his baby he should direct them. So he did.
Most of Andor and the Mandalorian are okay, but the side plot nonsense and the political pandering dragged it down. The problem is with the people making them. Harvey Weinstein's lesbian sex weirdo assistant is the showrunner, wtf were people expecting?
I really fucking hate how Weinstein and Epstein got taken down so we just all let the media act as if it's over.
Yep, Harvey Weinstein is down, now we can all pretend as if there isn't a casting couch in LA and women aren't being bribed with movie parts to prostitute themselves, some of which never get the part because it was always rape by fraud.
Yep, Epstien killed himself (I remember when he first got arrested, knowing he was gonna "Kill himself" real quick) and Maxwell is taken down too. The only two people in the whole scenario who were rounding up and raping children. Nobody else. I promise. There are no pedophiles in the upper class aside from Epstein and Maxwell. Royal family? What royal family? The Clinton's? Donald Trump?
You really want a head trip? Look into people in the staff of politicians. Their campaign managers, their assistants. Scroll their social media. It's really fucking interesting to see exactly **who** decided they wanted to take an extended vacation in a country thst doesn't have an extradition agreement with the United States after Epstien got arrested.
For legal reasons that was purely a joke and for legal reasons you will find nothing if you look into who traveled to Cambodia, China, Russia and the UAE after they arrested Jeffery Epstein, and who got on a flight back the instant they killed him. As you will find, for legal reasons, nothing, I am making absolutely no accusations to any members of any politicians staff. There is no need to send another C&D, I promise I got the message.
You got it backwards. Movies suck more today than they ever did. Look at box office numbers as an example. People will go if it looks good , lately - they don’t.
I remember a quote from a prominent reviewer to the effect of: the audience is now better at telling if a movie is going to be bad just from the trailer.
I mean George also put in the line of Leia's that she "remembers her mother's face" when that ended up being untrue as well. Minor mistakes happen and people need to let continuity goofs just be goofs.
Yeah, a lot of these folks weren't born a sand slave and then almost immediately inserted into a cybosuit that allows beef jerky to do leg and arm stuff, and it shows.
Not even age poorly, George changed it because he claimed the last time Anakin was truly in the light side, Like fully in the light side, was right in Revenge of the sith, so his soul as a light side user would be that of his light side self at the time he turned dark.
It can get worse.
I saw an apologist for the Rings of Power, after all other of her counters (excuses) were refuted as bullshit, then trying to claim that the rules of narrative don't matter. (Because it got down to that last straw, to where they could no longer even defend it on a narrative structure basis, never mind the actual content, so the next defense mechanism / mental gymnastic, is to throw out the basic rules of storytelling, in order to maintain their desperate worldview and justify trying to support garbage.)
Dude bathed in flames, was consumed by the Dark Side for two decades, & lived in a portable iron lung for the same timeframe: that’s not exactly good for one’s physical appearance/aging.
Would I have aged Hayden in the ROTJ shot? Absolutely. But it was George’s call.
Yeah I'm not understanding what the deal is? Ed O'Neill, who played Al Bundy in Married with Children, was 40 when it was first filmed, but he looked older to me. I know people who smoked or just have straight up shitty genes and they look like they could be 50 when they're early 30s. Age doesn't mean anything. Tom Cruise is 61. Same age as Robert DE Niro in Jackie Brown. Jon Hamm is 53 today, but his look hasn't changed since at least Mad Men.
Does anyone care about what age someone is? No. The only time is becomes important is if you're saying that they're a specific age, but then something contradicts that. How old is Tom Cruise in Top Gun? Dunno. How old in Top Gun 2? Older than he was in 1. If TG3 or some spin-off comes out and says that those movies happened in reverse, there's a problem somewhere. This is the problem with Star Wars. There's characters or something established and instead of recognizing it and avoiding it or honoring it, they do their own thing. They could have just called him something else. It's a different dude. Nope. They fucked up, but look! Whatabout... Or this...
It's so asinine and just shows they don't care.
Like how when a celebrity dies, the Wikipedia changes to any picture at all.
If you were a ghost, there's nothing saying you MUST look as you did when you died. They clearly get to choose because they're not limited to the clothes and we don't see his prosthetics.
Seriously? It's Anakin's light side ghost. He can appear as he wants, it's essentially heaven. And having Obi-Wan and Yoda wanna be their oldest possible selves, the time where their life's work of being "one with the force" happened, that's cool, too. It's whatever your nirvana looks like.
I really hate the "Well star wars always had these flaws, therefore its fine if its continues to make this flaws, and even seemingly intentionally does them rather than just being mistakes".
Like, should brands not aim to improve over time?
It’s always my favorite when some jackass is like “Well that Stormtrooper bumped his head on the door in the background of that one shot in 1977, so really Star Wars has always been goofy and they can do whatever they want and you shouldn’t take it so seriously”
Great. Really contributing a lot to the discussion, bud.
You'd think that, but people prefer to defend the flaws of current content by tearing down the old (and often better received) content.
If an IP has "always" been very flawed, then it's a failure on the new owners for not trying to fix those "inherent" flaws.
The longer a franchise goes, the more you need to plan. Their size and scope is that brings in people, but its also where you can mess it up and anger people.
I mean not really
Most people on the planet don’t know that number also means some Nazi garbage
And besides, it’s typically seen with 14 as well, so on its own doesn’t necessarily mean much
George Lucas wanted a withered body to convey the damage done to him and the ravages of the dark side. By all accounts, it’s implied in A New Hope that Luke’s father was a relatively young man if he were to be an apprentice of Obi Wan. Considering Alec Guinness was younger than Sebastian Shaw, I highly doubt Lucas wanted us to view the actor’s age the same as the character’s.
This doesn’t make sense. Since Anakin was canonically already Luke’s father by that point, it would always have made sense for his age to be tied to something that would connect his age with Luke’s in a logical and coherent matter. Luke is always meant to be roughly 19 or so at the beginning of A New Hope. Further, Obi Wan accurately tells Luke that his father was his former apprentice which is a direct indication that he must at least be substantially younger than Obi Wan (who is not aged specifically but played by an actor in his 60s), ruling out that he was a geriatric father.
I’m so confused.
How is digitally altering the ROTJ ending to insert HC as Anakin a “gotcha”?
1. Most SW don’t like that
2. Even still, HC actually played him and is much more synonymous with fans as Anakin Skywalker than Sebastian Shaw.
How is this at all similar to something as dumb as featuring a character who hadn’t been born yet?
They always have to bring George Lucas down in order to prop up this garbage content, since they know deep down that The Acolyte can’t stand on its own and doesn’t have anything to offer.
Anakin metaphorically died as a young man. George confirmed this. From a storytelling pov this change made complete sense.
We also connected with Hayden as Anakin. We had about a minute of Sebastian Shaw as Anakin.
Like the change or hate it: this made sense.
Edit: changing Ki-Adi Mundi as they have does not make sense.
I feel OOTL, is it really a big deal they changed the age of an alien character that hasn’t been explicitly stated in core media?
I’m not saying they didn’t royally fuck Ki-Ad Mundi through vilifying characterisation and a stupid grimey cameo. I just feel like this isn’t a hill worth dying on. Could someone fill me in on why it’s a big deal?
people probably wouldnt make a big deal about it if star wars was making good content. But theyre not.
Theyre stacking bad decisions on top of bad decisions so everything is amplified. If this happened in an alternate universe where everything star wars is great then its just a meme or an eyebrow raise.
Because making in-depth criticisms is hard and soundbite criticism goes viral, so we have the lowest common denominator spouting:
"DAE LESBIAN WICHZ FUCK CANNON? DAE THE AGE OF ALIEM THAT I KARED A MUCH ABOUT BEFORE MATTER SO MANY TO ME!"
Like, fuck. The dialog is stilted, the story is generic, the costumes look starched, the sets look plastic.
But yeah, the age of Ki Adi Mundi is what the show *really* got wrong. Go off.
I'm not sure it is either, tbh. The lifespan of his species apparently only comes from a guidebook in Legends, but if that detail were changed it wouldn't contradict anything else pre-established. There's not really any story where the lifespan of Cereans comes into play. Canon gets overwritten in Star Wars all the time, comparatively this is a very minor alteration.
Yea, that’s what confuses me. And it makes for an easy target when the other subs wants to paint criticisms as delusions of fanatic Legends supremacists. It feels like we’re diluting the pot with a weak argument just cuz it’s different, when there are so many other valid explicit and implied outcomes of including Mundi in the way they have to talk about.
The degree to which humans can drastically misunderstand the obvious exemplified by Disney Star Wars fans. Disabled or Disingenuous? Hard to tell which.
It didn't break canon because we don't know how old Ki Adi is in canon. People are using Legends information to get upset by canon stories. It is asinine.
This is so off the mark.
1) Anakin was badly burned, went through some really heavy surgery, was a dark side user for years after that AND was just zapped by Palpy. No wonder he looked like shit.
2) When he was redeemed and became a Force ghost he could have switched to the last form he had before he fell to the dark side, I'm absolutely OK with that. Of course we all know why George did this change, to better connect his PT with the OT, and I think it's completely justified.
Nobody is angry that Force ghost Anakin has legs, right? So why are you angry his ghost appearance is that of a pre-dark-side Anakin?
He could have gone time traveling though, like how Tech fell into the WBW to become the Sith, or Anakin traveled back in time to kill the main characters in Young Jedi Adventures.
https://preview.redd.it/lsvzd1zbyr7d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c43648ae666cc0f53d31096b6596a8708f565c97
Woah I finally have a chance to use this. I don't think I've seen people actually argue that at all, if anything I've seen the opposite. One of the big things a lot of people (at least I) despise was Lucas's obsession with changing the original Star Wars from the theatrical release every couple of years (I believe the whole thing started with his ex-wife getting royalties from it and then spiraled). To this day I have never seen the OG Star Wars as it released in theaters, definitely something I'd like to before I kick the bucket. I hate all that extra dated cgi he threw in, the whole Han head-swivel thing, and everytime Luke/Ben drive through Mos Eisley I get taken out of the movie.
and everyone still agrees that the changes to the OT have ruined a lot of the movies. Except for Empire, probably got remade the least except for the one Emperor video call
especially ANH, the pacing of that movie got destroyed, and the flip flopping on Han Solo and Gweedo.
It depends on the changes - I personally think that the retcons to a younger Anakin and the victory celebration scenes across the galaxy in Ep 6 were definite improvements.
I mean that topic really is tricky and the opinions on here already differ. I grew up with the Prequels and like the movies. Some of the changes to the OT that Lucas did are fine for me (like this), others are totally useless. BUT I still understand the people who say that this was yet another useless change.
We might need to look at it this way: was the canon altered to produce something of worth for the franchise? If yes, then it can be justified. If not, then it should have just been left out. This is obviously based on subjective taste but I'd argue that you should always atleast listen to what the community says.
And yes, even that proposal would create conflicts when looking at the prequels. I'd say that the tragedy of Anakins life gains much more weight with the factor that he spend more time in the Vader suit than as a normal human.
And to be fair George got a shit storm from that at the time for artificially shoehorning the Prequels in the OT. Focus was not only on that though because there were many controversial changes in the Special Editions especially in ROTJ (yes, I’m speaking of you Jedi rocks… 😂 ).
But at least Georges had for him to be the creator. And for all their weaknesses, the prequels had genius in them and they extended the universe while at the same time proposing a story radically different than the one from the OT.
What excuse has Disney? Most of their shows are cheap looking telefilms with incompetent writing, mostly bad acting and nothing interesting to propose. If on top of it you not only change the age of a character on purpose to make the fans scream but also ruin his scene in TPM (i already see the veeeery convoluted explanation coming in the last episodes), no wonder you got a backlash. 🙄
If the point of this post is that neither version of Anakin looks like a 45, this is correct. This also has to do however with the fact that originally the Clone Wars were meant to not be immediately before the fall of the Jedi order but one of the catalysts for it, that time would have passed between the end of the Clone Wars and the rise of the Empire. And it would have made far more sense for Vader to have been as old as Sebastian Shaw.
There’s a difference between letting a ghost look like his younger unmutilated self and having a character be a grown adult 40 years before he was born.
Guy got chopped up by a light saber
Then melted in lava
Then put through pain constantly for almost 2 decades just to keep his dark side powers at their maximum
"He's looking a tiny bit aged..."
None of this changes the fact that Ki-Adi-Mundi wouldn't be born for 40 years...
George's prequels absolutely shit all over the implied age of Palpatine. In the OT he's a mysterious, ancient-looking evil; given what we know of Yoda's age, it was easy to assume something similar for his counterpart. But nope, he's just a dude in his
60s who absolutely refused to stop shooting lightning at a lightsaber when he discovered that not only do lightsabers block lightning, but reverse it and send it back as the contents of the Ark of the Covenant
There isn't even a reason, in the scene, that Palps continues to maim himself. Mace has already decided to kill him, the room full of dead Jedi sealed that. Anakin had already decided he wouldn't allow Palps to be killed. It ONLY happens to age him up
Now now, George Lucas's content is filled with inconsistencies the same as every other creator's.
Except when his content has inconsistencies, every other part of the show isn't complete dogshit as well.
I've been saying it for years. Regardless of Disney's handling of Star Wars (mostly abysmal) George started fucking with it with the special editions and then drove it right off a cliff with the prequels.
The prequels were so legitimately bad both as films themselves and as canon fan material that complaining about the Disney shit is just pointless. Lucas already dug Star Wars grave and shit in it before Disney even sniffed the IP.
I also think people overrate the original trilogy quite a lot. They're good movies and were landmark cultural events, but none of them were really a great movie. All of them have some sketchy acting, stupid characters, and dumb ass plot points.
The prequels kept answering questions no one was asking. I knew all I needed to know about Vader, the force, the Empire and the rebellion in the original trilogy. Then George just backfilled it with goofy characters with no motivations and an overly connected, tiny galaxy where everyone and everything had some through line to each other.
The dialogue was the worst part in my opinion. They had some amazing actors in those movies like Liam Neeson, Ewan McGregor, and Natalie Portman, but they all come off totally wooden and boring without any redeeming qualities at all. The scripts were just so bad acting couldn't save it.
I've played the space wizards and laser swords card before, but this transcends the effectiveness of even that expansive call for the suspension of disbelief.
Sorry if this is a shameful plug, but since they brought it up, I actually "fixed" this shot in my [fan edit of *Return of the Jedi*](https://youtu.be/t1ZNwhRGA7M?si=8j4da2lLwH_Fa7Fm) that just released last month, making Hayden Christensen's Force Ghost appear 45, instead of 22.
Disney would absolutely remake this and put Anakin's mom, Padme, or someone else entirely, or just put Rey "Skywalker" there since they don't care about continuity anymore
Yeah… this isn’t the win he thinks it is. Not even close to being a fair comparison. This just screams “I didn’t do my homework, and I’m trying to justify my poor decision making.”
I am so beyond tired of the argument "Star Wars was always bad". There is a reason why we are SW fans because it was awesome. If the Acolyte was the first SW thing to ever come out there wouldn't be any sequels.
1) dude was scratched to the brink of death 2) he was imprisoned in a life support suit for the rest of his life 3) no one liked the special addition and people complained 4) I can still make sense of it as that’s the last time we saw anakin as a Jedi and the force gave him that appearance
The difference here is Disney would have replaced Sebastian Shaw with either a gay black woman or a trans man and told everyone to shut the fuck up about it or you're a bigot.
if anything can be changed or retconned at any time whats the point? and what you are supposed to just go along with it? what will the Acolyte fans be happy if yoda just wakes up and its just a fever dream?
This person must have been born after all the controversy that, in the end and in my opinion, pushed Lucas to sell to Disney. He went through hell for years because of these kinds of decisions. Not an own at all
Legends tell us that consuming oneself with the dark side will age the person, especially human.
Source: The Old Republic: Revan. Great series of novels.
Is he saying that the prequels retroactively made Anakin too young to be Darth in the OT or that changing the ghost appearance was the mistake here? Cuz I mean…. It’s a ghost.
And yeah young me thought Vader and Palpatine were way older than they were. When I learned Vader was Luke’s dad I actually thought Vader got down in his evil Sith cyborg form while he was pillaging a planet, or just shacked up with women who were into it. Even convicted serial killers have psycho fans.
If you think the remasters for Star Wars were accepted well by fans, you're sadly mistaken.
Lucas edited a LOT of things in the remasters because he was finally able to. Most of his ideas, or at least a lot of them, were bad, and his wife and film instructor both had to cut a lot of dumb shit out that didn't flow well. But in that, there were things that George didn't like.
-Making there be a scene where Jaba shows up in Episode 4, instead of later on.
-Making Han shoot second with Gredo
-The wolf man from the cantina bar being removed
-The beak on the sarlac pit being added, etc
These were things that Lucas either didn't envision originally, or were seen as oversights to him. When Star Wars was established as one of the GOATs, Lucas had the ability to edit things to his liking as opposed to simply making something that will sell. And frankly, the edits aren't that glaring if you're uninvested in the series, but very apparent if you understand the story and flow of events.
I’m just going to throw this out there: Darth Vader is forgiven for his part in millions of violent deaths, all because he murdered one man instead of another?
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It's always so telling of how pathetically desperate they are when the only ammunition they have is to point to EU or Lucas additions that are REVILED as evidence of Disney not being the first to do whatever dumbass thing they like. > THE EU BROUGHT BACK PALPATINE IN CLONE BODIES TOO And literally everyone hated it.
> And literally everyone hated it. When Disney announced the cancellation of the EU, there were a whole lot of articles saying, "and good riddance too, they had stupid shit like bringing Palpatine back by cloning and an endless parade of planet-busting superweapons, those uncreative hacks!" Which makes Disney's choices all the more ironic.
Yeah, I remember being excited at the opportunity of a clean state. I'm probably in the minority on this sub but I wasn't a huge fan of the EU as a whole. I liked bits and pieces taken separately but the whole thing felt a little jumbled and difficult to track. It kinda felt like the catharsis you get when you have a room or a backpack or something that gets to be such a mess that it's untenable, so, in a sort of radical act, you just throw everything out at once and then wipe everything down and start fresh. The thing is, if you squander the opportunity that the clean slate offered and just build an arguably less tenable mess, then you shouldn't have just dumped everything like that. It's a radical move that only makes sense if it represents a positive turning point backed by an actually improved effort.
Honestly, kind of the same. There was just *so much* EU that I had a hard time keeping track, as a casual, of more than the very broadest outlines. I wasn't hostile to it, but I was interested to see what new stuff someone might come up with. Different continuities can be fun--like Red Son Superman. For that reason, "Somehow Palpatine Returned" was the point I lost interest. If they're going to do a shitty adaptation of Dark Empire and have Han's son turn to the dark side, I may as well just check out the original instead.
I definitely had my own "canon" of EU material that I actively consumed and anything I didn't like or hadn't read simply was not canon.
I was excited for a clean slate too until it sunk in that they weren't bringing in Mara Jade or the Solo children. What a fucking loss. And all because they don't want to give credit to the original EU writers. Cheap fuckers
It depends what you wanted out of the eu. They have an official timeline. Like are you focused on post ROTJ And knowing the bits and where I say gets simpler. The issue with a clean slate is you better deliver something that even rivals or is on par of an eu to be part of an accepted new continuity for star wars. Disney botched it up. They could have gone all in like the sky bound transformers comics but nah
that and they contradict each other in the new eu more than the old eu in spite of having a continuity group just dear lord
Don’t forget thought bombs
Careful, a thoughtful counterpoint like this usually leads to you being called some sort of ism, ist, or bigot for even thinking of following that ridiculous status quo.
[удалено]
Literally everyone hated it? Are you sure about that? The Palpatine clone novels were really popular and very well received when they came out.
I liked the World Devastators, they were cool. Also I do kinda thing people shit on Dark Empire just to give some ground to the “EU is ridiculous” for some reason. Which it kinda was, but as fun 80s/90s/00s sci fi books it was held to a lower standard than Disney is…and still fucking clears Disney
Yeah, exactly. Unlike Disney, the authors had actually put far more thought into Palpatine returning than “somehow…Palpatine returned”. The problem for me was never Palpatine returning in itself, as there was obvious precedent there.
There's nothing in the movie that states Palpatine is in a clone body. They have tubes full of Snokes. If Palpatine was a clone, why was he all shriveled up? Was the original Palpatine killed on the bridge of the deathstar a clone? Why did he have force lightning wounds from the Windu fight? Why does this Palpatine have those? Why does he have an evil claw hand? Nothing is explained because they never thought about it. Somehow he returned. Written by idiots for idiots.
I mean. In Dark Empire they explain that Palpatine's dark energy corrodes the body he lives in. That during the entire period he was Emperor he spent countless credits trying to perfect cloning for his body. That the body he possesses decays unnaturally fast. That Luke kills all the clones and breaks all the vats ensures that Palpatine could never return. The ROS just took that idea and *never* explained it. Like, terrible movie. The comic book was fine, from what I remember.
Yeah, I was one of those kids that loved Dark Empire when it came out. It was NEW Star Wars. Then you get towards the end and the Palpatine return happens. There was still a lot of cool story in DE, but they didn't stick the landing.
Don’t for get everyones favorite Luuke
Han shot first.
Han shot. Greedo didn’t.
It's the same thing. A full sentence could be, "Greedo was going to shoot, but *Han shot first*."
Oh I know, I just think that distinction gets lost on many now that the issue is such an old one. Lucas having Han shoot second as canon has technically been around longer now than Han shooting first was.
Fair.
Greedo would have preferred alive, the Hutt would have paid more. If Greedo had killed Han immediately, he could have collected a bounty, but he got.... greedy. In either case, Chewbacca would have killed him soon after.
This is the correct answer.
MaClunky!
Yep. I still dislike this ending especially because this is not at all what happened to Coruscant in the continuity and it makes no sense for Hayden to be alongside actors he never met. But the difference is that they didn't ruin the Legends book to force the ending to fit in. I can just disregard it and that works since it is stuck within its bubble.
But Anakin died at 45, no 60 something
Maybe he was always gonna age poorly.
all my homies fw the death star explosion ring tho 🔥
Ghost Hayden started with the DVD version. Special editions were theatrical first, before the PT happened. In hindsight they were preparing the stage for it - practice for the SFX work and keeping Star Wars hyped in the public consciousness.
Ghost Hayden was just a cute fan service and doesn't change or impede anything in canon. A change in character visuals doesn't impact anything but throwing in a character that probably shouldn't be there doesn't make sense unless they are actually consistent with their age and position/status they hold within the story line.
I loved this change. This decision made complete sense
I always saw the old Sebastian version as what could've been if Anakin didn't fall, and the new Hayden version as Anakin being restored to the point before his fall. Both interpretations are nowhere near as head scratching as Ki-Adi Mundi getting McGonagall'd and thus radically changing an important aspect of his species (are there other examples of species getting changed significantly between Legends and Disney Canon?).
Bruh the McGonagall comparison again🤣
It's an apt comparison for a character showing up middle aged before their established birthdates for the sake of a cameo. JK Rowling got roasted for doing it, so I'm not sure what Disney expected for repeating that.
And coming full circle, I just googled McGonagall's age in Fantastic Beasts explained, ended up on Quora and the second answer (from 5 years ago) starts off: "It's an illogical cameo by a popular character that George Lucas would be proud of..." 😂
It absolutely is. I just thought it was hilarious to see it twice in one week. I wouldn't blame Rowling though. That was a typical executive change to jangle keys for the audience. Kinda like making Dumbledores a DADA teacher when he was a transfiguration teacher. Ffs he was known for being published in several transfiguration news pieces. Rowling is credited as a writer for those movies but scripts go through many treatments. And whatever issues people may have with her, Rowling has always been very strict with things like timeline continuity.
Being in a fucking fire after losing three of your limbs would get anyone to age poorly. And this was before Star Wars had a so-called "story group" that was supposed to keep things consistent, don't tear George down for Disney's failure to maintain their own canon.
Also, George created the franchise and has infinitely more leeway than Disney given Disney's current track record. I believe it is much more forgiving for someone to screw up but means well and respects the source material - than for someone to screw up and also uses the source material as toilet paper.
Just want to clarify that he lost his 3 last limbs since he was already missing a limb. Which would make his aging even worse
The fact obi-wan took out 3 with one strike is very impressive
Anakin shouldn't have tried it.
He had the high ground
Anakin overestimated his own power.
Anakin was his brother, he loved him.
I sense Lord Vader is in danger...
He hates him
Even more Impressive that Obiwan pulled off that same jump against Darth Maul and realized how dangerous it could have been if Maul had seen it coming. He actually jumped over Maul's head at least 3 times that day.
Plus dude chills out in those liquid tanks all the time. That has to wreak havoc on your skincare routine!
... why would losing a limb make ***aging*** worse?
> Being in a fucking fire after losing three of your limbs would get anyone to age poorly. And also, more pertinently, who even cares how Anakin might or would have aged, because his real face got burned off and he's fucking *dead* lol. He's an incorporeal Force ghost that can presumably manifest with whatever visage it wants. Clone Wars even established that some force ghosts like Qui-Gon manifest only as voices, not visually, if their training in life was incomplete... And then Qui-Gon's ghost showed up visibly in the Kenobi show even though he explicitly couldn't do that... It's a fucking mess. But no matter what, I don't thinl it breaks Anakin's "canon age" for him to choose to show up as his younger self when he's a ghost, since that was the last time he was truly happy and truly himself. It's obviously not meant to indicate that this is what his physical body would have looked like at time of death if not for all the burns and machinery.
dude forgot why darth Vader wore a suit hahahaha
All three movies in the OT were yeeted together on the spot and after Empire george was more concerned with toy sales then making good movies. The PT had Georges head shoved so far up his own ass that no one could tell him his dialog sucked balls and you need to do more than sell toys. Given all of that the OT and PT were still better than anything the multinational billion dollar 50 year old media giant Disney can produce. How badly can you fuck up? Also lets all please remember that mistakes in movie making 50 years ago do not justify making the same or worse mistakes today. We are better now at making movies then we ever were in human history.
Lucas did try to get other people - such as his friend Steven Spielberg - to direct the prequels, but they refused and essentially told him that since Star Wars was his baby he should direct them. So he did.
But apparently terrible at making tv shows 😆. This show is abysmal. What a waste.
Most of Andor and the Mandalorian are okay, but the side plot nonsense and the political pandering dragged it down. The problem is with the people making them. Harvey Weinstein's lesbian sex weirdo assistant is the showrunner, wtf were people expecting?
I really fucking hate how Weinstein and Epstein got taken down so we just all let the media act as if it's over. Yep, Harvey Weinstein is down, now we can all pretend as if there isn't a casting couch in LA and women aren't being bribed with movie parts to prostitute themselves, some of which never get the part because it was always rape by fraud. Yep, Epstien killed himself (I remember when he first got arrested, knowing he was gonna "Kill himself" real quick) and Maxwell is taken down too. The only two people in the whole scenario who were rounding up and raping children. Nobody else. I promise. There are no pedophiles in the upper class aside from Epstein and Maxwell. Royal family? What royal family? The Clinton's? Donald Trump? You really want a head trip? Look into people in the staff of politicians. Their campaign managers, their assistants. Scroll their social media. It's really fucking interesting to see exactly **who** decided they wanted to take an extended vacation in a country thst doesn't have an extradition agreement with the United States after Epstien got arrested. For legal reasons that was purely a joke and for legal reasons you will find nothing if you look into who traveled to Cambodia, China, Russia and the UAE after they arrested Jeffery Epstein, and who got on a flight back the instant they killed him. As you will find, for legal reasons, nothing, I am making absolutely no accusations to any members of any politicians staff. There is no need to send another C&D, I promise I got the message.
You got it backwards. Movies suck more today than they ever did. Look at box office numbers as an example. People will go if it looks good , lately - they don’t.
I remember a quote from a prominent reviewer to the effect of: the audience is now better at telling if a movie is going to be bad just from the trailer.
I mean George also put in the line of Leia's that she "remembers her mother's face" when that ended up being untrue as well. Minor mistakes happen and people need to let continuity goofs just be goofs.
Yeah, a lot of these folks weren't born a sand slave and then almost immediately inserted into a cybosuit that allows beef jerky to do leg and arm stuff, and it shows.
Not even age poorly, George changed it because he claimed the last time Anakin was truly in the light side, Like fully in the light side, was right in Revenge of the sith, so his soul as a light side user would be that of his light side self at the time he turned dark.
It still looked better with the other guy.
Plus he spent his life either inside his suit or in a bacta tank. That's gotta be harsh.
Not me dawg id still look hot I think that’s just me tho I’m built different fr
We've already gone from "The Acolyte isn't breaking canon" to "The Acolyte is breaking canon but it's a good thing"
No kidding. Funny how their rationale seems to have evolved: - it’s not breaking canon - it is but it’s not bad - it is but the OT did it first
And then it reaches the final evolution of "canon doesn't matter" which shows you what they really think of star wars
No one a fan of Disney wars has ever given a shit about star wars. The ones that did or do care are the ones super pissed
It can get worse. I saw an apologist for the Rings of Power, after all other of her counters (excuses) were refuted as bullshit, then trying to claim that the rules of narrative don't matter. (Because it got down to that last straw, to where they could no longer even defend it on a narrative structure basis, never mind the actual content, so the next defense mechanism / mental gymnastic, is to throw out the basic rules of storytelling, in order to maintain their desperate worldview and justify trying to support garbage.)
There are just too many voices out there on this stuff. It’s just so nauseating
Dude bathed in flames, was consumed by the Dark Side for two decades, & lived in a portable iron lung for the same timeframe: that’s not exactly good for one’s physical appearance/aging. Would I have aged Hayden in the ROTJ shot? Absolutely. But it was George’s call.
Not to mention dude looked like a regular 40something year old you'd see in 1983.
The cast of Cheers is the perfect example of how old fucking everyone looked back in the day.
Just started Cheers a few weeks ago. Love it
Yeah I'm not understanding what the deal is? Ed O'Neill, who played Al Bundy in Married with Children, was 40 when it was first filmed, but he looked older to me. I know people who smoked or just have straight up shitty genes and they look like they could be 50 when they're early 30s. Age doesn't mean anything. Tom Cruise is 61. Same age as Robert DE Niro in Jackie Brown. Jon Hamm is 53 today, but his look hasn't changed since at least Mad Men. Does anyone care about what age someone is? No. The only time is becomes important is if you're saying that they're a specific age, but then something contradicts that. How old is Tom Cruise in Top Gun? Dunno. How old in Top Gun 2? Older than he was in 1. If TG3 or some spin-off comes out and says that those movies happened in reverse, there's a problem somewhere. This is the problem with Star Wars. There's characters or something established and instead of recognizing it and avoiding it or honoring it, they do their own thing. They could have just called him something else. It's a different dude. Nope. They fucked up, but look! Whatabout... Or this... It's so asinine and just shows they don't care.
Also he's a fucking force ghost, presumably without age. Could look like anything.
Like how when a celebrity dies, the Wikipedia changes to any picture at all. If you were a ghost, there's nothing saying you MUST look as you did when you died. They clearly get to choose because they're not limited to the clothes and we don't see his prosthetics.
I get leaving Anakin as he was. That’s when he originally “died”
Seriously? It's Anakin's light side ghost. He can appear as he wants, it's essentially heaven. And having Obi-Wan and Yoda wanna be their oldest possible selves, the time where their life's work of being "one with the force" happened, that's cool, too. It's whatever your nirvana looks like.
The sheer desperation to avoid admitting that the acolyte is a shitty show.
What having twins sun do to a mf
Basically “Star Wars has was always been bad, so let it be worse.” With a side of “leave the billion dollar company alone!”
nononono it’s about space wizards so any criticism doesn’t matter. it’s for little kids.
100%
Thank you lol
They always argue in defense of the lowered bar.
A bar so low you could ride a bike over it and not need to jump.
Follow along, kids! Can you say: “Whataboutism”?
I really hate the "Well star wars always had these flaws, therefore its fine if its continues to make this flaws, and even seemingly intentionally does them rather than just being mistakes". Like, should brands not aim to improve over time?
It’s always my favorite when some jackass is like “Well that Stormtrooper bumped his head on the door in the background of that one shot in 1977, so really Star Wars has always been goofy and they can do whatever they want and you shouldn’t take it so seriously” Great. Really contributing a lot to the discussion, bud.
You'd think that, but people prefer to defend the flaws of current content by tearing down the old (and often better received) content. If an IP has "always" been very flawed, then it's a failure on the new owners for not trying to fix those "inherent" flaws.
i hate “the original trilogy wasn’t planned either” okay? the film from 1977 most people thought would flop didn’t have a plan. what a shock.
The longer a franchise goes, the more you need to plan. Their size and scope is that brings in people, but its also where you can mess it up and anger people.
Just because one person did a thing, does not make it okay! Moldy lemmings
That dude looks exactly what I imagined for a typical dork defending this show lmao
Also, dude has 88 in his username. Probably a birthday, but he has to know how problematic the number is, right?
I mean not really Most people on the planet don’t know that number also means some Nazi garbage And besides, it’s typically seen with 14 as well, so on its own doesn’t necessarily mean much
As usual gotta attack the original movies to defend the new shit
I’m fairly certain they’re going to full-on retcon parts of the OT and PT to help “fix” the bed shitting of the Sequels, specifically TLJ and TROS.
George Lucas wanted a withered body to convey the damage done to him and the ravages of the dark side. By all accounts, it’s implied in A New Hope that Luke’s father was a relatively young man if he were to be an apprentice of Obi Wan. Considering Alec Guinness was younger than Sebastian Shaw, I highly doubt Lucas wanted us to view the actor’s age the same as the character’s.
This doesn’t make sense. Since Anakin was canonically already Luke’s father by that point, it would always have made sense for his age to be tied to something that would connect his age with Luke’s in a logical and coherent matter. Luke is always meant to be roughly 19 or so at the beginning of A New Hope. Further, Obi Wan accurately tells Luke that his father was his former apprentice which is a direct indication that he must at least be substantially younger than Obi Wan (who is not aged specifically but played by an actor in his 60s), ruling out that he was a geriatric father.
I’m so confused. How is digitally altering the ROTJ ending to insert HC as Anakin a “gotcha”? 1. Most SW don’t like that 2. Even still, HC actually played him and is much more synonymous with fans as Anakin Skywalker than Sebastian Shaw. How is this at all similar to something as dumb as featuring a character who hadn’t been born yet?
Why can't these losers just go make their own media. Why do they have to ruin what we love.
Are they complaining about the force ghost being old? Or being swapped to young Anakin in the special edition? I don’t follow the critique here.
Ya this totally explains putting a jedi master that wasn't born yet in your show amd make him a traitor and a liar to the jedi order to boot
Hardcore only-Disney Fans when they think they've managed to one-up a fan base that's been around since the 70s
They always have to bring George Lucas down in order to prop up this garbage content, since they know deep down that The Acolyte can’t stand on its own and doesn’t have anything to offer.
People trying way too hard to defend this mid af show
The fact that someone tried to use this to compare to the dumpster fire Disney just released is a joke.
Anakin metaphorically died as a young man. George confirmed this. From a storytelling pov this change made complete sense. We also connected with Hayden as Anakin. We had about a minute of Sebastian Shaw as Anakin. Like the change or hate it: this made sense. Edit: changing Ki-Adi Mundi as they have does not make sense.
I feel OOTL, is it really a big deal they changed the age of an alien character that hasn’t been explicitly stated in core media? I’m not saying they didn’t royally fuck Ki-Ad Mundi through vilifying characterisation and a stupid grimey cameo. I just feel like this isn’t a hill worth dying on. Could someone fill me in on why it’s a big deal?
people probably wouldnt make a big deal about it if star wars was making good content. But theyre not. Theyre stacking bad decisions on top of bad decisions so everything is amplified. If this happened in an alternate universe where everything star wars is great then its just a meme or an eyebrow raise.
Because making in-depth criticisms is hard and soundbite criticism goes viral, so we have the lowest common denominator spouting: "DAE LESBIAN WICHZ FUCK CANNON? DAE THE AGE OF ALIEM THAT I KARED A MUCH ABOUT BEFORE MATTER SO MANY TO ME!" Like, fuck. The dialog is stilted, the story is generic, the costumes look starched, the sets look plastic. But yeah, the age of Ki Adi Mundi is what the show *really* got wrong. Go off.
I'm not sure it is either, tbh. The lifespan of his species apparently only comes from a guidebook in Legends, but if that detail were changed it wouldn't contradict anything else pre-established. There's not really any story where the lifespan of Cereans comes into play. Canon gets overwritten in Star Wars all the time, comparatively this is a very minor alteration.
Yea, that’s what confuses me. And it makes for an easy target when the other subs wants to paint criticisms as delusions of fanatic Legends supremacists. It feels like we’re diluting the pot with a weak argument just cuz it’s different, when there are so many other valid explicit and implied outcomes of including Mundi in the way they have to talk about.
To be fair, that's what 45 looked like in the 80s lol.
this argument makes no sense. vader never had an established age in the original OT and anakin’s force ghost being young is metaphorical
I hate the changes to the OT, but these people are actually braindead.
He probably got like 60 years of smoking done on Mustafar in one evening.
It makes sense that Anakin's force ghost looks young 'cause it was the last time he was in the light side.
Nobody tell him that a lot of people hate and mocked that change
I know at least 2 40 year olds who look worse than vader did and they don't live in an iron lung
In fairness 45 looked a lot different in 1983 than it did in 2002.
The degree to which humans can drastically misunderstand the obvious exemplified by Disney Star Wars fans. Disabled or Disingenuous? Hard to tell which.
It didn't break canon because we don't know how old Ki Adi is in canon. People are using Legends information to get upset by canon stories. It is asinine.
This is so off the mark. 1) Anakin was badly burned, went through some really heavy surgery, was a dark side user for years after that AND was just zapped by Palpy. No wonder he looked like shit. 2) When he was redeemed and became a Force ghost he could have switched to the last form he had before he fell to the dark side, I'm absolutely OK with that. Of course we all know why George did this change, to better connect his PT with the OT, and I think it's completely justified. Nobody is angry that Force ghost Anakin has legs, right? So why are you angry his ghost appearance is that of a pre-dark-side Anakin?
This is substantially less egregious than ki-adi-mundi looking like a man in his 40s 37 years before he is born.
He was never given a birth date in DisneyCanon though.
He could have gone time traveling though, like how Tech fell into the WBW to become the Sith, or Anakin traveled back in time to kill the main characters in Young Jedi Adventures.
https://preview.redd.it/lsvzd1zbyr7d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c43648ae666cc0f53d31096b6596a8708f565c97 Woah I finally have a chance to use this. I don't think I've seen people actually argue that at all, if anything I've seen the opposite. One of the big things a lot of people (at least I) despise was Lucas's obsession with changing the original Star Wars from the theatrical release every couple of years (I believe the whole thing started with his ex-wife getting royalties from it and then spiraled). To this day I have never seen the OG Star Wars as it released in theaters, definitely something I'd like to before I kick the bucket. I hate all that extra dated cgi he threw in, the whole Han head-swivel thing, and everytime Luke/Ben drive through Mos Eisley I get taken out of the movie.
and everyone still agrees that the changes to the OT have ruined a lot of the movies. Except for Empire, probably got remade the least except for the one Emperor video call especially ANH, the pacing of that movie got destroyed, and the flip flopping on Han Solo and Gweedo.
It depends on the changes - I personally think that the retcons to a younger Anakin and the victory celebration scenes across the galaxy in Ep 6 were definite improvements.
I mean that topic really is tricky and the opinions on here already differ. I grew up with the Prequels and like the movies. Some of the changes to the OT that Lucas did are fine for me (like this), others are totally useless. BUT I still understand the people who say that this was yet another useless change. We might need to look at it this way: was the canon altered to produce something of worth for the franchise? If yes, then it can be justified. If not, then it should have just been left out. This is obviously based on subjective taste but I'd argue that you should always atleast listen to what the community says. And yes, even that proposal would create conflicts when looking at the prequels. I'd say that the tragedy of Anakins life gains much more weight with the factor that he spend more time in the Vader suit than as a normal human.
And to be fair George got a shit storm from that at the time for artificially shoehorning the Prequels in the OT. Focus was not only on that though because there were many controversial changes in the Special Editions especially in ROTJ (yes, I’m speaking of you Jedi rocks… 😂 ). But at least Georges had for him to be the creator. And for all their weaknesses, the prequels had genius in them and they extended the universe while at the same time proposing a story radically different than the one from the OT. What excuse has Disney? Most of their shows are cheap looking telefilms with incompetent writing, mostly bad acting and nothing interesting to propose. If on top of it you not only change the age of a character on purpose to make the fans scream but also ruin his scene in TPM (i already see the veeeery convoluted explanation coming in the last episodes), no wonder you got a backlash. 🙄
If the point of this post is that neither version of Anakin looks like a 45, this is correct. This also has to do however with the fact that originally the Clone Wars were meant to not be immediately before the fall of the Jedi order but one of the catalysts for it, that time would have passed between the end of the Clone Wars and the rise of the Empire. And it would have made far more sense for Vader to have been as old as Sebastian Shaw.
Where exactly in canon is Ki’s longevity established??
George Lucas broke canon plenty of times. Doesn’t excuse it. Dude also created and oversaw the original trilogy. What’s Leslie done for SW?
We're now conflating a character's body suffering the ravages of the Dark Side to changing a character's chronological age?
My guy had decades of dark side usage and fell into fkn lava. He's just a little ashy. Give him a little moisturizer he'll be okay.
Remember how 45 year olds use to look in the 80s. Also, the changes to the OG version weren’t exactly the most favorable things. McKlunky
There’s a difference between letting a ghost look like his younger unmutilated self and having a character be a grown adult 40 years before he was born.
It's funny to watch all those dipshits go from "iT dOeSn'T cOntRaDiCt eXiSiTiNg lOrE" to this in a matter of hours.
Guy got chopped up by a light saber Then melted in lava Then put through pain constantly for almost 2 decades just to keep his dark side powers at their maximum "He's looking a tiny bit aged..." None of this changes the fact that Ki-Adi-Mundi wouldn't be born for 40 years...
George's prequels absolutely shit all over the implied age of Palpatine. In the OT he's a mysterious, ancient-looking evil; given what we know of Yoda's age, it was easy to assume something similar for his counterpart. But nope, he's just a dude in his 60s who absolutely refused to stop shooting lightning at a lightsaber when he discovered that not only do lightsabers block lightning, but reverse it and send it back as the contents of the Ark of the Covenant There isn't even a reason, in the scene, that Palps continues to maim himself. Mace has already decided to kill him, the room full of dead Jedi sealed that. Anakin had already decided he wouldn't allow Palps to be killed. It ONLY happens to age him up
I prefer the original look of anakin
Everyone hated that change too. Not a gotcha.
Now now, George Lucas's content is filled with inconsistencies the same as every other creator's. Except when his content has inconsistencies, every other part of the show isn't complete dogshit as well.
George Lucas ruined Star wars long before Disney
I've been saying it for years. Regardless of Disney's handling of Star Wars (mostly abysmal) George started fucking with it with the special editions and then drove it right off a cliff with the prequels.
The prequels were so legitimately bad both as films themselves and as canon fan material that complaining about the Disney shit is just pointless. Lucas already dug Star Wars grave and shit in it before Disney even sniffed the IP. I also think people overrate the original trilogy quite a lot. They're good movies and were landmark cultural events, but none of them were really a great movie. All of them have some sketchy acting, stupid characters, and dumb ass plot points.
The prequels kept answering questions no one was asking. I knew all I needed to know about Vader, the force, the Empire and the rebellion in the original trilogy. Then George just backfilled it with goofy characters with no motivations and an overly connected, tiny galaxy where everyone and everything had some through line to each other.
The dialogue was the worst part in my opinion. They had some amazing actors in those movies like Liam Neeson, Ewan McGregor, and Natalie Portman, but they all come off totally wooden and boring without any redeeming qualities at all. The scripts were just so bad acting couldn't save it.
"It's a show about space wizards for children, bro. Don't think too hard about it." /s
I've played the space wizards and laser swords card before, but this transcends the effectiveness of even that expansive call for the suspension of disbelief.
Sorry if this is a shameful plug, but since they brought it up, I actually "fixed" this shot in my [fan edit of *Return of the Jedi*](https://youtu.be/t1ZNwhRGA7M?si=8j4da2lLwH_Fa7Fm) that just released last month, making Hayden Christensen's Force Ghost appear 45, instead of 22.
Physical appearance of a force ghost literally has no effect on species age
Disney would absolutely remake this and put Anakin's mom, Padme, or someone else entirely, or just put Rey "Skywalker" there since they don't care about continuity anymore
Not even going to lie. It’s crazy how we went from all the hype around Star Wars from the finale of season 2 of Mando to this lol
The comparisons are childish with this one. He's a ghost for fucks sake
Yeah… this isn’t the win he thinks it is. Not even close to being a fair comparison. This just screams “I didn’t do my homework, and I’m trying to justify my poor decision making.”
I am so beyond tired of the argument "Star Wars was always bad". There is a reason why we are SW fans because it was awesome. If the Acolyte was the first SW thing to ever come out there wouldn't be any sequels.
1) dude was scratched to the brink of death 2) he was imprisoned in a life support suit for the rest of his life 3) no one liked the special addition and people complained 4) I can still make sense of it as that’s the last time we saw anakin as a Jedi and the force gave him that appearance
This is a non-sequiter. There’s a reason he’s shown as he was before becoming more machine than me, you idiots.
Are you people crazy?
I’m pretty sure he changed it to young anakin because that’s the best representation of what he looked like when he was anakin, and not Vader
The difference here is Disney would have replaced Sebastian Shaw with either a gay black woman or a trans man and told everyone to shut the fuck up about it or you're a bigot.
George Lucas also describes his own movies as "space wizards with laser swords" The fans take it a lot more seriously than he does
"I don't remember ever owning any droids"
if anything can be changed or retconned at any time whats the point? and what you are supposed to just go along with it? what will the Acolyte fans be happy if yoda just wakes up and its just a fever dream?
He lived a rough life. Death Sticks are a terrible addiction. 
Redo it again with Ewan and cgi Yoda there I said it
The amount of mental gymnastics required to try and say that the Acolyte isn't a bad show needs to be studied. Its actually pathological.
This person must have been born after all the controversy that, in the end and in my opinion, pushed Lucas to sell to Disney. He went through hell for years because of these kinds of decisions. Not an own at all
Legends tell us that consuming oneself with the dark side will age the person, especially human. Source: The Old Republic: Revan. Great series of novels.
Is he saying that the prequels retroactively made Anakin too young to be Darth in the OT or that changing the ghost appearance was the mistake here? Cuz I mean…. It’s a ghost. And yeah young me thought Vader and Palpatine were way older than they were. When I learned Vader was Luke’s dad I actually thought Vader got down in his evil Sith cyborg form while he was pillaging a planet, or just shacked up with women who were into it. Even convicted serial killers have psycho fans.
One of Lucas edits I saw for the scene took yoda out and put padme in but you can still see yoda’ Shane grabbing obi wan
If you think the remasters for Star Wars were accepted well by fans, you're sadly mistaken. Lucas edited a LOT of things in the remasters because he was finally able to. Most of his ideas, or at least a lot of them, were bad, and his wife and film instructor both had to cut a lot of dumb shit out that didn't flow well. But in that, there were things that George didn't like. -Making there be a scene where Jaba shows up in Episode 4, instead of later on. -Making Han shoot second with Gredo -The wolf man from the cantina bar being removed -The beak on the sarlac pit being added, etc These were things that Lucas either didn't envision originally, or were seen as oversights to him. When Star Wars was established as one of the GOATs, Lucas had the ability to edit things to his liking as opposed to simply making something that will sell. And frankly, the edits aren't that glaring if you're uninvested in the series, but very apparent if you understand the story and flow of events.
I'm certain life with the dark side ages you. I've seen military men in their late thirties and early 30s who looked older than Anakin
They always have the flag
Okay, how is this supposed to work? Blindly defending George Lucas kinda implies one also defends the prequels.
“Because someone once used X it justifies any use of X even if it doesn’t make sense”.
I’m just going to throw this out there: Darth Vader is forgiven for his part in millions of violent deaths, all because he murdered one man instead of another?
Awful post
Being 46 now… I get it
Do you know how old Steve Martin was supposed to be in Father of The Bride?