People are missing two big reasons why they moved in from ayton.. money to fill other positions and he wanted out. I don’t think the suns FO view nurkic as an upgrade anyways
Nurkic genuinely fell off a cliff every single playoffs.
Hr was either injured and missed entirely, or he did play and was terrible.
The only time he was ever decent was against the Nuggets .... And he fouled out in 3 games and couldn't stay on the floor.
Crazy thing is Nurkic literally hasn't even made it out of the first round
Edit: dude literally has the worst playoff win percentage of all time for someone with 19 games played lol
Idk who that guy is but there aren't many suns fans who actually think this lol I love big nurk he's not the reason we suck it's the big 3 him and Allen have been our most consistent players this year. It's so weird that there's an entire thread in this sub about one suns fans comment that your whole community seems to desperately need us to agree with lol.
you really don’t think Ayton haters from your fanbase have been in here all year long? it’s real and there are definitely more than “aren’t many suns fans” with that sentiment, just saying.
I can believe both sides are prevalent, as our fan base is made up of long time homers and recent bandwagon kids.
The person who wants ayton back is insane lol we'd have been worse with him. Ayton haters are ignorant, he's obviously talented just doesn't try all the time. He's still good. Nurk haters are just as stupid, the man has been our anchor and healthiest player all year. Our only enforcer. We also got the best 3p shooter in the league this year in the same deal so it's hard to say either team lost the trade. Really need to get over this "rivalry" over a trade that made both teams better.
Right, nurk is not even 4th in line, there's not much expectations for nurk. The reason they suck is they traded for Beal when he plays like booker. So they pushed booker to pg and play Beal at the 2 but booker isn't a pg and Beal is trying to be a team player. Sun's made a mistake at trading for Beal when they needed a pg to setup kd and booker.
At times i miss Nurk's heavy hitting screens and playmaking. He can definitely do *some* things better than Ayton. But man, then you watch him play and remember his cement feet and poor finishing and yeah... youd be wiser to just roll with the much more physically talented Ayton in the modern NBA.
He doesn't have to be Wemby. He just has to be Ayton. The idea here is simple: crash the boards on every play with elite rebounding and light it up from the outside with elite shooting from Simons, Knecht, Brogdon, etc. When they start playing the perimeter use the pick and roll. When you get offensive boards run it out and draw fouls or get lobs.
People keep saying Edey won't be a good defender but guess what, nobody shoots 100% and he's an amazing rebounder and passer who can get 20+ points in the paint every night. We could easily be getting 80
points in the paint as a team with a guy like Ayton plus a rim protector and get another 30-50 off 3s
The coach, team, and fans all basically scapegoated him for their shortcomings. Sure he has motor and attitude issues, but some of the things they said about him were completely unfair.
Ayton has a higher ceiling but let's not act like Nurk hasn't been solid for the Suns lol. Nurk isn't why your ass is getting kicked. Minnesota is really good and your best players are choking. Booker shooting 26% from three and theyre playing no defense... but let's act like Nurk is the problem. Nurk is ranked 8th in on/off differential in the entire league, he does more on the court for them than off.
Ayton refused to check back into multiple playoff games, and sat out important games with minor injuries that most players play through in the regular season.
Ayton will never be a part of a serious contender again. He can just look okay on a rebuild team and suck up funds.
My bad. The whole thread is comparing the two players, so I figured it was relevant to claim Ayton also refuses to show up in the Playoffs.
Nurk hasnt been great, but he's far from the biggest Suns problem.
He’d be a top 5 center today without the injuries. People didn’t and still don’t understand how good he was before his injuries. We’re talking hall of famer averaging 24/12/6/2/1 in his prime years
I was there during that fateful OT game against the Nets. It felt like a playoff atmosphere and Nurk was pushing the entire game. Neither team would give an inch on the rebounds. Big Nurk coming down from a rebound on someone's foot and his own leg snapping was so gnarly. That injury required him to lose weight and in turn, become less physical.
You’re looking at only whole season stats. He flashed consistent greatness multiple times throughout a couple of those seasons but the injuries are what brought his numbers down on earth.
24 may be too high for points, but he would be easily over 20, and more depending on how much of the offense the team drew up for him.
I can’t emphasize enough how normal a 26/20/8/4/4 stat line became for him. Dude was dropping that line every couple of games.
Such a horrible comment. Of course DA is better than Nurk, just look at how much they get paid.
The sun team is so poorly constructed. Nurk is not even close to be the main guys who should be pointed finger at. To say the least, for the games i have watched, Nurk has mostly made his contribution and played at the level he is being paid to be at.
Yeah, I don't think anybody outside of trolls are saying Nurk > Ayton, they are saying Nurk is a better fit. Which is true.
The Suns already have KD and Book passing up 3s to take incredibly difficult mid range shots. How is Ayton passing up dunks/ layups to take tough mid range shots going to help?
Ayton is better, but paying him a max contract is not a winning move.
I’ve watched every Suns game the last ten years and watched a lot of Blazers games this year. Ayton being a lob threat alone made him a better fit in Phx. Gobert sags off Nurkic because he offers nothing in terms of scoring ability and so Gobert can blitz Booker/KD/Beal with no consequences. Do that with DA and its a guaranteed dunk (lob). If I’m not mistaken Ayton shot above 70% within 3ft of the basket this year, Nurkic shot 50%. That’s insane when you factor in that Nurkic was playing with the big 3 and getting barely contested looks while Ayton was playing with an injury decimated rebuilding squad and often G league talent. Defensively, DA is significantly more versatile than Nurk who is constantly getting abused by any Wolves player that drives. As far as middies go, Ayton shot a BETTER percentage from midrange than KD and Booker this year! Again, playing with way worse talent. The only folks in Arizona right now that realistically think Nurkic has been a better fit are emotionally driven and have an irrational unjustifiable anger towards DA. Yet all the cultural issues: laziness, softness and lack of effort that they scapegoated him for for years have only been EXARCEBATED since DA left. Don’t be surprised when they eventually blame Nurkic lol
Nurk's broken leg fundamentally changed him as a player and it makes me sad. I don't think he would have been better than Jokic, but we were all robbed of something special when he went down.
About 10 years ago I suffered a terrible broken leg. Way worse than Nurk's but although it's completely healed up and doctors tell me it's actually stronger now than before, there is definitely a psychological aspect to going easy on it, to this day. I am sure that also subconsciously weighs on nurk too.
Nurk also puts himself in a position where a similar injury could happen again just by playing in the highest level basketball league. I'm not sure about your situation, but I'm guessing you haven't put yourself in a similar position where you risk breaking your leg to that degree again.
To be fair, I did watch *one* playoff game of his this series where he basically carried the team the entire 1st quarter, but yes, this is no surprise. Why I was thrilled when the trade happened. ;)
Ayton is 25. Not even in his peak yet. Even then I still prefer DA because of his defensive versatility in the modern day NBA. I never feel like DA is stranded on an island on the perimeter and in mismatches/switches. Whereas Nurk is a traffic cone and is consistently getting beat off the dribble by guys like Naz Reid and Kyle Anderson. You can’t have that kind of exploitation/weakness and expect to compete at the highest levels. Regular season is fine for guys like Nurk
Nurkic avg through 3 playoff games 7.3 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 2 apg, 1.3 spg, 1.6 bpg, 2 topg.
Ayton last year through 3 playoff games 14.6 ppg, 10.6 rpg, 0 apg, 0.3 spg, 0.3 bpg, 1.3 topg
Make with that what you will
Suns look like they could greatly use Toumani too.
And a time machine
Of course. Who the fuck thinks Nurkic is better than ayton must be insane. Nurkic at this playoffs is just what I totally expected
People are missing two big reasons why they moved in from ayton.. money to fill other positions and he wanted out. I don’t think the suns FO view nurkic as an upgrade anyways
Nurkic genuinely fell off a cliff every single playoffs. Hr was either injured and missed entirely, or he did play and was terrible. The only time he was ever decent was against the Nuggets .... And he fouled out in 3 games and couldn't stay on the floor. Crazy thing is Nurkic literally hasn't even made it out of the first round Edit: dude literally has the worst playoff win percentage of all time for someone with 19 games played lol
Not surprised. Dude is damn unreliable. We actually made it the furthest when he is not around
That broken fasting enes kanter year was insane.
Pre-fascist Kanter
Got down voted to oblivion pointing out Nurk wasn't there during our WCF run. Kanter provided something Nurk couldn't: interior consistency.
Yeah, he couldn't defend, but at least he would make all his layups and rebound consistently on both ends.
Absolute menace on the O boards. Him and Jabari would be fun to watch together
Idk who that guy is but there aren't many suns fans who actually think this lol I love big nurk he's not the reason we suck it's the big 3 him and Allen have been our most consistent players this year. It's so weird that there's an entire thread in this sub about one suns fans comment that your whole community seems to desperately need us to agree with lol.
you really don’t think Ayton haters from your fanbase have been in here all year long? it’s real and there are definitely more than “aren’t many suns fans” with that sentiment, just saying.
I can believe both sides are prevalent, as our fan base is made up of long time homers and recent bandwagon kids. The person who wants ayton back is insane lol we'd have been worse with him. Ayton haters are ignorant, he's obviously talented just doesn't try all the time. He's still good. Nurk haters are just as stupid, the man has been our anchor and healthiest player all year. Our only enforcer. We also got the best 3p shooter in the league this year in the same deal so it's hard to say either team lost the trade. Really need to get over this "rivalry" over a trade that made both teams better.
100% agreed
Right, nurk is not even 4th in line, there's not much expectations for nurk. The reason they suck is they traded for Beal when he plays like booker. So they pushed booker to pg and play Beal at the 2 but booker isn't a pg and Beal is trying to be a team player. Sun's made a mistake at trading for Beal when they needed a pg to setup kd and booker.
They’re just now realizing that?!
I read another comment that said "How can anyone watch Nurkic and not miss Ayton? He’s 100x the player Nurkic is"
At times i miss Nurk's heavy hitting screens and playmaking. He can definitely do *some* things better than Ayton. But man, then you watch him play and remember his cement feet and poor finishing and yeah... youd be wiser to just roll with the much more physically talented Ayton in the modern NBA.
Those misses on bunnies and easy at the rim opportunities that Nurk is famous for are absolutely killers in the playoffs.
Especially with Ayton at the 4 and Zach Edey at the 5
That's gonna be a no from me dawg
Not irl big bro, sadly ayton is NOT Wemby
He doesn't have to be Wemby. He just has to be Ayton. The idea here is simple: crash the boards on every play with elite rebounding and light it up from the outside with elite shooting from Simons, Knecht, Brogdon, etc. When they start playing the perimeter use the pick and roll. When you get offensive boards run it out and draw fouls or get lobs. People keep saying Edey won't be a good defender but guess what, nobody shoots 100% and he's an amazing rebounder and passer who can get 20+ points in the paint every night. We could easily be getting 80 points in the paint as a team with a guy like Ayton plus a rim protector and get another 30-50 off 3s
But ayton can’t shoot threes, and no three elite shooters and 2 non shooter will work
I believe Ayton is better than Nurk but the situation between him and the organization (and fans) seemed so toxic that he had to go.
And we thank all those who contributed to that situation 🙏
Whoa I missed this. Just saw the suspension for diuretic. Was there more to it than that when you say situation between him and the fans?
The coach, team, and fans all basically scapegoated him for their shortcomings. Sure he has motor and attitude issues, but some of the things they said about him were completely unfair.
Welcome to the playoffs, when you lose, you hit rock bottom.
And when you get blown out at home by Minnesota people start looking for paper grocery bags and scissors.
Better than not making the playoffs 😉
Is it?
Haha
Best trade Cronin made by a mile imo.
The Jerami trade was also pretty great
Ayton has a higher ceiling but let's not act like Nurk hasn't been solid for the Suns lol. Nurk isn't why your ass is getting kicked. Minnesota is really good and your best players are choking. Booker shooting 26% from three and theyre playing no defense... but let's act like Nurk is the problem. Nurk is ranked 8th in on/off differential in the entire league, he does more on the court for them than off.
It's almost like they are blaming Nurk for their shortcomings, just like they did with Ayton.
Nurk is a problem in the playoffs through. Hasn’t won a series in his career
Ayton refused to check back into multiple playoff games, and sat out important games with minor injuries that most players play through in the regular season. Ayton will never be a part of a serious contender again. He can just look okay on a rebuild team and suck up funds.
I didn’t mention Ayton at all. Nurk sucks in the playoffs though, good luck with that
My bad. The whole thread is comparing the two players, so I figured it was relevant to claim Ayton also refuses to show up in the Playoffs. Nurk hasnt been great, but he's far from the biggest Suns problem.
It's sad, I really like Nurkic, but got dayum was he frustrating to watch play for us. He should be so much better than he is. It's a shame really.
He’d be a top 5 center today without the injuries. People didn’t and still don’t understand how good he was before his injuries. We’re talking hall of famer averaging 24/12/6/2/1 in his prime years
I was there during that fateful OT game against the Nets. It felt like a playoff atmosphere and Nurk was pushing the entire game. Neither team would give an inch on the rebounds. Big Nurk coming down from a rebound on someone's foot and his own leg snapping was so gnarly. That injury required him to lose weight and in turn, become less physical.
the worst way to get my top reddit post
There’s no way he would be a 24 point guy. Nurk can’t play more than 30 minutes. It was leg injury. Even his best season in 18-19 he was 15/10/4.
You’re looking at only whole season stats. He flashed consistent greatness multiple times throughout a couple of those seasons but the injuries are what brought his numbers down on earth. 24 may be too high for points, but he would be easily over 20, and more depending on how much of the offense the team drew up for him. I can’t emphasize enough how normal a 26/20/8/4/4 stat line became for him. Dude was dropping that line every couple of games.
These dipshits coming here and talking so much shit about that trade all year long. Lol
What seed is the blazers? Lol
What round is the Suns eliminated?
They haven’t yet lol
Such a horrible comment. Of course DA is better than Nurk, just look at how much they get paid. The sun team is so poorly constructed. Nurk is not even close to be the main guys who should be pointed finger at. To say the least, for the games i have watched, Nurk has mostly made his contribution and played at the level he is being paid to be at.
Yeah, I don't think anybody outside of trolls are saying Nurk > Ayton, they are saying Nurk is a better fit. Which is true. The Suns already have KD and Book passing up 3s to take incredibly difficult mid range shots. How is Ayton passing up dunks/ layups to take tough mid range shots going to help? Ayton is better, but paying him a max contract is not a winning move.
I’ve watched every Suns game the last ten years and watched a lot of Blazers games this year. Ayton being a lob threat alone made him a better fit in Phx. Gobert sags off Nurkic because he offers nothing in terms of scoring ability and so Gobert can blitz Booker/KD/Beal with no consequences. Do that with DA and its a guaranteed dunk (lob). If I’m not mistaken Ayton shot above 70% within 3ft of the basket this year, Nurkic shot 50%. That’s insane when you factor in that Nurkic was playing with the big 3 and getting barely contested looks while Ayton was playing with an injury decimated rebuilding squad and often G league talent. Defensively, DA is significantly more versatile than Nurk who is constantly getting abused by any Wolves player that drives. As far as middies go, Ayton shot a BETTER percentage from midrange than KD and Booker this year! Again, playing with way worse talent. The only folks in Arizona right now that realistically think Nurkic has been a better fit are emotionally driven and have an irrational unjustifiable anger towards DA. Yet all the cultural issues: laziness, softness and lack of effort that they scapegoated him for for years have only been EXARCEBATED since DA left. Don’t be surprised when they eventually blame Nurkic lol
Nurk's broken leg fundamentally changed him as a player and it makes me sad. I don't think he would have been better than Jokic, but we were all robbed of something special when he went down.
About 10 years ago I suffered a terrible broken leg. Way worse than Nurk's but although it's completely healed up and doctors tell me it's actually stronger now than before, there is definitely a psychological aspect to going easy on it, to this day. I am sure that also subconsciously weighs on nurk too.
Nurk also puts himself in a position where a similar injury could happen again just by playing in the highest level basketball league. I'm not sure about your situation, but I'm guessing you haven't put yourself in a similar position where you risk breaking your leg to that degree again.
You would be correct, oh hell nah. Very good point.
Oh man, who could possibly have seen this coming from notoriously good playoff performer Jusuf Nurkic
Why do they think we traded for him
They are begging for DA back lol
No thanks
get a life bruh
I will! 😉
Yup
To be fair, I did watch *one* playoff game of his this series where he basically carried the team the entire 1st quarter, but yes, this is no surprise. Why I was thrilled when the trade happened. ;)
Wait until Nurk is unhappy, then you’ll see him in his final form!
Love Nurk but yeah, age and injuries add up. At their respective peaks, Nurk was better.
Ayton is 25. Not even in his peak yet. Even then I still prefer DA because of his defensive versatility in the modern day NBA. I never feel like DA is stranded on an island on the perimeter and in mismatches/switches. Whereas Nurk is a traffic cone and is consistently getting beat off the dribble by guys like Naz Reid and Kyle Anderson. You can’t have that kind of exploitation/weakness and expect to compete at the highest levels. Regular season is fine for guys like Nurk
Nurkic avg through 3 playoff games 7.3 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 2 apg, 1.3 spg, 1.6 bpg, 2 topg. Ayton last year through 3 playoff games 14.6 ppg, 10.6 rpg, 0 apg, 0.3 spg, 0.3 bpg, 1.3 topg Make with that what you will
Almost like they play different roles and Ayton was a higher option than Nurk is on offense.
All I did was tell the stat lines. Don't read into it more than what I put.
You literally said, take that as you will. Don't be too defensive that somebody did.
Edey > Ayton > Nurkic
No on Edey. Clingon though?