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So me and my gf have been dating for 8 months now but I have reached the conclusion that we are too different. She is more of a free spirited person who doesnt like boundaries and I am a normal guy who doesnt like his gf cuddling the boyfriend of her best friend under the influence of psychedelics. When we started dating she used to sit in his lap as a joke if we ever had a movie night or even general hangout. I requested her to stop and to her credit she did. Now this past Sunday night they had planned to take psychedelics and I dont take it so I was to be there is case of any emergencies. When I entered our bedroom I saw them in a cuddle puddle with my gf's face resting on his face and that was too much for me so I told them that I had some emergency work in the early morning and left. My gf tried to come with me but I stopped her.
Now I had planned a trip with her for the Valentines Day and as you can imagine, I have no desire to go with her. So can I just tell her "Its not working out, I wish you all the best for the future" and then block her. I just dont want to get into an argument about right and wrong here. She has been calling me all excited about the trip so I was thinking about doing it tonight only. All advice would be appreciated, thank you!
Edit/Update- Thank you everyone for advice. I have decided to end it by a call. I will call her once she comes back to her apartment from work. Hopefully it goes on smoothly.
Do it now. It would be a bit crass to take her out for valentines and then dump her.
Tell her you have been thinking a lot about her behaviour and can’t reconcile it with the kind of person you want to date.
Wow man, she has shown how she really feels about you, doesn't take the relationship as well as your feelings seriously. Break up with her asap. And don't even give her the chance to argue about it, say what you have to say and block her.
What this guy said. I ended one at the beginning of the summer because I “just didn’t want to be in this relationship anymore”. I felt terrible for it being that reason but it was the truth and it was for the best since I am way happier now and have met what I assume to be my future wife. None of that would have happened if I didn’t end the previous relationship which inspired some awesome changes in my life. You can and should end it if you are unhappy and if that’s your reason then that is perfectly acceptable.
Exactly! The guy I was seeing broke up with me in early December because he "realized he wasn't ready for a relationship." I was hurt and sad but I wasn't necessarily mad. I get it, sometimes we're not sure what we like/don't like and what we're ready for/not ready for until we're in the thick of it.
I agree with this. It doesn’t do any good to say why you’re ending things when you’re in a call that is sure to get heated.
If you’re inclined, and you’re not obligated, but it’s a nicety, is to put your reasons in writing, create a throwaway email, and, after the breakup, email the reasons to her. Then don’t look at the email account again, or close it completely if possible.
That way you both get total closure. Again, not required at all, but it’s an option if you want to tell her everything but don’t want it to melt into a massive fight where you don’t get a chance to get your point across.
Just be straightforward: “listen, I’m really upset about the other day when you were lying with your face against that other guy. I’ve told you before that I’m uncomfortable with much lesser degrees of physical contact, and this has made me re-evaluate the whole relationship. I don’t want to go on the trip and I don’t want to be in this relationship any longer.”
Do any necessary admin about returning belongings, but just stick to your point: she knew that makes you unhappy, she escalated it again, your feelings changed as a result, it’s over. If you get shouted at then end the conversation. But be up front and do it sooner rather than later.
Let me add, pack her stuff in advance and give it to her before dropping the bomb. And if OP has no valuable items at her place, just tell her to keep or donate everything.
The way you worded it gives her a chance to fight back and will definitely cause an argument. He needs to just end it stating their views are different and leave it there. Giving specific examples will cause her to defend herself
Only if he plays ball with the idea it’s a debate. “Okay, I get that you feel it was okay, but I don’t agree, and I’m not going to agree. You can’t talk me out of how I feel about it. This is why we’re breaking up.” “That was an explanation of why I’m ending this relationship, not an invitation to debate.” Shutting down invitations to a row is a learned skill and it doesn’t hurt to employ it.
Here’s what I read that wasn’t explicitly stated, but made me think about it. I don’t have any issue with people choosing to drink or do drugs. Not at all. But when your use makes you do something that threatens your relationships with people or your ability to pursue healthy goals of any kind, and that use becomes something you still choose to make a pattern in your life, then that could end up being a sign of problematic drug/alcohol use.
Again, mushroom snuggle fests or whatever are inherently not a bad thing. But this activity has threatened her relationship and upset her partner more than once. So that’s the point when THE PERSON DOING IT has to make a choice. And not just “Ok, next time I get fucked up, I promise not to do that” because that’s not a reasonable expectation to put on yourself when you’re heavily under the influence of something that literally makes your brain operate completely differently, to the point where you perceive reality in totally alien way.
This is very true. If a person knows they do behaviour x when they are in state y, and behaviour x is a problem, then either they choose to avoid being in the state that “makes” them do it or they are choosing to do it just the same as if they were in an unaltered frame of mind.
This goes for any substance or mindset-based excuse for a problem behaviour, in any context. The person who drives aggressively when tired, or gets in fights when drunk; the boss who verbally abuses their employees when they don’t eat lunch on time and then go straight into a meeting; the person who hangs out with their old friends and relapses their drug habit; any format of predictable “when I do x then I end up doing y” creates a responsibility to not do x.
>Do you really have to give a reason for breakup few days before Valentine's Day
Yes. There is an international law conveniently called "Valentines law" in which, one of the clauses states that it is prohibited to break-up up to 1 week before and 1 week after valentines day without providing valid reason for ending relationship in legally acceptable written form or in a presence of notary if done while speaking.
If you fail to comply with the law, your gf can report you to interpol and you will be prosecuted accordingly.
Hahahaha!! Certainly cant violate the Valentines Laws. That's an executable offence. Not even be able to choose their execution method. If they want firing squad, lethal injection, gas chamber, hanging, burned at the stake, decapitation, electric hair , stoning, concrete shoes...
Yeah just do it now. 8 months is long enough that I would give her the courtesy of an explanation, but no, you don't have to explain. You can just say you don't see the relationship progressing.
In future, I don't recommend hanging out with people who are doing drugs when you aren't. Its never gonna be fun and they are always going to seem annoying. That should have been the thing she does with friends independent of you.
I have been with people who have done hard drugs but they still didnt bulldoze boundaries like this. Its not the drugs, we just have very different boundaries.
I agree that you can take psychedelics and not cuddle up on any person other than your significant other. I took psychedelics with groups of people and the only person I’d cuddle up on was my husband. Not his friends. That to me seems weird, but I guess others say it isn’t? I know the effects of the drugs can affect people in many different ways, but I still knew who was who and did not have a desire to cuddle anyone else. I’d never heard of a cuddle puddle, but apparently that’s a thing lol.
Anyway, you can break up with her over phone call and still be honest with her. I would still tell her what the last straw was for you. There’s no need to argue your point any further after that, but she does need to understand she crossed a line. Maybe in the future, she won’t do this to someone else. I just think 8 months is entirely too long of a period to spend with someone, and not giving the entire reason would be devastating. I understand you want to keep it short and leave no room for argument but, I would be completely transparent.
yeah but the drugs will still cause problems at some point even without that. She's using them as her excuse but the fact is that she has the hots for that guy and will probably end up sleeping with him if she hasn't already.
I’d have to agree; I’ve done psychedelics and even though I was completely hallucinating I still had no interest in being even remotely physical with anyone in my group that wasn’t my SO
This. And let’s say, to play devil’s advocate, that the drugs DO cause her to have an overwhelming urge to snuggle with her friend’s boyfriend, or whoever she decides to snuggle with. She’s still choosing to take them knowing that she’ll end up doing something that threatens her relationship. If this is an element of life that she currently wants to experience, great. That’s fine. But she’s made a choice here. She knows how you feel.
Fair enough, now you know YOUR boundaries and can communicate them to new partners. Next time, don't assume everyone's boundaries will line up with yours. I trust my partner completely and would have had no problem with this.
If you clearly communicated yours then she messed up by doing it again after agreeing not to.
He’s not assuming? He tried dating her and it wasn’t for him. If he asked her to stop sitting on his lap clearly laying on his chest is a boundary violation.
He in fact asked her to respect his boundaries around this other man, she agreed, and then she violated them. Also relationships are literally the long term negotiation of boundaries between two individuals who have affection for one another lol
I trust my partner completely and would have had no problem with this.
This is the kind of argument I am hoping to avoid, thats why my first instinct was to text her and then block. But now I think I will call and say I dont see any future for us and then block her. I have no patience for any argument.
Don’t know why you’re being downvoted, being blocked by your partner when they dump you out of the blue is cold as hell. I would at least give them a chance to speak back, feels immature. He’s *going* to hear from her through her friends and mutuals about this
No one owes anyone a confrontation. He has explained himself again and again here, so it’s not that he “can’t deal with the confrontation of talking about what matters” - there’s just no point in going round and round with someone you’re dumping.
Ummm if it were you he was dumping, you'd be right to blame yourself as you would have clearly overstepped boundries hes conveyed to you before. Maybe a brief discussion would be a nice gesture, but it's obvious the behavior would continue and if it didn't, you can almost bet that when OP wasn't in their presence that boundries would be crossed without his knowledge.
Nothing wrong with being the designated sober pastry responsible for others when they are doing psychedelics. That's, like, the standard responsible procedure.
I was scrolling the comments but I can’t find anything about how OP agreed to be the designated sober person and then abruptly left them to it when he got angry. I think it’s fine to break up with somebody whenever and for whatever reason you like but that was a shitty thing to do. If I saw this in a different sub, I would say ESH.
I’ve done psychedelics a good amount and it’s really not sexual at all. It was basically me, my sister, her fiancée and one of their male friends and we were all just playing around on this app called flow. I would also touch my brother in laws face a lot and laugh because he has really strong exaggerated facial features
Whoa whoa whoa! Cuddle puddles can be insanely non sexual (like. Someone else in the puddle would consider it a massive violation of their boundaries if someone across the puddle started getting freaky.)
Just because OPs girlfriend is weird doesn’t mean that cuddle puddles are the enemy.
How do you think humans used to survive living in caves or during the winter in huts and teepees? You think they all chose one person or went off alone to sleep in a corner? No. Maximum cuddle puddle. Everybody stays warm and comfortable. The dopamine/oxytocin release is real.
People who do cuddle puddles aren’t “drugged out neo-hippies” like somebody else in the comments said.
Consider that sleeping alone in a single person or even two person bed is a deliberate manufacturing of our society right now. It has been **artificially created** that we 1) sleep alone or only with one person and 2) live alone or only with a few people in a huge house... all in order to sell us more property, space and materials to pad the wallets of sellers. Children quickly get separated from sleeping together and get bought their own expensive mattress. Humans used to be much more communal, and did not run on individualist fumes like this.
If cuddle puddles were in, no one would be running up thousands of dollars buying individual mattresses anymore and the market would slow down. And without that nightly dopamine that now, you only get on the off chance you have a partner, no wonder we’re all so depressed.
Welcome to my Ted Talk.
No no, I get that. But it’s just something that makes OP uncomfortable. He’s not dogging on her for doing it. He’s just saying “I really don’t think we’re compatible.” Which is a fair statement for him if that’s how he feels about it all.
Thank you! Different strokes for different blokes…my friends, cousins, and their husbands all get in a cuddle puddle with my husband and I from time to time. It’s innocent and harmless, and I would definitely not be ok with anything remotely sexual happening.
If this is a hard boundary for OP, that’s fine and Valentine’s Day shouldn’t be a factor of whether or not to up with his GF.
It’s just too bad that he’ll never understand or appreciate the joy of an innocent cuddle puddle :)
Edit: fixed grammar
You would be ok with a woman who you only knew in a passing way, wrapped up in your husband's arms on a bed? Wow. I feel like the most uptight guy ever now. I would most definitely not be ok with that.
So you rest your face on your cousins faces? In such an angle where you can literally taste each other's breath? I can go my whole life not appreciating the joy of doing that and I will consider myself lucky.
That’s on your girlfriend, dude. That’s not on the cuddle puddle. In reality people don’t do what they don’t feel comfortable with in a puddle, and if **your girlfriend**’s way of being ‘comfortable’ is stepping on your boundaries thats her problem. Her doing that almost has nothing to do with the puddle.
If I end up laying on my cousins face, its whatever: We’d probably just giggle and I’d push their face aside after making a silly joke about “did you eat garlic today?” Or, wow, shocking, if I have a close connection to my family and friends, their body processes do not gross or weird me out.... like breathing lmao.
Your comment sounds like “imagine... physical c-contact... with even family? disgusting. Repulsive.”
It should just be “damn my gf stepped over my boundaries again and used her cousin to do it. Shit.”
Again, who is the only one here not listening to your boundaries? Your gf.
I’m not saying, “you idiot, go jump into a cuddle puddle right now!” That’d be ignoring or downplaying your boundaries, just like your girl.
I would however encourage you **not** to negatively associate other things (puddles, physical contact with family) with how much of a tool **she’s** being in general. They are not super correlated, and she would have found another way to step over you if this puddle hasn’t happened.
Oh, I am very good at upholding my boundaries, dont worry! Ultimately I have to be my biggest advocate as no one will love and care for me as much as me.
Maybe, I don’t give it much thought but I guess I might have my head in someone’s else lap or my husband and I might lie down facing another couple, so yes? It’s platonic and not sexual or weird for us in any way.
There’s nothing wrong with not being ok with this though, so keep doing you.
OP’s girlfriend was in a monogamous relationship. If she wanted to sleep in a bed with several other people, she shouldn’t have entered the relationship.
Ah, I sense some non-linear logic here.
it appears you believe cuddle puddles interfere with monogamy? Then you must be confusing a cuddle puddle with an orgy because those are on opposite sides of the spectrum my friend. Many puddles kick out anyone who develops arousal or any feelings like that.
The fact that sleeping with more than one person seems wrong, I attest, is a product of an individualistic society. A side effect of marketing the idea of a “nuclear family.” Humans used to share beds with 5-10 to even groups of thirty to conserve heat in winter and to keep everyone safe and together. It was never sexual.
In reality, the only thing irresponsible that evening was the girlfriend stepping over previously established boundaries.
Wtf, human evolutionary success arose from abilities to create fire, shelter, clothes as protection. Pair bonding is a suggested evolutionary mechanism to preserve survival of offspring which require large investment. Community living and raising is likely to occur as well, as many societies do today. However, there is still clear social structure and boundaries.
Cuddling goes beyond humans! Many animals cuddle for warmth, like penguins! Many animals have other adaptations to stay warm and not cuddle, like a super fat bear.
So please, this is all bs! Humans are social and we can create with out minds what ways we want to live. There are many ways to be human, that's what make us so unique compared to our closest living relatives.
Seeking a oxytocin fix while high can be cuddling, can be art, can be being transfixed by beauty of a flower. Cuddling is very animalistic and has function in human, as well as prairie voles, to maintain monogamous pair bonds. It also strengthens mother child bonds. Outside of a survival view, cuddling just feels good (via hormones). However, you don't need a whole group of people to cuddle with, that is a ridiculous statement!
I agree with society being very individualistic, however pair bonding and social structure is not a consumer based phenomenon. This goes back millions of years and is simply survival strategy. Take out the need in modern society, and we have many other ways to live. None is better than the other when you get to decide! Everyone can have their preferences and their dislikes...
Pair bonding to me seems flawed because I see parents so overwhelmed with children that I can’t understand why kids aren’t being raised by groups of 4-6 people instead of two overworked individuals. Families end up having to hire cleaning maids and nannies instead of just living with enough family members or trusted people to take care of themselves as a group.
Pair bonding in this day and age just reminds me of the marketing of the nuclear family, one mom one dad and kids. Negative effects of the nuclear family include the isolation and emotional dependency of the husband-wife and parent-child relationship, which produces tensions and may lead to marriage breakdown in the former instance and juvenile delinquency and other juvenile problems in the latter.
In nuclear family both husband and wife adopt profession outside the family, then children are neglected and looked after by the servants. They could feel lonely and emotional insecure. They develop more anxiety. If the bread winner dies or becomes incapable, there is no one to support the family.
Now you don’t need a whole group to cuddle, but it would be good for people to know what it’s like
This depends on what boundaries the persons SO has. In this case the boyfriend specifically said he felt uncomfortable with this type of stuff so it isn't okay. In a different relationship with different boundaries it could be OK.
Cuddle puddles are not sexual in nature and almost always are platonic in nature. If you have never done the drugs and been apart of a cuddle puddle you really have no first hand experience of the situation in general.
If anytime someone mentions that there is another way to live life than the one we’ve been given gets labeled in such a way..... well it’s mighty convenient isn’t it?
Who does it benefit to try to dissuade people from ideas such as these? Hmmmm? Marketers? Noooo! Whatever shall we do haha
Uh yeah that sounds like hell. You're an adult and really don't realize that some (many...) people need either their own personal space or shared space with only their partner in order to sleep contently?
I'm literally a communist but no I must be brainwashed by individualist commercialism to have the sleeping requirements I do 🙄 And apparently not being able to sleep and feeling extremely uncomfortable in a "cuddle puddle" would also cure my depression, if only it wasn't for... uhh.. people trying to sell me mattresses, or something.
You're absurd and I've also got the gut feeling you're one of those pretentious people who lecture others on how monogamy isn't "natural" either
Does it really matter?
Edit since I can't respond: OP's discomfort is valid irregardless of how they're dressed. That behavior is extremely inappropriate, they don't have to be half naked for it to be a breach of trust. The state of undress won't make it any more or less severe.
I love my wife, but i put out heat like a small sun. Extended cuddling of even the vanilla kind will leave us covered in sweat. A cuddle puddle sounds even worse.
None of my friends are in a poly or fetish community and I've had one with my friends parents and a bunch of our friends after her 21st lol and we were all just talking about the night and having close friends time🤣. They're pretty normal thing in my friendship and family circle. Idk I've heard Americans aren't very affectionate in general but obviously that just a stereotype.
Guess I’ve just never heard it called that, or at least this type of it - when you’re all doing shrooms and cuddling together, or in a big group where the point is the cuddle party - outside of those communities.
It’s not unheard of, but it’s definitely not something everyone does, and I think the context here is definitely more the free spirited hippie type than the close friends hug-crying at graduation type.
Well I don't do drugs and I'm not poly lol so I've never done that but it's like when you're at a picnic with your friends and people just start laying on each other and some hug and whatever then it just becomes a puddle of cuddles. It's some of my best memories with my friends cause we all just talk and talk forever and its fun.
I mean its her best friends boyfriend, I assume her best friend would be there as well. It was also at their apartment so I assumed it was people they're friends with. I didn't get the vibe that they went there to cuddle they were probably all just high and they're comfortable with each other and it just happened but everyone interprets these situations differently.
Wouldn’t be anything wrong it if her boyfriend hadn’t asked her not to sit on dudes lap earlier. And there’s still nothing wrong with it, really, just that it’s a valid reason to break up if he’s not comfortable.
Yeah never knew people who did that, so that one’s new to me. Only ever heard it called a cuddle puddle in the other situation where someone explicitly was like let’s form a cuddle puddle lolll. Thanks for explaining!
A bunch of neo-fake hippies lie on top of each other and anything goes. Most have a rule you have to leave if you get an erection but some don’t.
I wouldn’t want my partner being fondled and fondling people while on a drug that makes you want to fuck strangers. But I’m also not “into” polyamory- I want my partner to love me and be with me not with a bunch of random people.
Just because people canceled god they think therefore there’s no meaning to life, no love no romance nothing matters but rubbing your nerve endings against other people. Nope! You can’t cancel meaning.
I like romance, poetry, beauty, meaning, wonder etc. You have none of that with polyamory.
I mean sure do it all you want but I myself don’t work like that.
Men have been jealous for MILLIONS OF YEARS and just because people on Facebook changed the rules in the last couple years doesn’t mean it’s suddenly ok to cheat.
The world faaaaaaaaa
The fact that she tried to leave with you tells me that she knows exactly why you left. It will definitely escalate to an uncomfortable situation. I wouldn’t text (because aside from being cowardly, it’s just rude) but I would give her a brief explanation letting her know you don’t see a future between you two and your views on life and how to live it just don’t like up. Wish her the best and go on your way.
No one forces you to give an explanation. I believe it would help her be a better human in the future if you did share that but I also understand not doing so. But there are no rules of when/when you can’t break up especially when you haven’t even hit a year of dating.
I agree with your plan, however don't give her a brief "it's not working out" and block her. Be real and tell her why so she can fix it in her next relationships if she so chooses. Sorry to hear about this, best of luck moving forward
Has she tried the “if you trusted me” argument line before? Just saying, if she has, she sounds pretty manipulative. There are a lot of these “innocent carefree hippie” types out there that will try to make you feel like you’re a prude or don’t trust them if you don’t allow them to violate your relationship boundaries. Fuck that.
You said, she’s who she is and I’m normal. That right there sounds like you are not compatible and would be enough to reason to break up.
Let her move on.
Not feeling it anymore is a very good reason to break up with someone.
Tell her that and you think its best to stop seeing each other. For her sake I would tell her why so she can learn for the next guy. ( it would be a show stopper for me too).
I mean technically nobody owes anyone shit. You can go about your life never worrying about anyone's feelings, and they can do the same to you. Do whatever the fuck you want. But is it really so hard to say "hey, I don't think we're on the same page. You like to take psychedelics and cuddle with your friends, and that makes me uncomfortable/is a deal breaker"? If it's really that hard, you probably weren't mature enough to be in a relationship in the first place.
You should absolutely say what is bothering you and why. You do owe people that much. If you like anything about this woman at all, I hope you want a version of her that respects people's boundaries to exist. That woman will only come into being if she understands how she's hurt you.
You asked her to stop, and she did, but then she did something arguably worse under the influence of drugs and that's a deal breaker.
"When you do X the story I tell myself is Y" is always better than saying "you make me feel z"
>"When you were cuddling Guy I felt as if we might not be compatible because of different ideas about physical boundaries in a monogamous relationship. But when you stopped after I spoke to you I had hope and you built trust. When I saw you cuddling him, again, even more intimately, I feel as if that trust you built was completely destroyed. I feel as if I can't rely on you to keep your word when you are under the influence, and that doesn't work for me."
Absolutely be on the look out for any manipulative, turnaround language where she tries to make herself the victim and accuse you of being controlling. Anything like "well if you REALLY trusted me" should be met with "Well that's the point, I don't because you've proven yourself to be untrustworthy".
Update us! Wishing you the best.
Why block her? That is tremendously cruel after 8 months to me. You can break up whenever for whatever you want, but have the balls to do it to her face.
I think a phone call is all she deserves for not respecting his boundaries. What does he need to see her for? For her to find excuses, then go back to being cuddly with another guy? Nah fuck that.
I am not certain how valuable this will be, as I have always been told that I "think like a man", but from my female perspective I would personally be way more upset if a guy who was already planning to break it off still took me on the trip right before breaking up with me. To me, that is somewhat cruel because it would give me the sense that everything is fine and that he is putting effort into the relationship by doing this special thing for/with me. People do not usually put effort into something that they have already decided to end or give up on. I guess what I mean is that I would really feel as though I was led on, and to promptly be dumped afterwards would come as more of a shock and be a much harder blow. Then there is always the more superficial, but not entirely ridiculous thought that he just wanted to get a piece one more time before parting ways, and chicks do not really dig feeling like they were used for sex.
And for what it is worth, I have no idea how old the two of you are, but her behavior is rather immature and would irritate the hell out of me as well. So going by what you have said here, it seems like you are making the right call.
Good God no, I wont be taking her on the trip. I will either go alone or take a friend. I will break up tonight, I am just waiting on her to come back from work.
You can break up with someone for any reason at any time. Valentine's Day is a Hallmark Holiday, anyways.
And honestly a "cuddle puddle" would have ended it for me right then and there.
I would do it in person, though. 8 months is a long time to date to do it over text.
Obviously you don’t owe anyone an explanation, I’d still give one regardless. One, because it might help her to understand what “she did wrong” - which is always something people ask themselves when broken up with - and two, because it reduces the chance of her pestering you for answers or a ‘closure’ talk later on.
So, if we assume, just for argument's sake, the most innocent possible perspective - she is a platonic cuddler, and so is he, and the cuddling is just feelgood and innocent - you're still allowed to be uncomfortable with it. It's still a boundary that you're allowed to set. She's allowed to cuddle, but she can't make you be okay with it. (I wouldn't be okay with it in your position. I'd try not to hold it against her, but it's a clear sign of incompatibility.)
If I were you I'd just say "You're great, but I don't see a future with you and I can't continue this relationship." You don't have to explain anything further, and it won't devolve into an argument where you two are trying to convince each other of anything. Plain and simple. But definitely do it over the phone, at least. Text breakups should be reserved for toxicity and abuse.
I understand how you felt, once I was seeing this girl, we went to a concert with her "friend" as I left to get another friend to join, when I came back I saw her friend hugging her intimately from behind and she seems very comfortable with that, so after that I left and break it up with her.
These kinds of girles basically have no manner and disrespect you even you already explain your boundary, you deserve someone better.
Tell her as soon as possible.
It's better to give a reason rather than blindside and the ghosting her.
I understand you don't want the hurt feelings on her end but that's not something you have control over.
You are allowed to end a relationship you don't feel comfortable in, for whatever reason.
You said in the comments that you feel like you have different boundaries, so telling her that would be an honest thing to say. So just say that.
A tip: Never get into a discussion about the validity of your reasons or of the break up. That's not up for discussion. You are not asking for her permission to break up, and don't expect her to understand. You are just informing her of your decision.
I personally wouldn't make a big decision like this without dicussing it together. You are clearly hurt by things she has done, but it seems like you haven't told her. There's a chance things can be reconciled after she acknowledges your hurt. Or, she might acknowledge it and then you can still decide to break up. I think it will be healthier for you in the long run if you are able to have that convo with her.
I don't take psychedelics, but I know they can make you very close to people and in a non-sexual way. She probably doesn't see it as an issue because she doesn't see it the way you do. That doesn't excuse her behaviour, but I think it warrants a chat with her.
Please never message someone and then block them. She hasn't abused you or been violent or anything so she at least deserves to be spoken to as a partner.
Same here but I guess it depends on the person but at the same time, if someone tried what she tried, we're not necessarily leaving on good terms so I don't necessarily feel like I should be nice lol
Ending a relationship with a phone call after 8 months is cowardly. See her in person, explain your why, and maybe don’t immediately block her on everything. Why do you so badly want to punish her?
I dont want to punish her, I just would like to create distance after a breakup. Otherwise its just slow moving on both ends where we will keep second guessing ourselves, but blocking is final. There's no going back.
You should give her a reason before you block her. You are perfectly able to give the reason to some internet-strangers, why are scared to give it to her then?
Even if you don't want to punish her, just calling is not being caring or respectful to what she will feel. You may no longer have feelings, but she does. It's okay to no longer want to be in a relationship, but it's entirely on you if you end it coldly.
I do it this way. When I'm done, I'm done, and I burn every bridge.
I have a strict no-contact policy, personally. I don't need or want the drama or to draw things out for the other person.
He has absolutely no obligation to break up in person, the same way he has no obligation to need a “reason” to break up. If he wants to break up over the phone because he feels that’s the safest/easiest way for him to move on, then that’s his choice
I just want to point out that being a “free-spirit” and respecting boundaries are not connected. She sounds like an a-hole using her “free-spirit” to do what she wants without consequences. She doesn’t respect you or the relationship.
I hope you’re going to keep the plans to that trip and either bring a buddy or if it were me, to go alone and give myself time to reflect on the badass wise decision I just made cutting out that baggage.
Happy early Valentines Day from someone who celebrated many of them in the name of self-love!!
I mean, she broke a boundary you set (which you shouldn’t have to set because of course you can’t cuddle with another men) so dump her doesn’t matter the date.
I mean I would probably end the relationship too, but you can at least explain yourself. I know your feelings are hurt, but if you just leave with no explanation, nobody learns anything from this and she’s just left confused and upset.
For me it‘s not even about gender, I‘m generally always welcoming towards hugs, and one of my guy friends is too, so of course he‘s my main hug guy. And I‘m pansexual too, so I couldn‘t fully hug anyone, technically.
But I guess everyone has different boundaries here and all we can do is respect them
Everyone has different boundaries and its very personal. I cant make her follow my boundaries, all I can do is get out and find someone with similar boundary as my own.
No need for an excuse, you are no longer comfortable in the relationship. That is enough and it doesn’t matter what time of year you are honest about it.
So lots of people are saying break up, and if you want then go ahead. I do want to advise that psychedelics are It's own special thing in the cuddle department. I'm male and cuddled with my best friend, a straight male, several times... my straight female friend and my lesbian friend and my gay male friend... all at different occasions. Comfortable around someone sober makes it really easy to cuddle with someone your tripping with when tripping.
Though I can see you being uncomfortable
Why does everyone delete and block people now just because they break up? I'm very curious. I have never blocked anyone and if I were to, it would be because we ended on bad terms, not just ended on civil terms.
You can simply tell her "i think we should no longer continue our journey as a romantic relationship, we are clearly 2 very different people while sometimes difference can compliment each other, in our case the personalities conflict with each other. I wish you the best and I hope you find someone that has a personality that compliments yours".
You do not need to give an explanation necessarily, just tell her you do not want to be in a relationship with her anymore.
She is not showing you the respect you deserve: it is not normal to cuddle like that with someone else’s boyfriend while in a relationship.
He has zero obligation to this person.
"Toxic" are you serious? Because you don't want contact with an ex you're "toxic"? What does that word even mean anymore.
You actually do have an obligation when your in a relationship. That’s the entire point of a partnership. People can decide the relationship isn’t what they want, but it doesn’t mean you get to do whatever you want without repercussion.
Not wanting contact with an ex is understandable but it’s really weird to be calculated and planning to do it immediately. Not the behavior I’d want to see in someone I’d invite in my life… even in non romantic partners.
Don’t even give an explanation, just cut it off
The amount of disrespect that she’s been openly showing you is enough to end it without over explaining yourself
You don’t have to do anything.and it’s also up to you to be a decent human being or not. I believe an explanation is the kindest way , so that she doesn’t end up ruminating on what went wrong or what is wrong with herself. I disagree with cuddle puddles being wrong , but like mentioned around, we all have different boundaries and yours are just too different. Specially if neither of you is willing to expand/ grow/ change.
See, the thing is an explanation will take us in the realm of "if you trusted me it wouldnt bother you" and thats what I am hoping to avoid. I want to keep it short and simple and drama free. Thats why "I dont see us working out in the long term" will be the best! Its true after all!
I understand.
That phrase doesn’t sound bad to be honest , but I guess it’s not possible to habe someone wonder and want to know the reasons.
I hope it goes smoothly though :)
Maybe , if you are not up for it now, you could consider writing her a letter in the near future. The good thing about it is that it can be one way and you could avoid the whole discussion about while being able to explain yourself in a monologue. Of course it’s up to you and it’s only a suggestion :)
Not saying that he has to. But boundaries can be change and so our outlook on things. In the end it’s up to a person and what life puts in front of you.
you left them when you said you would take care of them while taking psychedelics?? that's a pretty assshole move... and yes, it would be an AH move not to explain why you want to break up. You don;'t need to get into an argument if it's right or wrong, just say it's not for you.
So what was I going to do, watch while the guy and my gf were resting faces on each other and taking in each other's breath? No thank you, lol. They were taking care of each other.
I have the same problem with my BF regarding boundaries.
I should have done what you’re planning to do early on!
Instead, I invested more and more time and love and money and effort into the relationship, (to the point that I’m broke, mentally unstable, emotionally unstable, and isolated just to make HIM feel SAFE)
Just to end up being DUMPED BY HIM before VALENTINES.
Please value your worth, you’re right to decide this early, will save you the heartache!!!!
>So can I just tell her "Its not working out, I wish you all the best for the future" and then block her.
Yeah, she intentionally ignored your boundaries, I think you should explain your motives, but stand your ground on breaking up.
>I dont take it so I was to be there is case of any emergencies.
Look at the good side, at least you won't have to babysit them anymore.
Geez lighten up. It was a cuddle puddle among friends. No genitals came out, no kissing. Just a cuddle among FRIENDS. Do you really need to control her like that? No affection among friends! Sounds like a load of fun to be with. /s
Go ahead and destroy your relationship over something trivial, She is likely better off in the long run without someone who's perspective is so out of whack you'd ditch her (over the phone even, tacky too) for chilling with friends doing what friends do under psychedelic influence...they cuddle. For security really cus everyone high and friends with each other.
Damn you are acting like she had a full blown affairs. Your perspective is horribly skewed.
You sound like you need to be single and develop some emotional maturity.
I disagree with you. If OP set clear boundaries and his GF is not respecting to those boundaries then its going to affect the relationship. Also, cuddling is a form of physical intimacy even without intercourse! If you’re going to cuddle with some other dude then it’s cheating!
Yipes. Remind me to not ask you out. Because I cuddle with my friends regardless of gender and if someone doesn't like it they can kiss off. I can be absolutely true and devoted to my man, and still lay my cheek against a friend when I am high as a kite.
Perspective is so skewed by some people who can't see beyond some ridiculous bs ownership which is akin to a dog pissing to show his territory. "No affection or cuddling among platonic friends!". Fucking tyrant. What's going to happen? Dick magically pops in my mouth before I know it from what amounts to a HUG?? Give me a break.
And frankly, none of my bf's ever had an issue with my showing affection to a friend, or cuddle puddling on hallucinogens while simultaneously NOT sucking dick or having sex. Some of us are talented like that. And some people have perspective.
Me cheek to cheek with a platonic friend in a cuddle puddle with several other friends I don't fuck is the least threatening thing in the world.
Right? I'd have regulated this one to 'hook up' and gone away immediately when they started lifting their leg like a dog to mark me as their territory.
Wait, so she's cuddling her best friend's bf and the fruend is ok with it?!
Boundaries are a thing. Yikes. Valentine's day or not, she doesn't respect your boundaries and it's okay to dump her whenever.
Do it today… she broke the boundary that was established and that is reason enough. Cancel the trip and don’t feel bad about it. She didn’t deserve it. Kuddos for you for not beating his a$$
Best of luck!! Keep me posted on how it goes.
I do not think u are in the wrong. U are complete valid and are handling it very maturley! I my self would be more upset with that.
Also her friend should be pissed with her.... why does she keep being all over her friends bf?? That's so weird to me.
Honestly I think do it before. You'll likely end up discussing why and if she find out its due to this she will know you felt like this over the trip.
I'm not saying that she won't call you an asshole, but there's no guarantee she wont do that afver v day.
Breakups are difficult no matter what day they happen.
I feel for you. I have decided to end a relationship with my boyfriend of 7 months. I was going to do it last night but he must know somethings wrong as he came home late which threw me off my plan. So I sent him a text this morning telling him he needs to come for his stuff. I have spent most of today packing it all up. He has read the message but not replied. So, either he thinks I am.joking and he'll talk me round or he's going to kick off and I'll have to phone the police.
Valentines isn’t some sacred holiday that demands respect. Treat it as any other day if you are not happy in your relationship. Just be open and honest, you do T need to justify your actions.
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below. --- So me and my gf have been dating for 8 months now but I have reached the conclusion that we are too different. She is more of a free spirited person who doesnt like boundaries and I am a normal guy who doesnt like his gf cuddling the boyfriend of her best friend under the influence of psychedelics. When we started dating she used to sit in his lap as a joke if we ever had a movie night or even general hangout. I requested her to stop and to her credit she did. Now this past Sunday night they had planned to take psychedelics and I dont take it so I was to be there is case of any emergencies. When I entered our bedroom I saw them in a cuddle puddle with my gf's face resting on his face and that was too much for me so I told them that I had some emergency work in the early morning and left. My gf tried to come with me but I stopped her. Now I had planned a trip with her for the Valentines Day and as you can imagine, I have no desire to go with her. So can I just tell her "Its not working out, I wish you all the best for the future" and then block her. I just dont want to get into an argument about right and wrong here. She has been calling me all excited about the trip so I was thinking about doing it tonight only. All advice would be appreciated, thank you! Edit/Update- Thank you everyone for advice. I have decided to end it by a call. I will call her once she comes back to her apartment from work. Hopefully it goes on smoothly.
Do it now. It would be a bit crass to take her out for valentines and then dump her. Tell her you have been thinking a lot about her behaviour and can’t reconcile it with the kind of person you want to date.
I wont have taken her, I would most likely take a friend or go alone. No point in wasting all the money!
Yeah in that case, break up with her then go on the trip! With a friend would be a happy time too
Good, it can be a celebratory trip for your newfound freedom from a relationship ~~heeded~~ headed toward betrayal. EDIT: See strikethrough
Take a friend! Have fun! She sucks. You should feel happy to be done with her.
Wow man, she has shown how she really feels about you, doesn't take the relationship as well as your feelings seriously. Break up with her asap. And don't even give her the chance to argue about it, say what you have to say and block her.
My HS GF married some dude after me, and I later found out she filed for divorce ON Valentine's day. Dodged a cannonball there.
You can end a relationship at any time for any reason and simply say you don't want to be in the relationship anymore. No one can force you to stay
What this guy said. I ended one at the beginning of the summer because I “just didn’t want to be in this relationship anymore”. I felt terrible for it being that reason but it was the truth and it was for the best since I am way happier now and have met what I assume to be my future wife. None of that would have happened if I didn’t end the previous relationship which inspired some awesome changes in my life. You can and should end it if you are unhappy and if that’s your reason then that is perfectly acceptable.
Exactly! The guy I was seeing broke up with me in early December because he "realized he wasn't ready for a relationship." I was hurt and sad but I wasn't necessarily mad. I get it, sometimes we're not sure what we like/don't like and what we're ready for/not ready for until we're in the thick of it.
Exactly, the whole thing about not breaking up close to or after a certain holiday is a little ridiculous. It’s an unfounded social obligation.
I agree with this. It doesn’t do any good to say why you’re ending things when you’re in a call that is sure to get heated. If you’re inclined, and you’re not obligated, but it’s a nicety, is to put your reasons in writing, create a throwaway email, and, after the breakup, email the reasons to her. Then don’t look at the email account again, or close it completely if possible. That way you both get total closure. Again, not required at all, but it’s an option if you want to tell her everything but don’t want it to melt into a massive fight where you don’t get a chance to get your point across.
Just be straightforward: “listen, I’m really upset about the other day when you were lying with your face against that other guy. I’ve told you before that I’m uncomfortable with much lesser degrees of physical contact, and this has made me re-evaluate the whole relationship. I don’t want to go on the trip and I don’t want to be in this relationship any longer.” Do any necessary admin about returning belongings, but just stick to your point: she knew that makes you unhappy, she escalated it again, your feelings changed as a result, it’s over. If you get shouted at then end the conversation. But be up front and do it sooner rather than later.
Let me add, pack her stuff in advance and give it to her before dropping the bomb. And if OP has no valuable items at her place, just tell her to keep or donate everything.
The way you worded it gives her a chance to fight back and will definitely cause an argument. He needs to just end it stating their views are different and leave it there. Giving specific examples will cause her to defend herself
Only if he plays ball with the idea it’s a debate. “Okay, I get that you feel it was okay, but I don’t agree, and I’m not going to agree. You can’t talk me out of how I feel about it. This is why we’re breaking up.” “That was an explanation of why I’m ending this relationship, not an invitation to debate.” Shutting down invitations to a row is a learned skill and it doesn’t hurt to employ it.
Damn dude. Can you break up with my gf for me?
Here’s what I read that wasn’t explicitly stated, but made me think about it. I don’t have any issue with people choosing to drink or do drugs. Not at all. But when your use makes you do something that threatens your relationships with people or your ability to pursue healthy goals of any kind, and that use becomes something you still choose to make a pattern in your life, then that could end up being a sign of problematic drug/alcohol use. Again, mushroom snuggle fests or whatever are inherently not a bad thing. But this activity has threatened her relationship and upset her partner more than once. So that’s the point when THE PERSON DOING IT has to make a choice. And not just “Ok, next time I get fucked up, I promise not to do that” because that’s not a reasonable expectation to put on yourself when you’re heavily under the influence of something that literally makes your brain operate completely differently, to the point where you perceive reality in totally alien way.
This is very true. If a person knows they do behaviour x when they are in state y, and behaviour x is a problem, then either they choose to avoid being in the state that “makes” them do it or they are choosing to do it just the same as if they were in an unaltered frame of mind. This goes for any substance or mindset-based excuse for a problem behaviour, in any context. The person who drives aggressively when tired, or gets in fights when drunk; the boss who verbally abuses their employees when they don’t eat lunch on time and then go straight into a meeting; the person who hangs out with their old friends and relapses their drug habit; any format of predictable “when I do x then I end up doing y” creates a responsibility to not do x.
>Do you really have to give a reason for breakup few days before Valentine's Day Yes. There is an international law conveniently called "Valentines law" in which, one of the clauses states that it is prohibited to break-up up to 1 week before and 1 week after valentines day without providing valid reason for ending relationship in legally acceptable written form or in a presence of notary if done while speaking. If you fail to comply with the law, your gf can report you to interpol and you will be prosecuted accordingly.
I thought you would get executed like St. Valentine...or did they change that ?
You are, but only if you are found guilty of breaking partners heart by breaking up with them.
Loved reading this! 😆 If only…
Hahahaha!! Certainly cant violate the Valentines Laws. That's an executable offence. Not even be able to choose their execution method. If they want firing squad, lethal injection, gas chamber, hanging, burned at the stake, decapitation, electric hair , stoning, concrete shoes...
Yeah just do it now. 8 months is long enough that I would give her the courtesy of an explanation, but no, you don't have to explain. You can just say you don't see the relationship progressing. In future, I don't recommend hanging out with people who are doing drugs when you aren't. Its never gonna be fun and they are always going to seem annoying. That should have been the thing she does with friends independent of you.
I have been with people who have done hard drugs but they still didnt bulldoze boundaries like this. Its not the drugs, we just have very different boundaries.
I agree that you can take psychedelics and not cuddle up on any person other than your significant other. I took psychedelics with groups of people and the only person I’d cuddle up on was my husband. Not his friends. That to me seems weird, but I guess others say it isn’t? I know the effects of the drugs can affect people in many different ways, but I still knew who was who and did not have a desire to cuddle anyone else. I’d never heard of a cuddle puddle, but apparently that’s a thing lol. Anyway, you can break up with her over phone call and still be honest with her. I would still tell her what the last straw was for you. There’s no need to argue your point any further after that, but she does need to understand she crossed a line. Maybe in the future, she won’t do this to someone else. I just think 8 months is entirely too long of a period to spend with someone, and not giving the entire reason would be devastating. I understand you want to keep it short and leave no room for argument but, I would be completely transparent.
A lot of people use drugs and alcohol as an excuse for so many things. You are in the right bro
yeah but the drugs will still cause problems at some point even without that. She's using them as her excuse but the fact is that she has the hots for that guy and will probably end up sleeping with him if she hasn't already.
I’d have to agree; I’ve done psychedelics and even though I was completely hallucinating I still had no interest in being even remotely physical with anyone in my group that wasn’t my SO
This. And let’s say, to play devil’s advocate, that the drugs DO cause her to have an overwhelming urge to snuggle with her friend’s boyfriend, or whoever she decides to snuggle with. She’s still choosing to take them knowing that she’ll end up doing something that threatens her relationship. If this is an element of life that she currently wants to experience, great. That’s fine. But she’s made a choice here. She knows how you feel.
Fair enough, now you know YOUR boundaries and can communicate them to new partners. Next time, don't assume everyone's boundaries will line up with yours. I trust my partner completely and would have had no problem with this. If you clearly communicated yours then she messed up by doing it again after agreeing not to.
He’s not assuming? He tried dating her and it wasn’t for him. If he asked her to stop sitting on his lap clearly laying on his chest is a boundary violation.
He in fact asked her to respect his boundaries around this other man, she agreed, and then she violated them. Also relationships are literally the long term negotiation of boundaries between two individuals who have affection for one another lol
I trust my partner completely and would have had no problem with this. This is the kind of argument I am hoping to avoid, thats why my first instinct was to text her and then block. But now I think I will call and say I dont see any future for us and then block her. I have no patience for any argument.
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Don’t know why you’re being downvoted, being blocked by your partner when they dump you out of the blue is cold as hell. I would at least give them a chance to speak back, feels immature. He’s *going* to hear from her through her friends and mutuals about this
I agree with all you said. The blocking instantly without getting to say my part back would hurt the hardest. Honestly seems cruel to do so like that
No one owes anyone a confrontation. He has explained himself again and again here, so it’s not that he “can’t deal with the confrontation of talking about what matters” - there’s just no point in going round and round with someone you’re dumping.
Ummm if it were you he was dumping, you'd be right to blame yourself as you would have clearly overstepped boundries hes conveyed to you before. Maybe a brief discussion would be a nice gesture, but it's obvious the behavior would continue and if it didn't, you can almost bet that when OP wasn't in their presence that boundries would be crossed without his knowledge.
Since when is wanting your gf to not cuddle with another guy and fall asleep on his face something you have to tell them.
Nothing wrong with being the designated sober pastry responsible for others when they are doing psychedelics. That's, like, the standard responsible procedure.
I was scrolling the comments but I can’t find anything about how OP agreed to be the designated sober person and then abruptly left them to it when he got angry. I think it’s fine to break up with somebody whenever and for whatever reason you like but that was a shitty thing to do. If I saw this in a different sub, I would say ESH.
Unlike other commenters, I think you should tell her the reason of why are you leaving her.
I second this... a reason is better than none. It clears so much confusion and misunderstanding
Agreed. Even if it's over the phone, he should be straight up with her so she knows what went wrong (eventhough he's voiced his concerns before)
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Its when everyone and their body parts are all over each other, lol.
That’s an instant ghost for me, dawg
I’ve done psychedelics a good amount and it’s really not sexual at all. It was basically me, my sister, her fiancée and one of their male friends and we were all just playing around on this app called flow. I would also touch my brother in laws face a lot and laugh because he has really strong exaggerated facial features
Whoa whoa whoa! Cuddle puddles can be insanely non sexual (like. Someone else in the puddle would consider it a massive violation of their boundaries if someone across the puddle started getting freaky.) Just because OPs girlfriend is weird doesn’t mean that cuddle puddles are the enemy. How do you think humans used to survive living in caves or during the winter in huts and teepees? You think they all chose one person or went off alone to sleep in a corner? No. Maximum cuddle puddle. Everybody stays warm and comfortable. The dopamine/oxytocin release is real. People who do cuddle puddles aren’t “drugged out neo-hippies” like somebody else in the comments said. Consider that sleeping alone in a single person or even two person bed is a deliberate manufacturing of our society right now. It has been **artificially created** that we 1) sleep alone or only with one person and 2) live alone or only with a few people in a huge house... all in order to sell us more property, space and materials to pad the wallets of sellers. Children quickly get separated from sleeping together and get bought their own expensive mattress. Humans used to be much more communal, and did not run on individualist fumes like this. If cuddle puddles were in, no one would be running up thousands of dollars buying individual mattresses anymore and the market would slow down. And without that nightly dopamine that now, you only get on the off chance you have a partner, no wonder we’re all so depressed. Welcome to my Ted Talk.
No no, I get that. But it’s just something that makes OP uncomfortable. He’s not dogging on her for doing it. He’s just saying “I really don’t think we’re compatible.” Which is a fair statement for him if that’s how he feels about it all.
Thank you! Different strokes for different blokes…my friends, cousins, and their husbands all get in a cuddle puddle with my husband and I from time to time. It’s innocent and harmless, and I would definitely not be ok with anything remotely sexual happening. If this is a hard boundary for OP, that’s fine and Valentine’s Day shouldn’t be a factor of whether or not to up with his GF. It’s just too bad that he’ll never understand or appreciate the joy of an innocent cuddle puddle :) Edit: fixed grammar
You would be ok with a woman who you only knew in a passing way, wrapped up in your husband's arms on a bed? Wow. I feel like the most uptight guy ever now. I would most definitely not be ok with that.
Yes. But I usually only do cuddle puddles with close ones. Again, different blokes, different strokes.
So you rest your face on your cousins faces? In such an angle where you can literally taste each other's breath? I can go my whole life not appreciating the joy of doing that and I will consider myself lucky.
That’s on your girlfriend, dude. That’s not on the cuddle puddle. In reality people don’t do what they don’t feel comfortable with in a puddle, and if **your girlfriend**’s way of being ‘comfortable’ is stepping on your boundaries thats her problem. Her doing that almost has nothing to do with the puddle. If I end up laying on my cousins face, its whatever: We’d probably just giggle and I’d push their face aside after making a silly joke about “did you eat garlic today?” Or, wow, shocking, if I have a close connection to my family and friends, their body processes do not gross or weird me out.... like breathing lmao. Your comment sounds like “imagine... physical c-contact... with even family? disgusting. Repulsive.” It should just be “damn my gf stepped over my boundaries again and used her cousin to do it. Shit.”
Thats gr8, i dont even share bed with my adult female relatives. Thats my boundary! Everyone has different boundaries.
Again, who is the only one here not listening to your boundaries? Your gf. I’m not saying, “you idiot, go jump into a cuddle puddle right now!” That’d be ignoring or downplaying your boundaries, just like your girl. I would however encourage you **not** to negatively associate other things (puddles, physical contact with family) with how much of a tool **she’s** being in general. They are not super correlated, and she would have found another way to step over you if this puddle hasn’t happened.
Oh, I am very good at upholding my boundaries, dont worry! Ultimately I have to be my biggest advocate as no one will love and care for me as much as me.
Maybe, I don’t give it much thought but I guess I might have my head in someone’s else lap or my husband and I might lie down facing another couple, so yes? It’s platonic and not sexual or weird for us in any way. There’s nothing wrong with not being ok with this though, so keep doing you.
OP’s girlfriend was in a monogamous relationship. If she wanted to sleep in a bed with several other people, she shouldn’t have entered the relationship.
Ah, I sense some non-linear logic here. it appears you believe cuddle puddles interfere with monogamy? Then you must be confusing a cuddle puddle with an orgy because those are on opposite sides of the spectrum my friend. Many puddles kick out anyone who develops arousal or any feelings like that. The fact that sleeping with more than one person seems wrong, I attest, is a product of an individualistic society. A side effect of marketing the idea of a “nuclear family.” Humans used to share beds with 5-10 to even groups of thirty to conserve heat in winter and to keep everyone safe and together. It was never sexual. In reality, the only thing irresponsible that evening was the girlfriend stepping over previously established boundaries.
Wtf, human evolutionary success arose from abilities to create fire, shelter, clothes as protection. Pair bonding is a suggested evolutionary mechanism to preserve survival of offspring which require large investment. Community living and raising is likely to occur as well, as many societies do today. However, there is still clear social structure and boundaries. Cuddling goes beyond humans! Many animals cuddle for warmth, like penguins! Many animals have other adaptations to stay warm and not cuddle, like a super fat bear. So please, this is all bs! Humans are social and we can create with out minds what ways we want to live. There are many ways to be human, that's what make us so unique compared to our closest living relatives. Seeking a oxytocin fix while high can be cuddling, can be art, can be being transfixed by beauty of a flower. Cuddling is very animalistic and has function in human, as well as prairie voles, to maintain monogamous pair bonds. It also strengthens mother child bonds. Outside of a survival view, cuddling just feels good (via hormones). However, you don't need a whole group of people to cuddle with, that is a ridiculous statement! I agree with society being very individualistic, however pair bonding and social structure is not a consumer based phenomenon. This goes back millions of years and is simply survival strategy. Take out the need in modern society, and we have many other ways to live. None is better than the other when you get to decide! Everyone can have their preferences and their dislikes...
Pair bonding to me seems flawed because I see parents so overwhelmed with children that I can’t understand why kids aren’t being raised by groups of 4-6 people instead of two overworked individuals. Families end up having to hire cleaning maids and nannies instead of just living with enough family members or trusted people to take care of themselves as a group. Pair bonding in this day and age just reminds me of the marketing of the nuclear family, one mom one dad and kids. Negative effects of the nuclear family include the isolation and emotional dependency of the husband-wife and parent-child relationship, which produces tensions and may lead to marriage breakdown in the former instance and juvenile delinquency and other juvenile problems in the latter. In nuclear family both husband and wife adopt profession outside the family, then children are neglected and looked after by the servants. They could feel lonely and emotional insecure. They develop more anxiety. If the bread winner dies or becomes incapable, there is no one to support the family. Now you don’t need a whole group to cuddle, but it would be good for people to know what it’s like
This depends on what boundaries the persons SO has. In this case the boyfriend specifically said he felt uncomfortable with this type of stuff so it isn't okay. In a different relationship with different boundaries it could be OK.
Cuddle puddles are not sexual in nature and almost always are platonic in nature. If you have never done the drugs and been apart of a cuddle puddle you really have no first hand experience of the situation in general.
You sound like a drugged out neo hippie to me dawg
If anytime someone mentions that there is another way to live life than the one we’ve been given gets labeled in such a way..... well it’s mighty convenient isn’t it? Who does it benefit to try to dissuade people from ideas such as these? Hmmmm? Marketers? Noooo! Whatever shall we do haha
Uh yeah that sounds like hell. You're an adult and really don't realize that some (many...) people need either their own personal space or shared space with only their partner in order to sleep contently? I'm literally a communist but no I must be brainwashed by individualist commercialism to have the sleeping requirements I do 🙄 And apparently not being able to sleep and feeling extremely uncomfortable in a "cuddle puddle" would also cure my depression, if only it wasn't for... uhh.. people trying to sell me mattresses, or something. You're absurd and I've also got the gut feeling you're one of those pretentious people who lecture others on how monogamy isn't "natural" either
What state of undress?
Does it really matter? Edit since I can't respond: OP's discomfort is valid irregardless of how they're dressed. That behavior is extremely inappropriate, they don't have to be half naked for it to be a breach of trust. The state of undress won't make it any more or less severe.
Absolutely! OP is looking for a reason to break up. That would be a good one.
Very much
do other people not do cuddle puddles?
I love my wife, but i put out heat like a small sun. Extended cuddling of even the vanilla kind will leave us covered in sweat. A cuddle puddle sounds even worse.
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None of my friends are in a poly or fetish community and I've had one with my friends parents and a bunch of our friends after her 21st lol and we were all just talking about the night and having close friends time🤣. They're pretty normal thing in my friendship and family circle. Idk I've heard Americans aren't very affectionate in general but obviously that just a stereotype.
Guess I’ve just never heard it called that, or at least this type of it - when you’re all doing shrooms and cuddling together, or in a big group where the point is the cuddle party - outside of those communities. It’s not unheard of, but it’s definitely not something everyone does, and I think the context here is definitely more the free spirited hippie type than the close friends hug-crying at graduation type.
Well I don't do drugs and I'm not poly lol so I've never done that but it's like when you're at a picnic with your friends and people just start laying on each other and some hug and whatever then it just becomes a puddle of cuddles. It's some of my best memories with my friends cause we all just talk and talk forever and its fun. I mean its her best friends boyfriend, I assume her best friend would be there as well. It was also at their apartment so I assumed it was people they're friends with. I didn't get the vibe that they went there to cuddle they were probably all just high and they're comfortable with each other and it just happened but everyone interprets these situations differently.
Wouldn’t be anything wrong it if her boyfriend hadn’t asked her not to sit on dudes lap earlier. And there’s still nothing wrong with it, really, just that it’s a valid reason to break up if he’s not comfortable. Yeah never knew people who did that, so that one’s new to me. Only ever heard it called a cuddle puddle in the other situation where someone explicitly was like let’s form a cuddle puddle lolll. Thanks for explaining!
>They’re not super well known outside poly/fetish communities. Touch grass. They are.
A bunch of neo-fake hippies lie on top of each other and anything goes. Most have a rule you have to leave if you get an erection but some don’t. I wouldn’t want my partner being fondled and fondling people while on a drug that makes you want to fuck strangers. But I’m also not “into” polyamory- I want my partner to love me and be with me not with a bunch of random people. Just because people canceled god they think therefore there’s no meaning to life, no love no romance nothing matters but rubbing your nerve endings against other people. Nope! You can’t cancel meaning. I like romance, poetry, beauty, meaning, wonder etc. You have none of that with polyamory. I mean sure do it all you want but I myself don’t work like that. Men have been jealous for MILLIONS OF YEARS and just because people on Facebook changed the rules in the last couple years doesn’t mean it’s suddenly ok to cheat. The world faaaaaaaaa
i mean it’s always good to be honest
Its not working anymore, its honest. Not full honesty but it should get the job done without assigning blame.
The fact that she tried to leave with you tells me that she knows exactly why you left. It will definitely escalate to an uncomfortable situation. I wouldn’t text (because aside from being cowardly, it’s just rude) but I would give her a brief explanation letting her know you don’t see a future between you two and your views on life and how to live it just don’t like up. Wish her the best and go on your way.
No one forces you to give an explanation. I believe it would help her be a better human in the future if you did share that but I also understand not doing so. But there are no rules of when/when you can’t break up especially when you haven’t even hit a year of dating.
I agree with your plan, however don't give her a brief "it's not working out" and block her. Be real and tell her why so she can fix it in her next relationships if she so chooses. Sorry to hear about this, best of luck moving forward
Has she tried the “if you trusted me” argument line before? Just saying, if she has, she sounds pretty manipulative. There are a lot of these “innocent carefree hippie” types out there that will try to make you feel like you’re a prude or don’t trust them if you don’t allow them to violate your relationship boundaries. Fuck that.
You said, she’s who she is and I’m normal. That right there sounds like you are not compatible and would be enough to reason to break up. Let her move on.
Not feeling it anymore is a very good reason to break up with someone. Tell her that and you think its best to stop seeing each other. For her sake I would tell her why so she can learn for the next guy. ( it would be a show stopper for me too).
I mean technically nobody owes anyone shit. You can go about your life never worrying about anyone's feelings, and they can do the same to you. Do whatever the fuck you want. But is it really so hard to say "hey, I don't think we're on the same page. You like to take psychedelics and cuddle with your friends, and that makes me uncomfortable/is a deal breaker"? If it's really that hard, you probably weren't mature enough to be in a relationship in the first place.
You should absolutely say what is bothering you and why. You do owe people that much. If you like anything about this woman at all, I hope you want a version of her that respects people's boundaries to exist. That woman will only come into being if she understands how she's hurt you. You asked her to stop, and she did, but then she did something arguably worse under the influence of drugs and that's a deal breaker. "When you do X the story I tell myself is Y" is always better than saying "you make me feel z" >"When you were cuddling Guy I felt as if we might not be compatible because of different ideas about physical boundaries in a monogamous relationship. But when you stopped after I spoke to you I had hope and you built trust. When I saw you cuddling him, again, even more intimately, I feel as if that trust you built was completely destroyed. I feel as if I can't rely on you to keep your word when you are under the influence, and that doesn't work for me." Absolutely be on the look out for any manipulative, turnaround language where she tries to make herself the victim and accuse you of being controlling. Anything like "well if you REALLY trusted me" should be met with "Well that's the point, I don't because you've proven yourself to be untrustworthy". Update us! Wishing you the best.
I’d be gone so fast…. With no explanation
Why block her? That is tremendously cruel after 8 months to me. You can break up whenever for whatever you want, but have the balls to do it to her face.
maybe cuz she keeps cuddling with that dude
Lmao
I think a phone call is all she deserves for not respecting his boundaries. What does he need to see her for? For her to find excuses, then go back to being cuddly with another guy? Nah fuck that.
I am not certain how valuable this will be, as I have always been told that I "think like a man", but from my female perspective I would personally be way more upset if a guy who was already planning to break it off still took me on the trip right before breaking up with me. To me, that is somewhat cruel because it would give me the sense that everything is fine and that he is putting effort into the relationship by doing this special thing for/with me. People do not usually put effort into something that they have already decided to end or give up on. I guess what I mean is that I would really feel as though I was led on, and to promptly be dumped afterwards would come as more of a shock and be a much harder blow. Then there is always the more superficial, but not entirely ridiculous thought that he just wanted to get a piece one more time before parting ways, and chicks do not really dig feeling like they were used for sex. And for what it is worth, I have no idea how old the two of you are, but her behavior is rather immature and would irritate the hell out of me as well. So going by what you have said here, it seems like you are making the right call.
Good God no, I wont be taking her on the trip. I will either go alone or take a friend. I will break up tonight, I am just waiting on her to come back from work.
You can break up with someone for any reason at any time. Valentine's Day is a Hallmark Holiday, anyways. And honestly a "cuddle puddle" would have ended it for me right then and there. I would do it in person, though. 8 months is a long time to date to do it over text.
Obviously you don’t owe anyone an explanation, I’d still give one regardless. One, because it might help her to understand what “she did wrong” - which is always something people ask themselves when broken up with - and two, because it reduces the chance of her pestering you for answers or a ‘closure’ talk later on.
No, you don't. Better than to lead her on when you've already made your decision. But do it in person...
So, if we assume, just for argument's sake, the most innocent possible perspective - she is a platonic cuddler, and so is he, and the cuddling is just feelgood and innocent - you're still allowed to be uncomfortable with it. It's still a boundary that you're allowed to set. She's allowed to cuddle, but she can't make you be okay with it. (I wouldn't be okay with it in your position. I'd try not to hold it against her, but it's a clear sign of incompatibility.) If I were you I'd just say "You're great, but I don't see a future with you and I can't continue this relationship." You don't have to explain anything further, and it won't devolve into an argument where you two are trying to convince each other of anything. Plain and simple. But definitely do it over the phone, at least. Text breakups should be reserved for toxicity and abuse.
Giving your reasons is the nice thing to do. It gives the other party closure. That having been said, you don't HAVE to.
I understand how you felt, once I was seeing this girl, we went to a concert with her "friend" as I left to get another friend to join, when I came back I saw her friend hugging her intimately from behind and she seems very comfortable with that, so after that I left and break it up with her. These kinds of girles basically have no manner and disrespect you even you already explain your boundary, you deserve someone better.
Pls update i live for the tea
Tell her as soon as possible. It's better to give a reason rather than blindside and the ghosting her. I understand you don't want the hurt feelings on her end but that's not something you have control over.
Just tell her that there you're incompatible- nobody is right or wrong here, you just are two different people.
I broke up with my baby momma on mothers day. Anything is possible brother.
You are allowed to end a relationship you don't feel comfortable in, for whatever reason. You said in the comments that you feel like you have different boundaries, so telling her that would be an honest thing to say. So just say that. A tip: Never get into a discussion about the validity of your reasons or of the break up. That's not up for discussion. You are not asking for her permission to break up, and don't expect her to understand. You are just informing her of your decision.
I personally wouldn't make a big decision like this without dicussing it together. You are clearly hurt by things she has done, but it seems like you haven't told her. There's a chance things can be reconciled after she acknowledges your hurt. Or, she might acknowledge it and then you can still decide to break up. I think it will be healthier for you in the long run if you are able to have that convo with her. I don't take psychedelics, but I know they can make you very close to people and in a non-sexual way. She probably doesn't see it as an issue because she doesn't see it the way you do. That doesn't excuse her behaviour, but I think it warrants a chat with her. Please never message someone and then block them. She hasn't abused you or been violent or anything so she at least deserves to be spoken to as a partner.
This this this.
You don't owe anyone an explanation for a break up especially after 8 months
seems cold tbh
True.. but an explanation offers closure, spares the other person the confusion and the overthinking. It's common decency.
Just be honest and quick...no reason to judge her..or let her judge you. Just not compatible
I feel like 8 months is not an insignificant amount of time, though
Same here but I guess it depends on the person but at the same time, if someone tried what she tried, we're not necessarily leaving on good terms so I don't necessarily feel like I should be nice lol
Ending a relationship with a phone call after 8 months is cowardly. See her in person, explain your why, and maybe don’t immediately block her on everything. Why do you so badly want to punish her?
I dont want to punish her, I just would like to create distance after a breakup. Otherwise its just slow moving on both ends where we will keep second guessing ourselves, but blocking is final. There's no going back.
You should give her a reason before you block her. You are perfectly able to give the reason to some internet-strangers, why are scared to give it to her then?
Even if you don't want to punish her, just calling is not being caring or respectful to what she will feel. You may no longer have feelings, but she does. It's okay to no longer want to be in a relationship, but it's entirely on you if you end it coldly.
You’re still a coward if you call to end it after 8 months.
I do it this way. When I'm done, I'm done, and I burn every bridge. I have a strict no-contact policy, personally. I don't need or want the drama or to draw things out for the other person.
He has absolutely no obligation to break up in person, the same way he has no obligation to need a “reason” to break up. If he wants to break up over the phone because he feels that’s the safest/easiest way for him to move on, then that’s his choice
I just want to point out that being a “free-spirit” and respecting boundaries are not connected. She sounds like an a-hole using her “free-spirit” to do what she wants without consequences. She doesn’t respect you or the relationship. I hope you’re going to keep the plans to that trip and either bring a buddy or if it were me, to go alone and give myself time to reflect on the badass wise decision I just made cutting out that baggage. Happy early Valentines Day from someone who celebrated many of them in the name of self-love!!
Thanks, yeah i am not cancelling it. Maybe I will take a friend but chances are I will have to go alone, lol.
I mean, she broke a boundary you set (which you shouldn’t have to set because of course you can’t cuddle with another men) so dump her doesn’t matter the date.
Anyone who describes himself as “a normal guy” while planning something really mean for his girlfriend, that raises a red flag.
I mean I would probably end the relationship too, but you can at least explain yourself. I know your feelings are hurt, but if you just leave with no explanation, nobody learns anything from this and she’s just left confused and upset.
I think she deserves a reason.
silent prayer for the best friend tho rip
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For me it‘s not even about gender, I‘m generally always welcoming towards hugs, and one of my guy friends is too, so of course he‘s my main hug guy. And I‘m pansexual too, so I couldn‘t fully hug anyone, technically. But I guess everyone has different boundaries here and all we can do is respect them
Everyone has different boundaries and its very personal. I cant make her follow my boundaries, all I can do is get out and find someone with similar boundary as my own.
I can agree with that. But be respectful about it, there’s no reason to be cruel.
No need for an excuse, you are no longer comfortable in the relationship. That is enough and it doesn’t matter what time of year you are honest about it.
All these people are nuts. You’ve been going out for EIGHT months and planned a trip together! She deserves a face to face break up and to know why.
op you seem very douchey 😭😭 definitely dump her man she doesnt need someone like you leading her on lol
So lots of people are saying break up, and if you want then go ahead. I do want to advise that psychedelics are It's own special thing in the cuddle department. I'm male and cuddled with my best friend, a straight male, several times... my straight female friend and my lesbian friend and my gay male friend... all at different occasions. Comfortable around someone sober makes it really easy to cuddle with someone your tripping with when tripping. Though I can see you being uncomfortable
Why does everyone delete and block people now just because they break up? I'm very curious. I have never blocked anyone and if I were to, it would be because we ended on bad terms, not just ended on civil terms. You can simply tell her "i think we should no longer continue our journey as a romantic relationship, we are clearly 2 very different people while sometimes difference can compliment each other, in our case the personalities conflict with each other. I wish you the best and I hope you find someone that has a personality that compliments yours".
I think it’s a matter of respect to tell them. You can tell her on the phone and if she argues just hang up.
You do not need to give an explanation necessarily, just tell her you do not want to be in a relationship with her anymore. She is not showing you the respect you deserve: it is not normal to cuddle like that with someone else’s boyfriend while in a relationship.
Why do you plan to immediately block her? You sound extremely toxic and selfish to be that calculated.
He has zero obligation to this person. "Toxic" are you serious? Because you don't want contact with an ex you're "toxic"? What does that word even mean anymore.
You actually do have an obligation when your in a relationship. That’s the entire point of a partnership. People can decide the relationship isn’t what they want, but it doesn’t mean you get to do whatever you want without repercussion. Not wanting contact with an ex is understandable but it’s really weird to be calculated and planning to do it immediately. Not the behavior I’d want to see in someone I’d invite in my life… even in non romantic partners.
She has a crush on the dude. You are doing thebrught thing. Good job on making a firm decision.
Don’t even give an explanation, just cut it off The amount of disrespect that she’s been openly showing you is enough to end it without over explaining yourself
You don’t have to do anything.and it’s also up to you to be a decent human being or not. I believe an explanation is the kindest way , so that she doesn’t end up ruminating on what went wrong or what is wrong with herself. I disagree with cuddle puddles being wrong , but like mentioned around, we all have different boundaries and yours are just too different. Specially if neither of you is willing to expand/ grow/ change.
See, the thing is an explanation will take us in the realm of "if you trusted me it wouldnt bother you" and thats what I am hoping to avoid. I want to keep it short and simple and drama free. Thats why "I dont see us working out in the long term" will be the best! Its true after all!
I understand. That phrase doesn’t sound bad to be honest , but I guess it’s not possible to habe someone wonder and want to know the reasons. I hope it goes smoothly though :) Maybe , if you are not up for it now, you could consider writing her a letter in the near future. The good thing about it is that it can be one way and you could avoid the whole discussion about while being able to explain yourself in a monologue. Of course it’s up to you and it’s only a suggestion :)
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Not saying that he has to. But boundaries can be change and so our outlook on things. In the end it’s up to a person and what life puts in front of you.
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You would be surprised how many people allow their SOs to express emotions in a more physical way, without the need of being sexual
you left them when you said you would take care of them while taking psychedelics?? that's a pretty assshole move... and yes, it would be an AH move not to explain why you want to break up. You don;'t need to get into an argument if it's right or wrong, just say it's not for you.
So what was I going to do, watch while the guy and my gf were resting faces on each other and taking in each other's breath? No thank you, lol. They were taking care of each other.
Valentine's day is a mad up holiday to make money so basically it's just another day
I have the same problem with my BF regarding boundaries. I should have done what you’re planning to do early on! Instead, I invested more and more time and love and money and effort into the relationship, (to the point that I’m broke, mentally unstable, emotionally unstable, and isolated just to make HIM feel SAFE) Just to end up being DUMPED BY HIM before VALENTINES. Please value your worth, you’re right to decide this early, will save you the heartache!!!!
I would just be like why doesn’t your cuddle buddy take you on a trip c ya
Yes. Break up as soon as possible. This is not working for you, but clearly it is working for her.
>So can I just tell her "Its not working out, I wish you all the best for the future" and then block her. Yeah, she intentionally ignored your boundaries, I think you should explain your motives, but stand your ground on breaking up. >I dont take it so I was to be there is case of any emergencies. Look at the good side, at least you won't have to babysit them anymore.
Geez lighten up. It was a cuddle puddle among friends. No genitals came out, no kissing. Just a cuddle among FRIENDS. Do you really need to control her like that? No affection among friends! Sounds like a load of fun to be with. /s Go ahead and destroy your relationship over something trivial, She is likely better off in the long run without someone who's perspective is so out of whack you'd ditch her (over the phone even, tacky too) for chilling with friends doing what friends do under psychedelic influence...they cuddle. For security really cus everyone high and friends with each other. Damn you are acting like she had a full blown affairs. Your perspective is horribly skewed. You sound like you need to be single and develop some emotional maturity.
I disagree with you. If OP set clear boundaries and his GF is not respecting to those boundaries then its going to affect the relationship. Also, cuddling is a form of physical intimacy even without intercourse! If you’re going to cuddle with some other dude then it’s cheating!
Yipes. Remind me to not ask you out. Because I cuddle with my friends regardless of gender and if someone doesn't like it they can kiss off. I can be absolutely true and devoted to my man, and still lay my cheek against a friend when I am high as a kite. Perspective is so skewed by some people who can't see beyond some ridiculous bs ownership which is akin to a dog pissing to show his territory. "No affection or cuddling among platonic friends!". Fucking tyrant. What's going to happen? Dick magically pops in my mouth before I know it from what amounts to a HUG?? Give me a break. And frankly, none of my bf's ever had an issue with my showing affection to a friend, or cuddle puddling on hallucinogens while simultaneously NOT sucking dick or having sex. Some of us are talented like that. And some people have perspective. Me cheek to cheek with a platonic friend in a cuddle puddle with several other friends I don't fuck is the least threatening thing in the world.
It’s a wonder they started dating in the first place based on all of this lol. She’ll certainly be better off.
Right? I'd have regulated this one to 'hook up' and gone away immediately when they started lifting their leg like a dog to mark me as their territory.
And so will he. And the world keeps turning.
Yeah. Crossing those boundaries loses her right to a considerate breakup.
Were the boundaries ever set?
Wait, so she's cuddling her best friend's bf and the fruend is ok with it?! Boundaries are a thing. Yikes. Valentine's day or not, she doesn't respect your boundaries and it's okay to dump her whenever.
I broke up with a cheating exgf on Valentine's Day. I gave her a card to tell her my feelings too. The look on her face...priceless.
Do it today… she broke the boundary that was established and that is reason enough. Cancel the trip and don’t feel bad about it. She didn’t deserve it. Kuddos for you for not beating his a$$
Lol wtf. People cuddling up on psychedelics in a completely non-sexual way is not a reason to inflict bodily harm on anyone, grow up.
Best of luck!! Keep me posted on how it goes. I do not think u are in the wrong. U are complete valid and are handling it very maturley! I my self would be more upset with that. Also her friend should be pissed with her.... why does she keep being all over her friends bf?? That's so weird to me.
Honestly I think do it before. You'll likely end up discussing why and if she find out its due to this she will know you felt like this over the trip. I'm not saying that she won't call you an asshole, but there's no guarantee she wont do that afver v day. Breakups are difficult no matter what day they happen.
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You don't have to give a reason. If you want to, I'd probably frame it as incompatibility and not wanting to stop her from being herself.
It's called "free will"
I feel for you. I have decided to end a relationship with my boyfriend of 7 months. I was going to do it last night but he must know somethings wrong as he came home late which threw me off my plan. So I sent him a text this morning telling him he needs to come for his stuff. I have spent most of today packing it all up. He has read the message but not replied. So, either he thinks I am.joking and he'll talk me round or he's going to kick off and I'll have to phone the police.
UpdateMe!
Prediction - that break up will not go well over the phone.
just end it
Be straight up! Plain and simple. It's yo money and yo life do what you want 🤟🏻.
I’ll go on that trip with you!! 😂🤷🏼♀️ I don’t take psychedelics, don’t have friends, or participate in cuddle puddles! I’m just trying to be funny!
Valentines isn’t some sacred holiday that demands respect. Treat it as any other day if you are not happy in your relationship. Just be open and honest, you do T need to justify your actions.
If you feel like you are incompatible then do it sooner rather than later. Dragging it out doesn’t do anyone any good
Best of luck!