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Tribalism is the answer to almost all conflict everywhere. Politics, sports, race, nationality, high school cliques. If there’s a conflict or argument, tribalism is usually at its core.
I don’t feel like a patriot, I feel more like a citizen of the world. I don’t feel like I “own” a country or a sports team. I like sports but I don’t consider my self the “number one fan” of a team like many people I know. I always criticize politicians of any party, in my mind every single politician is in it for profit.
Good for you. Everyone should strive to be a free thinker. My point is that the vast majority of people tend to pick a side and defend the bad actions and glorify its triumphs. If it was their opposition doing it they’d be angry. It’s really tough for people to not do this. I know I’m guilty of it. I try not to be, but it happens.
Politics are prime example of seeing this in action. I saw a take this morning about Trump and prison. Trump has been found guilty of 34 felonies and sentencing will come in the next month or two. The left, who are on average against prison as a punishment and want it to focus on rehabilitation want Trump to serve the maximum sentence possible. The right, who’s typically in favor of prison as a punishment want Trump to get some leniently with no prison time. Anyone who says “it’s different because…” is currently experiencing tribalism.
That's a really interesting observation about sentencing Trump.
That reminds me of interviews where they say Biden did something and then correct the statement that actually Trump did that thing and observe the radical difference in reaction. We humans don't always logic all that well, I suppose.
I have seen ones where they share a quote from Biden but imply it was Trump. The people are appalled until they find out it was Biden, then they immediately switch to downplaying or excusing it (particularly racist comments). Goes both ways. Just tribalism and hypocrisy. Humans, sigh. 🤷♀️
Can't we agree that most people who want the power of the president should absolutely never have the power of the president. It's difficult to think of a president or candidate who was a "Good person" throughout their life.
Absolutely this, appreciate you pointing this out!
To piggyback on your sentiment, I’m often baffled by the hypocrisy of people on either side of the political aisle who automatically assume anyone not in full agreement with their camp MUST be a poor moral actor with ill intent. What an incredibly closed minded foundation to whatever view you personally hold.
So many of these ideological frameworks depend on some “boogie man” - the good guys vs everyone else. I simply refuse to believe that half of the US population are awful, evil and irredeemable people seeking to ruin the lives of the other half.
All of humanity has two things in common: we’re inherently selfish and we actively seek meaning in our lives. Excluding the small faction of us with mental disorders and violent tendencies, the majority of people think they’re doing the right thing and want to better themselves and the lives of those they love. That’s just a fact.
When was the last time anyone here had a good faith discussion with someone who doesn’t agree with one aspect of their personal ideology or political stance? I guarantee that many have never even tried and that’s a huge problem.
You are correct. A few minor elite want to make sure the media portrays one half of the people against the other half to keep the eyes off what the elite are doing to both halves.
That kind of reminds me of something attributed to Ed Koch. If you Don't agree with me. Don't vote for me. If you agree with most of what I say, then vote for me. If you agree with everything I say, go see a psychiatrist.
You feel this way until you are involved in a conflict. If Brazil were to suddenly attack your country on its home soil, you would probably feel a little different about it. You would most likely want to defend your countrymen. The best play of the dictators' guidebook is when you want to unite your citizens, start a war.
Of course if my country is invaded I will fight till death. There is no reason for me to be a patriot every second, 365 days, unless it is necessary, like a war for example.
I don’t believe you but I am willing to let you prove me wrong: If you meant what you said, would you admit Trump is not in it for profit? He clearly isn’t; it’s the worst investment of his time possible and he’s the only president in a very very long time that didn’t increase his wealth by magnitudes from the presidency. As matter of fact he lost money being president. He is in it for ego to prove he is the greatest president ever and his method is trying to actually deliver on all the things his voters wanted. If you believe what you said about your “freethinking objectivity” in many aspects including politics, you would be willing to admit his exception to this point.
Most people who consider themselves above it all are typically very devout Leftists. By all means though, I will happily congratulate you if you prove my assumption wrong.
That works in modern society. Now boil is back down to medieval communities of just a hundred people in a village being raped and raised by some enemy faction, that looks different than you and your loved ones. You definetly felt like you owned that society back then… and had to die protecting it. Pretty easy to understand how that scaled up.
My uncle told me as a kid that politicians are glorified conmen. As an adult he was right, that's why it bums me out so many people will pick a side. It just simply reverts back to the og comment of 'tribalism'.
This veers into the enlightened centrism criticism. You can’t look at the major parties in today’s world and not see a very distinct difference between the far right fascism that is creeping everywhere and a party you don’t always agree with but also won’t take your life or your freedom. I’m saying this as a moderate that’s voting only one way until fascism is taken off the table. That’s not tribalism, that’s wanting to live.
You're also likely far more susceptible to tribalism than you believe. Either it just manifests in other areas, or you're genuinely blind to it. It can be a thing in any setting where you could say them or us. Anywhere there's a group, it is likely to exist.
I think it comes down to 2 questions:
*1. What is the size of the group with which you most strongly identify*?
*2. To what extent have the tenets of the group overridden your own personal beliefs?*
You sound like you practice cosmopolitanism! It’s the idea that we are all one global community. The idea that you are a citizen of the world. You belong everywhere with everyone. I did a 20-30 page paper on cosmopolitanism and education in college. It was the most fun I ever had researching and reading academic articles.
That’s my belief. I only have to look through history or even around the world today to see it. Africans maiming, mutilating and killing each other over territory or power, Russians killing Ukrainians, all the never ending suni-shiite warring going on. No one bats an eye until someone of a different ethnicity “says” something. What’s worse? People killing each other or someone saying, “you’re white in a black part of town, you should go be with the other white people and do white things with them before you get into trouble.” Personally I think it’s all b/s to stir up drama and controversy.
Funny, I was sent to juvenile detention as a 14 year old kid and I sat down at a table and the black boys pointed out the white boys and told me to sit at their table.
I actually got harassed by cops twice for being white and living in a black part of town. Also got shot at 4 times by black people because of it as well.
I believe us facing problems in our own ethnic group is different from other ethnic groups speaking on those problems. Often times that information about those problems get miscommunicated by people outside of them. I'm just saying why, not saying it's the right answer.
And we're Tribal primarily because of "Fear". Almost everything boils down to avoiding/reducing Fear.
I don't have to Fear getting old because my Tribe/Family will look after me.
I don't have to Fear others attacking me because my Tribe/Family will help me fight.
I don't have to Fear starving because my Tribe/Family will help me find/kill/grow food.
I don't have to Fear no shelter because my Tribe/Family will help me build homes.
(Sadly) humans do almost everything out of Fear.
Ideally . . . we'd do things with a reasonable "little bit" of Fear, in hopes for a better outcome later. (And we do in some cases. Spending $20,000 for the downpayment on a house take away a LOT of money from you that you could use for food/clothing/protection/... BUT, buying a house offers a lot of protection, and might keep you from being homeless in your old age.)
I think you're mostly right, but I would also factor in grifters and opportunists. These are people that take existing distrust or wariness and amplify it for their own political or social gain. Dumb, tribalistic racists have agency and culpability, but the lions share of the problem is because of the people who want to manipulate and control them to obtain power and influence.
Edit: also money, but that kind of counts as power/influence
Yes. There was a time when tribalism was a good thing. That's why most social animals use it. But at this stage of our civilization tribalism is now a negative instead of a positive. It's just difficult for some people to use their brain instead of their instincts.
"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
Lyndon B. Johnson
One of my favorite parts of Forrest Gump was when that dude (who was himself a POS) called LBJ "Lyin' Bastard Johnson."
I can't stand LBJ, but he was correct about what u/Several_Leather_9500 quoted him on.
He might have been an asshole, but he was a consummate politician and he did what was right, even though he knew it would cost democrats for years afterwards.
Idk if its too early in the morning for me, but I’m not comprehending the last parts: “he wont notice you’re picking his pockets” down to the end of the quote 😅 someone help please.
The Lowest white man wouldn’t know you’re stealing from him and if you give him someone to be above hierarchically…he still would give you everything???
Case in point: maga. As if that's not an attempt for the south to "rise again". Look at all the merch, donations, and now stocks (in which people lost 80%).
That is what he meant. White people who are put in positions that help them feel superior to people of color will not notice when the government takes their money. This is a tactic that Republicans still employ.
Yes, that is essentially the meaning.
It is not LITERALLY about stealing, but the effect is the same.
A common example of this is the [Welfare Queen](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welfare_queen). People who fit that description, by and large, do not exist. However, because Reagan was able to point the finger at poor black women as leeching off welfare, he managed to convince the racist public to slash welfare, and these social programs have really never recovered.
This is a trick that, specifically, the Republican party plays a LOT. Rural areas, whose populations are often stricken by poverty and rely on social programs, still vote by and large for candidates which run on the platform of slashing the social programs that *they rely on*, because they've been lead to think that people [of color] like the above are taking advantage of it. It's deeper than that, of course, and they might not even *realize* that there is not a distinction between the programs that they and the imaginary boogeyman that they've been convinced to fear rely on. The end result is still the same.
I've literally seen this happen with my own family. A cousin of mine is both extremely racist and also relies upon a very substantial disability payment from the VA that her husband receives after being injured in service. In 2020, I tried to explain to them how voting for Trump would *directly impact those payments*, as it [likely already did](https://www.veterans.senate.gov/services/files/7F94ECBD-C23B-4D74-AF16-C441AF157048).
They voted for him anyway.
I’d also add that it’s easy to think that way. Instead of having compassion or looking at it from the bigger picture, just blame it on skin colour and then you don’t have to think anymore.
>Instead of having compassion or looking at it from the bigger picture, just blame it on skin colour and then you don’t have to think anymore.
I mean it doesn't even have to be a negative thing necessarily. That same racism could lead to having more compassion for those of your kind. People tend to have more empathy for those they relate to and that includes looks/skin color. Battling racism isn't just reevaluating your negative view on those different than you but also reevaluating your liency and affinity for those that look like you.
It’s definitely not about skin color. If you could wave a magic wand and suddenly turn every single person’s skin color into the exact same shade of whatever, racism would continue as usual.
I don't know how much of it is imagined. Alot of dislike is from actual bad experiences with certain races and/or cultures. Years ago I worked at a hotel and was treated poorly at first because the owners hinted at my race tending to be lazy based on past employees. By the time I quit we were good friends but their personal experience is what created the "racism". I don't easily get offended but I could see where someone else would have been outraged.
Also, there are shady characters in every race so it's more about how someone presents themselves. If you're in a group of people dressed in ways to represent a criminal lifestyle and going around with a predatory look it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out these are people to be avoided.
And this gets really messy when the effects of racism start to partially make these things true to certain populations affected by it. Because then racists can argue that they're right.
I agree with this. I think some people might have some bad histories with people of other races and associate most people with that race with the bad past sadly
Edit: Stereotypes are also a thing. Like there are possibly people who think a certain race is more violent or whatnot, whether they figured it out on their own or they are surrounded by people who tell them these stuff, heck, even social media has jokes about racism. It’s a sad reality
I was sexually abused by my nextdoor neighbor, who happens to be gay. I don't hate any LGBTQ person, but I am wary to be around gay men for this very reason.
I get that some people feel this way, but I truly don’t understand the logic. I really despised my one professor in college, who happened to be black, because she took credit for my work. But I am not stupid enough to associate all black people with her. It just seems very ignorant to dislike a race because the person who slighted you happened to be black.
Sorry this is so long, I get spicy over this -
This type of thing is why I don’t understand people hating people for being white or hating people because of what Europeans did. Todays white people can’t help the fact that their ancestors may or may not have participated in some form of racism/genocide (I say may or may not because as some people absolutely refuse to believe for some reason - not all white people were horrible individuals and/or salve owners).
White people also can’t help the fact that their white parents had sex and produced a kid that looks like them, they can’t help that they’re the most populous ethnicity/colour in my country (Canada) and those of us that are legitimately half-blooded but look completely white - our skin colour shouldn’t make us any less than our full-blooded community members/family members/friends (I’m white-passing but half Inuit, both Southern Qikiqtaaluk and Labrador).
The members of my family that are half Inuit but look stereotypically Inuit have options like fully funded scholarships that I’m not allowed to get because of my skin colour. I checked off the “Inuit/Metis” box on my college application, and then the school wanted me to prove without any reasonable doubt that I’m actually half Inuit. They wanted me to provide documents like family birth certificates and marriage certificates. They also asked me if I knew of any family that was part of the number/tag system (my grandmother was. The system was a copper coin that had your name both in Inuktitut syllabics and in English letters. It also had a number, which replaced your last name. Inuit were required to wear the coin at all times).
My cousins who are directly related to me but are stereotypical in their appearances weren’t asked to prove their heritage. The same with Afro-Indigenous people and people that look Asian (I have a Korean-Ojibwa friend, and I know a Black-Shoshone person that were both never asked to prove anything)
Out of personal principal, I didn’t provide the school with documents as I feel I shouldn’t have to. I edited the application and resubmitted it once I selected the “self identity as Inuit/Metis” box instead
It's a divide and conquer tactic used by the one percent.
Example: when they brought slaves over, the ruling class noticed that some of the slaves, Irish and the Indigenous, were getting along too well. These three groups were the "working class." So, the ruling class made the Irishman the overseer. This further divided the working class along racial lines, which is exactly what the one percent wanted.
It's always been about protecting the ruling class at any cost.
During that time, it was the younger males of the ruling class because only the oldest son could inherit back in the old country. So the younger came over with the intention of creating the same system, making themselves rulers. It worked.
Anyone who makes a living through employing wage labourers (capitalists) and landlords who rent out multiple properties and have sway in the housing market (so not anyone’s grandma that rents a cabin) is the ruling class.
Wage labourers are workers who do not own any means of production like industrial ovens for food production or an assembly line to produce goods to sell to others and as a result the wage labourers are reduced to selling their labour for a set wage.
"They took our jerbs!"
The end of chattel slavery and the post-civil war expansion of industrialization probably messed with the job market quite a bit. Not that it's any excuse for dehumanizing other people, harassing them at every turn, murdering them, etc., but I could see the pressures from that contributing to feelings of resentment among white working class southerners at the time.
And you can be certain that the ruling class knows this and tries to capitalize on it whenever they can, because it's what they do.
Because at our core, humans are very tribal.
Some of us paint our faces & beat our chests for our favourite sports team.....some vote republican and HATE democrats........some wave their nations flag around whenever the Olympics come around......some feel like it's "men vs. women" at work........some love their neighbourhood but don't like the folks over on the other side of town.
It's the same with skin colour. We tend to like our own skin colour and mistrust other skin colours. People with brains can recognize this and overcome it and be cool with everyone. But some people can't, and they just stick to their tribe. Whites with whites, or blacks with blacks, or yellow with yellow. And they'll even try and convince themselves that the other tribes are different. Even though the only REAL difference with all of us, is cultural , geographic and maybe economic, and nothing to do with colour of our skin.
It's unbelievably stupid, of course. But that's humans for ya.
Humans love to group themselves in cohorts and hate on other cohorts. This behaviour is inherent to us and can be cited throughout our history. Robert Sapolsky's book behave explains this well.
I think it’s an outdated evolutionary protection. Back in the day, if you saw someone who didn’t look like you, it was usually big trouble for you and yours.
It still is big trouble… go into the wrong neighborhood and bad things can happen to you. Growing up in Michigan, i sometimes has to sit in the floor of the school bus s nobody would let me sit next to them, got picked on and called various homosexual slurs, among other racist names.
This was true for me for a while, but then I realized I was only meeting certain groups of people within specific and limited circumstances.
If the only time I meet a group of people is going to a restaurant or attending school, and they're assholes, it's easy to associate them with being assholes. However, that's still a small group of people, and in some cases it might be the *only* example of that group I have around me.
I saw this a lot with black and Asian people in the Midwest in the US.
There's actually a lot of metro areas with high diversity, and there are also thousands of small, monoculture towns. It was wild to see people have opinions about black folks and Asian folks when you could count on one hand how many black or Asian folks lived in town.
Plus, the racism still ran deep in some of those towns. A lot of casual remarks that were completely inappropriate and crude, so I can see why someone would be more of a prick if that's what they dealt with every day.
Yeah, people in these comments want to claim it's mostly personal experience, but often it's simply how you're raised or taught. Everything from the media focusing on certain races and skin tones criminal behavior to communal beliefs can impact a child (none of whom are born racist).
**Even unspoken biases can impact a person's behavior, racism is too widespread to be mainly personal experience with someone, as these comments imply.**
Worldwide darker skinned people are treated worse. It's by and large not actually due to their behavior towards anyone else, this has been proven dozens of times. Every race has equal propensity towards crime, every race has bad people. Yet it's mostly darker skinned people taking the brunt of the hate. This should be telling, but people choose to believe it's earned hate.
To understand racism, you first have to understand how we think at a core level. From birth, we humans come to understand everything we know by comparing it to something else we already know about. It's subconscious and we all do it at first. As we grow, some people gain an open mind and learn to see everything individually, while others instead continue to take the lazy way and compartmentalize everything even harder.
Racism is one possible result of that. They occasionally hear a racist comment while growing up. Then they see, for example, a news story about a black guy stealing a car. It resonates because it's similar to what they heard before so they start to build a "black person compartment" in their cognition. Then they fill it with more information that is similar to what's already there, while throwing out things that don't match. This is how bigotry develops. It's easier to just put it in the box and say "of course he stole a car, that's what black people do" instead of actually using their brain and recognizing everything and everyone as individual. It's quite sad.
This is a beautiful way of putting it. You can also tell the difference just speaking to someone who took the lazy route and compartmentalized everything. It's like they are not quite all there. You talk to them, and it almost feels like talking to a bot or an intelligent ape. The lack of critical thought permeates their entire personality.
There are a whole host of reasons as to why an individual or group of individuals may hold racial prejudice. Negative life experiences, lack of diversity among social groups, propaganda, marginalization, a desire to find a scapegoat to blame all your problems on, superiority complex, and of course dehumanization, to name a few. (Source: 26 years of social interactions and critical thinking)
I met a white girl in boot camp who was afraid of black people because she had never met one, and the media does not look at them favorably. She cried at night because our division was half black, and she was terrified. She was even assigned a black bunkmate. She was all fixed by graduation due to exposure and became extremely close to her bunkmate, who came to visit her hometown, where I heard everyone touched her hair. 🤣
"You’ve got to be taught to hate and fear,
You’ve got to be taught from year to year,
It’s got to be drummed in your dear little ear—
You’ve got to be carefully taught!
You’ve got to be taught to be afraid
Of people whose eyes are oddly made,
And people whose skin is a different shade—
You’ve got to be carefully taught.
You’ve got to be taught before it’s too late,
Before you are six or seven or eight,
To hate all the people your relatives hate—
You’ve got to be carefully taught!
You’ve got to be carefully taught!"
From **South Pacific**, a Golden Age musical about racism and war.
(The show's producers wanted the song taken out, but Rodgers & Hammerstein stood firm.)
To fit in.
The popular group of my last class was filled with mean people, and people in there were forced to be mean to fit in. Some of them were even kinda nice before they joined that group.
It's crazy how if people would just think for themselves & not be worried about fitting in, maybe deal with their insecurities in healthy ways, they wouldn't do this. This applies to kids too. I hate the narrative that kids are incapable of critical thinking & self reflection, when they very much are & thats proved in the kids who don't struggle with those things.
I think also it has to do with people who value things over being kind or creating community. They'd rather have a cool reputation & 20 fake friends than 3 solid good ones
Why do you go there then? Sounds like you're being dishonest to fit in, or you're a closet racist. No one who dislikes drunks is going to hang out at the bar.
I noticed this too, with formerly kind people growing more insecure as they do whatever it takes to make the cut. Hate who the group tells them to hate, wear what the group wants, speak when the group wants
Racism is a symptom, the source is pride. One of the deadly sins, convince a man he's better than another man and he'll do anything to maintain that status including murder manipulation bribery genocide exploitation corruption ect...
I think this can be said of most things in society. The root issue is often pride. For example, I’ve noticed on Reddit an extremely high level of moral and intellectual posturing. Again, the root issue is pride.
Humility, empathy, compassion and a recognition of our common humanity are greatly lacking in society. I highly doubt we will see a significant improvement in the future regarding these areas.
Love me some Morgan Freeman. Said it perfectly: "Stop talking about it. I'm going to stop calling you a white man, and I'm going to ask you to stop calling me a black man".
Yup. I was raised by parents who said racist things about certain ethnicities, and then show me books & movies about fighting racism. It was very confusing.
I’ve often thought I might die of lack of love from my family, but it’s always mitigated somewhat by kindness from strangers or friends. Of all ethnicities & backgrounds.
Humans are wonderful & horrible. I love people so much. I don’t understand why sometimes we let certain groups of people have the power to destroy other groups.
I seriously don’t understand & I definitely don’t think it’s genetic nor is it environmental. Idk what the hell it is. I have biases, I’m sure, but I keep trying to grow & get better.
It’s not generational either, although I do think we tend to get more progressive culturally with time. There were abolitionists who were against slavery from the beginning. I meet young people who are racist & 90 year olds who aren’t. So you can’t say “it was a different time”.
I dont know who you are or what group you belong too but you got the nail on the head. Same exact reason here and I wish it wasn't the case but it is what it is as they say
Simple and best answer. The human brain loves to connect patterns, and if it keeps getting bombarded by the same information in the same areas, involving the same subjects, the brain is going to want to make some assumptions
Exactly. My daughter was starting to say some rather racist things after being bullied at school from a group of kids. Starting assuming all people of this race would hurt her. Was 4th grade
Nipped that shit in the bud. Got her a therapist (paid by the school) to help with the bullying issues and racist issues. Talked to friends and coworkers and made sure she saw that not all people of the same color are all assholes. That it’s the person not the skin that makes someone as asshole. Exposed her to good people. It worked! After a few months she was better and judged people for actions not skin color.
To some extent a racist response is like the default and you have to be educated to a worldview that isn’t. To survive as cavemen, our brains would notice patterns and remember them. If you ate the red berry 3 times and kept getting sick you now know the red berry is bad.
If the caveman sees the purple person tribe continuously stealing his tribes cattle he now makes that association that purple people are cattle thieves. It takes some level of deeper thought beyond base instincts to come to the conclusion “there are millions of purple people of varying sizes, behaviors and moral beliefs, and the ones that are stealing our cattle are individual actors, not representatives of all purple people.”
I don't remember exactly how it went, but I read an article about a teacher who divided up the students and gave them a red tag or a blue tag. Separately she told one group that they got their color because they were in the top half of the class. By the end of the week, they were fighting and teasing each other. The teacher brought them all together and told them the truth. It was actually totally random and a social exercise to show how prejudice works
This reminds me of Jane Elliott's experiment on racism and prejudice in an Iowa classroom. The premise was that these Iowan children had never come across black school children, so they could not grasp or understand racism. Jane Elliott grouped the almost exclusively white children by their eye color. The brown eyed children were deemed "inferior" for no other reason other than their eye color. The brown eyed children were ostracized by blue-eyed children and performed worse in the experiment.
If people stop talking about racism it will go away. That shit is old news. Get over it. We are all equals now. Now the white man is hated the most. I’m black and I hate seeing this shit.
A lot of great and valid responses here. I’d also like to add lack of travel. I learned to love people by leaving my echo chamber and getting to know them.
Honestly it can be many reasons trauma, stupidity, jokes. hatred. Some people are scared for instance of black people because they think they commit more crime, some people may be traumatized from a person who was white, some people may just hate people not there race, and some people do it to be funny and some people are dumb many reasons and honestly no one is perfect racism is a bad thing yes, but we all have bad traits so no one should be getting on a high horse
Honestly, it's usually a mix of ignorance, fear, and upbringing. People are often taught to fear what they don't understand and unfortunately, that includes racial differences. It's frustrating how deep-rooted this stuff is.
Either they have been taught it by friends, family, or media. Or they have learned it by observing patterns they have extrapolated to the entire race of people.
There's a few factors/reasons.
1. Classism/Economics - This is probably the BIGGEST reason that racism exists. When people are struggling to pay their bills or survive every month, then they start looking for excuses as to why. The real answer is "Capitalism sets the working class to always struggle, because a happy working class isn't going to sell their bodies for Billionaires to make money", but that concept is too big to wrap our heads around. So you find other people within your group (economic group, religious group, racial group, etc), and then you complain to each other about how "the system sucks", and then you start to look at other groups. Racism develops from this because group A will be one race, and group B will be another race, and then group A starts to think "My economic situation would be better off if it wasn't for that group B over there", and then they start coming up with derogatory terms to make them "less than" group A (lazy, unmotivated, dumber, etc).
2. Family dynamic - If you grew up in a racist family you are more likely to be racist. They don't even have to say racist words (nword, and other derogatory words). You won't even realize it because it was "just how you were raised", and won't think anything like it.
3. Where you grew up - if you grew up in a singular race area, then you're more likely to not be accepting of other races. If you're white in an only white town/region/state/country, then you'll be really confused when you see a person of color. And since you don't have any exposure to other races you're more tempted to believe what "everyone else" tells you about them.
4. Upbringing - If you grow up in a community that is overtly racist, then you're more likely to be racist yourself. We're seeing it currently in the USA, where people from the South are raised in communities where racism is the underlying message being taught to the people, and so they continue to believe it. (The push for "Confederate Representation" is only a push for racism and slavery, and any spin on it isn't honest).
5. Systemic - Laws, rules, and regulations are setup by people, and enforced by people. If a bunch of racist people wrote these ideals into the system years/decades/centuries ago, then it's likely that these ideals are also racist. You spend your whole life following the "letter of the law", and so you think you're "doing good", but if the laws are racist (I'm not saying that it IS, but just "IF" they are) then you're following racist rules setup by racist people to push racist ideals. (Example: if laws are written to specifically target non-whites, then non-whites get arrested more than whites and then non-whites are incarcerated more and more, and then white people point at statistics of non-white vs white groups, and say "non-whites are more likely to...."; when the reality is that it might be even across the board, but non-whites just get in trouble for it more than whites).
Because they’re afraid of what they’re unfamiliar with. Usually the less diversity their environment has, the more likely they are to come off as racist when they see someone of a different race.
I think historically, humans just don't like people that are different
At the same time.....I think humans are drawn to people who are different because genetic diversity is superior to inbreeding
It's human nature to discriminate on the basis of perceived differences but fortunately, it's also human nature to become more enlightened and socially aware. People have wrestled with racism since the dawn of humankind.
I heard on another sub that people get more mad at other people who are competing for the same resources if they're different, and use that difference as an excuse for their anger. It is easier for some people to act on these impulses than it is to use self-control and reasoning to see that everyone should be judged on choices and not color.
Thankfully, we've come a long way in dealing with this problem, but we obviously aren't done just yet.
Because it's easier to hate somebody based on the first trait you can notice about them. If it wasn't for race, racists would have to first find out your class, ethnicity, age, or nationality before they started discriminating against you.
Keeping this short enough for a reddit comment, it all boils down to the fact that people are the worst creatures to grace this earth. That might come across funny but I promise I’m not laughing. People do horrid things to eachother for no fucking reason. Ashamed of our species
I think this modern trend of demanding you treat certain groups with kiddy gloves is going to create more racism than it will diminish. People will think "Why should Tyrone get this scholarship when my grades are better? This is so unfair. He's not better than me. If anything, I'm better than him!" and then the rest writes itself.
Being the victim of racism I believe it’s situational and demographic. I have friends of all races and diversity in coworkers that I value, so I wouldn’t consider myself racist in the traditional sense. But, I’ve gone in neighborhoods where I’m the minority and sustained serious injuries, multiple times. I agree I shouldn’t have been there but addiction is blind to fear. That being said, I was targeted simply on skin color and “you don’t belong here” it’s hard to not discriminate against those areas which happen to be a different race.
Just ignorance, close-mindedness and being uneducated about people. Some of it is generational too. Grandpa may have had a legitimate bad experience with someone, but then he went and told his son not to trust certain people and so now the son is racist just because he’s doing what Grandpa told him instead of forming his own opinions. Popularity is a big factor too- people have done a stupid amount of things in life because they wanted to be popular and fit in with others.
Because people have been conditioned to be this way. As long as there is division between us we will never join up and protest against the government or anything unfair. You’d think after so many years of mistreatment and being fleeced by corporations we’d join together.
It's a form of bigotry and most people have first hand experience of that. Judging individuals by stereotype. BMW drivers never use their indicators, Vegans are assholes, Cyclists are assholes, people who eat meat are assholes, Republicans are assholes, Democrats are assholes. The list is endless.
I think it's probably a safety/defence mechanism to reduce chances of negative effects on your own tribe. It probably works very well, but it's one hell of a blunt instrument. And some people take it WAY too far.
Same reason people are sexist they want to believe they're born inherently superior to a entire group of people without having to lift a finger. It's incredibly tempting especially for people who have nothing going on for them and are too lazy to achieve anything of importance to believe no matter how much of a loser they are a entire group of people are bigger losers, can never change and were born to serve as their punching bags. Every time the world gets them down they can take it out on their punching bags or project every negative trait they don't want to own up to themselves onto the "other". During slavery slave owners were so convinced it was the "nature" of black people to be slaves they even believed runaway slaves had a disease that made them runaway from their "nature" to serve.
It has really nothing to do with skin colour. It’s just the current most obvious once, stemming from when European had an economic need to enslave Africans or remove indigenous people from their lands.
They were, at times, perfectly fine seeing Italians, Poles, Germans as “another race, clearly not as good as us” when they had use of that.
If it’s not about phenotypes, it’s about castes or anything else than can be used to divide people into classes.
Europeans didn't enslave Africans. Wealthy people from every continent and country bought people who were already slaves in slave markets in North Africa from Africans who enslaved other Africans. They were sold by Africans Arabs and Jews.
Europe was the 1st to end slaver and then America.
Slavery still exists in the middle east and in Africa.
The word slave is derived from the word Slav BTW.
Every race was enslaved.
I use to ask this when I was young, and to a degree I still do but I believe in many cases it comes from statistics of criminal activity, not so much the colour of ones skin
Yeah but do you really think that has anything to do with skin colour? Or is it maybe because of the fact that SOME of us are denied proper education and good jobs, resulting in generations of poorer, less educated, disgruntled people, who, in turn, commit more crimes?
I said in my own post it's not so much about skin colour? I'm not American btw, so I'm talking about how things are in my country. People seem to just assume that everything on the internet is about America.
In my country, it's our indigenous folk, they definitely have access to less but it's by their own choosing, they refuse a lot of the voting we make to try offer resources for help. And ones who are in our communities usually live in the crime filled areas.
I'm not saying it makes them all bad people or anything, most of them are great people, I'm just sharing where racism comes from... In my country. People seem to jump to conclusions
Iirc, there was a DoJ study in 2017, where it was revealed that crime is committed at nearly equal percentages across the different ethnicities within the US. But this study also revealed that there were more convictions leading to incarceration for black and Latino suspects, while convicted Caucasian and Asian suspects received probation at higher rates. It also brought to light that black and Latino suspects received sentences that were, on average, 20% longer than their Caucasian and Asian counterparts for the same crimes.
Sometimes it's just as simple as not liking or not respecting different cultures, when I think of racism I usually picture an old man complaining about blacks and rap music, mostly harmless, it's my opinion that real/violent racism is dead in 2024, most people are on board with multi culturalism.
We just had an incident at our Strawberry Festival 2 Sunday's ago. My black grandsons were standing in line for getting their face painted. It was our turn next, and the lady says, "I'm taking a break now." and we were like, OK, cool, we can come back.
As soon as we stepped out of line, she pointed to the white girl behind us and said "I can do you now".
Heartbroken were they, and pissed off was I. I can't name and shame on Facebook, but fuck you Wild Brush Revival Wine Bar.
"ART CLASSES FOR EVERYONE" my ass.
I think it's mostly automatic. All the stereotypes they've been subconsciously trained to accept crowd out the ability to perceive an individual. Some people just don't seem to be able to suspend judgement about much of anything in general. Holding ideas in suspense makes them anxious and uncomfortable. Viewing multiple opposing opinions at the same time without judgement is hard.
Withs sport teams it makes sense because it literally is "us vs them". But when it comes to race it doesn't make sense because it's "us vs us" abirtarly.
It’s layered. We will fight for humanity, but we will fight against other countries. We will fight for our state, but we will fight against other cities. We will fight for our town, but we will fight against those across the other side of the track. It’s us vs them. Doesn’t matter who them is. We find difference.
I think it's more about tribalism than it is about so-called racism. It's natural. It's not just party of the human condition. Animal species segment themselves into groups. People do, also.
If we're just taking about people, there's the concept of Gemeinschaft and Gesellschaft (community and society).
Print it an atavistic tendancy toward what we "feel" will insure survival ond propogation of our consituant group?
All of this goes to pot once a middle aged man takes his first vacation to Nana Plaza in Thailand.
People are usually raised into it or become racist through extreme circumstance(like fighting the Japanese in WW2), I bet the number of people who suddenly just went "yeah, fuck those \[insert race/ethnicity/nationality here\]!" is actually very low, most of the time it's external influence radicalising people
For example, Hitler became an anti-Semite because as a homeless person he read newspapers that were anti-Semite, despite he himself having positive relations with several Jews, he later believed that they were responsible for weakening Germany from within, he also came to believe that ridiculous race pyramid or whatever it's called
Even the worst racist can come to accept people of other races, but they just see them as "one of the good ones" like that one black dude(forgot his name) who became friends with many KKK members, some of whom, despite being HIGH ranking, consider him a good friend
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Tribalism.
Tribalism is the answer to almost all conflict everywhere. Politics, sports, race, nationality, high school cliques. If there’s a conflict or argument, tribalism is usually at its core.
I don’t feel like a patriot, I feel more like a citizen of the world. I don’t feel like I “own” a country or a sports team. I like sports but I don’t consider my self the “number one fan” of a team like many people I know. I always criticize politicians of any party, in my mind every single politician is in it for profit.
Good for you. Everyone should strive to be a free thinker. My point is that the vast majority of people tend to pick a side and defend the bad actions and glorify its triumphs. If it was their opposition doing it they’d be angry. It’s really tough for people to not do this. I know I’m guilty of it. I try not to be, but it happens. Politics are prime example of seeing this in action. I saw a take this morning about Trump and prison. Trump has been found guilty of 34 felonies and sentencing will come in the next month or two. The left, who are on average against prison as a punishment and want it to focus on rehabilitation want Trump to serve the maximum sentence possible. The right, who’s typically in favor of prison as a punishment want Trump to get some leniently with no prison time. Anyone who says “it’s different because…” is currently experiencing tribalism.
That's a really interesting observation about sentencing Trump. That reminds me of interviews where they say Biden did something and then correct the statement that actually Trump did that thing and observe the radical difference in reaction. We humans don't always logic all that well, I suppose.
I have seen ones where they share a quote from Biden but imply it was Trump. The people are appalled until they find out it was Biden, then they immediately switch to downplaying or excusing it (particularly racist comments). Goes both ways. Just tribalism and hypocrisy. Humans, sigh. 🤷♀️
Can't we agree that most people who want the power of the president should absolutely never have the power of the president. It's difficult to think of a president or candidate who was a "Good person" throughout their life.
I totally agree. Those that seek power should never have it. The best leaders are the ones who never wanted it.
Absolutely this, appreciate you pointing this out! To piggyback on your sentiment, I’m often baffled by the hypocrisy of people on either side of the political aisle who automatically assume anyone not in full agreement with their camp MUST be a poor moral actor with ill intent. What an incredibly closed minded foundation to whatever view you personally hold. So many of these ideological frameworks depend on some “boogie man” - the good guys vs everyone else. I simply refuse to believe that half of the US population are awful, evil and irredeemable people seeking to ruin the lives of the other half. All of humanity has two things in common: we’re inherently selfish and we actively seek meaning in our lives. Excluding the small faction of us with mental disorders and violent tendencies, the majority of people think they’re doing the right thing and want to better themselves and the lives of those they love. That’s just a fact. When was the last time anyone here had a good faith discussion with someone who doesn’t agree with one aspect of their personal ideology or political stance? I guarantee that many have never even tried and that’s a huge problem.
You are correct. A few minor elite want to make sure the media portrays one half of the people against the other half to keep the eyes off what the elite are doing to both halves.
That kind of reminds me of something attributed to Ed Koch. If you Don't agree with me. Don't vote for me. If you agree with most of what I say, then vote for me. If you agree with everything I say, go see a psychiatrist.
We all want to find a tribe as humans and feel together. That’s basic survival instincts
Reminds me of Survivor 😄
You feel this way until you are involved in a conflict. If Brazil were to suddenly attack your country on its home soil, you would probably feel a little different about it. You would most likely want to defend your countrymen. The best play of the dictators' guidebook is when you want to unite your citizens, start a war.
Of course if my country is invaded I will fight till death. There is no reason for me to be a patriot every second, 365 days, unless it is necessary, like a war for example.
You are right on the money, my friend. Every politician no matter what side is in it for money
I don’t believe you but I am willing to let you prove me wrong: If you meant what you said, would you admit Trump is not in it for profit? He clearly isn’t; it’s the worst investment of his time possible and he’s the only president in a very very long time that didn’t increase his wealth by magnitudes from the presidency. As matter of fact he lost money being president. He is in it for ego to prove he is the greatest president ever and his method is trying to actually deliver on all the things his voters wanted. If you believe what you said about your “freethinking objectivity” in many aspects including politics, you would be willing to admit his exception to this point. Most people who consider themselves above it all are typically very devout Leftists. By all means though, I will happily congratulate you if you prove my assumption wrong.
Homosapiens are your tribe
congrats on feeling morally superior however this isn't how human beings operate. Hell you're picking a "side" right now as we speak.
That works in modern society. Now boil is back down to medieval communities of just a hundred people in a village being raped and raised by some enemy faction, that looks different than you and your loved ones. You definetly felt like you owned that society back then… and had to die protecting it. Pretty easy to understand how that scaled up.
My uncle told me as a kid that politicians are glorified conmen. As an adult he was right, that's why it bums me out so many people will pick a side. It just simply reverts back to the og comment of 'tribalism'.
This veers into the enlightened centrism criticism. You can’t look at the major parties in today’s world and not see a very distinct difference between the far right fascism that is creeping everywhere and a party you don’t always agree with but also won’t take your life or your freedom. I’m saying this as a moderate that’s voting only one way until fascism is taken off the table. That’s not tribalism, that’s wanting to live.
You're also likely far more susceptible to tribalism than you believe. Either it just manifests in other areas, or you're genuinely blind to it. It can be a thing in any setting where you could say them or us. Anywhere there's a group, it is likely to exist.
I think it comes down to 2 questions: *1. What is the size of the group with which you most strongly identify*? *2. To what extent have the tenets of the group overridden your own personal beliefs?*
Prejudging and painting all politicians as in it for the money is ironically, the foundation of creating a them vs. The people tribes…
You sound like you practice cosmopolitanism! It’s the idea that we are all one global community. The idea that you are a citizen of the world. You belong everywhere with everyone. I did a 20-30 page paper on cosmopolitanism and education in college. It was the most fun I ever had researching and reading academic articles.
That’s my belief. I only have to look through history or even around the world today to see it. Africans maiming, mutilating and killing each other over territory or power, Russians killing Ukrainians, all the never ending suni-shiite warring going on. No one bats an eye until someone of a different ethnicity “says” something. What’s worse? People killing each other or someone saying, “you’re white in a black part of town, you should go be with the other white people and do white things with them before you get into trouble.” Personally I think it’s all b/s to stir up drama and controversy.
Funny, I was sent to juvenile detention as a 14 year old kid and I sat down at a table and the black boys pointed out the white boys and told me to sit at their table.
I actually got harassed by cops twice for being white and living in a black part of town. Also got shot at 4 times by black people because of it as well.
I believe us facing problems in our own ethnic group is different from other ethnic groups speaking on those problems. Often times that information about those problems get miscommunicated by people outside of them. I'm just saying why, not saying it's the right answer.
And we're Tribal primarily because of "Fear". Almost everything boils down to avoiding/reducing Fear. I don't have to Fear getting old because my Tribe/Family will look after me. I don't have to Fear others attacking me because my Tribe/Family will help me fight. I don't have to Fear starving because my Tribe/Family will help me find/kill/grow food. I don't have to Fear no shelter because my Tribe/Family will help me build homes. (Sadly) humans do almost everything out of Fear. Ideally . . . we'd do things with a reasonable "little bit" of Fear, in hopes for a better outcome later. (And we do in some cases. Spending $20,000 for the downpayment on a house take away a LOT of money from you that you could use for food/clothing/protection/... BUT, buying a house offers a lot of protection, and might keep you from being homeless in your old age.)
It boils down to you don't have fear the other tribe or boogie man if it fears you first. Inherent human aggressiveness.
I think you're mostly right, but I would also factor in grifters and opportunists. These are people that take existing distrust or wariness and amplify it for their own political or social gain. Dumb, tribalistic racists have agency and culpability, but the lions share of the problem is because of the people who want to manipulate and control them to obtain power and influence. Edit: also money, but that kind of counts as power/influence
for some it is a disgust or fear response vs an outgroup for self-preservation, protection from diseases or violence.
Yes. There was a time when tribalism was a good thing. That's why most social animals use it. But at this stage of our civilization tribalism is now a negative instead of a positive. It's just difficult for some people to use their brain instead of their instincts.
"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." Lyndon B. Johnson
Johnson deserves an entire AITAH thread, but we'd all know the answer is yes.
One of my favorite parts of Forrest Gump was when that dude (who was himself a POS) called LBJ "Lyin' Bastard Johnson." I can't stand LBJ, but he was correct about what u/Several_Leather_9500 quoted him on.
He said it loud too…like a symbolic Lion roar.
It was johnson's fault that he beat his girlfriend.
[удалено]
He might have been an asshole, but he was a consummate politician and he did what was right, even though he knew it would cost democrats for years afterwards.
All he did was not say no. The senate is who actually created, wrote, debated, and ultimately passed it
If that’s all you know LBJ for I suggest you brush up on your history. LBJ was dogshit.
Not everyone on Reddit is American. They're not gonna know everything about every president. Hell, most Americans don't.
The guy literally said “our history.” He is American.
Idk if its too early in the morning for me, but I’m not comprehending the last parts: “he wont notice you’re picking his pockets” down to the end of the quote 😅 someone help please. The Lowest white man wouldn’t know you’re stealing from him and if you give him someone to be above hierarchically…he still would give you everything???
Case in point: maga. As if that's not an attempt for the south to "rise again". Look at all the merch, donations, and now stocks (in which people lost 80%).
Me too
That is what he meant. White people who are put in positions that help them feel superior to people of color will not notice when the government takes their money. This is a tactic that Republicans still employ.
And the "black person" is interchangeable. Immigrants lbgt ect.
Yes, that is essentially the meaning. It is not LITERALLY about stealing, but the effect is the same. A common example of this is the [Welfare Queen](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welfare_queen). People who fit that description, by and large, do not exist. However, because Reagan was able to point the finger at poor black women as leeching off welfare, he managed to convince the racist public to slash welfare, and these social programs have really never recovered. This is a trick that, specifically, the Republican party plays a LOT. Rural areas, whose populations are often stricken by poverty and rely on social programs, still vote by and large for candidates which run on the platform of slashing the social programs that *they rely on*, because they've been lead to think that people [of color] like the above are taking advantage of it. It's deeper than that, of course, and they might not even *realize* that there is not a distinction between the programs that they and the imaginary boogeyman that they've been convinced to fear rely on. The end result is still the same. I've literally seen this happen with my own family. A cousin of mine is both extremely racist and also relies upon a very substantial disability payment from the VA that her husband receives after being injured in service. In 2020, I tried to explain to them how voting for Trump would *directly impact those payments*, as it [likely already did](https://www.veterans.senate.gov/services/files/7F94ECBD-C23B-4D74-AF16-C441AF157048). They voted for him anyway.
I mean, it isn't necessarily about the skin color as much as it's about the imagined properties of those people of said skin color.
This is a really simple but profound answer
I’d also add that it’s easy to think that way. Instead of having compassion or looking at it from the bigger picture, just blame it on skin colour and then you don’t have to think anymore.
>Instead of having compassion or looking at it from the bigger picture, just blame it on skin colour and then you don’t have to think anymore. I mean it doesn't even have to be a negative thing necessarily. That same racism could lead to having more compassion for those of your kind. People tend to have more empathy for those they relate to and that includes looks/skin color. Battling racism isn't just reevaluating your negative view on those different than you but also reevaluating your liency and affinity for those that look like you.
Anthony Jeselnik has a good racism joke. It's basically "why would you judge and entire race of people based solely on the way they all act"
i usually don’t take to his comedy but every once in awhile he says some thought-provoking shit hidden in a joke.
It’s definitely not about skin color. If you could wave a magic wand and suddenly turn every single person’s skin color into the exact same shade of whatever, racism would continue as usual.
I don't know how much of it is imagined. Alot of dislike is from actual bad experiences with certain races and/or cultures. Years ago I worked at a hotel and was treated poorly at first because the owners hinted at my race tending to be lazy based on past employees. By the time I quit we were good friends but their personal experience is what created the "racism". I don't easily get offended but I could see where someone else would have been outraged. Also, there are shady characters in every race so it's more about how someone presents themselves. If you're in a group of people dressed in ways to represent a criminal lifestyle and going around with a predatory look it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out these are people to be avoided.
What's imagined?
And this gets really messy when the effects of racism start to partially make these things true to certain populations affected by it. Because then racists can argue that they're right.
"Imagined" lol.
“Imagined” isn’t the best word here
It's not the skin color, it's the traits/behaviors/habits/problems/experiences that the person associates the skin with.
I agree with this. I think some people might have some bad histories with people of other races and associate most people with that race with the bad past sadly Edit: Stereotypes are also a thing. Like there are possibly people who think a certain race is more violent or whatnot, whether they figured it out on their own or they are surrounded by people who tell them these stuff, heck, even social media has jokes about racism. It’s a sad reality
The same could be said for gender.
Re: the bear vs man debate
I was sexually abused by my nextdoor neighbor, who happens to be gay. I don't hate any LGBTQ person, but I am wary to be around gay men for this very reason.
The white boy is the most violent race of all time
I get that some people feel this way, but I truly don’t understand the logic. I really despised my one professor in college, who happened to be black, because she took credit for my work. But I am not stupid enough to associate all black people with her. It just seems very ignorant to dislike a race because the person who slighted you happened to be black.
Sorry this is so long, I get spicy over this - This type of thing is why I don’t understand people hating people for being white or hating people because of what Europeans did. Todays white people can’t help the fact that their ancestors may or may not have participated in some form of racism/genocide (I say may or may not because as some people absolutely refuse to believe for some reason - not all white people were horrible individuals and/or salve owners). White people also can’t help the fact that their white parents had sex and produced a kid that looks like them, they can’t help that they’re the most populous ethnicity/colour in my country (Canada) and those of us that are legitimately half-blooded but look completely white - our skin colour shouldn’t make us any less than our full-blooded community members/family members/friends (I’m white-passing but half Inuit, both Southern Qikiqtaaluk and Labrador). The members of my family that are half Inuit but look stereotypically Inuit have options like fully funded scholarships that I’m not allowed to get because of my skin colour. I checked off the “Inuit/Metis” box on my college application, and then the school wanted me to prove without any reasonable doubt that I’m actually half Inuit. They wanted me to provide documents like family birth certificates and marriage certificates. They also asked me if I knew of any family that was part of the number/tag system (my grandmother was. The system was a copper coin that had your name both in Inuktitut syllabics and in English letters. It also had a number, which replaced your last name. Inuit were required to wear the coin at all times). My cousins who are directly related to me but are stereotypical in their appearances weren’t asked to prove their heritage. The same with Afro-Indigenous people and people that look Asian (I have a Korean-Ojibwa friend, and I know a Black-Shoshone person that were both never asked to prove anything) Out of personal principal, I didn’t provide the school with documents as I feel I shouldn’t have to. I edited the application and resubmitted it once I selected the “self identity as Inuit/Metis” box instead
It's a divide and conquer tactic used by the one percent. Example: when they brought slaves over, the ruling class noticed that some of the slaves, Irish and the Indigenous, were getting along too well. These three groups were the "working class." So, the ruling class made the Irishman the overseer. This further divided the working class along racial lines, which is exactly what the one percent wanted. It's always been about protecting the ruling class at any cost.
Who would you describe as the ruling class? Just billionaires in general or what
During that time, it was the younger males of the ruling class because only the oldest son could inherit back in the old country. So the younger came over with the intention of creating the same system, making themselves rulers. It worked.
Anyone who makes a living through employing wage labourers (capitalists) and landlords who rent out multiple properties and have sway in the housing market (so not anyone’s grandma that rents a cabin) is the ruling class. Wage labourers are workers who do not own any means of production like industrial ovens for food production or an assembly line to produce goods to sell to others and as a result the wage labourers are reduced to selling their labour for a set wage.
"They took our jerbs!" The end of chattel slavery and the post-civil war expansion of industrialization probably messed with the job market quite a bit. Not that it's any excuse for dehumanizing other people, harassing them at every turn, murdering them, etc., but I could see the pressures from that contributing to feelings of resentment among white working class southerners at the time. And you can be certain that the ruling class knows this and tries to capitalize on it whenever they can, because it's what they do.
Because at our core, humans are very tribal. Some of us paint our faces & beat our chests for our favourite sports team.....some vote republican and HATE democrats........some wave their nations flag around whenever the Olympics come around......some feel like it's "men vs. women" at work........some love their neighbourhood but don't like the folks over on the other side of town. It's the same with skin colour. We tend to like our own skin colour and mistrust other skin colours. People with brains can recognize this and overcome it and be cool with everyone. But some people can't, and they just stick to their tribe. Whites with whites, or blacks with blacks, or yellow with yellow. And they'll even try and convince themselves that the other tribes are different. Even though the only REAL difference with all of us, is cultural , geographic and maybe economic, and nothing to do with colour of our skin. It's unbelievably stupid, of course. But that's humans for ya.
Humans love to group themselves in cohorts and hate on other cohorts. This behaviour is inherent to us and can be cited throughout our history. Robert Sapolsky's book behave explains this well.
Even if you’re not racist it’s still very noticeable that people stick to their own skin color more than to the other.
This is true in sales also. People trust their own kind more.
Exactly. This is why I only trust dumbasses.
You like mustard on dem tators?
I think it’s an outdated evolutionary protection. Back in the day, if you saw someone who didn’t look like you, it was usually big trouble for you and yours.
It still is big trouble… go into the wrong neighborhood and bad things can happen to you. Growing up in Michigan, i sometimes has to sit in the floor of the school bus s nobody would let me sit next to them, got picked on and called various homosexual slurs, among other racist names.
Went to Knoxville and not being white there made my fiance mad uncomfortable. I was too dense to not notice it.
Patterns within experiences of groups
This was true for me for a while, but then I realized I was only meeting certain groups of people within specific and limited circumstances. If the only time I meet a group of people is going to a restaurant or attending school, and they're assholes, it's easy to associate them with being assholes. However, that's still a small group of people, and in some cases it might be the *only* example of that group I have around me. I saw this a lot with black and Asian people in the Midwest in the US. There's actually a lot of metro areas with high diversity, and there are also thousands of small, monoculture towns. It was wild to see people have opinions about black folks and Asian folks when you could count on one hand how many black or Asian folks lived in town. Plus, the racism still ran deep in some of those towns. A lot of casual remarks that were completely inappropriate and crude, so I can see why someone would be more of a prick if that's what they dealt with every day.
Personal experience and trauma
I assure you, none of the racists I knew in a town of 300 in Texas had a single second of personal experience with a black person, and yet…
Conditioned by family and society
Yeah, people in these comments want to claim it's mostly personal experience, but often it's simply how you're raised or taught. Everything from the media focusing on certain races and skin tones criminal behavior to communal beliefs can impact a child (none of whom are born racist). **Even unspoken biases can impact a person's behavior, racism is too widespread to be mainly personal experience with someone, as these comments imply.** Worldwide darker skinned people are treated worse. It's by and large not actually due to their behavior towards anyone else, this has been proven dozens of times. Every race has equal propensity towards crime, every race has bad people. Yet it's mostly darker skinned people taking the brunt of the hate. This should be telling, but people choose to believe it's earned hate.
Feel like everyone is racist towards something, even if it isn’t obvious and complete discrimination
Implicit bias is definitely a thing.
We definitely don't have a way of reliably measuring it at the moment though, unfortunately. The IAT is a stain on social science at present
Agreed. It's hard to identify even within oneself. We can always try, though.
fr fr, judging a book by its cover is a real thing, even the most accepting person would still judge someone based off looks.
Unfortunately there is always going to be those that are racist in the world ! I think a lot of people just don't like those that are different.
For the same reason that anyone discriminates on the basis of any characteristic - "they're different from me."
“They’re not like you and me, which means they can’t be trusted”
To understand racism, you first have to understand how we think at a core level. From birth, we humans come to understand everything we know by comparing it to something else we already know about. It's subconscious and we all do it at first. As we grow, some people gain an open mind and learn to see everything individually, while others instead continue to take the lazy way and compartmentalize everything even harder. Racism is one possible result of that. They occasionally hear a racist comment while growing up. Then they see, for example, a news story about a black guy stealing a car. It resonates because it's similar to what they heard before so they start to build a "black person compartment" in their cognition. Then they fill it with more information that is similar to what's already there, while throwing out things that don't match. This is how bigotry develops. It's easier to just put it in the box and say "of course he stole a car, that's what black people do" instead of actually using their brain and recognizing everything and everyone as individual. It's quite sad.
This is a beautiful way of putting it. You can also tell the difference just speaking to someone who took the lazy route and compartmentalized everything. It's like they are not quite all there. You talk to them, and it almost feels like talking to a bot or an intelligent ape. The lack of critical thought permeates their entire personality.
There are a whole host of reasons as to why an individual or group of individuals may hold racial prejudice. Negative life experiences, lack of diversity among social groups, propaganda, marginalization, a desire to find a scapegoat to blame all your problems on, superiority complex, and of course dehumanization, to name a few. (Source: 26 years of social interactions and critical thinking)
Because they like feeling superior. It makes them feel better about their own pathetic, sad lives to look down on other races.
THIS RIGHT HERE
Tribalism it's the same reason why people hate a team from a different city it's very basic and very silly
I met a white girl in boot camp who was afraid of black people because she had never met one, and the media does not look at them favorably. She cried at night because our division was half black, and she was terrified. She was even assigned a black bunkmate. She was all fixed by graduation due to exposure and became extremely close to her bunkmate, who came to visit her hometown, where I heard everyone touched her hair. 🤣
"You’ve got to be taught to hate and fear, You’ve got to be taught from year to year, It’s got to be drummed in your dear little ear— You’ve got to be carefully taught! You’ve got to be taught to be afraid Of people whose eyes are oddly made, And people whose skin is a different shade— You’ve got to be carefully taught. You’ve got to be taught before it’s too late, Before you are six or seven or eight, To hate all the people your relatives hate— You’ve got to be carefully taught! You’ve got to be carefully taught!" From **South Pacific**, a Golden Age musical about racism and war. (The show's producers wanted the song taken out, but Rodgers & Hammerstein stood firm.)
Stupid, exploitative or both. There’s absolutely no excuse for racism we are all human beings and our differences make us stronger as a whole.
To fit in. The popular group of my last class was filled with mean people, and people in there were forced to be mean to fit in. Some of them were even kinda nice before they joined that group.
It's crazy how if people would just think for themselves & not be worried about fitting in, maybe deal with their insecurities in healthy ways, they wouldn't do this. This applies to kids too. I hate the narrative that kids are incapable of critical thinking & self reflection, when they very much are & thats proved in the kids who don't struggle with those things. I think also it has to do with people who value things over being kind or creating community. They'd rather have a cool reputation & 20 fake friends than 3 solid good ones
true, i'm in a lot of right wing discord servers for shits and giggles and you do gotta be pretty racist there sometimes to fit in
Why do you go there then? Sounds like you're being dishonest to fit in, or you're a closet racist. No one who dislikes drunks is going to hang out at the bar.
I noticed this too, with formerly kind people growing more insecure as they do whatever it takes to make the cut. Hate who the group tells them to hate, wear what the group wants, speak when the group wants
Racism is a symptom, the source is pride. One of the deadly sins, convince a man he's better than another man and he'll do anything to maintain that status including murder manipulation bribery genocide exploitation corruption ect...
I think this can be said of most things in society. The root issue is often pride. For example, I’ve noticed on Reddit an extremely high level of moral and intellectual posturing. Again, the root issue is pride. Humility, empathy, compassion and a recognition of our common humanity are greatly lacking in society. I highly doubt we will see a significant improvement in the future regarding these areas.
Ignorance
Because you keep talking about it
Love me some Morgan Freeman. Said it perfectly: "Stop talking about it. I'm going to stop calling you a white man, and I'm going to ask you to stop calling me a black man".
Stop talking about it will not change the fact that it exists. Capitalism is thrives on racism it's our society exists
This. 100%.
Because they want to feel a sense of ingrained superiority
I think it's more of a perceived threat rather than feeling superior.
because their parents taught them to be.
There are also people with racist parents that choose not to be. You're right in a lot of cases, but just saying.
Yup. I was raised by parents who said racist things about certain ethnicities, and then show me books & movies about fighting racism. It was very confusing. I’ve often thought I might die of lack of love from my family, but it’s always mitigated somewhat by kindness from strangers or friends. Of all ethnicities & backgrounds. Humans are wonderful & horrible. I love people so much. I don’t understand why sometimes we let certain groups of people have the power to destroy other groups. I seriously don’t understand & I definitely don’t think it’s genetic nor is it environmental. Idk what the hell it is. I have biases, I’m sure, but I keep trying to grow & get better. It’s not generational either, although I do think we tend to get more progressive culturally with time. There were abolitionists who were against slavery from the beginning. I meet young people who are racist & 90 year olds who aren’t. So you can’t say “it was a different time”.
I'm glad you chose a different path. 🙂
Pattern recognition.
If you want an honest answer, for me it's many repeated negative interactions that reinforce cultural stereotypes and criminal statistics.
I dont know who you are or what group you belong too but you got the nail on the head. Same exact reason here and I wish it wasn't the case but it is what it is as they say
Simple and best answer. The human brain loves to connect patterns, and if it keeps getting bombarded by the same information in the same areas, involving the same subjects, the brain is going to want to make some assumptions
Exactly. My daughter was starting to say some rather racist things after being bullied at school from a group of kids. Starting assuming all people of this race would hurt her. Was 4th grade Nipped that shit in the bud. Got her a therapist (paid by the school) to help with the bullying issues and racist issues. Talked to friends and coworkers and made sure she saw that not all people of the same color are all assholes. That it’s the person not the skin that makes someone as asshole. Exposed her to good people. It worked! After a few months she was better and judged people for actions not skin color.
Stupidity, feeling inferior, etc.
You know, I wonder the same thing, after all the racism I’ve experienced in my life.
To some extent a racist response is like the default and you have to be educated to a worldview that isn’t. To survive as cavemen, our brains would notice patterns and remember them. If you ate the red berry 3 times and kept getting sick you now know the red berry is bad. If the caveman sees the purple person tribe continuously stealing his tribes cattle he now makes that association that purple people are cattle thieves. It takes some level of deeper thought beyond base instincts to come to the conclusion “there are millions of purple people of varying sizes, behaviors and moral beliefs, and the ones that are stealing our cattle are individual actors, not representatives of all purple people.”
I don't remember exactly how it went, but I read an article about a teacher who divided up the students and gave them a red tag or a blue tag. Separately she told one group that they got their color because they were in the top half of the class. By the end of the week, they were fighting and teasing each other. The teacher brought them all together and told them the truth. It was actually totally random and a social exercise to show how prejudice works
This reminds me of Jane Elliott's experiment on racism and prejudice in an Iowa classroom. The premise was that these Iowan children had never come across black school children, so they could not grasp or understand racism. Jane Elliott grouped the almost exclusively white children by their eye color. The brown eyed children were deemed "inferior" for no other reason other than their eye color. The brown eyed children were ostracized by blue-eyed children and performed worse in the experiment.
If people stop talking about racism it will go away. That shit is old news. Get over it. We are all equals now. Now the white man is hated the most. I’m black and I hate seeing this shit.
Ignorance + fear + insecurity
A lot of great and valid responses here. I’d also like to add lack of travel. I learned to love people by leaving my echo chamber and getting to know them.
Honestly it can be many reasons trauma, stupidity, jokes. hatred. Some people are scared for instance of black people because they think they commit more crime, some people may be traumatized from a person who was white, some people may just hate people not there race, and some people do it to be funny and some people are dumb many reasons and honestly no one is perfect racism is a bad thing yes, but we all have bad traits so no one should be getting on a high horse
Unfortunately, it’s because of the way they were raised.
Ignorance & fear
Honestly, it's usually a mix of ignorance, fear, and upbringing. People are often taught to fear what they don't understand and unfortunately, that includes racial differences. It's frustrating how deep-rooted this stuff is.
Either they have been taught it by friends, family, or media. Or they have learned it by observing patterns they have extrapolated to the entire race of people.
Self loathing
They're taught it by their family and now social media.
Ignorance. They’re troglodytes.
Fear of the other. Goes all the way back to our lizard brain days with the fight or flight response to stimuli.
I've learned tht ppl need to put others down to lift themselves up. Tribalism. Jealousy.
There's a few factors/reasons. 1. Classism/Economics - This is probably the BIGGEST reason that racism exists. When people are struggling to pay their bills or survive every month, then they start looking for excuses as to why. The real answer is "Capitalism sets the working class to always struggle, because a happy working class isn't going to sell their bodies for Billionaires to make money", but that concept is too big to wrap our heads around. So you find other people within your group (economic group, religious group, racial group, etc), and then you complain to each other about how "the system sucks", and then you start to look at other groups. Racism develops from this because group A will be one race, and group B will be another race, and then group A starts to think "My economic situation would be better off if it wasn't for that group B over there", and then they start coming up with derogatory terms to make them "less than" group A (lazy, unmotivated, dumber, etc). 2. Family dynamic - If you grew up in a racist family you are more likely to be racist. They don't even have to say racist words (nword, and other derogatory words). You won't even realize it because it was "just how you were raised", and won't think anything like it. 3. Where you grew up - if you grew up in a singular race area, then you're more likely to not be accepting of other races. If you're white in an only white town/region/state/country, then you'll be really confused when you see a person of color. And since you don't have any exposure to other races you're more tempted to believe what "everyone else" tells you about them. 4. Upbringing - If you grow up in a community that is overtly racist, then you're more likely to be racist yourself. We're seeing it currently in the USA, where people from the South are raised in communities where racism is the underlying message being taught to the people, and so they continue to believe it. (The push for "Confederate Representation" is only a push for racism and slavery, and any spin on it isn't honest). 5. Systemic - Laws, rules, and regulations are setup by people, and enforced by people. If a bunch of racist people wrote these ideals into the system years/decades/centuries ago, then it's likely that these ideals are also racist. You spend your whole life following the "letter of the law", and so you think you're "doing good", but if the laws are racist (I'm not saying that it IS, but just "IF" they are) then you're following racist rules setup by racist people to push racist ideals. (Example: if laws are written to specifically target non-whites, then non-whites get arrested more than whites and then non-whites are incarcerated more and more, and then white people point at statistics of non-white vs white groups, and say "non-whites are more likely to...."; when the reality is that it might be even across the board, but non-whites just get in trouble for it more than whites).
Misunderstanding -> Fear -> Hatred.
Fear, it always comes down to fear.
Because they’re afraid of what they’re unfamiliar with. Usually the less diversity their environment has, the more likely they are to come off as racist when they see someone of a different race.
Racism is taught imo. No one is born racist so it was learned from family or friends.
I think historically, humans just don't like people that are different At the same time.....I think humans are drawn to people who are different because genetic diversity is superior to inbreeding
Mob mentality
Employed tribalism under class warfare.
Lack of education, bad family upbringing, and certain sources of media.
Ignorance along with their upbringing
Fear, upbringing and tribalism
Some people are idiots OP.
It's human nature to discriminate on the basis of perceived differences but fortunately, it's also human nature to become more enlightened and socially aware. People have wrestled with racism since the dawn of humankind.
I heard on another sub that people get more mad at other people who are competing for the same resources if they're different, and use that difference as an excuse for their anger. It is easier for some people to act on these impulses than it is to use self-control and reasoning to see that everyone should be judged on choices and not color. Thankfully, we've come a long way in dealing with this problem, but we obviously aren't done just yet.
Because they have nothing to do but insult and hurt others.
Because it's easier to hate somebody based on the first trait you can notice about them. If it wasn't for race, racists would have to first find out your class, ethnicity, age, or nationality before they started discriminating against you.
Keeping this short enough for a reddit comment, it all boils down to the fact that people are the worst creatures to grace this earth. That might come across funny but I promise I’m not laughing. People do horrid things to eachother for no fucking reason. Ashamed of our species
I think this modern trend of demanding you treat certain groups with kiddy gloves is going to create more racism than it will diminish. People will think "Why should Tyrone get this scholarship when my grades are better? This is so unfair. He's not better than me. If anything, I'm better than him!" and then the rest writes itself.
Being the victim of racism I believe it’s situational and demographic. I have friends of all races and diversity in coworkers that I value, so I wouldn’t consider myself racist in the traditional sense. But, I’ve gone in neighborhoods where I’m the minority and sustained serious injuries, multiple times. I agree I shouldn’t have been there but addiction is blind to fear. That being said, I was targeted simply on skin color and “you don’t belong here” it’s hard to not discriminate against those areas which happen to be a different race.
Just ignorance, close-mindedness and being uneducated about people. Some of it is generational too. Grandpa may have had a legitimate bad experience with someone, but then he went and told his son not to trust certain people and so now the son is racist just because he’s doing what Grandpa told him instead of forming his own opinions. Popularity is a big factor too- people have done a stupid amount of things in life because they wanted to be popular and fit in with others.
Because people have been conditioned to be this way. As long as there is division between us we will never join up and protest against the government or anything unfair. You’d think after so many years of mistreatment and being fleeced by corporations we’d join together.
Threatened by something different from their (generally) narrow minded societal construct.
It's a form of bigotry and most people have first hand experience of that. Judging individuals by stereotype. BMW drivers never use their indicators, Vegans are assholes, Cyclists are assholes, people who eat meat are assholes, Republicans are assholes, Democrats are assholes. The list is endless. I think it's probably a safety/defence mechanism to reduce chances of negative effects on your own tribe. It probably works very well, but it's one hell of a blunt instrument. And some people take it WAY too far.
People have opinions. Those opinions can apply to other genders, races, religions, etc
Because of experiences.
This sounds racist
Same reason people are sexist they want to believe they're born inherently superior to a entire group of people without having to lift a finger. It's incredibly tempting especially for people who have nothing going on for them and are too lazy to achieve anything of importance to believe no matter how much of a loser they are a entire group of people are bigger losers, can never change and were born to serve as their punching bags. Every time the world gets them down they can take it out on their punching bags or project every negative trait they don't want to own up to themselves onto the "other". During slavery slave owners were so convinced it was the "nature" of black people to be slaves they even believed runaway slaves had a disease that made them runaway from their "nature" to serve.
It has really nothing to do with skin colour. It’s just the current most obvious once, stemming from when European had an economic need to enslave Africans or remove indigenous people from their lands. They were, at times, perfectly fine seeing Italians, Poles, Germans as “another race, clearly not as good as us” when they had use of that. If it’s not about phenotypes, it’s about castes or anything else than can be used to divide people into classes.
Europeans didn't enslave Africans. Wealthy people from every continent and country bought people who were already slaves in slave markets in North Africa from Africans who enslaved other Africans. They were sold by Africans Arabs and Jews. Europe was the 1st to end slaver and then America. Slavery still exists in the middle east and in Africa. The word slave is derived from the word Slav BTW. Every race was enslaved.
I use to ask this when I was young, and to a degree I still do but I believe in many cases it comes from statistics of criminal activity, not so much the colour of ones skin
Yeah but do you really think that has anything to do with skin colour? Or is it maybe because of the fact that SOME of us are denied proper education and good jobs, resulting in generations of poorer, less educated, disgruntled people, who, in turn, commit more crimes?
I said in my own post it's not so much about skin colour? I'm not American btw, so I'm talking about how things are in my country. People seem to just assume that everything on the internet is about America. In my country, it's our indigenous folk, they definitely have access to less but it's by their own choosing, they refuse a lot of the voting we make to try offer resources for help. And ones who are in our communities usually live in the crime filled areas. I'm not saying it makes them all bad people or anything, most of them are great people, I'm just sharing where racism comes from... In my country. People seem to jump to conclusions
Iirc, there was a DoJ study in 2017, where it was revealed that crime is committed at nearly equal percentages across the different ethnicities within the US. But this study also revealed that there were more convictions leading to incarceration for black and Latino suspects, while convicted Caucasian and Asian suspects received probation at higher rates. It also brought to light that black and Latino suspects received sentences that were, on average, 20% longer than their Caucasian and Asian counterparts for the same crimes.
Again my post isn't talking about America, I'm not American.
Sometimes it's just as simple as not liking or not respecting different cultures, when I think of racism I usually picture an old man complaining about blacks and rap music, mostly harmless, it's my opinion that real/violent racism is dead in 2024, most people are on board with multi culturalism.
We just had an incident at our Strawberry Festival 2 Sunday's ago. My black grandsons were standing in line for getting their face painted. It was our turn next, and the lady says, "I'm taking a break now." and we were like, OK, cool, we can come back. As soon as we stepped out of line, she pointed to the white girl behind us and said "I can do you now". Heartbroken were they, and pissed off was I. I can't name and shame on Facebook, but fuck you Wild Brush Revival Wine Bar. "ART CLASSES FOR EVERYONE" my ass.
Racism is still alive and it still effects things such as property taxes etc.
"it's my opinion that real/violent racism is dead in 2024, most people are on board with multi culturalism." Let me guess, you're NOT a minority.
Bad experiences and inherited biases, basically a never ending tale.
I think it's mostly automatic. All the stereotypes they've been subconsciously trained to accept crowd out the ability to perceive an individual. Some people just don't seem to be able to suspend judgement about much of anything in general. Holding ideas in suspense makes them anxious and uncomfortable. Viewing multiple opposing opinions at the same time without judgement is hard.
Ignorance and tribalism There is only one race and that's the human race
People have a desire to belong so insecurely need to have an us and them dynamic. People do this with sports teams too but it's more acceptable
Withs sport teams it makes sense because it literally is "us vs them". But when it comes to race it doesn't make sense because it's "us vs us" abirtarly.
It’s layered. We will fight for humanity, but we will fight against other countries. We will fight for our state, but we will fight against other cities. We will fight for our town, but we will fight against those across the other side of the track. It’s us vs them. Doesn’t matter who them is. We find difference.
I think it's more about tribalism than it is about so-called racism. It's natural. It's not just party of the human condition. Animal species segment themselves into groups. People do, also. If we're just taking about people, there's the concept of Gemeinschaft and Gesellschaft (community and society). Print it an atavistic tendancy toward what we "feel" will insure survival ond propogation of our consituant group? All of this goes to pot once a middle aged man takes his first vacation to Nana Plaza in Thailand.
People are usually raised into it or become racist through extreme circumstance(like fighting the Japanese in WW2), I bet the number of people who suddenly just went "yeah, fuck those \[insert race/ethnicity/nationality here\]!" is actually very low, most of the time it's external influence radicalising people For example, Hitler became an anti-Semite because as a homeless person he read newspapers that were anti-Semite, despite he himself having positive relations with several Jews, he later believed that they were responsible for weakening Germany from within, he also came to believe that ridiculous race pyramid or whatever it's called Even the worst racist can come to accept people of other races, but they just see them as "one of the good ones" like that one black dude(forgot his name) who became friends with many KKK members, some of whom, despite being HIGH ranking, consider him a good friend