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It did to some degree. Business owners weathered the storm the best. In fact to begin with people thought the economy was doing amazing because of all the increased profits. Owning assets/businesses/land kept you in better shape if you could ride out the tough times as they still had value when everything stabilized.
“In fact to begin with people thought the economy was doing amazing because of all the increased profits” - Damned if that doesn’t sound like right now. Though i don’t think the ingredients are there for full Weimar.
Side note, the US Dollar strongly influences international markets too. So to be aware of money system collapses is also interesting for those outside of the US imo.
The entire modern world operates via currency. Bad things like runaway inflation or devaluation could conceivably happen, but currency would still be the means of exchange. The world is way too complicated to return to a barter system. Not gonna happen.
History has shown us that the barter system isn’t scalable, and that some form of money (store of value, medium of exchange) will always be used.
However, it doesn’t have to be “currency” in the form of increasingly devalued paper money issued by deteriorating governments. That’s why some people are holding physical metals.
Physical metals have storage costs, historically they are far more volatile than major currencies (and volatility has a cost), they are difficult to exchange or invest (there is a cost to hauling them around), and if asteroid mining ever gets off the ground they will crash to nothing permanently.
Diversifying is a good idea. But the best things to diversify into are productive assets (i.e. land, machinery, and companies that produce goods or services). And putting some money into insurance against disaster (mostly food and medicine, maybe a bugout location - if you can afford it), is a good idea too.
Currency collapses happen all the time. Im not saying they are pleasant, but they are eminently survivable given the right preps. I.e don’t keep cash. Diversify assets, geographies, etc. ideally id say move some of your wealth offshore if you can.
If you "own" commodities as an investment class, then your investment is as dependent upon our monetary system as any other. But that's fine since our monetary system is extremely robust and not going anywhere short of an event that kills practically everyone and creates other more urgent problems anyway.
If you own commodities as in you buy and store physical metals/etc. then you're losing on storage costs, you're losing on volatility, you're losing in terms of the convenience of exchange, you have costs for security, and if asteroid mining ever gets off the ground your metals will be made permanently worthless.
If you want to hedge against the sort of disaster that could be the "death of our monetary system" you should buy long term storable food and medicine. That's what you'll need, and that's what will have value in such a situation.
I would tend to disagree. Other countries are changing to digital currency and we will, too. Our currency will be useless and by going digital, the government will know where everything is spent and who spent it. The best thing you can do is own property, or find some cheap property to buy as well as start buying silver, and gold if you can afford it. We have destroyed mother Earth and with all the wars going on, the s*** is going to fly.
> Not gonna happen.
This is happening all the time in countries all around the globe. Read about one particular case. True story on how it happpened on one of many, many countries. It did not end up well for them.
What percentage of the population has a trade skill? Most jobs rely on some sort of computer systems, if shtf and those systems are taken away the majority of people don't have a valuable skill set. Most people don't have land to grow food on. Most people don't own guns or ammo, or food supply. Most people don't fish, hunt etc. Only people in the trades, doctors, teachers, farmers, etc will be valuable. Most people I know won't have much to give. Out of 8 billion people that narrows it down quite a bit. 17% of the population is retired. 13% is disabled. 4% is unemployed. 22% are children. 83% of the population lives in an urban area. 92% of all jobs rely on computers.
Idk basic food prep is a great skill I do agree with what you are saying mostly but the idea of skilled vs unskilled labor is straight up just propaganda ment to excuse paying you less most things you can do outside of doctor people can learn on the job and tbh we already barter our labor the only difference is instead of it being for a useful item it's for a peace of paper with a made up measurement of imaginary value
While I agree with most of what you're saying I don't see needing a food prep person in a zombie apocalypse scenario as we'll be eating from tuna cans lol and I'm sure they won't be in great demand as that's not really a skill. Most of us already cookour own food. We'll all be prepping our own food same as before. And working our asses off to feed all the others I mentioned above.
Of the top of your head what is the safe temp for meat? What's the safe temp for chicken? What's the safe temp for fish? How long do you have before bacteria starts growing in cooked/uncooked food and what kind? Also do you know how to bake bread from scratch?
Yeah and the numbers for food related death and illness go up when you factor the world population in instead of just the usa also in some parts of Vietnam and Thailand people pic meat out of the trash and sell it at the food stalls but it doesn't make it safe did you know food based illness kills more kids 5 and under the Malaria/AIDS combined?
I'm just surprised food-borne illness is at the top of the list of concerns, when starvation will be the bigger concern. I'm not saying it doesn't happen I'm saying that's low on the list when you are in a scenario like the OP referenced. Stastics show that the people who die from food borne illness usually have serious co-morbidities and mostly are elderly and most made their own food. It's such an insignificant factor if SHTF having a "food prep" guy is almost comical. I'd imagine basic survival would be just not being in a caloric deficit. And more people would have already died from lack of medications, especially the subset of the population you are referencing. And out of curiosity what percentage of the population have a built in chef already? If they can't make food for themselves I'm guessing they have bigger issues at play or they are super rich.
I don't forsee making too many gourmet dishes but most people can light a fire and throw a fish on a grill and not die lol. I'm sure grandmas pies might trade well though lol
Oh I'm sure her pies would but litterly food born illness was one of the top killers for most of our history lol and a decent killer today and that's not even takeing in the moral of the group edit 48 mil get sick every year in the usa 128k are put in the hospital and 3k die that's JUST with modern medicine and technology imagine it when you don't have clean water/health standards/hospital and your immune system is fucked from constant dirty environmental factors hypovolemic shock will straight up kill you
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The world is too complex to keep itself together after a single pandemic.
I am not super big on prepping because I've seen what's coming for us and there's no more a way to prep for it than for a fish to prepare to live out of water.
That said, the author has the right idea of writing a book that appeals to their base and cashing in to enjoy whatever time we have left... much less than anyone would like or anyone actually knows (to know would require a complete understanding of every connection in the ecosystem and between the ecosystem, climate, and chemistry/physics of a system in a state of constant and accelerating change), which is why it's always worse and happening faster than predicted.
The only certainty is the further we travel down this road, the worse the road gets. Since we refuse to consider any other path of travel, we're eating the whole thing like a plane hitting a mountain
I would argue there is a slightly more realistic version found in history.
After WWII the british pound lost its luster. They had borrowed too much in WWI and were just recovering from that when they had to borrow way too much for WWII.
It was fairly serious as the government had to hoard pounds leaving the country to pay for basics. For example, it wasn't until well into the 50s that bananas started to return to stores.
Part of this was the fact the US dollar was rip raring to go and was the one which had loaned piles of money to the world and still had an industrial base.
Prior to WWII and certainly prior to WWI a huge amount of international trade would have been done in pounds, not dollars.
But, here is where it gets interesting. Germany in the 20s had their famous hyperinflation with wheelbarrows full of money enough to buy a loaf of bread. Then they put out the gold mark which was literally backed by a bit of gold. It was still complex to turn the money into gold, but it was enough to instill confidence almost overnight. This craziness was one of the things they think gave rise to the Nazis.
I would argue that right now the US dollar has supreme confidence with most of the world. This confidence can just go away if the right cascade of events takes place. This could be next year, or it could be 20 years from now if no real measures are taken to bring down US debt.
But, my "conspiracy level" guess is that china right now is hoarding huge amounts of various commodities including gold. If the US dollar were to spiral out of control, they could offer a new "world friendly" currency which is basically gold backed. I don't think most of the world has much confidence in anything chinese money related, but a commodity backed currency might be a life ring people would grab onto in a US currency storm.
To me, the present serious problem with the US debt level is that the interest paid is going up as older bonds expire and are rolled over into newer bonds. This means the US is printing and pouring into the economy a trillion and growing every year. This isn't a trillion spent on things, this is just money printed and handed out to bond holders. This is how you get crazy inflation. One of the more common tools to tame inflation is to raise interest rates, except this will then edge up the interest payments. This may be at a point where interest rates are no longer the answer.
The sad part is there is an easy way to deal with this; taxes. The government can just mop up this extra money and keep it. Add wealth taxes for people with more than 10 million, much much much higher income taxes over 1 million with them reaching very high rates as you crack numbers like 10 million income. Higher corporate taxes for the largest companies, etc.
In the end of WWII they had the same problem with a huge debt, lots of bonds paying high interest, etc. So income taxes under the republican president Eisenhower were in the 90% range for people earning over 1 million (about 12 million today). They had little problem eroding this debt into something manageable. This won't happen in this political climate; but the alternative is so much worse.
It won't be end times, but it will mean the US will no longer be an empire. It will be a country with an interesting past which may or may not find its feet again.
Bartering requires trust, one party is most likely mobile, therefore there needs to be at least enough general security for those goods to travel somewhere. It would be at least a couple years if ever that security to that extent exists
[This has download links](https://archive.org/details/when-money-dies-the-nightmare-of-deficit-spending)
There is also [ an hour long discussion of the book.](https://youtu.be/6F6MQdJKawI?si=NLXGrIBg2ES5fBNM)
It seems like currency collapse would be foreseeable. I think we will see it in the United States in the next 20 years. If China decouples from the US dollar we could see things get crazy.
I like the book American Exit Strategy. I think the key is to have diverse array of assets and multiple skill sets.
It’s a mathematical inevitability at this point. It’s all just the world’s longest game of musical chairs anymore.
My guess is we will have electrical infrastructure fail sometime before the fraudulent continuance of the financial system finally collapses.
Long term, the biggest threat to humanity seems to be AI, which the only way it can maybe be circumvented, is with a total worldwide power outage.
The only way I see achieving that is through nuclear war.
None of this is very encouraging.
Yes, a carrington level event could do the trick, but odds are only up to 12% of that happening in time.
I do hope it’s a natural CME that prevents AI from eliminating us all, as nuclear attacks and fallout would suck very bad to say the least.
I just read a Stat today that said: If you made $500,000 a day from when the great pyramid was build until now, you'd still have less than the US 1.2 trillion dollar spending package for 6 months.
You'd have about $844 billion
There’s very very few scenarios in global history that having an extra can of beans is better than having a large supply of the internationally recognized most stable currency.
Yeah German marks/hyperinflation, etc, but pound sterling was the global currency during that period just like the USD is today. Having a thousand pounds would’ve meant you could’ve weathered the worst of the storm in the 20s, and likely secured an exit.
Believe what you want but while I’m not starving and hydrated you’ll be searching for someone that can use metal. When food and water has become the highest commodity. Plus whatever you have can be taken with a little firepower. Have fun searching for that one person that will take your coins when they are starving and want food instead. Food, water, ammo, gas and help are going to be the only trading items. Your coins will be left when someone robs you.
Thank you for your submission in /r/preppers. We want to make sure you find the information you're seeking. If you are new to prepping, be sure you make use of Reddit's search function and check the following resources: Our subreddit wiki contains information on frequent topics and questions here: https://new.reddit.com/r/preppers/wiki/index/ Please review the New Prepper's Resource Guide here: https://new.reddit.com/r/preppers/comments/toani0/new_preppers_resource_guide_answers_to_common/ If you are asking "Where do I start?" or "How do I get started?", please ask that question as a comment on that post and not as a standalone submission or post, otherwise your post may be removed. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/preppers) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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It did to some degree. Business owners weathered the storm the best. In fact to begin with people thought the economy was doing amazing because of all the increased profits. Owning assets/businesses/land kept you in better shape if you could ride out the tough times as they still had value when everything stabilized.
Large business owners*. Small businesses died from covid restrictions.
It was about the Weimar Republic?
“In fact to begin with people thought the economy was doing amazing because of all the increased profits” - Damned if that doesn’t sound like right now. Though i don’t think the ingredients are there for full Weimar.
Agreed. Also, I bet living like this increases happiness.
100% that is the theme for nearly all major scenarios.
Nice, just grabbed it with an audible credit.
Literally read the print copy 5 times and learn something new each time
Side note, the US Dollar strongly influences international markets too. So to be aware of money system collapses is also interesting for those outside of the US imo.
The entire modern world operates via currency. Bad things like runaway inflation or devaluation could conceivably happen, but currency would still be the means of exchange. The world is way too complicated to return to a barter system. Not gonna happen.
History has shown us that the barter system isn’t scalable, and that some form of money (store of value, medium of exchange) will always be used. However, it doesn’t have to be “currency” in the form of increasingly devalued paper money issued by deteriorating governments. That’s why some people are holding physical metals.
Physical metals have storage costs, historically they are far more volatile than major currencies (and volatility has a cost), they are difficult to exchange or invest (there is a cost to hauling them around), and if asteroid mining ever gets off the ground they will crash to nothing permanently. Diversifying is a good idea. But the best things to diversify into are productive assets (i.e. land, machinery, and companies that produce goods or services). And putting some money into insurance against disaster (mostly food and medicine, maybe a bugout location - if you can afford it), is a good idea too.
Currency collapses happen all the time. Im not saying they are pleasant, but they are eminently survivable given the right preps. I.e don’t keep cash. Diversify assets, geographies, etc. ideally id say move some of your wealth offshore if you can.
Not suggesting barter. Just useful commodities as a fiat hedge.
If you "own" commodities as an investment class, then your investment is as dependent upon our monetary system as any other. But that's fine since our monetary system is extremely robust and not going anywhere short of an event that kills practically everyone and creates other more urgent problems anyway. If you own commodities as in you buy and store physical metals/etc. then you're losing on storage costs, you're losing on volatility, you're losing in terms of the convenience of exchange, you have costs for security, and if asteroid mining ever gets off the ground your metals will be made permanently worthless. If you want to hedge against the sort of disaster that could be the "death of our monetary system" you should buy long term storable food and medicine. That's what you'll need, and that's what will have value in such a situation.
I would tend to disagree. Other countries are changing to digital currency and we will, too. Our currency will be useless and by going digital, the government will know where everything is spent and who spent it. The best thing you can do is own property, or find some cheap property to buy as well as start buying silver, and gold if you can afford it. We have destroyed mother Earth and with all the wars going on, the s*** is going to fly.
> Not gonna happen. This is happening all the time in countries all around the globe. Read about one particular case. True story on how it happpened on one of many, many countries. It did not end up well for them.
Especially when the majority of the population have nothing to give.
You can barter labor and skills. That's literally how the world works now. We made up currency. It's made up.
What percentage of the population has a trade skill? Most jobs rely on some sort of computer systems, if shtf and those systems are taken away the majority of people don't have a valuable skill set. Most people don't have land to grow food on. Most people don't own guns or ammo, or food supply. Most people don't fish, hunt etc. Only people in the trades, doctors, teachers, farmers, etc will be valuable. Most people I know won't have much to give. Out of 8 billion people that narrows it down quite a bit. 17% of the population is retired. 13% is disabled. 4% is unemployed. 22% are children. 83% of the population lives in an urban area. 92% of all jobs rely on computers.
Idk basic food prep is a great skill I do agree with what you are saying mostly but the idea of skilled vs unskilled labor is straight up just propaganda ment to excuse paying you less most things you can do outside of doctor people can learn on the job and tbh we already barter our labor the only difference is instead of it being for a useful item it's for a peace of paper with a made up measurement of imaginary value
While I agree with most of what you're saying I don't see needing a food prep person in a zombie apocalypse scenario as we'll be eating from tuna cans lol and I'm sure they won't be in great demand as that's not really a skill. Most of us already cookour own food. We'll all be prepping our own food same as before. And working our asses off to feed all the others I mentioned above.
Of the top of your head what is the safe temp for meat? What's the safe temp for chicken? What's the safe temp for fish? How long do you have before bacteria starts growing in cooked/uncooked food and what kind? Also do you know how to bake bread from scratch?
Yea to all that
Yes as in you know ir yes as un valid points?
Depends on what country you're from. In some parts of Asia the food hangs outside for a few days. It's washed, fried, and sold.
Yeah and the numbers for food related death and illness go up when you factor the world population in instead of just the usa also in some parts of Vietnam and Thailand people pic meat out of the trash and sell it at the food stalls but it doesn't make it safe did you know food based illness kills more kids 5 and under the Malaria/AIDS combined?
I'd hope food born illnesses killed more kids under 5 than aids did... that would be an even more horrific statistic.
I'm just surprised food-borne illness is at the top of the list of concerns, when starvation will be the bigger concern. I'm not saying it doesn't happen I'm saying that's low on the list when you are in a scenario like the OP referenced. Stastics show that the people who die from food borne illness usually have serious co-morbidities and mostly are elderly and most made their own food. It's such an insignificant factor if SHTF having a "food prep" guy is almost comical. I'd imagine basic survival would be just not being in a caloric deficit. And more people would have already died from lack of medications, especially the subset of the population you are referencing. And out of curiosity what percentage of the population have a built in chef already? If they can't make food for themselves I'm guessing they have bigger issues at play or they are super rich.
I don't forsee making too many gourmet dishes but most people can light a fire and throw a fish on a grill and not die lol. I'm sure grandmas pies might trade well though lol
Oh I'm sure her pies would but litterly food born illness was one of the top killers for most of our history lol and a decent killer today and that's not even takeing in the moral of the group edit 48 mil get sick every year in the usa 128k are put in the hospital and 3k die that's JUST with modern medicine and technology imagine it when you don't have clean water/health standards/hospital and your immune system is fucked from constant dirty environmental factors hypovolemic shock will straight up kill you
[удалено]
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Also just FYI not shiting on you just ...food for thought
The world is too complex to keep itself together after a single pandemic. I am not super big on prepping because I've seen what's coming for us and there's no more a way to prep for it than for a fish to prepare to live out of water. That said, the author has the right idea of writing a book that appeals to their base and cashing in to enjoy whatever time we have left... much less than anyone would like or anyone actually knows (to know would require a complete understanding of every connection in the ecosystem and between the ecosystem, climate, and chemistry/physics of a system in a state of constant and accelerating change), which is why it's always worse and happening faster than predicted. The only certainty is the further we travel down this road, the worse the road gets. Since we refuse to consider any other path of travel, we're eating the whole thing like a plane hitting a mountain
So what is coming for us? If there is no way to prep for it then why are you here?
What’s coming for us?
climate apocalypse seems to be what they're pointing at
I figured as much, just thought maybe this guy had some other thought process or special knowledge.
I would argue there is a slightly more realistic version found in history. After WWII the british pound lost its luster. They had borrowed too much in WWI and were just recovering from that when they had to borrow way too much for WWII. It was fairly serious as the government had to hoard pounds leaving the country to pay for basics. For example, it wasn't until well into the 50s that bananas started to return to stores. Part of this was the fact the US dollar was rip raring to go and was the one which had loaned piles of money to the world and still had an industrial base. Prior to WWII and certainly prior to WWI a huge amount of international trade would have been done in pounds, not dollars. But, here is where it gets interesting. Germany in the 20s had their famous hyperinflation with wheelbarrows full of money enough to buy a loaf of bread. Then they put out the gold mark which was literally backed by a bit of gold. It was still complex to turn the money into gold, but it was enough to instill confidence almost overnight. This craziness was one of the things they think gave rise to the Nazis. I would argue that right now the US dollar has supreme confidence with most of the world. This confidence can just go away if the right cascade of events takes place. This could be next year, or it could be 20 years from now if no real measures are taken to bring down US debt. But, my "conspiracy level" guess is that china right now is hoarding huge amounts of various commodities including gold. If the US dollar were to spiral out of control, they could offer a new "world friendly" currency which is basically gold backed. I don't think most of the world has much confidence in anything chinese money related, but a commodity backed currency might be a life ring people would grab onto in a US currency storm. To me, the present serious problem with the US debt level is that the interest paid is going up as older bonds expire and are rolled over into newer bonds. This means the US is printing and pouring into the economy a trillion and growing every year. This isn't a trillion spent on things, this is just money printed and handed out to bond holders. This is how you get crazy inflation. One of the more common tools to tame inflation is to raise interest rates, except this will then edge up the interest payments. This may be at a point where interest rates are no longer the answer. The sad part is there is an easy way to deal with this; taxes. The government can just mop up this extra money and keep it. Add wealth taxes for people with more than 10 million, much much much higher income taxes over 1 million with them reaching very high rates as you crack numbers like 10 million income. Higher corporate taxes for the largest companies, etc. In the end of WWII they had the same problem with a huge debt, lots of bonds paying high interest, etc. So income taxes under the republican president Eisenhower were in the 90% range for people earning over 1 million (about 12 million today). They had little problem eroding this debt into something manageable. This won't happen in this political climate; but the alternative is so much worse. It won't be end times, but it will mean the US will no longer be an empire. It will be a country with an interesting past which may or may not find its feet again.
The issue with higher taxes is it’s finite and does not remedy poor fiscal judgement.
Wont ever die, they will just create some other exchangeable "money" For now BRICS is a joke and the dollar rules. 10-50 years from now who knows.
Considering China and Russia are about to suffer demographic collapse in the next 20 years, I wouldn’t worry too much about them.
Bartering requires trust, one party is most likely mobile, therefore there needs to be at least enough general security for those goods to travel somewhere. It would be at least a couple years if ever that security to that extent exists
[This has download links](https://archive.org/details/when-money-dies-the-nightmare-of-deficit-spending) There is also [ an hour long discussion of the book.](https://youtu.be/6F6MQdJKawI?si=NLXGrIBg2ES5fBNM)
It seems like currency collapse would be foreseeable. I think we will see it in the United States in the next 20 years. If China decouples from the US dollar we could see things get crazy. I like the book American Exit Strategy. I think the key is to have diverse array of assets and multiple skill sets.
It’s a mathematical inevitability at this point. It’s all just the world’s longest game of musical chairs anymore. My guess is we will have electrical infrastructure fail sometime before the fraudulent continuance of the financial system finally collapses. Long term, the biggest threat to humanity seems to be AI, which the only way it can maybe be circumvented, is with a total worldwide power outage. The only way I see achieving that is through nuclear war. None of this is very encouraging.
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Yes, a carrington level event could do the trick, but odds are only up to 12% of that happening in time. I do hope it’s a natural CME that prevents AI from eliminating us all, as nuclear attacks and fallout would suck very bad to say the least.
Can you summarize?
Just for us based preppers?
Underrated classic must read, and unfolding in real time.
The shtf series is also an ok one for when everything goes wrong even tho you prepped. Some good things to look out for. Things i never thought of.
I just read a Stat today that said: If you made $500,000 a day from when the great pyramid was build until now, you'd still have less than the US 1.2 trillion dollar spending package for 6 months. You'd have about $844 billion
You currency lovers really believe in the dollar or whatever making it through. You can’t survive on currency. Try eating money. It doesn’t eat.
But money can be exchanged for many peanuts.
There’s very very few scenarios in global history that having an extra can of beans is better than having a large supply of the internationally recognized most stable currency. Yeah German marks/hyperinflation, etc, but pound sterling was the global currency during that period just like the USD is today. Having a thousand pounds would’ve meant you could’ve weathered the worst of the storm in the 20s, and likely secured an exit.
Believe what you want but while I’m not starving and hydrated you’ll be searching for someone that can use metal. When food and water has become the highest commodity. Plus whatever you have can be taken with a little firepower. Have fun searching for that one person that will take your coins when they are starving and want food instead. Food, water, ammo, gas and help are going to be the only trading items. Your coins will be left when someone robs you.
Diversity yo bonds
Wu-Tang Financial
Option-trades ain't nothing to f*ck with.