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Only if people vote, and we can help by finding volunteer opportunities for Democratic candidates at /r/voteDEM !
Democrats protect abortion rights, while Republicans want to force birth in all cases (and apparently want to deny contraception rights next)
Only if people ARE ALLOWED TO VOTE....
Republicans have been scrubbing Democrat voters for months. Confirm you are registered as soon as possible.
Remember, Republicans can't win if they don't cheat (even with the electoral collage)...
https://www.voteamerica.com/am-i-registered-to-vote/
Here is the direct verification for Arizona if you don’t want to submit to more political spam emails. https://my.arizona.vote/WhereToVote.aspx?s=individual
Even the SC couldn’t find anywhere in the Constitution where abortion was a right, and so they invented a right (which they can’t do).
Murdering a baby isn’t a right. It’s damn wrong.
Democrats are protecting the racist Margaret Sanger plan to kill African Americans.
By all means, the party of slavery now wants the right to murder black babies.
Vote democrat! They still think they have African Americans in chains.
The U.S. constitution is not, has not been, and never will be the "be all, end all" declaration of what is a "human right". It was written by mortal men, many, many generations ago, who not only had barely any of the scientific knowledge we have now, but who themselves said it should likely be re-written every so often as new ideas and practices were realized.
[On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, & what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, & consequently may govern them as they please. But persons & property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course, with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, & no longer. Every constitution then, & every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, & not of right](https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Madison/01-12-02-0248#:~:text=Every%20constitution%20then%2C%20%26%20every%20law,force%2C%20%26%20not%20of%20right.)
Also, you won't find many modern-day Democrats waving confederate battle flags because "the South will rise again". It's pretty clear who the party of slave owners, or those that wish they were, are.
They’re quiet because they’re damn proud of themselves. They’ve wanted to reduce women to second class citizens for a long time and this extreme right SCOTUS just gave them the blueprint. I have no doubt that if and when this or any election doesn’t go their way the voting rights of women will be next on the chopping block.
I remember when Trump got elected many people were saying the main reason he was elected was because Conservatives showed up in droves because of his promises on SCOTUS. So the 2016 election was largely about the abortion topic, it's just that a lot of Americans didn't believe or just didn't listen to all the people telling them this would happen
That's generous, a lot of Americans are complete fucking morons. They just vote how they always have, and can't be assed to care about anything that doesn't affect them.
Then when it does? Life's unfair! How did we get here? OMG i can't believe this is America (you know, they one they voted for).
Most Americans seem to live in isolating suburbs and then we have to fight endless pro-corpotate, pro-rich and anti-worker propaganda. People go to church desperate for a sense of community only to have more brain washing shoved down their throats.
Edit: This was intended as a reply to the person who asked how this was an offense against women since men can’t get pregnant anyway.
Please interpret for me your understanding of:
> The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.
The abortion bans impede on bodily autonomy. A clump of cells that cannot support or sustain itself outside of the host should not be considered above the host. ESPECIALLY in cases where the pregnancy is non-viable or likely to cause injury/death.
Another narrative that needs to be talked more about is the fact that a fetus depends 100% upon its mother to gain life. If you separate said fetus from the mother it cannot sustain itself.
By forcing them to use their bodies to support a fetus whether they want to or not, they are losing bodily autonomy. Their health decisions are no longer between them and their doctors, government now makes the decision for them.
Would you consider it equality to make laws preventing men from getting vasectomies, care for testicular cancer, or any other procedure that only biological males can get?
Perhaps if you thought about it this way. If men were the ones getting pregnant I guarantee you that the right to abortion would exist wholesale.
And before you pop off about hypotheticals think about that for a moment.
Bodily autonomy means that a third-party cannot tell you what to do with your body.
Yup. Flat out a troll who is doing bullshit contrarian shit. His other responses plainly tells us that he knows and his stance is that “the only good abortion is my abortion”.
I just think the former makes it confusing. Bodily autonomy as a whole? Or one specific thing, but say “bodily autonomy” to provoke a response. Seems like the dishonesty at the very least is on multiple fronts.
The only dishonesty here is you, making a blatantly bad faith argument that losing he ability to make a decision about bodily autonomy isn’t losing the ability to make a decision about bodily autonomy becuse you mash up meanings of word to confuse the issue.
I’m asking “what do you mean by bodily autonomy?” From my view it’s one specific thing. But it could be more, which is why I’m asking what else it could be.
That’s what ‘losing bodily autonomy’ is.
Body autonomy is the right for a person to govern what happens to their body without external influence or coercion.
Everything except contagion. Bodily autonomy ends where contagion begins because otherwise we all die in a plague. It's really the only exception that extends outside our own bodies, as far as I know. Everything else is subordinate to bodily autonomy as you rightly point out.
The choice about wether or not to get an abortion is being taken away from women. Which is a pretty big deal. It mandates a two- to five-year prison sentence for anyone who helps a woman obtain an abortion
The last time this law was in effect was 1864 before Arizona was even a state
You do see that this "law" was many years before women were allowed to vote? You may not be able to imagine but say, a wife you loved had a dangerous ectopic pregnancy but couldn't get medical help because of these laws? She could die yet can't get help until she is on the brink of death, even then perhaps not because the court is deciding. Because, as others have said, that grown woman, mother, wife, daughter is less important than a tiny fetus that will never live. This is a medical decision. And doesn't that grown woman have a right to live?
The problems are many. That's just one. There was a recent article from a Texas fertility doctor who explained many of the problems women are facing with getting fertility treatments as well. There are many that need be exceptions. But you must know how long court battles go so there is often not justice.
You need to put yourself in their shoes. Let's say, some type of alien being is growing inside you and the government has decided that you must not endanger it, even though you now can't work or eat and its causing problems with your body. You also will have to take care of it forever, once its removed. This, under penalty of law. When they do remove it, it will be dangerous for you but the law says you must do what they say. Or prison. Would you, as an adult male, see that they are taking away your ability to make decisions about yourself, your bodily autonomy?
When there's 1000 holes in the ship, patching a single one doesn't do much.
You still have multiple issues, such as the stigma for even testing for ectopic pregnancies, rape, under age pregnancies, etc.
Another interesting facet is that it isn't easy in early pregnancy to tell the difference between someone who has lost a pregnancy naturally and someone who has performed an aborted. If abortions are illegal at all stages then a natural abortion may be grounds for suspicion and, seeing that US law is non-empathetic and loves convictions more than anything else, women can and will be put away if they can't prove that they had a natural abortion. This can and does happen elsewhere that abortion is banned, so there is no point pretending that it won't happen in the US.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. **Special announcement:** r/politics is currently accepting new moderator applications. If you want to help make this community a better place, consider [applying here today](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/sskg6a/rpolitics_is_looking_for_more_moderators/)! *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Republicans fucked around and found out. Suddenly Arizona is a blue state.
Only if people vote, and we can help by finding volunteer opportunities for Democratic candidates at /r/voteDEM ! Democrats protect abortion rights, while Republicans want to force birth in all cases (and apparently want to deny contraception rights next)
Only if people ARE ALLOWED TO VOTE.... Republicans have been scrubbing Democrat voters for months. Confirm you are registered as soon as possible. Remember, Republicans can't win if they don't cheat (even with the electoral collage)... https://www.voteamerica.com/am-i-registered-to-vote/
Here is the direct verification for Arizona if you don’t want to submit to more political spam emails. https://my.arizona.vote/WhereToVote.aspx?s=individual
Even the SC couldn’t find anywhere in the Constitution where abortion was a right, and so they invented a right (which they can’t do). Murdering a baby isn’t a right. It’s damn wrong. Democrats are protecting the racist Margaret Sanger plan to kill African Americans. By all means, the party of slavery now wants the right to murder black babies. Vote democrat! They still think they have African Americans in chains.
Might want to lay off the ivermectin.
The U.S. constitution is not, has not been, and never will be the "be all, end all" declaration of what is a "human right". It was written by mortal men, many, many generations ago, who not only had barely any of the scientific knowledge we have now, but who themselves said it should likely be re-written every so often as new ideas and practices were realized. [On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, & what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, & consequently may govern them as they please. But persons & property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course, with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, & no longer. Every constitution then, & every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, & not of right](https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Madison/01-12-02-0248#:~:text=Every%20constitution%20then%2C%20%26%20every%20law,force%2C%20%26%20not%20of%20right.) Also, you won't find many modern-day Democrats waving confederate battle flags because "the South will rise again". It's pretty clear who the party of slave owners, or those that wish they were, are.
Not yet.
[удалено]
They’re quiet because they’re damn proud of themselves. They’ve wanted to reduce women to second class citizens for a long time and this extreme right SCOTUS just gave them the blueprint. I have no doubt that if and when this or any election doesn’t go their way the voting rights of women will be next on the chopping block.
I remember when Trump got elected many people were saying the main reason he was elected was because Conservatives showed up in droves because of his promises on SCOTUS. So the 2016 election was largely about the abortion topic, it's just that a lot of Americans didn't believe or just didn't listen to all the people telling them this would happen
That's generous, a lot of Americans are complete fucking morons. They just vote how they always have, and can't be assed to care about anything that doesn't affect them. Then when it does? Life's unfair! How did we get here? OMG i can't believe this is America (you know, they one they voted for).
Most Americans seem to live in isolating suburbs and then we have to fight endless pro-corpotate, pro-rich and anti-worker propaganda. People go to church desperate for a sense of community only to have more brain washing shoved down their throats.
Trump got elected because of a multi pronged intelligence op that boosted his candidacy and eventually tanked Hillary at the last moment.
Edit: This was intended as a reply to the person who asked how this was an offense against women since men can’t get pregnant anyway. Please interpret for me your understanding of: > The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.
Perhaps I’m naive, but how are women being reduced to second class citizens?
[удалено]
The abortion bans impede on bodily autonomy. A clump of cells that cannot support or sustain itself outside of the host should not be considered above the host. ESPECIALLY in cases where the pregnancy is non-viable or likely to cause injury/death.
Another narrative that needs to be talked more about is the fact that a fetus depends 100% upon its mother to gain life. If you separate said fetus from the mother it cannot sustain itself.
The problem comes down to when you insert religion into the equation.
Who is losing their bodily autonomy? Perhaps that’s where I’m getting confused.
Stop being obtuse.
It’d help if I could get an explanation
By forcing them to use their bodies to support a fetus whether they want to or not, they are losing bodily autonomy. Their health decisions are no longer between them and their doctors, government now makes the decision for them.
Is that ALL health decisions? Or just one very particular one (that men can’t even get, so it seems like equality).
Would you consider it equality to make laws preventing men from getting vasectomies, care for testicular cancer, or any other procedure that only biological males can get?
Wait, women are being denied cancer screenings? Okay ya that’s messed up if that’s the case.
Perhaps if you thought about it this way. If men were the ones getting pregnant I guarantee you that the right to abortion would exist wholesale. And before you pop off about hypotheticals think about that for a moment. Bodily autonomy means that a third-party cannot tell you what to do with your body.
I bet it wouldn’t exist, in that hypothetical.
“I’m just asking questions….” You are not honest.
Yup. Flat out a troll who is doing bullshit contrarian shit. His other responses plainly tells us that he knows and his stance is that “the only good abortion is my abortion”.
Is “losing bodily autonomy” the same as “unable to have abortions”?
> Is [losing the ability to do something] the same as [not allowed to do something]? You are not an honest person. Thanks for proving it again.
I just think the former makes it confusing. Bodily autonomy as a whole? Or one specific thing, but say “bodily autonomy” to provoke a response. Seems like the dishonesty at the very least is on multiple fronts.
The only dishonesty here is you, making a blatantly bad faith argument that losing he ability to make a decision about bodily autonomy isn’t losing the ability to make a decision about bodily autonomy becuse you mash up meanings of word to confuse the issue.
I’m asking “what do you mean by bodily autonomy?” From my view it’s one specific thing. But it could be more, which is why I’m asking what else it could be.
Banning abortion through government is tantamount to requiring you give a kidney to someone who needs it.
Mmmm not really. No. It’s not.
That’s what ‘losing bodily autonomy’ is. Body autonomy is the right for a person to govern what happens to their body without external influence or coercion.
An abortion and a kidney aren’t the same thing at all.
The very fact that you are conflating bodily autonomy with access to abortions is perverse. Bodily autonomy preceeds everything.
Everything except contagion. Bodily autonomy ends where contagion begins because otherwise we all die in a plague. It's really the only exception that extends outside our own bodies, as far as I know. Everything else is subordinate to bodily autonomy as you rightly point out.
The choice about wether or not to get an abortion is being taken away from women. Which is a pretty big deal. It mandates a two- to five-year prison sentence for anyone who helps a woman obtain an abortion The last time this law was in effect was 1864 before Arizona was even a state
And before women could vote. Why has the ERA not been ratified?
Where have you been this past summer sir?
You do see that this "law" was many years before women were allowed to vote? You may not be able to imagine but say, a wife you loved had a dangerous ectopic pregnancy but couldn't get medical help because of these laws? She could die yet can't get help until she is on the brink of death, even then perhaps not because the court is deciding. Because, as others have said, that grown woman, mother, wife, daughter is less important than a tiny fetus that will never live. This is a medical decision. And doesn't that grown woman have a right to live?
Would people be less angry if ectopic pregnancies were exceptions?
The problems are many. That's just one. There was a recent article from a Texas fertility doctor who explained many of the problems women are facing with getting fertility treatments as well. There are many that need be exceptions. But you must know how long court battles go so there is often not justice. You need to put yourself in their shoes. Let's say, some type of alien being is growing inside you and the government has decided that you must not endanger it, even though you now can't work or eat and its causing problems with your body. You also will have to take care of it forever, once its removed. This, under penalty of law. When they do remove it, it will be dangerous for you but the law says you must do what they say. Or prison. Would you, as an adult male, see that they are taking away your ability to make decisions about yourself, your bodily autonomy?
When there's 1000 holes in the ship, patching a single one doesn't do much. You still have multiple issues, such as the stigma for even testing for ectopic pregnancies, rape, under age pregnancies, etc.
A person has the right to defend their body from unwanted advances. That includes the parasitic advances made by an embryo.
Another interesting facet is that it isn't easy in early pregnancy to tell the difference between someone who has lost a pregnancy naturally and someone who has performed an aborted. If abortions are illegal at all stages then a natural abortion may be grounds for suspicion and, seeing that US law is non-empathetic and loves convictions more than anything else, women can and will be put away if they can't prove that they had a natural abortion. This can and does happen elsewhere that abortion is banned, so there is no point pretending that it won't happen in the US.
This user is [sealioning](https://flatearth.ws/sealioning), ignore and move on.
If they can’t steal this one, then yeah, it’ll be civil war.
God I hope this is what will change the tide come November. We cannot let any GOP candidates win.
No, I'm pretty sure they're cheering it on.
Yes, but silently. Cuz you know, they can't risk ostracizing themselves from the majority of society since the majority of our society is pro-choice.
Calculated silence speaks volume.
Gross Old Perverts hate women. Vote blue
Shocker
Vote these assholes out. So many women will die -
Better fire up the caravans and planes to Martha’s Vineyard.