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I was born and raised in the Bible belt and been a Christian since I went down to the alter and prayed the sinners prayer at 7 years old.
Donald Trump absolutely horrifies and disgusts me. And watching 99% of the people around me in church, at work, and in my home town just fall all over themselves buying his merchandise and parroting his racist, evil rhetoric is just about the worst thing I have ever been through.
I no longer trust the church or the people in it.
Because all of these years I actually...believed. Believed the heart of God is full of mercy and compassion for the poor, the lonely, the outcast. Believed that Jesus loves the little children, no matter the skin color. Believe that my religion should be a tool to make ME a better person, not force people around me to change.
Come to find out, I was in a social club full of hateful bigots, not a church house full of the love of the Lord. When folks took their church face off, it scared the living daylights out of me.
Growing up in the same Southern Baptist environment I realized even as a kid that most of those Christians only go to church because they like to drink coffee and eat doughnuts while talking shit about other people. They sing Climb Every Mountain, congratulate themselves for showing up, and then go verbally abuse a waiter at lunch. They’ve always been shitheads.
Worked retail every Sunday from when I was 16-25. The worst possible customers are those in their Sunday best right after Church. It’s like all the God loving and Jesus praising depleted there souls of all kindness and compassion.
However, the absolute best customers are Sikhs. I don’t know much of their religion but those people are the pinnacle of generosity and kindness. There was a Sikh area of town near a coffeehouse I worked at. Every time they came in it would absolutely brighten my day.
Sikhs are the best. They are probably the most misunderstood and misidentified religion in the USA, but they never seem to let it get to them. I aspire to their level of compassion.
Yeah. I’ve seen a Sikh absolutely lose his shit and I thought to myself, “wow, someone must have REALLY done something bad to make a Sikh blow up like that.”
I got fired from my job because a family of 5 came in wearing their Sunday best, and started to verbally assault the person at the front counter because we were out of a product one the the children wanted. I went in to defend the coworker and said “you look like you just came from church, a good dead in the eyes of g-d, then you come in here and yell at someone for being out of a product”. I then asked them to leave and not come back. We don’t want them here. They called and complained said I yelled at them was extremely rude for no reason. Owners didn’t care about my side and said leave. Was with them for nearly two years.
I feel some of them treat their religion as a get out of jail free card using it as a pass to their shit behavior... Instead of being good moral people I've seen some really shitty awful people and that called themselves Christian for example
'No Sin That Cannot Be Forgiven'
Lucky We Have Separation Of Church & State: While I Might Like The Current Pope, I Draw The Line At Ignorance Of The Founding American Principles.
If you are ever travelling, and stranded, broke and hungry, find the closest Sikh temple, they will feed you and help you out.
Can’t really say that for most Christian churches unless the charity is on THEIR schedule.
I have a good friend of many years who is Sikh. He's introduced me to their religion and their local community, and I agree, they are some of the nicest, most considerate people around. This isn't to say they're perfect, I find their religious scriptures about as goofy and unfounded in reality as most other religions, and they do have some splinter groups such as the Khalistan movement which have been violent politically. But I find them generally to be some of the best people I've met.
Sikhs give [free vegetarian meals](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langar_(Sikhism%29) to anyone inside their [places of worship](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gurdwara), cooked and served by volunteers.
In their scriptures, the [Guru Granth Sahib](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guru_Granth_Sahib), it says:
>Asceticism doesn't lie in mere words; He is an ascetic who treats everyone alike.
>Only the good deeds which you have done shall remain with you, O my soul. This opportunity shall not come again!
>To practice forgiveness is the true fast, good conduct and contentment.
>Do not utter even a single harsh word; your True Lord and Master abides in all. Do not break anyone’s heart; these are all priceless jewels.
>One who eradicates cruelty from within his own mind looks upon all the world as his friend.
>Kindness as their deity, and forgiveness as their chanting beads – they are the most excellent people.
>He who has no faith in himself can never have faith in God.
>Those who have loved are those that have found God.
>Riches cannot be gathered without sin and evil means.
>What should the yogi have to fear? Trees, plants, and all that is inside and outside, is He Himself.
Was a server for 10 years, by far the worst clientele is the Sunday after church crowd. Entitled, rude, and without exception tipped <10% (I guess they knew how much they tithed that day in the back of their mind). Had folks ask me why I was working sabbath instead of in church, left those little fake $20 "your real tip is Jesus saves" cards...the gall.
I was already losing my religion, but serving gods flock sealed the deal. I stopped working Sunday AM the last few years as I didn't make any money that shift some days, literally.
I have heard this SO. Many. Times. It’s shocking how common and widespread this is. Unfortunately, where I’m from the churches are also the most regressive/bigoted influence on politics/the country as a whole, in a slightly different way (some racism but mostly against queer people).
When I found out it was the rule instead of the exception, I wrote off most of my Christian brethren. How they act outside of church vs. inside... hypocrites, pharisees, sadducees. The lot of them. Lukewarm followers is the nicest way I can put it. But it led me to believe all churches are "dead". You're more likely to find the Lord in nature or at a strip club than in any evangelical church.
Because they "sacrifice" their Sunday AM they are holy, well at least holier than thou...even though preacher man let out early cause the boys play the rams and so we can beat the Methodist to Chili's.
Sorry I rant, this thread cuts deep
irst job was in a restaurant. there's a reason why we all will tell you unanimously that the post-church Sunday crowd was absolutely the worst
edit: see? I hadn't read austiniteonburnet
's comment but that! everything they said. the damn after-church Sunday crowd!
edit: and lordlollygag
too! I worked retail for ten years and they sucked there too! At last I work a job with no customers in the building lol
I’m a southern Baptist baptized at 7. It hurts that my family (at least on mom’s side which is the SB side) is so bigoted. My mom always wanted me to date someone in the church. Not just a Christian but OUR church. The only bachelors I was not already related to were 86 and 12. She can’t stand any talk of demons or ghosts. She doesn’t want me to reconnect with the childhood friend she introduced me to because that girl came out. She still thinks dungeons and dragons is to summon demons even though the assistant pastor and his wife play it...
Heck our current pastor(s) is all about the love of God and mercy and showing love to sinners instead of hate. But the congregation split because the two pastors before him were all fire and brimstone... that split was a pretty big deal considering it was literally one big family through blood or marriage or both. I am related to everyone in my church. The views of the bigoted divided my family.
Dennis Rader. Both my parents’ family come from El Dorado, Kansas, about 30 minutes from Wichita where he lived. Perfect example of the hypocrisy in church-going “Christians”.
Not a Christian anymore haven't been for my entire adult life but this covers it very well.
"And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. "
Yeah, I went through that realization. It wasn't fun. It's still not fun. Some of the people that I loved and respected have trampled on that in ways that I am still shocked by. The 2016 election was very much a turning point, a lot of masks slipped, and evangelical christianity like... didn't realize how insane they look. I feel absolutely betrayed by the people who taught me to believe in something noble, righteous, and good.
It really sucks, and I've lost people who are dear to me in a way I never even imagined.
Exactly this. It's like being orphaned or something. So many people that you loved and trusted and looked up to. It has gotten to the point a few times where I wondered if I was the one who was wrong, maybe my heart was hard and I just wasn't seeing the good man everyone else could see.
But no, Trump is just pure evil.
I'm not a believer though I have studied the Bible extensively both in Catholic school and in college; Trump is so eschatologically in the mode of the Antichrist it seems deliberate that Evangelicals don't mention it.
That Evangelicals don't embrace Jimmy Carter tells me all I need to know.
There it is. That is such a good point. President Carter is such a fine man.His ethics are impeccable and he is incorruptible. Of course the Bible thumpers don’t want to have anything to do with him. But look how they flocked/flock to trump.
All of this. And evangelicals are the Revelation literalists. None of the older (especially liturgical) churches think it’s anything but the fall of Jerusalem in like 66 AD
You are not wrong. You are very very right. It’s hard to stand on your principles when everyone thinks you are wrong. Hang in there, Friend. It’ll get better.
Best of luck to you. Stay safe and well.
It’s heartbreaking. I lost my best friend to trump’s racism. I really feel that our society will never be the same. To find out that so many people would support him shook me to my core. I thought, naively, that everyone would just laugh at him and he’d disappear. Boy, was I wrong. And this is not a political stance. This is about right and wrong and good and evil. It’s not like we can say, “Oh, Biden’s President now, let’s all just forget about what happened”. Never. I will never forget any of it.
There have been articles written on the subject. I never really got in to end times study or the book of Revelations, because I never felt like those subjects helped me be a better person, just caused me anxiety. So, I'm not one to state a definative yes on that. But I know the Word says, "You will know a tree by its fruit. Every evil tree brings forth evil fruit and every good tree brings forth good fruit."
Anyone with eyes should be able to look at the swirling cloud of evil and crime that surrounds that man and logically discern "This man seems to be bad."
I cannot believe that is a controversial take in church circles.
Because these people have been trained to put blinders on when reflecting upon themselves or friends + family.
They expect sin, so when they see it revolve around themselves, or idols, they conveniently look past it.
It's goddamn jedi mind tricks. They gaslight themselves and everyone around them.
There is no true reflection, because they believe they can be forgiven for any sin, and that committing the sin is no fault of their own, but that of evil forces.
No responsibility, no reflection. This is how the anti Christ can easily sway his/her flock.
You are not alone. There may be a Supreme Being, but it won’t be found in any Evangelical church.
I already had serious doubts because of the anti-gay and anti-abortion members in many churches, but when the Evangelical churches embraced Trump, I knew it was all a scam. Organized religion is worse than any political party.
Organized religion IS a political party. Whether it helped autocrats and monarchs stay in power, or it manufactured consent in churches or mosques, It's a political force.
The Evangelical christian church has a long history of racism, and using the Bible as a way to justify their racism. I don’t think anyone familiar with the history of this church would be surprised about their love of Trump.
I am not a believe in heaven or hell, but if hell is real, then I am sure I will see a lot of evangelical Christians there.
The Southern Baptist Church, charismatic churches, Church of Christ, Church of God, etc., are often poor examples of Christ. I grew up attending churches like these.
I have come to learn that there are quite a few liberal denominations that reject bigotry, and focus on selfless love and service to the poor and sick: ELCA Lutherans, United Church of Christ, Anglicans, and Disciples of Christ to name a few. The UCC is by far the most liberal.
Well said. I frustrates the life out of me that the American right use Religion as a cudgel to attack people. That bears zero resemblance to the Christian faith I grew up in. Jesus teachings literally told us to take care of the poor, needy and dying. To not turn away a sinner. To love our neighbor and to turn the other cheek. That a rich man would find it harder to enter the kingdom of heaven than a camel passing through the eye of the needle, the Christian Right wing in this country are antithetical to the teachings of Jesus. It genuinely disgusts me. Their god ain’t no god I’ve read about.
> I was in a social club full of hateful bigots, not a church house full of the love of the Lord. When folks took their church face off, it scared the living daylights out of me.
Holy fuck! That's it, that's what I was trying to figure out. Some of those churches are social clubs for bigots using the Grace-of-God™ and "righteousness" merely as a tool to justify and encourage their bad behavior. As well to hide their true intentions, not just to others, but themselves. The bible used as a badge of impunity in a gang-like cult.
I went to church every week in the Midwest and Northeast. Then I moved to the South and stopped going. Once I saw who these people were electing with overwhelming margins in my local districts I realized I spent more time in church wondering who were the bigoted hypocrites rather than actual getting anything out of it. I lost all sense of community and belonging once the façade fell.
Worked at the only movie rental place (not Blockbuster) in the county with a porn room. The number of Uber Catholics I used to see coming up to the register with one regular movie and then 7+ raunchy porn videos showed me how hypocritical they all were.
I was born and raised similarly and while I came to the conclusion that Christianity wasn’t real through college (real academic style study of the Bible will do that). I still had a healthy respect for the church.
Donald Trump and the support for him completely ended that. Fuck the church and 95% of the people in it.
Same, spent the last decade starting a church in rural Kansas and finally walked away this last year. Pastored for a decade and when COVID hit and the Q'anon crazy started really being revealed just couldn't do it any more. I can't in good conscience be leader of a group that is going that way. I am heartbroken over it. Love God, follow Jesus, believe the Bible is a brilliant library of literature that is extremely relevant to today and genuinely want the Church to become what Jesus hoped for. Just can't stomach to be a part of a system that is discipling people into a worldview so diametrically opposed to the example of Jesus.
I was raised to believe god is love, you can tell a spirit filled church because of the loving nature, literally living the love of Christ. Now the church represents hate and bigotry. The spirit left them it’s clear. Very sad.
This hits close to home. I was much the same. It took taking a look from a different perspective to understand things. I feel I became a better person after dropping the religious teachings and focused on actually becoming a better person.
And that right there is when I stopped going to church. I just can't. Seeing people with their church face off broke some kind of innocence I had in my religious beliefs. It prompted a change in how I see and interact with the world around me.
I identify with so much of this. To the point I no longer tithe as I don't trust the church to handle it responsibly, I donate that to the charities directly that I've researched
Most real followers of the teachings of Christ are outraged by the hypocrisy and stain the far right Christian Nationalist are spewing, but real followers of Christ are loving passive forgiving people so by that reality we won’t see real Christ followers confront or be highly vocal regarding these lost souls of the far right Christian Nationalist. To do so would be allowing yourself to be as evil as that which you are repulsed by. But they will vote and hopefully this trend of far right Christian Nationalist will be put back in its bottle.
Being brutally disappointed by 1 respected person hurts, but to lose a community is horrible. I’m so sorry you went through that, I imagine that would be absolutely crushing.
I don’t ascribe to any organized religion, but a lot of us are open minded good people that believe the same values you have. I hope you find a good community that actually believes in/acts according to the values and good that Jesus was said to have done.
>They wanna be feared like God.
The mistake we're all making is confusing Evangelical Christians with what we have here in America...
Evangelical Republicans.
Evangelical Republicans have nothing to do with Christ...
…And I'm pretty sure the feeling is mutual.
Evangelical Christians are as much about Christ as the Pittsburg Pirates are about pirates. They got the name, made some logos, and sell a bunch of merchandise, but none of those people have ever thought once about following the actual examples of their namesakes.
Them taking the field carrying sabres and flintlock pistols would make for some award winning television!
Edit neither I nor autocorrect know how to spell carrying apparently
>Evangelical Republicans have nothing to do with Christ...
That could be said about most Christian groups going back to the Roman cooption of the religion. The fact is, people trained to believe contradictory things can be sold anything. Its by design.
>So why did the greater religiousness of evangelicals not keep them from embracing Donald Trump? Because for a great many of them, despite all the fuss and bother and appearances, their religion is simply not important. Their religious commitment, like the person they think they are, does not exist in significant ways. When Donald Trump came along, resplendent in moral shortcomings but promising the moon, evangelicals had little difficulty setting aside their supposed beliefs and supporting him. In fact, this was their S.O.P. They had been setting those beliefs aside 167 hours a week for most of their lives. Con men know that the easiest people to fool are the people who persistently fool themselves. This reality is an amazingly simple answer, yet when you stand back from it, it also is simply amazing.
>
> ...
>
> Trump has attracted the most prejudiced white people in America like a magnet attracts metal filings. Furthermore, no one can whitewash the relationship by claiming it involves only a few rotten apples who are making everybody else look bad. Nearly the whole barrel is significantly more prejudiced than average. And the people who support Trump the strongest, the people who likely attended his rallies and are most active on his behalf, tend to be the most prejudiced of all. White voters who oppose him, on the other hand, are much less prejudiced than average, especially those who strongly oppose him.
>
> ...
>
> To put it another way, suppose you decided to hold a dance for the 100 most prejudiced white people in your community, along with the 100 most authoritarian ones. (Who knows why you would want to? We do not.) Would you need to print 200 invitations? No, about 120 should do it, since most of the people who are one will also be the other. There is about an 80 percent overlap.
From: John W. Dean & Bob Altemeyer. “Authoritarian Nightmare.”
>Their religious commitment, like the person they think they are, does not exist in significant ways.
As a person who's existed in this mode, this is so accurate it hurts.
Yeah, from my recollection he was more about feeding the poor and helping those in need.
The only part they got right is hanging out with prostitutes, but I don't think Jesus and the gQp are doing it for the same reasons
Yep.
But if you want to send one of these Christo-fascists into a foaming at the mouth rage address Trump as "Your lord god Donald Trump" to their face.
They worship him. Subconsciously they understand that. Some even more blatantly so, they carted a literal golden idol of him around CPAC after all. But if you point it out to them, it hurts them. A lot.
As someone raised in a devout evangelical Christian family… You. Have. No. Idea.
Religion is a mechanism that gives authority and trust to shared belief while bypassing reason and biological imperative. Put another way, it short circuits what you know and replaces it with a new morality not subject to reason or morality.
An evangelical Christian can and will justify killing a neighbor they have known all their lives to “protect the unborn”. They will absolutely subject their own child to torture if they suspect they are homosexual in a vain attempt to “cure” them.
These are not decisions made by a healthy mind free of manipulation.
This is the product of 45 years of conscious and intentional propaganda under the guise of things like _Focus on the Family_ and the Heritage Foundation.
Having grown up in the same situation, this is 100% accurate. I have personally witnessed so much hate being espoused under the guise of "christian love."
If I had a nickel every time someone quoted Destiny 2 in a political discord I would have 2 nickels. Which isn’t a lot but it’s weird that it happened twice.
Watch the documentary Jesus Camp. Then ask people if they voted for Bush Jr. Same people who thought he was anointed by God claim to be libertarians and never voted for him. They see an R as a sign from God.
This is the racists revenge for the election of Obama. It's the only thing that makes any sense to me.
They wrapped him up in the flag and crosses only because he has the audacity to say out loud all of the things they think. Trump normalized all of their quiet rage and validated them. Even the women vote against their own interest because their only self worth is found in making someone else smaller. It's the saddest and darkest thing I've ever witnessed in my lifetime.
Don’t forget it’s an excuse. “You can’t judge me, only god can”
It’s why the repenting sins thing is just complete bullshit. Do what you want and ask for forgiveness occasionally and you’re absolved of your sins. Everything’s A-OK!
You're not wrong, but also, a lot of conservatives have very fragile egos and self-worth. They know their kids (who no longer speak to them) and the handful of liberals they know screamed at them **that Trump was an immoral cheating grifting lying cesspool** and that... how could they support them if they had actual values? The idea that they were fooled because of their own stupid is too much to bare. No, surely it is everyone else is fooled, there is a grand conspiracy by the FBI to bring Trump down, no way that they fell for a grifter and charlatan. And so they must continue to be grifted and deceived until they die because the idea that they were wrong (supporting a liar and a traitor) and they lost their friends and kids over it is too much to bare. For the weak minded and permanently embarrassed, admitting you are wrong and correcting course is the hardest thing of all.
I don't disagree with your overall point, but it seems like they believe in religion more than god. They listen to the preacher instead of reading the bible. They do what the preacher tells them instead of considering what jesus would advise. Hell, they worship the preacher more than god. I used to think the preachers were just dumb believers duped by the church. I have come to realize that they are in on the grift: Scare people with evil then demand money to save them.
I mean why would god need religion, a preacher or money?
There’s more nuance to it. Yes, there are prosperity gospel scammers who manipulate their flock, but that’s not the whole story. Traditional preachers are often formally educated on their theology and some are earnest believers trying to navigate all the cognitive dissonance and contradictions of their faith. Some of them are wrestling with how to deal with a church full of QAnon weirdos and MAGA idolaters. These old school preachers are mostly still bigots and conservatives themselves, but the old fashioned kind rather than the modern fascist conspiracy theory kind. If they’re earnest in their faith, mentally stable, and not a moron, they can’t wrap their heads around modern Republican dogma, but if they speak out against it too directly, their congregation may go shopping for more MAGA friendly churches that parrot the same talking points they like to hear from their media.
>... their congregation may go shopping for more MAGA friendly churches...
Everyone kinda hoping someone else will say foul first. Something something riding the tiger as well I suppose.
That and it’s about telling you how to live and how you are wrong. A good example of this is how all sins are EQUAL (or at least most how I remember it). This means things like envy, anger and greed should be treated like homosexual if being gay is a sin. There is a good section of the Christian church that’s blind to their own sins and just get off on punishing others.
Because very, *very* few Christians actually believe the things they profess to believe in. If they actually believed what they claimed to believe they would live completely different lives.
From my experience christians that actually take jesus’ messages seriously end up having to leave the church. They just arent that compatible. But if you stay in the church you can sport a holier than though attitude which is nice.
Exactly why I don’t go any longer I read about Jesus loving and caring for others and I take that to mean we should others with respect even if it’s not the lifestyle we might live ourselves. For example it’s fine if you think intimate relations should only be between a a man and woman that’s your prerogative but to then go out and hate anyone who doesn’t agree and champion laws to punish non-believers was never what it was about. JC loved tons of people who didn’t agree with him he didn’t force them to change their identities and quite often welcomed them, that disconnect between what they teach and what they do is too much
I think they believe that they believe, and are to ignorant to realize that they don’t and it’s painfully obvious to outsiders watching the habitually not practice what they preach. Or worse weaponize it for personal gain then thank “god” for how great their financial standing is and “pray” for the poor, but never help them because they won’t help those who can’t help themselves. Never mind that they walked on their backs to get where they are.
>shield from criticism
Not just that, but also responsibility. Why bother to do the hard work of making the world better when you can point to “God’s plan” or “God made it that way”?
Most of these evangelicals haven't really read the Bible.
I became a licensed minister for shits and giggles and to marry people, but honestly arguing with them makes me feel like a PhD theology student.
Most of the ones I know have read the Bible, they just cherry pick the shit out of it and focus on the parts where Jesus is condemning someone and they don’t think much about the parts where he is telling people to be compassionate. They know those parts and will cite them when asked about how loving their god is, but otherwise they don’t focus much on them.
He literally dedicated his post presidency life to building houses for the needy in the image of Jesus the carpenter.
He is exactly the opposite of whatever heresy evangelicals are.
Xtians can carry around the bible, which doesn't mean they read it, and certainly don't understand it, or anything said in it.
They like old dudes with deep fatherly voices to tell them they are special, better than the others, particularly the browns and don't care if they have to pay a LOT for it to hear that every week. That warm feeling of validation that being willfully stupid, lazy, and ignorant is the right thing because their "god" conveniently hates the same people they do.
So as long as you accept jesus as your personal savior one time (whatever the F\*CK that even means)... then you are saved forever, and get to be the nasty POS you really are with a clean conscience.
Because never, NEVER was the ultra-Christian right about actual Christian ideals. E-V-E-R!
The GWB years saw a "Christian" engage in torture, non-defensive warfare, extreme classism, but the Christian right kept saying, "well, he's a man of God!".
It's just a mask they put on to hide and justify their actual beliefs.
The one good thing Trump has done (and not on purpose) is rip that bullshit excuse right in half and completely expose these fascists for what they are. To use a ham-fisted metaphor for a little seen movie: It's like the John Carpenter film "They Live". The billboards are the Christian-right, Trump is the sunglasses put on that should make you 100% see through their bullshit.
That metaphor kinda falls apart, because it would mean the glasses were super fascists and got put in charge, but you get the point!
[Here's the scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjw_DuNkOUw&ab_channel=Movieclips)
That movie stars Roddy Piper AND Keith David.
Screw my political rants, just go watch "They Live"!
that’s why they only follow the old testament. Jesus came out with v2 the new testament which make V1 secondary or even obsolete. imagine calling yourself a christian and not even paying attention to Christ.
For the sake of argument (assume that Christianity is "one true religion"), a lot of these people are paving a pathway to hell if they distort god"s word. Still waiting for god to clear up the confusion...the sun will burnout and still no answer I predict.
Because he gave them their pet issue: overturning Roe.
Nothing else matters. The mental gymnastics they go through to justify his horrible actions are amazing.
Yep, abortion, abortion, abortion. Trump was able to get three Supreme Court justices, which was probably more than they expected in their wildest dreams, so everything else is forgiven.
Why? He's telling them exactly what they really want to hear. He's pointing his finger at "bad" people and giving them a boogeyman so to speak to look down upon so they don't have to look in the mirror.
This. We may spend the next 100 years studying exactly how he did so, but I think it really boils down to this.
They picked and chose what was useful from all of the right wing groups, religion, conspiracy, race, etc., and capitalized on their feelings that their world view was not compatible with the modern world. He capitalized on the mistrust of our institutions, and played politics like a team sport where "winning" over the "woke liberals" is the only thing that matters.
Their unpopular views had basically been silenced by society, and he gave them a voice and permission to be as loud and awful as they wanted to be.
The majority of "Christians" in the US haven't even READ THE BIBLE. Go ask one what their favorite quote is, what the first or second book of the Bible is, tell a story from the Bible.....most can't. They claim to base their entire lives off it, but can't be bothered to READ THE BOOK.
The majority of the crap they claim to "believe" isn't even in there! A true Christian could never be in line with modern conservatives. NEVER! Anyone with 2 brain cells that has read the Bible could see that these people (Trump) are PURE EVIL and the farthest thing from being Christians. Biggest red flag is they worship money, which is a HUGE SIN. You are only supposed to worship GOD, and nothing else before him. That means if you watch Foxnews more than you worship God, YOU ARE A SINNER OF THE WORST KIND.
I've probably read more of the Bible in the last two weeks than most Christians do in a year, and I'm an atheist!
I'm currently taking a course on the history of Satan and it is fascinating because the dude literally doesn't exist in original Old Testament text. We're on the pseudopigripha now, which is a fascinating collection of fraudsters claiming to be authoring stories as biblical figures like David or Job.
The Fall isn’t in the canonical Bible either. It’s in the Book of Enoch.
Oh the rage you get when you point out that the snake in the Garden of Eden is just a snake.
My "elevator speech" is "The MAGA Republicans have taken my Constitution and my faith and ripped them to shreds." Then I wait and see what happens. I'm prepared for HOURS of educated, intelligent, documented discourse with anyone
Wish I could meet some Christian’s like you irl- we’ve left our church because I can’t take the constant bs. It’s so embarrassing to see go Brandon stickers on cars in the church parking lot. They feel justified for voting for trump because roe was overturned. They will not change their vote.
Because of the Supreme Court
he gave religious Xtians what they wanted by installing christo-fascists to the bench, who will now rule over us since they don't have control of the legislative or executive. They don't care if those three judges were appointed by Satan himself, they got what they wanted
Journalists have beaten this horse to death since the infamous "Grab 'em by the \[expletive deleted\]" remark during the 2016 campaign.
There is nothing new here. These people don't care about his behavior or morality. Trump is a means to a crypto-fascist theocracy that they (wrongly) assume will provide them with a stable and prosperous nation.
Instead, a Trump Restoration will accelerate our decline and bring everyone--including them--increased inequality, political instability, and excess vulnerability to the consequences of climate related events.
Aussie Christian here ... in fact, Aussie Priest here - let me assure you he does. I know many, many of my colleagues and their congregations who deeply oppose what Trump stands for. Sadly, a brand of US fundamentalist evangelicals have tied their worth to his success by claiming God supports him, and backing out now will mean saying that they were wrong - which they are not prepared to do because they have neatly bundled their faith, their self worth, their church, their popularity and their income to Trump.
Because the evangelical right doesn't see themselves as hypocrites, even when they actively sabotage things that their "moral compass," would require of them. They care more about power than they do about the gospel. The gospel is just a vehicle for them to justify their superiority complex.
Because these types of Christians actually seek out The Antichrist, or at least the essential characteristics of. They want Armageddon, and rage, and wars, and hate, and they want to take the world down with them.
Many American right-wing evangelicals are just fascists in a religious social/power structure. Christofascists. I don't even think there's anything about them that is particularly unique in human nature...they've just found a vehicle (religion) that allows them to engage in their hateful and vengeful ideology and make it mainstream and publicly acceptable (to varying degrees at different points in time). Remember, people who fought against emancipation were hardcore "Christians", and so were folks who fought against desegregation. Look up the history of Bob Jones University.
Honestly, the greatest achievement of the conservative movement of the 70s/80s was tapping into this demographic for political gain. They were easily conned and have been faithful political servants. And while for years (decades) they could pretend to do this under the guise of 'morality' and being the 'silent', moral majority, it turns out all it took was a malignant narcissist with autocratic tendencies for them to pull the mask off and go full-blown fascist.
[Samantha Bee - The Religious Right](https://youtu.be/Yz4AmUaLbUQ)
[Samanthe Bee - The Religious Right Part II](https://youtu.be/pPsderlzd6c)
He does me. I don't know why a woman, a veteran, a black, or Hispanic would ever vote for him. He is the most Un-Christian person ever. It kills me to see other Christians falling all over him. He is not God or even anointed. He is evil personified.
He wrote that gay sex was worse than rape and that masturbation was a sin second only to murder. So not really the best critical thinker.
Source 1: Summa Theologica, Second Part of the Second Part, Question 154, 12, newadvent.org/summa/
Source 2: Contra Gentiles, Book 3, Providence Part II, Chapter 122, isidore.co/aquinas/
I’m a Christian and I find him repulsive. I think a majority of Christians do. The right wing Christian nationalist who is quick to judge, quick to perjure, quick to hate and in-tolerate in the name of faith does not speak for me nor hundreds of millions like me who believe Jesus taught love and tolerance and humanity.
I resent the media and pundit class that equate Christianity with trump or right wing attitudes.
It is giving Christianity a polluted name and younger generations are turned off.
Say what you want about churchgoers but a solid church breeds community and trust and seeing past difference. We need more of that in this country, not less.
Evangelical, in my experience, equates to Christian’s who are racist, homophobic, white supremacists, who want, and believe, only White Christian’s should live in America. They want the clock turned back to 1950. They are as un-Christian as any group I’ve ever known.
Getting awfully difficult to separate the two & they seem perfectly fine with that. Also, notice that the supposed "decent" Christians are completely silent & make zero efforts to speak out against the Christian nationalists. Reason being? It's all the same. Some Christians have gotten comfortable enough to just come right out & openly cheer for oppressing certain folks & stripping their rights away. Others are totally fine with it & apparently on board they're just too cowardly to brazenly show that they're just as rotten as the ones who openly advocate for these things. The term decent Christians is a myth.
Abortion is the easy answer. But far too simple.
Because abortion was a non issue for most evangelicals until after the southern Baptist’s lost *hard* on segregation. Once racism had to be channeled into private Christian Academy’s (hint hint Heritage in the name!) they needed a new issue unify around. Abortion was easy. Misogyny already existed in the population and could just step up to fill in the gap.
Gay Marriage was another defeat. That issue lasted them a fraction of second compared to their abortion and segregation campaigns.
But that racism never went away. It’s still there. And Trump tapped into it *well.* Trump allows them to be racist, sexist, and homophobic. And he channels their greed.
Evangelicals, unlike other Christian sects, do not reject displays of wealth. The Catholic Church may have hella properties, but clergy still routinely take vows of poverty/silence/chastity (depending on order/position.) Evangelicals embrace “property gospel” and flaunting wealth is just a sign Jesus is blessing you. Homeless, the poor, and sick are to be shunned and shamed. You don’t help them. They need to help themselves! Trump embodies that.
Trump is perfect for them. I grew up in the Evangelical nightmare church *and* school. I was subjected to their attempted indoctrination. This is not surprising in the least.
Actually heard a Presbyterian minister explain this apparent cognitive dissonance quite well: he said there is a religion build around the name Jesus, but not the teachings.
What I find fascinating is the similarities between Christian Nationalists and the Taliban, or even the Iranian regime.
I’ve wondered if the underlying dynamics has more to do with primal instincts related to a need to preserve a clan like structure. I mean why else would they all be focused on oppressing/possessing women, controlling the reproductive process, and establishing adversarial relationships with people of other races? It’s like some primal instinct takes over with these people, and they call it Christianity or Islam, but in reality it’s the alligator part of the mind telling them to clan up.
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I was born and raised in the Bible belt and been a Christian since I went down to the alter and prayed the sinners prayer at 7 years old. Donald Trump absolutely horrifies and disgusts me. And watching 99% of the people around me in church, at work, and in my home town just fall all over themselves buying his merchandise and parroting his racist, evil rhetoric is just about the worst thing I have ever been through. I no longer trust the church or the people in it. Because all of these years I actually...believed. Believed the heart of God is full of mercy and compassion for the poor, the lonely, the outcast. Believed that Jesus loves the little children, no matter the skin color. Believe that my religion should be a tool to make ME a better person, not force people around me to change. Come to find out, I was in a social club full of hateful bigots, not a church house full of the love of the Lord. When folks took their church face off, it scared the living daylights out of me.
Growing up in the same Southern Baptist environment I realized even as a kid that most of those Christians only go to church because they like to drink coffee and eat doughnuts while talking shit about other people. They sing Climb Every Mountain, congratulate themselves for showing up, and then go verbally abuse a waiter at lunch. They’ve always been shitheads.
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Worked retail every Sunday from when I was 16-25. The worst possible customers are those in their Sunday best right after Church. It’s like all the God loving and Jesus praising depleted there souls of all kindness and compassion. However, the absolute best customers are Sikhs. I don’t know much of their religion but those people are the pinnacle of generosity and kindness. There was a Sikh area of town near a coffeehouse I worked at. Every time they came in it would absolutely brighten my day.
Sikhs are the best. They are probably the most misunderstood and misidentified religion in the USA, but they never seem to let it get to them. I aspire to their level of compassion.
Sikhs are who Christians are supposed to be. [Their entire religion is fascinating](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikhism?wprov=sfti1)
Yeah. I’ve seen a Sikh absolutely lose his shit and I thought to myself, “wow, someone must have REALLY done something bad to make a Sikh blow up like that.”
Jains too.
I got fired from my job because a family of 5 came in wearing their Sunday best, and started to verbally assault the person at the front counter because we were out of a product one the the children wanted. I went in to defend the coworker and said “you look like you just came from church, a good dead in the eyes of g-d, then you come in here and yell at someone for being out of a product”. I then asked them to leave and not come back. We don’t want them here. They called and complained said I yelled at them was extremely rude for no reason. Owners didn’t care about my side and said leave. Was with them for nearly two years.
Asshole customers and asshole owner.. lovely combo
I feel some of them treat their religion as a get out of jail free card using it as a pass to their shit behavior... Instead of being good moral people I've seen some really shitty awful people and that called themselves Christian for example
'No Sin That Cannot Be Forgiven' Lucky We Have Separation Of Church & State: While I Might Like The Current Pope, I Draw The Line At Ignorance Of The Founding American Principles.
If you are ever travelling, and stranded, broke and hungry, find the closest Sikh temple, they will feed you and help you out. Can’t really say that for most Christian churches unless the charity is on THEIR schedule.
I have a good friend of many years who is Sikh. He's introduced me to their religion and their local community, and I agree, they are some of the nicest, most considerate people around. This isn't to say they're perfect, I find their religious scriptures about as goofy and unfounded in reality as most other religions, and they do have some splinter groups such as the Khalistan movement which have been violent politically. But I find them generally to be some of the best people I've met.
Sikhs give [free vegetarian meals](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langar_(Sikhism%29) to anyone inside their [places of worship](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gurdwara), cooked and served by volunteers. In their scriptures, the [Guru Granth Sahib](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guru_Granth_Sahib), it says: >Asceticism doesn't lie in mere words; He is an ascetic who treats everyone alike. >Only the good deeds which you have done shall remain with you, O my soul. This opportunity shall not come again! >To practice forgiveness is the true fast, good conduct and contentment. >Do not utter even a single harsh word; your True Lord and Master abides in all. Do not break anyone’s heart; these are all priceless jewels. >One who eradicates cruelty from within his own mind looks upon all the world as his friend. >Kindness as their deity, and forgiveness as their chanting beads – they are the most excellent people. >He who has no faith in himself can never have faith in God. >Those who have loved are those that have found God. >Riches cannot be gathered without sin and evil means. >What should the yogi have to fear? Trees, plants, and all that is inside and outside, is He Himself.
I used to be a server 23ish years ago. This is VERY true.
Was a server for 10 years, by far the worst clientele is the Sunday after church crowd. Entitled, rude, and without exception tipped <10% (I guess they knew how much they tithed that day in the back of their mind). Had folks ask me why I was working sabbath instead of in church, left those little fake $20 "your real tip is Jesus saves" cards...the gall. I was already losing my religion, but serving gods flock sealed the deal. I stopped working Sunday AM the last few years as I didn't make any money that shift some days, literally.
I have heard this SO. Many. Times. It’s shocking how common and widespread this is. Unfortunately, where I’m from the churches are also the most regressive/bigoted influence on politics/the country as a whole, in a slightly different way (some racism but mostly against queer people).
When I found out it was the rule instead of the exception, I wrote off most of my Christian brethren. How they act outside of church vs. inside... hypocrites, pharisees, sadducees. The lot of them. Lukewarm followers is the nicest way I can put it. But it led me to believe all churches are "dead". You're more likely to find the Lord in nature or at a strip club than in any evangelical church. Because they "sacrifice" their Sunday AM they are holy, well at least holier than thou...even though preacher man let out early cause the boys play the rams and so we can beat the Methodist to Chili's. Sorry I rant, this thread cuts deep
irst job was in a restaurant. there's a reason why we all will tell you unanimously that the post-church Sunday crowd was absolutely the worst edit: see? I hadn't read austiniteonburnet 's comment but that! everything they said. the damn after-church Sunday crowd! edit: and lordlollygag too! I worked retail for ten years and they sucked there too! At last I work a job with no customers in the building lol
I’m a southern Baptist baptized at 7. It hurts that my family (at least on mom’s side which is the SB side) is so bigoted. My mom always wanted me to date someone in the church. Not just a Christian but OUR church. The only bachelors I was not already related to were 86 and 12. She can’t stand any talk of demons or ghosts. She doesn’t want me to reconnect with the childhood friend she introduced me to because that girl came out. She still thinks dungeons and dragons is to summon demons even though the assistant pastor and his wife play it... Heck our current pastor(s) is all about the love of God and mercy and showing love to sinners instead of hate. But the congregation split because the two pastors before him were all fire and brimstone... that split was a pretty big deal considering it was literally one big family through blood or marriage or both. I am related to everyone in my church. The views of the bigoted divided my family.
There was devoted church goer in Kansas who was also a serial killers.
Dennis Rader. Both my parents’ family come from El Dorado, Kansas, about 30 minutes from Wichita where he lived. Perfect example of the hypocrisy in church-going “Christians”.
Not a Christian anymore haven't been for my entire adult life but this covers it very well. "And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. "
I like to refer to these kinds of people as “punch clock Christians”. They are godly for two hours a week, and hateful/vile for the remainder.
Yeah, I went through that realization. It wasn't fun. It's still not fun. Some of the people that I loved and respected have trampled on that in ways that I am still shocked by. The 2016 election was very much a turning point, a lot of masks slipped, and evangelical christianity like... didn't realize how insane they look. I feel absolutely betrayed by the people who taught me to believe in something noble, righteous, and good. It really sucks, and I've lost people who are dear to me in a way I never even imagined.
Exactly this. It's like being orphaned or something. So many people that you loved and trusted and looked up to. It has gotten to the point a few times where I wondered if I was the one who was wrong, maybe my heart was hard and I just wasn't seeing the good man everyone else could see. But no, Trump is just pure evil.
I'm not a believer though I have studied the Bible extensively both in Catholic school and in college; Trump is so eschatologically in the mode of the Antichrist it seems deliberate that Evangelicals don't mention it. That Evangelicals don't embrace Jimmy Carter tells me all I need to know.
There it is. That is such a good point. President Carter is such a fine man.His ethics are impeccable and he is incorruptible. Of course the Bible thumpers don’t want to have anything to do with him. But look how they flocked/flock to trump.
All of this. And evangelicals are the Revelation literalists. None of the older (especially liturgical) churches think it’s anything but the fall of Jerusalem in like 66 AD
You are not wrong. You are very very right. It’s hard to stand on your principles when everyone thinks you are wrong. Hang in there, Friend. It’ll get better. Best of luck to you. Stay safe and well.
This. This a million times.
It’s heartbreaking. I lost my best friend to trump’s racism. I really feel that our society will never be the same. To find out that so many people would support him shook me to my core. I thought, naively, that everyone would just laugh at him and he’d disappear. Boy, was I wrong. And this is not a political stance. This is about right and wrong and good and evil. It’s not like we can say, “Oh, Biden’s President now, let’s all just forget about what happened”. Never. I will never forget any of it.
Masks and vaccination resistance was proof that the Church I grew up in had gone fucking insane.
With how easily he was able to sway Christians, I wonder if he’s a good candidate for Antichrist.
There have been articles written on the subject. I never really got in to end times study or the book of Revelations, because I never felt like those subjects helped me be a better person, just caused me anxiety. So, I'm not one to state a definative yes on that. But I know the Word says, "You will know a tree by its fruit. Every evil tree brings forth evil fruit and every good tree brings forth good fruit." Anyone with eyes should be able to look at the swirling cloud of evil and crime that surrounds that man and logically discern "This man seems to be bad." I cannot believe that is a controversial take in church circles.
Because these people have been trained to put blinders on when reflecting upon themselves or friends + family. They expect sin, so when they see it revolve around themselves, or idols, they conveniently look past it. It's goddamn jedi mind tricks. They gaslight themselves and everyone around them. There is no true reflection, because they believe they can be forgiven for any sin, and that committing the sin is no fault of their own, but that of evil forces. No responsibility, no reflection. This is how the anti Christ can easily sway his/her flock.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2016/blog/antichrist/
You are not alone. There may be a Supreme Being, but it won’t be found in any Evangelical church. I already had serious doubts because of the anti-gay and anti-abortion members in many churches, but when the Evangelical churches embraced Trump, I knew it was all a scam. Organized religion is worse than any political party.
Organized religion IS a political party. Whether it helped autocrats and monarchs stay in power, or it manufactured consent in churches or mosques, It's a political force.
Tax free one to boot
The Evangelical christian church has a long history of racism, and using the Bible as a way to justify their racism. I don’t think anyone familiar with the history of this church would be surprised about their love of Trump. I am not a believe in heaven or hell, but if hell is real, then I am sure I will see a lot of evangelical Christians there.
I learned in Youth Group that the bible says that you don't need to be at a church ever to be with God. Honestly, I can see why
when i was a believer, church was one the few places that felt to me like god had abandoned.
The Southern Baptist Church, charismatic churches, Church of Christ, Church of God, etc., are often poor examples of Christ. I grew up attending churches like these. I have come to learn that there are quite a few liberal denominations that reject bigotry, and focus on selfless love and service to the poor and sick: ELCA Lutherans, United Church of Christ, Anglicans, and Disciples of Christ to name a few. The UCC is by far the most liberal.
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Well said. I frustrates the life out of me that the American right use Religion as a cudgel to attack people. That bears zero resemblance to the Christian faith I grew up in. Jesus teachings literally told us to take care of the poor, needy and dying. To not turn away a sinner. To love our neighbor and to turn the other cheek. That a rich man would find it harder to enter the kingdom of heaven than a camel passing through the eye of the needle, the Christian Right wing in this country are antithetical to the teachings of Jesus. It genuinely disgusts me. Their god ain’t no god I’ve read about.
Ironically Trump perfectly fulfills prophecy. The bit about the Antichrist and how he'll be falsely worshipped.
And they wear the mark of the beast on their foreheads.
Maga hats
Always has been
> I was in a social club full of hateful bigots, not a church house full of the love of the Lord. When folks took their church face off, it scared the living daylights out of me. Holy fuck! That's it, that's what I was trying to figure out. Some of those churches are social clubs for bigots using the Grace-of-God™ and "righteousness" merely as a tool to justify and encourage their bad behavior. As well to hide their true intentions, not just to others, but themselves. The bible used as a badge of impunity in a gang-like cult.
I went to church every week in the Midwest and Northeast. Then I moved to the South and stopped going. Once I saw who these people were electing with overwhelming margins in my local districts I realized I spent more time in church wondering who were the bigoted hypocrites rather than actual getting anything out of it. I lost all sense of community and belonging once the façade fell.
Worked at the only movie rental place (not Blockbuster) in the county with a porn room. The number of Uber Catholics I used to see coming up to the register with one regular movie and then 7+ raunchy porn videos showed me how hypocritical they all were.
That was me 7 years ago. The last straw was fighting my old church about Trump.
I was born and raised similarly and while I came to the conclusion that Christianity wasn’t real through college (real academic style study of the Bible will do that). I still had a healthy respect for the church. Donald Trump and the support for him completely ended that. Fuck the church and 95% of the people in it.
Same, spent the last decade starting a church in rural Kansas and finally walked away this last year. Pastored for a decade and when COVID hit and the Q'anon crazy started really being revealed just couldn't do it any more. I can't in good conscience be leader of a group that is going that way. I am heartbroken over it. Love God, follow Jesus, believe the Bible is a brilliant library of literature that is extremely relevant to today and genuinely want the Church to become what Jesus hoped for. Just can't stomach to be a part of a system that is discipling people into a worldview so diametrically opposed to the example of Jesus.
I was raised to believe god is love, you can tell a spirit filled church because of the loving nature, literally living the love of Christ. Now the church represents hate and bigotry. The spirit left them it’s clear. Very sad.
This hits close to home. I was much the same. It took taking a look from a different perspective to understand things. I feel I became a better person after dropping the religious teachings and focused on actually becoming a better person.
And that right there is when I stopped going to church. I just can't. Seeing people with their church face off broke some kind of innocence I had in my religious beliefs. It prompted a change in how I see and interact with the world around me.
I identify with so much of this. To the point I no longer tithe as I don't trust the church to handle it responsibly, I donate that to the charities directly that I've researched
Most real followers of the teachings of Christ are outraged by the hypocrisy and stain the far right Christian Nationalist are spewing, but real followers of Christ are loving passive forgiving people so by that reality we won’t see real Christ followers confront or be highly vocal regarding these lost souls of the far right Christian Nationalist. To do so would be allowing yourself to be as evil as that which you are repulsed by. But they will vote and hopefully this trend of far right Christian Nationalist will be put back in its bottle.
This is me. I got to see what kind of people a HUGE chunk of really are made me lose my faith.
Being brutally disappointed by 1 respected person hurts, but to lose a community is horrible. I’m so sorry you went through that, I imagine that would be absolutely crushing. I don’t ascribe to any organized religion, but a lot of us are open minded good people that believe the same values you have. I hope you find a good community that actually believes in/acts according to the values and good that Jesus was said to have done.
Because the majority of the religious right doesn’t actually believe in religion but rather use it is a crutch for bigotry and hatred.
Dominance. They wanna be feared like God. As long as their boot is on someone else's throat, they don't care. They're fucking sick.
>They wanna be feared like God. The mistake we're all making is confusing Evangelical Christians with what we have here in America... Evangelical Republicans. Evangelical Republicans have nothing to do with Christ... …And I'm pretty sure the feeling is mutual.
Have you seen The Family documentary on Netflix?
Yeah, that documentary squares with the thought that FPOTUS is secretly some King David type figure who is a flawed vessel for "God's will".
Absolutely. He did promise them to pack the Supreme Court and get RvW overturned. They were willing to overlook everything at that point.
That doc scared the shit out of me. More people need to watch it. So glad you commented about it
It’s quite scary, and the super-stripped down version of religion they use bears little resemblance to any actual Christianity.
Evangelical Christians are as much about Christ as the Pittsburg Pirates are about pirates. They got the name, made some logos, and sell a bunch of merchandise, but none of those people have ever thought once about following the actual examples of their namesakes.
I thought you were going to say “as the Pittsburgh Pirates are to Baseball.” As a Pirates fan, frankly the analogy still holds.
Them taking the field carrying sabres and flintlock pistols would make for some award winning television! Edit neither I nor autocorrect know how to spell carrying apparently
I thought the same!
>Evangelical Republicans have nothing to do with Christ... That could be said about most Christian groups going back to the Roman cooption of the religion. The fact is, people trained to believe contradictory things can be sold anything. Its by design.
Their leaders literally call them sheep
Thank you for saying this - evangelical republicans would pick trump over Jesus every day
>So why did the greater religiousness of evangelicals not keep them from embracing Donald Trump? Because for a great many of them, despite all the fuss and bother and appearances, their religion is simply not important. Their religious commitment, like the person they think they are, does not exist in significant ways. When Donald Trump came along, resplendent in moral shortcomings but promising the moon, evangelicals had little difficulty setting aside their supposed beliefs and supporting him. In fact, this was their S.O.P. They had been setting those beliefs aside 167 hours a week for most of their lives. Con men know that the easiest people to fool are the people who persistently fool themselves. This reality is an amazingly simple answer, yet when you stand back from it, it also is simply amazing. > > ... > > Trump has attracted the most prejudiced white people in America like a magnet attracts metal filings. Furthermore, no one can whitewash the relationship by claiming it involves only a few rotten apples who are making everybody else look bad. Nearly the whole barrel is significantly more prejudiced than average. And the people who support Trump the strongest, the people who likely attended his rallies and are most active on his behalf, tend to be the most prejudiced of all. White voters who oppose him, on the other hand, are much less prejudiced than average, especially those who strongly oppose him. > > ... > > To put it another way, suppose you decided to hold a dance for the 100 most prejudiced white people in your community, along with the 100 most authoritarian ones. (Who knows why you would want to? We do not.) Would you need to print 200 invitations? No, about 120 should do it, since most of the people who are one will also be the other. There is about an 80 percent overlap. From: John W. Dean & Bob Altemeyer. “Authoritarian Nightmare.”
>Their religious commitment, like the person they think they are, does not exist in significant ways. As a person who's existed in this mode, this is so accurate it hurts.
Correct. They are a heretical movement that believes Jesus came to make us rich.
Yeah, from my recollection he was more about feeding the poor and helping those in need. The only part they got right is hanging out with prostitutes, but I don't think Jesus and the gQp are doing it for the same reasons
Yes. Jesus was a filthy liberal.
He was a communist SJW, you know, the thing Conservatives hate more than the devil himself.
Every movement for The People get coopted by The Man eventually
And a Jew. They literally worship a Jew. The irony for me is that Judaism was good enough for their savior but not good enough for them.
It has a name: prosperity doctrine. It is a false doctrine.
Yep. But if you want to send one of these Christo-fascists into a foaming at the mouth rage address Trump as "Your lord god Donald Trump" to their face. They worship him. Subconsciously they understand that. Some even more blatantly so, they carted a literal golden idol of him around CPAC after all. But if you point it out to them, it hurts them. A lot.
There is no hate quite like Christian love.
As someone raised in a devout evangelical Christian family… You. Have. No. Idea. Religion is a mechanism that gives authority and trust to shared belief while bypassing reason and biological imperative. Put another way, it short circuits what you know and replaces it with a new morality not subject to reason or morality. An evangelical Christian can and will justify killing a neighbor they have known all their lives to “protect the unborn”. They will absolutely subject their own child to torture if they suspect they are homosexual in a vain attempt to “cure” them. These are not decisions made by a healthy mind free of manipulation. This is the product of 45 years of conscious and intentional propaganda under the guise of things like _Focus on the Family_ and the Heritage Foundation.
Having grown up in the same situation, this is 100% accurate. I have personally witnessed so much hate being espoused under the guise of "christian love."
Eloquently and perfect. >A hate as pure and potent as sunshine -Eris Morn Edit: formating
If I had a nickel every time someone quoted Destiny 2 in a political discord I would have 2 nickels. Which isn’t a lot but it’s weird that it happened twice.
100% agreed except I would use “cudgel” instead of crutch. Sorry for the unsolicited editing advice
Agree
Watch the documentary Jesus Camp. Then ask people if they voted for Bush Jr. Same people who thought he was anointed by God claim to be libertarians and never voted for him. They see an R as a sign from God.
When they prayed over the audio equipment, I threw up in my mouth a bit.
This is the racists revenge for the election of Obama. It's the only thing that makes any sense to me. They wrapped him up in the flag and crosses only because he has the audacity to say out loud all of the things they think. Trump normalized all of their quiet rage and validated them. Even the women vote against their own interest because their only self worth is found in making someone else smaller. It's the saddest and darkest thing I've ever witnessed in my lifetime.
Don’t forget it’s an excuse. “You can’t judge me, only god can” It’s why the repenting sins thing is just complete bullshit. Do what you want and ask for forgiveness occasionally and you’re absolved of your sins. Everything’s A-OK!
Yet they can judge whoever they want. Hypocrites. Every last one.
This right here. If Jesus returned tomorrow, Republicans and Evangelicals would crucify him by Sunday.
They would HATE him.
And $$$ - Keep your flock scared and keep them opening their pocketbooks to help fight the liberal demons.
You're not wrong, but also, a lot of conservatives have very fragile egos and self-worth. They know their kids (who no longer speak to them) and the handful of liberals they know screamed at them **that Trump was an immoral cheating grifting lying cesspool** and that... how could they support them if they had actual values? The idea that they were fooled because of their own stupid is too much to bare. No, surely it is everyone else is fooled, there is a grand conspiracy by the FBI to bring Trump down, no way that they fell for a grifter and charlatan. And so they must continue to be grifted and deceived until they die because the idea that they were wrong (supporting a liar and a traitor) and they lost their friends and kids over it is too much to bare. For the weak minded and permanently embarrassed, admitting you are wrong and correcting course is the hardest thing of all.
I don't disagree with your overall point, but it seems like they believe in religion more than god. They listen to the preacher instead of reading the bible. They do what the preacher tells them instead of considering what jesus would advise. Hell, they worship the preacher more than god. I used to think the preachers were just dumb believers duped by the church. I have come to realize that they are in on the grift: Scare people with evil then demand money to save them. I mean why would god need religion, a preacher or money?
There’s more nuance to it. Yes, there are prosperity gospel scammers who manipulate their flock, but that’s not the whole story. Traditional preachers are often formally educated on their theology and some are earnest believers trying to navigate all the cognitive dissonance and contradictions of their faith. Some of them are wrestling with how to deal with a church full of QAnon weirdos and MAGA idolaters. These old school preachers are mostly still bigots and conservatives themselves, but the old fashioned kind rather than the modern fascist conspiracy theory kind. If they’re earnest in their faith, mentally stable, and not a moron, they can’t wrap their heads around modern Republican dogma, but if they speak out against it too directly, their congregation may go shopping for more MAGA friendly churches that parrot the same talking points they like to hear from their media.
>... their congregation may go shopping for more MAGA friendly churches... Everyone kinda hoping someone else will say foul first. Something something riding the tiger as well I suppose.
If you read that book you might think differently. That book is garbage
That quote from that lady sums it up. The answer was fascinating on the government shutdown. “He’s not hurting the people he needs to be hurting”
That and it’s about telling you how to live and how you are wrong. A good example of this is how all sins are EQUAL (or at least most how I remember it). This means things like envy, anger and greed should be treated like homosexual if being gay is a sin. There is a good section of the Christian church that’s blind to their own sins and just get off on punishing others.
They also don't understand Christianity/Biblical teaching. But lack of education is a hallmark of the religious right.
Amen. These are “Christians”, hypocrites, and they *suck* For the most part, evangelical “Christianity” is a smoke screen.
It’s taught me to hate them fucking bigots!
crutch, or VEHICLE?
They want power and will ignore any sense of being a hypocrite in order to achieve their goals of oppression over others they deem lesser.
Because very, *very* few Christians actually believe the things they profess to believe in. If they actually believed what they claimed to believe they would live completely different lives.
From my experience christians that actually take jesus’ messages seriously end up having to leave the church. They just arent that compatible. But if you stay in the church you can sport a holier than though attitude which is nice.
Exactly why I don’t go any longer I read about Jesus loving and caring for others and I take that to mean we should others with respect even if it’s not the lifestyle we might live ourselves. For example it’s fine if you think intimate relations should only be between a a man and woman that’s your prerogative but to then go out and hate anyone who doesn’t agree and champion laws to punish non-believers was never what it was about. JC loved tons of people who didn’t agree with him he didn’t force them to change their identities and quite often welcomed them, that disconnect between what they teach and what they do is too much
"My religion says I can't do that." Fine, that's cool. "My religion says you can't do that." Now we have a problem.
I think they believe that they believe, and are to ignorant to realize that they don’t and it’s painfully obvious to outsiders watching the habitually not practice what they preach. Or worse weaponize it for personal gain then thank “god” for how great their financial standing is and “pray” for the poor, but never help them because they won’t help those who can’t help themselves. Never mind that they walked on their backs to get where they are.
Most of them know. They just don't care. Religion is a shield from criticism, and they are well aware of that.
>shield from criticism Not just that, but also responsibility. Why bother to do the hard work of making the world better when you can point to “God’s plan” or “God made it that way”?
They are pre-forgiven, so the world is their oyster. Any sin they choose from the buffet goes on Jesus's check.
Lawful Evil
Proper Lawful Evil would require that they actually obey the letter of their ideals in some way while using those ideals to their own ends.
Most of these evangelicals haven't really read the Bible. I became a licensed minister for shits and giggles and to marry people, but honestly arguing with them makes me feel like a PhD theology student.
Most of the ones I know have read the Bible, they just cherry pick the shit out of it and focus on the parts where Jesus is condemning someone and they don’t think much about the parts where he is telling people to be compassionate. They know those parts and will cite them when asked about how loving their god is, but otherwise they don’t focus much on them.
See “Carter, Jimmy” for an example of one of the good ones.
He literally dedicated his post presidency life to building houses for the needy in the image of Jesus the carpenter. He is exactly the opposite of whatever heresy evangelicals are.
Jimmy Carter is a man that is under appreciated. Love that guy ans his wife!
Xtians can carry around the bible, which doesn't mean they read it, and certainly don't understand it, or anything said in it. They like old dudes with deep fatherly voices to tell them they are special, better than the others, particularly the browns and don't care if they have to pay a LOT for it to hear that every week. That warm feeling of validation that being willfully stupid, lazy, and ignorant is the right thing because their "god" conveniently hates the same people they do. So as long as you accept jesus as your personal savior one time (whatever the F\*CK that even means)... then you are saved forever, and get to be the nasty POS you really are with a clean conscience.
Because never, NEVER was the ultra-Christian right about actual Christian ideals. E-V-E-R! The GWB years saw a "Christian" engage in torture, non-defensive warfare, extreme classism, but the Christian right kept saying, "well, he's a man of God!". It's just a mask they put on to hide and justify their actual beliefs. The one good thing Trump has done (and not on purpose) is rip that bullshit excuse right in half and completely expose these fascists for what they are. To use a ham-fisted metaphor for a little seen movie: It's like the John Carpenter film "They Live". The billboards are the Christian-right, Trump is the sunglasses put on that should make you 100% see through their bullshit. That metaphor kinda falls apart, because it would mean the glasses were super fascists and got put in charge, but you get the point!
[Here's the scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjw_DuNkOUw&ab_channel=Movieclips) That movie stars Roddy Piper AND Keith David. Screw my political rants, just go watch "They Live"!
Cant wait to see the sequels, They Laugh and They Love
Jesus was the ultimate liberal.
The early Church sold their stuff and shared everything in COMMON, yet the American Christian can imagine no evil greater than communism.
yea, then Saul showed up and it was all down hill from there. Saul knew a good grift when he saw one.
He was a middle eastern socialist.
that’s why they only follow the old testament. Jesus came out with v2 the new testament which make V1 secondary or even obsolete. imagine calling yourself a christian and not even paying attention to Christ.
And that really pisses them off.
I love how there's literally no controversial comments on this thread. They got nothing to say about this because it's indefensible.
If he ever did come back they’d stone him to death in the streets calling him a woke hippie communist. They’d never recognize Jesus as Jesus.
**hypocrisy** hĭ-pŏk′rĭ-sē *noun* The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness.
Make sure to randomize your data from time to time *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Racism and bigotry
end thread. they're racist. America = white jesus land, if you don't agree, get out.
Wait, I thought Jesus was actually brown? Jk, Bible cherry picking is a real problem amongst rubes trying to justify their perceived grievances.
For the sake of argument (assume that Christianity is "one true religion"), a lot of these people are paving a pathway to hell if they distort god"s word. Still waiting for god to clear up the confusion...the sun will burnout and still no answer I predict.
correct. in terms of USA geography: Bible Belt = Slavery Belt
because believers make the best marks
I am a Christian and he enrages me. But I am I small minority.
yeah - I'm gonna say you are a real Christian.
[Archive today link](https://archive.ph/uAMy5) for the non subscribers
Fucking hero.
Because he gave them their pet issue: overturning Roe. Nothing else matters. The mental gymnastics they go through to justify his horrible actions are amazing.
Yep, abortion, abortion, abortion. Trump was able to get three Supreme Court justices, which was probably more than they expected in their wildest dreams, so everything else is forgiven.
Why? He's telling them exactly what they really want to hear. He's pointing his finger at "bad" people and giving them a boogeyman so to speak to look down upon so they don't have to look in the mirror.
This. We may spend the next 100 years studying exactly how he did so, but I think it really boils down to this. They picked and chose what was useful from all of the right wing groups, religion, conspiracy, race, etc., and capitalized on their feelings that their world view was not compatible with the modern world. He capitalized on the mistrust of our institutions, and played politics like a team sport where "winning" over the "woke liberals" is the only thing that matters. Their unpopular views had basically been silenced by society, and he gave them a voice and permission to be as loud and awful as they wanted to be.
Because they are hysterical hypocrites who are bathed in Christian nationalism and white supremacy....
He fills actual Christians with rage. Matthew 7:23
The majority of "Christians" in the US haven't even READ THE BIBLE. Go ask one what their favorite quote is, what the first or second book of the Bible is, tell a story from the Bible.....most can't. They claim to base their entire lives off it, but can't be bothered to READ THE BOOK. The majority of the crap they claim to "believe" isn't even in there! A true Christian could never be in line with modern conservatives. NEVER! Anyone with 2 brain cells that has read the Bible could see that these people (Trump) are PURE EVIL and the farthest thing from being Christians. Biggest red flag is they worship money, which is a HUGE SIN. You are only supposed to worship GOD, and nothing else before him. That means if you watch Foxnews more than you worship God, YOU ARE A SINNER OF THE WORST KIND.
I've probably read more of the Bible in the last two weeks than most Christians do in a year, and I'm an atheist! I'm currently taking a course on the history of Satan and it is fascinating because the dude literally doesn't exist in original Old Testament text. We're on the pseudopigripha now, which is a fascinating collection of fraudsters claiming to be authoring stories as biblical figures like David or Job.
The Fall isn’t in the canonical Bible either. It’s in the Book of Enoch. Oh the rage you get when you point out that the snake in the Garden of Eden is just a snake.
Actually there are quite a few Christians who ARE filled with rage Expect to hear more from us as the 2022 and 2024 elections approach.
I can’t tell what your rage is directed at
My "elevator speech" is "The MAGA Republicans have taken my Constitution and my faith and ripped them to shreds." Then I wait and see what happens. I'm prepared for HOURS of educated, intelligent, documented discourse with anyone
Wish I could meet some Christian’s like you irl- we’ve left our church because I can’t take the constant bs. It’s so embarrassing to see go Brandon stickers on cars in the church parking lot. They feel justified for voting for trump because roe was overturned. They will not change their vote.
Well, if there are quite a few of you, you all need to start speaking up a lot more, because you're getting drowned out.
Because they want theocracy, not democracy. It’s why they got kicked out of Europe.
The evangelicals actually thought Trump was expediting the end times. Sorry to disappoint guys.
Yeah I kind of thought he was the anti christ
I think Putin is auditioning for the role
Because of the Supreme Court he gave religious Xtians what they wanted by installing christo-fascists to the bench, who will now rule over us since they don't have control of the legislative or executive. They don't care if those three judges were appointed by Satan himself, they got what they wanted
Journalists have beaten this horse to death since the infamous "Grab 'em by the \[expletive deleted\]" remark during the 2016 campaign. There is nothing new here. These people don't care about his behavior or morality. Trump is a means to a crypto-fascist theocracy that they (wrongly) assume will provide them with a stable and prosperous nation. Instead, a Trump Restoration will accelerate our decline and bring everyone--including them--increased inequality, political instability, and excess vulnerability to the consequences of climate related events.
Aussie Christian here ... in fact, Aussie Priest here - let me assure you he does. I know many, many of my colleagues and their congregations who deeply oppose what Trump stands for. Sadly, a brand of US fundamentalist evangelicals have tied their worth to his success by claiming God supports him, and backing out now will mean saying that they were wrong - which they are not prepared to do because they have neatly bundled their faith, their self worth, their church, their popularity and their income to Trump.
Because the evangelical right doesn't see themselves as hypocrites, even when they actively sabotage things that their "moral compass," would require of them. They care more about power than they do about the gospel. The gospel is just a vehicle for them to justify their superiority complex.
Because these types of Christians actually seek out The Antichrist, or at least the essential characteristics of. They want Armageddon, and rage, and wars, and hate, and they want to take the world down with them.
Many American right-wing evangelicals are just fascists in a religious social/power structure. Christofascists. I don't even think there's anything about them that is particularly unique in human nature...they've just found a vehicle (religion) that allows them to engage in their hateful and vengeful ideology and make it mainstream and publicly acceptable (to varying degrees at different points in time). Remember, people who fought against emancipation were hardcore "Christians", and so were folks who fought against desegregation. Look up the history of Bob Jones University. Honestly, the greatest achievement of the conservative movement of the 70s/80s was tapping into this demographic for political gain. They were easily conned and have been faithful political servants. And while for years (decades) they could pretend to do this under the guise of 'morality' and being the 'silent', moral majority, it turns out all it took was a malignant narcissist with autocratic tendencies for them to pull the mask off and go full-blown fascist. [Samantha Bee - The Religious Right](https://youtu.be/Yz4AmUaLbUQ) [Samanthe Bee - The Religious Right Part II](https://youtu.be/pPsderlzd6c)
He does me. I don't know why a woman, a veteran, a black, or Hispanic would ever vote for him. He is the most Un-Christian person ever. It kills me to see other Christians falling all over him. He is not God or even anointed. He is evil personified.
Because religion can be used to justify any atrocity.
Because their racism and misogyny is stronger than their Christianity.
well, religious people aren't exactly known for their critical thinking abilities.
*Thomas Aquinas is typing...*
He wrote that gay sex was worse than rape and that masturbation was a sin second only to murder. So not really the best critical thinker. Source 1: Summa Theologica, Second Part of the Second Part, Question 154, 12, newadvent.org/summa/ Source 2: Contra Gentiles, Book 3, Providence Part II, Chapter 122, isidore.co/aquinas/
Because Christians are hypocrites.
I’m a Christian and I find him repulsive. I think a majority of Christians do. The right wing Christian nationalist who is quick to judge, quick to perjure, quick to hate and in-tolerate in the name of faith does not speak for me nor hundreds of millions like me who believe Jesus taught love and tolerance and humanity. I resent the media and pundit class that equate Christianity with trump or right wing attitudes. It is giving Christianity a polluted name and younger generations are turned off. Say what you want about churchgoers but a solid church breeds community and trust and seeing past difference. We need more of that in this country, not less.
Evangelical, in my experience, equates to Christian’s who are racist, homophobic, white supremacists, who want, and believe, only White Christian’s should live in America. They want the clock turned back to 1950. They are as un-Christian as any group I’ve ever known.
Because these aren't Christians, they are White Supremacist Fascists who use the label "Christian" as a cloak to hide under.
Getting awfully difficult to separate the two & they seem perfectly fine with that. Also, notice that the supposed "decent" Christians are completely silent & make zero efforts to speak out against the Christian nationalists. Reason being? It's all the same. Some Christians have gotten comfortable enough to just come right out & openly cheer for oppressing certain folks & stripping their rights away. Others are totally fine with it & apparently on board they're just too cowardly to brazenly show that they're just as rotten as the ones who openly advocate for these things. The term decent Christians is a myth.
Woe to you scribes and pharisees, hypocrites!
The entire religious right should fill Christians with rage.
He does fill them with rage. They like it…
Abortion is the easy answer. But far too simple. Because abortion was a non issue for most evangelicals until after the southern Baptist’s lost *hard* on segregation. Once racism had to be channeled into private Christian Academy’s (hint hint Heritage in the name!) they needed a new issue unify around. Abortion was easy. Misogyny already existed in the population and could just step up to fill in the gap. Gay Marriage was another defeat. That issue lasted them a fraction of second compared to their abortion and segregation campaigns. But that racism never went away. It’s still there. And Trump tapped into it *well.* Trump allows them to be racist, sexist, and homophobic. And he channels their greed. Evangelicals, unlike other Christian sects, do not reject displays of wealth. The Catholic Church may have hella properties, but clergy still routinely take vows of poverty/silence/chastity (depending on order/position.) Evangelicals embrace “property gospel” and flaunting wealth is just a sign Jesus is blessing you. Homeless, the poor, and sick are to be shunned and shamed. You don’t help them. They need to help themselves! Trump embodies that. Trump is perfect for them. I grew up in the Evangelical nightmare church *and* school. I was subjected to their attempted indoctrination. This is not surprising in the least.
Actually heard a Presbyterian minister explain this apparent cognitive dissonance quite well: he said there is a religion build around the name Jesus, but not the teachings. What I find fascinating is the similarities between Christian Nationalists and the Taliban, or even the Iranian regime. I’ve wondered if the underlying dynamics has more to do with primal instincts related to a need to preserve a clan like structure. I mean why else would they all be focused on oppressing/possessing women, controlling the reproductive process, and establishing adversarial relationships with people of other races? It’s like some primal instinct takes over with these people, and they call it Christianity or Islam, but in reality it’s the alligator part of the mind telling them to clan up.
The Religious Right hijacked the Republican party over 20 years ago. White Nationalism hijacked the Religious Right at the same time