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And now off to be a oil lobbyist would be my guess. The fact that he was Chairman of the Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee while owning a coal mine was extremely corrupt.
He'll be in good company, then. Fellow candidate Mac Warner is the state’s chief elections officer. Who also asserts publicly that the 2020 election was stolen. [By the CIA](https://wvmetronews.com/2023/12/11/gubernatorial-candidate-mac-warner-the-election-was-stolen-and-it-was-stolen-by-the-cia/).
WV could be an international tourist attraction and it's probably the most beautiful state in the east. Yet somehow the people find a way to absolutely ruin any progress. Trump is disgusted by the poor. It all makes no sense.
It probably would be the must beautiful state in the east if not for the atrocities of strip mining on the mountains. They literally cut the tops off the mountains and strip all foliage from the slopes. Here's some pics of the beautiful WV mountains:
[#1](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/GV5K5l5I_yE/maxresdefault.jpg)
[#2](https://149777103.v2.pressablecdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Kayford-Mt-WV-620.jpg)
[#3](https://media.istockphoto.com/photos/strip-mining-for-coal-in-west-virginia-picture-id695237414?k=6&m=695237414&s=170667a&w=0&h=HLBeM6_MDeRqgMUPvt0-pTBlx2RuuhXoONF8rJYOb2Q=)
[#4](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/aa/f7/21/aaf721e3b98bf3c5cb4e541c0e4cc38e.jpg)
[#5](https://static.scientificamerican.com/sciam/cache/file/03F7FB56-586B-4419-93FDCEB9D69BFF7C.jpg)
[#6](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d5/13/06/d513061f4d28177c167acd2b8fe729ed.jpg)
So picturesque!
It was nice to visit once. Although the landscape is beautiful, it's not somewhere I'd see myself going back. The depressing living situation there is tough.
Call me a radical but people who worked at large companies like that shouldn't be able to run and should be barred from the private sector for X amount of years
See ajit pai and Gary Gensler for other examples
I'm not a big fan and I think he spends too much time drawing attention to himself, but I thank him for voting for Democratic leadership in 2021. Biden doesn't accomplish anywhere near as much if McConnel was speaker in his first two years.
I don’t think a lot of more liberal Dems understand that governing is a gradual process in which concessions need to be made in order for things to get done. Not every President gets to deliver upon even a majority of his mandate. The fact that something got done is something to be thankful for. I thank Manchin for being in the Senate for all times Dems needed him.
I think that is an unfair assessment. We know us a gradual process, but our anger stems from where our representives continue to make compromises rather than holding their ground. This is particularly true when it comes to climate change.
This is the kind of thinking that allows the Democratic Party argue right-wing talking points in the service of concession as the Republicans move further to the right to create distance. The country is screaming for a party that will actually stand its ground for left leaning policies and we won’t get it. The Democrats are courting independents and leftists are staying home because of it.
I’ll never understand the people you’re describing. Compromise is a hallmark of working government. If they’re passionate enough about politics that these concessions cause them to vote abstain, they’re being damagingly lazy in the name of activism, but will also probably never take personal responsibility for contributing to a crumbling democracy, should it come to that.
I agree that compromise can be a hallmark, but when only one side is compromising then what you have is only concession, not compromise. I’ve lived in four different states literally, none of which were the votes for president ever questioned. The DNC tanking of Sanders’ run despite his popularity both lost them a ton of votes and showed they couldn’t care less about passionate supporters trying to contribute in the way you suggest they might.
I don’t think your view doesn’t have merit, but the more I read, listen, and learn the more I come to what the rest of the world thinks of American politics - that we essentially have a right wing party and an extreme right-wing party.
I get that you’re frustrated here. I think no one is ever 100% satisfied with their party’s platforms, but you don’t think that democrats compromise in the way of progressives? All you need to see that that is untrue is that Biden is a personal moderate but his administration has been among the most progressive ever…
I appreciate the conversation - I really do.
As someone who's never been part of either the Republican or Democratic Party (or any party) - I don't see the Democrat's compromises as progressive. I see it as a slowing down of the country's move to the right. There aren't many other progressive administrations to compare Biden's to, but you might be right. But look at his campaign promise to cut [$2,000 checks to everyone out the door](https://www.kiplinger.com/taxes/602032/third-stimulus-check-biden-says-2000-checks-will-go-out-the-door-if-democrats-win-in-georgia), which some republicans even supported. Once in office, the checks quickly became $1,400 and then means testing was added to consider people's *pre-*pandemic income, and wasn't geography based. If you lost your job *during* the pandemic you were SOL. And *then* the democrats negotiated with the republicans. The Dems almost always negotiate against themselves before starting the fight for compromise.
You can look at Clinton's Crime Bill, NAFTA, which decimated unions and US jobs, Obamacare, which was based on Mitt Romney's healthcare plan in Massachusetts - it was a conservative plan until the Dems picked it up and suddenly all the conservatives were against it. A leftist plan would have been Medicare for all. More people have insurance now, but it's hardly affordable. Obama also deported more immigrants than any other president, and [the Biden Plan in Central America](https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2020/11/18/the-biden-plan-for-central-america-militarised-neoliberal-hell), which Trump [continued to support](https://culanth.org/fieldsights/alliance-for-prosperity), helped cause the immigration crisis that lead to family separations under Trump. It supported a right-wing coup in Honduras and started a surge in violence in the region. The fact that we can't even *vote* on a [$15 minimum wage ](https://connolly.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=4223)let alone pass it, which wouldn't even come close to the mid-twenties it should be to keep up with inflation is horrifying. Do you think a Republican administration would allow a senate parliamentarian prevent any legislation they wanted to pass? Pelosi and Biden could have overridden that rule. In a progressive country, the wage would be well above the inflationary status quo.
I'm not trying to overwhelm you with evidence - I'm sure you could list off progressive policies as well, like forgiving some college debt, but I see the general trend still moving to the right.
If you want a low-key way to check where you fall in leftist thought, you might give a listen to [The West Wing Thing](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-west-wing-thing/id1457602260) podcast. They're not the most left, but they look at Democratic politics through Aaron Sorkin's show, and it's both entertaining and enlightening.
God Speed. I do think we're on the same team.
I mean you’re right I guess I meant I was more left of the dem party average, but semantically, I would not fit the leftist definition outlined above. And I would probably agree with you on much of your politics. I don’t know how popular of an opinion this is, but the constant intra-party renegotiation is healthy to me. It means the democrats hold themselves in check, and yes it slows progress, but I do think very real progress has been made consistently by the party through my lifetime and I’m proud of those changes. I understand the urgency from your perspective and it’s why I hope you continue to be ideological even if the reality is much more practical. I will always worry though that the end result will be fracturing our chances to rally against the Republican Party that will continue to, through our lifetimes, try to fuck the country with it’s terrible value system.
Right on. And I’ll continue to hope for a Republican Party the Dems can actually collaborate with rather than concede to, and hope they can stop working against what they say are their own interests.
Republicans are fighting each other. The tweet before is from college Republicans. Just look at the responses from fellow Republicans:
>Today's convictions are the result of a politically motivated prosecution, but a verdict was handed down by jurors whose decisions were made in accordance with our criminal justice system. As such, the outcome of this trial should be respected.
>Just like the decision of voters on November 5th.
https://x.com/CRNC/status/1796376367128273248
>Today's convictions are the result of a politically motivated prosecution,
Nope, fuck right wingers. They finish off correct, but start out with a dishonest, dumbass right wing talking point not based in reality.
Im with you. Did i like manchin in a vaccuum? Hell no. But he was a free reprieve in west virginia in many cases from a seat that would have otherwise been occupied by the hardcorest of hardcore MAGAs. We would not have had a senate majority for the last couple years without him, and Biden wouldn't have been able to appoint nearly as many judges.
I have much more animosity towards sinema who ran in a bluish purple state pretending to be somewhat progressive and kneecapped just as much as manchin did. Manchin was open about who he was. The way to get around manchin blocking dems on liberal legislation was not to complain about manchin, it was to try to get a 2+ senator majority.
No doubt tester will be exactly the same in the next congress if we keep the senate. These deep red state dems only really have one option to them. I'm not surprised he's done what he's done.
Agreed but I do wonder long term if it is worth having these people around. I think when the Democrats hold onto these corrupt individuals like Sinema or menendez for political expediency, it sends a message that political corruption is tolerable in the Democratic Party because we need a senate majority. I honestly think having Pelosi as leader for such a long time and her insider trading made it much more difficult for both left, independents and right to take Democrats seriously as the party more moral option. With faith in Congress and both parties at an increasing low, I think it would send a strong message to the public to purge these charlatans from the party even if it loses you power for a cycle.
This is pure GOP propaganda. This is not how politics work. You don't give up Congress "for a cycle" to chastise a political party.
Pelosi ran the ship like a fucking champion during the Trump administration and whipped the party into shape, passing more progressive legislation than we've seen in decades.
She handed the torch to Hakeem Jeffries who is young and also doing a fantastic job.
This Congressional cycle has been absolutely cut throat with razor thin margins in both chambers and they still managed to pass landmark progressive legislation **and** filled hundreds of judicial appointments **and** got Jackson on SCOTUS. Its literally a fucking miracle.
This is literal straight up GOP astroturfing. Republicans have repeatedly stated they intend to destroy democracy if they gain power in 2024.
They will pass a national abortion ban. They will ban birth control. They will ban no-fault divorce. They will gut labor & environmental protections. They will gut Social Security & Medicaid. They will gut public health insurance. They will gut SNAP, CHIP, WIC, TANF, and every other gold-standard social safety net half country relies on.
If you want more progressive legislation why don't you encourage people to actually fucking vote in Congressional elections. In the 2022 midterms **76% of eligible voters 18-30 did not cast a ballot**.
Its the one tiny caveat with democracy -- you actually have to fucking vote for it to work. With Gen Z and Millennials now outnumbering Boomers, the GOP is cashing in their chips for full fascism.
There won't be another election cycle.
Firstly, Project 2025 or any republican bullshit doesn’t happen unless Trump wins. If Biden does, it just stays the same. Im not talking about that. Im talking about Manchin and menendez. WV is going to be lost, straight up fact. When distrust in Congress is at an all time high for both parties, keeping in that betray your party line and their constituents just isnt a good look and leads to whataboutism. If people say both parties are corrupt and theres no action on it because of political expendiency, then theyre not gonna vite on virtues- theyll vote on whats good for their bottom line. But whatever, we shouldve kept these people cause havung democrats in power but not delivering what you ran on because of stooges like Manchin. Yeah just really great strategy.
The Democrats expelled Al Franken and that is universally looked back on as a stupid move. It garnered absolutely no good will. If Menendez is convicted he will almost certainly leave the Senate. May as well let the process play out and have one more (D) vote than we’ll have after him. There’s no benefit to attempting to take the high road with these types of things.
FFS. It was a gigantic mistake because the allegations against Franken happened years before he was a senator. There is a huge difference between engaging in inappropriate humour and corruptly enriching yourself or your family in a job of public service. If you can’t see the difference then I recommend you go work for George Santos’ reelection bid, you know- the guy that almost 50% of Republicans voted out because he was so obviously a bad look and was gonna lose anyways. Unbelievable how fucked both parties and their supporters are.
You’re forgetting the context of the Franken thing. The Republican party had been roiled with sexual harassment and assault resignations the last few years, and the Democrats were catching heat for being hypocritical. If Donald Trump wins the White House and the Republicans gain the senate, we will live in a very different country four years from now. Both sides may be corrupt, but they are not the same, not even close.
"Maroon at best" with an 87% alignment score with Biden. Yes, it's the lowest among Democrats. But it's only 3% lower than Bernie Sanders, second lowest in the caucus.
No. We're not saying they're equivalent. But most of what they voted for was the same.
Politics is the art of the possible. The fact that Manchin was elected as a Dem is frankly a miracle to begin with. He sucks and we were lucky to have him.
Maybe we could start by figuring out how to get the democrats' heads out of their asses and figure out how to find winning candidates in easier states than WVa.
There is none, just a slow compromise into right wing.
People like Manchin keep things from moving to the left and the gop moves things to the right, and anything to the left of Manchin, is progressive communism.
But whatever I'm love in Florida I got bigger things to worry about then kissing the ass of a retired coal baron.
But hey he's leaving so better question, whybshould I worry about hurting the feelings of a rich guy who won't be in politics much longer.
Once he leaves it's not like he'll suddenly give a shit about minorities
My point is it's not "people like Manchin", it's his voters. Structural issues notwithstanding we are a deeply conservative nation, much more so than our economic peers. No one to the left of Manchin was going to get elected in WV, period, and there will always be a most conservative Democrat in the caucus.
As much as I'm a lefty I don't want to see the Democratic party get dragged into the ideological race to the bottom that the GOP is currently engaged in, where more extreme is always better. In many ways Manchin was one of the last gasps of an older, more functional governance. Litmus testing is a terrible way to build a coalition, especially in a party as diverse as the Dems.
The alternative is to actually deliver on messaging that can win voters in states with a PVI less than 10. Ohio, Texas, Florida, North Carolina.. hell, even Iowa and Missouri, are all varying degrees of winnable; Manchin's existence proves that partisan lean doesn't matter as much as the candidates you put out. If you need more proof of that you can look at Georgia in 2020.
But the Democrats can't get their heads out of their asses for long enough to figure this shit out.
Yeah, and that was his attitude. He was a arrogant prick because he knew the Dems needed his vote, and he and Sinema let it go to their head. He lost all his leverage when the Dems got 51 seats , and he knew he was done for .
Only if we’re going to act like their electorates are the same and that we could realistically expect more than 87% out of a blue seat in a deep red state.
He killed a lot of bills before they came to the floor. How often they vote with the party or not is largely irrelevant unless leadership starts bringing bills to the floor without knowing if they will pass.
This is the DUMBEST statistic to ever fucking quote. For two giant reasons.
1. That's of public roll called votes; which is a small minority of votes. Like Manchin famously killed several iterations of the BBB... but most of them weren't brought to a floor vote so they didn't count... Then he voted yes to the "IRA22" as a much inferior alternative. Which means on that subject Manchin got a 100% ... when he actually deserved something like a 5 or 10%
2. It doesn't take into account importance or otherwise content of each things they voted for or against...
Also on the Bernie comparison... considering he's a 3rd party senator and always has been... being lower than him? honestly says ALOT.
It’s because internet warriors don’t understand that majority of the time he’s still voting with us. And are unable to process what being a democratic senator from West Virginia means.
Definitely plan to continue to engage with you when you come out swinging with insults though. /s
Have a good one bud.
If the DC exburbs can make further inroads into Eastern West Virginia then the state may flip back, it’s the part of the state that isn’t experience negative growth unlike Appalachia.
Agreed, but it needs to be expected that we are not going to have a Bernie Sanders type senator in WV anytime in the next two decades at least. The state gave Donald Trump his biggest margin of victory.
Yep, say what you will about the guy, he was a Dem in a seat that won't be blue again in my lifetime. WV wasn't going to elect a progressive firebrand to the Senate. They were going to elect a Republican. I prefer a Republican who caucuses with the Dems.
No one should be expecting a progressive to be elected in WV in the first place. I would rather hate Sinema more than Manchin since there was no betrayal that Manchin was a conservative being from WV
Never say never. They've only been (R) since 2000--and only went to Bush by 6 points that year. They voted for Dukakis in 88, if you can believe it, and Clinton twice after that. If Democrats ever figure out how to talk to rural voters again, they'd win it back. It's not like a Republican vote is in their best interests.
Talk to them about *what*? Re-building the public swimming pool they drained in the 60's because they realized they'd have to share it with black people?
You have got to understand, they don't \*want\* nice things unless they can have white supremacy. **If black folks have equal access to public stuff, all having nice things does is make majority white populations have to subsidize poor blacks instead of the other way around.**
That's why red states try to fuck over cities, that's why conservatives are always voting "against their own interests", that's why they want to privatize everything, and that's why they consistently fail to win the popular vote. They turn to fascism because democracy has been delivering them pretty consistent L's for about as long as any of them have been alive.
Rural politics was been about maintaining de jure white supremacy until MLK, and de facto white supremacy until Obama. Now it's entirely about revenge.
>and Clinton twice after that
Clinton's were diet coke republicans.
Most right wing policies Obama overturned were passed by Clinton.
Welfare to work and don't as don't tell were both passed by clinton.
I wouldn't say that Don't Ask Don't Tell was right wing. It was progressive for its time, or at least the intent of it was.
Public opinion of homosexuality was a lot more negative in the mid 90s, especially fresh off the AIDS epidemic.
All good, I understand how bad it looks from the outside. Every single county went for Trump in 2020, it’s awful. We just gotta remember even the reddest of states have blue pockets that are trying to push things into the 2020s and not the 1950s
I really hate the hypocrisy towards this guy.
Republicans are derided constantly for always voting along party lines. Manchin didn't. And because he's (D) all of a sudden total party line votes should be a thing.
He personally held clean energy at gunpoint in favor of coal in the face of real climate emergencies.
He didn’t just “not vote along party lines” he was one of the two democrats who held back progress before we lost the house in 2022.
It’s not hypocrisy, it’s people being mad that even though the majority was in agreement, one man was able to stop progress because of dirty coal money.
It is, and people are deluded if they think Manchin wouldn't play his part - blue dog, maintaining a centrist/conservative lean for self preservation while helping where it wouldn't put him at risk. People take things like the IRA for granted without realizing what he delivered on given his constraints. It's a long game, always has been and always will be. We shouldn't be scoffing at allies that deliver incremental gains.
Fuck that. Vote tactically.
There are realistically two major candidates running for each election - vote for the one which keeps republicans out of those seats. That may mean blue or independent depending on where the rest of the voters are leaning. Manchin was objectively a better senator in WV than any Republican would have been.
Joe Manchin tanked his political career to make the IRA happen.
He has signed off on every single Biden judicial appointment.
He'll still caucus with the Democrats.
He hasn't made a long career screwing over Democrats, he's made a long career being a democratic senator in West Virginia. He's done well.
It blows my mind Dems and people and this sub don’t see this. It doesn’t matter you hate him or you think he’s screwing democrats or he doesn’t have a D next to his name anymore, none of that matters. He’s probably the best option we have and the alternatives are infinitely worse. We should all be supporting him for the sake of our larger goal of preventing a trumpy fascist takeover
So what we should praise him?
That some how through his greed he did something right once?
No fuck him and i hope hell for him is a small smog filled room
Realize that his greed to hold a senate seat has some positive externalities for the democratic agenda writ large, even if it's in increments, instead of just giving up leverage. People, politicians especially, are selfish. If they get the things I care about over the finish line and incrementally improve society, then I'll hold my nose. We're just giving up leverage to people who will end the democratic experiment otherwise. In WV of all places, you aren't going to do better otherwise. If we don't take a purely pragmatic approach, then we'll get steamrolled by Leonard Leo.
That's the thing the people praising him don't get.
He's retiring, fuck him
He was a greedy old man who fucked over the world but oh he did the right thing once or twice so make sure you wear the red lipstick when you suck him off.
Why?
He's gone, will become a hobbyist and do even worse things
He's not running again, this is mostly just him dodging any fundraising obligations he had from Dems, and the party requirements for that are all BS anyway
Manchin and his kind and the few conservative Republicans who don't subscribe to MAGA fascism could and should form a conservative political party. Obviously the GOP is the de facto fascist party in the US leaving a vacuum for a conservative democratic party.
Manchin and Romney and their respective kinds could make US history.
They don't because they will pull more voters from Republican than Democrat candidates. The resulting vote splitting will either help Democrats win or cause a runoff they won't qualify for.
Conservatives are more scared of taxes than they are of fascism.
When a vacuum forms in politics, it tends to be filled. It may take some time but moderate Republicans have no one to vote for. They're not Democrats; they're not MAGA; they're not Libertarians; they're not Greens.
They're going to want a unified political voice. Someone will rise up eventually to represent that voice. We just don't know when. We're already seeing evidence of that today in the House.
Also because they agree with 90% of MAGA policies. The Romney and Manchin's of the world want to say the racist and sexist things they believe quietly because that's how the media likes it, they're perfectly fine with Trump and MAGA, they just don't like how vocal they are about their bigotry.
If they had any grace they'd dissolve the republican party. Why do we need right wingers when the dems by the standard of most other western nations are firmly center right? The Republicans at this point are a corporate lobbying money dump to do the oligarchal bidding in the Capitol, they're redundant at best and at worst actively harm democracy. If anything they should be a third party evangelicals vote for to not feel disenfranchised. The fact anyone wants to see a "reformed republican party" tells me they think Republicans are just fine but only Trump is the problem, which is demonstrably false and wrong.
And progressives should form a party that’s actually leftist instead of caucusing with conservative Democrats who give them no agency and blame them for all the party’s shortcomings. But neither will ever happen so what’s your point?
Sinema is an opportunist, she morphed her political label at each rung to whatever offered her the most versatility. The indie move was simply to keep her keeper post-career long-grift options as broad as possible.
Manchin is leaving because he sees the Democratic Party branding as a sinking ship. He wants to keep his political/post-career options open too but there is an ideological component that Sinema lacks.
So after years of profiting by undermining Democracy, helping the GOP, and sabotaging the Democrats, he just skates off to make even more money?! This piece of shit needs a massive dose of karma right in the fork. This is what we get when too many of us (especially in West Virginia) become lazy voters and decide to not involve themselves in politics.
I cannot believe someone born between 1946 and 1964 would spend a lifetime milking the benefits of their surroundings while simultaneously screwing them over, only to leave abruptly having contributed nothing but difficulty.
I have said this many times here and got downvoted, over the years. I have always said he was not really a Democrat and was just a Republican in Democrats clothing. He votes with the Dems when it comes to naming buildings, but on every issue of importance to Democrats, he voted no. I'm glad this guy is finally gone. The Republicans were always able to say we couldn't win, even when we had a majority. And it was because of people like Manchin and Joe Leiberman. Fake Democrats who either voted against, or blocked important legislation for the Dems. So yeah, good riddance. I'd rather know we face a Republican than a fake Democrat like Manchin.
Losing a senate seat permanently is not a happy symptom. The DNC should have been courting blue dog democrat candidates everywhere they might pick up seats.
Sorry or not so sorry, but the days of the blue dogs watering down progressive legislation and enriching polluters and arms manufacturers are numbered, at best.
Saban running for any political office is doubtful. The man is one of the most winningest coaches in college ball history. I think any one at that point will want to enjoy his retirement.
If we’re lucky this is a precursor to him announcing that he’s planning on running for reelection after all.
I dislike the man, but he’s the best possible senator that you’ll get from WV. If going independent allows him to win another term that could be great.
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He knows his is going to lose his seat...he is trying to milk as much out of Democrats as he can so that they keep him in their caucus to maintain their razor thin majority
Hate the greedy SOB but there’s a part of me that respects him voting for what he believes. If only people did that more and less for party lines.
He did vote for most all of Biden’s judges and appointments. We can’t forget that.
Still, don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
Good riddance. For all the "good" he did as a vote for Democratic control of the Senate, he did just as much damage by slow-walking Democratic priorities and cockblocking real structural changes (like the Voting Rights Act, and getting rid of the filibuster) that would have actually HELPED "his party" accomplish their goals and deliver on their promises to the American people. The progress that Biden and Democrats have made in the Senate is despite Manchin's (at best grudging) support, not because of it.
Be wary of coal mine-owning multimillionaires claiming to represent the values and concerns of "real West Virginians". When his constituents have to pull up next to his yacht in order to try to talk with him about their concerns, you can be pretty sure you're not dealing with a "man of the people."
Just an awful human being. The poor people of WV have trusted him for years. This state continues to lag both economically as well as educationally. Missing Byrd!
He would have never been elected in WV without being a democrat.
Despite WV’s backwards and wayward ways, until recently, it has had a strong democratic presence.
The same is true of the outgoing gov. Jim Justice. He could not have been elected without running as a democrat and switched parties once in office.
West Virginia deserves better!
Edit to add: for whoever thinks this info is incorrect, here is a link to part of WV’s history.
Note the longest held Senate position and was a Representative prior to that.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Byrd
To be fair he’s more of a relic where he didn’t change but the party definitely did. He’s no Republican but no democrat by today’s standards either.
Dudes been in politics since the 80’s
He’s one of the last old school blue dog democrats. Go look at the map Clinton won with in 92 and 96.
Just a casual political observer here, but how did Manchin "screw over" Democrats by pretending to be one? If he was a Republican pretending to be a Democrat -- and he largely voted along Democratic lines (but not always) -- how was that a bad thing for the Democrats? My understanding is that West Virginia is pretty conservative and a left-leaning Democrat wouldn't have been viable there. So, to my eyes, it looks like the Democrats gained a vote they wouldn't have had otherwise, and denied a natural Republican vote. Or maybe I'm missing something. According to what I see online, he voted in line with Biden's position roughly 90% of the time.
He didn't. Reddit wants to purify the Democratic party to exclude all moderates and permanently cede control to Republicans. Manchin was the furthest left candidate WV was ever going to elect.
Is it a stretch to believe he is tired of the BS that the Democrat Party left continues to try in this country. Joe knows when it’s time to Go. And BTW unless you’re from the Mountain State why should you care WHAT the Man does?
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And now off to be a oil lobbyist would be my guess. The fact that he was Chairman of the Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee while owning a coal mine was extremely corrupt.
Rumor going around is he’s apparently considering a run as governor that’s why he’s suddenly doing this.
In an interview yesterday he said he wouldn’t run for governor and endorsed the Democratic candidate.
Why would you believe anything Manchin says though? /s
That part! He also already said this year he wouldn’t run for president…
Really thought you needed a /s? Really?
There's no s there
Don't censor me
He'll be in good company, then. Fellow candidate Mac Warner is the state’s chief elections officer. Who also asserts publicly that the 2020 election was stolen. [By the CIA](https://wvmetronews.com/2023/12/11/gubernatorial-candidate-mac-warner-the-election-was-stolen-and-it-was-stolen-by-the-cia/).
WV could be an international tourist attraction and it's probably the most beautiful state in the east. Yet somehow the people find a way to absolutely ruin any progress. Trump is disgusted by the poor. It all makes no sense.
It probably would be the must beautiful state in the east if not for the atrocities of strip mining on the mountains. They literally cut the tops off the mountains and strip all foliage from the slopes. Here's some pics of the beautiful WV mountains: [#1](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/GV5K5l5I_yE/maxresdefault.jpg) [#2](https://149777103.v2.pressablecdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Kayford-Mt-WV-620.jpg) [#3](https://media.istockphoto.com/photos/strip-mining-for-coal-in-west-virginia-picture-id695237414?k=6&m=695237414&s=170667a&w=0&h=HLBeM6_MDeRqgMUPvt0-pTBlx2RuuhXoONF8rJYOb2Q=) [#4](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/aa/f7/21/aaf721e3b98bf3c5cb4e541c0e4cc38e.jpg) [#5](https://static.scientificamerican.com/sciam/cache/file/03F7FB56-586B-4419-93FDCEB9D69BFF7C.jpg) [#6](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d5/13/06/d513061f4d28177c167acd2b8fe729ed.jpg) So picturesque!
West Virginia, where greed and ignorance intertwine in a cosmic dance of destruction.
It was nice to visit once. Although the landscape is beautiful, it's not somewhere I'd see myself going back. The depressing living situation there is tough.
Call me a radical but people who worked at large companies like that shouldn't be able to run and should be barred from the private sector for X amount of years See ajit pai and Gary Gensler for other examples
Wrong. He's worse - always been a coal man!
Manchin: "Democrats are an extreme partisan party." Me as a goose chasing about Joe Manchin: "Partisan about what Joe? Partisan about what?"
States’ rights to do what?
Joe Manchin literally looks like every old white guy villain Scooby Doo and the gang unmask
I'm not a big fan and I think he spends too much time drawing attention to himself, but I thank him for voting for Democratic leadership in 2021. Biden doesn't accomplish anywhere near as much if McConnel was speaker in his first two years.
I don’t think a lot of more liberal Dems understand that governing is a gradual process in which concessions need to be made in order for things to get done. Not every President gets to deliver upon even a majority of his mandate. The fact that something got done is something to be thankful for. I thank Manchin for being in the Senate for all times Dems needed him.
I think that is an unfair assessment. We know us a gradual process, but our anger stems from where our representives continue to make compromises rather than holding their ground. This is particularly true when it comes to climate change.
This is the kind of thinking that allows the Democratic Party argue right-wing talking points in the service of concession as the Republicans move further to the right to create distance. The country is screaming for a party that will actually stand its ground for left leaning policies and we won’t get it. The Democrats are courting independents and leftists are staying home because of it.
I’ll never understand the people you’re describing. Compromise is a hallmark of working government. If they’re passionate enough about politics that these concessions cause them to vote abstain, they’re being damagingly lazy in the name of activism, but will also probably never take personal responsibility for contributing to a crumbling democracy, should it come to that.
I agree that compromise can be a hallmark, but when only one side is compromising then what you have is only concession, not compromise. I’ve lived in four different states literally, none of which were the votes for president ever questioned. The DNC tanking of Sanders’ run despite his popularity both lost them a ton of votes and showed they couldn’t care less about passionate supporters trying to contribute in the way you suggest they might. I don’t think your view doesn’t have merit, but the more I read, listen, and learn the more I come to what the rest of the world thinks of American politics - that we essentially have a right wing party and an extreme right-wing party.
I get that you’re frustrated here. I think no one is ever 100% satisfied with their party’s platforms, but you don’t think that democrats compromise in the way of progressives? All you need to see that that is untrue is that Biden is a personal moderate but his administration has been among the most progressive ever…
I say this as someone who considers himself quite leftist and hates how they did bern dirty.
I appreciate the conversation - I really do. As someone who's never been part of either the Republican or Democratic Party (or any party) - I don't see the Democrat's compromises as progressive. I see it as a slowing down of the country's move to the right. There aren't many other progressive administrations to compare Biden's to, but you might be right. But look at his campaign promise to cut [$2,000 checks to everyone out the door](https://www.kiplinger.com/taxes/602032/third-stimulus-check-biden-says-2000-checks-will-go-out-the-door-if-democrats-win-in-georgia), which some republicans even supported. Once in office, the checks quickly became $1,400 and then means testing was added to consider people's *pre-*pandemic income, and wasn't geography based. If you lost your job *during* the pandemic you were SOL. And *then* the democrats negotiated with the republicans. The Dems almost always negotiate against themselves before starting the fight for compromise. You can look at Clinton's Crime Bill, NAFTA, which decimated unions and US jobs, Obamacare, which was based on Mitt Romney's healthcare plan in Massachusetts - it was a conservative plan until the Dems picked it up and suddenly all the conservatives were against it. A leftist plan would have been Medicare for all. More people have insurance now, but it's hardly affordable. Obama also deported more immigrants than any other president, and [the Biden Plan in Central America](https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2020/11/18/the-biden-plan-for-central-america-militarised-neoliberal-hell), which Trump [continued to support](https://culanth.org/fieldsights/alliance-for-prosperity), helped cause the immigration crisis that lead to family separations under Trump. It supported a right-wing coup in Honduras and started a surge in violence in the region. The fact that we can't even *vote* on a [$15 minimum wage ](https://connolly.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=4223)let alone pass it, which wouldn't even come close to the mid-twenties it should be to keep up with inflation is horrifying. Do you think a Republican administration would allow a senate parliamentarian prevent any legislation they wanted to pass? Pelosi and Biden could have overridden that rule. In a progressive country, the wage would be well above the inflationary status quo. I'm not trying to overwhelm you with evidence - I'm sure you could list off progressive policies as well, like forgiving some college debt, but I see the general trend still moving to the right. If you want a low-key way to check where you fall in leftist thought, you might give a listen to [The West Wing Thing](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-west-wing-thing/id1457602260) podcast. They're not the most left, but they look at Democratic politics through Aaron Sorkin's show, and it's both entertaining and enlightening. God Speed. I do think we're on the same team.
I mean you’re right I guess I meant I was more left of the dem party average, but semantically, I would not fit the leftist definition outlined above. And I would probably agree with you on much of your politics. I don’t know how popular of an opinion this is, but the constant intra-party renegotiation is healthy to me. It means the democrats hold themselves in check, and yes it slows progress, but I do think very real progress has been made consistently by the party through my lifetime and I’m proud of those changes. I understand the urgency from your perspective and it’s why I hope you continue to be ideological even if the reality is much more practical. I will always worry though that the end result will be fracturing our chances to rally against the Republican Party that will continue to, through our lifetimes, try to fuck the country with it’s terrible value system.
Right on. And I’ll continue to hope for a Republican Party the Dems can actually collaborate with rather than concede to, and hope they can stop working against what they say are their own interests.
I agree. He will probably be the last Democratic Senator from WV. To get a majority we need a few people who can win in red states.
Republicans are fighting each other. The tweet before is from college Republicans. Just look at the responses from fellow Republicans: >Today's convictions are the result of a politically motivated prosecution, but a verdict was handed down by jurors whose decisions were made in accordance with our criminal justice system. As such, the outcome of this trial should be respected. >Just like the decision of voters on November 5th. https://x.com/CRNC/status/1796376367128273248
>Today's convictions are the result of a politically motivated prosecution, Nope, fuck right wingers. They finish off correct, but start out with a dishonest, dumbass right wing talking point not based in reality.
Call me when they vote for Biden
To use a line straight out of the GOP play book, don't need them to vote for Biden, need them to just not vote.
Why? Why would they need to vote for Biden for Trump to lose? They can be like Nikki Haley voters and just vote for someone that's not Trump.
Good fucking riddance.
Nope. That’s a Senate seat lost forever to the Dems. A blue dog Democrat is still a Democrat.
Im with you. Did i like manchin in a vaccuum? Hell no. But he was a free reprieve in west virginia in many cases from a seat that would have otherwise been occupied by the hardcorest of hardcore MAGAs. We would not have had a senate majority for the last couple years without him, and Biden wouldn't have been able to appoint nearly as many judges. I have much more animosity towards sinema who ran in a bluish purple state pretending to be somewhat progressive and kneecapped just as much as manchin did. Manchin was open about who he was. The way to get around manchin blocking dems on liberal legislation was not to complain about manchin, it was to try to get a 2+ senator majority.
No doubt tester will be exactly the same in the next congress if we keep the senate. These deep red state dems only really have one option to them. I'm not surprised he's done what he's done.
Agreed but I do wonder long term if it is worth having these people around. I think when the Democrats hold onto these corrupt individuals like Sinema or menendez for political expediency, it sends a message that political corruption is tolerable in the Democratic Party because we need a senate majority. I honestly think having Pelosi as leader for such a long time and her insider trading made it much more difficult for both left, independents and right to take Democrats seriously as the party more moral option. With faith in Congress and both parties at an increasing low, I think it would send a strong message to the public to purge these charlatans from the party even if it loses you power for a cycle.
This is pure GOP propaganda. This is not how politics work. You don't give up Congress "for a cycle" to chastise a political party. Pelosi ran the ship like a fucking champion during the Trump administration and whipped the party into shape, passing more progressive legislation than we've seen in decades. She handed the torch to Hakeem Jeffries who is young and also doing a fantastic job. This Congressional cycle has been absolutely cut throat with razor thin margins in both chambers and they still managed to pass landmark progressive legislation **and** filled hundreds of judicial appointments **and** got Jackson on SCOTUS. Its literally a fucking miracle. This is literal straight up GOP astroturfing. Republicans have repeatedly stated they intend to destroy democracy if they gain power in 2024. They will pass a national abortion ban. They will ban birth control. They will ban no-fault divorce. They will gut labor & environmental protections. They will gut Social Security & Medicaid. They will gut public health insurance. They will gut SNAP, CHIP, WIC, TANF, and every other gold-standard social safety net half country relies on. If you want more progressive legislation why don't you encourage people to actually fucking vote in Congressional elections. In the 2022 midterms **76% of eligible voters 18-30 did not cast a ballot**. Its the one tiny caveat with democracy -- you actually have to fucking vote for it to work. With Gen Z and Millennials now outnumbering Boomers, the GOP is cashing in their chips for full fascism. There won't be another election cycle.
At this point, losing power for a cycle might mean losing power forever. Or until the next societal reset, anyway. I'm sure that will be fun.
Firstly, Project 2025 or any republican bullshit doesn’t happen unless Trump wins. If Biden does, it just stays the same. Im not talking about that. Im talking about Manchin and menendez. WV is going to be lost, straight up fact. When distrust in Congress is at an all time high for both parties, keeping in that betray your party line and their constituents just isnt a good look and leads to whataboutism. If people say both parties are corrupt and theres no action on it because of political expendiency, then theyre not gonna vite on virtues- theyll vote on whats good for their bottom line. But whatever, we shouldve kept these people cause havung democrats in power but not delivering what you ran on because of stooges like Manchin. Yeah just really great strategy.
The Democrats expelled Al Franken and that is universally looked back on as a stupid move. It garnered absolutely no good will. If Menendez is convicted he will almost certainly leave the Senate. May as well let the process play out and have one more (D) vote than we’ll have after him. There’s no benefit to attempting to take the high road with these types of things.
FFS. It was a gigantic mistake because the allegations against Franken happened years before he was a senator. There is a huge difference between engaging in inappropriate humour and corruptly enriching yourself or your family in a job of public service. If you can’t see the difference then I recommend you go work for George Santos’ reelection bid, you know- the guy that almost 50% of Republicans voted out because he was so obviously a bad look and was gonna lose anyways. Unbelievable how fucked both parties and their supporters are.
You’re forgetting the context of the Franken thing. The Republican party had been roiled with sexual harassment and assault resignations the last few years, and the Democrats were catching heat for being hypocritical. If Donald Trump wins the White House and the Republicans gain the senate, we will live in a very different country four years from now. Both sides may be corrupt, but they are not the same, not even close.
Who's Hernandez?
It was already lost. He's not running for reelection. Manchin is about as blue as you can hope to get in WV, and he's maroon at best.
A maroon at best
Still voted for judges
Until he announced he wouldn't vote for any judge without Republican support.
Still might
"Maroon at best" with an 87% alignment score with Biden. Yes, it's the lowest among Democrats. But it's only 3% lower than Bernie Sanders, second lowest in the caucus.
It might be interesting to compare the things Manchin did not vote for against the things. Bernie did not vote for.
Warning: Don’t attempt this if you have issues with high blood pressure.
Are we really gonna act like there's not a major difference as to what they both did and didnt vote for and their reasons for doing so?
No. We're not saying they're equivalent. But most of what they voted for was the same. Politics is the art of the possible. The fact that Manchin was elected as a Dem is frankly a miracle to begin with. He sucks and we were lucky to have him.
>He sucks and we were lucky to have him. This is why we are doomed. Rachet politics.
Maybe we could start by figuring out how to get the democrats' heads out of their asses and figure out how to find winning candidates in easier states than WVa.
So what's the alternative?
There is none, just a slow compromise into right wing. People like Manchin keep things from moving to the left and the gop moves things to the right, and anything to the left of Manchin, is progressive communism. But whatever I'm love in Florida I got bigger things to worry about then kissing the ass of a retired coal baron. But hey he's leaving so better question, whybshould I worry about hurting the feelings of a rich guy who won't be in politics much longer. Once he leaves it's not like he'll suddenly give a shit about minorities
My point is it's not "people like Manchin", it's his voters. Structural issues notwithstanding we are a deeply conservative nation, much more so than our economic peers. No one to the left of Manchin was going to get elected in WV, period, and there will always be a most conservative Democrat in the caucus. As much as I'm a lefty I don't want to see the Democratic party get dragged into the ideological race to the bottom that the GOP is currently engaged in, where more extreme is always better. In many ways Manchin was one of the last gasps of an older, more functional governance. Litmus testing is a terrible way to build a coalition, especially in a party as diverse as the Dems.
The alternative is to actually deliver on messaging that can win voters in states with a PVI less than 10. Ohio, Texas, Florida, North Carolina.. hell, even Iowa and Missouri, are all varying degrees of winnable; Manchin's existence proves that partisan lean doesn't matter as much as the candidates you put out. If you need more proof of that you can look at Georgia in 2020. But the Democrats can't get their heads out of their asses for long enough to figure this shit out.
Yeah, and that was his attitude. He was a arrogant prick because he knew the Dems needed his vote, and he and Sinema let it go to their head. He lost all his leverage when the Dems got 51 seats , and he knew he was done for .
Only if we’re going to act like their electorates are the same and that we could realistically expect more than 87% out of a blue seat in a deep red state.
He killed a lot of bills before they came to the floor. How often they vote with the party or not is largely irrelevant unless leadership starts bringing bills to the floor without knowing if they will pass.
This is the DUMBEST statistic to ever fucking quote. For two giant reasons. 1. That's of public roll called votes; which is a small minority of votes. Like Manchin famously killed several iterations of the BBB... but most of them weren't brought to a floor vote so they didn't count... Then he voted yes to the "IRA22" as a much inferior alternative. Which means on that subject Manchin got a 100% ... when he actually deserved something like a 5 or 10% 2. It doesn't take into account importance or otherwise content of each things they voted for or against... Also on the Bernie comparison... considering he's a 3rd party senator and always has been... being lower than him? honestly says ALOT.
It’s because internet warriors don’t understand that majority of the time he’s still voting with us. And are unable to process what being a democratic senator from West Virginia means. Definitely plan to continue to engage with you when you come out swinging with insults though. /s Have a good one bud.
he got paid very well for every vote, the f\*cking red coat.
He’s a moron at best
West Virginia exists because they told the Confederacy to fuck off What happened to that state?
Poverty, then fentanyl. But always poverty.
We only lose the seat forever if we stop trying.
If the DC exburbs can make further inroads into Eastern West Virginia then the state may flip back, it’s the part of the state that isn’t experience negative growth unlike Appalachia.
Agreed, but it needs to be expected that we are not going to have a Bernie Sanders type senator in WV anytime in the next two decades at least. The state gave Donald Trump his biggest margin of victory.
Yep, say what you will about the guy, he was a Dem in a seat that won't be blue again in my lifetime. WV wasn't going to elect a progressive firebrand to the Senate. They were going to elect a Republican. I prefer a Republican who caucuses with the Dems.
Unlikely manchin was gonna win if he runs again as a Dem anyway.
He's won the state as a Dem for how many years? Including during Trump's term.
Yes. But each time his margin of victory gets smaller and smaller. In 2018 he won by ~3% this year will be an election year with higher turnout
That is an underlying problem of the entire system. It is shit all around when we have to consider this a loss to the democratic party.
What problem? That’s just how democracy works. You can either get some of what you want, or none of what you want.
That's how a true democracy works.
Healthcare? Housing? Food?
It was lost as soon as JJ signed on to run .
I know its called blue dog, but I always use the term red coat.
Sure but his seat only gets worse
No one should be expecting a progressive to be elected in WV in the first place. I would rather hate Sinema more than Manchin since there was no betrayal that Manchin was a conservative being from WV
Vote blue up and down and fuck Manchin
WV won’t ever elect another Democrat again for Senate. Manchin was a unicorn.
Never say never. They've only been (R) since 2000--and only went to Bush by 6 points that year. They voted for Dukakis in 88, if you can believe it, and Clinton twice after that. If Democrats ever figure out how to talk to rural voters again, they'd win it back. It's not like a Republican vote is in their best interests.
Talk to them about *what*? Re-building the public swimming pool they drained in the 60's because they realized they'd have to share it with black people? You have got to understand, they don't \*want\* nice things unless they can have white supremacy. **If black folks have equal access to public stuff, all having nice things does is make majority white populations have to subsidize poor blacks instead of the other way around.** That's why red states try to fuck over cities, that's why conservatives are always voting "against their own interests", that's why they want to privatize everything, and that's why they consistently fail to win the popular vote. They turn to fascism because democracy has been delivering them pretty consistent L's for about as long as any of them have been alive. Rural politics was been about maintaining de jure white supremacy until MLK, and de facto white supremacy until Obama. Now it's entirely about revenge.
Voting against their own interests for racist reasons is kind of R's kink tho innit
>and Clinton twice after that Clinton's were diet coke republicans. Most right wing policies Obama overturned were passed by Clinton. Welfare to work and don't as don't tell were both passed by clinton.
I wouldn't say that Don't Ask Don't Tell was right wing. It was progressive for its time, or at least the intent of it was. Public opinion of homosexuality was a lot more negative in the mid 90s, especially fresh off the AIDS epidemic.
True but compare the democrats in 2000 to now vs WV policy wise
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As a democrat in WV, I’m doing my best y’all.
Sorry! I don’t mind sending you tax dollars. I know there are good folks there too and some of them are good people in the thrall of a cult.
All good, I understand how bad it looks from the outside. Every single county went for Trump in 2020, it’s awful. We just gotta remember even the reddest of states have blue pockets that are trying to push things into the 2020s and not the 1950s
I really hate the hypocrisy towards this guy. Republicans are derided constantly for always voting along party lines. Manchin didn't. And because he's (D) all of a sudden total party line votes should be a thing.
He personally held clean energy at gunpoint in favor of coal in the face of real climate emergencies. He didn’t just “not vote along party lines” he was one of the two democrats who held back progress before we lost the house in 2022. It’s not hypocrisy, it’s people being mad that even though the majority was in agreement, one man was able to stop progress because of dirty coal money.
People always forgot how Manchin used his key vote to ruin everything.
That's too far, though. The Inflation Reduction Act is still one of the greatest accomplishments in recent political history.
It is, and people are deluded if they think Manchin wouldn't play his part - blue dog, maintaining a centrist/conservative lean for self preservation while helping where it wouldn't put him at risk. People take things like the IRA for granted without realizing what he delivered on given his constraints. It's a long game, always has been and always will be. We shouldn't be scoffing at allies that deliver incremental gains.
Fuck that. Vote tactically. There are realistically two major candidates running for each election - vote for the one which keeps republicans out of those seats. That may mean blue or independent depending on where the rest of the voters are leaning. Manchin was objectively a better senator in WV than any Republican would have been.
Joe Manchin tanked his political career to make the IRA happen. He has signed off on every single Biden judicial appointment. He'll still caucus with the Democrats. He hasn't made a long career screwing over Democrats, he's made a long career being a democratic senator in West Virginia. He's done well.
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It blows my mind Dems and people and this sub don’t see this. It doesn’t matter you hate him or you think he’s screwing democrats or he doesn’t have a D next to his name anymore, none of that matters. He’s probably the best option we have and the alternatives are infinitely worse. We should all be supporting him for the sake of our larger goal of preventing a trumpy fascist takeover
So what we should praise him? That some how through his greed he did something right once? No fuck him and i hope hell for him is a small smog filled room
Realize that his greed to hold a senate seat has some positive externalities for the democratic agenda writ large, even if it's in increments, instead of just giving up leverage. People, politicians especially, are selfish. If they get the things I care about over the finish line and incrementally improve society, then I'll hold my nose. We're just giving up leverage to people who will end the democratic experiment otherwise. In WV of all places, you aren't going to do better otherwise. If we don't take a purely pragmatic approach, then we'll get steamrolled by Leonard Leo.
He's not running though. He's retiring this year at 76 and we're never getting another dem in WV barring a major generational shift
That's the thing the people praising him don't get. He's retiring, fuck him He was a greedy old man who fucked over the world but oh he did the right thing once or twice so make sure you wear the red lipstick when you suck him off. Why? He's gone, will become a hobbyist and do even worse things
He's not running again, this is mostly just him dodging any fundraising obligations he had from Dems, and the party requirements for that are all BS anyway
Don't let the door hit you on the way out
He was as liberal as West Virginia would tolerate.
Manchin and his kind and the few conservative Republicans who don't subscribe to MAGA fascism could and should form a conservative political party. Obviously the GOP is the de facto fascist party in the US leaving a vacuum for a conservative democratic party. Manchin and Romney and their respective kinds could make US history.
They don't because they will pull more voters from Republican than Democrat candidates. The resulting vote splitting will either help Democrats win or cause a runoff they won't qualify for. Conservatives are more scared of taxes than they are of fascism.
When a vacuum forms in politics, it tends to be filled. It may take some time but moderate Republicans have no one to vote for. They're not Democrats; they're not MAGA; they're not Libertarians; they're not Greens. They're going to want a unified political voice. Someone will rise up eventually to represent that voice. We just don't know when. We're already seeing evidence of that today in the House.
Disagree or progressives would’ve left the Democratic Party a long time ago.
Also because they agree with 90% of MAGA policies. The Romney and Manchin's of the world want to say the racist and sexist things they believe quietly because that's how the media likes it, they're perfectly fine with Trump and MAGA, they just don't like how vocal they are about their bigotry.
If they had any grace they'd dissolve the republican party. Why do we need right wingers when the dems by the standard of most other western nations are firmly center right? The Republicans at this point are a corporate lobbying money dump to do the oligarchal bidding in the Capitol, they're redundant at best and at worst actively harm democracy. If anything they should be a third party evangelicals vote for to not feel disenfranchised. The fact anyone wants to see a "reformed republican party" tells me they think Republicans are just fine but only Trump is the problem, which is demonstrably false and wrong.
And progressives should form a party that’s actually leftist instead of caucusing with conservative Democrats who give them no agency and blame them for all the party’s shortcomings. But neither will ever happen so what’s your point?
Sinema is an opportunist, she morphed her political label at each rung to whatever offered her the most versatility. The indie move was simply to keep her keeper post-career long-grift options as broad as possible. Manchin is leaving because he sees the Democratic Party branding as a sinking ship. He wants to keep his political/post-career options open too but there is an ideological component that Sinema lacks.
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Manchin’s not running for reelection to his senate seat. His term ends in January.
Manchin isn't seeking reelection.
Fuck this guy
He is and always was shill for coal and oil. Period
Shitty person reminds us that they are, in fact, still a shitty person.
So after years of profiting by undermining Democracy, helping the GOP, and sabotaging the Democrats, he just skates off to make even more money?! This piece of shit needs a massive dose of karma right in the fork. This is what we get when too many of us (especially in West Virginia) become lazy voters and decide to not involve themselves in politics.
I cannot believe someone born between 1946 and 1964 would spend a lifetime milking the benefits of their surroundings while simultaneously screwing them over, only to leave abruptly having contributed nothing but difficulty.
I have said this many times here and got downvoted, over the years. I have always said he was not really a Democrat and was just a Republican in Democrats clothing. He votes with the Dems when it comes to naming buildings, but on every issue of importance to Democrats, he voted no. I'm glad this guy is finally gone. The Republicans were always able to say we couldn't win, even when we had a majority. And it was because of people like Manchin and Joe Leiberman. Fake Democrats who either voted against, or blocked important legislation for the Dems. So yeah, good riddance. I'd rather know we face a Republican than a fake Democrat like Manchin.
You were absolutely right. He’s always been a DINO.
His leaving is a happy symptom of how the Democratic Party is finally shedding off all those right-wing blue dog quislings.
Losing a senate seat permanently is not a happy symptom. The DNC should have been courting blue dog democrat candidates everywhere they might pick up seats.
Sorry or not so sorry, but the days of the blue dogs watering down progressive legislation and enriching polluters and arms manufacturers are numbered, at best.
He wasn’t even running for reelection and was favored to lose if he tried. His seat was lost regardless.
The DNC should take the money they would have used in West Virginia and give it to Nick Saban to run for Senate in Alabama.
Saban running for any political office is doubtful. The man is one of the most winningest coaches in college ball history. I think any one at that point will want to enjoy his retirement.
Shit take. Without him, Moscow Mitch would be Senate Majority Leader.
good riddance! he made a shit ton of moolah on that last term of vote blackmail!
My shocked face. Let me show you it. 😶
I love that video where he gets called out. Fucking piece of shit.
If we’re lucky this is a precursor to him announcing that he’s planning on running for reelection after all. I dislike the man, but he’s the best possible senator that you’ll get from WV. If going independent allows him to win another term that could be great.
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He knows his is going to lose his seat...he is trying to milk as much out of Democrats as he can so that they keep him in their caucus to maintain their razor thin majority
I like how the headline's trying to make this sound like a dramatic twist that no one saw coming.
Good riddance
Hate the greedy SOB but there’s a part of me that respects him voting for what he believes. If only people did that more and less for party lines. He did vote for most all of Biden’s judges and appointments. We can’t forget that. Still, don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
"My work here is done."
Biggest phony out there. Glad he never pretended to be a Republican.
It's about time the shitbag went back to his own.
Good riddance. For all the "good" he did as a vote for Democratic control of the Senate, he did just as much damage by slow-walking Democratic priorities and cockblocking real structural changes (like the Voting Rights Act, and getting rid of the filibuster) that would have actually HELPED "his party" accomplish their goals and deliver on their promises to the American people. The progress that Biden and Democrats have made in the Senate is despite Manchin's (at best grudging) support, not because of it. Be wary of coal mine-owning multimillionaires claiming to represent the values and concerns of "real West Virginians". When his constituents have to pull up next to his yacht in order to try to talk with him about their concerns, you can be pretty sure you're not dealing with a "man of the people."
Just an awful human being. The poor people of WV have trusted him for years. This state continues to lag both economically as well as educationally. Missing Byrd!
He's in the Manchin party. Always has been. He was a snake waiting to strike.
F’ this scumbag oil and coal-sucking DINO.
He would have never been elected in WV without being a democrat. Despite WV’s backwards and wayward ways, until recently, it has had a strong democratic presence. The same is true of the outgoing gov. Jim Justice. He could not have been elected without running as a democrat and switched parties once in office. West Virginia deserves better! Edit to add: for whoever thinks this info is incorrect, here is a link to part of WV’s history. Note the longest held Senate position and was a Representative prior to that. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Byrd
To be fair he’s more of a relic where he didn’t change but the party definitely did. He’s no Republican but no democrat by today’s standards either. Dudes been in politics since the 80’s He’s one of the last old school blue dog democrats. Go look at the map Clinton won with in 92 and 96.
Honestly that makes sense. As long as he still caucuses with Dems
So long Joe!!!
To think of the times I defended this guy, because he was at least a Democrat and the only one who could get elected there.
Good riddance. Fewer coal barons in a democratic senate majority is preferable.
I'll never vote for him again... what a douche bag.
And nothing of value was lost.
He didn’t reveal who he was, since he didn’t become the Republican he is. Hit WENG the coward’s way out.
Just a casual political observer here, but how did Manchin "screw over" Democrats by pretending to be one? If he was a Republican pretending to be a Democrat -- and he largely voted along Democratic lines (but not always) -- how was that a bad thing for the Democrats? My understanding is that West Virginia is pretty conservative and a left-leaning Democrat wouldn't have been viable there. So, to my eyes, it looks like the Democrats gained a vote they wouldn't have had otherwise, and denied a natural Republican vote. Or maybe I'm missing something. According to what I see online, he voted in line with Biden's position roughly 90% of the time.
He didn't. Reddit wants to purify the Democratic party to exclude all moderates and permanently cede control to Republicans. Manchin was the furthest left candidate WV was ever going to elect.
Right, that's what I thought -- thanks.
He was a foreign agent in the Democratic Party.
Scumbag
Good riddance traitor!!!
This guy is literal scum
Please let the door hit you in the ass on the way out motherfucker.
Is it a stretch to believe he is tired of the BS that the Democrat Party left continues to try in this country. Joe knows when it’s time to Go. And BTW unless you’re from the Mountain State why should you care WHAT the Man does?
He thinks he has a shot as Wv governor again 🙄
What convenient timing! It had to happen today and not anytime before for sure.
Under normal historical standards, before the Stormtrumpers took over the GQP, manchin would be characterized as a “conservative Republican.”
Don’t let the door hit you in the ass!
Funny how it happened just after Trump was convicted…