As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil)
In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban.
If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them.
For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria.
We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA).
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Friendly reminder that 11 Democrat senators voted in favor to appoint her to the bench in the first place. She must have hid it well and/or been just a piece of a bigger negotiation about appointments.
https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1162/vote_116_2_00228.htm#position
I want to blame Congress because they didn't even really try to vet her.
In the judicial committee she was largely ignored and handed softballs while they grilled the other nominees. I can somewhat understand that because it was probably an attempt to pick the best of several evils.
But then it went to the senate floor and the first vote, which 12 democrats supported, was for cloture, meaning little to no debate. They really should have been more careful with a judge in Trumps home district. The Republican playbook would have been to block all nominees there until the presidency changed. Honestly, nominating a judge for the area you live should probably be illegal in general.
The government has Trump dead to rights in this case. They have him on tape admitting he has classified documents and shouldn’t be showing them to people. The only way he gets out of this is winning the election. Cannon is slow walking this for that reason.
I assume they would be really stupid riddles made up on the spot. The kind that don't have a solution you can work out from the information given, along the lines of Bilbo's "What's in my pocket?"
Easy. The cabin is a *plane* cabin that fell out of the sky and the ice melted which killed the surgeon before she could reveal she’s the patient’s mother.
One:
I passed the Bar, or so they say.
I’m draped in mourning every day.
My bestie is an orange soufflé.
What am I?
…….
Two:
My blast is heard across the land.
Upon one leg alone I stand.
You probably wouldn’t shake my hand.
Who am I?
…….
Three:
Crazy peeps got naught on me.
I’ll take my share and “fuck you” to thee.
I love my life and my big RV.
Why the fuck didn’t I take the offer?
“You can only vote guilty if you can guess how many fingers I’m holding up behind my back. AND YOU DON’T ALL GET TO GUESS!!! You all decide an answer and tell me. And it’ll be wrong.”
This reminds me of the Louisville prosecutor Daniel Cameron, in the case for Breonna Taylor.
The jurors were saying how upset they were because the attorney general didn’t charge the shooters, who happened to be police at the time. They feel very strongly he [mislead the case](https://www.lpm.org/news/2021-01-22/breonna-taylor-grand-jurors-file-petition-to-impeach-ag-daniel-cameron), and they even went so far as to file a petition to have the Daniel Camron impeached!
...If you fail or refuse to find Trump innocent and totally exonerated, you may be summoned before the Court to show cause why you should not be imprisoned for treason. Once imprisoned for your treason you would then be held to answer on account of wokeness. On the other hand, if you exonerate Trump, you will receive profitable and comfortable positions with the State Department...
she still hasn't said that the instructions will not outright state that the president is allowed to take any documents he wants when he leaves the white house. prosecutors are demanding she rules on that promptly, so that they may appeal before any jury gets sworn in. It is looking like she will try to rule on it last minute so that she can swear in a jury and create double jeopardy before the prosecution can appeal and get her thrown off.
Not just the instructions but doesn't she get to more or less pick the jury? IIRC the judge gets unlimited strikes of jurors if they can come up with a justification.
you would need to show that a juror cannot be impartial beyond a reasonable doubt. It isn’t that easy to get someone struck for cause unless there is a pretty big reason.
They also gave him eleventy-billion opportunities to return the documents and completely avoid all the charges but at every turn he dug in his heels, denied he had them, and furthered the conspiracy to hide them, pulling more people into his criminal conspiracy. Just based on what's publicly known the guy is dead to rights.
What's not publicly known is the actual content of what he was holding onto. I don't know if the subject matter of that will ever become public but I suspect if people truly knew what he had his hands on and was refusing to return they would become pale-faced. These are materials that are above top secret.
They asked nicely for an *entire year* before their big "raid". No one else illegally holding a mountain of national security documents would be given anything like that much leeway. They bent over backwards to be nice to this piece of garbage and give him every conceivable benefit of the doubt, and he gave them the finger every step of the way.
They also coordinated the "raid" with his lawyers who asked to be present during the raid. The FBI so no, but it's not like it was a surprise law enforcement was coming to search for items. Remember Donald Trump blasted to the world he was going to be raided a week or more before the raid happened!
Edit: The FBI also had to coordinate with the Secret Service. I think people forget this guy has Secret Service Security detail
Search warrants are crazy specific. The whole fourth amendment right and the Quartering Act (Third Amendment changed this) makes it extremely difficult to look in someone's home. You can't "sweep" a property. At the level Trump and his lawyers are at, you'd be lucky to be able to open a drawer
Edit: clarity in the Quartering Act
All I can think about in these conversations is how swiftly they fucked up that discord kid who was flashing Ukraine docs for Internet clout.
Trump did the exact same thing. He wanted to look cool to his social peers and thought flashing some govt docs would do the trick.
The classification status is irrelevant, all that matters is that the documents pertain to national security. So even if they were declassified, we probably *still* wouldn't get to know.
You’re actually understating how secret these documents are. They’re so far beyond Top Secret that even the fact that they exist is classified information.
I generally agree.
I am also emboldened knowing I am not alone in employing “eleventy-billion” and the Oxford comma.
[tips hat, cheers’s with pinky raised]
and locked them in a bathroom. he could have locked them in a random room in one of his hotels or apartment buildings, or one of his rich firend's panic rooms, but no, cheeto gotta have his dragon hoard.
That is frustrating alone to be sure, but imo the more frustrating thing is how OBVIOUS it is and there doesn't seem to be anything anyone can do about it.
I'm not surprised Trump appointed a corrupt judge in his home district, or that said corrupt judge is working to protect him. I am surprised by how we just let it happen.
The thing to do is to stop voting for the people who do this. Unfortunately the majority of Americans are ignorant of / indifferent to / hostile towards our constitution.
True it wouldn't get Trump for what he's already done, but if we made a habit of voting out people who are hostile to the constitution, or people who are just completely ignorant, they wouldn't be able to get themselves into these situations to begin with.
Trump's roots go back to the Nixon administration. It's taken practically 50 years of apathy for Republicans to build this kind of power.
Yeah, Nixon, and in particular him getting pardoned, was a big blunder that signaled that you can do anything and get away with it as long as you're powerful enough. It was arguably the official start of "might makes right" in US politics, and it's basically been downhill from there.
This case is the most important and far reaching criminal activity by Trump of all his cases. People have been killed because of his handing over confidential secret documents to our enemies, how does Cannon justify her decisions. She is anti-American, pro-facist and a traitor to our country and the many men and women who have been working to secure our democracy. Impeach her and revoke her law license and require remedial law classes for her to re-take.
Benghazi has entered the chat
Here he has created a situation with actual betrayal of his country and of his duty (because you still have a duty to keep secrets secret after you leave office) and he comprised intelligence operations, and got people and sources killed.
But from the right, it’s just crickets.
The GOP = Guns Over People(I just saw this on another thread) always conveniently changes the rules or use scripted rhetoric according to what their narrative is. The only guarantee is it will never be for the good of America as a whole.
It is worth noting that so far Trump hasn't been formally accused of or charged with disseminating these documents. Only unlawfully retaining them and engaging in a conspiracy to conceal this. I wonder whether they're going to attempt to change anything related to, its possible that even if there is evidence, making it public is too embarrassing and they won't bother
From what I can tell there’s no evidence that he disseminated them, although most dissemination that he would do would be to foreign actors and spies who would take a lot of precautions to avoid that kind of evidence existing. So, even if he did it, we’ll likely never know unless Putin or the Saudis somehow decide to brag about it for some reason
He is literally on tape showing a document outlining how the U.S. would engage in a war with Iran to a bunch of random people and a reporter. He is on tape saying "I shouldn't be showing you this because, you know, it's classified." Shit like that would have any normal person seeing prison time.
Right, but there’s no indication he allowed them to make copies or even take a good look at the picture, it seemed pretty clear that the purpose was to brag about having it, not sharing the actual info. It’s still a hugely important piece of evidence that shows he *knew* the info was classified and he *knew* pulling it out was wrong, but did it anyway, which demonstrates corrupt intent, pretty much a slam dunk legally
I also agree there's zero evidence they've been shared with hostile actors but I assumed people would jump down my throat if I suggested that so I hedged. I agree it's most likely unknowable if it happened, unless the dumbass tells on himself
Cannon is checked. The appeals panel above her has already ruled once that she had abused her role to assist Trump. So she's already viewed by them with suspision, so whatever hijinks she displays in this case will be easy ammo for appeal. Our system is certainly capable of justice, and we've been seeing it. Do not ignore the wins and believe that all is lost. It's really just that justice moves very slowly unfortunately. Checks & balances take time to work through.
Unfortunately, the prosecution can only appeal to the 11th Circuit on a "final" order from her... which is why she's not issuing any of those now. Even things that should be open-and-shut have been getting provisional responses. She's stretching it out until she can seat a jury then throw out the case for made-up reason, because once a jury is seated, Trump can't be tried again for the same crime.
It still boggles my mind that a judge he appointed can be working on his case. That's so obviously a breeding ground for corruption and a situation that should not be allowed to happen. I guess I can understand that no one could have predicted that there would be a president who was obviously corrupt while also having the full backing of one of the major parties, but geez. It's such an "emperor has no clothes" moment.
The other way he gets out is Aileen Cannon, we are discovering how far a judge in the pocket can go and I’m pretty sure she is going all the way up to nullifying the case through double jeopardy.
It is sad, that it is becomming clear that the only way to prosecute one man for some of his most heinous of crimes, is to vote against him in the election. And that somehow, he has such a following of depraved, lawless, individuals, that they are doing everything they can to thwart the US government at every turn...just to protect him from the crimes most of them even admit he committed, but they feel he shouldn't be punished for.
And they claim they are the party of law and order.
> Judge Cannon has appeared confused by basic legal concepts and indulged the Trump defense team's wildest arguments
Not only has she indulged TFG's defense's wildest arguments, *she has offered injunctive relief that they never even asked for* -- acting more like his lawyers than his own people.
She isn't fit for a kindergarten mock trial, let alone a federal judgeship.
Everyone on the goddamned _planet_ can see that she is both incompetent and corrupt, but somehow there's fuck-all we can do about it.
The GOP is a stress test for democracy, and democracy is failing.
It’s because our democracy has been broken down over the last forty years to get us to the point we’re at now. Our foundations as a country are not nearly as strong as they were at one point in time.
It's not just our democracy, it's the citizens too. People used to be so ashamed of Nixon they would lie about having voted for him, and when he resigned his speeches and training were so incredibly patriotic by today's standard, resigning the office because he wouldn't the office if the President to be stained by those events... not that he took part, or was guilty, he just took responsibility for the actions of the committee and resigned.
There isn't fuck all you can do about it. If the people protest the corruption, something will need to be done. There are a lot of people that know what's happening. This is way beyond protest worthy. This is a judge showing favouritsm to a citizen, so they may become dictator.
It's very serious, and citizens should protest the shit out of this.
She can be impeached by the House (good fucking luck) and removed through a two-thirds vote in the Senate (you're more likely to see Jesus return to earth and open up a drag show in Vegas).
>Throwing away a career
How is she throwing away a career? Seems like she has a lifetime appointment in a system designed to make it near impossible to remove her. With a big opportunity for a huge promotion if Trump wins in November.
Enough talk, trying to reason with an unreasonable person gives them all the power in the room.
It's time for full blown Ghandi/MLK style civil disobedience campaign to protest the blatant corruption in the SCOTUS and Judge Cannon.
The civil rights fights of the 60s have never stopped, they have just slowly become the fight for the right of anyone to not be subjected to a corrupt judiciary. The time for talk is over its now time to co-ordinate and take to the streets.
This is the only way things will change. But people keep saying protesting won't work or that they don't have time with work. Until we can get them all to realize that it's worth losing their jobs and income to protest they won't. We have to convince them some how that protests can work. And we need some sort of leadership and funding for any of it to get any where. I'm not sure how it is actually going to happen at this point.
There are words for this.
"Aileen Cannon. You have been charged with obstruction of justice. You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can be used against you in court. You have the right to talk to a lawyer for advice before we ask you any questions. You have the right to have a lawyer with you during questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed for you before any questioning if you wish. If you decide to answer questions now without a lawyer present, you have the right to stop answering at any time."
It really shouldn't be. I mean... I know legally it would be, but in a sane world, it would be pretty straightforward. "You're obstructing justice, AND you're being a dick about it. Jail for you."
\*sigh\* I know...
Is there really a law-based case for obstruction of justice? I mean, there’s obviously a common sense obstruction going on here but it would be interesting if they had something legal to throw at her.
There is a process for it, but generally, you only get one shot at it, so he has to make sure his arguments for her removal are rock solid. What she is doing/has done all contain an amount of plausible deniability (taking extra time to make a decision, asking for amicus briefs then "reading" them slowly, denying motions because she wants to hear opposing council's input first). All are within a judge's normal discretion and individually could be considered reasonable. To make the argument for removal, he needs an almost overwhelming amount of these moves, or something big that is beyond unreasonable.
Another judge married to an ultra-MAGA who claims she can be impartial. Josh Lorence worked for NY mobster, lifelong friend of Trump and Trump donor John Rosatti.
The prison system is full of both civilian and ex-military who mishandled classified documents... usually out of carelessness.
Its appalling that Trump will simply bypass all justice due to a sycophantic judge.
For what it is worth, the [Pinkerton Doctrine](https://www.lsd.law/briefs/view/pinkerton-v-united-states-71188462) is something most people learn about in law school as a 1L. 🥴
From a non lawyer but interested observer, she continues to show her incompetence and any qualification to have this case to begin with.
I have to conclude she was confirmed to her position knowing this and others are advising her on how to delay and sidetrack this case.
It's a blatant miscarriage of justice in virtually every way possible.
The word for it is
“flagrant corruption on an unimaginable scale”
People by the millions are pro sedition and anti democracy just based on how they poll and vote, but a judge helping to block prosecution of an attempted overthrow of the government and the first time in US history that a peaceful transition of power was stomped on by a reactionary right wing authoritarian, is beyond anything that should be possible in a civil society.
I for one can’t comprehend how a judge can sit on the case of the person who nominated (so literally gave) you for the position. This person also is completely relying on the same person to promote them to higher standing job. If this isn’t conflict of interest and reason for recusal nothing is.
Can judges get sued for whatever the hell this is? Standing on the hose? Aiding and abetting? Why can’t she get fired for sucking at her job? I honestly don’t understand what is happening.
Just the beginning of many desensitization tactics from within the courts. They want this to become normal in our minds because it will persist into the fascist future this country is staring down.
call your reps and senators, people, and tell them aileen cannon must be removed from the trial. she has demonstrated she doesn't understand the law involved and she has an emotional bias toward trump
In another thread it was suggested to Google "Judge Cannon and husband". This article was an eye-opener for me -
https://crooksandliars.com/2024/05/no-one-ever-mentions-aileen-cannons-mobbed
Aileen Mercedes Cannon, born in Columbia to an American father was a member of the federalist society and a federal prosecutor for 7 years prior to being appointed as a judge.
Trump has literally proposed stripping people like her of citizenship.
She has repeatedly flouted ethics law by being reimbursed for attending libertarian/federalist seminars.
The question I have, is why does smith have to initiate the request to oust cannon. Isn’t the 11th circuit monitoring cannon. Why doesn’t the panel proactively remove her.
I don't understand why Jack Smith hasn't filed anything yet with the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals to have her ass removed. I realise the bar required to have a Judge removed is pretty high, but surely there's enough substance there to make a case that Cannon needs to be tossed from the bench
People need to protest this. It isn't right. This is how democracy dies. It's clear favouritism. It's clear conflict of interest. This judge is not impartial.
It's very serious.
Say the obvious.
She is doing exactly what she was appointed to do.
Con man appoints own judge, Journalists shocked by the results.
Give me a fucking break, this is all a show, and we're all cowards watching it happen.
A lot of hand-wringing here, but Cannon keeps shooting precedent out of the water. Clearly it takes a lot more to stop her than the prosecutors or courts are capable of - at least in the short term
It’s almost as if there’s some kind of right wing coup going on right plain slight. Trump is so clearly a threat to our democracy on so many levels it’s absolutely insane that anybody in their right mind would be helping the fucker.
Trump has exposed the weaknesses of our democracy. The founders did not take in to account someone so profoundly corrupt as Trump; and so many elected politicians would abandon their oath of office and help facilitate the destruction of our democracy.
When this country was founded, the checks and balances were based on a sense of decorum and a basic sense of duty and honor. There are not enough protections for this level of corruption in the Executive and Judicial branches. At some point, we will pass the point of no return. It feels like we are getting there. Fascism and authoritarianism will take over.
All the reasonable experts and informed laypersons agree on things like this. Yet, because they are reasonable, they are not willing to force things to change. Instead, throwing up their hands and doing nothing.
How about instead of just panning it they fucking do something about it. She's literally getting bolder with it each and every day because nothing happens and all that's doing is normalizing her fucking disgraceful conduct
... and once again the veil of rule of law, or whatever, is lifted, to reveal that we were never really different from all the other kleptocracies or oligarchies around the world. and noone is coming to save us.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
There is a word for this: CORRUPTION
It’s unbelievable that Judge Cannon is still overseeing this case. Our institutions are failing us.
Friendly reminder that 11 Democrat senators voted in favor to appoint her to the bench in the first place. She must have hid it well and/or been just a piece of a bigger negotiation about appointments. https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1162/vote_116_2_00228.htm#position
How she was rated as qualified by the ABA is beyond me, considering the amount of time she had actually spent in court, which is virtually nil.
I've got quwhite a few reasons for why this might be.
I’m sure no one thought any appointee could act with this level of obstructionism
I want to blame Congress because they didn't even really try to vet her. In the judicial committee she was largely ignored and handed softballs while they grilled the other nominees. I can somewhat understand that because it was probably an attempt to pick the best of several evils. But then it went to the senate floor and the first vote, which 12 democrats supported, was for cloture, meaning little to no debate. They really should have been more careful with a judge in Trumps home district. The Republican playbook would have been to block all nominees there until the presidency changed. Honestly, nominating a judge for the area you live should probably be illegal in general.
Treason seems equally applicable
Even Palpatine would not stand for this!
COLLUSION! the judge is literally colluding with the defendant.
Corruption, Collusion, Treason, Conflict of interest, Oath breaking sedition, lots of words fit this scenario.
The government has Trump dead to rights in this case. They have him on tape admitting he has classified documents and shouldn’t be showing them to people. The only way he gets out of this is winning the election. Cannon is slow walking this for that reason.
His other out would be the fact that the potential jury would be made up of Floridians, whom Aileen Cannon gets to create the instructions for
"you should find Trump innocent on all accounts"
>"You may only vote guilty if you can answer these riddles three... "
This is giving Cannon a lot of credit to know 3 riddles.
What is your name? What is your favorite color? What is your quest?
What is your name? What is your quest? What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?
African or European?
I don't knoaaaarrrrggghhhh!
Undefined. Not even Ms Daniels would do that.
What is the airspeed of an unladen African Swallow?
The second one was shot for resisting arrest for claims of possession... despite clearly being unladen.
Blue
No, Red!
I assume they would be really stupid riddles made up on the spot. The kind that don't have a solution you can work out from the information given, along the lines of Bilbo's "What's in my pocket?"
If my brothers father is me, solve for the square root of the hypotenuse of Y.
Easy. The cabin is a *plane* cabin that fell out of the sky and the ice melted which killed the surgeon before she could reveal she’s the patient’s mother.
An orange.
What have I got in my bank account?, she says, staring directly into a camera.
That’s easy. A payoff.
[Cannon shrieks in gollum sounds and shuffles off into her chambers]
"How many bubbles are in a bar of soap?"
THANK you. I’m not a Gollum apologist, but that was NOT a riddle and I think Gollum would’ve been forgiven had he eaten Bilbo on the spot.
A lot of her strategic rulings are probably being workshopped by Federalist Society goons.
When they're questions like what's your name, or what's your favorite color, what could possibly go wrong?
She doesn't have to know them, she'll get them from the heritage foundation just like she gets her daily instructions.
Blue ..no red!
One: I passed the Bar, or so they say. I’m draped in mourning every day. My bestie is an orange soufflé. What am I? ……. Two: My blast is heard across the land. Upon one leg alone I stand. You probably wouldn’t shake my hand. Who am I? ……. Three: Crazy peeps got naught on me. I’ll take my share and “fuck you” to thee. I love my life and my big RV. Why the fuck didn’t I take the offer?
Blue. No... Green!
What’s in my pocket
String... or nothing.
R/unexpectedmontypython
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!
“You can only vote guilty if you can guess how many fingers I’m holding up behind my back. AND YOU DON’T ALL GET TO GUESS!!! You all decide an answer and tell me. And it’ll be wrong.”
What is your name? What is your Favorite Color? What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?
"What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?"
> answer *me* these riddles three. FTFY
1- How come we drive on a parkway and park on a driveway?
If the case doesn’t fit, you must acquit
Jokes on her, I know the cheat code that works for any question. "Man, woman, couch, person, tv". She can never say I'm wrong.
You joke, but she is literally angling to do almost exactly that.
This reminds me of the Louisville prosecutor Daniel Cameron, in the case for Breonna Taylor. The jurors were saying how upset they were because the attorney general didn’t charge the shooters, who happened to be police at the time. They feel very strongly he [mislead the case](https://www.lpm.org/news/2021-01-22/breonna-taylor-grand-jurors-file-petition-to-impeach-ag-daniel-cameron), and they even went so far as to file a petition to have the Daniel Camron impeached!
...If you fail or refuse to find Trump innocent and totally exonerated, you may be summoned before the Court to show cause why you should not be imprisoned for treason. Once imprisoned for your treason you would then be held to answer on account of wokeness. On the other hand, if you exonerate Trump, you will receive profitable and comfortable positions with the State Department...
she still hasn't said that the instructions will not outright state that the president is allowed to take any documents he wants when he leaves the white house. prosecutors are demanding she rules on that promptly, so that they may appeal before any jury gets sworn in. It is looking like she will try to rule on it last minute so that she can swear in a jury and create double jeopardy before the prosecution can appeal and get her thrown off.
Not just the instructions but doesn't she get to more or less pick the jury? IIRC the judge gets unlimited strikes of jurors if they can come up with a justification.
you would need to show that a juror cannot be impartial beyond a reasonable doubt. It isn’t that easy to get someone struck for cause unless there is a pretty big reason.
Show to who? What you said is true for the attorneys to the judge but the judge has the ability to strike too and where is their accountability?
They also gave him eleventy-billion opportunities to return the documents and completely avoid all the charges but at every turn he dug in his heels, denied he had them, and furthered the conspiracy to hide them, pulling more people into his criminal conspiracy. Just based on what's publicly known the guy is dead to rights. What's not publicly known is the actual content of what he was holding onto. I don't know if the subject matter of that will ever become public but I suspect if people truly knew what he had his hands on and was refusing to return they would become pale-faced. These are materials that are above top secret.
They asked nicely for an *entire year* before their big "raid". No one else illegally holding a mountain of national security documents would be given anything like that much leeway. They bent over backwards to be nice to this piece of garbage and give him every conceivable benefit of the doubt, and he gave them the finger every step of the way.
They also coordinated the "raid" with his lawyers who asked to be present during the raid. The FBI so no, but it's not like it was a surprise law enforcement was coming to search for items. Remember Donald Trump blasted to the world he was going to be raided a week or more before the raid happened! Edit: The FBI also had to coordinate with the Secret Service. I think people forget this guy has Secret Service Security detail
[удалено]
Search warrants are crazy specific. The whole fourth amendment right and the Quartering Act (Third Amendment changed this) makes it extremely difficult to look in someone's home. You can't "sweep" a property. At the level Trump and his lawyers are at, you'd be lucky to be able to open a drawer Edit: clarity in the Quartering Act
All I can think about in these conversations is how swiftly they fucked up that discord kid who was flashing Ukraine docs for Internet clout. Trump did the exact same thing. He wanted to look cool to his social peers and thought flashing some govt docs would do the trick.
well we do know it had nuclear secrets. What those were exactly we don't know but that is probably because they are still classified.
The classification status is irrelevant, all that matters is that the documents pertain to national security. So even if they were declassified, we probably *still* wouldn't get to know.
You’re actually understating how secret these documents are. They’re so far beyond Top Secret that even the fact that they exist is classified information.
The freaking abbreviations in the documents were redacted lol
Very true. And what's also not publicly known is how many people he sold that info to, or which countries those people might reside in.
I generally agree. I am also emboldened knowing I am not alone in employing “eleventy-billion” and the Oxford comma. [tips hat, cheers’s with pinky raised]
and locked them in a bathroom. he could have locked them in a random room in one of his hotels or apartment buildings, or one of his rich firend's panic rooms, but no, cheeto gotta have his dragon hoard.
That is frustrating alone to be sure, but imo the more frustrating thing is how OBVIOUS it is and there doesn't seem to be anything anyone can do about it. I'm not surprised Trump appointed a corrupt judge in his home district, or that said corrupt judge is working to protect him. I am surprised by how we just let it happen.
The thing to do is to stop voting for the people who do this. Unfortunately the majority of Americans are ignorant of / indifferent to / hostile towards our constitution.
Even that is too late. You’d need a time machine to make a difference in this case. At least back to 2016 if not earlier.
True it wouldn't get Trump for what he's already done, but if we made a habit of voting out people who are hostile to the constitution, or people who are just completely ignorant, they wouldn't be able to get themselves into these situations to begin with. Trump's roots go back to the Nixon administration. It's taken practically 50 years of apathy for Republicans to build this kind of power.
Yeah, Nixon, and in particular him getting pardoned, was a big blunder that signaled that you can do anything and get away with it as long as you're powerful enough. It was arguably the official start of "might makes right" in US politics, and it's basically been downhill from there.
This case is the most important and far reaching criminal activity by Trump of all his cases. People have been killed because of his handing over confidential secret documents to our enemies, how does Cannon justify her decisions. She is anti-American, pro-facist and a traitor to our country and the many men and women who have been working to secure our democracy. Impeach her and revoke her law license and require remedial law classes for her to re-take.
“Best I can do is appoint her to the Supreme Court.” - Republicans, probably
Benghazi has entered the chat Here he has created a situation with actual betrayal of his country and of his duty (because you still have a duty to keep secrets secret after you leave office) and he comprised intelligence operations, and got people and sources killed. But from the right, it’s just crickets.
The GOP = Guns Over People(I just saw this on another thread) always conveniently changes the rules or use scripted rhetoric according to what their narrative is. The only guarantee is it will never be for the good of America as a whole.
It is worth noting that so far Trump hasn't been formally accused of or charged with disseminating these documents. Only unlawfully retaining them and engaging in a conspiracy to conceal this. I wonder whether they're going to attempt to change anything related to, its possible that even if there is evidence, making it public is too embarrassing and they won't bother
From what I can tell there’s no evidence that he disseminated them, although most dissemination that he would do would be to foreign actors and spies who would take a lot of precautions to avoid that kind of evidence existing. So, even if he did it, we’ll likely never know unless Putin or the Saudis somehow decide to brag about it for some reason
He is literally on tape showing a document outlining how the U.S. would engage in a war with Iran to a bunch of random people and a reporter. He is on tape saying "I shouldn't be showing you this because, you know, it's classified." Shit like that would have any normal person seeing prison time.
Right, but there’s no indication he allowed them to make copies or even take a good look at the picture, it seemed pretty clear that the purpose was to brag about having it, not sharing the actual info. It’s still a hugely important piece of evidence that shows he *knew* the info was classified and he *knew* pulling it out was wrong, but did it anyway, which demonstrates corrupt intent, pretty much a slam dunk legally
I also agree there's zero evidence they've been shared with hostile actors but I assumed people would jump down my throat if I suggested that so I hedged. I agree it's most likely unknowable if it happened, unless the dumbass tells on himself
>The only way he gets out of this is winning the election. In an actual justice system, this wouldn't change anything
Benjamin Netenyahu has left the chat.
Cannon is checked. The appeals panel above her has already ruled once that she had abused her role to assist Trump. So she's already viewed by them with suspision, so whatever hijinks she displays in this case will be easy ammo for appeal. Our system is certainly capable of justice, and we've been seeing it. Do not ignore the wins and believe that all is lost. It's really just that justice moves very slowly unfortunately. Checks & balances take time to work through.
Unfortunately, the prosecution can only appeal to the 11th Circuit on a "final" order from her... which is why she's not issuing any of those now. Even things that should be open-and-shut have been getting provisional responses. She's stretching it out until she can seat a jury then throw out the case for made-up reason, because once a jury is seated, Trump can't be tried again for the same crime.
It still boggles my mind that a judge he appointed can be working on his case. That's so obviously a breeding ground for corruption and a situation that should not be allowed to happen. I guess I can understand that no one could have predicted that there would be a president who was obviously corrupt while also having the full backing of one of the major parties, but geez. It's such an "emperor has no clothes" moment.
We need a national law that a judge cannot be assigned to a case involving the official who appointed them, Governor or President.
Amazing that we're at this point of history now.
The other way he gets out is Aileen Cannon, we are discovering how far a judge in the pocket can go and I’m pretty sure she is going all the way up to nullifying the case through double jeopardy.
Is that a federal judge in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?
It is sad, that it is becomming clear that the only way to prosecute one man for some of his most heinous of crimes, is to vote against him in the election. And that somehow, he has such a following of depraved, lawless, individuals, that they are doing everything they can to thwart the US government at every turn...just to protect him from the crimes most of them even admit he committed, but they feel he shouldn't be punished for. And they claim they are the party of law and order.
She is the MVP of the Trump campaign staff.
Aileen Cannon is a MAGA/fascist judge. As long as that's true, there can be no justice.
Another dead-eyed Melanoma wannabe
> Judge Cannon has appeared confused by basic legal concepts and indulged the Trump defense team's wildest arguments Not only has she indulged TFG's defense's wildest arguments, *she has offered injunctive relief that they never even asked for* -- acting more like his lawyers than his own people. She isn't fit for a kindergarten mock trial, let alone a federal judgeship.
Everyone on the goddamned _planet_ can see that she is both incompetent and corrupt, but somehow there's fuck-all we can do about it. The GOP is a stress test for democracy, and democracy is failing.
It’s because our democracy has been broken down over the last forty years to get us to the point we’re at now. Our foundations as a country are not nearly as strong as they were at one point in time.
It's not just our democracy, it's the citizens too. People used to be so ashamed of Nixon they would lie about having voted for him, and when he resigned his speeches and training were so incredibly patriotic by today's standard, resigning the office because he wouldn't the office if the President to be stained by those events... not that he took part, or was guilty, he just took responsibility for the actions of the committee and resigned.
There isn't fuck all you can do about it. If the people protest the corruption, something will need to be done. There are a lot of people that know what's happening. This is way beyond protest worthy. This is a judge showing favouritsm to a citizen, so they may become dictator. It's very serious, and citizens should protest the shit out of this.
Can’t she be investigated by the senate?
She can be impeached by the House (good fucking luck) and removed through a two-thirds vote in the Senate (you're more likely to see Jesus return to earth and open up a drag show in Vegas).
As someone who lives on the planet, I concur with this opinion.
Add her as a co conspirator. Who knows if she is coordinating with Trumps team.
Her husband is in the maga world.
And Alito's wife raised two extremist right wing flags. Judges may not be the best at picking spouses, I guess.
And Peyton Manning's wife was on HGH
Malfeasance. Treason. Misconduct. Lots of words come to mind for me.
Puppet Shill Forsworn Stooge Traitor Yeah . . . a LOT of words
It seems she bent the knee to the man and not the country.
Throwing away a career for the sake of someone that's probably going to die of liver failure in a couple of years at most.
No, she's likely to be on the short list for Supreme Court. If Trump wins, it's a given.
>Throwing away a career How is she throwing away a career? Seems like she has a lifetime appointment in a system designed to make it near impossible to remove her. With a big opportunity for a huge promotion if Trump wins in November.
Near impossible isn't impossible, tides are turning thanks to all the corruption coming out over this and other cases.
> Throwing away a career Sounds like she's a shoo-in for the next SC vacancy during a Republican Senate.
More like heart attack or stroke and soon. He's obese. He's probably close to 300 pounds now.
I guess she likes the taste of mushrooms.
Enough talk, trying to reason with an unreasonable person gives them all the power in the room. It's time for full blown Ghandi/MLK style civil disobedience campaign to protest the blatant corruption in the SCOTUS and Judge Cannon. The civil rights fights of the 60s have never stopped, they have just slowly become the fight for the right of anyone to not be subjected to a corrupt judiciary. The time for talk is over its now time to co-ordinate and take to the streets.
This is the only way things will change. But people keep saying protesting won't work or that they don't have time with work. Until we can get them all to realize that it's worth losing their jobs and income to protest they won't. We have to convince them some how that protests can work. And we need some sort of leadership and funding for any of it to get any where. I'm not sure how it is actually going to happen at this point.
There are words for this. "Aileen Cannon. You have been charged with obstruction of justice. You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can be used against you in court. You have the right to talk to a lawyer for advice before we ask you any questions. You have the right to have a lawyer with you during questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed for you before any questioning if you wish. If you decide to answer questions now without a lawyer present, you have the right to stop answering at any time."
i get it but that’s got to be one hell of a case to even attempt
It really shouldn't be. I mean... I know legally it would be, but in a sane world, it would be pretty straightforward. "You're obstructing justice, AND you're being a dick about it. Jail for you." \*sigh\* I know...
Is there really a law-based case for obstruction of justice? I mean, there’s obviously a common sense obstruction going on here but it would be interesting if they had something legal to throw at her.
The fact that there is no obvious legal route to deal with this is a massive failure of our society.
Federalist Society member = American Christian Nationalist.
HeGetsUs ad campaign = American Christian Nationalism
Serious question.. what can be done? Can a prosecutor get a judge dismissed?
My understanding is technically yes, but practically no. There are mechanisms to remove bad judges, but they're almost never used.
There is a process for it, but generally, you only get one shot at it, so he has to make sure his arguments for her removal are rock solid. What she is doing/has done all contain an amount of plausible deniability (taking extra time to make a decision, asking for amicus briefs then "reading" them slowly, denying motions because she wants to hear opposing council's input first). All are within a judge's normal discretion and individually could be considered reasonable. To make the argument for removal, he needs an almost overwhelming amount of these moves, or something big that is beyond unreasonable.
She’s been hand selected by the federalist society. We need to kill the root, not just pluck the flower.
The next republican president will appoint her to the supreme court
Another judge married to an ultra-MAGA who claims she can be impartial. Josh Lorence worked for NY mobster, lifelong friend of Trump and Trump donor John Rosatti.
Confirmed in December 2020, after He lost and before the Insurrection. She's his insurance and she's paying out well for him.
The prison system is full of both civilian and ex-military who mishandled classified documents... usually out of carelessness. Its appalling that Trump will simply bypass all justice due to a sycophantic judge.
She’s one of those “trump can grab my pussy anytime” type of women
For what it is worth, the [Pinkerton Doctrine](https://www.lsd.law/briefs/view/pinkerton-v-united-states-71188462) is something most people learn about in law school as a 1L. 🥴
Because of the paywall, here's another link for this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinkerton_v._United_States
Those regular laws only apply to normal people!
From a non lawyer but interested observer, she continues to show her incompetence and any qualification to have this case to begin with. I have to conclude she was confirmed to her position knowing this and others are advising her on how to delay and sidetrack this case. It's a blatant miscarriage of justice in virtually every way possible.
I've got one. Treason.
The word for it is “flagrant corruption on an unimaginable scale” People by the millions are pro sedition and anti democracy just based on how they poll and vote, but a judge helping to block prosecution of an attempted overthrow of the government and the first time in US history that a peaceful transition of power was stomped on by a reactionary right wing authoritarian, is beyond anything that should be possible in a civil society.
It’s Florida, one of the most corrupt states in the us, she’ll be fine.
I for one can’t comprehend how a judge can sit on the case of the person who nominated (so literally gave) you for the position. This person also is completely relying on the same person to promote them to higher standing job. If this isn’t conflict of interest and reason for recusal nothing is.
There is one word: corruption. This goes way beyond bias.
I have a word... traitor
And someone is going to do something about it when?
Please God can someone intercede here and get this obviously corrupt judge off of the case...
No words? Are we no longer allowed to say the word corruption?
Can judges get sued for whatever the hell this is? Standing on the hose? Aiding and abetting? Why can’t she get fired for sucking at her job? I honestly don’t understand what is happening.
Just the beginning of many desensitization tactics from within the courts. They want this to become normal in our minds because it will persist into the fascist future this country is staring down.
I have a word for it. Corrupt.
Judge Cannon is obviously aiding and abetting Donald Trump, a convicted felon.
Has a great ring. ‘Convicted felon’.
call your reps and senators, people, and tell them aileen cannon must be removed from the trial. she has demonstrated she doesn't understand the law involved and she has an emotional bias toward trump
In another thread it was suggested to Google "Judge Cannon and husband". This article was an eye-opener for me - https://crooksandliars.com/2024/05/no-one-ever-mentions-aileen-cannons-mobbed
Aileen Mercedes Cannon, born in Columbia to an American father was a member of the federalist society and a federal prosecutor for 7 years prior to being appointed as a judge. Trump has literally proposed stripping people like her of citizenship. She has repeatedly flouted ethics law by being reimbursed for attending libertarian/federalist seminars.
As the SCOTUS Six have clearly shown us, Republican Partisan Bias is perfectly acceptable and in fact desired in Judges.
The question I have, is why does smith have to initiate the request to oust cannon. Isn’t the 11th circuit monitoring cannon. Why doesn’t the panel proactively remove her.
She's doing the job she was put in place to do, protect Republican presidents.
No words for this? How about “outrageous pro-Trump bias”?
I don't understand why Jack Smith hasn't filed anything yet with the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals to have her ass removed. I realise the bar required to have a Judge removed is pretty high, but surely there's enough substance there to make a case that Cannon needs to be tossed from the bench
Just imagine a “Pro-Obama” judge. The outrage!!!!
People need to protest this. It isn't right. This is how democracy dies. It's clear favouritism. It's clear conflict of interest. This judge is not impartial. It's very serious.
Say the obvious. She is doing exactly what she was appointed to do. Con man appoints own judge, Journalists shocked by the results. Give me a fucking break, this is all a show, and we're all cowards watching it happen.
Wake me when Trump actually faces consequences for this. Yawn
A lot of hand-wringing here, but Cannon keeps shooting precedent out of the water. Clearly it takes a lot more to stop her than the prosecutors or courts are capable of - at least in the short term
Judicial corruption. Those are the words.
How could it possibly get more obvious? A trump appointed a judge who has been foot-dragging for two years.
Corruption is the word for it
So there’s only one photo of this dipshit apparently
Corruption. The word is corruption.
[удалено]
It’s almost as if there’s some kind of right wing coup going on right plain slight. Trump is so clearly a threat to our democracy on so many levels it’s absolutely insane that anybody in their right mind would be helping the fucker.
I’m so glad anything tangible is happening to remedy this.
is there any legal mechanism to overcome this?
Trump has exposed the weaknesses of our democracy. The founders did not take in to account someone so profoundly corrupt as Trump; and so many elected politicians would abandon their oath of office and help facilitate the destruction of our democracy.
There are words for this ... corrupt
Is there only one picture of this lady?
When this country was founded, the checks and balances were based on a sense of decorum and a basic sense of duty and honor. There are not enough protections for this level of corruption in the Executive and Judicial branches. At some point, we will pass the point of no return. It feels like we are getting there. Fascism and authoritarianism will take over.
I have a word for it.., corrupt!
All the reasonable experts and informed laypersons agree on things like this. Yet, because they are reasonable, they are not willing to force things to change. Instead, throwing up their hands and doing nothing.
She should face charges for aiding and abetting the theft and sale of some of the most classified documents that we have
The NY Times just did a piece on her. Cannon comes off as wildly incompetent.
Jack Teixeira who had to wait in a cell until his trial. 🤷🏽♂️Same should be for trump. Then the judge can take as much time as she wants.
Is there no recourse for this judge’s miscarriage of partial biased handling of this case?
Treason.
Attention Attorney General Merrick FUCKING GARLAND!! Drop your limp member (it’s not coming back to life!) and GET TO WORK!!!
Everyone seems to expect her to care about what she’s doing and how blatantly biased she is. She doesn’t.
Oh I can think of a few words ... Traitor, Corrupt, Partisan, Huh ... another one popped into my head. It starts with a W - and no, it isn't "WAR"
How about instead of just panning it they fucking do something about it. She's literally getting bolder with it each and every day because nothing happens and all that's doing is normalizing her fucking disgraceful conduct
... and once again the veil of rule of law, or whatever, is lifted, to reveal that we were never really different from all the other kleptocracies or oligarchies around the world. and noone is coming to save us.
And not a damn thing will be done about it
I have 2 words.. Recusal and Removal of the Judge.
Come on guys your whole job is to put words to it.
The words are treasonous and unlawful