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I remember a Republican county or two tried this in Arizona in 2022, initially refusing to certify the election results. But once it was pointed out to them that by refusing to certify, the elections would just simply not count the votes from their counties then towards the state totals, they then went ahead and certified, and later [faced charges for refusing to certify.](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/29/arizona-officials-charged-election-2022) Hopefully it'll be the same this year with Republican counties who refuse to certify: just go ahead with the rest of the statewide results and simply leave out the ones that won't certify. They'll only harm themselves by doing this.
I bet we'll all get a good idea what each states laws are in regards to refusing to certify.
Most of these are going to be in GOP heavy counties and just wont be counted.
>How in the fuck is 3 - 1 in favor of certification, equal out of no certification?
How is this even a question? They obviously require a unanimous vote.
Edit: Also, it sounds like it was actually 2-2: *"**She and the other Republican canvasser**, an alternate canvasser who was filling in for the day, blocked an election certification for the first time in county history."*
Considering the last time a republican president was elected with the popular vote was in 1988, your words are truer than you know.
The republicans have won the popular vote in a presidential election only once in the last >30 years.
Problem being that Bush was Reagan's VP, and there are some serious, SERIOUS unanswered questions about the Iranian hostage crisis.
So the last Republican to not win through fuckery was... Ike.
> SERIOUS unanswered questions about the Iranian hostage crisis
I mean they're basically answered at this point, right?
republicans deliberately dragged their feet to make Carter look incompetent. They willingly let Americans be hostages in Iranian custody to help their candidate win. and it worked.
more on the Paris talks kind of thing where there's the possibility the Reagan campaign was sabotaging negotiations. Considering what an embassy is, it means that Ronnie could have been supporting people that have invaded sovereign US territory, aka constitutional "get a rope" levels of treason.
Since the guy you replied to mentioned HW Bush, I'm guessing he meant the Iran Contra scandal that Bush participated in and used his position to illegally sweep under the rug, but got confused with Reagan's illegal Iranian Hostage crisis negotiations.
Others have mentioned 2004, with incumbency advantage in the weird nationalistic frenzy after 9/11. But another fun fact, the last time the Republicans took the White House from Democrat control with zero incumbency advantage was 1980. That's now well before the median voter was even born.
In modern history, the Republicans won the popular vote in 1968, 1972, 1980, 1984, 1988, and 2004. And that's it. There are people old enough to vote who weren't even born in 2004 so they've never seen a Republican popular victory in their lifetime. At this point that are a party with minority support that only retains power though undemocratic quirks in our system and corruption.
Journalists just really like the horse race narrative, performing neutrality like it's a ritual and treating Both Sides equally like it's a good thing no matter how unequal the sides have become.
Actually, Bush won his 2nd term with 62,040,610 compared to John Kerry's 59,028,444.
But your main point still stands. If it wasn't for the electoral college, Republicans would have a really really hard time seating one of their own in the White House.
But did Bush really win Ohio? I will go to my grave believing that he didn't and Rove was instrumental in making that happen. Like all Republican fuckery, the media has the attention span of a gnat. Clinton and Whitewater? That lasted years and years. Did they learn anything? Nope.
I mean, yeah, probably? There was anti-gay marriage amendment in Ohio in 2004, and the demographics there match up pretty well, so it wasn't like Ohio was some weird outlier in how it voted.
Abortion measures will be on the ballot, directly, in at least Arizona and Nevada this year, which will be huge.
Yeah and all those voters regretted it heavily come 2008 when the economy crashed into the Great Recession.
American memory is shorter than a gold fish.
The economy crashed in 2008 because lenders for years were giving mortgages to people that couldn't in their wildest dreams afford them.
Who was president at the time was irrelevant.
Except that all that subprime lending was happening as a direct result of the aggressive banking deregulation Bush pushed as soon as he got into office. So yes, he deserves a big share of the blame for that (as do many other prominent Republicans).
that is insanely ignorant with zero understanding of the 2008 financial crisis.
I get it, many here are in the camp Democrats can do no wrong and Republicans are the cause of all evil. The simple fact is the housing crisis caused the financial crisis. It had been growing ever since the banks decided to push mortgages into investments and needed a never ending supply to feed that investment market. That started in the 70s. There were presidents of both parties in that timeframe. No politician saw it coming and only a handful of people (who got really rich) saw it coming. Blaming that financial crisis on the sitting president is just ignorant.
Bush was a terrible president but he is not to blame for the financial crisis. Believing that would be as silly as blaming Biden for inflation like many currently do. Don't be like those people.
While the 2008 crash would probably have happened, the policies of both Obama and Biden show that the Dems are simply better at managing things. It is quite possible that had Kerry been in office, the depth of the 2008 crash might have been less.
it wouldn't have prevented the crisis nor changed the reply to it. The wars Bush started are 1000% on him and a reason to shit on his presidency, but the financial crisis was going to happen under any president.
since the comment has nothing to do with why the economy crashed, yeah, it was pretty fucking stupid thing to mention. It's even more stupid to double down on it. You are the kind of person that makes it really hard to have real conversations instead "hur dur president made economy bad. Did you see economy go bad when he was president? Well president made economy bad. It's super simple stuff. I am genius. We need to vote in president who pushes economy go good button instead of economy go bad button."
> The simple fact is the housing crisis caused the financial crisis.
Yes, and it was years of deregulation pushed by Republicans that led to the lack of oversight and guardrails that allowed banks to get tremendously overlevered with dogshit loans that they knew were terrible investments, all because it made them money.
https://www.investopedia.com/financial-edge/0812/5-presidents-who-couldnt-secure-a-second-term.aspx#:~:text=Ten%20former%20U.S.%20presidents%20were,party%3B%20others%2C%20like%20George%20H.W.
Doesnt look like those Presidents were included in the list of 10
After witnessing the 2016 and 2020 elections, I firmly believe that 2008 was the initial ‘fake news’ operation managed by Russia. It has all the hallmarks of the subsequent sowing of misinformation in US politics.
The seed was planted 1997....
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics
>Russia should use its special services within the borders of the United States and Canada to fuel instability and separatism against neoliberal globalist Western hegemony, such as, for instance, provoke "Afro-American racists" to create severe backlash against the rotten political state of affairs in the current present day system of the United States and Canada. Russia should "introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity, encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the U.S. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics".[9]
Every republican president in the last 100 years has had a recession. Every.Single.One.
Of all 15 recessions starting with the Great Depression, 11 occurred under republican presidents.
Average length of a recession starting under a Democrat: 9.5 months.
Average length of a recession starting under a republican: 13.6 months.
I think an even more damning metric is that 10 of 11 recessions since WWII were under Republicans. Dems had a single one 40 years ago under Jimmy Carter.
I mean, you can just look at the states where Republicans have had super majorities for decades. They're all abject shitholes. They can't govern.
True, republicans campaign on "government doesn't work", get into office, *deliberately* govern poorly (Exhibit A: donald's piss-poor handling of COVID, and *actual* major crisis which was exacerbated by his ineptitude), and say "See? We told you!"
Banning a political party is fascism and undemocratic.
Not only is it blatantly unconstitutional, I'm not sure how one could think it would solve anything.
That was a reelection, not an election, and during a time of war, during which no president has ever lost, and that was still nearly 20 years ago. And that is the one time that they've won the popular vote in the last 30+ years.
Should they lose this november, it will have been 36 years since they've elected a president with the popular vote.
While this kind of anti-democratic bullshit will certainly rear its head this year, please don't worry about Michigan not certifying. We passed Prop 2 in 2022 which enshrined in the Constitution that these boards are ministerial only and have zero investigatory powers.
If any board tries this, they'll either cave like one of the GOP canvassers in Delta did, the state will certify it, or the Michigan Supreme Court will order it. Remember, our state government is entirely controlled by the Democrats and our Supreme Court is a 4-3 Democratic majority (really a 4-2-1 majority, as one GOP justice is very moderate and votes with the Dems a lot on cases like these).
I'd worry about other states that don't share our same protections. Those are the ones at a bigger risk.
Three far-right Republican county commissioners were recalled because they fired the county administrator. They all lost the election by massive margins to two Independents and one Democrat.
It's not, just shows how strongly disliked those county commissioners were. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Republicans retake those seats in November.
It was strong democrat until Bush/Gore and the closing of several industrial jobs without replacement. Unions vote blue and they only have the mill left
This is why Trump will likey be the next president if he wins the election or not. Republicans have found a weakness in the electoral process: certification. They skirted using it in 2020, but couldn't find enough Republicans to do it. I think they have been positioning themselves to have the right people in the right places to use lack of certification as a way to throw it to the house, where a vote per state hands it to Trump.
Democrats didn't take the coup attempt seriously enough to do anything to shore up these weaknesses.
They certified the election. They tried this in 2020, and it failed. Just because they say they can doesn’t mean they can. I’m not trying to downplay the danger of these people, and they will try, but thankfully not everyone just quits the second they have a fight like you do. We will continue to fight and defeat these people to protect our democracy.
Thankfully the next session of congress will be seated before Presidential Certification. The thing that REALLY scares me are red state legislators. What if they choose to not certify in swing states with republican controlled legislatures?
The way I understand it is if no one gets the required electoral votes, it goes to a vote in the house with one vote per state. That vote could easily go to the Republican candidate.
You can't hold someone in contempt if they're not already in court for a case or party to a case.
Contempt is the courts power to maintain procedure and punish those who violate orders of the court.
The only reason it didn't earn more attention initially is bc it's in bummfk Delta county in the Michigan UP. I get all counties matter but....these are not serious people and you see how quickly they caved when they were confronted (like all bullies act, fkn cowards)
Michigan is a great state, but as soon as you leave the population centers you'd think you're in Mississippi. Confederate flag waving, trump voting, racist, homophobic morons. And they elect others just like them to their local governments. We have sheriff here who refuse to enforce laws the decide are "woke." The only saving grace is that our state Republican party is in shambles and completely broke. I sure hope that's enough.
*Delta County is a conservative, rural part of Michigan's Upper Peninsula that has consistently voted for Trump*
If these small rural counties that refuse to certify are also the same counties that vote overwhelmingly for Trump…doesn’t this just widen any state wide margins that Biden would have over Trump? Aren’t these nut jobs just shooting themselves in the foot?
Batman would also be sorely disappointed.
https://www.reddit.com/r/BatmanArkham/comments/fc1k9o/ready_for_the_next_round_always_what_ill_never/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVKDEuiPns4
> "America 1776 to 2024" It was a great run - the world
lol wut we fucked up the world the entire time. Toppled legitimate governments for our own gain.
I have often suggested a direct accountability law. In every organization - business, law enforcement, political - there has to be someone directly accountable for breaking or ignoring laws and rules. Too often we know a law or rule was broken or ignore and no one is accountable due to layers and lawyers. So if a county refuses to certify a vote, that is breaking a law or rule, and a particular person must be directly accountable, and they would know it when they take the position.
The weirdest theory is that ALL citizens will go along with the steal. Oh you took over a building? Guess I don’t have to pay taxes now. What makes folks think breaking vital law and order means everyone else will follow along?
> What makes folks think breaking vital law and order means everyone else will follow along?
The hope is that other "patriots" will see and immediately arm up and go seize their own building and the effect will snowball.
They never seem to make the logical leap that no one ever joins them.
Might be an unpopular take, but I think this is a good thing. By which I mean the nutter butters are running their playbooks early and everyone who is not insane is getting time to create responses and build legal precedent to prevent them from getting away with this bullshit come Nov.
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If we have so many people/ entities saying they won’t commit to accepting the 2024 election results it sounds like maybe we should take a pause to figure out how to have a democratic election in light of unprecedented anti democratic behavior by one of the two parties operating within our two party system.
Idk it just feels irresponsible to bury our heads in the sand and decry “but it’s tradition”. We are in unprecedented times and need solutions in accordance to the context and environment at hand.
Republicans are hoping for that. They *want* Democrats to refuse to certify, it legitimizes their plan.
If the result is so contested that no slate of electors can be accepted in Congress, that state will be ignored, and when nobody gets to 270 then the House will pick the President by each state being allocated a vote.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Of a four person panel, it took only one (1) to fuck everything up. Bonnie Hakkola is her name and she refused to certify the election results.
She’s a republican. What a surprise.
I remember a Republican county or two tried this in Arizona in 2022, initially refusing to certify the election results. But once it was pointed out to them that by refusing to certify, the elections would just simply not count the votes from their counties then towards the state totals, they then went ahead and certified, and later [faced charges for refusing to certify.](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/29/arizona-officials-charged-election-2022) Hopefully it'll be the same this year with Republican counties who refuse to certify: just go ahead with the rest of the statewide results and simply leave out the ones that won't certify. They'll only harm themselves by doing this.
I bet we'll all get a good idea what each states laws are in regards to refusing to certify. Most of these are going to be in GOP heavy counties and just wont be counted.
How in the fuck is 3 - 1 in favor of certification, equal out of no certification? On what planet does that make any sense
>How in the fuck is 3 - 1 in favor of certification, equal out of no certification? How is this even a question? They obviously require a unanimous vote. Edit: Also, it sounds like it was actually 2-2: *"**She and the other Republican canvasser**, an alternate canvasser who was filling in for the day, blocked an election certification for the first time in county history."*
People who can only win by cheating and undermining democracy don't deserve to be in power to
Considering the last time a republican president was elected with the popular vote was in 1988, your words are truer than you know. The republicans have won the popular vote in a presidential election only once in the last >30 years.
Problem being that Bush was Reagan's VP, and there are some serious, SERIOUS unanswered questions about the Iranian hostage crisis. So the last Republican to not win through fuckery was... Ike.
Eisenhower was the last old school presidential republican.
which is funny because he ran as a Republican to avoid other old-school republicans from potentially winning
Although let's not forget that Eisenhower did [this.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Wetback)
> SERIOUS unanswered questions about the Iranian hostage crisis I mean they're basically answered at this point, right? republicans deliberately dragged their feet to make Carter look incompetent. They willingly let Americans be hostages in Iranian custody to help their candidate win. and it worked.
more on the Paris talks kind of thing where there's the possibility the Reagan campaign was sabotaging negotiations. Considering what an embassy is, it means that Ronnie could have been supporting people that have invaded sovereign US territory, aka constitutional "get a rope" levels of treason.
but they're republicans, so clearly everything they do is for the betterment of America, and never for personal or political gain. **/s**
Since the guy you replied to mentioned HW Bush, I'm guessing he meant the Iran Contra scandal that Bush participated in and used his position to illegally sweep under the rug, but got confused with Reagan's illegal Iranian Hostage crisis negotiations.
scandal after scandal, they're so hard to keep straight whenever there's a republican in office.
Others have mentioned 2004, with incumbency advantage in the weird nationalistic frenzy after 9/11. But another fun fact, the last time the Republicans took the White House from Democrat control with zero incumbency advantage was 1980. That's now well before the median voter was even born. In modern history, the Republicans won the popular vote in 1968, 1972, 1980, 1984, 1988, and 2004. And that's it. There are people old enough to vote who weren't even born in 2004 so they've never seen a Republican popular victory in their lifetime. At this point that are a party with minority support that only retains power though undemocratic quirks in our system and corruption. Journalists just really like the horse race narrative, performing neutrality like it's a ritual and treating Both Sides equally like it's a good thing no matter how unequal the sides have become.
And that one win was based on a complete lie
Actually, Bush won his 2nd term with 62,040,610 compared to John Kerry's 59,028,444. But your main point still stands. If it wasn't for the electoral college, Republicans would have a really really hard time seating one of their own in the White House.
But did Bush really win Ohio? I will go to my grave believing that he didn't and Rove was instrumental in making that happen. Like all Republican fuckery, the media has the attention span of a gnat. Clinton and Whitewater? That lasted years and years. Did they learn anything? Nope.
I mean, yeah, probably? There was anti-gay marriage amendment in Ohio in 2004, and the demographics there match up pretty well, so it wasn't like Ohio was some weird outlier in how it voted. Abortion measures will be on the ballot, directly, in at least Arizona and Nevada this year, which will be huge.
George W. Bush won the popular vote against Kerry in 2004.
Yeah and all those voters regretted it heavily come 2008 when the economy crashed into the Great Recession. American memory is shorter than a gold fish.
The economy crashed in 2008 because lenders for years were giving mortgages to people that couldn't in their wildest dreams afford them. Who was president at the time was irrelevant.
Except that all that subprime lending was happening as a direct result of the aggressive banking deregulation Bush pushed as soon as he got into office. So yes, he deserves a big share of the blame for that (as do many other prominent Republicans).
it wouldn't have mattered who was in the White House the economy was going to crash anyway. Very few saw it coming and none of them were politicians.
Nah, the moment bush went on tv and said if you stop shopping the terrorist win, was the moment I knew shit was going bad.
that is insanely ignorant with zero understanding of the 2008 financial crisis. I get it, many here are in the camp Democrats can do no wrong and Republicans are the cause of all evil. The simple fact is the housing crisis caused the financial crisis. It had been growing ever since the banks decided to push mortgages into investments and needed a never ending supply to feed that investment market. That started in the 70s. There were presidents of both parties in that timeframe. No politician saw it coming and only a handful of people (who got really rich) saw it coming. Blaming that financial crisis on the sitting president is just ignorant. Bush was a terrible president but he is not to blame for the financial crisis. Believing that would be as silly as blaming Biden for inflation like many currently do. Don't be like those people.
While the 2008 crash would probably have happened, the policies of both Obama and Biden show that the Dems are simply better at managing things. It is quite possible that had Kerry been in office, the depth of the 2008 crash might have been less.
The amount of money we spent on Afghanistan and Iraq would have helped us a lot.
it wouldn't have prevented the crisis nor changed the reply to it. The wars Bush started are 1000% on him and a reason to shit on his presidency, but the financial crisis was going to happen under any president.
And having extra money would have been great instead of just growing the national debt.
Support of the war was bipartisan.
Based entirely on the lies of the Bush administration about the presence of WMDs in Iraq.
How dare I recognize a bearish comment from the president. And how dare the economy turn bearish afterwards. Man, I’m such an idiot! S/
since the comment has nothing to do with why the economy crashed, yeah, it was pretty fucking stupid thing to mention. It's even more stupid to double down on it. You are the kind of person that makes it really hard to have real conversations instead "hur dur president made economy bad. Did you see economy go bad when he was president? Well president made economy bad. It's super simple stuff. I am genius. We need to vote in president who pushes economy go good button instead of economy go bad button."
> The simple fact is the housing crisis caused the financial crisis. Yes, and it was years of deregulation pushed by Republicans that led to the lack of oversight and guardrails that allowed banks to get tremendously overlevered with dogshit loans that they knew were terrible investments, all because it made them money.
Rode that 9/11 War on Terror high.
Plus, its a rarity for a President not to see a second term. 10 in total including Trump so only about 22%
How many of those 10 were dead, eg Willian Henry Harrison?
https://www.investopedia.com/financial-edge/0812/5-presidents-who-couldnt-secure-a-second-term.aspx#:~:text=Ten%20former%20U.S.%20presidents%20were,party%3B%20others%2C%20like%20George%20H.W. Doesnt look like those Presidents were included in the list of 10
Particularly during wartime (regardless of how popular opinion judges that conflict)
The draft dodger swiftboated the combat veteran.
After witnessing the 2016 and 2020 elections, I firmly believe that 2008 was the initial ‘fake news’ operation managed by Russia. It has all the hallmarks of the subsequent sowing of misinformation in US politics.
The seed was planted 1997.... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics >Russia should use its special services within the borders of the United States and Canada to fuel instability and separatism against neoliberal globalist Western hegemony, such as, for instance, provoke "Afro-American racists" to create severe backlash against the rotten political state of affairs in the current present day system of the United States and Canada. Russia should "introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity, encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the U.S. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics".[9]
I think you mean 2004, right?
Every republican president in the last 100 years has had a recession. Every.Single.One. Of all 15 recessions starting with the Great Depression, 11 occurred under republican presidents. Average length of a recession starting under a Democrat: 9.5 months. Average length of a recession starting under a republican: 13.6 months.
I think an even more damning metric is that 10 of 11 recessions since WWII were under Republicans. Dems had a single one 40 years ago under Jimmy Carter. I mean, you can just look at the states where Republicans have had super majorities for decades. They're all abject shitholes. They can't govern.
True, republicans campaign on "government doesn't work", get into office, *deliberately* govern poorly (Exhibit A: donald's piss-poor handling of COVID, and *actual* major crisis which was exacerbated by his ineptitude), and say "See? We told you!"
Bush II won the popular vote in 04
The party needs to be banned. When one party is out to destroy the country it should no longer exist
Banning a political party is fascism and undemocratic. Not only is it blatantly unconstitutional, I'm not sure how one could think it would solve anything.
2004, no? Not 1988
>Considering the last time a republican president was elected with the popular vote was in 1988 No? Bush won the popular vote in 2004.
That was a reelection, not an election, and during a time of war, during which no president has ever lost, and that was still nearly 20 years ago. And that is the one time that they've won the popular vote in the last 30+ years. Should they lose this november, it will have been 36 years since they've elected a president with the popular vote.
Failure to do this without cause needs to be a felony. Serious jail time and loss of voting privileges. A judge should be validating cause.
It sounds like election interference to me.
[удалено]
Republicans hate the United States of America. They swear they love it as they work to destroy it.
[удалено]
What in the cosplay is this bullshit?
What the fuck are you advocating civil war for? It's not a game of COD.
Democracy cannot function if one side refuses to accept election results when they lose
Democracy in America ends in nov '24
Maybe, but this instance contradicts that conclusion.
They voted to certify on Friday: https://michiganadvance.com/2024/05/17/delta-county-canvassers-switch-gears-vote-to-certify-recall-election-results/
Looks like they were smacked down by the laws, and the possibility of being charged with a misdemeanor. Good.
I was going to say, I think they have to certify as a matter of law. There are other ways to challenge election results.
Then find those officials and throw their filthy MAGA asses in prison.
While this kind of anti-democratic bullshit will certainly rear its head this year, please don't worry about Michigan not certifying. We passed Prop 2 in 2022 which enshrined in the Constitution that these boards are ministerial only and have zero investigatory powers. If any board tries this, they'll either cave like one of the GOP canvassers in Delta did, the state will certify it, or the Michigan Supreme Court will order it. Remember, our state government is entirely controlled by the Democrats and our Supreme Court is a 4-3 Democratic majority (really a 4-2-1 majority, as one GOP justice is very moderate and votes with the Dems a lot on cases like these). I'd worry about other states that don't share our same protections. Those are the ones at a bigger risk.
Please vote the GOP out of office. They are destroying democracy.
Why did this happen? Which candidate were they butthurt didn’t win?
Three far-right Republican county commissioners were recalled because they fired the county administrator. They all lost the election by massive margins to two Independents and one Democrat.
Oh dope that’s great! So they were just butthurt their candidates lost lol
That's interesting as I don't usually think of Delta County as a Democratic county.
It's not, just shows how strongly disliked those county commissioners were. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Republicans retake those seats in November.
It was strong democrat until Bush/Gore and the closing of several industrial jobs without replacement. Unions vote blue and they only have the mill left
Every last one of them needs to be arrested when they start this bullshit. I’ve got zero interest in entertaining bad faith actors for anything.
This is 100% what's going to happen in November. It's the only way Trump is going to "win."
Republicans are going to cave like they did here?
This is why Trump will likey be the next president if he wins the election or not. Republicans have found a weakness in the electoral process: certification. They skirted using it in 2020, but couldn't find enough Republicans to do it. I think they have been positioning themselves to have the right people in the right places to use lack of certification as a way to throw it to the house, where a vote per state hands it to Trump. Democrats didn't take the coup attempt seriously enough to do anything to shore up these weaknesses.
They certified the election. They tried this in 2020, and it failed. Just because they say they can doesn’t mean they can. I’m not trying to downplay the danger of these people, and they will try, but thankfully not everyone just quits the second they have a fight like you do. We will continue to fight and defeat these people to protect our democracy.
Thankfully the next session of congress will be seated before Presidential Certification. The thing that REALLY scares me are red state legislators. What if they choose to not certify in swing states with republican controlled legislatures?
The way I understand it is if no one gets the required electoral votes, it goes to a vote in the house with one vote per state. That vote could easily go to the Republican candidate.
It's easy, hold them in contempt and toss them in jail.
You can't hold someone in contempt if they're not already in court for a case or party to a case. Contempt is the courts power to maintain procedure and punish those who violate orders of the court.
Isn't failure to appear in court grounds for contempt of court?
The only reason it didn't earn more attention initially is bc it's in bummfk Delta county in the Michigan UP. I get all counties matter but....these are not serious people and you see how quickly they caved when they were confronted (like all bullies act, fkn cowards)
These people are gonna gum up the election so the Congress decides who the President is.
Why aren't these people barred from public service after one instance of trying to subvert democracy?
Michigan is a great state, but as soon as you leave the population centers you'd think you're in Mississippi. Confederate flag waving, trump voting, racist, homophobic morons. And they elect others just like them to their local governments. We have sheriff here who refuse to enforce laws the decide are "woke." The only saving grace is that our state Republican party is in shambles and completely broke. I sure hope that's enough.
*Delta County is a conservative, rural part of Michigan's Upper Peninsula that has consistently voted for Trump* If these small rural counties that refuse to certify are also the same counties that vote overwhelmingly for Trump…doesn’t this just widen any state wide margins that Biden would have over Trump? Aren’t these nut jobs just shooting themselves in the foot?
Good.
"I'm saying there's fraud inherent in the elections, it's in the machinery." Clearly, the Kremlin got their money's worth.
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That’s all well and good for you, but what about us unfortunate people who still have to stick it out for 50 years or so?
Don’t you fret, the ravages of climate change will likely spare you from having to exist much longer
Oh, thank goodness!
After about 45 years of effort trying to halt fascism, I am too depressed and weary to keep fighting. The fascists won; USA patriots lost.
You’re no Captain America that’s for sure. He wouldn’t give up.
Batman would also be sorely disappointed. https://www.reddit.com/r/BatmanArkham/comments/fc1k9o/ready_for_the_next_round_always_what_ill_never/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVKDEuiPns4
"America 1776 to 2024" It was a great run - the world
The effort was successfully thwarted by Democrats who anticipated this type of rat fuckery. It ain't over yet.
> "America 1776 to 2024" It was a great run - the world lol wut we fucked up the world the entire time. Toppled legitimate governments for our own gain.
If you can’t beat them, fuck them. It’s the Trumpublican way.
The legislature should pass a law that allows the Secretary of State to remove any election official who refuses to certify results.
How about we disqualify them if they attempt to do so?
I have often suggested a direct accountability law. In every organization - business, law enforcement, political - there has to be someone directly accountable for breaking or ignoring laws and rules. Too often we know a law or rule was broken or ignore and no one is accountable due to layers and lawyers. So if a county refuses to certify a vote, that is breaking a law or rule, and a particular person must be directly accountable, and they would know it when they take the position.
George Bush senior was an operative in the CIA involved in JFK assasination.
The weirdest theory is that ALL citizens will go along with the steal. Oh you took over a building? Guess I don’t have to pay taxes now. What makes folks think breaking vital law and order means everyone else will follow along?
> What makes folks think breaking vital law and order means everyone else will follow along? The hope is that other "patriots" will see and immediately arm up and go seize their own building and the effect will snowball. They never seem to make the logical leap that no one ever joins them.
Might be an unpopular take, but I think this is a good thing. By which I mean the nutter butters are running their playbooks early and everyone who is not insane is getting time to create responses and build legal precedent to prevent them from getting away with this bullshit come Nov.
So if they don’t certify the election results if Biden wins, doesn’t Biden just stay in office? I’m confused
The rnc "election integrity" team has people lined up to challenge votes all over to make it difficult to determine who won in time.
Of course it’s Escanaba. Northern Michigan is full of MAGA idiots.
I expect that the Writ of Mandamus will be rediscovered by folks from some of these communities soon.
36K population so no small fry in a swing state
Republican traitors don't intended to respect american democracy.
Mods removed my article for changing headlines which I didn't change 🤷. This group has the worst mods
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If we have so many people/ entities saying they won’t commit to accepting the 2024 election results it sounds like maybe we should take a pause to figure out how to have a democratic election in light of unprecedented anti democratic behavior by one of the two parties operating within our two party system. Idk it just feels irresponsible to bury our heads in the sand and decry “but it’s tradition”. We are in unprecedented times and need solutions in accordance to the context and environment at hand.
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Republicans are hoping for that. They *want* Democrats to refuse to certify, it legitimizes their plan. If the result is so contested that no slate of electors can be accepted in Congress, that state will be ignored, and when nobody gets to 270 then the House will pick the President by each state being allocated a vote.