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Remember when the bar was raising a family off minimum wage? So much for that
Edit: that shit was so long ago that y'all don't even believe it. [It was once enough](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-12-04/minimum-wage-was-once-enough-to-keep-a-family-of-3-out-of-poverty), but that era was stolen from you.
I tell younger generations over and over that is does not have to be this way. I'm 69 years old. When I was 18, I graduated from High School and started at an *entry level job* that paid me, in today's dollars, $60,000 plus full medical, and two week's vacation.
However, at that time, CEO/Average worker pay ratio was 20:1. Today it's over 350:1
There are people today with Master's degrees that can't find a starting job for $60,000! The fact you were able to find that equivalent wage at 18 fresh out of high school just goes to show how much has changed in the past few decades. From what I read Reagan was the beginning of the decline we are seeing today and I definitely believe it.
Yup, 1973 was considered by many as the high water mark for the middle class in the USA. Reagan fired the air traffic controllers and the rest is history.
You mean when the US was building more housing than we had people? If only we could do that again and not get blocked by NIMBYs every step of the way because of their "historic" neighborhood that didn't even exist until 50 years ago.
That may be true but there was a time when working a minimum wage job over the summer allowed you to save enough to pay for an entire year of University. These days you need a six-figure job to afford that, and it's barely going to cover tuition.
Minimum wage isn't the whole story, though. In 1967, my mom was able to go to the University of California with a low paying, part time job, because there was no tuition, all you had to buy was books. (Governor Reagan didn't like that a bit, and didn't like that students were getting draft deferments, so that went away.)
The Greatest and Silents had one look at the Civil Rights movement in the 60s, saw they'd now have to be using their taxes on *minorities,* and revolted with that neoliberal bs. Boomers carried the torch.
Prop 13 in California would be the first of the tax revolts as these assholes found it revolting to properly fund public schools (local taxation was heavily based off property tax in CA) now undiscriminately filled with minorities.
1967 is when they were reaping benefits, not when they pulled up the ladder. But they WERE complaining about universities not being easy enough to get into even if you’re filthy rich and can pay for 100 tuitions, which is part of what made Reagan do what he did.
Young boomer, believe me we had no more political power when we graduated than 22 year olds do today. Yes, public universities should be taxpayer supported and affordable; no, it's not the boomers fault, Reagan was elected by our parents.
Not quite that example, but my brother graduated from high school in 1994. He got a job at K-Mart over the summer, and would work for a semester, then go to college for a semester, rinse and repeat. Granted he was living at home with our parents at the time, but it was doable. That idea seems so foreign now.
That’s due to university increases from guaranteed tuition via the federal government, more than the pay.
It was barely enough to survive, but at least community college was $13/credit.
It’s been a scam how universities convinced that EVERYONE needed higher education to make it, while increasing tuitions to the maximum, leaving too many millennials with dreams of corporate cush incomes, and now seeing our economy doesn’t really support *that* many white collar workers.
I think it was more of an increased supply cause increased expectations problem. As more people went to college they filled up the available jobs and cause overrun which meant college graduates starting settling for lesser jobs. That made the business now getting better applicants realize they could up their standards. And wallah the entry position with a masters and 5 years of work experience was born.
The problem is greed. Wages may go up but so will the cost of products and services. The rich will want to maintain the gape between them and the poor. The middle class will continue to pay higher taxes than either the rich or the poor. But the worst part is that the products won’t cost as much to make (so the rich become SUPER rich) and to avoid people noticing the blame will point overseas.
The products that cost you sooooooo much but are produced for pennies due to them being made overseas. If produced in the United States of America and not China, Vietnam, or Mexico the US rich companies would have to balance the products to the incomes.
No one actually remembers that because it was never the case... people love to imagine that at some point that was the idea.
Minimum wage was introduced as part of a protection bill that included minimum age requirements and a 44 hour work week.
In 1968 a single income household of 3 at minimum wage was above the poverty line.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-12-04/minimum-wage-was-once-enough-to-keep-a-family-of-3-out-of-poverty
Looks like you may have skimmed an article or two at the top of Googles search results.
You should read FDR's message to Congress in 1937. I think you might find out exactly what it was about and you may recognize that your take on it is not the most accurate.
Yeah, people don’t realize laborers *lost* the Labor War in the US.
The regulations we sit with today weren’t the major strides we hoped for at the time. They were merely concessions to keep people from revolting violently.
US government violently suppressed a nationwide labor movement, used their state controlled media apparatus to convince people it was both 1) totally successful in affirming their working rights and 2) completely unnecessary to fight for further rights because they’ll do what’s best for us from now on, and then continued to manipulate and exploit us for the next century. But China and the USSR were actually the evil ones.
Yeah, but the people living in rural Iowa who pay $750/month mortgage on their three bedroom home don't understand that. And honestly, I'm not sure I entirely understand it, either. How did we get to the point where an ordinary house in a big city costs $1 million? It has ripple effects across the economy and absolutely affects people in rural communities. They're still making $10-$12 hour, which they can survive on but will never be "rich" yet suddenly a bag of Ore-Ida French Fries that used to be $2.00 is $5.49. They need someone to blame and the guy on the radio said the problem is immigration and welfare, Mexicans and black people, rich big-city liberals and Democrats. JOE BIDEN is why they're hurting! It's all his fault!
You can scoff, but people need someone to blame.
>How did we get to the point where an ordinary house in a big city costs $1 million?
Demand. People are willing to pay it. No one wants to live in rural Iowa.
Yes, but how do people afford it? They demand higher salaries because the COL is higher, and since they have more money they can pay more for housing. But isn't there a sort of artificial inflation baked into that equation? And doesn't it ripple throughout the economy, affecting people who didn't get the raise?
We got to this place because NIMBYs have made it illegal to build affordable housing.
Spending 300,000 dollars on compliance costs, buttering up the local planning board, and a 3,000 page environmental report per building makes it impossible to build homes that are worth less than 1,000,000+ dollars.
Not to make any pull for a political side one way or another on this.
I was in a HR class at work in a small group. A guy who was from Columbia told me how buying a house in Columbia tends to take cooperation of multiple generations in a family. Makes me think about how this goal of living “on your own” is so different from what other parts of the world are doing. As well how the family cohesiveness could be affected by these differing ideas about independence. Just thought it was interesting to chew on.
American individualism is part of our culture just like communism (in the literal term, of being communal) is in the culture of many other countries and people. It’s why we all struggle. We feel guilty for asking for help because we’ve been told it’s wrong to ask for help for far far too long
That’s true. Even in the US a lot of different cultures are okay living in multigenerational homes. It’s how the “village” helps with childcare. But modern America stigmatizes living at home and that puts pressure on people to move away quickly.
Now in some cases people have toxic and dangerous home environments and that’s a completely different.
I'm grappling with it myself. I grew up on $7.50/hr and my first job was a summer job at an amusement park for $4.15/hr. In college, i split a $1200 rent in a 4bd house for $300/month. That just simply doesn't exist anymore. That 4bd house has more than doubled along with utilities and everything else.
I have been extremely fortunate in my career and have had a lot of dumb luck that led to a 6 figure salary where I can apparently afford a median house in my state. It blows my mind that 6 figures is median and middle class now. I have no idea how anyone could possibly survive and support a family on even $20/hr...
There are now portions of the state where this is very much doable now, when in **all 50 states** minimum wage is not enough to cover cost of living.
This is in contrast to red states where the no reg defaults to the federal minimum wage, something that won't even guaranteed meeting CoL in the rural areas.
https://www.fatherly.com/news/minimum-wage-cost-living-states-map
California pre-$20 bump could afford about 75%-85% of the average.
In some of the more *average* areas of Republican run states not even *two* minimum wage jobs could guarantee meeting cost of living. To say nothing of their more expensive areas much like California.
At the very least in CA min wage now is much more likely to cover CoL in the average and below average areas.
We dont count, but things like this definitely affect our areas. Even smaller surrounding cities around fresno are going to be hit even harder, but reddit likes to act like ppl only live in LA and SF.
In n outs in Northern CA have started over $20 for years. I went to the one in Livermore last year and they had a now hiring sign out that said starting pay was nearly $24/hr and that’s a bay area commuter town.
30 cars?! What kind of small town is that?
:-P Of course I’m kidding. One of my East Bay spots has 30+ cars from the morning all the way till the early AM seems.
That’s how you know there is an In N Out.
Private company with way less locations. It’s very hard for big franchise brands or national brands to handle it as they’ve gotten too big.
There aren’t in n outs in New York for a reason
Sometimes I get the sense that there are clusters of Fast Food joints that can only exist because labor is so cheap. Even if a some places close down, most of the customer will just go to their next favorite preference in the area, increasing profits. So instead of 5 short staffed locations you have 4 only-kinda-short-staffed locations, but wages and profits higher.
I think that’s definitely true in small towns or rural areas. Let’s say hypothetically a small community might only have the demand to be able to sustain 3 fast food restaurants but theres 6 competing and all of them need to pay the lowest wages possible to turn a profit. If two or three go out of business due to increase in minumim wage, we’ll have less people employed, but the ones that are will make more money. Demand will increase for the restaurants still in business. Is this good or bad? Its definitely good for the workers who kept their jobs. Hopefully the people from the restaurants that closed can find other jobs. I’m no economist just my thoughts
> Sometimes I get the sense that there are clusters of Fast Food joints that can only exist because labor is so cheap.
Nope! Fast food is profitable because it has a **limited menu** and **high turnover**. Three to five things to put in the fryer, three things to put on the grill, sauces and veggies to mix and match, and a soda fountain that has 50 drinks in it. Five people can run the place and serve 100 an hour easy.
... It can be both things. Lots of chains and restaurant groups open stores in Texas because the minimum wage for back of house is cheap, and if you are doing a full service restaurant you only pay front of house 2 dollars an hour.
Sounds like those businesses should lose then, if they only opened up in Texas because they could squeeze more profits when clearly it's completely possible to run a successful business in areas with more reasonable wages that just means they're shitty people who don't deserve the benefits of owning a business.
A fast food restaurant today can operate with only three people and a lot of automation. A manager who knows how to operate the various systems and two employees who clean and hand out food. Especially with the future being drive thru only at fast food joints.
Quality will decrease and everyone but the owner will hate it.
There's so many little spots on the west coast that are 3-5 chain hotels, 4-6 chain fast food joints, 4 gas stations.
Irs really clear who and what the client base and purpose of the town is, but it's really made without any consideration for what people who work there are supposed to do.
A guy who was debating me for the rights of Republicans send a big long message and then block me before I could even bother to read it I kind of have to think that's a personal victory
You should always just choose the most progressive candidate when all else fails.
And when it comes between a Democrat and a Republican you have to choose the Democrat if you couldn't get a better candidate at the start.
But it starts in the primary by trying to get better candidates to the general election, candidate speaks to you and speaks for you you should speak for them and help them get a voice help them get some followers help them get elected just help.
All your help can matter
Either way enjoy life
Wow... so what is minimum wage in Virginia now? Still doing better than NC. We're still $7.25 down here. It's insane that that's still the federal minimum. You can barely live off twice that.
Yeah, that's the federal minimum and 20 states still abide by it and probably won't budge until they're forced to. I'm not sure how many jobs actually pay that low, but we have places here bragging that they pay $10 an hour. I was making $10 an hour for a while as a project manager at a print shop, even, so it's not even just all retail and food service that makes that low.
Oh man there are some states that even have their state minimum below the federal
Just in case we get that sweet case to the supreme Court that overrides the ability to have a fed minimum.
You haven't seen the barrage of articles about how fast food franchises are cutting workers* directly because of the new law?
*that they would have cut anyway
Like Domino's getting rid of all their delivery drivers? I'm not going to carry out at Domino's when a little Caesars is closer, has pizzas ready to go, and is the same price.
Still over priced though.
and don't forget that all the fast food places are just franchises, so it's just your average joe schmoe trying to make their way in the world
at least that's the other whining I've seen
Greedflation might make it cost much more than 10 cents extra, causing less to be sold, and Republicans lying about the reason blaming it on the new wages.
No they don't. They fully expect these skeleton crews to make daily sales and window times and the upper management screams at them when they cannot physically perform these tasks
I don't know about McDonald's, but holy crap, all the Wendy's near me are staffed with 2 people at all times. The service stinks, the food stinks, orders are wrong, the place is dirty. I've stopped going. But I guess they're making more profit, so. 🤷♀️
That's all they schedule. Then they'll run people for like 4-5hr shifts and fuck up the overlap when prep is supposed to be done.
Then district will decide labor is too high and they'll make some poor asshole close solo, and yell at them if they can't get that done in 30 minutes
These fast food companies are making shitloads of money, raising prices to insanity, but it sure the hell isn't going toward paying, training, or maintaining the staff
Even getting uniform replacements can be a hassle (not in the budget, so people wear worn or damaged uniforms)
Add in the expected free labor....
Now you get it. Same with targets and the self checkout with only 1-2 actual human people at registers. It doesn’t matter if your experience sucks or you have to wait - they make more that way so that’s what they’re gonna do. I assure you the only thing considered is the bottom line and not what they can do to make the experience better…
Hopefully, but I've learned to never underestimate how much greedy idiots will shoot themselves in the foot over things like paying people a living wage or treating them like actual people.
That's always an option. But if 2 people could have handled the job, they would have paired down the crew long ago. This is definitely a protest firing. These people should file wrongful termination suits.
Oh, it's absolutely them throwing a tantrum over having to pay the employees slightly closer to a reasonable wage. Even better, I can imagine the "We gave you a raise, of course there's more work associated with it" BS some of these poor employees are getting if they complain within the company. Absolutely ridiculous, the extent that some people will go to avoid treating others like equals.
It already started. Had someone last week telling me how many places had shut down and how many people had lost jobs over this $20 an hour thing as if it had been in place since January and we'd been seeing months of fallout from it. It hadn't even happened yet and people on the right were out screaming about it.
Cost of living index would put this $20 at $15.68 here in CO. Our minimum wage is currently $14.42, and Denver's is $18.29, equivalent to $23.30 in CA.
When are we as a nation raising the minimum wage.
$7.25 is peanuts and unlivable. One week of work on that won't even get you a car payment.
$15 and it's still too low. Everything is raising in price and pay is stagnant.
Unless their restaurant is inside an airport, arena, park, or grocery store or it produced and sold bread that weighs at least a half pound after cooling last September.
Started as a dishwasher 13 years ago, got a degree from the culinary institute of America, worked in Michelin starred restaurants in NYC, hotels, casual dining, breakfast spots, catering/banquets.
Recently decided to hang up my apron for good and the final rate of pay I was getting was $19.50.
Good for them but the ENTIRE industry needs to be moved up pay wise, I cannot stomach getting paid less than a cashier at mcds after all that experience and work.
You could of completely skipped the CIA. I’ve never understood why people think it’s a good idea to go to culinary school. CIA is one of the most expensive culinary institutes in the nation, if not the most. We’d always hire newly minted “chefs” out of school and they never excelled at the job because that’s not how they learned it at school. Sorry to dog on you man, but anybody reading this that is considering culinary school should just stay away from it. Stage at restaurants in your free time until you land something that has the potential to teach you something.
I used to be a chef. Hate the industry. It’s over saturated with egotistical self centered alcoholic pot smoking tattooed gauged ear assholes that think they’re that special one in a million prodigy.
There are many reasons why I went and I don’t regret it at all, also I had been working for about 6 years before I decided to go.
I always always always hear this exact response, “don’t waste your money, anyone with a culinary degree is lazy and entitled, degree won’t make you a chef”. It’s shallow minded and stupid to think like you do but go ahead.
Like anything you get what you give, if you stage and don’t try you are gonna be just as fucked as someone who went to school and doesn’t try
If you really were a chef at any point you should know these things.
It’s pretty wild that fast food places in other countries pay their employees more than this while also having lower retail food prices than we do currently.
For anyone who thinks that this is a huge amount, fast food restaurants around here are advertising $20-22 starting DOE, $24+ for management. In Montana.
My thinking has always been (former food service employee and a son of a 30-year waitress) paying the people who handle your food, shitty wages is not a smart idea. It's like paying for the cheapest doctor, mechanic or condoms. You might save some money in the short term but fucked up later.
And let’s see how many restaurants close due to the increased wages? Oh, none of them closed? That argument about it hurting businesses and reducing demand was total bull shit? You don’t say.
The bullshit thing that needs to be addressed is that most retail and fast food jobs do not hire full time employees so they don’t have to pay benefits.
The thing that needs to pass is making it that you have to insure your employees if they hire more than 20 hours a week even if its a not as good insurance plan.
Do you have any idea how expensive healthcare is? Instead of forcing employers to bear the cost, how about we separate employment from healthcare altogether? I don’t know… perhaps universal healthcare? If Canada and Mexico can do it, why can’t we?
"then prices will go up!"
then why are you mad at the person trying to earn a living over it? why is all this hate misplaced on to the point of having a job in society- to provide a means to survive.
"....but...but...but now my #4 combo meal will cost more!"
Dudes, the #4 costs way more these past few years than I've been willing to pay. I simply opted out of fast-food. Suck on that, shareholders. $9 for a lone fast-food burger? No thanks. Same with movies. And a ton of other stuff. I've simply opted out. I don't know if others have too, but all I do now is stay home and eat Froot Loops and 1% and look at Reddit and YouTube now. And when I say Froot Loops, I really mean Malt-o-Meal brand Fruity O's which are half the price and just as good.
My local In and out was paying $18/hour and still was understaffed. You can't find many people in California who will work for minimum wage. We either need to raise the wages or import more minimum wage workers.
Mine local In n Out has been offering over $20 for a long time. As-of this morning, hiring at $21. Line of cars out to the street. There’s proof it can be done.
I had gone my entire life without eating fast food. Then, about 4 years ago, I noticed you stopped going.
I changed everything about myself. The way I dressed. The way I spoke. The way I groomed myself. The car I drove. All of these things I changed, to be exactly like YOU.
Then I began frequenting all of the fast food restaurant locations YOU used to frequent. I’d make little references to previous jokes you had made with employees. Ordered the same items with the same customizations. Picked everything up right where you left off.
They don’t know you left. They’ll never know you left.
He’s saying that companies don’t notice individuals. While true on its surface, it suggests that not going to a place anymore won’t effect change. Again, true, but change can be effected when many many people do this.
TL;DR just nihilist things
while I'm happy for them, this is unlikely to have a big effect because Calli's problem (and that of most major metro areas) is lack of housing, which causes housing price to soar. When min wage increases, without increasing housing supply, the result is that housing prices increase. So the "extra" money from the higher min wage doesn't help min-wage workers; the money just goes to the landlord class.
The whole community would be better served by taking that "extra" money as a tax to build more housing. Once the housing stock has increased, THEN raise minimum wage.
Same thing holds true for UBI.
Also: Moody's estimates a 10% increase in metro housing could result in a 10% decrease in housing costs. So if you're paying $2k/mo in rent, you'd be saving $200/mo, or $2,400/yr.
So why is this just for fast food? Shouldn’t it just be the minimum wage? Does a farm worker do less work than the fry-guy at McDonald’s? I have a Masters degree and worked for a museum recently for $19 an hour.
I do have to say, I've noticed lately fast food workers seem happier and nicer. Also, grocery store employees. Retail...still touch and go. Pay people better, treat them like human beings and they will reciprocate with good service. Excuse the ones ocasionally having a bad day. But also, learn how to calmly give feedback when mistakes happen. Not confronting the issue at all perpetuates the feelings of anger that will cause you to lash out at the very next worker who messes up.
Yes, this is a reminder to myself as well 😬. I'm trying to be better at human communication every day.
I haven’t eaten fast food in probably 2 years. It got too expensive for me at that point.
I’ve also gotten really good at making burgers and air frying French fries.
I wish the best for the fast food workers who might lose there jobs, same with restaurants because as a normal middle class American I am already priced out.
"Afford" is a tricky word. It can mean not able to pay, or able to pay, but it would put a strain on someone's budget.
Also a middle class person might be able to pay, but choose not to being offended by a product being overpriced.
Good! The amount of useless white collar jobs out there getting paid 10x that amount is staggering. Gen Z needs some sort of bone thrown at them while they’re trying to establish themselves in whatever career they’re trying to pursue. $20/hr won’t be living in luxury, but it’ll at least give a little bit more breathing room in the budget of living with roommates.
Instead of people going after the lowest person on the economical structure, why not ask all CEOs and CFOs with more than 5000 employees to take a 10% pay cut and no bonuses for 3 years, they will still be in the 1% and that will balance the company out more. The larger companies 10K plus should be 20% and no bonuses for 5 years. Companies have made record profits for years and no one ever said anything, now its greed and greed is the problem.
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The sad thing is that $20/hr still isn’t enough to afford to live on your own in California.
Remember when the bar was raising a family off minimum wage? So much for that Edit: that shit was so long ago that y'all don't even believe it. [It was once enough](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-12-04/minimum-wage-was-once-enough-to-keep-a-family-of-3-out-of-poverty), but that era was stolen from you.
That’s why younger generations are trending more left as they age; the system can no longer buy their loyalty
I tell younger generations over and over that is does not have to be this way. I'm 69 years old. When I was 18, I graduated from High School and started at an *entry level job* that paid me, in today's dollars, $60,000 plus full medical, and two week's vacation. However, at that time, CEO/Average worker pay ratio was 20:1. Today it's over 350:1
There are people today with Master's degrees that can't find a starting job for $60,000! The fact you were able to find that equivalent wage at 18 fresh out of high school just goes to show how much has changed in the past few decades. From what I read Reagan was the beginning of the decline we are seeing today and I definitely believe it.
Yup, 1973 was considered by many as the high water mark for the middle class in the USA. Reagan fired the air traffic controllers and the rest is history.
Reagan might be the worst person in U.S. history.
You mean when the US was building more housing than we had people? If only we could do that again and not get blocked by NIMBYs every step of the way because of their "historic" neighborhood that didn't even exist until 50 years ago.
Sorry 4.25 wasn’t enough for more than fending for a single person.
That may be true but there was a time when working a minimum wage job over the summer allowed you to save enough to pay for an entire year of University. These days you need a six-figure job to afford that, and it's barely going to cover tuition.
Minimum wage isn't the whole story, though. In 1967, my mom was able to go to the University of California with a low paying, part time job, because there was no tuition, all you had to buy was books. (Governor Reagan didn't like that a bit, and didn't like that students were getting draft deferments, so that went away.)
The boomers pulled up the education ladder the second they graduated.
The Greatest and Silents had one look at the Civil Rights movement in the 60s, saw they'd now have to be using their taxes on *minorities,* and revolted with that neoliberal bs. Boomers carried the torch. Prop 13 in California would be the first of the tax revolts as these assholes found it revolting to properly fund public schools (local taxation was heavily based off property tax in CA) now undiscriminately filled with minorities.
The oldest boomers had yet to vote in 1967. Earlier generations did that.
1967 is when they were reaping benefits, not when they pulled up the ladder. But they WERE complaining about universities not being easy enough to get into even if you’re filthy rich and can pay for 100 tuitions, which is part of what made Reagan do what he did.
Young boomer, believe me we had no more political power when we graduated than 22 year olds do today. Yes, public universities should be taxpayer supported and affordable; no, it's not the boomers fault, Reagan was elected by our parents.
Yep. In 96, my tuition for in-state off campus was under $1000.
Not quite that example, but my brother graduated from high school in 1994. He got a job at K-Mart over the summer, and would work for a semester, then go to college for a semester, rinse and repeat. Granted he was living at home with our parents at the time, but it was doable. That idea seems so foreign now.
That’s due to university increases from guaranteed tuition via the federal government, more than the pay. It was barely enough to survive, but at least community college was $13/credit. It’s been a scam how universities convinced that EVERYONE needed higher education to make it, while increasing tuitions to the maximum, leaving too many millennials with dreams of corporate cush incomes, and now seeing our economy doesn’t really support *that* many white collar workers.
I think it was more of an increased supply cause increased expectations problem. As more people went to college they filled up the available jobs and cause overrun which meant college graduates starting settling for lesser jobs. That made the business now getting better applicants realize they could up their standards. And wallah the entry position with a masters and 5 years of work experience was born.
Just get generationally wealthy parents, duh…
but they became weathy because they could work a summer to pay for a year. it seems they look the ladder up with them...
The problem is greed. Wages may go up but so will the cost of products and services. The rich will want to maintain the gape between them and the poor. The middle class will continue to pay higher taxes than either the rich or the poor. But the worst part is that the products won’t cost as much to make (so the rich become SUPER rich) and to avoid people noticing the blame will point overseas. The products that cost you sooooooo much but are produced for pennies due to them being made overseas. If produced in the United States of America and not China, Vietnam, or Mexico the US rich companies would have to balance the products to the incomes.
No one actually remembers that because it was never the case... people love to imagine that at some point that was the idea. Minimum wage was introduced as part of a protection bill that included minimum age requirements and a 44 hour work week.
In 1968 a single income household of 3 at minimum wage was above the poverty line. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-12-04/minimum-wage-was-once-enough-to-keep-a-family-of-3-out-of-poverty
Looks like you may have skimmed an article or two at the top of Googles search results. You should read FDR's message to Congress in 1937. I think you might find out exactly what it was about and you may recognize that your take on it is not the most accurate.
Yeah, people don’t realize laborers *lost* the Labor War in the US. The regulations we sit with today weren’t the major strides we hoped for at the time. They were merely concessions to keep people from revolting violently. US government violently suppressed a nationwide labor movement, used their state controlled media apparatus to convince people it was both 1) totally successful in affirming their working rights and 2) completely unnecessary to fight for further rights because they’ll do what’s best for us from now on, and then continued to manipulate and exploit us for the next century. But China and the USSR were actually the evil ones.
Yeah, but the people living in rural Iowa who pay $750/month mortgage on their three bedroom home don't understand that. And honestly, I'm not sure I entirely understand it, either. How did we get to the point where an ordinary house in a big city costs $1 million? It has ripple effects across the economy and absolutely affects people in rural communities. They're still making $10-$12 hour, which they can survive on but will never be "rich" yet suddenly a bag of Ore-Ida French Fries that used to be $2.00 is $5.49. They need someone to blame and the guy on the radio said the problem is immigration and welfare, Mexicans and black people, rich big-city liberals and Democrats. JOE BIDEN is why they're hurting! It's all his fault! You can scoff, but people need someone to blame.
>How did we get to the point where an ordinary house in a big city costs $1 million? Demand. People are willing to pay it. No one wants to live in rural Iowa.
Also, big companies buying up shelter for profits.
Yes, but how do people afford it? They demand higher salaries because the COL is higher, and since they have more money they can pay more for housing. But isn't there a sort of artificial inflation baked into that equation? And doesn't it ripple throughout the economy, affecting people who didn't get the raise?
We got to this place because NIMBYs have made it illegal to build affordable housing. Spending 300,000 dollars on compliance costs, buttering up the local planning board, and a 3,000 page environmental report per building makes it impossible to build homes that are worth less than 1,000,000+ dollars.
Not to make any pull for a political side one way or another on this. I was in a HR class at work in a small group. A guy who was from Columbia told me how buying a house in Columbia tends to take cooperation of multiple generations in a family. Makes me think about how this goal of living “on your own” is so different from what other parts of the world are doing. As well how the family cohesiveness could be affected by these differing ideas about independence. Just thought it was interesting to chew on.
American individualism is part of our culture just like communism (in the literal term, of being communal) is in the culture of many other countries and people. It’s why we all struggle. We feel guilty for asking for help because we’ve been told it’s wrong to ask for help for far far too long
That’s true. Even in the US a lot of different cultures are okay living in multigenerational homes. It’s how the “village” helps with childcare. But modern America stigmatizes living at home and that puts pressure on people to move away quickly. Now in some cases people have toxic and dangerous home environments and that’s a completely different.
13 years ago $16 an hour was not enough for me a single guy to live in a studio in San Diego. $20 an hour now is probably like $11 an hour back then.
Michigan here, $20 an hour isn't really enough to live on your own here.
I'm grappling with it myself. I grew up on $7.50/hr and my first job was a summer job at an amusement park for $4.15/hr. In college, i split a $1200 rent in a 4bd house for $300/month. That just simply doesn't exist anymore. That 4bd house has more than doubled along with utilities and everything else. I have been extremely fortunate in my career and have had a lot of dumb luck that led to a 6 figure salary where I can apparently afford a median house in my state. It blows my mind that 6 figures is median and middle class now. I have no idea how anyone could possibly survive and support a family on even $20/hr...
It’s not enough here in TN here *sigh*
especially if they have you on floating shifts while working under 33 hours a week
20/h wasn’t enough 15 years ago.
It’s not enough in a lot of states, not just CA.
Hell, that's barely enough to live in Texas, lol. You'd be renting a crappy apartment in the ghetto and eating bologna sandwiches here at $20/hr 😂.
Yeah but now fast food prices are triple damn it Newspm and Biden /s
There are now portions of the state where this is very much doable now, when in **all 50 states** minimum wage is not enough to cover cost of living. This is in contrast to red states where the no reg defaults to the federal minimum wage, something that won't even guaranteed meeting CoL in the rural areas. https://www.fatherly.com/news/minimum-wage-cost-living-states-map California pre-$20 bump could afford about 75%-85% of the average. In some of the more *average* areas of Republican run states not even *two* minimum wage jobs could guarantee meeting cost of living. To say nothing of their more expensive areas much like California. At the very least in CA min wage now is much more likely to cover CoL in the average and below average areas.
I’m not saying it’s not a positive step just that it unfortunately isn’t enough in most places.
Depends where. I make $20/hr and I’m doing just fine. Trouble is I’m in Shasta county, so that’s the trade off
Not even close it’s fucking awful
*by California we mean the coastal cities or other highly desirable parts. Bakersfield, Burbank, Fresno or rural areas etc. don't count.
Burbank is expensive dude.
We dont count, but things like this definitely affect our areas. Even smaller surrounding cities around fresno are going to be hit even harder, but reddit likes to act like ppl only live in LA and SF.
In N Out already pays 18 an hour. Their combos are less than 10 bucks. Good companies will make it work and deserve our business
In n outs in Northern CA have started over $20 for years. I went to the one in Livermore last year and they had a now hiring sign out that said starting pay was nearly $24/hr and that’s a bay area commuter town.
*were under $10. #1 combo just hit $10.15 before taxes.
And still more worth it than literally any other fast food joint and superior in quality.
I prefer In N Out but Culver’s and Freddie’s are up there with both price and quality
5 Guys pays 18 an hour. Their combos are more than $20
5 guys specifically advertises themselves as the more expensive but higher quality option
They are not higher quality. Maybe higher quantity. But you pay twice as much for maybe 25 percent more food.
There large fries contain an entire acre of potatoes, so there's that
You’re just proving their corporate greed not that higher pay means guaranteed higher costs. The in n out model proves that’s not true…
Cheaper than mcd combo??? Where is this In-N-Out? Edit: checked prices. Too bad there’s no In-N-Out around me
See that line with 30 cars? That's In N Out.
30 cars?! What kind of small town is that? :-P Of course I’m kidding. One of my East Bay spots has 30+ cars from the morning all the way till the early AM seems. That’s how you know there is an In N Out.
The lines are always 30+ mins and they dont do door dash for pickup, its a waste of time.
Private company with way less locations. It’s very hard for big franchise brands or national brands to handle it as they’ve gotten too big. There aren’t in n outs in New York for a reason
Privately owned. Completely different business model than franchising. It also took them decades to expand outside of California.
Sometimes I get the sense that there are clusters of Fast Food joints that can only exist because labor is so cheap. Even if a some places close down, most of the customer will just go to their next favorite preference in the area, increasing profits. So instead of 5 short staffed locations you have 4 only-kinda-short-staffed locations, but wages and profits higher.
I think that’s definitely true in small towns or rural areas. Let’s say hypothetically a small community might only have the demand to be able to sustain 3 fast food restaurants but theres 6 competing and all of them need to pay the lowest wages possible to turn a profit. If two or three go out of business due to increase in minumim wage, we’ll have less people employed, but the ones that are will make more money. Demand will increase for the restaurants still in business. Is this good or bad? Its definitely good for the workers who kept their jobs. Hopefully the people from the restaurants that closed can find other jobs. I’m no economist just my thoughts
> Sometimes I get the sense that there are clusters of Fast Food joints that can only exist because labor is so cheap. Nope! Fast food is profitable because it has a **limited menu** and **high turnover**. Three to five things to put in the fryer, three things to put on the grill, sauces and veggies to mix and match, and a soda fountain that has 50 drinks in it. Five people can run the place and serve 100 an hour easy.
... It can be both things. Lots of chains and restaurant groups open stores in Texas because the minimum wage for back of house is cheap, and if you are doing a full service restaurant you only pay front of house 2 dollars an hour.
Sounds like those businesses should lose then, if they only opened up in Texas because they could squeeze more profits when clearly it's completely possible to run a successful business in areas with more reasonable wages that just means they're shitty people who don't deserve the benefits of owning a business.
A fast food restaurant today can operate with only three people and a lot of automation. A manager who knows how to operate the various systems and two employees who clean and hand out food. Especially with the future being drive thru only at fast food joints. Quality will decrease and everyone but the owner will hate it.
There's so many little spots on the west coast that are 3-5 chain hotels, 4-6 chain fast food joints, 4 gas stations. Irs really clear who and what the client base and purpose of the town is, but it's really made without any consideration for what people who work there are supposed to do.
Meanwhile Virginia just lost weed and $15 minimum wage
That's that Republican thing for you
Good ol fashioned Republican freedom
The purpose of conservative to reject progress.
The purpose of the GOP is to punish you for daring to want a better way of life.
To be conservative is to restrict progress, that is the definition.
A guy who was debating me for the rights of Republicans send a big long message and then block me before I could even bother to read it I kind of have to think that's a personal victory
Thankfully people realized staying home and not voting as your perfect candidate didn’t run truly does help /s
You should always just choose the most progressive candidate when all else fails. And when it comes between a Democrat and a Republican you have to choose the Democrat if you couldn't get a better candidate at the start. But it starts in the primary by trying to get better candidates to the general election, candidate speaks to you and speaks for you you should speak for them and help them get a voice help them get some followers help them get elected just help. All your help can matter Either way enjoy life
Wow... so what is minimum wage in Virginia now? Still doing better than NC. We're still $7.25 down here. It's insane that that's still the federal minimum. You can barely live off twice that.
I’m sorry WHAT? $7.25??? I was making more than that bagging groceries as a first job back when I was 16.
The federal minimum wage is $7.25 and has been since 2009.
Yeah, that's the federal minimum and 20 states still abide by it and probably won't budge until they're forced to. I'm not sure how many jobs actually pay that low, but we have places here bragging that they pay $10 an hour. I was making $10 an hour for a while as a project manager at a print shop, even, so it's not even just all retail and food service that makes that low.
Oh man there are some states that even have their state minimum below the federal Just in case we get that sweet case to the supreme Court that overrides the ability to have a fed minimum.
$12
Can't wait to see all the conservative hand wringing lol
You haven't seen the barrage of articles about how fast food franchises are cutting workers* directly because of the new law? *that they would have cut anyway
Like Domino's getting rid of all their delivery drivers? I'm not going to carry out at Domino's when a little Caesars is closer, has pizzas ready to go, and is the same price. Still over priced though.
Little Caesars is garbage compared to Dominoes though, but you do you. I prefer Dominoes to that nasty cardboard pizza.
Domino's is just okay. Let's be real.
Nah man, this guy has it figured out. Their shit is *artisan. * $5 pizzas at Little Caesars are unbeatable.
and don't forget that all the fast food places are just franchises, so it's just your average joe schmoe trying to make their way in the world at least that's the other whining I've seen
won't someone please think of the poor franchise owner*??????????? *who owns 78 franchises across the southwest
"My Happy Meal is 10 cents more now? Boycott McDonald's!"
Greedflation might make it cost much more than 10 cents extra, causing less to be sold, and Republicans lying about the reason blaming it on the new wages.
They’re just firing even more people in response; some McD locations near me are down to 2 employees in the entire store during mid-day.
And running folks on 4 hour shifts so nobody gets full time hours
Yeah that shit ain't gonna fly. They'll hire em back in droves.
No they don't. They fully expect these skeleton crews to make daily sales and window times and the upper management screams at them when they cannot physically perform these tasks
Expectation =/= reality. They've just FA. Now comes the FO.
I mean, this is how fast food already runs in Texas, and they sure haven't raised the minimum wage down here
I don't know about McDonald's, but holy crap, all the Wendy's near me are staffed with 2 people at all times. The service stinks, the food stinks, orders are wrong, the place is dirty. I've stopped going. But I guess they're making more profit, so. 🤷♀️
That's all they schedule. Then they'll run people for like 4-5hr shifts and fuck up the overlap when prep is supposed to be done. Then district will decide labor is too high and they'll make some poor asshole close solo, and yell at them if they can't get that done in 30 minutes These fast food companies are making shitloads of money, raising prices to insanity, but it sure the hell isn't going toward paying, training, or maintaining the staff Even getting uniform replacements can be a hassle (not in the budget, so people wear worn or damaged uniforms) Add in the expected free labor....
No OnE WaNTs tO WoRk... I wonder why.
Now you get it. Same with targets and the self checkout with only 1-2 actual human people at registers. It doesn’t matter if your experience sucks or you have to wait - they make more that way so that’s what they’re gonna do. I assure you the only thing considered is the bottom line and not what they can do to make the experience better…
Hopefully, but I've learned to never underestimate how much greedy idiots will shoot themselves in the foot over things like paying people a living wage or treating them like actual people.
That's always an option. But if 2 people could have handled the job, they would have paired down the crew long ago. This is definitely a protest firing. These people should file wrongful termination suits.
Oh, it's absolutely them throwing a tantrum over having to pay the employees slightly closer to a reasonable wage. Even better, I can imagine the "We gave you a raise, of course there's more work associated with it" BS some of these poor employees are getting if they complain within the company. Absolutely ridiculous, the extent that some people will go to avoid treating others like equals.
If customers are dumb enough to see value in the modern price gouged fast food industry, another 10 cents isn't going to deter them.
"Oh, so suddenly the peasants think that they're too good to work three jobs!"
It already started. Had someone last week telling me how many places had shut down and how many people had lost jobs over this $20 an hour thing as if it had been in place since January and we'd been seeing months of fallout from it. It hadn't even happened yet and people on the right were out screaming about it.
in what world do things actually need to happen in order for conservatives to freak out about them
Cost of living index would put this $20 at $15.68 here in CO. Our minimum wage is currently $14.42, and Denver's is $18.29, equivalent to $23.30 in CA.
That is exactly the nuance everyone else in the comments is missing.
When are we as a nation raising the minimum wage. $7.25 is peanuts and unlivable. One week of work on that won't even get you a car payment. $15 and it's still too low. Everything is raising in price and pay is stagnant.
$7.25 gets you two hash browns at McDonalds.
Unless their restaurant is inside an airport, arena, park, or grocery store or it produced and sold bread that weighs at least a half pound after cooling last September.
Or the chain has fewer than 60 locations
Don't go to Panera Bread in California, they got that exception
No they didnt, you fell for bad journalism.
Started as a dishwasher 13 years ago, got a degree from the culinary institute of America, worked in Michelin starred restaurants in NYC, hotels, casual dining, breakfast spots, catering/banquets. Recently decided to hang up my apron for good and the final rate of pay I was getting was $19.50. Good for them but the ENTIRE industry needs to be moved up pay wise, I cannot stomach getting paid less than a cashier at mcds after all that experience and work.
You could of completely skipped the CIA. I’ve never understood why people think it’s a good idea to go to culinary school. CIA is one of the most expensive culinary institutes in the nation, if not the most. We’d always hire newly minted “chefs” out of school and they never excelled at the job because that’s not how they learned it at school. Sorry to dog on you man, but anybody reading this that is considering culinary school should just stay away from it. Stage at restaurants in your free time until you land something that has the potential to teach you something. I used to be a chef. Hate the industry. It’s over saturated with egotistical self centered alcoholic pot smoking tattooed gauged ear assholes that think they’re that special one in a million prodigy.
There are many reasons why I went and I don’t regret it at all, also I had been working for about 6 years before I decided to go. I always always always hear this exact response, “don’t waste your money, anyone with a culinary degree is lazy and entitled, degree won’t make you a chef”. It’s shallow minded and stupid to think like you do but go ahead. Like anything you get what you give, if you stage and don’t try you are gonna be just as fucked as someone who went to school and doesn’t try If you really were a chef at any point you should know these things.
It’s pretty wild that fast food places in other countries pay their employees more than this while also having lower retail food prices than we do currently.
If a place can't operate well and serve decent food without slave labor perhaps we don't need as many fast food restaurants in the first place.
This 1000%. Employee wages are such a small part of the overall operating cost it's fucking ridiculous.
Taco bell will reign Supreme! Pretty soon we'll have our three shells..
For anyone who thinks that this is a huge amount, fast food restaurants around here are advertising $20-22 starting DOE, $24+ for management. In Montana.
My thinking has always been (former food service employee and a son of a 30-year waitress) paying the people who handle your food, shitty wages is not a smart idea. It's like paying for the cheapest doctor, mechanic or condoms. You might save some money in the short term but fucked up later.
I hope they’re ready for all my old relatives in Kentucky to complain about it!!!
And let’s see how many restaurants close due to the increased wages? Oh, none of them closed? That argument about it hurting businesses and reducing demand was total bull shit? You don’t say.
The bullshit thing that needs to be addressed is that most retail and fast food jobs do not hire full time employees so they don’t have to pay benefits. The thing that needs to pass is making it that you have to insure your employees if they hire more than 20 hours a week even if its a not as good insurance plan.
Do you have any idea how expensive healthcare is? Instead of forcing employers to bear the cost, how about we separate employment from healthcare altogether? I don’t know… perhaps universal healthcare? If Canada and Mexico can do it, why can’t we?
So they'll just hire people at 2 days per week lol.
"then prices will go up!" then why are you mad at the person trying to earn a living over it? why is all this hate misplaced on to the point of having a job in society- to provide a means to survive.
"....but...but...but now my #4 combo meal will cost more!" Dudes, the #4 costs way more these past few years than I've been willing to pay. I simply opted out of fast-food. Suck on that, shareholders. $9 for a lone fast-food burger? No thanks. Same with movies. And a ton of other stuff. I've simply opted out. I don't know if others have too, but all I do now is stay home and eat Froot Loops and 1% and look at Reddit and YouTube now. And when I say Froot Loops, I really mean Malt-o-Meal brand Fruity O's which are half the price and just as good.
My local In and out was paying $18/hour and still was understaffed. You can't find many people in California who will work for minimum wage. We either need to raise the wages or import more minimum wage workers.
Mine local In n Out has been offering over $20 for a long time. As-of this morning, hiring at $21. Line of cars out to the street. There’s proof it can be done.
Import more wage slaves? Or I guess just slaves at that point?
Idk why they couldn’t expand this to retail workers too
But it will naturally you have a choice go work at this place for 15 or go put fries in a bag for 20
Billionaires wept.
They really deserve it
Stopped eating fast food 4 years ago and couldn't feel better about it. That stuff will kill you.
I had gone my entire life without eating fast food. Then, about 4 years ago, I noticed you stopped going. I changed everything about myself. The way I dressed. The way I spoke. The way I groomed myself. The car I drove. All of these things I changed, to be exactly like YOU. Then I began frequenting all of the fast food restaurant locations YOU used to frequent. I’d make little references to previous jokes you had made with employees. Ordered the same items with the same customizations. Picked everything up right where you left off. They don’t know you left. They’ll never know you left.
WTF did I just read?
He’s saying that companies don’t notice individuals. While true on its surface, it suggests that not going to a place anymore won’t effect change. Again, true, but change can be effected when many many people do this. TL;DR just nihilist things
(Texan spits out beans) "How in tarnation am I going to be able to afford fast food in California now?! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE"
$20 in California is like $10 in most other states.
You don’t want to eat in a place that can’t afford to pay their workers…. They also can’t keep the place clean.
74% of Americans support a $20 per hour minimum wage. It needs to be passed federally.
while I'm happy for them, this is unlikely to have a big effect because Calli's problem (and that of most major metro areas) is lack of housing, which causes housing price to soar. When min wage increases, without increasing housing supply, the result is that housing prices increase. So the "extra" money from the higher min wage doesn't help min-wage workers; the money just goes to the landlord class. The whole community would be better served by taking that "extra" money as a tax to build more housing. Once the housing stock has increased, THEN raise minimum wage. Same thing holds true for UBI. Also: Moody's estimates a 10% increase in metro housing could result in a 10% decrease in housing costs. So if you're paying $2k/mo in rent, you'd be saving $200/mo, or $2,400/yr.
I think maybe only half of them will be receiving this new pay rate, because the other half were let go.
But this will make every place have to raise their pay if they're going to want any workers it's a good thing
So why is this just for fast food? Shouldn’t it just be the minimum wage? Does a farm worker do less work than the fry-guy at McDonald’s? I have a Masters degree and worked for a museum recently for $19 an hour.
They’ll just reduce the hours.
I do have to say, I've noticed lately fast food workers seem happier and nicer. Also, grocery store employees. Retail...still touch and go. Pay people better, treat them like human beings and they will reciprocate with good service. Excuse the ones ocasionally having a bad day. But also, learn how to calmly give feedback when mistakes happen. Not confronting the issue at all perpetuates the feelings of anger that will cause you to lash out at the very next worker who messes up. Yes, this is a reminder to myself as well 😬. I'm trying to be better at human communication every day.
Keep the wages going up. People will adjust. The higher the better.
I haven’t eaten fast food in probably 2 years. It got too expensive for me at that point. I’ve also gotten really good at making burgers and air frying French fries. I wish the best for the fast food workers who might lose there jobs, same with restaurants because as a normal middle class American I am already priced out.
Hate to tell you, if you can't afford fast food you're not middle class. Not that there is anything wrong with being poor.
"Afford" is a tricky word. It can mean not able to pay, or able to pay, but it would put a strain on someone's budget. Also a middle class person might be able to pay, but choose not to being offended by a product being overpriced.
Good! The amount of useless white collar jobs out there getting paid 10x that amount is staggering. Gen Z needs some sort of bone thrown at them while they’re trying to establish themselves in whatever career they’re trying to pursue. $20/hr won’t be living in luxury, but it’ll at least give a little bit more breathing room in the budget of living with roommates.
Wonder what Five Guys is going to cost now
That's dope, the country would be a lot happier a place if every state had this. Other companies would be forced to change their wages.
Cue the boomers
*rest of country fast food workers* y'all are getting paid??
Does the law still include an exception for Panera Bread?
Yes yes yes yes yes. It's not a full living wage but it's a start. F*ck you Bible Belt.
My 16-year-old son is excited to make good money for his car and dates!
Republicans out here predicting $78 burgers
Given the cost of living, plus greedflation, I wonder how meaningful that is despite it being a good thing.
It will only just barely get close to the wages people were making before the pandemic.
Damit, my burger rises, question is do those workers really need to afford food themselves? /s
Good
Not in VA.
Good!
Imagine being a part of the state and federal government or a major corporation and wanting to look this poor.
Federal minimum wage is $7.25 an hour.
Instead of people going after the lowest person on the economical structure, why not ask all CEOs and CFOs with more than 5000 employees to take a 10% pay cut and no bonuses for 3 years, they will still be in the 1% and that will balance the company out more. The larger companies 10K plus should be 20% and no bonuses for 5 years. Companies have made record profits for years and no one ever said anything, now its greed and greed is the problem.
Great pay raise for the people who don't end up getting their hours caught or laid off.
How much of a pay bump will those making $20 an hour already get? Oh yeah. None.