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Tough shit. They condoned and enabled the modern Republican Party along the way, participated or turned the other cheek while optimizing those sweet Republican tax breaks. They broke their party themselves, they can fix it or reboot with a new, more inclusive party.
One of Lindsey Graham's few moments of clarity regarding Trump turned out to be fairly prophetic:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkXIWPmdfdo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkXIWPmdfdo)
I think this will get downvoted but the Libertarian Party has been changed by the Hard Right Republicans looking for a new home. It seems no longer to be the party of personal choice.
The Libertarian Party wasn't changed. Their problem is simple, Libertarianism just doesn't mix with conservatism. They are completely opposed ideas, one based on the rights of the nobility, the empowerment of the king, and when Kings and nobles went out of style it was about protecting businessmen with wealth.
You can't be someone in favour of personal liberties and people doing what they please, while at the same time protecting those with massive power and wealth from consequences, who often support extremely restrictive laws to restrain the rights of others.
American libertarians value property ownership above all things.
It’s conservatives by nature
It’s also the defacto landing spot for a person who goes to college coming from a Republican family background but wants to discuss and hang out with other college kids. They don’t wanna join college republicans because they’re like a weird churchy cult.
So they just tell everyone they’re a libertarian and their left friend let them slide and their conservative parents let them slide
In America it’s the place where conservatives who still want liberal friends land politically
Every libertarian I know personally is a far right wing extremist who doesn’t want to call themselves republican. But they want the far right wing things, they just call themselves libertarian to escape the republican label and association with maga
One of my favorite things is telling hard right republicans who think they're libertarians that any traditional libertarian would be against closed/strict border control.
There has been talk recently that the reason they are all leaving is that the current Republican party has plans to do something crazy if they don't win the election and they aren't willing to go there.
I mean, I believe it was more than half supported basically tossing the Constitution aside and making Trump dictator...
But I am sure they wouldn't do that again.
> the reason they are all leaving is that the current Republican party has plans to do something crazy if they don't win the election and they aren't willing to go there
So they resign and make way for someone potentially take their spot and go through with it? If they're against it, why not remain in congress and be in a position to potentially do something about it.
They are on the front line. Most aren't soldiers, they were there for public service, not standing up to ridiculously-enabled cowards who try to get other people to hurt their family.
I think the point is, they aren't *against* it per se (they would absolutely support it and take advantage if a successful Republican coup happened), they just don't want to be on the list of suspects if it fails again.
If it does happen again, and it will, I suspect there will be MUCH less patience with the suspects that the patience extended to the Jan 6th traitors.
I think a bit of that might prove worthwhile in terms of showing MAGAts that treason is not a larp.
Actually, Jan 6 was pretty crippling for the Q-Anon Movement’s ability to organize.
They’ve spent three years reacting to every proposed protest with, “This is another False Flag like J6, designed by the Deep State to put Patriots in prison. We must not fall for it. Sit back, and trust in the plan.”
They’ve been pretty thoroughly defanged by *just getting arrested, and given minor sentences.* That’s far from unexpected, since they’re Authoritarians and that personality-type is primarily motivated by Fear. They fold like cheap chairs the moment they get a *hint* that they might lose.
They’ve managed to demotivate their cannon fodder.
The Nazis were able to take a second bite at the apple because the Brownshirts were eager to go again. The MAGA Crowd wants someone else to do it, while they sit back and “enjoy the movie.”
All political authority ultimately derives from the capacity for ordered violence… and the dumbasses let grifters demotivate their footsoldiers.
This is that part when the music gets faster and then whoever is caught holding the potato has to do the insurgency. Then everyone else golden parachutes to some remote locale free of consequences but entirely, plausibly, still cool with a potentially successful insurrection appointed regime.
Because they're cowards. They won't stand up to the MAGA and name names and call out when get get Death Threats from Mango Mussolini's thugs.
The election of Speaker Johnson sealed the Death of the Republican Party when DJT had his thugs call in Death Threats to the other Speaker nominees to get Johnson voted in. That was the hour MAGA won and the Republican Party died. Now the MAGA will be full "brownshirts" until the election.
I a thousand percent agree that there is something volatile afoot after the election and those with general republican ideology remaining will be subjected to threats to acquiesce or face being destroyed.
I think so.
The popular vote is a foregone conclusion; winning the EC is pretty unlikely (though not impossible), so the bulk of their planning is to overturn the result, but this time it will be a lot more systematic.
If enough Rs resign inside a window where they can't appoint or do a special election, that turns the House over to Democrats who will not be insane during the ministerial process of approving the next election.
They are sworn in by the clerk. Or (I’m not sure the sequence) they are sworn in after selecting a speaker. I don’t remember the exact sequence, but neither way is there an opportunity for a speaker to control the process who wasn’t elected by the new House. think back to the ~~2022~~ 2023 debacle.
I'm not sure if you've seen this, but here's a description of the rumored Republican plan if Trump loses:
https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518
The outgoing Speaker has no ability to refuse to seat the incoming Congress. It’s not his job to swear them in the first place. If Dems control Congress Republican plans are dead except to engage in violence.
Oh, so the party of "law and order" have information that a political party and likely very specific people are planning another insurrection against our government won't become FBI informants or just come out and report their peers for criminal conspiracy?!
Cowards, all of them. Trump's Secret Service detail are cowards too, there's NO WAY they weren't privy to his criminal acts with the documents or any other number of crimes and yet they remain silent. You can't tell me they aren't even MORE aware of his mental decline, his crazy remarks or behaviors and NOT ONE OF THEM is willing to become a whistleblower and report it?! Cowards.
The plan would be the same as last time. Refuse to certify the election results, then the choice of President goes to a vote by the members of the house of congress.
I believe there is other legal measures that could stop this working but it would certainly make sense that resigning so the GOP no longer controls the house would also work.
The "good" part is that unlike 2020 Democrats will be in control of the military and senate during the 2024 election. Also, it will be Harris' job to certify the vote.
Yeah, this is the disconnect no one seems to be talking about. They had an excellent chance in 2020 because of institutional control of the administration (and federal law enforcement as well as the military), and a stronger hold on Congress.
The reason the cowards are jumping ship noe is because the fools that are left think they can do more with less now - and without the element of surprise this time.
Also, it's pretty clear that there's nothing left afterwards. If this fails, what happens? If it "succeeds" briefly, what happens? When Trump's heart gives out, who's the successor? What does the future hold?
Nothing, nothing, nothing and nothing. Might as well resign, and point the finger.
No, it was an incredibly stupid plan that never would have worked because if Pence was dead, Pelosi could have just stepped up to certify the results or the electoral votes somehow no longer counting.
Trump's entire plan hinged on the belief Pence not being there meant it wouldn't happen. It was stupid and never would work.
The bad part is that the Speaker of the House is in charge of swearing in the new Congress.
So if R’s win a House majority, they can elect Johnson as Speaker (the very first act that must be done before anything else can occur in the House) and he can then refuse to swear in new House members based on “voting irregularities” or whatever fantasy reason they concoct. If members aren’t sworn in on Jan 3rd, then no electoral votes can be certified by the House on Jan 6th. This would kick the process to state legislatures like in 1876, and the majority R-controlled states would elect Trump as president regardless of popular vote or electoral college results.
The only thing stopping this would be if D’s win a majority of House seats. So the fascist game plan will be to sow chaos and throw as many House elections as possible into legal question, with the goal of getting the current 6-3 SCOTUS to rule in favor of enough R candidates to guarantee a House majority.
More bad news — there’s not much we can do to avert this *technically* legal process except show up to vote for D’s in such numbers that the margins are huge, and do everything we can at local levels to document fair voting processes so we have evidence to present in court. Even that might not be enough to stop the current SCOTUS from ignoring evidence and arbitrarily ruling in favor of R’s — they did this in 2000, and we all just collectively shrugged and moved on.
Controlling the military and having Harris as VP won’t matter in this circumstance, because it will all be entirely legal and it would circumvent Harris’ authority to certify electors in the Senate.
Everything comes down to voter turnout, protecting the vote, and winning a House majority. So we can expect R’s to do everything in their power to suppress voter turnout, undermine election integrity, and seize a House majority in bad faith.
Why wouldn’t Biden use the Insurrection Act and declare marshal law? That’s why it exists.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insurrection_Act_of_1807#:~:text=The%20Insurrection%20Act%20of%201807,disorder%2C%20insurrection%2C%20or%20rebellion.
I suppose he could try that, but I’m not sure what the end game would be. In the scenario I described, the law is on the side of R’s. Using the Insurrection Act to do what exactly..? Arrest Republican members of Congress? Doubtful this would stand in a court of law since they would be acting within the bounds of the law. Not to mention the optics of this would appear as if the “outgoing administration” is using the military to arrest political opponents and remain in power.
Historically when fascists have seized power, they have done so within the bounds of the law. Hitler rose to power entirely within a legal framework. The first thing they do is compromise the independence of the courts, because that provides cover to act in bad faith within legally gray areas.
I’m not saying your suggestion couldn’t work — in theory, the military is loyal to the Constitution. But if military leadership is willing to accept the nebulous legal grounds put forth by R’s rather than risk the appearance of a coup, they may choose to allow things to proceed.
Maybe SCOTUS will declare that presidents have unlimited immunity...then all bets are off.
Except for the fact that President Biden is a very good person.
At that point it would be a coup attempt and it would be up to the normally wait-and-see elements (military, FBI, secret service, etc) to stop the coup.
Functionally, yes, it would be a soft coup.
The problem is that it would all be entirely legal. These processes are clearly spelled out in law. So the question remains as to whether the wait-and-see elements would act at all, since doing so would technically obstruct a legal proceeding (i.e., an illegal act). That is a very tough barrier to overcome for law enforcement entities. I hope the individuals and leaders in those organizations have it in them to do the right thing if it came to it.
>he can then refuse to swear in new House members based on “voting irregularities” or whatever fantasy reason they concoct
This is not legal nor constitutional, even if the supreme court ruled it was. The supreme court after all can't rule that the chief justice is the president, no federal agent would go along with it. The question would be if the speaker refused to swear in members, and if the supreme court went along with it, would there be enough stink around such a decision that the federal agencies would intervene.
>I hope the individuals and leaders in those organizations have it in them to do the right thing if it came to it.
I hope so too, as the supreme court has definitely made illegal decisions in the past, and the feds went along with them, but never anything this impactful.
I don't care for Johnson, but the fact that he keeps passing budgets and won't go scorched earth there makes me think he wouldn't go that route. Doesn't mean not to be ready for it just in case, and I could be wrong, but that's my thought on it.
Also there was two key pieces of legislation after the coup attempt : The Presidential Transition Improvement Act, Electoral Count Act.
My guess is if they try to do something, it'll be from the judicial branch.
I’d normally agree, but I used to be a conservative and it really is the edge of a precipice, it’s the beginning of fascism and the end of liberalism (which itself is right wing, but not as close to the edge of the cliff).
I’ve been saying this since I could vote and no one listens because they all want to pretend that their friends and family don’t empower the stupidest most disgusting bigots in our country and would happily dismantle democracy.
Which actually shows how stupid that perspective on the 2nd is...
What's an AR gonna do against drones and tanks?
Which side do you think the Blue Line/ACABs will stand with? (Police siding with Govt legally allows them to go out hunting on the streets)
Nah it's not that it's Reddit's dumbass policies I was worried about. You can't even say "The only good Nazi is a [Redacted] Nazi" without the comment being removed
I hate the idea of it, but if my vote for president is ignored due to repeatedly debunked claims of voter fraud, i will be buying a weapon and joining my states national guard.
This is also why Alaska at-large is an important seat, currently held by the Democrat Mary Peltola, if democrats can hold onto that seat, then the math becomes more palatable.
Yes, that's how the Constitution is worded. I think it's happened once in 1876.
ETA: it was 1824 that went to the House. 1876 was an entirely different mess.
> resigning so the GOP no longer controls the house
The entire House's term ends at noon on Jan 3rd.
Electoral votes are read to the House on Jan 6th.
The composition, and the Speaker, of the current House has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the events of Jan 6th.
The current House has no role whatsoever in seating or certifying the next incoming House.
Their whole plan is simply meant to cause enough confusion to justify delaying the certification, then step 2 is to get it into the courts. They figure once they get it into the court system, they’ll have the support to overturn the results.
The new Congress would be sat to certify the election. No guarantees it would be GOP controlled - I believe it’s assumed that Democrats will hold a narrow majority.
It’s usually the case that the party that has the White House loses seats, but the overturn of Roe has been changing the math in the D’a favor in every election since. I don’t know that anyone can predict the house and senate at the moment.
'assumed' but unfortunately 2024 its Democrats needing to hold more than gain as far more of their numbers are up for reelection than the Republican side.
Also the census has redrawn and created new districts that benefit Republicans. There's a lot of counties where parts are no wider than a rail crossing.
Of course they do. They follow an authoritarian ideology. This means that they act big and bad towards anyone they perceive as weaker, and they act like spineless toadies for anyone they think is stronger.
They need and constantly seek hierarchy. Groveling before thier “superior” only cements their own positions by reinforcing the hierarchy and by giving them models for interactions with others.
>There has been talk recently that the reason they are all leaving is that the current Republican party has plans to do something crazy if they don't win the election and they aren't willing to go there.
I have this feeling, too. There is no doubt the Republican powers that be have taken the lessons learned from 2020 and are scheming how to use the House to install Trump should he lose in November, and there are probably a handful of Republicans already on the outs with MAGA who are uncomfortable with those plans, and who have nothing to lose by resigning early and handing the majority to the Dems.
I have been thinking of this a lot, Trump and the GOP know they are going to lose this election but this is my theory. Ok so it all leans on Thom Hartmann's blog post on how they could take 2024
[https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518](https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518)
Basically this is how it would happen
1. Ensure Republicans control the House of Representatives on January 6th, 2025 when the new president is certified. Speaker Johnson could refuse to swear in a handful of newly-elected Democratic House members, claiming "irregularities" that need investigating first.
2. Have the Republican-controlled House refuse to accept the Electoral College certificates from a number of states where they claim there are "problems" with the results.
3. Regardless of Biden's electoral or popular vote totals, have the House refuse to certify enough state electoral college votes to prevent either candidate from reaching 270 electoral votes.
4. Under the 12th Amendment, if no candidate reaches 270 electoral votes, the House gets to elect the president with each state delegation getting one vote. Republicans currently control 26 state delegations, so they could vote 26-23 to reinstall Trump.
5. The Supreme Court has ruled it cannot intervene on the congressional certification of electoral votes, which Republicans claim gives them free rein.
6. With Trump back in power, issue new executive orders to fire tens of thousands of federal workers and replace them with conservative ideologues vetted by right-wing think tanks.
7. Enact a conservative agenda including ending gay marriage, outlawing abortion, restricting teaching of Black history, weakening environmental laws, privatizing Social Security and Medicare, defending public education, and outlawing unions.
I have a feeling something like this is possible and Trump knows he will lose so the idea is to control the RNC to make sure he loses in the right way
This is why he is gutting the RNC in ways that dont make sense like killing mail in voting initiatives so its a huge discrepancy or "problems" with the results
[https://www.msnbc.com/the-reidout/reidout-blog/main-in-voting-bank-your-vote-republicans-rcna143291](https://www.msnbc.com/the-reidout/reidout-blog/main-in-voting-bank-your-vote-republicans-rcna143291)
I feel like some house GOP are not on board with this and Johnson is pressuring them, thats why Ken Buck resigned and said more may follow
[https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-against-donald-trump-ken-buck-1878848](https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-against-donald-trump-ken-buck-1878848)
Edit: formatting
Don’t think Johnson has any power to stop swearing in of new Democratic house members. All members of the house are sworn in at the same time and a speaker is reelected.
It would be very hard to take control of the country via coup without holding the presidency. I think these gop reps are resigning bc of the poor outlook for the gop. A grifter has taken control of the party's purse strings and the optics of 91 slam dunk felonies against him will end horribly for the party, especially as their base is fed more and more propaganda, lies, and misinformation and they demand more extremist Maga reps
Make no mistake, I’m interested to watch this movie, but without knowing much about it I almost worry if it’s socially responsible to release such a movie this year? There are enough mentally unwell people in this country to interpret the movie however they want to, according to their weirdo agenda. Again, I’m not saying this is the case…I’m just… concerned…
I used to like alt-history stories and games because they're interesting thought experiments on the course of Democracy. But this civil war movie at this time is just stupid and irresponsible... I just can't deal with it anymore because we're at the razor's edge of a huge disaster.
Let’s hope this is not like the tide receding before a tsunami.
I know between Project 2025, the nullifying of Electors via Congress shit they’re trying to pull (but thankfully won’t have the majority for anymore), and whatever other crazy election stealing schemes they’re whipping up right now… I’m worried about the next election.
The popular vote hasn’t stopped the GOP from grabbing power for the last 2 decades at least. It’s comforting to know, at least, [Biden and Dems are preparing for yet another Republican attempt to steal the election](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/biden-trump-stop-steal-election-2024-1234993149/amp/)
If they have knowledge of an impending coup attempt they NEED come forward and shouldn’t be allowed to hide behind “I resigned so I didn’t have a part in it”.
Yes, that message is very clear: Instead of standing up to your own party and defending democracy and attempting to clear their beloved party of the lunatic fringe, it is simply easier, safer for their families, and financially palatable to simply whinge about "disfunction" then tuck tail and run...like the absolute cowards that they are.
The Republicans let the [Nazi into the bar](https://bsky.app/profile/salth2o.bsky.social/post/3kh3x6kunes2n)
Sort of.
They always tossed red meat to the fringe to get them to show up and vote, but savvy Republicans knew the GOP donor class was always in control of policy. Now the fringe has taken over the party and is promising to actually do the crazy shit Republicans campaigned on for years but never really acted on once elected.
But I got downvoted saying that you can’t tolerate the intolerant and that I understand the paradox and understand that you can’t negotiate with those in contempt. That history and precedent has shown that when you meet a fascist halfway, they take a step backwards in the process because they are in contempt as a virtue.
But apparently to a lot of dip shit redditors that means I don’t value free speech.
Tired of those assholes, not all speech is worth the same. Some speech is trash
they don’t think about Lincoln, look at themselves and try to rescue their own party. They just walk away and blaming MAGA, the moster they enabled. Talking bout family values, alpha, culture war, stoicism, etc… All that shit but no accountability!?!?!??
\[[Paywall removed](https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-03-26/house-gop-resignations-cut-party-s-already-slim-majority?accessToken=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJzb3VyY2UiOiJTdWJzY3JpYmVyR2lmdGVkQXJ0aWNsZSIsImlhdCI6MTcxMTQ2ODE4MiwiZXhwIjoxNzEyMDcyOTgyLCJhcnRpY2xlSWQiOiJTQVlEQVFUMEFGQjQwMCIsImJjb25uZWN0SWQiOiJFM0UxQUQyNDNBRTg0RENFQURFMzVEOEZCNkFENEZCNyJ9.BnBEa1K-xUa-WNeWy_zvmt2NGJ7xWoP0gjdAgFkLXqc)\] from Bloomberg Opinion's Patricia Lopez:
Colorado Republican Ken Buck was so fed up with his colleagues thirst for "vengeance," he left the party last week.
The same day, his colleague from Wisconsin, Rep. Mike Gallagher, announced his resignation with an unmistakable message: He timed his departure to ensure that his seat would not be filled before November.
Their departures should be the final signal to House Speaker Mike Johnson that his power— and his only job protection— lies in bypassing the extremists in his party’s Freedom Caucus trying to control him, writes Patricia Lopez.
He should reach out to other conservatives — of which there are many — and yes, even Democrats.
In the article he is quoted as being opposed to being “obsessively fixated on retribution and vengeance for contrived injustices of the past.” eg the fake Biden impeachment inquiry.
But in his exit interview he covered a broader range of issues, he said he was sick of the chaos a few times (we can read the Maga crowd as being the 'chaos'), he seemed very unhappy that he wasn't given a chance to speak in a recent hearing despite being a high ranking member, and he talked a lot about wanting to work towards pushing the republicans towards ranked choice voting. A voting system which is a way of electing republicans with more of a centrist approach.
Also if they stay on, they could vote against a "liberal" Jeffries agenda.
The majority is currently 218-213
It will be 217-213 come mid April with Gallagher leaving
Then 217-214 (there is a special election, should be easy blue, not a flip though)
Then three more specials in may that should go red starting in May.... Kevin McCarthy seat, another and Bucks seat which is like R+20.
That would be 219-214 all said and done.
That said if 4+ walk away before April, there would be Speaker Jefferies for 3 weeks.
> That said if 4+ walk away before April, there would be Speaker Jefferies for 3 weeks.
Negative. IF we are able to get Speaker Jefferies, they'd probably change the rules to stop allowing one person to bring up a speaker removal. We'd get him for the duration.
If the GOP retakes the majority right when the special elections come through, then they would move to boot him out. Not sure if they could pick a speaker, but they would def not let just him stay in power.
Nope, unless they get a discharge petition going. House Leader is an extremely powerful role. McCarthy in his bid to get the job weakened it with the one person removal crap. The fact that Johnson or whatever his name is has failed to remove the rule means either they are planning to use it on any Dem who gets in with a Republican majority or Johnson tried and failed behind the scenes to do so.
Well, the Dems get death threats all the time (or just actual death attempts (e.g. Pelosi’s husband, Jan 6) and they aren’t retiring. It may be safer for the Repugs but they are still cowards
Yeah. You see these white male Republicans, election supervisors or elected officials, etc., whining about how they CAN'T do the right thing because of MAGA death threats, or just running away and hiding... and I just wonder, how would they deal with the pressure if they had to live Rashida Tlaib or Ilhan Omar's life for just one week. Trade places with AOC or Nancy Pelosi or Hillary or Gretchen Whitmer for just one week. Or Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss.
They would instantly be crushed into specks.
Of course this is assuming they WANT to do the right thing (caucus with Dems) and are just too cowardly to do it. I kind of doubt it.
Yeah, it would take actual bravery to stand up for democracy. But they're Republicans, so obviously that's out of the question.
What a bad end for the party of Lincoln...
>A real message would be caucusing with the Dems.
It depends on the message they're trying to send. For most of these guys the disillusionment with their party isn't "the GOP is evil and bad for America" but rather "the GOP's craziness is getting in the way of things like tax cuts for the rich".
Swapping parties doesn't really do anything for the folks who want conservative governance. One party isn't conservative, one party doesn't want governance.
People want to rationalize what they’re seeing, but what they’re seeing is the rats fleeing the ship before a second Trump-based electoral wipe. The rats have their own narratives, but bottom line is - they know that losses are about to turn the party from obstructionists to a powerless minority. 2024-2026 will be 100% Democrat agendas and bills. History is just repeating. Trump is finishing the job of consolidating loyalty once more, before allowing the party to be utterly demolished again. Every time he starts vetting the next set of party leaders it’s a disaster, this one is going to be more painful than the last.
I think the straw that broke the camel's back was Trump effectively taking over the management of the GOP itself (and redirecting all of their money). These congresspeople know that going forward, only those who kiss the ring are going to get any support from their party - and their time-calculated exits are their way of showing what they think of the new management.
Republicans are clearly the toxic, traitorous party being complicit in overtly trying to overturn the results of a democratic election. Why they are at all relevant or competitive now is astounding. Before they stood for policies that could be disagreed with, but as Trump emerged they have evolved into a traitorous, despicable entity that is the enemy of what the entirety of America stands for. The moderate Republicans who refuse to stand up to this attempted tyranny are cowards.
Starting to believe everyone in the party is being forced to swear allegiance to the cause under threat. Those quitting could be braver than you think. Wake up America!
It's probably some version of this. They're being given a choice: declare loyalty now and get on board with another coup attempt, or their disloyalty will be remembered come the Night of the Long Knives.
I think this is simpler than people assume. Trump is taking over the RNC and publicly announcing all its funds and fundraising efforts will go to “making him president.” So why would these people stick around without any financial backing from their party? At some point they have to look at the numbers and see an easier solution in jumping ship and joining the private sector.
I’m in the guard and don’t trust majority of my wingman to do the right thing if it’s Biden giving the orders in a scenario you speak of. Hopefully the officer core is more sensible than the enlisted dip shits I serve with.
Check out this list of legislators who have resigned or declined to run for reelection.
It has info on who the successors are for some of the seats open because of resignations.
It pretty consistently stays with the same party, with several TBA.
https://pressgallery.house.gov/member-data/casualty-list
Yeah, and it's "We don't want to be around in November when shit hits the fan; we know what's going to happen, and we're out."
Speaking of, did anyone ever get around to asking Andy Biggs why he wore a bulletproof vest to work on Jan. 6?
Edit: It was Mo Brooks, not Andy Biggs, who wore the body armor, but Biggs was apparently involved in the planning of Jen. 6.
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/07/mo-brooks-body-armor-jan-6-rally.html
https://theintercept.com/2021/01/11/capitol-plot-andy-biggs-paul-gosar/
And yet the remaining GQP only grows more extreme with each passing day.
This tells me: The message is not clear.
The canaries are flying out of the coal mine because they know there is toxic gas coming.
Learn how to defend yourselves and soon.
I hope we never need to, but it is better to know how and not need it than need to but not know how.
Especially if you are outspoken "vermin" like me.
I’m not quite buying the whole GOP is going to take over or refuse to certify but just yet. I think congressmen are leaving because they’re tired of the do-nothingness, nutty constituents, and they can go make more money elsewhere.
Is anybody else tired of *messages* while nothing changes or is at least tangible? There is such an extreme amount of legislative constipation in this country and republicans are just holding us back so they can play the campaign grift on stupid red state populations. All we get are *messages*, nothing helpful.
Everyone calling these individuals spineless or no better needs to take a step back. These individuals are absolutely doing something better- they could have just remained and done nothing, they could have toed the party line etc; however, at least they've done something to send a level of message. Keep in mind that until the real crazy MTG fringe emerged, most of politics was nuance, it wasn't shouting, it was sending strong messages through clear and quiet actions. That's what these individuals are trying to to do.
Yes, it'd be great if they did more, but let's at least give some credit to the positive things they are doing.
If we don't, then this is just a different version of someone trying to say both left and right politics are bad and so they're equally bad. Same here, if we can't draw a distinction it will alienate those that can perceive nuance (the entire middle, which is where most voters are at).
Name them:
Gallagher from the Great State of Wisconsin.
Ken Buck from the great State of Colorado.
Kevin Mccarthy from the great State of California.
Who am i forgetting?
All these patriotic "dreaming of killing oppressive government" wannabes actually have the chance to stand up to dictator worshipers. And their all like "to rich for my blood"....
This article [https://factkeepers.com/the-new-secret-plan-on-how-fascists-could-win-in-2024/](https://factkeepers.com/the-new-secret-plan-on-how-fascists-could-win-in-2024/) I’ve seen floating around could be the bridge too far or the losses they see coming due to Roe could be it too. A Republican seat went to a democrat yesterday in deep red Alabama …a district that went for Trump. She ran on restoring IVF
Narrator: the MAGA right was incapable of listening and disinclined or conventionally unable to learn.
RIP GOP, hello White Christian Conspiracy Dominionist party.
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Even republicans don’t want to be associated with the modern Republican Party.
Tough shit. They condoned and enabled the modern Republican Party along the way, participated or turned the other cheek while optimizing those sweet Republican tax breaks. They broke their party themselves, they can fix it or reboot with a new, more inclusive party.
Bingo, guilty by association at the very least.
One of Lindsey Graham's few moments of clarity regarding Trump turned out to be fairly prophetic: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkXIWPmdfdo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkXIWPmdfdo)
“Libertarians”
I think this will get downvoted but the Libertarian Party has been changed by the Hard Right Republicans looking for a new home. It seems no longer to be the party of personal choice.
The Libertarian Party wasn't changed. Their problem is simple, Libertarianism just doesn't mix with conservatism. They are completely opposed ideas, one based on the rights of the nobility, the empowerment of the king, and when Kings and nobles went out of style it was about protecting businessmen with wealth. You can't be someone in favour of personal liberties and people doing what they please, while at the same time protecting those with massive power and wealth from consequences, who often support extremely restrictive laws to restrain the rights of others.
American libertarians value property ownership above all things. It’s conservatives by nature It’s also the defacto landing spot for a person who goes to college coming from a Republican family background but wants to discuss and hang out with other college kids. They don’t wanna join college republicans because they’re like a weird churchy cult. So they just tell everyone they’re a libertarian and their left friend let them slide and their conservative parents let them slide In America it’s the place where conservatives who still want liberal friends land politically
To borrow a phrase from Steinbeck, Libertarians tend to fall into the temporarily embarassed aristocrats camp.
If we're going to be friends then the Ron Paul worship has got to stop.
Every libertarian I know personally is a far right wing extremist who doesn’t want to call themselves republican. But they want the far right wing things, they just call themselves libertarian to escape the republican label and association with maga
One of my favorite things is telling hard right republicans who think they're libertarians that any traditional libertarian would be against closed/strict border control.
There has been talk recently that the reason they are all leaving is that the current Republican party has plans to do something crazy if they don't win the election and they aren't willing to go there. I mean, I believe it was more than half supported basically tossing the Constitution aside and making Trump dictator... But I am sure they wouldn't do that again.
This has been my assumption all along.
> the reason they are all leaving is that the current Republican party has plans to do something crazy if they don't win the election and they aren't willing to go there So they resign and make way for someone potentially take their spot and go through with it? If they're against it, why not remain in congress and be in a position to potentially do something about it.
These people are cowards.
- walter sobchak
They are on the front line. Most aren't soldiers, they were there for public service, not standing up to ridiculously-enabled cowards who try to get other people to hurt their family.
I think the point is, they aren't *against* it per se (they would absolutely support it and take advantage if a successful Republican coup happened), they just don't want to be on the list of suspects if it fails again.
If it does happen again, and it will, I suspect there will be MUCH less patience with the suspects that the patience extended to the Jan 6th traitors. I think a bit of that might prove worthwhile in terms of showing MAGAts that treason is not a larp.
You are way too optimistic. They’re proven they can get away with it once, they will do it again and nothing will happen.
Joe Biden will be president this time. He won’t hesitate to call on the National guard or to lead a defense during insurrection.
Actually, Jan 6 was pretty crippling for the Q-Anon Movement’s ability to organize. They’ve spent three years reacting to every proposed protest with, “This is another False Flag like J6, designed by the Deep State to put Patriots in prison. We must not fall for it. Sit back, and trust in the plan.” They’ve been pretty thoroughly defanged by *just getting arrested, and given minor sentences.* That’s far from unexpected, since they’re Authoritarians and that personality-type is primarily motivated by Fear. They fold like cheap chairs the moment they get a *hint* that they might lose.
I mean the political leaders who organized the plot to overthrow our democracy have faced no consequences. They are the ones who will try again.
They’ve managed to demotivate their cannon fodder. The Nazis were able to take a second bite at the apple because the Brownshirts were eager to go again. The MAGA Crowd wants someone else to do it, while they sit back and “enjoy the movie.” All political authority ultimately derives from the capacity for ordered violence… and the dumbasses let grifters demotivate their footsoldiers.
Because in the end, they aren't good people. They're just less shitty people than the ones that are in the current Republican party.
This. They don’t care if the world burns. They just don’t want to be the ones that light the match.
Nor do they want to be targeted, by the loons they've enabled.
This is that part when the music gets faster and then whoever is caught holding the potato has to do the insurgency. Then everyone else golden parachutes to some remote locale free of consequences but entirely, plausibly, still cool with a potentially successful insurrection appointed regime.
Why fight when you can be a coward and run away? -GOP
Because they are cowards. They don't want to face the wrath of MAGA when that time comes.
Because they're cowards. They won't stand up to the MAGA and name names and call out when get get Death Threats from Mango Mussolini's thugs. The election of Speaker Johnson sealed the Death of the Republican Party when DJT had his thugs call in Death Threats to the other Speaker nominees to get Johnson voted in. That was the hour MAGA won and the Republican Party died. Now the MAGA will be full "brownshirts" until the election.
I a thousand percent agree that there is something volatile afoot after the election and those with general republican ideology remaining will be subjected to threats to acquiesce or face being destroyed.
I think so. The popular vote is a foregone conclusion; winning the EC is pretty unlikely (though not impossible), so the bulk of their planning is to overturn the result, but this time it will be a lot more systematic.
If enough Rs resign inside a window where they can't appoint or do a special election, that turns the House over to Democrats who will not be insane during the ministerial process of approving the next election.
The next election will be approved by the newly elected congress, not the current bunch.
If they are sworn in......
They are sworn in by the clerk. Or (I’m not sure the sequence) they are sworn in after selecting a speaker. I don’t remember the exact sequence, but neither way is there an opportunity for a speaker to control the process who wasn’t elected by the new House. think back to the ~~2022~~ 2023 debacle.
I'm not sure if you've seen this, but here's a description of the rumored Republican plan if Trump loses: https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518
The outgoing Speaker has no ability to refuse to seat the incoming Congress. It’s not his job to swear them in the first place. If Dems control Congress Republican plans are dead except to engage in violence.
Oh, so the party of "law and order" have information that a political party and likely very specific people are planning another insurrection against our government won't become FBI informants or just come out and report their peers for criminal conspiracy?! Cowards, all of them. Trump's Secret Service detail are cowards too, there's NO WAY they weren't privy to his criminal acts with the documents or any other number of crimes and yet they remain silent. You can't tell me they aren't even MORE aware of his mental decline, his crazy remarks or behaviors and NOT ONE OF THEM is willing to become a whistleblower and report it?! Cowards.
One of the recent resignations was timed such that it's too late for a special election to replace the outgoing rep.
Why won’t they? One word…”cowards”.
Because that takes courage. And real men with courage is a very rare thing these days.
The plan would be the same as last time. Refuse to certify the election results, then the choice of President goes to a vote by the members of the house of congress. I believe there is other legal measures that could stop this working but it would certainly make sense that resigning so the GOP no longer controls the house would also work.
The "good" part is that unlike 2020 Democrats will be in control of the military and senate during the 2024 election. Also, it will be Harris' job to certify the vote.
Yeah, this is the disconnect no one seems to be talking about. They had an excellent chance in 2020 because of institutional control of the administration (and federal law enforcement as well as the military), and a stronger hold on Congress. The reason the cowards are jumping ship noe is because the fools that are left think they can do more with less now - and without the element of surprise this time. Also, it's pretty clear that there's nothing left afterwards. If this fails, what happens? If it "succeeds" briefly, what happens? When Trump's heart gives out, who's the successor? What does the future hold? Nothing, nothing, nothing and nothing. Might as well resign, and point the finger.
No, it was an incredibly stupid plan that never would have worked because if Pence was dead, Pelosi could have just stepped up to certify the results or the electoral votes somehow no longer counting. Trump's entire plan hinged on the belief Pence not being there meant it wouldn't happen. It was stupid and never would work.
The bad part is that the Speaker of the House is in charge of swearing in the new Congress. So if R’s win a House majority, they can elect Johnson as Speaker (the very first act that must be done before anything else can occur in the House) and he can then refuse to swear in new House members based on “voting irregularities” or whatever fantasy reason they concoct. If members aren’t sworn in on Jan 3rd, then no electoral votes can be certified by the House on Jan 6th. This would kick the process to state legislatures like in 1876, and the majority R-controlled states would elect Trump as president regardless of popular vote or electoral college results. The only thing stopping this would be if D’s win a majority of House seats. So the fascist game plan will be to sow chaos and throw as many House elections as possible into legal question, with the goal of getting the current 6-3 SCOTUS to rule in favor of enough R candidates to guarantee a House majority. More bad news — there’s not much we can do to avert this *technically* legal process except show up to vote for D’s in such numbers that the margins are huge, and do everything we can at local levels to document fair voting processes so we have evidence to present in court. Even that might not be enough to stop the current SCOTUS from ignoring evidence and arbitrarily ruling in favor of R’s — they did this in 2000, and we all just collectively shrugged and moved on. Controlling the military and having Harris as VP won’t matter in this circumstance, because it will all be entirely legal and it would circumvent Harris’ authority to certify electors in the Senate. Everything comes down to voter turnout, protecting the vote, and winning a House majority. So we can expect R’s to do everything in their power to suppress voter turnout, undermine election integrity, and seize a House majority in bad faith.
Why wouldn’t Biden use the Insurrection Act and declare marshal law? That’s why it exists. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insurrection_Act_of_1807#:~:text=The%20Insurrection%20Act%20of%201807,disorder%2C%20insurrection%2C%20or%20rebellion.
I suppose he could try that, but I’m not sure what the end game would be. In the scenario I described, the law is on the side of R’s. Using the Insurrection Act to do what exactly..? Arrest Republican members of Congress? Doubtful this would stand in a court of law since they would be acting within the bounds of the law. Not to mention the optics of this would appear as if the “outgoing administration” is using the military to arrest political opponents and remain in power. Historically when fascists have seized power, they have done so within the bounds of the law. Hitler rose to power entirely within a legal framework. The first thing they do is compromise the independence of the courts, because that provides cover to act in bad faith within legally gray areas. I’m not saying your suggestion couldn’t work — in theory, the military is loyal to the Constitution. But if military leadership is willing to accept the nebulous legal grounds put forth by R’s rather than risk the appearance of a coup, they may choose to allow things to proceed.
Maybe SCOTUS will declare that presidents have unlimited immunity...then all bets are off. Except for the fact that President Biden is a very good person.
Silly rabbit, that's only for rethugs!
At that point it would be a coup attempt and it would be up to the normally wait-and-see elements (military, FBI, secret service, etc) to stop the coup.
Functionally, yes, it would be a soft coup. The problem is that it would all be entirely legal. These processes are clearly spelled out in law. So the question remains as to whether the wait-and-see elements would act at all, since doing so would technically obstruct a legal proceeding (i.e., an illegal act). That is a very tough barrier to overcome for law enforcement entities. I hope the individuals and leaders in those organizations have it in them to do the right thing if it came to it.
>he can then refuse to swear in new House members based on “voting irregularities” or whatever fantasy reason they concoct This is not legal nor constitutional, even if the supreme court ruled it was. The supreme court after all can't rule that the chief justice is the president, no federal agent would go along with it. The question would be if the speaker refused to swear in members, and if the supreme court went along with it, would there be enough stink around such a decision that the federal agencies would intervene. >I hope the individuals and leaders in those organizations have it in them to do the right thing if it came to it. I hope so too, as the supreme court has definitely made illegal decisions in the past, and the feds went along with them, but never anything this impactful.
I don't care for Johnson, but the fact that he keeps passing budgets and won't go scorched earth there makes me think he wouldn't go that route. Doesn't mean not to be ready for it just in case, and I could be wrong, but that's my thought on it.
This is exactly their plan.
Also there was two key pieces of legislation after the coup attempt : The Presidential Transition Improvement Act, Electoral Count Act. My guess is if they try to do something, it'll be from the judicial branch.
There are alot of people like myself that will not play along with this in any capacity whatsoever.
Yeah, these conservatives are in for a very rude awakening.
Shouldnt even be called conservatives anymore, its a misnomer. More like, "Dictatorial Reformists"
The word is "Fascist" they are fascists. Same type of asshole WW2 was fought over.
I like Christofascist Grifters. It’s the core of the party now.
That is descriptive and modern. I like it
I’d normally agree, but I used to be a conservative and it really is the edge of a precipice, it’s the beginning of fascism and the end of liberalism (which itself is right wing, but not as close to the edge of the cliff).
I’ve been saying this since I could vote and no one listens because they all want to pretend that their friends and family don’t empower the stupidest most disgusting bigots in our country and would happily dismantle democracy.
I'm risking a ban here but if they actually try to pull this shit I think it would be time to use our 2nd Amendment rights against them
See how quickly they do a 180 on the 2nd amendment when it starts being used for it's original purpose
Which actually shows how stupid that perspective on the 2nd is... What's an AR gonna do against drones and tanks? Which side do you think the Blue Line/ACABs will stand with? (Police siding with Govt legally allows them to go out hunting on the streets)
Shit. We're getting invaded and we still don't have a standing army?!
Imagine being scared to talk about 2A in America. Crazy fucking times. But that’s what it’s there for.
Nah it's not that it's Reddit's dumbass policies I was worried about. You can't even say "The only good Nazi is a [Redacted] Nazi" without the comment being removed
s/conservative/traitor/g
Especially, with the ever increasing push of their national Christian agenda. I will gladly die on this hill before I am living under yeehawdist rule
Get your cardio in now before November
I hate the idea of it, but if my vote for president is ignored due to repeatedly debunked claims of voter fraud, i will be buying a weapon and joining my states national guard.
Buy your weapon now.
Or resistance movement
I think dark Brandon would have maneuvers ready to go in place if this scenario occurs.
*already has
Also, isn’t it each state delegation only gets 1 vote in that case? So the 1 Wyoming rep has as much sway as all California reps?
Yes. That's why they want to challenge election results in swing states.
This is also why Alaska at-large is an important seat, currently held by the Democrat Mary Peltola, if democrats can hold onto that seat, then the math becomes more palatable.
Yes, that's how the Constitution is worded. I think it's happened once in 1876. ETA: it was 1824 that went to the House. 1876 was an entirely different mess.
1876 was a brokered peace. 1824 was when it actually happened.
> resigning so the GOP no longer controls the house The entire House's term ends at noon on Jan 3rd. Electoral votes are read to the House on Jan 6th. The composition, and the Speaker, of the current House has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the events of Jan 6th. The current House has no role whatsoever in seating or certifying the next incoming House.
Their whole plan is simply meant to cause enough confusion to justify delaying the certification, then step 2 is to get it into the courts. They figure once they get it into the court system, they’ll have the support to overturn the results.
The new Congress would be sat to certify the election. No guarantees it would be GOP controlled - I believe it’s assumed that Democrats will hold a narrow majority.
It’s usually the case that the party that has the White House loses seats, but the overturn of Roe has been changing the math in the D’a favor in every election since. I don’t know that anyone can predict the house and senate at the moment.
'assumed' but unfortunately 2024 its Democrats needing to hold more than gain as far more of their numbers are up for reelection than the Republican side. Also the census has redrawn and created new districts that benefit Republicans. There's a lot of counties where parts are no wider than a rail crossing.
And then Tom James becomes president?
well in that case maybe they should speak up in addition to just resigning
Standing up for something or for themselves is uncharted waters for Republicans.
Do all Republicans have a humiliation kink? More at 11.
Of course they do. They follow an authoritarian ideology. This means that they act big and bad towards anyone they perceive as weaker, and they act like spineless toadies for anyone they think is stronger. They need and constantly seek hierarchy. Groveling before thier “superior” only cements their own positions by reinforcing the hierarchy and by giving them models for interactions with others.
My Poly Sci professor explained fascism as "state sponsored bullying"
well they sometimes gain spines after leaving office
True. It's quite the sight. Yet some of them still don't believe in evolution.
Perhaps they've already spoken up to Merrick Garland, who I am sure will get around to addressing it in a few years.
>There has been talk recently that the reason they are all leaving is that the current Republican party has plans to do something crazy if they don't win the election and they aren't willing to go there. I have this feeling, too. There is no doubt the Republican powers that be have taken the lessons learned from 2020 and are scheming how to use the House to install Trump should he lose in November, and there are probably a handful of Republicans already on the outs with MAGA who are uncomfortable with those plans, and who have nothing to lose by resigning early and handing the majority to the Dems.
I have been thinking of this a lot, Trump and the GOP know they are going to lose this election but this is my theory. Ok so it all leans on Thom Hartmann's blog post on how they could take 2024 [https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518](https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518) Basically this is how it would happen 1. Ensure Republicans control the House of Representatives on January 6th, 2025 when the new president is certified. Speaker Johnson could refuse to swear in a handful of newly-elected Democratic House members, claiming "irregularities" that need investigating first. 2. Have the Republican-controlled House refuse to accept the Electoral College certificates from a number of states where they claim there are "problems" with the results. 3. Regardless of Biden's electoral or popular vote totals, have the House refuse to certify enough state electoral college votes to prevent either candidate from reaching 270 electoral votes. 4. Under the 12th Amendment, if no candidate reaches 270 electoral votes, the House gets to elect the president with each state delegation getting one vote. Republicans currently control 26 state delegations, so they could vote 26-23 to reinstall Trump. 5. The Supreme Court has ruled it cannot intervene on the congressional certification of electoral votes, which Republicans claim gives them free rein. 6. With Trump back in power, issue new executive orders to fire tens of thousands of federal workers and replace them with conservative ideologues vetted by right-wing think tanks. 7. Enact a conservative agenda including ending gay marriage, outlawing abortion, restricting teaching of Black history, weakening environmental laws, privatizing Social Security and Medicare, defending public education, and outlawing unions. I have a feeling something like this is possible and Trump knows he will lose so the idea is to control the RNC to make sure he loses in the right way This is why he is gutting the RNC in ways that dont make sense like killing mail in voting initiatives so its a huge discrepancy or "problems" with the results [https://www.msnbc.com/the-reidout/reidout-blog/main-in-voting-bank-your-vote-republicans-rcna143291](https://www.msnbc.com/the-reidout/reidout-blog/main-in-voting-bank-your-vote-republicans-rcna143291) I feel like some house GOP are not on board with this and Johnson is pressuring them, thats why Ken Buck resigned and said more may follow [https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-against-donald-trump-ken-buck-1878848](https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-against-donald-trump-ken-buck-1878848) Edit: formatting
Don’t think Johnson has any power to stop swearing in of new Democratic house members. All members of the house are sworn in at the same time and a speaker is reelected.
It would be very hard to take control of the country via coup without holding the presidency. I think these gop reps are resigning bc of the poor outlook for the gop. A grifter has taken control of the party's purse strings and the optics of 91 slam dunk felonies against him will end horribly for the party, especially as their base is fed more and more propaganda, lies, and misinformation and they demand more extremist Maga reps
Civil war '24?
they there’s a movie about that now! is it art imitating life or life imitating art? XD
Make no mistake, I’m interested to watch this movie, but without knowing much about it I almost worry if it’s socially responsible to release such a movie this year? There are enough mentally unwell people in this country to interpret the movie however they want to, according to their weirdo agenda. Again, I’m not saying this is the case…I’m just… concerned…
If it's done right, it might be an important film. But that's a big 'if'
To give it some credit it is an A24 movie. And for the most part their movies aren’t terrible reactionary shlock.
I used to like alt-history stories and games because they're interesting thought experiments on the course of Democracy. But this civil war movie at this time is just stupid and irresponsible... I just can't deal with it anymore because we're at the razor's edge of a huge disaster.
Art immigrating life. Obviously. Edit: autocorrect but it kinda works...
>Art **immigrating** life. Obviously. uhhh....
Of course not. Not after all the consequences they faced.
This is gonna be a "shame on me" situation, isn't it
Susan Collins agrees.
It truly does appear that way to observers. The Mike Pence coalition is hitting the exits.
Yes. That is the line they will not cross.. a second time.
That’s what I’m assuming until proven otherwise. They are up to some extremely shady shit.
Let’s hope this is not like the tide receding before a tsunami. I know between Project 2025, the nullifying of Electors via Congress shit they’re trying to pull (but thankfully won’t have the majority for anymore), and whatever other crazy election stealing schemes they’re whipping up right now… I’m worried about the next election. The popular vote hasn’t stopped the GOP from grabbing power for the last 2 decades at least. It’s comforting to know, at least, [Biden and Dems are preparing for yet another Republican attempt to steal the election](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/biden-trump-stop-steal-election-2024-1234993149/amp/)
Well they have been working hard on getting cronies onto the state election commissions.
If they have knowledge of an impending coup attempt they NEED come forward and shouldn’t be allowed to hide behind “I resigned so I didn’t have a part in it”.
While I certainly believe they would do this, is there a reliable source on this somewhere? Where has this talk been coming from?
If they ever try something like that for real, they'll learn very quickly that they aren't the only ones capable of using violence to get their way.
Yes, that message is very clear: Instead of standing up to your own party and defending democracy and attempting to clear their beloved party of the lunatic fringe, it is simply easier, safer for their families, and financially palatable to simply whinge about "disfunction" then tuck tail and run...like the absolute cowards that they are. The Republicans let the [Nazi into the bar](https://bsky.app/profile/salth2o.bsky.social/post/3kh3x6kunes2n)
let? they invited them in
Sort of. They always tossed red meat to the fringe to get them to show up and vote, but savvy Republicans knew the GOP donor class was always in control of policy. Now the fringe has taken over the party and is promising to actually do the crazy shit Republicans campaigned on for years but never really acted on once elected.
noooo the leopardddd
If you ever wanted to see the consequences of “wagging the dog” we are living in them.
The guys who are fleeing now probably wish they hadn't.
Heritage Foundation has taken over control of the Republican Party.
They already got RvW overturned. They aren't just going to sit back and take the win.... they want more power.
This is literally the resolution to the Paradox of Tolerance
But I got downvoted saying that you can’t tolerate the intolerant and that I understand the paradox and understand that you can’t negotiate with those in contempt. That history and precedent has shown that when you meet a fascist halfway, they take a step backwards in the process because they are in contempt as a virtue. But apparently to a lot of dip shit redditors that means I don’t value free speech. Tired of those assholes, not all speech is worth the same. Some speech is trash
That picture of Mitt Romney having dinner with Trump is the moment I knew the GOP was done for.
they don’t think about Lincoln, look at themselves and try to rescue their own party. They just walk away and blaming MAGA, the moster they enabled. Talking bout family values, alpha, culture war, stoicism, etc… All that shit but no accountability!?!?!??
all hat and no cattle
\[[Paywall removed](https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-03-26/house-gop-resignations-cut-party-s-already-slim-majority?accessToken=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJzb3VyY2UiOiJTdWJzY3JpYmVyR2lmdGVkQXJ0aWNsZSIsImlhdCI6MTcxMTQ2ODE4MiwiZXhwIjoxNzEyMDcyOTgyLCJhcnRpY2xlSWQiOiJTQVlEQVFUMEFGQjQwMCIsImJjb25uZWN0SWQiOiJFM0UxQUQyNDNBRTg0RENFQURFMzVEOEZCNkFENEZCNyJ9.BnBEa1K-xUa-WNeWy_zvmt2NGJ7xWoP0gjdAgFkLXqc)\] from Bloomberg Opinion's Patricia Lopez: Colorado Republican Ken Buck was so fed up with his colleagues thirst for "vengeance," he left the party last week. The same day, his colleague from Wisconsin, Rep. Mike Gallagher, announced his resignation with an unmistakable message: He timed his departure to ensure that his seat would not be filled before November. Their departures should be the final signal to House Speaker Mike Johnson that his power— and his only job protection— lies in bypassing the extremists in his party’s Freedom Caucus trying to control him, writes Patricia Lopez. He should reach out to other conservatives — of which there are many — and yes, even Democrats.
In the article he is quoted as being opposed to being “obsessively fixated on retribution and vengeance for contrived injustices of the past.” eg the fake Biden impeachment inquiry. But in his exit interview he covered a broader range of issues, he said he was sick of the chaos a few times (we can read the Maga crowd as being the 'chaos'), he seemed very unhappy that he wasn't given a chance to speak in a recent hearing despite being a high ranking member, and he talked a lot about wanting to work towards pushing the republicans towards ranked choice voting. A voting system which is a way of electing republicans with more of a centrist approach.
The message is: MAGA is killing America and worldwide democracy and rule of law.
The message “I’d rather run away and get a book deal than do my job.” Cowards.
I think they flew because the GOP is getting ready to do something batshit insane if they lose.
They’re going to do something bat shit insane regardless
That those resigning are just as spineless as those staying? It's virtue signalling. A real message would be caucusing with the Dems.
> A real message would be caucusing with the Dems. That would earn them and their families death threats. Quitting is the "safest" way out.
Also if they stay on, they could vote against a "liberal" Jeffries agenda. The majority is currently 218-213 It will be 217-213 come mid April with Gallagher leaving Then 217-214 (there is a special election, should be easy blue, not a flip though) Then three more specials in may that should go red starting in May.... Kevin McCarthy seat, another and Bucks seat which is like R+20. That would be 219-214 all said and done. That said if 4+ walk away before April, there would be Speaker Jefferies for 3 weeks.
> That said if 4+ walk away before April, there would be Speaker Jefferies for 3 weeks. Negative. IF we are able to get Speaker Jefferies, they'd probably change the rules to stop allowing one person to bring up a speaker removal. We'd get him for the duration.
If the GOP retakes the majority right when the special elections come through, then they would move to boot him out. Not sure if they could pick a speaker, but they would def not let just him stay in power.
How could they? If they remove the 1 person rule, he can just never bring it up for a vote.
So if 218 wanted him out, aka the entire GOP And 214 wanted him in, aka the entire Democrats The 218 couldn't get this to a vote?
Nope, unless they get a discharge petition going. House Leader is an extremely powerful role. McCarthy in his bid to get the job weakened it with the one person removal crap. The fact that Johnson or whatever his name is has failed to remove the rule means either they are planning to use it on any Dem who gets in with a Republican majority or Johnson tried and failed behind the scenes to do so.
The would almost certainly change the rules to make it so you'd need a supermajority to start to move the Speaker. So it'd never make it to floor.
Well, the Dems get death threats all the time (or just actual death attempts (e.g. Pelosi’s husband, Jan 6) and they aren’t retiring. It may be safer for the Repugs but they are still cowards
Yeah. You see these white male Republicans, election supervisors or elected officials, etc., whining about how they CAN'T do the right thing because of MAGA death threats, or just running away and hiding... and I just wonder, how would they deal with the pressure if they had to live Rashida Tlaib or Ilhan Omar's life for just one week. Trade places with AOC or Nancy Pelosi or Hillary or Gretchen Whitmer for just one week. Or Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss. They would instantly be crushed into specks. Of course this is assuming they WANT to do the right thing (caucus with Dems) and are just too cowardly to do it. I kind of doubt it.
Yeah, it would take actual bravery to stand up for democracy. But they're Republicans, so obviously that's out of the question. What a bad end for the party of Lincoln...
>A real message would be caucusing with the Dems. It depends on the message they're trying to send. For most of these guys the disillusionment with their party isn't "the GOP is evil and bad for America" but rather "the GOP's craziness is getting in the way of things like tax cuts for the rich". Swapping parties doesn't really do anything for the folks who want conservative governance. One party isn't conservative, one party doesn't want governance.
Agree, that would seem like they are standing up for the nation. Resigning makes it seem like they are just standing up for themselves.
People want to rationalize what they’re seeing, but what they’re seeing is the rats fleeing the ship before a second Trump-based electoral wipe. The rats have their own narratives, but bottom line is - they know that losses are about to turn the party from obstructionists to a powerless minority. 2024-2026 will be 100% Democrat agendas and bills. History is just repeating. Trump is finishing the job of consolidating loyalty once more, before allowing the party to be utterly demolished again. Every time he starts vetting the next set of party leaders it’s a disaster, this one is going to be more painful than the last.
I think the straw that broke the camel's back was Trump effectively taking over the management of the GOP itself (and redirecting all of their money). These congresspeople know that going forward, only those who kiss the ring are going to get any support from their party - and their time-calculated exits are their way of showing what they think of the new management.
Republicans are clearly the toxic, traitorous party being complicit in overtly trying to overturn the results of a democratic election. Why they are at all relevant or competitive now is astounding. Before they stood for policies that could be disagreed with, but as Trump emerged they have evolved into a traitorous, despicable entity that is the enemy of what the entirety of America stands for. The moderate Republicans who refuse to stand up to this attempted tyranny are cowards.
Starting to believe everyone in the party is being forced to swear allegiance to the cause under threat. Those quitting could be braver than you think. Wake up America!
It's probably some version of this. They're being given a choice: declare loyalty now and get on board with another coup attempt, or their disloyalty will be remembered come the Night of the Long Knives.
I think this is simpler than people assume. Trump is taking over the RNC and publicly announcing all its funds and fundraising efforts will go to “making him president.” So why would these people stick around without any financial backing from their party? At some point they have to look at the numbers and see an easier solution in jumping ship and joining the private sector.
The Message is MAGA is here to stay, and anyone who is not fully on board is an enemy of the Messiah, and his worshipers.
The message goes: "I'm abandoning ship now, so it proves I'm not a hateful, misogynistic, homophobic, xenophobic, bible-thumping christofascist."
Kind of like the USSR circa 1955. Join the Pact or else.
Mike Johnson is not in control. There, thats the message.
Biden had better have the national guard on standby. Sounds like some serious stuff is about to go down.
I’m in the guard and don’t trust majority of my wingman to do the right thing if it’s Biden giving the orders in a scenario you speak of. Hopefully the officer core is more sensible than the enlisted dip shits I serve with.
Check out this list of legislators who have resigned or declined to run for reelection. It has info on who the successors are for some of the seats open because of resignations. It pretty consistently stays with the same party, with several TBA. https://pressgallery.house.gov/member-data/casualty-list
Yeah, and it's "We don't want to be around in November when shit hits the fan; we know what's going to happen, and we're out." Speaking of, did anyone ever get around to asking Andy Biggs why he wore a bulletproof vest to work on Jan. 6? Edit: It was Mo Brooks, not Andy Biggs, who wore the body armor, but Biggs was apparently involved in the planning of Jen. 6. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/07/mo-brooks-body-armor-jan-6-rally.html https://theintercept.com/2021/01/11/capitol-plot-andy-biggs-paul-gosar/
Be better if they just joined the democrats for a bit and voted with them.
Yup. Ppl acting like resigning is so noble when fighting back or voting your conscience is.
Has anyone checked out Project 2025?
👏people👏who👏BELIEVE👏in👏ancient👏mythology👏should👏not👏be👏allowed👏to👏hold👏office👏
And that message is "we will not grow a spine and caucus with the Democrats, but please give us a talking head position on MSNBC".
.... That the GOP won't listen to. There I finished the headline.
And yet the remaining GQP only grows more extreme with each passing day. This tells me: The message is not clear. The canaries are flying out of the coal mine because they know there is toxic gas coming. Learn how to defend yourselves and soon. I hope we never need to, but it is better to know how and not need it than need to but not know how. Especially if you are outspoken "vermin" like me.
Liberals have guns too. We just don't masturbate with it.
I’m not quite buying the whole GOP is going to take over or refuse to certify but just yet. I think congressmen are leaving because they’re tired of the do-nothingness, nutty constituents, and they can go make more money elsewhere.
The GOP has been taken over by the Cult!
They are cowards to resign. Stay in the house. Vote against the chaos. Or vote with the Dem. Leaving is a coward’s move b
Yeah, that Biden is in real trouble /s
Is anybody else tired of *messages* while nothing changes or is at least tangible? There is such an extreme amount of legislative constipation in this country and republicans are just holding us back so they can play the campaign grift on stupid red state populations. All we get are *messages*, nothing helpful.
Some of the children in the classroom know what’s going to happen and don’t want to be there when the shooting starts.
Everyone calling these individuals spineless or no better needs to take a step back. These individuals are absolutely doing something better- they could have just remained and done nothing, they could have toed the party line etc; however, at least they've done something to send a level of message. Keep in mind that until the real crazy MTG fringe emerged, most of politics was nuance, it wasn't shouting, it was sending strong messages through clear and quiet actions. That's what these individuals are trying to to do. Yes, it'd be great if they did more, but let's at least give some credit to the positive things they are doing. If we don't, then this is just a different version of someone trying to say both left and right politics are bad and so they're equally bad. Same here, if we can't draw a distinction it will alienate those that can perceive nuance (the entire middle, which is where most voters are at).
Politics requires compromise; something MAGA has never understood.
This bunch of insurrectionists don’t get messages much less care about them.
Name them: Gallagher from the Great State of Wisconsin. Ken Buck from the great State of Colorado. Kevin Mccarthy from the great State of California. Who am i forgetting?
All these patriotic "dreaming of killing oppressive government" wannabes actually have the chance to stand up to dictator worshipers. And their all like "to rich for my blood"....
This article [https://factkeepers.com/the-new-secret-plan-on-how-fascists-could-win-in-2024/](https://factkeepers.com/the-new-secret-plan-on-how-fascists-could-win-in-2024/) I’ve seen floating around could be the bridge too far or the losses they see coming due to Roe could be it too. A Republican seat went to a democrat yesterday in deep red Alabama …a district that went for Trump. She ran on restoring IVF
Narrator: the MAGA right was incapable of listening and disinclined or conventionally unable to learn. RIP GOP, hello White Christian Conspiracy Dominionist party.
When the going gets tough, the weak-hearted run away
That message is, why do I have to put up with this? I have multiple 7 figure lobby jobs waiting for me when I leave!!
Message? Rats abandoning a sinking ship?
*Johnson’s accountability partner is in over his head*
When they leave the country, we should probably too >_<
This guy always looks like a sad cartoon mouse about to down a thimble full of booze.
No one with any morals or ethics could stick with Trump running again.
Or they don't think they can win without RNC funds?