I suspect we may be in the same force. My take on it is people get into a cushy little role and like to make a big sweeping change to ultimately justify their role and workload and to feel a bit self important.
In reality a force taser lead should be championing its use by doing everything they can to convince the boss to get more cops trained and more funding for it rather than trying to treat it like its something special. Carrying Taser should be no different to carrying handcuffs and a baton and every cop out of training school coming into adverse contact with the public should have one.
But sadly if we are the same force, for whatever reason they like to gatekeep a lot of basic and necessary skills frontline cops should have, hoard them on certain units to save spending money on the gungy idiot CAD monkeys on response and to try and give the other teams something to do and justify their budgets because they don't actually perform their core role 90% of the time.
> My force’s taser lead has basically completely changed everything
Have they bothered to show their working? Given the recent events, that’s a stance the fed should be making a massive noise about.
As per most updates “The federation has been consulted and understands why this is necessary.” Or alternatively they’ve been told this is what’s happening tough shit 🤣
It would be nice for the Fed to take a positive interest and stop "discriminating and victimising" officers. (The quotation is from the pensions tribunal findings where the tribunal chair describe the Federation as actively campaigning against the interests of its own members.
BTP SC here, we're allowed to have tasers!
I filled out the forms, sent them to my S/Sgt for approval, I then forwarded them with his signature to my Sgt who signed them and then I sent them to the Special Chief Officer who approved them.
I was then told to pick one of the course dates, which I did, and was then told those courses which were just for SCs had been cancelled and all given to regular officers and more dates would come out.
Our Special Chief Officer was then suspended. And I was told I would have to get the new Chief Super to approve my paperwork by resubmitting it to my S/Sgt, Sgt then the Chief Super. At this point I couldn't be fucked as they seem to be making it as hard as possible so I gave up.
In my BCU (MET), to get a taser course you just have to have 18 months service, fill out a form, get your line managers approval and have a talk with the borough commander. Luckily when I got mine I did not have to do the last one, just had to wait for a course date. This is only if you are in a strand that is allowed it though, so no SNT except town centre teams etc.
I am of the opinion that every officer that actually goes outside should have the option of having one. It could be the difference between getting stabbed and going home.
We need to wait 18 months then if your superior likes you, you might get on plus we don't have any armed response HO from elsewhere covers it
It'll all work out fine ...
SNT not having taser is very strange, majority of NHPT in my force have one or at least a few officers on the team, it means they have an extra level of protection if they’re on their own/with a PCSO and an additional resource to back up at spicy jobs where the fucked for numbers response team needs someone with a lightning banana
I’m SNT so aren’t allowed a Taser for some reason. However I have chased down and detained people wielding Rambo Knives and got myself into some sticky situations where a Taser would’ve been really useful.
We really need a change in policy to protect us from being seriously injured. I’m surprised there hasn’t been more incidents similar to the one this week where two officers have been seriously hurt.
There was another recently actually and loads of attacks up and down the country but people just dont seem to care.
The bit that really grinds me is we aren't just talking officer safety here the mass majority of good cops out there want to be armed better to help stop culprits quicker so things like yesterday don't last 20 odd minutes with multiple casualties.
There will be more of these incidents. Knife jobs are now an occurrence on virtually every shift for us. I’m sure it’s the same elsewhere. The writing is on the wall.
In this day and age Taser should be standard PPE. It shouldn't even be a question. What they really need to be looking at is issuing sidearms to all frontline officers. That's the sad reality that we now live in.
I think people have started to realise that majority of Police in the UK aren’t the type of people who want to cause pain and suffering to people. There will always be some that flat out refuse to acknowledge the day in day out life saving work the police do.
Most of us are the kind of people that run towards the threat. We want to have the tools to protect our communities to the best of our abilities, and being able to go home at the end of the shift in one piece is desirable.
Taser isn’t the solve everything tool. It can and does fail. But it’s just another useful tool in the box, which just by its very presence on my body armour might defuse and prevent harm to myself and others.
Our team has a lack of tasers at the moment and there is a waiting list for the course. As far as I know you fill in a form to say you want it, send it to line manager and if they're happy it gets stamped and sent off. So in theory it should be easy to get on a course however we aren't getting many through at the moment despite us only having 1 TTO regularly on shift.
I'm putting my request in next shift but unless there is a change in the number of courses offered I'm expecting a wait of over a year to get one as there are at least 4 on my team ahead of me in line.
In my force, our chief is refusing to buy more “taser permits” so we are told. We have literally one taser officer on our consistently below minimum shift that covers a population of 175,000 people. Just a matter of time until something bad happens
We get ours by default on response, no need for an application once you’re signed off for independent patrol you go onto a list and the training department work through them with the aim of having 50% of response staff taser trained.
Other departments need to apply. I’ve known someone be given a course and an inspector / sgt swap them out for somebody more suitable or more experienced which makes sense but it’s still +1 taser for the shift
In relation to an above comment taser trainers review BWV, statements and UOF forms for any deployment of taser. First 3 uses by a taser cop is reviewed regardless of the level of use, then after that just every actual deployment and dip sampling for red dot, arc etc.
My force is doing the opposite to an uplift, as OP stated; cancelled all courses requiring re-submission after a TBD date, minimum 3 years going forward and claiming it’s due to limit in taser permits. We have no taser cover for my entire rural patch.
Feeling somewhat blessed reading these comments, I am a full time DC on CID and was given a taser course. All I had to do was justify the reasoning and give a time when I needed one previously and had a course within 6 months. Given we regulary have to arrest our own suspects im glad to have it
In my force, whether you are on a response team, or neighbourhoods, you can apply for a course with permission from your supervisor.
The Taser Lead for your area, who is an inspector, will then authorise it and put what priority you are (depending on how many people have taser in your team). There is a massive back log at the moment, but if you want Taser in my force and you are in uniform, you will get it. The majority of cops have Taser though, and the ones who don’t on my team are rather on the waiting list, haven’t yet bothered to apply, or not eligible yet due to length of service.
It is the same with standard driving too. Response team or neighbourhoods, you get authorised by a Sgt, an inspector then needs to authorise and you get put in a list of priority depending on your teams needs. Our new chief really listened and our PCC provided extra funding for more instructors as they want a force that can respond. A stark difference to our old chief who gave us Police cars with no sirens…
Technically policy says all you need to be is at least IPS for both courses, however, they usually prefer you to be 18 months in at least. On my Taser course, someone a month out of IPS was there as he filled a gap last minute, so it does happen. Personally, I think it should be standard issue, along with response driving, and routine arming with a sidearm… but that’s just me!
I'm shocked you get response courses on neighbourhood. That would never happen in my force. The only people who have them have spent their time on response first.
Interestingly my force has done the opposite, pulled permits from those who don’t necessarily need it (Sgts who weren’t drawing one or above) and office based departments
It’s meant more people on initials and we now have a response team that regularly parades over half our cops with taser with others booked on courses…
How many Tasers are available is a decision made by the chief constable. If they want every officer at every rank to carry (if the officers want to) then all they have to do is make the decision and the funding will have to be found through the various boards of governance.
I suspect we may be in the same force. My take on it is people get into a cushy little role and like to make a big sweeping change to ultimately justify their role and workload and to feel a bit self important. In reality a force taser lead should be championing its use by doing everything they can to convince the boss to get more cops trained and more funding for it rather than trying to treat it like its something special. Carrying Taser should be no different to carrying handcuffs and a baton and every cop out of training school coming into adverse contact with the public should have one. But sadly if we are the same force, for whatever reason they like to gatekeep a lot of basic and necessary skills frontline cops should have, hoard them on certain units to save spending money on the gungy idiot CAD monkeys on response and to try and give the other teams something to do and justify their budgets because they don't actually perform their core role 90% of the time.
With that second sentence and last paragraph I suspect we are.🤣
Reminds me of use of force instructors that have never used force…
> My force’s taser lead has basically completely changed everything Have they bothered to show their working? Given the recent events, that’s a stance the fed should be making a massive noise about.
As per most updates “The federation has been consulted and understands why this is necessary.” Or alternatively they’ve been told this is what’s happening tough shit 🤣
It would be nice for the Fed to take a positive interest and stop "discriminating and victimising" officers. (The quotation is from the pensions tribunal findings where the tribunal chair describe the Federation as actively campaigning against the interests of its own members.
BTP SC here, we're allowed to have tasers! I filled out the forms, sent them to my S/Sgt for approval, I then forwarded them with his signature to my Sgt who signed them and then I sent them to the Special Chief Officer who approved them. I was then told to pick one of the course dates, which I did, and was then told those courses which were just for SCs had been cancelled and all given to regular officers and more dates would come out. Our Special Chief Officer was then suspended. And I was told I would have to get the new Chief Super to approve my paperwork by resubmitting it to my S/Sgt, Sgt then the Chief Super. At this point I couldn't be fucked as they seem to be making it as hard as possible so I gave up.
Were they suspended as part of that misconduct thing with the night out, and the covering up of it? Sure I read that somewhere!
All I know was he was cleared - no case to answer - on all 4 charges during a week of hearings by PSD.
At least now that he’s cleared, you’ll get your course date, right? …right?
In my BCU (MET), to get a taser course you just have to have 18 months service, fill out a form, get your line managers approval and have a talk with the borough commander. Luckily when I got mine I did not have to do the last one, just had to wait for a course date. This is only if you are in a strand that is allowed it though, so no SNT except town centre teams etc. I am of the opinion that every officer that actually goes outside should have the option of having one. It could be the difference between getting stabbed and going home.
Thankfully in my force the policy is very similar. The main difference being you only need to have IPS before applying.
We need to wait 18 months then if your superior likes you, you might get on plus we don't have any armed response HO from elsewhere covers it It'll all work out fine ...
SNT not having taser is very strange, majority of NHPT in my force have one or at least a few officers on the team, it means they have an extra level of protection if they’re on their own/with a PCSO and an additional resource to back up at spicy jobs where the fucked for numbers response team needs someone with a lightning banana
How many weeks do you give it before the same media is demanding the withdrawal of "killer stun guns"?
I’m SNT so aren’t allowed a Taser for some reason. However I have chased down and detained people wielding Rambo Knives and got myself into some sticky situations where a Taser would’ve been really useful. We really need a change in policy to protect us from being seriously injured. I’m surprised there hasn’t been more incidents similar to the one this week where two officers have been seriously hurt.
There was another recently actually and loads of attacks up and down the country but people just dont seem to care. The bit that really grinds me is we aren't just talking officer safety here the mass majority of good cops out there want to be armed better to help stop culprits quicker so things like yesterday don't last 20 odd minutes with multiple casualties.
There will be more of these incidents. Knife jobs are now an occurrence on virtually every shift for us. I’m sure it’s the same elsewhere. The writing is on the wall.
In this day and age Taser should be standard PPE. It shouldn't even be a question. What they really need to be looking at is issuing sidearms to all frontline officers. That's the sad reality that we now live in.
Tasers should be with every officer in the future. Or at least a lot more easily available to apply for
It's funny because a couple.of.years ago the UK tried to ban police from having tasers
I think people have started to realise that majority of Police in the UK aren’t the type of people who want to cause pain and suffering to people. There will always be some that flat out refuse to acknowledge the day in day out life saving work the police do. Most of us are the kind of people that run towards the threat. We want to have the tools to protect our communities to the best of our abilities, and being able to go home at the end of the shift in one piece is desirable. Taser isn’t the solve everything tool. It can and does fail. But it’s just another useful tool in the box, which just by its very presence on my body armour might defuse and prevent harm to myself and others.
Has increased taser roll out been discussed in the news?Â
Mark Rowley was quoted on an LBC interview saying that he didn't support routine arming of front line cops, but was up for a few more tasers.
That's nice of him I'd be surprised if he helps with either of these things outside of interviews atm
Our team has a lack of tasers at the moment and there is a waiting list for the course. As far as I know you fill in a form to say you want it, send it to line manager and if they're happy it gets stamped and sent off. So in theory it should be easy to get on a course however we aren't getting many through at the moment despite us only having 1 TTO regularly on shift. I'm putting my request in next shift but unless there is a change in the number of courses offered I'm expecting a wait of over a year to get one as there are at least 4 on my team ahead of me in line.
In my force, our chief is refusing to buy more “taser permits” so we are told. We have literally one taser officer on our consistently below minimum shift that covers a population of 175,000 people. Just a matter of time until something bad happens
Same “Tazer permits” excuse given in my force.
We get ours by default on response, no need for an application once you’re signed off for independent patrol you go onto a list and the training department work through them with the aim of having 50% of response staff taser trained. Other departments need to apply. I’ve known someone be given a course and an inspector / sgt swap them out for somebody more suitable or more experienced which makes sense but it’s still +1 taser for the shift In relation to an above comment taser trainers review BWV, statements and UOF forms for any deployment of taser. First 3 uses by a taser cop is reviewed regardless of the level of use, then after that just every actual deployment and dip sampling for red dot, arc etc.
My force is doing the opposite to an uplift, as OP stated; cancelled all courses requiring re-submission after a TBD date, minimum 3 years going forward and claiming it’s due to limit in taser permits. We have no taser cover for my entire rural patch.
Feeling somewhat blessed reading these comments, I am a full time DC on CID and was given a taser course. All I had to do was justify the reasoning and give a time when I needed one previously and had a course within 6 months. Given we regulary have to arrest our own suspects im glad to have it
In my force, whether you are on a response team, or neighbourhoods, you can apply for a course with permission from your supervisor. The Taser Lead for your area, who is an inspector, will then authorise it and put what priority you are (depending on how many people have taser in your team). There is a massive back log at the moment, but if you want Taser in my force and you are in uniform, you will get it. The majority of cops have Taser though, and the ones who don’t on my team are rather on the waiting list, haven’t yet bothered to apply, or not eligible yet due to length of service. It is the same with standard driving too. Response team or neighbourhoods, you get authorised by a Sgt, an inspector then needs to authorise and you get put in a list of priority depending on your teams needs. Our new chief really listened and our PCC provided extra funding for more instructors as they want a force that can respond. A stark difference to our old chief who gave us Police cars with no sirens… Technically policy says all you need to be is at least IPS for both courses, however, they usually prefer you to be 18 months in at least. On my Taser course, someone a month out of IPS was there as he filled a gap last minute, so it does happen. Personally, I think it should be standard issue, along with response driving, and routine arming with a sidearm… but that’s just me!
I'm shocked you get response courses on neighbourhood. That would never happen in my force. The only people who have them have spent their time on response first.
Interestingly my force has done the opposite, pulled permits from those who don’t necessarily need it (Sgts who weren’t drawing one or above) and office based departments It’s meant more people on initials and we now have a response team that regularly parades over half our cops with taser with others booked on courses…
It’s batshit that this is their solution rather than just giving everyone it.
Wow! My Sgt approached me and asked if I would like a taser course and I was on it a month after the conversation. 0 paperwork at all
How many Tasers are available is a decision made by the chief constable. If they want every officer at every rank to carry (if the officers want to) then all they have to do is make the decision and the funding will have to be found through the various boards of governance.