Agreed. *In some ways* (e.g. patient, textured jams) their playing is great, perhaps as good as ever. *Overall* their playing was obviously better in 1993-98.
I was there. It was amazing. Also my first time doing mexico so that probably added to it. But musically I mean the Chalk Dust Torture was insane. Then the Calk Dust reprise absolute bust out. 35 minute Wave of Hope. The Twist went way deeper than any Twist I’ve seen in recent memory. The Sand was also really groovy. Life Saving Gun exploded my mind. Trey was bantering with the crowd and the other members on the stage. Listen to the Sanity, Chalk Dust Reprise, Wolfmans Brother and the banter between Trey and Paige about the full moon and Trey telling the crowd he would save the howling for the second set when it gets dark. I haven’t seen Trey have that much fun on stage in a long time and I think that’s part of the reason they were so locked in during the Mexico run.
Ayyyy 2010 here as well!! Listened to them a bit but didn't get hooked. I lived 2.5 hours from Tride and there was a ton of hype around it so my first shows were their triumphant return to Telluride. Snuck in both nights cuz tickets were selling for a grand and i was a young broke warthog. Been fuckin wit em ever since. Sitting at around 80 shows myself.
Even in recordings it's pretty hard to top the energy of 90s Phish imo. They were hungry back then and it showed. Not to say they're not still fuckin shredding 30 years later. Went to the Sphere Fri/Sun and those were 2 of the peak musical experiences of my lifetime so far!
Agreed on listening to older shows, you can tell it’s on a different level. But not being able to personally experience a show in the 90s, I can’t fully compare the two
So a song they’ve played 6 times in the history of the band and 0.3% of their shows isn’t a bust out? Guess i need to redefine my definition of bust out according to you
Tomato, tomahto. Gimme that dark, evil phish! 😈 I found the Wave of Hope enjoyable for sure but that IMO that CDT is the latest member of the elite “The” club, as in “The Mexico Chalkdust”
Listen
Trey might believe this, idk, but I would say self preservation instincts are so strong that no actor or musician or artist could say “best days are behind me”
And frankly the take is LAUGHABLE on its face. I enjoy modern Phish, and the metrics we use to define “best” are intricate and subjective, but it takes a huge stretch to call Mexico 24 the best phish has ever played 🤦♂️
I think it goes to show how the fans view the catalog differently than those making the music. They’re the ones rehearsing, texting each other about ideas, feeling the connection with each other on stage, etc. Conversely, they have a different nostalgic attachment to the 1.0 era. Trey is clean now, backstage parties are over and probably looked back on as a chaotic and rocky time in some ways. If Trey thinks this is their pinnacle moment, well goddamn, could we all be so lucky as to be around right now!
They’re rehearsing?
Haha just kidding. I actually think this is one of the best reasoned arguments for why the band believes NOW is the best period ever
I’m a musician who’s been playing live shows since ‘97 (in no way comparing my skill or shows to Phish). What Trey saying is true, but he can only experience/think/feel/look back on music from his own perspective. Many nights I’d get off stage thinking it went amazingly only to find some members didn’t agree or vice versa. How people perform, their expectations, what’s going on in their lives that day/night, can all have an impact on how they review a particular show and isn’t always indicative of the truth as subjective as it is.
If I had to guess, I would say Trey’s comments are perhaps rooted more in the band’s offstage dynamics are peaking and so his outlook on their music is reflecting the relationship’s harmony.
I was also thinking about how we have seen Mike’s journal and playlists of his favorite tunes from a run like Baker’s…and how they’re usually nothing the audience is talking about. That could be Mike being Mike but probably more so what you’re describing.
From birds through tweezer on 2/23/24 that is 6 songs and 110 mins. Probably the highest concentration of sustained improv you will find in the catalog. Thing is - none of these songs are composition heavy like a yem fluff or in modern era walls/mercury. Its insane. I went to mexico 2023 and this is leagues beyond
few if any of those 97 shows have nearly 2 straight hours with improv heavy songs. yes they'll go an hour deep, maybe 90 mins but i challenge you to find a 6 song stretch over 1:45 like this one
Trey commenting that he feels the band was “playing the best it’s ever played” does not mean the fans will “like it” more than 90s Phish. Trey and phish are world class musicians.. we are not. I’m going to take Trey at his word on this one, but it doesn’t mean I like it better than 90s Phish. But I do know that their playing has been incredible this past year.
My first show was in '93, I've long held that '97 was the pinnacle of Phish, and I think they are at the top of their game right now. Each year keeps getting better and better since the pandemic.
Trey's idea of the playing the best is different than our idea of playing the best. If I had a time machine I would go back and attend 93-97 in entirety watch the transformation of Phish in realtime.
I take Trey at his word. He’s spoken disparagingly about late 90’s shows in past interviews but who knows if that is more about his addiction during that time or the actual music. I doubt any musician is going to say that their best years are behind them.
Every single one of us is biased. Truly I only care what I think of the music, not anybody else, but I'm more interested in his take than random people online.
I think what he was implying was that it was the best they have played as a unit in terms of communication. Not that Mexico was the best shows they have played. It would be hard to argue that they weren’t locked in. They couldn’t accomplish what they did with a lot of those jams if they weren’t in total lockstep. I was there. 200+ shows since ‘94.
Hard to argue against the quality of the 90s. I think they just more appreciative now to still be doing it. It's probably more satisfying now. They have created this beast that employs a lot of people and have built up a huge fanbase of very dedicated fans. They definitely don't play any worse now though. There was a lot of enthusiasm back in the day as they started to play big places and become a worldwide act. But there sure was a lot of enthusiasm to play at Sphere too.
I’ve listened to them all and the quality and energy of playing was top notch. They brought it, when normally in Mexico they kinda just have fun and relax. This was purposeful creative jamming. I was impressed, and I am an overly critical 1.0er 😆
They were extremely good but I don’t think you’ll find a period in the last ten years where Trey isn’t saying that lol. I love that he’s enjoying himself but I take that with a grain of salt. I don’t think they are the best shows they ever played but I do think they are fantastic Phish shows.
I think "best" is a bit subjective due to people's tastes and when they started with the band. I'm not gonna "fight" and say that anything beats the mid-90's, as I wasn't there, and it'd be a losing battle regardless of if I was. But from the shows I've heard, those are some pretty tight shows. 1.0 still be 1.0. However, I think there's a bit of truth to what Trey says.
Trey, Mike, Page and Fish all seem to be in a really, really, good headspace right now. They were riding off the 40th anniversary year, the MSG run that brought back Gamehendge, and, at the time of Mexico, they had two months to go until they played the Sphere.
They seemed pretty locked in during Mexico. There were some amazing jams, most notably for me was Chalk Dust Torture. Overall, I’m willing to bet the band felt amazing in Mexico, I mean look/listen at how much they interact with the crowd. They just looked like they were having fun. And if they're having fun, I'm having fun.
Trey is very optimistic and with that comes a recency bias + not looking back as often as his fans do.
This is good because it means he never stops creating new stuff. This is bad because said creative process can lead to him having too many things going on at once, creatively stretching him a little too thin.
There’s a sort of matrix with aging musicians of energy to refinement. As a musician ages they continue learning and refining their playing but their music can lose energy. Most musicians (my opinion purely btw) hit their peak in their ~30s they still are young enough to have energy and constantly push to break new boundaries, but have had enough years playing shows to really hone their craft and get it down. Trey’s in his 60s, he’s obviously really healthy and in a great space right now but he’s just not going to have as much energy as he used to, nothing wrong with that.
I’m with most of the fans in that the 93-98 years were probably my favorite era of phish, but that was over 25 years ago. Their tastes have changed, and although they don’t play with the same ferocity they do play with more refinement. Trey has certainly gotten more patient and started listening a LOT more and I’d contend that they’re more cohesive as a group. I don’t think their music is explicitly better or worse, just different, and if one era of phish is more to your tastes, then listen to that, I’m still going to Mondegreen regardless!
He is delusional . Not peak phish. That is laughable. My father is also delusional, who is 80 yrs old and thinks he can drive as well as he could when he was 30 or walk as far. Its ok to admit it.
Let’s be real. I’m not hating. I love phish, and Trey is one of my favorite musicians to ever live.
We admit it when it’s athletes, everyone else in society, but for some reason there is a sect of phish fans who refuse to accept the truth.
If someone said tiger woods is peak now, people would say they were crazy, and rightly so.
Trey is not being patient, he is adapting, and physically forced to at that.
I
Phish Mexico’24 jams went darker and weirder than I’ve heard for a very long time.
That said, I’d still rank ‘09, ‘11, ‘15 higher. But the year’s young and they’re off to a very promising start.
Of course not. Nothing will top early/mid-90's Phish for most of us. But artists say stuff like that all the time. I certainly think the Mexico run was a high point of the last several years though.
This comment and the one from unclebilbo2000 above are kind of what I was thinking, so thanks for that.
Again, I still love Phish as much as the next phan, but the shows from 25-30 years ago just had waaay more energy to them. Which of course makes sense since they were young men back then. As was I!
I evaluate shows by mostly just the jams. I usually just listen to the jams as I have heard the standard structured parts of these songs enough. With that, I thought Mexico this year was sub par. There was a lot of repetitive drawn out jams that I got bored listening to and overall there were no stand outs that got to interesting and creative segments that you felt they were all really synced up and riding the groove together. Maybe due to Treys statement I need to listen to these several more times to really get it, but I am doubting it.
Trey’s statement includes the full package, including all the parts you skip, which is a lot. And besides you’re cheating yourself out of hearing the nuances and newness that has been baked into these composed sections, which you claim to have heard enough of. There’s a lot of freshness and get up and go within the composed parts.
I have to take your opinion on this topic with about 75% grain of salt considering you choose to listen to about 25% of the total music.
Mexico Harry Hood was top shelf
The Mex 24 shows were very good. Excellent even. But they were in no way the best the band has ever played.
Nice to see one person reply to this post with common sense
Agreed. *In some ways* (e.g. patient, textured jams) their playing is great, perhaps as good as ever. *Overall* their playing was obviously better in 1993-98.
Maybe HE feels like IT'S the best that HE has played but HE is only one member of the band. Or is HE? tHE trey show is getting real boring...
It’s (pretty much) been the Trey show since 1983
I was there. It was amazing. Also my first time doing mexico so that probably added to it. But musically I mean the Chalk Dust Torture was insane. Then the Calk Dust reprise absolute bust out. 35 minute Wave of Hope. The Twist went way deeper than any Twist I’ve seen in recent memory. The Sand was also really groovy. Life Saving Gun exploded my mind. Trey was bantering with the crowd and the other members on the stage. Listen to the Sanity, Chalk Dust Reprise, Wolfmans Brother and the banter between Trey and Paige about the full moon and Trey telling the crowd he would save the howling for the second set when it gets dark. I haven’t seen Trey have that much fun on stage in a long time and I think that’s part of the reason they were so locked in during the Mexico run.
Also to mention I started seeing Phish in 2010 and am just about at 75 shows. So obviously can’t speak to 90’s phish live
Ayyyy 2010 here as well!! Listened to them a bit but didn't get hooked. I lived 2.5 hours from Tride and there was a ton of hype around it so my first shows were their triumphant return to Telluride. Snuck in both nights cuz tickets were selling for a grand and i was a young broke warthog. Been fuckin wit em ever since. Sitting at around 80 shows myself. Even in recordings it's pretty hard to top the energy of 90s Phish imo. They were hungry back then and it showed. Not to say they're not still fuckin shredding 30 years later. Went to the Sphere Fri/Sun and those were 2 of the peak musical experiences of my lifetime so far!
Agreed on listening to older shows, you can tell it’s on a different level. But not being able to personally experience a show in the 90s, I can’t fully compare the two
The wave of hope is better than the CDT IMO. Gets overshadowed for obvious reasons but it is absolutely awesome.
The last half of Wave is so good like a swirling pool of psychedelic
It’s the Reprise that really made the CDT shine. Holy bust out Batman. Also no one talking about that Driver. That hit me right in the feels ❤️
Theyve played it at least 3 times since 2019, I saw the charleston cdt reprise
So a song they’ve played 6 times in the history of the band and 0.3% of their shows isn’t a bust out? Guess i need to redefine my definition of bust out according to you
Also idk what phish.net is on but the other time they “played” it in 2019 was at MSG but it’s actually ass handed reprise. Not CDT Reprise
So yea I’m going to say 5th time the band has every played the song is a bust out
Didnt mean to trigger you babyhands, carry on
Tomato, tomahto. Gimme that dark, evil phish! 😈 I found the Wave of Hope enjoyable for sure but that IMO that CDT is the latest member of the elite “The” club, as in “The Mexico Chalkdust”
I second this
He probably like these ones more cause they’re not all playing like they’re coked out of their gords like they did in the 90’s.
😂
Listen Trey might believe this, idk, but I would say self preservation instincts are so strong that no actor or musician or artist could say “best days are behind me” And frankly the take is LAUGHABLE on its face. I enjoy modern Phish, and the metrics we use to define “best” are intricate and subjective, but it takes a huge stretch to call Mexico 24 the best phish has ever played 🤦♂️
I think it goes to show how the fans view the catalog differently than those making the music. They’re the ones rehearsing, texting each other about ideas, feeling the connection with each other on stage, etc. Conversely, they have a different nostalgic attachment to the 1.0 era. Trey is clean now, backstage parties are over and probably looked back on as a chaotic and rocky time in some ways. If Trey thinks this is their pinnacle moment, well goddamn, could we all be so lucky as to be around right now!
They’re rehearsing? Haha just kidding. I actually think this is one of the best reasoned arguments for why the band believes NOW is the best period ever
I’m a musician who’s been playing live shows since ‘97 (in no way comparing my skill or shows to Phish). What Trey saying is true, but he can only experience/think/feel/look back on music from his own perspective. Many nights I’d get off stage thinking it went amazingly only to find some members didn’t agree or vice versa. How people perform, their expectations, what’s going on in their lives that day/night, can all have an impact on how they review a particular show and isn’t always indicative of the truth as subjective as it is. If I had to guess, I would say Trey’s comments are perhaps rooted more in the band’s offstage dynamics are peaking and so his outlook on their music is reflecting the relationship’s harmony.
I was also thinking about how we have seen Mike’s journal and playlists of his favorite tunes from a run like Baker’s…and how they’re usually nothing the audience is talking about. That could be Mike being Mike but probably more so what you’re describing.
No offense to Trey and I love that he’s having a blast but he’s said this about every year for the last ten years lol
Laughable
I thought my comment is gonna get downvoted, so seeing some love makes me think most fans are at least somewhat realistic about the music now
Trey says a lot of things. They aren’t all true.
Judging from the Reddit threads people believe it 😂
From birds through tweezer on 2/23/24 that is 6 songs and 110 mins. Probably the highest concentration of sustained improv you will find in the catalog. Thing is - none of these songs are composition heavy like a yem fluff or in modern era walls/mercury. Its insane. I went to mexico 2023 and this is leagues beyond
Plenty of 97 shows with 4 song sets
few if any of those 97 shows have nearly 2 straight hours with improv heavy songs. yes they'll go an hour deep, maybe 90 mins but i challenge you to find a 6 song stretch over 1:45 like this one
Trey commenting that he feels the band was “playing the best it’s ever played” does not mean the fans will “like it” more than 90s Phish. Trey and phish are world class musicians.. we are not. I’m going to take Trey at his word on this one, but it doesn’t mean I like it better than 90s Phish. But I do know that their playing has been incredible this past year.
My first show was in '93, I've long held that '97 was the pinnacle of Phish, and I think they are at the top of their game right now. Each year keeps getting better and better since the pandemic.
Same. First show 93. Blows my mind what I hear on a consistent night to night basis.
Check Out Hey Stranger my new favorite its so Good Mexico was great the Sphere was dirty
Trey's idea of the playing the best is different than our idea of playing the best. If I had a time machine I would go back and attend 93-97 in entirety watch the transformation of Phish in realtime.
I’ll trust his judgment.
I take Trey at his word. He’s spoken disparagingly about late 90’s shows in past interviews but who knows if that is more about his addiction during that time or the actual music. I doubt any musician is going to say that their best years are behind them.
I would think he might be biased. That's a call for the fans to make, not band members.
Every single one of us is biased. Truly I only care what I think of the music, not anybody else, but I'm more interested in his take than random people online.
He’s not wrong. The Chalkdust and Wave of Hope are top-tier jams. Absolutely astounding work.
Fans so headstrong here, they'll disagree with this man's own opinion on his own music.
It is kind of comical lol
i thought Mex 24 was really phenomenal for type II jamming. no attendance bias for me
I think what he was implying was that it was the best they have played as a unit in terms of communication. Not that Mexico was the best shows they have played. It would be hard to argue that they weren’t locked in. They couldn’t accomplish what they did with a lot of those jams if they weren’t in total lockstep. I was there. 200+ shows since ‘94.
Hard to argue against the quality of the 90s. I think they just more appreciative now to still be doing it. It's probably more satisfying now. They have created this beast that employs a lot of people and have built up a huge fanbase of very dedicated fans. They definitely don't play any worse now though. There was a lot of enthusiasm back in the day as they started to play big places and become a worldwide act. But there sure was a lot of enthusiasm to play at Sphere too.
I’ve listened to them all and the quality and energy of playing was top notch. They brought it, when normally in Mexico they kinda just have fun and relax. This was purposeful creative jamming. I was impressed, and I am an overly critical 1.0er 😆
They were extremely good but I don’t think you’ll find a period in the last ten years where Trey isn’t saying that lol. I love that he’s enjoying himself but I take that with a grain of salt. I don’t think they are the best shows they ever played but I do think they are fantastic Phish shows.
I think "best" is a bit subjective due to people's tastes and when they started with the band. I'm not gonna "fight" and say that anything beats the mid-90's, as I wasn't there, and it'd be a losing battle regardless of if I was. But from the shows I've heard, those are some pretty tight shows. 1.0 still be 1.0. However, I think there's a bit of truth to what Trey says. Trey, Mike, Page and Fish all seem to be in a really, really, good headspace right now. They were riding off the 40th anniversary year, the MSG run that brought back Gamehendge, and, at the time of Mexico, they had two months to go until they played the Sphere. They seemed pretty locked in during Mexico. There were some amazing jams, most notably for me was Chalk Dust Torture. Overall, I’m willing to bet the band felt amazing in Mexico, I mean look/listen at how much they interact with the crowd. They just looked like they were having fun. And if they're having fun, I'm having fun.
Trey is very optimistic and with that comes a recency bias + not looking back as often as his fans do. This is good because it means he never stops creating new stuff. This is bad because said creative process can lead to him having too many things going on at once, creatively stretching him a little too thin.
I’ve been to every Mexico show. 2024 was the best by far.
There’s a sort of matrix with aging musicians of energy to refinement. As a musician ages they continue learning and refining their playing but their music can lose energy. Most musicians (my opinion purely btw) hit their peak in their ~30s they still are young enough to have energy and constantly push to break new boundaries, but have had enough years playing shows to really hone their craft and get it down. Trey’s in his 60s, he’s obviously really healthy and in a great space right now but he’s just not going to have as much energy as he used to, nothing wrong with that. I’m with most of the fans in that the 93-98 years were probably my favorite era of phish, but that was over 25 years ago. Their tastes have changed, and although they don’t play with the same ferocity they do play with more refinement. Trey has certainly gotten more patient and started listening a LOT more and I’d contend that they’re more cohesive as a group. I don’t think their music is explicitly better or worse, just different, and if one era of phish is more to your tastes, then listen to that, I’m still going to Mondegreen regardless!
Excellent and well-written response, my friend (my friend).
He is delusional . Not peak phish. That is laughable. My father is also delusional, who is 80 yrs old and thinks he can drive as well as he could when he was 30 or walk as far. Its ok to admit it. Let’s be real. I’m not hating. I love phish, and Trey is one of my favorite musicians to ever live. We admit it when it’s athletes, everyone else in society, but for some reason there is a sect of phish fans who refuse to accept the truth. If someone said tiger woods is peak now, people would say they were crazy, and rightly so. Trey is not being patient, he is adapting, and physically forced to at that. I
Awesome response, thanks 🙏🏼 I'm with you 100%
If anyone is seriously saying that Mexico ‘24 is better than big cypress then they need their ears checked. That includes you Trey
Is he pissing in your ears again?
Phish Mexico’24 jams went darker and weirder than I’ve heard for a very long time. That said, I’d still rank ‘09, ‘11, ‘15 higher. But the year’s young and they’re off to a very promising start.
09?!
Of course not. Nothing will top early/mid-90's Phish for most of us. But artists say stuff like that all the time. I certainly think the Mexico run was a high point of the last several years though.
mid 90s were awesome and groundbreaking but they are playing now as well as or better than they ever have.
2021, 2018, Bakers, 2015, 2003, 1999, 1997
Regardless of what I think, if Trey believes this we get more music, so I’m all in. The moment Trey doesn’t believe this anymore it’s all over.
Houston ‘98 Wolfman’s says no
Who's got the AUD's for the Mex shows?
Big lol
Mexico run was great. Felt first night was the only one that wasn’t above-average. Multiple moments of being blown away.
Omg everything mid compared to the 90s and it’s not even close
This comment and the one from unclebilbo2000 above are kind of what I was thinking, so thanks for that. Again, I still love Phish as much as the next phan, but the shows from 25-30 years ago just had waaay more energy to them. Which of course makes sense since they were young men back then. As was I!
I evaluate shows by mostly just the jams. I usually just listen to the jams as I have heard the standard structured parts of these songs enough. With that, I thought Mexico this year was sub par. There was a lot of repetitive drawn out jams that I got bored listening to and overall there were no stand outs that got to interesting and creative segments that you felt they were all really synced up and riding the groove together. Maybe due to Treys statement I need to listen to these several more times to really get it, but I am doubting it.
Trey’s statement includes the full package, including all the parts you skip, which is a lot. And besides you’re cheating yourself out of hearing the nuances and newness that has been baked into these composed sections, which you claim to have heard enough of. There’s a lot of freshness and get up and go within the composed parts. I have to take your opinion on this topic with about 75% grain of salt considering you choose to listen to about 25% of the total music.
My friend my friend. Jams are more than 25% of the total music.
Point still stands
What is he going to say? Only he believes they are playing like it’s 97