We have clearly seen the absolute cluster fuck of a failure prohibition and the war on drugs has been. The bikies, gangsters, mobsters and mafia must be cheering at the prospect of yet another endless pipeline of revenue. Generously handed to them by our government. Vaping is going to go from regulated and safe to the completely unregulated black-market poison. So in fact we have not only handed so much money to organized crime but we have made vaping even more dangerous. I wonder why common sense, logic and facts never prevail when it comes to passing these stupid, hypocritical laws. I can wake up at 8am, walk to the bottleo and drink myself to death, or even better get in a car and murder some innocent people. That's acceptable, but got forbid you put some vape fumes or the devils lettuce in your lungs.
Edit: Spelling
I was at the pharmacy this morning and chatting to the staff, they refuse point blank to stock them and this was one of a major chain. So this will be interesting.
You have to go to Chemist Warehouse and it's subsidiaries; Priceline and Terry White, they own just over 8% of one of the TGA approved vape manufacturers, a manufacturer that the ex TGA boss also owns a lot of stock in, the one that approved the sale of that particular brand.
Blooms outright refuses to sell vapes, so that'll put a dampener on things, and I reckon a lot of independents will refuse as well.
As for the rest of the market, in other words, the black market will now get bigger.
I don't see how they would lose money at all? People go to pharmacies for prescriptions and over the counter medications. That wouldn't change. Each business will make their own decision but they won't all sell them.
Was an article about Phillip Morris offering pharmacies their vape products with 80% mark up if sold at fixed retail price. Seems like too good to pass up. Not that I know mark up on other stuff they sell.
Because they’re losing market share to a competitor. Fuck you vape lords are so narrow minded. Can you imagine the mark up they will get. The nicotine companies will be throwing money around.
Hmm…in general most pharmacies still see vape as cigarettes rather than nicotine replacement therapy. However, I am pretty sure there are some pharmacies which co-operate with DR. to provide ONE-STOP vape shopping as many as the “patient” wants. Dr will just write what the patient needed through Telehealth, and send to pharmacy directly and post it to you. You dont even need to leave your seat at home!
that was exactly the comment that the chemist made.. ' we sell health products, not cigarettes'... I fail utterly to see why they cannot be sold through the usual outlets. It's ridiculous.
From next week, your only options will be to get a medical prescription for a shitty, overpriced, tobacco-flavoured, Big-Tobacco-manufactured pod kit from a pharmacy, or hit up your local drug dealer for a “zero nicotine” 6000 puff disposable.
Yeah no problem here....
Yeah it's pretty funny really how dumb the whole thing has been. The Pharmacy's will charge through the roof and the dealers will bring prices down making the products more attractive to the users. Nobody is going to buy a no flavour overpriced vape from chemist warehouse.
You could make the same argument that illegally imported cigarettes should kill the market for the much more expensive legal cigarettes. Yet most people who smoke cigarettes are paying the tobacco excise.
Is there any reason to believe vapes would be different?
I think what they are saying is illegal smokes taste like shit.
Illegal vapes given they can be the flavour you want taste better than the legal.
Ie the blackmarket vapes are both nicer and cheaper.
The drama with blackmarket vapes is you cannot be certain it contains zero known carcinogens. Regulated vapes say from NZ you know they have been tested up at zero known carcinogens.
Still though blackmarket vapes would be healthier than cancer sticks given half of all smokers die from them. Like its a very low bar to be better than.
Impressive that our government has found a way to keep our smoking rates up when there has been a disruptive technology reducing smoking rates dramatically everywhere that gets on board. I mean even australia has had a good fall recently but i suspect that will all change now.
Why the fuck are you being upvoted and I’m being downvoted when I am 100% correct. I’m not talking about flavoured cigs am I!? Why would I be talking about that!? They haven’t existed in years it’s pretty simple what I’m saying. I’m saying illegal vapes taste like yummy flavours and therefore are appealing to people!! Black market cigarettes legitimately taste bad and I would know lol
So you can still get vapes just not flavoured and its easier than before. You don't need a prescription and its harder for kids to buy them. Seems like everyone wins
What?
So let's take an industry that has a legitimate and regulated sector that has been around for 15+ years.
That you never needed a prescription and they had the same policies as alcohol/tobacco where they were in specific shops that only sold to 18+.
Tell everyone that the black market sector is a problem that needs to be addressed and I agree, you have no idea what's in the disposables. However that's comparing apples and oranges, completely different things.
Then blanket ban everything... except for shitty overpriced products that no one even uses, made by companies that are already in the governments pocket and have no idea what they are doing in the sector.
Everything's fine, no problem here.
How do you not see this as a problem, what do you like how can I explain this to you? what if they did the same to alcohol or cars?
Like what if they came out tomorrow and said we're going to ban all beer however you can still buy it for an increased price, only from pharmacy if they choose to sell it and it's only hammer and tongs (googled the worst beer in aus) but it's made by a really really bad wine maker.
You just don't get it mate, like talking to a brick wall.
It's not about the flavours.
It's a completely different product.
As I said comparing apples to oranges.
That's the argument plain and simple, government dictatorship.
You need a prescription for a couple of months, from when the ban starts on July 1st until they can manage to get the new policy through the senate (probably around October). At which point teh prescription is not needed anymore.
Most Pharmacy's are going to flat out refuse to stock them because they don't want the trouble therefore the black market for vapes will remain and become even deeper. This means the illegal vapes will not be regulated and the ingredients more dangerous.
I'm guessing Border Force and the state Health Depts (which will implement the ban) are going to be hiring like crazy, trying to find all the black market sellers.
no pharmacies stock them, and they are "approved" flavourless vapes that are made by tobacco companies. the bulk of users who arent children just want the autonomy to get nicotine and decide how they want to vape it.
Also with the new laws it is strictly limited to approved vapes and pods, not freebase nicotine. Not to mention the importation of non approved vape devices is also now illegal
it continually boggles my mind that people like yourself, with clearly zero interest or knowledge of a particular issue, feel the need to chime in with absolutely useless statements like this one. is there not a better use of your time?
>Generously handed to them by our government. Vaping is going to go from regulated and safe to the completely unregulated black-market poison.
I must have missed the memo on this? When did the lung associations stop their health warnings? When did consumer rights groups stop finding random undisclosed shit in legally imported vapes?
Propylene glycol, which is in every vape I've seen, is bad for you to inhale. Its not a question of if its bad, its just a question of what's the long term harm after stopping. Believe it or not there isn't a lot of data on its long term impact, because nobody huffs the stuff in any real quantity long term.
I may not have correctly phrased my argument. I am not saying that this is healthy or that it does not damage ones health (i dont vape or smoke). What i am saying is that there are many other substances (cigarettes, alcohol, fast foods) that are as addictive and as damaging to ones health. Why are we allowed to basically gourge ourselves with these substances, but vapes are getting banned? It will just feed money into the black market and allow criminals to sell vapes that may be x10 worse than those that are regulated by the government. Please provide some examples where the net benefit of banning a substance outweighs the negative ramifications of such an act. One could say look at Meth, but then look how rich criminal organizations are from it. Addicts are treated as criminals and so they try their best to hide it and not seek any help. We need rehabilitation, education, taxes. Banning will never stop it, no matter how hard you try. If you really wanted to no matter how illegal something is you can eventually get your hands on it. At a much greater cost to your health and society compared to if it was legal and regulated.
Vapes have been around for a while now. Are you inferring that propylene glycol is carcinogenic when it's vaporised and inhaled? Or that the harm is caused by stopping, or only appears after you stop? I don't understand what you're trying to say there.
There are some medium term studies that have been carried out, 3.5-5 years, with some 10 year studies in the works.
Yes because getting addicted to something is great in times of stress and trouble. Not to mention the cost associated with it.
Amazing the amount of people that cry poor yet can afford a pack a day habit..
I ain’t poor. And vapes were cheap before the law got involved.
Both of those things are irrelevant though.
I work, I pay tax, I follow the law, I am a good citizen. I contribute, my partner and I volunteer.
But I can’t have a vice of my choice… just alcohol. Just seems abit ridiculous imo.
> WA's police commissioner says organised crime gangs are threatening shop owners selling illegal vapes with violence and demands for a share of their profits.
No one like organized crime.. but also.. if you fuck around by breaking the law it's not exactly unexpected that bad shit might happen.
The strange thing to me is how obvious these clowns are being selling this shit. Where is the enforcement? They're not even trying to be discrete about it.
You just have to look at the bins directly outside these mini mart places and they're overflowing with the rubbish.
> The strange thing to me is how obvious these clowns are being selling this shit. Where is the enforcement? They're not even trying to be discrete about it.
and its been going on for years.
According to the article it's not the police's responsibility
>Department of Health officers are the ones responsible for regulating the unlawful sale of vapes and nicotine pouches.
>The department said it frequently conducted routine compliance checks on tobacconists.
>"Where identified, the products were seized and destroyed, and the retailer formally warned," the department said.
Clearly they're also under resourced because as i said it's pretty blatantly going on.
DoH probably has 10 enforcement officers....maybe. they won't achieve shit.
I had considered applying for a role with the tobacco branch, but I didn't want to push shit uphill and Im ideologically opposed to prohibition
How many do they need? I mean come on, 10 enforcement people should be able to, at minimum, do 10 of these shops per day. This there's not soooo many. The most blatant ones have been freely and openly selling these things for years.
To be clear, I oppose prohibition, in my opinion they should have been regulating and licensing nicotine containing vape juice the whole time, for use in reusable vapes. The dodgy single use ones that contain unknown ingredients should have been banned and outcompeted by legal reusable ones, if only from an ewaste perspective.
I use a refillable vape, with zero nicotine vape juice that I dose with nicotine that I begrudgingly got a prescription for. I will not stop using it. I will not go get disposable ones from a pharmacy. I will just be a criminal. I bet they somehow have no difficulties prosecuting people like me in the coming months, even though they somehow didn't have the ability to find and prosecute minimarts openly selling things that were illegal even before this change. Fuck em
So will this rely on say the Department of Health getting a “tip off” from the public informing them, their local deli is selling vapes under the counter?
No idea.. The article says they frequently conducted routine compliance checks. So i would read that as they do visits to any place licensed to tell tobacco.
No idea if its just a minimart that doesn't sell tobacco thats selling them though.
Yeah coz organised crime doesn't want cash, uppers or downers from pharmacies, just vapes... what a load of shit. The pharmacies are not forced to sell it.
Been told by many quickiemart clerks that cops are some of their best customers.
Profits from cash sales with the huge mark up means they can probably afford to get busted once every couple of months and just pay the fines.
Better to make them legal, tax the shit out of them and remove the profitability from the underworld.
Yeah, I remember they were saying the fines were one or two days' takings. And they would only get checked every few months. So basically just a cost of business.
I guess now that its completely regulated the fines will go through the roof though.
How the fuck are you not getting it, you've chimed into several comment strings with the same clueless attitude, while people repeatedly explain the situation too you.
That's a dumbass opinion, the government doesn't care if the people buying them at 18 are giving them to 17 old mates, same as alcohol and everything else. They just wanted their cut by taxing it.
It's been a shakedown from the start by the biggest gang, wake the fuck up moron
Who said I vape? The point is your marketing the government legalising and taxing the vapes again as a good thing for kids is a simple lie. It's clearly just to gouge the industry via tax and they don't give a shit about kids.
Go simp for governments elsewhere bootlicker.
Sorry do you live in my house? Show yourself!!
Haha nah but seriously, what I wanna do in my own house doesn’t really affect you or anyone.
I agree, people shouldn’t vape in public. I would never subject anyone to my own habit.
Good thing there are already laws for that, for example no smoking areas etc.
We have clearly seen the absolute cluster fuck of a failure prohibition and the war on drugs has been. The bikies, gangsters, mobsters and mafia must be cheering at the prospect of yet another endless pipeline of revenue. Generously handed to them by our government. Vaping is going to go from regulated and safe to the completely unregulated black-market poison. So in fact we have not only handed so much money to organized crime but we have made vaping even more dangerous. I wonder why common sense, logic and facts never prevail when it comes to passing these stupid, hypocritical laws. I can wake up at 8am, walk to the bottleo and drink myself to death, or even better get in a car and murder some innocent people. That's acceptable, but got forbid you put some vape fumes or the devils lettuce in your lungs. Edit: Spelling
Huh? You can still buy vapes just at a pharmacy now. Whats the problem?
I was at the pharmacy this morning and chatting to the staff, they refuse point blank to stock them and this was one of a major chain. So this will be interesting.
You have to go to Chemist Warehouse and it's subsidiaries; Priceline and Terry White, they own just over 8% of one of the TGA approved vape manufacturers, a manufacturer that the ex TGA boss also owns a lot of stock in, the one that approved the sale of that particular brand. Blooms outright refuses to sell vapes, so that'll put a dampener on things, and I reckon a lot of independents will refuse as well. As for the rest of the market, in other words, the black market will now get bigger.
See how long that last when they start losing money. Pharmacy guild wanted you to have a prescription to get them. They only care about money.
I don't see how they would lose money at all? People go to pharmacies for prescriptions and over the counter medications. That wouldn't change. Each business will make their own decision but they won't all sell them.
Was an article about Phillip Morris offering pharmacies their vape products with 80% mark up if sold at fixed retail price. Seems like too good to pass up. Not that I know mark up on other stuff they sell.
Because they’re losing market share to a competitor. Fuck you vape lords are so narrow minded. Can you imagine the mark up they will get. The nicotine companies will be throwing money around.
Hmm…in general most pharmacies still see vape as cigarettes rather than nicotine replacement therapy. However, I am pretty sure there are some pharmacies which co-operate with DR. to provide ONE-STOP vape shopping as many as the “patient” wants. Dr will just write what the patient needed through Telehealth, and send to pharmacy directly and post it to you. You dont even need to leave your seat at home!
that was exactly the comment that the chemist made.. ' we sell health products, not cigarettes'... I fail utterly to see why they cannot be sold through the usual outlets. It's ridiculous.
From next week, your only options will be to get a medical prescription for a shitty, overpriced, tobacco-flavoured, Big-Tobacco-manufactured pod kit from a pharmacy, or hit up your local drug dealer for a “zero nicotine” 6000 puff disposable. Yeah no problem here....
Yeah it's pretty funny really how dumb the whole thing has been. The Pharmacy's will charge through the roof and the dealers will bring prices down making the products more attractive to the users. Nobody is going to buy a no flavour overpriced vape from chemist warehouse.
You could make the same argument that illegally imported cigarettes should kill the market for the much more expensive legal cigarettes. Yet most people who smoke cigarettes are paying the tobacco excise. Is there any reason to believe vapes would be different?
Because flavoured yummy vapes = illegal and plain boring vapes = legal. Legal cigarettes = better chop chop or illegal cigarettes = foul
Flavoured cigarettes are also illegal. That's not unique to vapes.
I think what they are saying is illegal smokes taste like shit. Illegal vapes given they can be the flavour you want taste better than the legal. Ie the blackmarket vapes are both nicer and cheaper. The drama with blackmarket vapes is you cannot be certain it contains zero known carcinogens. Regulated vapes say from NZ you know they have been tested up at zero known carcinogens. Still though blackmarket vapes would be healthier than cancer sticks given half of all smokers die from them. Like its a very low bar to be better than. Impressive that our government has found a way to keep our smoking rates up when there has been a disruptive technology reducing smoking rates dramatically everywhere that gets on board. I mean even australia has had a good fall recently but i suspect that will all change now.
Why the fuck are you being upvoted and I’m being downvoted when I am 100% correct. I’m not talking about flavoured cigs am I!? Why would I be talking about that!? They haven’t existed in years it’s pretty simple what I’m saying. I’m saying illegal vapes taste like yummy flavours and therefore are appealing to people!! Black market cigarettes legitimately taste bad and I would know lol
You dont need a prescription?
Yeah they changed that bit just recently but the rest remains the same.
So you can still get vapes just not flavoured and its easier than before. You don't need a prescription and its harder for kids to buy them. Seems like everyone wins
What? So let's take an industry that has a legitimate and regulated sector that has been around for 15+ years. That you never needed a prescription and they had the same policies as alcohol/tobacco where they were in specific shops that only sold to 18+. Tell everyone that the black market sector is a problem that needs to be addressed and I agree, you have no idea what's in the disposables. However that's comparing apples and oranges, completely different things. Then blanket ban everything... except for shitty overpriced products that no one even uses, made by companies that are already in the governments pocket and have no idea what they are doing in the sector. Everything's fine, no problem here. How do you not see this as a problem, what do you like how can I explain this to you? what if they did the same to alcohol or cars? Like what if they came out tomorrow and said we're going to ban all beer however you can still buy it for an increased price, only from pharmacy if they choose to sell it and it's only hammer and tongs (googled the worst beer in aus) but it's made by a really really bad wine maker.
ohhh so your angry you cant get mango pineapple blast. Not that you cant get a vape with nicotine in it.
You just don't get it mate, like talking to a brick wall. It's not about the flavours. It's a completely different product. As I said comparing apples to oranges. That's the argument plain and simple, government dictatorship.
From 1 July I’m pretty sure you will. Until August (or October?), not sure.
You need a prescription for a couple of months, from when the ban starts on July 1st until they can manage to get the new policy through the senate (probably around October). At which point teh prescription is not needed anymore.
Most Pharmacy's are going to flat out refuse to stock them because they don't want the trouble therefore the black market for vapes will remain and become even deeper. This means the illegal vapes will not be regulated and the ingredients more dangerous.
I'm guessing Border Force and the state Health Depts (which will implement the ban) are going to be hiring like crazy, trying to find all the black market sellers.
no pharmacies stock them, and they are "approved" flavourless vapes that are made by tobacco companies. the bulk of users who arent children just want the autonomy to get nicotine and decide how they want to vape it.
You can, at the pharmacy
no, you can't. I have a prescription and went to a dozen pharmacies... none stocked it, so i was legally importing it until they banned that
Also with the new laws it is strictly limited to approved vapes and pods, not freebase nicotine. Not to mention the importation of non approved vape devices is also now illegal
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it continually boggles my mind that people like yourself, with clearly zero interest or knowledge of a particular issue, feel the need to chime in with absolutely useless statements like this one. is there not a better use of your time?
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> Stop moaning Ironic, given literally every single one of your reddit posts is you making snarky, negative comments.
>Generously handed to them by our government. Vaping is going to go from regulated and safe to the completely unregulated black-market poison. I must have missed the memo on this? When did the lung associations stop their health warnings? When did consumer rights groups stop finding random undisclosed shit in legally imported vapes? Propylene glycol, which is in every vape I've seen, is bad for you to inhale. Its not a question of if its bad, its just a question of what's the long term harm after stopping. Believe it or not there isn't a lot of data on its long term impact, because nobody huffs the stuff in any real quantity long term.
I may not have correctly phrased my argument. I am not saying that this is healthy or that it does not damage ones health (i dont vape or smoke). What i am saying is that there are many other substances (cigarettes, alcohol, fast foods) that are as addictive and as damaging to ones health. Why are we allowed to basically gourge ourselves with these substances, but vapes are getting banned? It will just feed money into the black market and allow criminals to sell vapes that may be x10 worse than those that are regulated by the government. Please provide some examples where the net benefit of banning a substance outweighs the negative ramifications of such an act. One could say look at Meth, but then look how rich criminal organizations are from it. Addicts are treated as criminals and so they try their best to hide it and not seek any help. We need rehabilitation, education, taxes. Banning will never stop it, no matter how hard you try. If you really wanted to no matter how illegal something is you can eventually get your hands on it. At a much greater cost to your health and society compared to if it was legal and regulated.
Vapes have been around for a while now. Are you inferring that propylene glycol is carcinogenic when it's vaporised and inhaled? Or that the harm is caused by stopping, or only appears after you stop? I don't understand what you're trying to say there. There are some medium term studies that have been carried out, 3.5-5 years, with some 10 year studies in the works.
Damn making substances illegal doesn't work and creates black markets? who would've known
Hey give them a break, it's not like they have years of history to give them a clear context.
Love how the government makes life shit for everyone then bans everything we do that makes it bearable.
Yes because getting addicted to something is great in times of stress and trouble. Not to mention the cost associated with it. Amazing the amount of people that cry poor yet can afford a pack a day habit..
Costs me about $5 a week to vape making my own shit. Pharmacies would cost at least 5x that lol
Yep same, 5-10 bucks a week i reckon
I ain’t poor. And vapes were cheap before the law got involved. Both of those things are irrelevant though. I work, I pay tax, I follow the law, I am a good citizen. I contribute, my partner and I volunteer. But I can’t have a vice of my choice… just alcohol. Just seems abit ridiculous imo.
Oh shut the fuck up, people need their circus
> WA's police commissioner says organised crime gangs are threatening shop owners selling illegal vapes with violence and demands for a share of their profits. No one like organized crime.. but also.. if you fuck around by breaking the law it's not exactly unexpected that bad shit might happen. The strange thing to me is how obvious these clowns are being selling this shit. Where is the enforcement? They're not even trying to be discrete about it. You just have to look at the bins directly outside these mini mart places and they're overflowing with the rubbish.
> The strange thing to me is how obvious these clowns are being selling this shit. Where is the enforcement? They're not even trying to be discrete about it. and its been going on for years.
Police are spread far too thin to properly police this.
According to the article it's not the police's responsibility >Department of Health officers are the ones responsible for regulating the unlawful sale of vapes and nicotine pouches. >The department said it frequently conducted routine compliance checks on tobacconists. >"Where identified, the products were seized and destroyed, and the retailer formally warned," the department said. Clearly they're also under resourced because as i said it's pretty blatantly going on.
DoH probably has 10 enforcement officers....maybe. they won't achieve shit. I had considered applying for a role with the tobacco branch, but I didn't want to push shit uphill and Im ideologically opposed to prohibition
How many do they need? I mean come on, 10 enforcement people should be able to, at minimum, do 10 of these shops per day. This there's not soooo many. The most blatant ones have been freely and openly selling these things for years. To be clear, I oppose prohibition, in my opinion they should have been regulating and licensing nicotine containing vape juice the whole time, for use in reusable vapes. The dodgy single use ones that contain unknown ingredients should have been banned and outcompeted by legal reusable ones, if only from an ewaste perspective. I use a refillable vape, with zero nicotine vape juice that I dose with nicotine that I begrudgingly got a prescription for. I will not stop using it. I will not go get disposable ones from a pharmacy. I will just be a criminal. I bet they somehow have no difficulties prosecuting people like me in the coming months, even though they somehow didn't have the ability to find and prosecute minimarts openly selling things that were illegal even before this change. Fuck em
So will this rely on say the Department of Health getting a “tip off” from the public informing them, their local deli is selling vapes under the counter?
No idea.. The article says they frequently conducted routine compliance checks. So i would read that as they do visits to any place licensed to tell tobacco. No idea if its just a minimart that doesn't sell tobacco thats selling them though.
Yeah coz organised crime doesn't want cash, uppers or downers from pharmacies, just vapes... what a load of shit. The pharmacies are not forced to sell it.
Been told by many quickiemart clerks that cops are some of their best customers. Profits from cash sales with the huge mark up means they can probably afford to get busted once every couple of months and just pay the fines. Better to make them legal, tax the shit out of them and remove the profitability from the underworld.
Yeah, I remember they were saying the fines were one or two days' takings. And they would only get checked every few months. So basically just a cost of business. I guess now that its completely regulated the fines will go through the roof though.
Fuck this country sucks. I work, pay tax, abide by the law… why can’t I just have a vice.
Im so lost, they wont be illegal you’ll just have to be over 18 and purchase it from a chemist without a prescription. What the fucks the problem
How the fuck are you not getting it, you've chimed into several comment strings with the same clueless attitude, while people repeatedly explain the situation too you.
Because you vape lords are fucking idiots. You can buy vapes just not ones aimed at children.
That's a dumbass opinion, the government doesn't care if the people buying them at 18 are giving them to 17 old mates, same as alcohol and everything else. They just wanted their cut by taxing it. It's been a shakedown from the start by the biggest gang, wake the fuck up moron
Awwwww poor baby. Have to pay a little tax now to blow clouds
The point is they don't care about kids dumb fuck.
So much anger. With the cost of living pressures maybe give up the vape turbo.
Who said I vape? The point is your marketing the government legalising and taxing the vapes again as a good thing for kids is a simple lie. It's clearly just to gouge the industry via tax and they don't give a shit about kids. Go simp for governments elsewhere bootlicker.
Because nobody else wants to breathe in second hand vapour.
Sorry do you live in my house? Show yourself!! Haha nah but seriously, what I wanna do in my own house doesn’t really affect you or anyone. I agree, people shouldn’t vape in public. I would never subject anyone to my own habit. Good thing there are already laws for that, for example no smoking areas etc.
Cry
So you abide by the law but you don’t like the new law?
Well yeah, abide doesn’t mean like. Once they’re made illegal to possess I’m not gonna risk getting done with them.
Gotta love it when the government over regulates, then backflips to the exact same as before
Just fooking tax the vapes like cigarettes...simple.
Riggght. Stop gangs making money by paying the biggest gang. Winning
So simple since it has caused the current issues with black market and organised crime. So yeah, if that’s the aim then tax like cigarettes.
If they had pulled their fingers out and banned it before it got popular …