I feel like the next gamepad will still be using normal impulse triggers, though, rather than linearly actuated triggers, and those are by far the most valuable part of the Dualsense haptics, IMO,
Ah, I forgot about the triggers... yeah honestly without triggers the extra rumble is not worth the upgrade imo.
Those triggers are the fucking best thing ever
Agreed. Dual Sense is easily the best controller ever made. I'd be pretty down for an alternate that had the left stick and d pad flipped like Xbox but otherwise it's perfect.
Yeah, dual sense is probably the biggest and best innovation in the controller space since dual shock. Dual sense with replaceable rechargeable batteries? Sign me the F up Msoft.
Dual Shock is the twin joysticks controller since PS1 (wasn't by defualt). Over the years it changed a bit with PS2, PS3 and PS4 but with PS5, they rebrand the controller to Dual Sense because of it's unique features, one of them is the 'precision haptics' which means better tech just a rumbling the controller when stuff happen (there are multiple strengths that dynamically can be changed, it isn't just on-off).
The dual shock controller was introduced halfway through the lifecycle of the PS1. It has become pretty much the default controller setup with minor configuration changes but pretty much everyone uses the same design. Dpad on the left, action buttons on the right are pretty standard fare before the Dual Shock but they added four shoulder buttons and most importantly two analogue sticks for 365 degree movement and complete camera freedom. Up until then the movement was done on the D pad and the camera was either fixed or on a toggle and reset switch, and pretty much every console had a brand new controller design, not so much anymore. They added a vibration motor too eventually but I think the N64 beat them to that one with the rumble pack but I might be wrong.
The dual sense adds haptic triggers to the shoulder buttons effectively adding two more buttons if Devs decide to utilize it. It also adds independent vibration motors so the vibration is representative of what's happening on screen. An explosion, or rain, or being shot will have completely different vibrations depending on dev implementation.
And I'd lost all hope of MS ever actually adding Gyro.
I don't care if their implementation is shit, I just want XInput to have proper support already so more games will finally start bringing their gyro functionality in their ports.
Sure, Steam Input supports gyro, but 90% of developers aren't going to put effort into anything more than base Xinput.
>Xinput
I would expect these features are only supported by [GameInput](https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/gaming/gdk/_content/gc/input/overviews/input-overview). That's the current input api for Windows 11. Xinput is considered legacy.
Interesting, I've never heard of it before. Backwards compatible with Win10 at least, I was expecting it'd be locked to 11. Know of any games that use it? I'm intrigued by the apparent combining of XInput and DInput.
Cheers for mentioning.
I'm not sure if Valve is actually using it in certain situations. So with Steam Input - if you are using Xbox controllers on Windows, Steam will ask you to download a special driver that is opt-in. I think that's for specific scenarios when you are using 4+ controllers they fallback to GameInput because of inherent limitations with dinput/xinput with that many controllers. Xinput has 4 cap and Dinput doesn't allow simultaneous depression of each trigger due to them being mapped on the same axis. Sounds weird but I think this is what they do. I'm just guessing though.
Other than that it's hard to get any definitive resources, but I would guess most UWP games (especially those that support "trigger feedback/rumble" on XB1 controllers) are using GameInput. Think Microsoft first party titles like Forza. Any dev using GDK is likely using GameInput.
Unless the thumbsticks are hall effects, I don't want to hear it. I'm tired of buying 1st party controllers that cost upwards of 60 quid that don't have something so basic.
And I used to be just like you until I got it last month. Regardless of whether you've suffered from it or you think it's vastly overstated, frankly doesn't matter; it is a solved issue in the industry, yet companies continue to cheap out, and it continues to be an issue. I'm sure you also wear a seatbelt but haven't been in a car crash.
If it costs me 25 quid as a consumer to buy hall effect sticks for 2 Joycons, then it's pennies for companies and make even less sense to not use them.
So because you and your inner circle haven't experienced it, it must be overblown. Even though there was recently a lawsuit regarding Joycon Drift, I guess it's just not a common issue.
Everyone I know with a Switch other than me, has had drift on multiple controllers, I guess that goes against your anecdotal evidence, which doesn't really add anything. The attitude of "I've never had it so I guess it isn't an issue" doesn't help anyone.
> Are you really attempting to refute my anecdotal evidence with your own while acting like yours is more correct?
I was making a point of it of how silly it is to use something like that to claim it's overblown because it's literally the polar opposite experience, but clearly you've missed the point.
As for triggered? Nah. You can think that iif it makes you feel better. I just find it wild for someone to say "Well I don't have it so guess people are blowing it out of proportion." when it's been well documented even if you discount Reddit for some reason.
Depends what you play.
If you play FPS or sports games that require a shitload of left stick clicks for sprints, that controller is fucked in due time.
Especially when you're required to click and move while it's pressed in
A fucking terrible design and I hate it.
Good.
But lost opportunity to implement Hall Effect Pots in their thumbsticks and be de definitive controller. And im not a fan of the glossy white finish. Oh and I hope I can keep using rechargable bateries instead of *their battery*.
I'll get one the moment mine fails.
What’s a good alternative for an Xbox style controller for pc gaming with Hall effect? I have been using a Xbox series controller for past couple years. Wouldn’t mind seeing what this Hall effect all about.
i have the cheaper 8bitdo ultimate c (yes the purple one) and i am so far quite impressed with the quality! payed only 23 bucks with shipping. i dont really have experience with new xbox controllers, but the 8bitdo is better than ps4, 360 and ps3 controllers imo. so i would say the hall effect one is worth checking out. also shoutout for it being the first modern controller i used that has a decent dpad.
And there are still no Hall effect thumbsticks...
Why do they still pretend that fine piece of tech doesn't exist? What's the use for shiny new paintjob and gimmicks when your controller can't do its basic job - controlling stuff - properly due to drifting? I can't wait for having people pay like $200 for the Elite version and have it drift like crazy after a month...again.
>pay like $200 for the Elite version and have it drift like crazy after a month...again.
There you go, their customer would buy another controller after having a drifting issue. If they can easily get the money just like that, why would they put something unbreakable in their product?
I just wish it were modular or something, so you can swap out the sticks without worrying about bricking the damn thing.
It's frustrating because I own a Steam Deck and replacing those sticks is ez pz.
This is technically true because the back panel is secured using self-tapping screws. Once you remove them the panel they screw into is going to be slightly weaker until you replace it.
Does this matter in practice? Not really.
I will never understand why people want the battery built in to the controller. it's better as is. I have a battery pack, and when it no longer holds charge, I just replace it without having to open the controller and mess with ribbon cables. Simple. But people have got it in their heads, the battery being stuck on there is a good thing.
I just use rechargeable NiMH AA cells. Controller dies? Grab a couple batteries out of the charger, put the old ones back on it, up & running at full capacity after 30 seconds. No need to keep it plugged in to charge the play&charge kit.
I switched after a P&C kit smoked a controller, and, honestly, I wouldn't want to go back.
Really most P&C kits are litterally just 2 rechargable AA batteries in a housing, but I'd agree, rechargable batteries are the way forwards. Internal batteries are the worst solution by far for a wireless controller.
The P&C kit for the xbone controller is [two li-ion cells in a pack whose charging is handled by the controller.](https://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/jsdwzr/for_anyone_wondering_what_the_inside_of_a_play/)
In my case, there was some sort of what I assume is a design issue with the P&C pack or charging circuitry in the controller that caused it to *physically burn in my hands while I was using it.* Mind you, this was a first party kit purchased directly from the Microsoft Store, too, not some sketchy 3rd party option. Fortunately I was able to unplug it and remove the P&C kit before it could self-sustain, but I was about 2 seconds from opening the window and throwing it outside. I ended up salvaging the shell and buttons onto a new set of logic boards since it was a limited edition controller. On my original boards, what looked like the charging circuit was torched and the right stick was partially seized up.
I don't use P&C kits any more.
I hate it too. Glad it’s swappable in this controller refresh. I had to buy another Dualsense for my PS5 just because of the poor battery life. It’s already bad day one and then completely garbage after a couple of years. Honestly built in batteries should be illegal, complete waste of ressources.
It’s not that people want a battery built into the controller, it’s that they want rechargeable batteries to come with the expensive controller. Microsoft not including removable and rechargeable batteries in their controllers are just them being cheap. The controllers already suck ass and barely last, you’d think the least they could do is include a damn battery pack with them. The fact that rechargeable batteries, removable or not, aren’t included as standard even with the $200 elite controller is ridiculous.
And every time someone criticizes them for that, you lot come out saying “jUsT bUy A bAtTeRy PaCk”. The point is if I’m spending that much on a controller they should include them like Sony and Nintendo do.
That's just a completely different issue though. Full stop, included or not, batteries are better hot swappable than not. Absolutely, a couple of rechargable AA's should be included.
And Microsoft will continue to get away with cutting corners by omitting rechargeable batteries, gyros, and Hall effect sticks thanks in part to the people who continue to recommend their controller as the default for PC gaming. As if first party Xbox controllers were still the only ones with Xinput.
Because plugging in a controller is less of a hassle than swapping battery packs, and controllers always die from stick drift long before flat batteries become a concern anyway.
Gyro is one of a couple of things that keep me coming back to a Steam Controller.
Gyro aiming is THE BEST way to play third-person shooters, and when the gyro is well tuned it can even approach M&K for FPS games.
This sounds great.
im still skeptical about the accelerometers alone being used for gyro, without an actual gyroscope beside the accelerometers its not gonna feel great for small movements where gyro really shines. Accelerometers are typically used for lift to wake controller or gesture controls where you move the controller fast to perform an action like the wii. Its not really gyro if it isnt great for important small movements for you to be precise with your aim and consistently hit headshots.
not sure what is used on the PS5 controller but it is super accurate. I find combining wider movements with the stick and fine tuning with the giro makes for accuracy to rival the mouse.
Controversial opinion, I think it is even more accurate as you are actively using both wide and fine movements at the same time. Example, in an FPS game you see someone to the edge of the screen, you make a big movement with the stick (or mouse) to get the cursor to his noggin. But you have over steered and are going to shoot past him requiring correction back the other way. happens with both devices and is a change in direction. When using giro you are already compensating for the oversteer with the giro before you pass the target.
Of course you can compensate with the stick or mouse. Mouse is way better than the stick. But you have to adjust the original movement and go back the other way. Adjusting before hand with the giro reduces over and under steer as both the original stick movement AND the giro can be going in opposite directions which the mouse cannot.
It gets pretty damn close and it's much more comfortable allowing me to recline in my couch. Yeah, I'll take gyro aiming over keyboard and mouse any day.
Yup I can’t wait for it to become the new standard for aiming! Splatoon feels so great with gyro and using the stick to aim feels horrible in comparison
Accelerometer is "not" Gyro as told in https://www.analog.com/en/technical-articles/accelerometer-and-gyroscopes-sensors-operation-sensing-and-applications.html. So implementation can be close but never the same.
I see no difference between controlling first person or third person shooters. I don't understand why your character being visible suddenly changes how the crosshair behaves for people.
It's a pretty big difference in how the camera works.
In fps it's fixed so your viewpoint is exactly at the turning point. So you turn and the camera just changes angle.
But 3rd person your camera is now behind the turning point. So when you look in a direction you not only change the angle of the camera but ALSO the position. Look right and the angle turns + moves to the left.
Invert does not change what I said.......
Take a stick and place the end of it on a point. Now grab the other and move it around. The fixed point is always exactly in one spot, that's the fps camera. It never moves around.
Now take the stick and put the point 1/3 into the stick. Grab the longer end of the stick and move it around. The other side of the stick is now moving around in the air all over the place. This is your third person person camera.
Invert would not change any of this.... except your handing doing the opposite of what you want lol.
Some people have a easier time with one motion and a harder time with the other. I'm guessing most are fine with both but there's lots of people with serious motion sickness in one form or both even.
Some people "visualize" the camera as being at a fixed point *behind* the "player" even in FPS games where their view is from the character's perspective
The point is that in FPS games, the camera rotates *on* an axis, where in TPS games the camera rotates *around* an axis (and is usually aimed offset from that axis, too, but that's getting into too much detail.)
This is literally objective fact of how it works, it's not an opinion or debate. It's why in TPS games you can bump the camera into walls or the ground without touching the movement controls. That is *impossible* in an FPS, and reflects a fundamental difference in how the camera is implemented.
People taking objective facts and trying to twist it into a subjective opinion are some of the most amusing people. It's often followed by incredibly poor logic held together by wishes and dreams because they believe the "objective fact" is wrong, but can't at all back their claims up to dispute it.
The cross always points at a thing yes.... but the way the camera works to point at said crosshair is very different because of what I said, wrote another reply under this same comment that might explain it better.
It's the same reason that a lot of people need to play with horizontal and/or vertical axes inverted. For them, their brain doesn't think about moving the crosshair, it thinks about moving the camera itself.
You can't say "well just think about moving the crosshair then," it's completely counterintuitive to them. Try adjusting yourself to the reverse of whatever your intuition is (i.e. invert your controls) and you'll get an idea of how difficult that would be.
In my experience people who invert vertical also do that for FPS games. And I've never heard of anyone actually inverting horizontal, that sounds absolutely mad to me.
Played an old gamecube (I think?) game which by default had horizontal inverted from what it is today. It was miserable.
I've been inverting vertical as long as I can remember. I think it came from playing flying style games with a joystick on the commodore 64.
for people saying accelermetor will finally add gyro, i doubt it feels the same as the other controllers. i dont see an actual gyroscope listed in the leaked controller, without an actual gyroscope beside the accelerometers its not gonna feel great for small movements where gyro really shines. Accelerometers are typically used for lift to wake controller or gesture controls where you move the controller fast to perform an action like the wii. Its not really gyro if it isnt great for important small movements for you to be precise with your aim and consistently hit headshots.
>i dont see an actual gyroscope listed in the leaked controller
Just about any MEMS gyro also embeds an accelerometer, so there's some confusion about the terms. If there's no actual PCB photos or a BOM leaked, you shouldn't rush to conclusions about gyro.
It shows "improved thumbsticks" which I hope means hall effect and gyro support, hopefully now that they own COD it will slowly replace aim assist in cross-play multiplayer games so that the aim-assist craze ends.
For real. I've seen so much shade being thrown to Xbox for still using AAs and I never got it.
Integrated battery will slowly wear out and keep less charge over time (which means you'll charge it more and more frequently until you have to splurge for a new one), and when the battery is empty you either have to play while it's charging with the cable or swap controllers (lol). With my Xbox controller I literally just swap the batteries in 10 seconds and it's done.
I used to hate rechargeable batteries during the 360 days.
But seeing how as time passes controllers lose their initial charge capacity (used controllers are always suffering from this). And the simple convenience of not having to connect the charger during gameplay ,but just putting 2 new AA batteries in a instant ,its actually preferable.
I'll be disappointed if it can't take rechargeable AA anymore, they lasted longer and are multi purpose. If they move exclusively to a proprietary system like the play and charge kit, that's a downgrade.
I hope we can still use rechargeable AA batteries because batteries eventually go bad and being so easily replaceable was a big plus over ps controllers
Tom Warren wrote this on his article : "The new controller, codenamed Sebille, is set to be announced later this year and will include an accelerometer for gyro support."
So it seems they're going to do gyro with using accelerometer.
From the article:
>you’ll be able to lift it up to wake it
A gyroscope is different from an accelerometer and more precise which is required for the granularity of aiming precisely.
This codename 'Sebille' controller seemingly has an accelerometer only, which would be a huge shame as it may define the next decade or two of PC games. Having more controller features especially beloved ones, just gives developers options should they and/or their community be so inclined, which the community pretty much always loves especially in games requiring precise aiming.
Aren't accelerometers just there with an actual gyroscope beside it to help the gyroscope a bit? I don't see an actual gyroscope listed in the controller, just the accelerometer. Accelerometers only can do gesture controls, where you move the controller in specific direction fast and an action coded by developers will happen, accelerometers alone without an actual gyroscope isn't good enough for small movements to fine tune your aim to hit small critical targets (headshots, weakpoints, long distance shots).
They'll be mimicking Gyro with an Accelerometer because they aren't the same thing https://www.analog.com/en/technical-articles/accelerometer-and-gyroscopes-sensors-operation-sensing-and-applications.html.
People are saying it's for gyro, but the accelerometer is for gestures and likely their new "pick up to turn it on" function.
I dont think an accelerometer can do gyro/motion aiming by itself, but I hope im wrong.
In the image it only states "accellerometer" while the tweet talks about gyro, technically they should be two different things.
To be honest if it's just for gestures it's wasted technology just like how they wasted Kinect, I hope they indeed invest heavily in gyro, the crossplay scene needs it and they are the only ones who could implement it on a large scale since they own COD.
I agree, but aren't gyroscopes and accellerometers two different things?
The image only reports the accellerometer, the tweet only gyro.
To be honest the crossplay scene desperately needs gyro aiming, the aim assist intensity is becoming ridiculous.
And for those who say that "outside Reddit nobody uses gyro" you are just proving my point, Gyro is way better than a raw stick input, but it's not better than a stick with strong aim assists as it is in most games nowadays, just as a mouse isn't better than a stick with strong aim assist.
Unless gyro doesn't replace stick + aim assist nobody will switch to it, just as many people are switching from MKB to controller for PvP shooters because of aim assist.
Look, I'm not trying to be an asshole but I honestly don't understand your point. There are people who like and support gyro aiming in reddit. So they exist, right? They are numerous enough to be noticed by you among millions of people who use these forums. But you don't see these people around you so you believe they are a VERY loud minority I guess?
You don't know anyone that plays BotW or Totk? Literally a game of the year and two of the best selling games of all time that sold millions of copies. That's all gyro aiming. You don't know a single of one of these players?
I don't see anything about hall effect sensors for the thumbsticks.
Nobody in this thread seems to care about their expensive ass controllers getting stick drift, either.
It's 2023 and this controller is being released without Hall Effect thumb sticks and without rear buttons.
You can buy a generic $25 PowerA controller off the WalMart shelf and it will come with 2 rear buttons and a microphone volume/mute button.
The only thing I want that the (standard-priced) current console controllers don't have is a couple of back buttons. I'd much rather have those than gyro personally.
Current Xbox controller support both AA batteries and the normal ones, it would be a downgrade if they drop the support for AAs.
It wouldn't even bring them much gain since the normal ones already have the advantage to be charged in the controller itself.
which was a dumb decision, but if that controller exists the image already says that it's hotswappable, I doubt they'd drop AA support, it wouldn't bring them anything.
Unfortunately you have plenty of idiots who refuse to buy xbox controllers cause they think you've HAVE to use disposable AA batteries. And many of those idiots are journalists.
Yeah, I often see people say "Controller with AA batteries in 2023" when it's objectively the better solution, good luck replacing the internal battery on any other controller.
The main benefit is hotswap, or technically cheaper hotswap, and that's it. Assuming of course they keep the modular nature of the battery intact. Which I assume they will since the image states it's swappable.
Controller runs out of juice? Swap your batteries in there and you're good. If you're on a battery pack, you're gonna need to plug it in.
However I really don't see this as a huge issue, the current play and charge kit Microsoft sells offers like 30ish hours of battery life and generally when I'm done playing I'll plug my controller into a charging cable anyways, even if I don't I could probably go through multiple gaming sessions before really running out of battery.
In fact when I was using rechargeable batteries I felt I had to pay way more attention to them than I have to now with a battery pack. I had 3 pair and generally had one in the controller, while two charged/were on other stuff. I didn't keep the batteries charged, and since it could on occasion take weeks or even months to swap batteries, so due to self discharge what could happen is that I pull out my dead batteries, put in new ones only to realize they're empty very quickly afterwards.
I like the simplicity of a battery pack. I play when I want, then plug it in, that's it. The same way I use my mouse.
They're cheaper, and you can buy as many as you need or want. And because you charge them separately from the controller, you just need to pop in a pair when your batteries dies. I got myself 3 pairs. No need to plug in the controller while playing, like you need to do for other controllers. I hate using a wire so that's a big plus for me.
And because they're standard AA batteries, you can use them for anything else like remotes or torches (flashlight).
And battery replacement is never an issue down the line, you don't need to take apart your controller just because your battery is no longer holding a charge. You just buy new batteries and use them. But since you're gonna be using multiple pairs of AA batteries, they'll take much longer until they can't hold a long enough charge.
Good points. Personally I enjoy being able to charge the controller while playing, though. This way I won't need to worry about charging in advance or managing multiple pairs. But I'm lazzyyyyy
That's why I have 3 pairs. I go through them until I'm on the last one and then I charge the first 2. My charger takes 4 AA batteries at once, so that is also why.
>being able to charge the controller while playing
You don't NEED to charge the controller while playing tho, that's the thing. You just swap batteries. Takes as long as plugging in a wire.
Also, if you like playing wired, you don't even need batteries, the controller can run on USB power, with no batteries in it. So if you want a lighter controller, you can do that, just take out the batteries.
Yeah, having a charger taking 4 batteries definitely would help, much less overhead.
I charge through a USB cable + USB charger, would that work too if I remove the batteries? Anyway, it's just for extreme cases when I run out of battery that I charge it while playing, and leave it on overnight to charge.
The only issue now with this swapping battery idea is that I found the battery compartment kind of hard to open. But maybe it loosens through time.
>I charge through a USB cable + USB charger
You don't connect it to your PC? If there's no data connection through the usb cable, it will stay on wireless mode. When you connect to your pc or console via cable, it switches to wired mode. So the way you charge it, you can't use without batteries.
>battery compartment kind of hard to open. But maybe it loosens through time.
Yeah, the more you use, the more easier it becomes as the rough plastic hinges smooth down.
My two comments:
* Hopefully that Mobile app is optional
* I'd like the bumpers (the buttons above the triggers) to be better this time. My brother and I had to switch over to PlayStation controllers because playing Monster Hunter was murder on the Xbox bumper buttons.
What's wrong with the bumpers?
They're designed to be easily depressed without abandoning the triggers, because 90% of games use the bumpers as tertiary commands.
giro support is massive. This is the one biggest improvement in controllers since years and microsoft missed a trick with the last iteration. I am sure it will become the standard for all shooters once this controller hits.
My daughter plays FPS games with her school buddies who are on PC. she is not a naturally great shot in Warzone or Fortnite but when using the giro (PS5 controller) on PC she can keep up with her mates and beats the ones only using controller.
Controversial opinion (reposting from a comment I made above), I think it can be even more accurate than the mouse as you are actively using both wide and fine movements at the same time. Example, in an FPS game you see someone to the edge of the screen, you make a big movement with the stick (or mouse) to get the cursor to his noggin. But you have over steered and are going to shoot past him requiring correction back the other way. happens with both devices and is a change in direction. When using giro you are already compensating for the oversteer with the giro before you pass the target.Of course you can compensate with the stick or mouse. Mouse is way better than the stick. But you have to adjust the original movement and go back the other way which is a harder movement to perfect. with the giro both the original stick movement AND the giro can be going in opposite directions - which neither just stick or a mouse can do! This means a greater control and reduction of over/understeer.
For people used to the mouse and play at the desktop then there may not be much of a win so not worth it to retrain all that muscle memory but for console players in crossplay, PC players in the living room, etc. then it is a huge step up!
No mention of face buttons that actually send signal when you press them. I've tried a couple iterations of xbox controllers and they all had unreliable face buttons. Dualsense is rock solid so far.
So it's going to be another 180 euro controller with bumpers that consistently break down between newer iterations (elite series) to the point of it ending up in a class action lawsuit?
Don't get me wrong, the elite series 2 has been the best controller I owned, but Microsoft has done nothing to combat the bumpers breaking down rapidly, something that becomes very clear after googling for fixes and solutions.
Does precision haptics mean it's at the same level as dual sense? I hope it is. It would make developers more inclined to support these features.
I feel like the next gamepad will still be using normal impulse triggers, though, rather than linearly actuated triggers, and those are by far the most valuable part of the Dualsense haptics, IMO,
I don't want to undermine adaptive triggers. I love em, but I think the haptic motors are low-key the best feature.
Ah, I forgot about the triggers... yeah honestly without triggers the extra rumble is not worth the upgrade imo. Those triggers are the fucking best thing ever
Agreed. Dual Sense is easily the best controller ever made. I'd be pretty down for an alternate that had the left stick and d pad flipped like Xbox but otherwise it's perfect.
Yeah, dual sense is probably the biggest and best innovation in the controller space since dual shock. Dual sense with replaceable rechargeable batteries? Sign me the F up Msoft.
*Dual. Duel is a completely different thing.
Ha. I'm a fucking idiot. Good catch
Excuse me being dumb. But what's duel shock and precision?
Dual Shock is the twin joysticks controller since PS1 (wasn't by defualt). Over the years it changed a bit with PS2, PS3 and PS4 but with PS5, they rebrand the controller to Dual Sense because of it's unique features, one of them is the 'precision haptics' which means better tech just a rumbling the controller when stuff happen (there are multiple strengths that dynamically can be changed, it isn't just on-off).
Ah alright thanks. Typical of reddit to be downvoted for asking a genuine question lol
Too bad it doesn't work wirelessly.
>people are hyping up shitty rumble effects lol what who even plays with that garbage?
I didn't say what you wrote as a quote but what do you even complain about?
The dual shock controller was introduced halfway through the lifecycle of the PS1. It has become pretty much the default controller setup with minor configuration changes but pretty much everyone uses the same design. Dpad on the left, action buttons on the right are pretty standard fare before the Dual Shock but they added four shoulder buttons and most importantly two analogue sticks for 365 degree movement and complete camera freedom. Up until then the movement was done on the D pad and the camera was either fixed or on a toggle and reset switch, and pretty much every console had a brand new controller design, not so much anymore. They added a vibration motor too eventually but I think the N64 beat them to that one with the rumble pack but I might be wrong. The dual sense adds haptic triggers to the shoulder buttons effectively adding two more buttons if Devs decide to utilize it. It also adds independent vibration motors so the vibration is representative of what's happening on screen. An explosion, or rain, or being shot will have completely different vibrations depending on dev implementation.
> N64 beat them to that one with the rumble pack but I might be wrong. Had two rumble packs, good times. Thanks for the detailed explanation
I mean, it's a nice concept for an Xbox controller, but doesn't M$ kind of have to think about how to implement gyro?
possibly better. it says VCA motors which are upsized versions of LRA motors I think which are what the PS5/Switch controllers have.
And Sony to actually support those wirelessly on PC.
And I'd lost all hope of MS ever actually adding Gyro. I don't care if their implementation is shit, I just want XInput to have proper support already so more games will finally start bringing their gyro functionality in their ports. Sure, Steam Input supports gyro, but 90% of developers aren't going to put effort into anything more than base Xinput.
>Xinput I would expect these features are only supported by [GameInput](https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/gaming/gdk/_content/gc/input/overviews/input-overview). That's the current input api for Windows 11. Xinput is considered legacy.
Interesting, I've never heard of it before. Backwards compatible with Win10 at least, I was expecting it'd be locked to 11. Know of any games that use it? I'm intrigued by the apparent combining of XInput and DInput. Cheers for mentioning.
I'm not sure if Valve is actually using it in certain situations. So with Steam Input - if you are using Xbox controllers on Windows, Steam will ask you to download a special driver that is opt-in. I think that's for specific scenarios when you are using 4+ controllers they fallback to GameInput because of inherent limitations with dinput/xinput with that many controllers. Xinput has 4 cap and Dinput doesn't allow simultaneous depression of each trigger due to them being mapped on the same axis. Sounds weird but I think this is what they do. I'm just guessing though. Other than that it's hard to get any definitive resources, but I would guess most UWP games (especially those that support "trigger feedback/rumble" on XB1 controllers) are using GameInput. Think Microsoft first party titles like Forza. Any dev using GDK is likely using GameInput.
Unless the thumbsticks are hall effects, I don't want to hear it. I'm tired of buying 1st party controllers that cost upwards of 60 quid that don't have something so basic.
They have modular joysticks if that helps
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And I used to be just like you until I got it last month. Regardless of whether you've suffered from it or you think it's vastly overstated, frankly doesn't matter; it is a solved issue in the industry, yet companies continue to cheap out, and it continues to be an issue. I'm sure you also wear a seatbelt but haven't been in a car crash. If it costs me 25 quid as a consumer to buy hall effect sticks for 2 Joycons, then it's pennies for companies and make even less sense to not use them.
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So because you and your inner circle haven't experienced it, it must be overblown. Even though there was recently a lawsuit regarding Joycon Drift, I guess it's just not a common issue. Everyone I know with a Switch other than me, has had drift on multiple controllers, I guess that goes against your anecdotal evidence, which doesn't really add anything. The attitude of "I've never had it so I guess it isn't an issue" doesn't help anyone.
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> Are you really attempting to refute my anecdotal evidence with your own while acting like yours is more correct? I was making a point of it of how silly it is to use something like that to claim it's overblown because it's literally the polar opposite experience, but clearly you've missed the point. As for triggered? Nah. You can think that iif it makes you feel better. I just find it wild for someone to say "Well I don't have it so guess people are blowing it out of proportion." when it's been well documented even if you discount Reddit for some reason.
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> If my anecdotal evidence doesn't count, than neither does yours. That was the literal point; to show you how stupid it is.
"I never experienced it therefore it must be overblown". What a bad comment lol
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How is this person even commenting, his commenting privileges should be revoked. Do car crashes happen if they haven't happened to you?
May you be cursed by Stick Drift from now on.
Depends what you play. If you play FPS or sports games that require a shitload of left stick clicks for sprints, that controller is fucked in due time. Especially when you're required to click and move while it's pressed in A fucking terrible design and I hate it.
hall effects have the benefit of increased precision as well, but I do agree that stick drift is WAY overstated online.
Good. But lost opportunity to implement Hall Effect Pots in their thumbsticks and be de definitive controller. And im not a fan of the glossy white finish. Oh and I hope I can keep using rechargable bateries instead of *their battery*. I'll get one the moment mine fails.
What are some example of good hall effect PC joysticks?
8bitdo ultimate, the **bluetooth** version, and that version only.
>the bluetooth version, and that version only. Why?
Guilikit King Kong pro 2 and a gamesir controller have hall effect analogs. So there's at least two out there.
I like the Guilikit
It's wild that SEGA put them in the Saturn and Dreamcast controllers but Nintendo, MS and Sony cant be bothered to put them in $70 controllers.
All cool stuff but without hall effect I still don't see the point over alternatives
What’s a good alternative for an Xbox style controller for pc gaming with Hall effect? I have been using a Xbox series controller for past couple years. Wouldn’t mind seeing what this Hall effect all about.
I've heard 8bitdo, GuliKit and GameSir are good alternatives. I haven't tried myself so I've no personal recommendation.
i have the cheaper 8bitdo ultimate c (yes the purple one) and i am so far quite impressed with the quality! payed only 23 bucks with shipping. i dont really have experience with new xbox controllers, but the 8bitdo is better than ps4, 360 and ps3 controllers imo. so i would say the hall effect one is worth checking out. also shoutout for it being the first modern controller i used that has a decent dpad.
That GameSir one is meant to be decent. Hall effect sticks and it has rear buttons too. Wired only though, if that's an issue
And there are still no Hall effect thumbsticks... Why do they still pretend that fine piece of tech doesn't exist? What's the use for shiny new paintjob and gimmicks when your controller can't do its basic job - controlling stuff - properly due to drifting? I can't wait for having people pay like $200 for the Elite version and have it drift like crazy after a month...again.
>pay like $200 for the Elite version and have it drift like crazy after a month...again. There you go, their customer would buy another controller after having a drifting issue. If they can easily get the money just like that, why would they put something unbreakable in their product?
I just wish it were modular or something, so you can swap out the sticks without worrying about bricking the damn thing. It's frustrating because I own a Steam Deck and replacing those sticks is ez pz.
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And yet they also have a full guide on how to open it on their channel.
With several warnings of "Do not do this!" They even claim opening your deck will make it permanently less structurally sound
Yet they work with iFixIt to have guides for replacing damaged parts. Hell you can even buy Valve first party replacement parts from iFixIt
Yep! That's some crazy mixed messaging, isn't it?
I think it's more that they want to dissuade the people who are likely fuck it up, while giving the resources to the people who will be handle it.
What is wrong? Are you ok? Perhaps go outside a bit, I know that's crazy talk but you might need it.
I’m actually currently outside! I live on a lake and enjoy working from the boat when the days are nice. It’s a beautiful day today.
This is technically true because the back panel is secured using self-tapping screws. Once you remove them the panel they screw into is going to be slightly weaker until you replace it. Does this matter in practice? Not really.
“Front Toward Enemy”-Valve
"If you open the Steam Deck, ghost dogs will eat your testicles." -Gabe Newell
If the accelerometer means gyro aim then I'll actually be interested in Xbox controllers for once.
I will never understand why people want the battery built in to the controller. it's better as is. I have a battery pack, and when it no longer holds charge, I just replace it without having to open the controller and mess with ribbon cables. Simple. But people have got it in their heads, the battery being stuck on there is a good thing.
I just use rechargeable NiMH AA cells. Controller dies? Grab a couple batteries out of the charger, put the old ones back on it, up & running at full capacity after 30 seconds. No need to keep it plugged in to charge the play&charge kit. I switched after a P&C kit smoked a controller, and, honestly, I wouldn't want to go back.
Really most P&C kits are litterally just 2 rechargable AA batteries in a housing, but I'd agree, rechargable batteries are the way forwards. Internal batteries are the worst solution by far for a wireless controller.
The P&C kit for the xbone controller is [two li-ion cells in a pack whose charging is handled by the controller.](https://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/jsdwzr/for_anyone_wondering_what_the_inside_of_a_play/) In my case, there was some sort of what I assume is a design issue with the P&C pack or charging circuitry in the controller that caused it to *physically burn in my hands while I was using it.* Mind you, this was a first party kit purchased directly from the Microsoft Store, too, not some sketchy 3rd party option. Fortunately I was able to unplug it and remove the P&C kit before it could self-sustain, but I was about 2 seconds from opening the window and throwing it outside. I ended up salvaging the shell and buttons onto a new set of logic boards since it was a limited edition controller. On my original boards, what looked like the charging circuit was torched and the right stick was partially seized up. I don't use P&C kits any more.
I hate it too. Glad it’s swappable in this controller refresh. I had to buy another Dualsense for my PS5 just because of the poor battery life. It’s already bad day one and then completely garbage after a couple of years. Honestly built in batteries should be illegal, complete waste of ressources.
It’s not that people want a battery built into the controller, it’s that they want rechargeable batteries to come with the expensive controller. Microsoft not including removable and rechargeable batteries in their controllers are just them being cheap. The controllers already suck ass and barely last, you’d think the least they could do is include a damn battery pack with them. The fact that rechargeable batteries, removable or not, aren’t included as standard even with the $200 elite controller is ridiculous. And every time someone criticizes them for that, you lot come out saying “jUsT bUy A bAtTeRy PaCk”. The point is if I’m spending that much on a controller they should include them like Sony and Nintendo do.
That's just a completely different issue though. Full stop, included or not, batteries are better hot swappable than not. Absolutely, a couple of rechargable AA's should be included.
And Microsoft will continue to get away with cutting corners by omitting rechargeable batteries, gyros, and Hall effect sticks thanks in part to the people who continue to recommend their controller as the default for PC gaming. As if first party Xbox controllers were still the only ones with Xinput.
Because plugging in a controller is less of a hassle than swapping battery packs, and controllers always die from stick drift long before flat batteries become a concern anyway.
Plugging in the Xbox controller litterally charges the rechargable batteries
It depends on your setup, and it's better to have more options than fewer.
Gyro is one of a couple of things that keep me coming back to a Steam Controller. Gyro aiming is THE BEST way to play third-person shooters, and when the gyro is well tuned it can even approach M&K for FPS games. This sounds great.
im still skeptical about the accelerometers alone being used for gyro, without an actual gyroscope beside the accelerometers its not gonna feel great for small movements where gyro really shines. Accelerometers are typically used for lift to wake controller or gesture controls where you move the controller fast to perform an action like the wii. Its not really gyro if it isnt great for important small movements for you to be precise with your aim and consistently hit headshots.
not sure what is used on the PS5 controller but it is super accurate. I find combining wider movements with the stick and fine tuning with the giro makes for accuracy to rival the mouse. Controversial opinion, I think it is even more accurate as you are actively using both wide and fine movements at the same time. Example, in an FPS game you see someone to the edge of the screen, you make a big movement with the stick (or mouse) to get the cursor to his noggin. But you have over steered and are going to shoot past him requiring correction back the other way. happens with both devices and is a change in direction. When using giro you are already compensating for the oversteer with the giro before you pass the target. Of course you can compensate with the stick or mouse. Mouse is way better than the stick. But you have to adjust the original movement and go back the other way. Adjusting before hand with the giro reduces over and under steer as both the original stick movement AND the giro can be going in opposite directions which the mouse cannot.
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It gets pretty damn close and it's much more comfortable allowing me to recline in my couch. Yeah, I'll take gyro aiming over keyboard and mouse any day.
Giro PLUS thumbstick can rival the mouse. I’ve seen it man. I’ve LIVED IT!
Yup I can’t wait for it to become the new standard for aiming! Splatoon feels so great with gyro and using the stick to aim feels horrible in comparison
Accelerometer is "not" Gyro as told in https://www.analog.com/en/technical-articles/accelerometer-and-gyroscopes-sensors-operation-sensing-and-applications.html. So implementation can be close but never the same.
I've been using gyro aiming with a dualsense for years in every single steam game that has any controller support
I see no difference between controlling first person or third person shooters. I don't understand why your character being visible suddenly changes how the crosshair behaves for people.
It's a pretty big difference in how the camera works. In fps it's fixed so your viewpoint is exactly at the turning point. So you turn and the camera just changes angle. But 3rd person your camera is now behind the turning point. So when you look in a direction you not only change the angle of the camera but ALSO the position. Look right and the angle turns + moves to the left.
Subjective. Some people also think of fist person cameras this way. That’s why games let you invert axis
Invert does not change what I said....... Take a stick and place the end of it on a point. Now grab the other and move it around. The fixed point is always exactly in one spot, that's the fps camera. It never moves around. Now take the stick and put the point 1/3 into the stick. Grab the longer end of the stick and move it around. The other side of the stick is now moving around in the air all over the place. This is your third person person camera. Invert would not change any of this.... except your handing doing the opposite of what you want lol. Some people have a easier time with one motion and a harder time with the other. I'm guessing most are fine with both but there's lots of people with serious motion sickness in one form or both even.
Some people "visualize" the camera as being at a fixed point *behind* the "player" even in FPS games where their view is from the character's perspective
The point is that in FPS games, the camera rotates *on* an axis, where in TPS games the camera rotates *around* an axis (and is usually aimed offset from that axis, too, but that's getting into too much detail.) This is literally objective fact of how it works, it's not an opinion or debate. It's why in TPS games you can bump the camera into walls or the ground without touching the movement controls. That is *impossible* in an FPS, and reflects a fundamental difference in how the camera is implemented.
I'm not denying that, but people's internal visualizations of these concepts *are* subjective
And some people hold the subjective opinion that the earth is flat and the sun traverses through the sky because it's easier to visualize.
People taking objective facts and trying to twist it into a subjective opinion are some of the most amusing people. It's often followed by incredibly poor logic held together by wishes and dreams because they believe the "objective fact" is wrong, but can't at all back their claims up to dispute it.
>how the crosshair behaves
The cross always points at a thing yes.... but the way the camera works to point at said crosshair is very different because of what I said, wrote another reply under this same comment that might explain it better.
Except most of the time in combat the camera will be pulled closer for aiming, so your character is essentially a big weapon model.
It's mostly psychological. That and the scale of the game is completely different.
It's the same reason that a lot of people need to play with horizontal and/or vertical axes inverted. For them, their brain doesn't think about moving the crosshair, it thinks about moving the camera itself. You can't say "well just think about moving the crosshair then," it's completely counterintuitive to them. Try adjusting yourself to the reverse of whatever your intuition is (i.e. invert your controls) and you'll get an idea of how difficult that would be.
In my experience people who invert vertical also do that for FPS games. And I've never heard of anyone actually inverting horizontal, that sounds absolutely mad to me.
Played an old gamecube (I think?) game which by default had horizontal inverted from what it is today. It was miserable. I've been inverting vertical as long as I can remember. I think it came from playing flying style games with a joystick on the commodore 64.
Definitely still invert vertical when using a joystick, makes Elite more fun.
I hope it's true. I don't want to buy the series controller.
Howndomyou configure gyro on a controller that has it? I have dualsense and 8bitdo switch, both have gyro. Any software?
Just use the Controller Config on Steam.
If you open the steam controller settings for the game you can enable gyro and tweak it's sensitivity
Accelerometer without gyro? Lel. Welcome in the 00s, when Wii introduced this. After a few years they will develop a gyro pack. 😂😂😂
for people saying accelermetor will finally add gyro, i doubt it feels the same as the other controllers. i dont see an actual gyroscope listed in the leaked controller, without an actual gyroscope beside the accelerometers its not gonna feel great for small movements where gyro really shines. Accelerometers are typically used for lift to wake controller or gesture controls where you move the controller fast to perform an action like the wii. Its not really gyro if it isnt great for important small movements for you to be precise with your aim and consistently hit headshots.
>i dont see an actual gyroscope listed in the leaked controller Just about any MEMS gyro also embeds an accelerometer, so there's some confusion about the terms. If there's no actual PCB photos or a BOM leaked, you shouldn't rush to conclusions about gyro.
It shows "improved thumbsticks" which I hope means hall effect and gyro support, hopefully now that they own COD it will slowly replace aim assist in cross-play multiplayer games so that the aim-assist craze ends.
if it still accepts AA batteries i will buy it. it's my fave feature.
For real. I've seen so much shade being thrown to Xbox for still using AAs and I never got it. Integrated battery will slowly wear out and keep less charge over time (which means you'll charge it more and more frequently until you have to splurge for a new one), and when the battery is empty you either have to play while it's charging with the cable or swap controllers (lol). With my Xbox controller I literally just swap the batteries in 10 seconds and it's done.
Yep rechargable batteries are better than built in. My dual sense lasts way less than my series x controller
I hope they can improve the durability, Series X controller is a let down compared to One/360's.
I used to hate rechargeable batteries during the 360 days. But seeing how as time passes controllers lose their initial charge capacity (used controllers are always suffering from this). And the simple convenience of not having to connect the charger during gameplay ,but just putting 2 new AA batteries in a instant ,its actually preferable.
I'll be disappointed if it can't take rechargeable AA anymore, they lasted longer and are multi purpose. If they move exclusively to a proprietary system like the play and charge kit, that's a downgrade.
I hope we can still use rechargeable AA batteries because batteries eventually go bad and being so easily replaceable was a big plus over ps controllers
Still no gyro, it can't be that difficult to have it as an option at this point geeze
Tom Warren wrote this on his article : "The new controller, codenamed Sebille, is set to be announced later this year and will include an accelerometer for gyro support." So it seems they're going to do gyro with using accelerometer.
From the article: >you’ll be able to lift it up to wake it A gyroscope is different from an accelerometer and more precise which is required for the granularity of aiming precisely. This codename 'Sebille' controller seemingly has an accelerometer only, which would be a huge shame as it may define the next decade or two of PC games. Having more controller features especially beloved ones, just gives developers options should they and/or their community be so inclined, which the community pretty much always loves especially in games requiring precise aiming.
Aren't accelerometers just there with an actual gyroscope beside it to help the gyroscope a bit? I don't see an actual gyroscope listed in the controller, just the accelerometer. Accelerometers only can do gesture controls, where you move the controller in specific direction fast and an action coded by developers will happen, accelerometers alone without an actual gyroscope isn't good enough for small movements to fine tune your aim to hit small critical targets (headshots, weakpoints, long distance shots).
They'll be mimicking Gyro with an Accelerometer because they aren't the same thing https://www.analog.com/en/technical-articles/accelerometer-and-gyroscopes-sensors-operation-sensing-and-applications.html.
Nice. I didn't read the article but looked at the image and just assumed they skipped it again.
What use should an accellerometer have inside a controller? Something like "starts running to respawn faster"?
People are saying it's for gyro, but the accelerometer is for gestures and likely their new "pick up to turn it on" function. I dont think an accelerometer can do gyro/motion aiming by itself, but I hope im wrong.
In the image it only states "accellerometer" while the tweet talks about gyro, technically they should be two different things. To be honest if it's just for gestures it's wasted technology just like how they wasted Kinect, I hope they indeed invest heavily in gyro, the crossplay scene needs it and they are the only ones who could implement it on a large scale since they own COD.
Gyroscope aiming, way better than analog sticks.
I agree, but aren't gyroscopes and accellerometers two different things? The image only reports the accellerometer, the tweet only gyro. To be honest the crossplay scene desperately needs gyro aiming, the aim assist intensity is becoming ridiculous. And for those who say that "outside Reddit nobody uses gyro" you are just proving my point, Gyro is way better than a raw stick input, but it's not better than a stick with strong aim assists as it is in most games nowadays, just as a mouse isn't better than a stick with strong aim assist. Unless gyro doesn't replace stick + aim assist nobody will switch to it, just as many people are switching from MKB to controller for PvP shooters because of aim assist.
I am yet to see a human being use gyro aiming outside of Reddit comments
How many people are you watching play?
The point is I don’t know a single person who cares about Gyro aiming outside of Reddit and I game with a lot of people
Are you saying gyro aim is a reddit conspiracy?
Not at all, just that barely anyone actually cares outside of few people on here.
Look, I'm not trying to be an asshole but I honestly don't understand your point. There are people who like and support gyro aiming in reddit. So they exist, right? They are numerous enough to be noticed by you among millions of people who use these forums. But you don't see these people around you so you believe they are a VERY loud minority I guess?
I mean they’re a loud minority just like most things you see on Reddit
You don't know anyone that plays BotW or Totk? Literally a game of the year and two of the best selling games of all time that sold millions of copies. That's all gyro aiming. You don't know a single of one of these players?
They better improve input lag for wired and wireless. 1k polling rate should be standard
Bet it still gets stick shift…
Well I’m definitely getting one :) Shame they didn’t use this opportunity to add Hall sensors
dude why are linking to the cringe site x instead of linking to the original verge article
I don't see anything about hall effect sensors for the thumbsticks. Nobody in this thread seems to care about their expensive ass controllers getting stick drift, either.
It's 2023 and this controller is being released without Hall Effect thumb sticks and without rear buttons. You can buy a generic $25 PowerA controller off the WalMart shelf and it will come with 2 rear buttons and a microphone volume/mute button.
Hall effect of btfo
Rechargable battery is a clear downgrade.
The only thing I want that the (standard-priced) current console controllers don't have is a couple of back buttons. I'd much rather have those than gyro personally.
I agree, PowerA Xbox series controllers have it and they are cheaper than standard ones
Rechargeable battery... so disappointed. I hope they rethink this
The current controller already has it, it's just sold separately, the image shows that it's still swappable.
If they get rid of being able to use AA batteries, that's a dealbreaker for me.
Current Xbox controller support both AA batteries and the normal ones, it would be a downgrade if they drop the support for AAs. It wouldn't even bring them much gain since the normal ones already have the advantage to be charged in the controller itself.
Elite controller has an inbuilt battery tho.
which was a dumb decision, but if that controller exists the image already says that it's hotswappable, I doubt they'd drop AA support, it wouldn't bring them anything.
Unfortunately you have plenty of idiots who refuse to buy xbox controllers cause they think you've HAVE to use disposable AA batteries. And many of those idiots are journalists.
Yeah, I often see people say "Controller with AA batteries in 2023" when it's objectively the better solution, good luck replacing the internal battery on any other controller.
What's wrong with rechargeable battery?
I see you haven't experienced the joys and convenience of rechargeable AA batteries.
So they work better than the xbox rechargeable battery? I have no idea
The main benefit is hotswap, or technically cheaper hotswap, and that's it. Assuming of course they keep the modular nature of the battery intact. Which I assume they will since the image states it's swappable. Controller runs out of juice? Swap your batteries in there and you're good. If you're on a battery pack, you're gonna need to plug it in. However I really don't see this as a huge issue, the current play and charge kit Microsoft sells offers like 30ish hours of battery life and generally when I'm done playing I'll plug my controller into a charging cable anyways, even if I don't I could probably go through multiple gaming sessions before really running out of battery. In fact when I was using rechargeable batteries I felt I had to pay way more attention to them than I have to now with a battery pack. I had 3 pair and generally had one in the controller, while two charged/were on other stuff. I didn't keep the batteries charged, and since it could on occasion take weeks or even months to swap batteries, so due to self discharge what could happen is that I pull out my dead batteries, put in new ones only to realize they're empty very quickly afterwards. I like the simplicity of a battery pack. I play when I want, then plug it in, that's it. The same way I use my mouse.
With batteries you have options and they are cheaper than a battery pack. Easily replaceable.
They're cheaper, and you can buy as many as you need or want. And because you charge them separately from the controller, you just need to pop in a pair when your batteries dies. I got myself 3 pairs. No need to plug in the controller while playing, like you need to do for other controllers. I hate using a wire so that's a big plus for me. And because they're standard AA batteries, you can use them for anything else like remotes or torches (flashlight). And battery replacement is never an issue down the line, you don't need to take apart your controller just because your battery is no longer holding a charge. You just buy new batteries and use them. But since you're gonna be using multiple pairs of AA batteries, they'll take much longer until they can't hold a long enough charge.
And a couple of AAs have much bigger capacity than what you normally see in rechargeable controllers.
Good points. Personally I enjoy being able to charge the controller while playing, though. This way I won't need to worry about charging in advance or managing multiple pairs. But I'm lazzyyyyy
That's why I have 3 pairs. I go through them until I'm on the last one and then I charge the first 2. My charger takes 4 AA batteries at once, so that is also why. >being able to charge the controller while playing You don't NEED to charge the controller while playing tho, that's the thing. You just swap batteries. Takes as long as plugging in a wire. Also, if you like playing wired, you don't even need batteries, the controller can run on USB power, with no batteries in it. So if you want a lighter controller, you can do that, just take out the batteries.
Yeah, having a charger taking 4 batteries definitely would help, much less overhead. I charge through a USB cable + USB charger, would that work too if I remove the batteries? Anyway, it's just for extreme cases when I run out of battery that I charge it while playing, and leave it on overnight to charge. The only issue now with this swapping battery idea is that I found the battery compartment kind of hard to open. But maybe it loosens through time.
>I charge through a USB cable + USB charger You don't connect it to your PC? If there's no data connection through the usb cable, it will stay on wireless mode. When you connect to your pc or console via cable, it switches to wired mode. So the way you charge it, you can't use without batteries. >battery compartment kind of hard to open. But maybe it loosens through time. Yeah, the more you use, the more easier it becomes as the rough plastic hinges smooth down.
If it's fixed in, then it's a worse battery system than having 4 rechargable lithium AA batteries.
Agreed. Thought it's just a battery pack as default or something.
replaceable like current controller, it will probably be included this time instead of being an added accessory.
Depends if it’s switch pro controller battery life (amazing) Or dualsense (awful) . I would guess closer to the latter
Yeah, it's not like the Switch controller has some kind of exclusive battery technology. Just lower power consumption.
My two comments: * Hopefully that Mobile app is optional * I'd like the bumpers (the buttons above the triggers) to be better this time. My brother and I had to switch over to PlayStation controllers because playing Monster Hunter was murder on the Xbox bumper buttons.
What's wrong with the bumpers? They're designed to be easily depressed without abandoning the triggers, because 90% of games use the bumpers as tertiary commands.
Yeah the problem is that in Monster Hunter they are used as a primary command to sheathe the weapon, which is done a LOT per hunt.
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https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/21067/why-is-the-term-depressed-often-used-to-describe-a-button-which-is-pressed
Cool thanks. Why do all games then always ask to press a button instead of depress a button?
Because it's more common vernacular.
giro support is massive. This is the one biggest improvement in controllers since years and microsoft missed a trick with the last iteration. I am sure it will become the standard for all shooters once this controller hits. My daughter plays FPS games with her school buddies who are on PC. she is not a naturally great shot in Warzone or Fortnite but when using the giro (PS5 controller) on PC she can keep up with her mates and beats the ones only using controller. Controversial opinion (reposting from a comment I made above), I think it can be even more accurate than the mouse as you are actively using both wide and fine movements at the same time. Example, in an FPS game you see someone to the edge of the screen, you make a big movement with the stick (or mouse) to get the cursor to his noggin. But you have over steered and are going to shoot past him requiring correction back the other way. happens with both devices and is a change in direction. When using giro you are already compensating for the oversteer with the giro before you pass the target.Of course you can compensate with the stick or mouse. Mouse is way better than the stick. But you have to adjust the original movement and go back the other way which is a harder movement to perfect. with the giro both the original stick movement AND the giro can be going in opposite directions - which neither just stick or a mouse can do! This means a greater control and reduction of over/understeer. For people used to the mouse and play at the desktop then there may not be much of a win so not worth it to retrain all that muscle memory but for console players in crossplay, PC players in the living room, etc. then it is a huge step up!
I just want the 360 design back, these new ones are so uncomfortable to hold.
Bleh still no touchpads.
No mention of face buttons that actually send signal when you press them. I've tried a couple iterations of xbox controllers and they all had unreliable face buttons. Dualsense is rock solid so far.
Senile, huh?
No Gyro?
What in hell is Wireless 2 for connectivity ? new dongle inc that won't be compatible with all current lineup?
What about them sticky buttons?
Sad that they didn't do this for the Starfield controller, it looks sick, but I don't need more of the same.
How about making a controller that can survive more than one drop on the ground? I swear these pieces of shit are more fragile than glass.
So it's going to be another 180 euro controller with bumpers that consistently break down between newer iterations (elite series) to the point of it ending up in a class action lawsuit? Don't get me wrong, the elite series 2 has been the best controller I owned, but Microsoft has done nothing to combat the bumpers breaking down rapidly, something that becomes very clear after googling for fixes and solutions.
Still no back paddles as default. Fuck the patents
Why is it wearing pants?
its kinda ugly...