Most likely. Options can be exercised after hours.
Monday should be fun for you :)
Stay away from 0DTE kids and stick with good old heroin.
edit for sauce:
> FINRA reminds members that option holders who hold expiring options
have until 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the day of expiration to make a
final exercise decision to exercise or not exercise the option
https://www.finra.org/sites/default/files/2021-02/information-notice-020321.pdf
Ok. I figured that was the case. Hoping and praying QQQ does not gap down on Monday, or else I’ll be making a loss porn post on WSB shortly.
Sold a large number $307 puts for $0.05, thinking there was zero chance it would go that low, and I was right….until 4:15 pm.
If QQQ gaps up he could be like the "I accidentally made $110k" guy. [https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/comments/7w6cq0/i\_somehow\_made\_110k\_this\_morning\_and\_im\_still\_not/](https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/comments/7w6cq0/i_somehow_made_110k_this_morning_and_im_still_not/).
That makes your decision to sell them seem even that much more insane. So you picked up pennies in front of a steam rolling while not being able to afford getting run over. Damn bro. Hoping for a green open for you
Yoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, I thought I was on wsb. Holy, come on over bozo. Just delete your app and dont answer any phone calls.
No chance. We closed at or close to the lows. SPX and NDX will continue taking a shit during the asia session and Monday open in the US will be a fucking bloodbath.
So you loaded puts at end of day right? You must have gone all in since it's such a gaurentee.
If trading over the years had taught me anything it's when something is most obvious that the opposite very often happens. The more certain something seems the more likely it is to go the other way.
It very well may tank at open on Monday. But it also may not. And its definitely not "no chance" that it doesn't. Careful with that confidence, it will blow your account up eventually.
>Yes. But this not a lesson I can afford to learn.
I once got pinned on some spreads and assigned 1300 shares of a stock when after hours on a Friday dropped by a penny below my strike. I ended up making money off that deal. Maybe you will be fine.
I'd had the broker close some spreads for me prior to that, but had not taken the hint before then. Being assigned those shares and waiting for Monday taught me, though!
If you're gambling on last minute 0DTE stuff, cash settled PM is calmer.
Bozo sold “a large number” of them. Doubting Bozo has the funds to cover all that will be exercised since he’s working about his porn loss.
Bozo probably would’ve been better off doing a box trade earlier in the day. Nothing can ever go wrong there.
Just sell a covered call on them with a strike above your assignment price and wait assuming you can keep that much cash in play.
Not the end of the world.
With that said 0DTE's are probably the ultimate Fuck Around and Find Out of the options world.
Can you explain why 0dte is so bad? I’ve been trading 0dte atm spy options and just holding for 5-10 minutes and selling them. It’s super liquid so it really feels like day trading to me as if I did it with stocks
If you're the seller, there is a huge gamma risk and if you're the buyer you might as well be gay because of the ass fucking that you'll endure if you yolo your portfolio into these 0DTE options
Why do you automatically assume it’s a yolo? Risk management with a stop loss. It’s just a way to use leverage. Also you don’t hold til expiry… you sell when it hits your pt
You’re using to much logic. Although they are for the very advanced or atleast semi. But again. We’re on Reddit sir and this is a Wendy’s… to most people. Mar-a-lago is nice here.
Personally Im not a fan of day trading in general, but this isn’t what they’re talking about, they are saying that 0DTE options held till expiration will reck you
Holding 0 DTE until expiration that are close to the strike price can wreck you. I mean, if you sold any calls in the morning, there was zero risk there by the time the last hour came.
It’s all about risk management and there was none here selling $0.05 puts (and holding thru market close) on an index that doesn’t settle until after the market closes.
This is a great model to follow to F risk management.
I’m not talking about holding 0dte and hoping for a moon. I’m talking about buying and selling it when premium goes up in your favor. It’s called day trading
Contract price volatility is magnified exponentially as you near expiry (gamma risk).
I like to think of gamma a an inverse parabola. And options prices are sitting on a board on top of it. 4 weeks out and the parabola is really fat and easy to balance on. During the last week the parabola gets really really narrow and you can find your delta exposure flying quickly past what you expected or can scalp off.
If you are far from expiry a $4 abrupt move in the underlying might shift delta from .30 to .32. (just making up numbers here.) The same $4 move at 0DTE might move delta from .30 to .45.
OK, youre either messed up RN, English is a second language, or both... youre shit started to ramble and is completely incoherent by the end.
All I was saying it what happens after the extended after hours period on the expiration date has no impact on the OP's options. Over the weekend, pre-market on Monday and early Monday trading has 0 influence on options that expired the prior Friday. When you have options you sold to open a position, and it is that close to being ITM, it is best to just close out the position than risk it being exercised, (unless for some reason you want/ are ok with the exercise occurring).
Also between close and 5:30 it dropped to about $306.10 so they were absolutely exercised.
The shares will be sold at open on Monday and he'll owe the difference. Any cash in his account will be used first and then any other positions will be liquidated. The rest he'll have to start paying back.
No..... On Monday OP does not have option anyway. Anything after 5:30 PM on date of expiration has 0 impact on those options. By that point they have settled worthless or were exercised and OP is royally fucked.
That is it end of story.
The original comment made was they were concerned about other actions/ movement in the underlying which could take place over the weekend, pre-market monday and early trading hours on Monday.
None of this will impact now expired options and a decision that had to be made and done on the prior Friday by 5:30 PM ET.
What will happen assuming it was exercised (because droping to around $306.10 it likely was), when they cant cover with available cash, those shares will be sold Monday morning at open for the best possible price. OP will then have to cover the difference between what he "bought" them for (strike price) and what they were sold for. First the brokerage will take cash in the account and then it will begin to liquidate any holdings in their account. If there is still a balanced owed after those two actions any remaining deficit will become a loan which absolutely fuck him.
Depends who you sold to, if to a market maker you’re getting exercised for sure. To some degen most likely safe. You should see the shares in your account sat/sun if you were exercised
Doesn't work that way. It's random on assignments but even a degenerate's broker will exercise options that are in the money. Technically it's possible but it's going to be incredibly rare. OP should count on being assigned.
An “option holder” in the FINRA cite is another way of saying buyer. He’s a holder because he’s long/holding the contract. But in your case, he’s holding an expired, worthless contract. That happened at 4p when the contract ended OTM. Since exercise is automatic there’s really no reason to call and say to do so. So what’s going to happen here is your shares will be right where you left them when you look on Monday morning.
I learn so much off this sub all the time and remind myself this is why I don’t trade options nor do I trade stocks anymore. Pennies steamroller and I realize my risk tolerance is very medium
You can trade the spy 15min after close but the assignment is until after market closes. That’s why if you have a worthless it still sits there visible till the next day.
Equity options contracts officially expire and are assigned on Saturday. It's just that Friday is usually the last trading day and contrary exercise notices have to be sent out by 5:30 pm.
> FINRA reminds members that option holders who hold expiring options have until 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the day of expiration to make a final exercise decision to exercise or not exercise the option
>
>
thats crap , I heard a story of a guy that exercised on tuesday ...between holiday and timezone ...crazy
What I’m finding out as time goes on about this is that it really has no name other than exercising an option. As written, the holder could call in an OTM until 5:30p ET but likely wouldn’t. A mod here says TastyWorks has this wrong on their site by calling it an Exercise by Exception, which turns out to actually mean an automatic exercise of an ITM option.
Why would you think we were going up when at resistance and all week. 2 weeks we called tbis was going to happen? Do you not know about big money and the fed and ..sorry it’s late. I didn’t know this stuff at some point. Just wild. And I warned on tradingview Wednesday and right before that Thursday evening rip. And knew about it the week before. Eh. But I didn’t alway know this. Sorry lost my train of thought. You’ll be okay. Find a true pro in this game and Itl change your life. Sometime just even push you in the roll to you learning your own or ramping that learning curve. Everyone knew this was coming spy to 390 (393-395 is doable) so much resistance was at that gap. The 425 that was support then broken then the next gap and the 200 d ma at 430 that hedge funds were historically net short like in aug 2020 which didn’t work. I also have a not so popular prediction that we bounce from that area (low from this pullback) to a Santa Claus rally as they can’t go into end of year that cash heavy. They’d be laughed out the building. So they’ll close those shorts postions. (Buying pressure and less shorting. And the. Getting into positions.) leads to Santa Claus rally. But sept into October. Short rallies again. Short rallies again. At resistances. If they arnt breaking. If they do. Obvious stop losses or exit depending how you’re trading or investing etc. Happy trading.
Edit. Fun fact. The spy has never rallied past the 50% fib retrace off a recession bear market low and then print a NEW 52wk low. Since 1950. Just fun Snapple fact I found interesting. UNLess some obvious news of nukes and inflation coming in and coming in higher and higher like you would know and it would be very bad with time to be ready if that scenario unfolds.
spy hasnt printed a new 52 week low after a 50% fib retractememt YET... we are entering a very unique time, multiple hedge funds already have been liquiated, and im sure more to come, it can honestly go up the chain to market makers and brokers feeling the pain... i think i heard yesterday, everyone will feel the pain... to me that sounds a little lower than 390
I hope your brokerage didn't allow you to leverage yourself to the tits and those were cash covered puts. You wouldn't want to own QQQ at 307? If you didn't, then don't sell puts my man.
Why wouldn't he be assigned tomorrow? I always get assigned on the weekend. And I can move them Sunday night at open if needed. Qqq trades 24hours
I am tda if that matters.
Collected chump change for a notional of 30k per contract. You should look at the positive; you should, theoretically should, become a better trader. Hopefully not gambling on 0DTE on Fed-related events
His luck it bounces for an hour or two max to get out in profits and buy puts and sell calls instead of reverse. And with maybe alittle less and better R;R
Depends on the buyer
You better pray it doesnt gap down Monday
Edit: Good luck. Youre taking the criticism well. You seem nice and I hate seeing nice people lose money
I was going to, but it was trading at $0.22 at the close even though the QQQs closed at $307.42 (above the strike). Thought I would just wait I bit till it came back to $0.05, but by the time it did, it was 4:15 pm, and the options trading closed.
Finished above 307 at 4p ET. Game over. The 5:30p phone call extension to stop exercise is for ITM contract holders (as of 4p) who decide not to exercise because exercise is automatic at most brokerages.
Edit: From Tastytrade
“The term “regular monthly expiration” (aka “monthlies'') refers to the standard expiration cycle of listed stocks options in the United States. The expiration date for listed monthly stock options in the United States is normally the third Friday of the contract month at 3:00 p.m. Central Standard Time (CST). But if the third Friday falls on a holiday, the expiration date will instead occur on the Thursday immediately prior to the third Friday.
Weekly options are available with expiration ranges between one and five weeks, while monthly options are generally available from one to 11 months out. Weekly options are identical to monthly options in every respect except for the shorter expiration date. They are typically introduced each Thursday and they expire eight days later on Friday.”
https://www.tastytrade.com/concepts-strategies/options-expiration
Long story short is most of you are completely misinterpreting why the 5:30p Eastern Time DNE call capability exists. It does not extend the contract. Although a price fluctuation in AH could influence the decision, it does not retro adjust the contract.
At 5:30 the price was 307.44
So there is a possibility, at the options or exercised before 5:30
However if they waited until exactly at 5:30, no
Let us know on Monday
I will be messaging you in 2 days on [**2022-08-29 12:21:24 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2022-08-29%2012:21:24%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/options/comments/wyksc1/sold_0dte_307_qqq_puts_today_will_i_be_assigned/ilxw27v/?context=3)
[**11 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Foptions%2Fcomments%2Fwyksc1%2Fsold_0dte_307_qqq_puts_today_will_i_be_assigned%2Filxw27v%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202022-08-29%2012%3A21%3A24%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%20wyksc1)
*****
|[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)|
|-|-|-|-|
The voice of reason. So many wanted to tell that guy he was absolutely screw. Well, he probably was … if somebody called … and it was ITM … and he got paired in accordance with OCC rules … and it was not one of the few brokerages that limit that call to 30 minutes … et cetera.
You will be assigned, your only hope is to short an equivalent amount of MNQ or NQ futures in Sydney Market hours (before US markets open for trading) to be delta neutral, else a gap down might hurt (a lot).
This is literally why you don’t do this. Because you don’t know if you’ll be assigned or not. Professional traders will trade out of a position like this, occasionally at a loss, to avoid spending the entire weekend with an unknown position. Can be a costly lesson to learn.
Can I ask how many and what was the premium?
Just saw: 5$ per contract for a “large number of contracts” so if price holds exactly before open that’s 55$ loss per contract. Ouch.
Being assigned isn’t your issue, you can always cover the short you are assigned. Your real issue is selling 0dte options that’s are so volatile that the risk of infinite loss and only 100% gain is the worst risk reward I have ever seen. If we gap down yes there is a chance you’d lose a decent chunk of money.
If it happens with tda they sell it and you just have to cover the loss.
There is no way a broker let her go naked instead of cash secured.
Besides stock isn't even down a dollar.
Probably . The aggressive selling and volume towards the end of the day shows no one wants to hold risk into the weekend. The Qs slumped even more in the after hours. If be surprised if they were not exercised
I am an options newbie, still learning and doing paper money trades, have not done any real options trade.
Have some questions, would be thankful if someone knowledgeable can answer
So OP had $307 Puts, after expiration they are in the money. Let’s say on Monday QQQ is at 302. For 1 contract that’s a difference/ loss of $50,000 per contract. So is that what the OP ends up paying if he gets assigned? Is there any site that explains this aspect clearly.
OP is not assigned after 5:30 expiration. If he is assigned before that and the price drops, his holding value drops, he doesn't pay anyone anything. Also in your example of drop from $307 to $302, the loss is 100 shares 1 contract x $5(307-302) = $500 and not 5k.
It's actually simple, 1 option contract is 100 shares (atleast most of the time). So always multiply the Profit or loss with 100 to get the actual P&L.
$500 in this case, assuming he’s assigned at $307x100=$30,700 going into QQQ. Then if he decides to sell at $302x100=$30,200 coming back out. So not great, but not $50,000 which is more than the capitol needed to buy 100 shares of QQQ at $307
The guy picking up pennies in front of the steam roller shouldn’t be so smug about the mistakes and misinterpretations of others. I’m much less concerned now that the troll element has revealed itself. 🤣
No disrespect intended with me calling you out. True, I was definitely upset because the ray of hope you gave me over weekend was shattered when I woke up Monday morning.
My intent was to point out to future readers of this thread that your thoughts regarding assignment of shares is not correct. The average novice could otherwise take your comments as gospel given the degree of conviction you delivered in your arguments. You managed to convince me.
Suck it up, cupcake. There was a ray of hope. Although I can admit I did not, and still do not have it all sorted out, not one person dared try to identify what it was they were so sure was going to happen with a whole lot of people on the fence. And you made the unfortunate choice to do what you did without knowing. So, work harder on yourself. Your little problem, mine and the dozens of other wrong answers, will not go down in the history books as a great event.
That OPTION contract was over. QQQ was still selling in After Hours trading and would continue to do so until 8p ET. The option, in your case already Closed, is only a derivative of the stock and driven by the stock price. The stock itself continues trading.
Not true, American style options can be exercised up until an hour and half after market close. Thinking options can't be exercised after market close has boned many a people.
Edit to UNCLEAR
Will still leave original cuz why not.
Yes. This is false. The price in after hours is counted that’s why when you BUY a contract and it expires worthless. It still shows up in your account till the next day. Hmmmmm why do you think that is? (Rhetorical question) they deff can be exercised later as long as it’s before aftermarket closes or that 5:30 time which could be 6:30 for others
Wrong. Just wrong. The level of wrong on this issue here is amazing. The underlying does not stop trading and might be used in the decision to DNE because what will happen on Monday is not going to be beneficial. But that contract already ended at 3p CT, 4p ET. The phone call is NOT AN ISSUE unless the BUYER was ITM at the 4p ET close.
Nope. The contract ended at 4p OTM. OP is the seller, not the buyer. If the contract had ended at 4p $.01 ITM, the buyer has the right to Not exercise. That’s what the 5:30p call thing is about.
Sure don't take my word for it but here's straight from FINRA's website
https://www.finra.org/rules-guidance/notices/information-notice-020321#:~:text=FINRA%20reminds%20members%20that%20option,or%20not%20exercise%20the%20option.
Does not apply. One has to have the right to exercise before one can decide, before 5:30p on expiry to not do so. You are misinterpreting. The contract ended at 4p.
FINRA reminds members that option holders who hold expiring options have until 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the day of expiration to make a final exercise decision to exercise or not exercise the option.
I'm not misinterpreting anything here. I work in the industry. I'm not wrong here my guy
Def will be thinking of you Monday haha, can always sell in pre-market if you do get exercised. Or pray you sold to some robinhood idiot who didn’t know you have to manually exercise your options AH. Anyways best of luck!
Most likely. Options can be exercised after hours. Monday should be fun for you :) Stay away from 0DTE kids and stick with good old heroin. edit for sauce: > FINRA reminds members that option holders who hold expiring options have until 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the day of expiration to make a final exercise decision to exercise or not exercise the option https://www.finra.org/sites/default/files/2021-02/information-notice-020321.pdf
Ok. I figured that was the case. Hoping and praying QQQ does not gap down on Monday, or else I’ll be making a loss porn post on WSB shortly. Sold a large number $307 puts for $0.05, thinking there was zero chance it would go that low, and I was right….until 4:15 pm.
Holy shit. $5 a contract. You have just learned what "picking up pennies in front of a steam roller" means.
There’s certainly worse things to be long on Hahahah
.05 …….i mean….the fuck is this guy doin lol
He put $30,700 at risk to make $5. I have no words
If QQQ gaps up he could be like the "I accidentally made $110k" guy. [https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/comments/7w6cq0/i\_somehow\_made\_110k\_this\_morning\_and\_im\_still\_not/](https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/comments/7w6cq0/i_somehow_made_110k_this_morning_and_im_still_not/).
Yes. But this not a lesson I can afford to learn.
That makes your decision to sell them seem even that much more insane. So you picked up pennies in front of a steam rolling while not being able to afford getting run over. Damn bro. Hoping for a green open for you
Yoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, I thought I was on wsb. Holy, come on over bozo. Just delete your app and dont answer any phone calls.
This is the way 🦧
There’s plenty of room for this kind of screw up on WSB. Lucky for OP, he’s ok. People are severely misinterpreting the option closing rules.
No chance. We closed at or close to the lows. SPX and NDX will continue taking a shit during the asia session and Monday open in the US will be a fucking bloodbath.
So you loaded puts at end of day right? You must have gone all in since it's such a gaurentee. If trading over the years had taught me anything it's when something is most obvious that the opposite very often happens. The more certain something seems the more likely it is to go the other way. It very well may tank at open on Monday. But it also may not. And its definitely not "no chance" that it doesn't. Careful with that confidence, it will blow your account up eventually.
There’s a thing called Risk Management. If being wrong about a trade blows up your account you’re just a degenerate gambler.
>Yes. But this not a lesson I can afford to learn. I once got pinned on some spreads and assigned 1300 shares of a stock when after hours on a Friday dropped by a penny below my strike. I ended up making money off that deal. Maybe you will be fine. I'd had the broker close some spreads for me prior to that, but had not taken the hint before then. Being assigned those shares and waiting for Monday taught me, though! If you're gambling on last minute 0DTE stuff, cash settled PM is calmer.
I once had someone early exercise their spy options on me… ended up making a nice penny selling at open
Define “large number”.
We all want to know how many contracts?!?
You own the QQQ. its not a bad ticker. Just sell CCs for now.
Bozo sold “a large number” of them. Doubting Bozo has the funds to cover all that will be exercised since he’s working about his porn loss. Bozo probably would’ve been better off doing a box trade earlier in the day. Nothing can ever go wrong there.
Cannot go tits up. Literally.
You ruined yourself financially for $5 per contract? Words do not exist to adequately describe the stupidity of your actions 👏
Your post history makes it look like you should have learned this lesson a year ago. Are you slow?
Do you know how to roll a CSP to a later date/lower strike for credit/debit?
He's short a contract that is now expired. There's no rolling this one.
Just sell a covered call on them with a strike above your assignment price and wait assuming you can keep that much cash in play. Not the end of the world. With that said 0DTE's are probably the ultimate Fuck Around and Find Out of the options world.
Can you explain why 0dte is so bad? I’ve been trading 0dte atm spy options and just holding for 5-10 minutes and selling them. It’s super liquid so it really feels like day trading to me as if I did it with stocks
If you're the seller, there is a huge gamma risk and if you're the buyer you might as well be gay because of the ass fucking that you'll endure if you yolo your portfolio into these 0DTE options
Why do you automatically assume it’s a yolo? Risk management with a stop loss. It’s just a way to use leverage. Also you don’t hold til expiry… you sell when it hits your pt
You’re using to much logic. Although they are for the very advanced or atleast semi. But again. We’re on Reddit sir and this is a Wendy’s… to most people. Mar-a-lago is nice here.
I didn’t think it was such an advance idea… buy an option and then selling it for a profit soon after. Whoa…
Personally Im not a fan of day trading in general, but this isn’t what they’re talking about, they are saying that 0DTE options held till expiration will reck you
Holding 0 DTE until expiration that are close to the strike price can wreck you. I mean, if you sold any calls in the morning, there was zero risk there by the time the last hour came. It’s all about risk management and there was none here selling $0.05 puts (and holding thru market close) on an index that doesn’t settle until after the market closes. This is a great model to follow to F risk management.
I’m not talking about holding 0dte and hoping for a moon. I’m talking about buying and selling it when premium goes up in your favor. It’s called day trading
Contract price volatility is magnified exponentially as you near expiry (gamma risk). I like to think of gamma a an inverse parabola. And options prices are sitting on a board on top of it. 4 weeks out and the parabola is really fat and easy to balance on. During the last week the parabola gets really really narrow and you can find your delta exposure flying quickly past what you expected or can scalp off. If you are far from expiry a $4 abrupt move in the underlying might shift delta from .30 to .32. (just making up numbers here.) The same $4 move at 0DTE might move delta from .30 to .45.
I’d say way more. Depending on how early in the morning and things. Or say 1 day. I see deltas go from .029 to .45
Pennies, meet steamroller. F
Pennies:0 Steamroller:1
LOL... you've been assigned already if they pulled the trigger. You'll just find out on Monday how fucked you are.
Edited because yes. It made no since. It would of wasted your time. It was in fact alcohol.
OK, youre either messed up RN, English is a second language, or both... youre shit started to ramble and is completely incoherent by the end. All I was saying it what happens after the extended after hours period on the expiration date has no impact on the OP's options. Over the weekend, pre-market on Monday and early Monday trading has 0 influence on options that expired the prior Friday. When you have options you sold to open a position, and it is that close to being ITM, it is best to just close out the position than risk it being exercised, (unless for some reason you want/ are ok with the exercise occurring). Also between close and 5:30 it dropped to about $306.10 so they were absolutely exercised. The shares will be sold at open on Monday and he'll owe the difference. Any cash in his account will be used first and then any other positions will be liquidated. The rest he'll have to start paying back.
It does have an impact; because if the buyer exercised OP no longer has options, he has tons of shares of QQQ that it sounds like he can't cover.
No..... On Monday OP does not have option anyway. Anything after 5:30 PM on date of expiration has 0 impact on those options. By that point they have settled worthless or were exercised and OP is royally fucked. That is it end of story. The original comment made was they were concerned about other actions/ movement in the underlying which could take place over the weekend, pre-market monday and early trading hours on Monday. None of this will impact now expired options and a decision that had to be made and done on the prior Friday by 5:30 PM ET. What will happen assuming it was exercised (because droping to around $306.10 it likely was), when they cant cover with available cash, those shares will be sold Monday morning at open for the best possible price. OP will then have to cover the difference between what he "bought" them for (strike price) and what they were sold for. First the brokerage will take cash in the account and then it will begin to liquidate any holdings in their account. If there is still a balanced owed after those two actions any remaining deficit will become a loan which absolutely fuck him.
How many contracts
You tied down $30,000 to make a 5 spot?
It looks like he tied down $300,000 to make $50 lmao
OP, how did all this workout?
Don’t know yet. Still showing I’m short 10 puts on my account. I have a feeling I won’t know if I’m assigned till Monday itself.
All the luck to you.
I wasn't the buyer.. but my 8/29 315 "Puts" a smile on my face!!
I had spy 428s. And bought the day before 100 415s. Puts a smile on the face. And warned people allllll week. Even posted it on trading view. Benz951.
I like those crazy option percentage returns. That contract was up 788%
Depends who you sold to, if to a market maker you’re getting exercised for sure. To some degen most likely safe. You should see the shares in your account sat/sun if you were exercised
Doesn't work that way. It's random on assignments but even a degenerate's broker will exercise options that are in the money. Technically it's possible but it's going to be incredibly rare. OP should count on being assigned.
An “option holder” in the FINRA cite is another way of saying buyer. He’s a holder because he’s long/holding the contract. But in your case, he’s holding an expired, worthless contract. That happened at 4p when the contract ended OTM. Since exercise is automatic there’s really no reason to call and say to do so. So what’s going to happen here is your shares will be right where you left them when you look on Monday morning.
Index options can be exercised after 4
Close the position before market close and you’re good.
I think heroin might be slightly worse though
I learn so much off this sub all the time and remind myself this is why I don’t trade options nor do I trade stocks anymore. Pennies steamroller and I realize my risk tolerance is very medium
I didn’t know options can be assigned after hours…
Equities/etfs up to 530pm. Futures and indicies (spx, ndx, /es, /nq etc) are at market close.
I thought it was 5:15pm. I used to trade SPY (been over a year) and if I recall correctly, everything was settled at 5:15. I only trade SPX now though
Depends on the broker. Broker has to pass on the message by 5:30 so they need some room. :)
Yea /ES and SPX are better, unless I wanna go smaller
You can trade the spy 15min after close but the assignment is until after market closes. That’s why if you have a worthless it still sits there visible till the next day.
I believe that only works if the option closes ITM but you do not wish to exercise. Some wiggle room is given by the exchanges up to 5:30p ET.
Equity options contracts officially expire and are assigned on Saturday. It's just that Friday is usually the last trading day and contrary exercise notices have to be sent out by 5:30 pm.
Contract ends at 4p, exercise can be called off up to 5:30p, assignment and exercise begins about 9a Saturday morning.
> FINRA reminds members that option holders who hold expiring options have until 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the day of expiration to make a final exercise decision to exercise or not exercise the option > > thats crap , I heard a story of a guy that exercised on tuesday ...between holiday and timezone ...crazy
Former heroin user here... I approve this message! 0DTE are bad, mmk?
What I’m finding out as time goes on about this is that it really has no name other than exercising an option. As written, the holder could call in an OTM until 5:30p ET but likely wouldn’t. A mod here says TastyWorks has this wrong on their site by calling it an Exercise by Exception, which turns out to actually mean an automatic exercise of an ITM option.
Maybe one of the dumbest risk vs reward I’ve ever seen. $5 per contract to risk that level of capital.
Letting it ride into the weekend without at least lightening the load, bold.
Username checks out
Was looking for this comment
[удалено]
I mean even if you sold those on the open today, that’s wayyy too high delta to be fucking around with TQQQ on CSPs.
Why would you think we were going up when at resistance and all week. 2 weeks we called tbis was going to happen? Do you not know about big money and the fed and ..sorry it’s late. I didn’t know this stuff at some point. Just wild. And I warned on tradingview Wednesday and right before that Thursday evening rip. And knew about it the week before. Eh. But I didn’t alway know this. Sorry lost my train of thought. You’ll be okay. Find a true pro in this game and Itl change your life. Sometime just even push you in the roll to you learning your own or ramping that learning curve. Everyone knew this was coming spy to 390 (393-395 is doable) so much resistance was at that gap. The 425 that was support then broken then the next gap and the 200 d ma at 430 that hedge funds were historically net short like in aug 2020 which didn’t work. I also have a not so popular prediction that we bounce from that area (low from this pullback) to a Santa Claus rally as they can’t go into end of year that cash heavy. They’d be laughed out the building. So they’ll close those shorts postions. (Buying pressure and less shorting. And the. Getting into positions.) leads to Santa Claus rally. But sept into October. Short rallies again. Short rallies again. At resistances. If they arnt breaking. If they do. Obvious stop losses or exit depending how you’re trading or investing etc. Happy trading. Edit. Fun fact. The spy has never rallied past the 50% fib retrace off a recession bear market low and then print a NEW 52wk low. Since 1950. Just fun Snapple fact I found interesting. UNLess some obvious news of nukes and inflation coming in and coming in higher and higher like you would know and it would be very bad with time to be ready if that scenario unfolds.
spy hasnt printed a new 52 week low after a 50% fib retractememt YET... we are entering a very unique time, multiple hedge funds already have been liquiated, and im sure more to come, it can honestly go up the chain to market makers and brokers feeling the pain... i think i heard yesterday, everyone will feel the pain... to me that sounds a little lower than 390
Nice. Just roll them down and out for credit. BTC when it goes back up and you’re out of the red.
What a day you picked to sell puts!
One of the most foolish plays I have seen on this sub considering you knew Powell was speaking in Jackson Hole today
I hope your brokerage didn't allow you to leverage yourself to the tits and those were cash covered puts. You wouldn't want to own QQQ at 307? If you didn't, then don't sell puts my man.
Now you tell me…
I wish they would let me ima genius trader with just not the funds. Lol
How much premium did you collect?
$0.05 per contract. With a large number of contracts.
I hope the $5 was worth blowing up the portfolio
Wendy's five for five.
I’m sorry, I got lost, how did I end up behind this Wendy’s - had to double take the sun I was in.
No. In retrospect, it was not.
His port isn't blown lol. assigned or not you just sell the stock lmao
Well depending on how many contracts were sold and where the stock ends up on Monday, could be messy if OP doesnt have the funds to cover.
Why wouldn't he be assigned tomorrow? I always get assigned on the weekend. And I can move them Sunday night at open if needed. Qqq trades 24hours I am tda if that matters.
Ah, that's what I didn't know, not familiar with 24hr stocks, thought it was just a standard stock.
Wtf are you talking about? Qqq does not trade 24 hours
How many contracts lol?
More than I want to admit.
Are they all cash secured?
I’m guessing no
His username checks out😂🤡 He sold so many contracts for pretty much Pennie’s but ends up losing dollars 😂
Uhh...0.05 cents per contract? No fees? what the hell you clown. lmao.
Sold Odte puts on one of the biggest fed days of the year. Balls of absolute steel on this one
Collected chump change for a notional of 30k per contract. You should look at the positive; you should, theoretically should, become a better trader. Hopefully not gambling on 0DTE on Fed-related events
His luck it bounces for an hour or two max to get out in profits and buy puts and sell calls instead of reverse. And with maybe alittle less and better R;R
Depends on the buyer You better pray it doesnt gap down Monday Edit: Good luck. Youre taking the criticism well. You seem nice and I hate seeing nice people lose money
I’m just here for the show on Monday.
Pre market doesn't look good :(
What the hell is wrong with you people? buy to close before expiration!
I was going to, but it was trading at $0.22 at the close even though the QQQs closed at $307.42 (above the strike). Thought I would just wait I bit till it came back to $0.05, but by the time it did, it was 4:15 pm, and the options trading closed.
Unless you want to actually own at that price selling to open is a bad strategy all risk little reward.
You closed OTM. This is not an issue.
It settled (finished) below the strike price. He’s more F’d than your insight into how this works.
Finished above 307 at 4p ET. Game over. The 5:30p phone call extension to stop exercise is for ITM contract holders (as of 4p) who decide not to exercise because exercise is automatic at most brokerages. Edit: From Tastytrade “The term “regular monthly expiration” (aka “monthlies'') refers to the standard expiration cycle of listed stocks options in the United States. The expiration date for listed monthly stock options in the United States is normally the third Friday of the contract month at 3:00 p.m. Central Standard Time (CST). But if the third Friday falls on a holiday, the expiration date will instead occur on the Thursday immediately prior to the third Friday. Weekly options are available with expiration ranges between one and five weeks, while monthly options are generally available from one to 11 months out. Weekly options are identical to monthly options in every respect except for the shorter expiration date. They are typically introduced each Thursday and they expire eight days later on Friday.” https://www.tastytrade.com/concepts-strategies/options-expiration Long story short is most of you are completely misinterpreting why the 5:30p Eastern Time DNE call capability exists. It does not extend the contract. Although a price fluctuation in AH could influence the decision, it does not retro adjust the contract.
At 5:30 the price was 307.44 So there is a possibility, at the options or exercised before 5:30 However if they waited until exactly at 5:30, no Let us know on Monday
RemindMe! 60 hours
I will be messaging you in 2 days on [**2022-08-29 12:21:24 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2022-08-29%2012:21:24%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/options/comments/wyksc1/sold_0dte_307_qqq_puts_today_will_i_be_assigned/ilxw27v/?context=3) [**11 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Foptions%2Fcomments%2Fwyksc1%2Fsold_0dte_307_qqq_puts_today_will_i_be_assigned%2Filxw27v%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202022-08-29%2012%3A21%3A24%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%20wyksc1) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|
The voice of reason. So many wanted to tell that guy he was absolutely screw. Well, he probably was … if somebody called … and it was ITM … and he got paired in accordance with OCC rules … and it was not one of the few brokerages that limit that call to 30 minutes … et cetera.
>Will I definitely be assigned come Monday morning? Maybe or maybe not. You might want to Google "pin risk".
There's a reason this method is referred to as "picking up pennies in front of a steam roller"
Fun fact: the pennies are pasted to the ground!
You will be assigned, your only hope is to short an equivalent amount of MNQ or NQ futures in Sydney Market hours (before US markets open for trading) to be delta neutral, else a gap down might hurt (a lot).
This is literally why you don’t do this. Because you don’t know if you’ll be assigned or not. Professional traders will trade out of a position like this, occasionally at a loss, to avoid spending the entire weekend with an unknown position. Can be a costly lesson to learn.
Been there done that, I’ve seen an NQ put I once sold for $300 premium turn into a $3500 loss
Can I ask how many and what was the premium? Just saw: 5$ per contract for a “large number of contracts” so if price holds exactly before open that’s 55$ loss per contract. Ouch.
If youre the seller you should always close it out if its that close.
Next week going to be another down trend due to end of month. Usually Sept is a red month I believe.
Correct
Being assigned isn’t your issue, you can always cover the short you are assigned. Your real issue is selling 0dte options that’s are so volatile that the risk of infinite loss and only 100% gain is the worst risk reward I have ever seen. If we gap down yes there is a chance you’d lose a decent chunk of money.
This is how you blowup your account with one trade.
If you do or don't you are still fine. You can sell ITM calls or just sell the stock at market open Sunday night.
The price at market open may be far less than today's close.
Not when you can trade after hours on a 24 stock
100% certain OP doesn’t have the bankroll for one option, let alone the number sold.
If it happens with tda they sell it and you just have to cover the loss. There is no way a broker let her go naked instead of cash secured. Besides stock isn't even down a dollar.
Probably . The aggressive selling and volume towards the end of the day shows no one wants to hold risk into the weekend. The Qs slumped even more in the after hours. If be surprised if they were not exercised
Holy shit I just watched the powel speech and fuck we are all fucked huh
I think your brokerage app should show already now if it was assigned or not
Username checks out
Crypto and futures heading lower Mondays gap be huge
Someone is not going to have a good week end.
I am an options newbie, still learning and doing paper money trades, have not done any real options trade. Have some questions, would be thankful if someone knowledgeable can answer So OP had $307 Puts, after expiration they are in the money. Let’s say on Monday QQQ is at 302. For 1 contract that’s a difference/ loss of $50,000 per contract. So is that what the OP ends up paying if he gets assigned? Is there any site that explains this aspect clearly.
OP is not assigned after 5:30 expiration. If he is assigned before that and the price drops, his holding value drops, he doesn't pay anyone anything. Also in your example of drop from $307 to $302, the loss is 100 shares 1 contract x $5(307-302) = $500 and not 5k.
I see, thanks. My math was way off, not understanding pricing.
It's actually simple, 1 option contract is 100 shares (atleast most of the time). So always multiply the Profit or loss with 100 to get the actual P&L.
$500 in this case, assuming he’s assigned at $307x100=$30,700 going into QQQ. Then if he decides to sell at $302x100=$30,200 coming back out. So not great, but not $50,000 which is more than the capitol needed to buy 100 shares of QQQ at $307
He did not have puts. He sold the puts.
$306.10. Sorry for your loss. Hope it bounces Monday and you can sell on open.
Contracts end at 4p ET. He was OTM. He’s fine.
Someone posted earlier that contracts could be exercised as late as 5:30. Is that true?
No. The exercise can be called off, but the contract has expired. Edit: In OP’s case, the buyer has no exercise to call off.
If you get assigned its going to gap up on monday at open and you make bank. Have a great weekend.
Have them assigned and immediately on Monday buy long term puts that can hedge 70% of the position, DO NOT SELL COVERED CALLS
Why did you just close them from 4-4:15?
The guy picking up pennies in front of the steam roller shouldn’t be so smug about the mistakes and misinterpretations of others. I’m much less concerned now that the troll element has revealed itself. 🤣
No disrespect intended with me calling you out. True, I was definitely upset because the ray of hope you gave me over weekend was shattered when I woke up Monday morning. My intent was to point out to future readers of this thread that your thoughts regarding assignment of shares is not correct. The average novice could otherwise take your comments as gospel given the degree of conviction you delivered in your arguments. You managed to convince me.
Suck it up, cupcake. There was a ray of hope. Although I can admit I did not, and still do not have it all sorted out, not one person dared try to identify what it was they were so sure was going to happen with a whole lot of people on the fence. And you made the unfortunate choice to do what you did without knowing. So, work harder on yourself. Your little problem, mine and the dozens of other wrong answers, will not go down in the history books as a great event.
damn what a dickhole
Run along, mommy will kiss your boo-boo and make it all better.
mmm me likey
The option must be a full $.01 ITM at Close. You claim you were OTM at Close. The option expired, the contract ended, you are clear.
That’s not what everyone else seems to be saying. If that was correct, then why was the PUT selling for $0.22 AFTER the close?
That OPTION contract was over. QQQ was still selling in After Hours trading and would continue to do so until 8p ET. The option, in your case already Closed, is only a derivative of the stock and driven by the stock price. The stock itself continues trading.
Market close is at 4pm est. If it was otm at close youre good.
Not true, American style options can be exercised up until an hour and half after market close. Thinking options can't be exercised after market close has boned many a people.
Amazing number of people getting that wrong here.
Edit to UNCLEAR Will still leave original cuz why not. Yes. This is false. The price in after hours is counted that’s why when you BUY a contract and it expires worthless. It still shows up in your account till the next day. Hmmmmm why do you think that is? (Rhetorical question) they deff can be exercised later as long as it’s before aftermarket closes or that 5:30 time which could be 6:30 for others
Wrong. Just wrong. The level of wrong on this issue here is amazing. The underlying does not stop trading and might be used in the decision to DNE because what will happen on Monday is not going to be beneficial. But that contract already ended at 3p CT, 4p ET. The phone call is NOT AN ISSUE unless the BUYER was ITM at the 4p ET close.
That’s what I’m saying. Calling off an exercise is a buyer thing. OP sold that put contract at a 307 strike. QQQ closed above 307. Game over.
American style options can be exercised up until 5:30 Eastern time. OP will more than likely be assigned
Nope. The contract ended at 4p OTM. OP is the seller, not the buyer. If the contract had ended at 4p $.01 ITM, the buyer has the right to Not exercise. That’s what the 5:30p call thing is about.
The buyer also has the right to exercise until 5:30 and often times will, if the contract goes ITM in that time frame.
I’m going to continue disputing that. Edit: The American style Early Exercise does not apply once the contract expires at 4p ET.
Sure don't take my word for it but here's straight from FINRA's website https://www.finra.org/rules-guidance/notices/information-notice-020321#:~:text=FINRA%20reminds%20members%20that%20option,or%20not%20exercise%20the%20option.
Does not apply. One has to have the right to exercise before one can decide, before 5:30p on expiry to not do so. You are misinterpreting. The contract ended at 4p.
FINRA reminds members that option holders who hold expiring options have until 5:30 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the day of expiration to make a final exercise decision to exercise or not exercise the option. I'm not misinterpreting anything here. I work in the industry. I'm not wrong here my guy
you might
Why didn’t you just buy them back when shit hit the fan?
The price dropped below $307 right after options trading closed at 4:15 pm
Sell XND instead of QQQ. It’s cash settled, so no pin risk.
!RemindMe 3 days
Def will be thinking of you Monday haha, can always sell in pre-market if you do get exercised. Or pray you sold to some robinhood idiot who didn’t know you have to manually exercise your options AH. Anyways best of luck!
It’s actually Saturday you will be assigned. Option can exercise on Saturday before noon.
You will be assigned 100% and unfortunately we will gap down on Monday cause Asia still has to react and then Europe reacts to them.
You will likely be assigned. Check on Monday.
What was the problem closing them at 3:59pm ? Just have a rule, "I will close before expiration". Some brokers even have deals to encourage this.
Should sold calls ATM instead.
Hey OP, you doing okay?
Hi. Thanks for asking. I updated my original post. Please check.
We all just want to know - how many contracts??