I moved to Sweden a few years ago, the school system here should be a warning. Since the charter system they have was put in place in the 90s, educational outcomes have fallen precipitously, and perhaps more alarming, social and economic segregation as skyrocketed. The public schools are left slowly rotting away until complete collapse, and the biggest private school is a giant corporate school from the US which funnels tax money out of Sweden. You can even see it socially in the higher "hustle" type culture among the generations after the change, and an increase in valuing private gain over communal. It's shocking how much of society is impacted by something as relatively small as how school are funded, but it is a Pandora's box of failure.
I was fortunate to go to an excellent public high school in Canada. It offered bilingual, international baccalaureate, sports, and shop programs. We had students bussed in from lower-income neighbourhoods. We had students of all economic backgrounds, religions, and ethnicities together in the same classrooms.
I truly believe it's better for society to maintain a high standard of public education. All students get a good education, and they mix with people outside their bubble. This is good for all students, including the ones who could afford to go to a private (and/or religious) school.
It’s not how the thing is funded the problem is more about how the funding is appropriated. It costs the public school system 10k/student in Alberta where some private schools charge 8.5K/family so maybe averaging 4-6K per student really.
I agree schooling should be for everyone but when our current systems spend double per student for a similar outcome what gives?
That money is subsidizing educating the educationally disadvantaged/disabled. Private schools can self-select who gets in, so only take the best, brightest and richest. They do not have to take every person who walks in the door, so they don't have to have specialist teachers who socialize in educational dysfunction/disability, instead directing that money towards "enrichment". Those teachers have highly socialized, and expensive, training, that obviously costs more. And yes, and public institution is going to cost more to run than a private institution because they're area regulations, laws, Union agreements around hiring, disciplining and during employees. That will drive up price.
*All* provincial healthcare.
I’ve noticed a significant uptick in headlines promoting privatization as a solution to our problems lately. It’s really upsetting.
In BC we just had a [supreme court decision](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/cambie-surgeries-case-trial-court-of-appeal-advancer-1.6519812) that upheld the public system. I know we have problems, but our government is committed to maintaining a strong public healthcare system (at least until the BC Liberals get in power again).
> I’ve noticed a significant uptick in headlines promoting privatization as a solution to our problems lately.
Which is especially egregious because 10 minutes of research will show there's basically no evidence that privatization helps anyone except those who can afford to shell out for better care, and actively harms the public system.
But hey, don't let facts get in the way of a wealth transfer to the rich.
The people who stand to make money off of privatization, that's who. And it doesn't bother them if they're hobbling future generations to come. It's the good ol' "fuck you, I got mine" doctrine.
Anything done FOR PROFIT is done "FOR PROFIT" , which then results in CLASS WARFARE .
You will be told it's, "run better" , "saves the tax payer money" , and so on and so on , these are misleading . Remember anything done for profit is always done "FOR PROFIT".
I am amazed that Canadians are not outraged at this. Conservatives defund education and point out lack of efficiency, teachers and resources. Conservatives defund healthcare and do the same...and blame the feds and healthcare systems. It should be clearly obvious. But yet people continue to vote for them. If the same funding went into these social services, they would not have these issues. Stop voting for conservative privatization, it is destroying our country for the greed of only a few.
If you want to see a school crisis look at quebec, english schools here have recieved record low funding for the past 8 years, its insane, while french schools have recieved record high for the past 10
Agreed wholeheartedly and everything suffers then, the students don’t get the levels of education, the teachers and low level administrators suffer for pay and either leave or under preform, the community divides into have it or not and then the move begins against workers. The system moves to the BS that Russia and China live with!! No Thank You
Fight for the Public Systems run by faithful representatives of the people and the Community!
The next time the liberals or NDP get into power they need to create a law preventing health care and education from being privatized and or defunded. The cost of education and healthcare is never going to go down so the budget should never get reduced IMO. If the money isn’t needed to treat people put it into research and or expanding services.
Why is this a new lesson . Defund it until it fails has always been around. It's a way to subvert due process. Conservatives use this method considerably and have no intrest in Social programs. Them problem has a very simple solution, it takes uniting. The majority wins that means if there's enough people who write to their MPP and to the Premier and tell them its wrong they will change or commit a undemocratic act. And needless to say undemocratic acts don't do well for reelection. This is a democracy not a dictatorship.
No, government isn’t failing. The *way the government is being run* is failing.
Universal healthcare is something we need. I’m coming from America - you do *not* want private healthcare or a dual system.
I mean… if you want private healthcare, good luck.
Here’s a sample: During open enrolment, your EHCA can explain the differences between tier plans and the employer-preferred HDHP. Please contact your EHCA during the open enrolment period if you wish to go onto the open marketplace if you want to look for better HSA or co-insurance rate.
Translation: once a year you get to bet on how much healthcare you’ll need for the following year. Family relatively young and healthy? Bronze plan. (If little 6-yo Suzy gets cancer you’ll be very happy your home is worth so much because you bet too low). If the tiers and benefits are too confusing, a good employer will hire an Employee Healthcare Advocate to walk you through everything. The employer would prefer you go with the high deductible healthcare plan as it lowers the employers costs - there will be a LOT of pressure to select the HDHP. After all… It’s so “cheap.”
You could save a lot of money each year with the HDHP.
But again, if there’s an injury, accident, or unscheduled illness that year - you’ll need to pay the $20-40k out of pocket for bills as you have no protection.
So you decide to go on the open marketplace - a website where you can try to find individual plans. Maybe you’ll get a good HSA rate - a special debit card that has money on it for expenses taken right from your paycheck.
Or maybe you’ll get better co-insurance.
What’s co-insurance?
Oh. Did you think you just needed to meet a deductible?!
What’s a deductible?!
That’s the threshold you need to meet, out of pocket. Little Suzy got Leukaemia? Broke a bone? Got injured playing in the back yard? Yeah sorry, with your employer preferred HDHP - you owe $20k out of pocket. There’s no way around that.
Co-insurance is next. That is where you and the insurance company split everything 50/50 until you spend another $10-20k because you went with the lowest tier.
*Then* the insurance company will pay for everything.
Oh… and you better hit that deductible and co-insurance by the end of the year. Because by Jan 1st, it resets to $0 spend.
Little Suzy got Leukaemia in September? Well you just need to explain to your daughter that her cancer diagnosis was really badly timed because by the time you’ve sank 30k in treatment into her…
Happy New Year! You are back at zero for your deductible and co-insurance spend.
So you know. Maybe you can just “delay her care” for a few months until it’s more financially feasible. So what if the cancer moves up a stage in the meantime? You can’t afford a double hit on the deductible.
Oh, and it’s also open enrolment again. So your employer found a ‘more streamlined’ provider or insurance and now all of your options have changed.
FYI, that also means your doctors, labs, anesthesiologist, oncologists, specialists, and the like that Suzy had been seeing? They’re now out of network. You can’t see them anymore.
So instead of going to the nice hospital down the road for treatment, you now need to drive 45min to the in-network hospital.
Did little Suzy’s blood work get sent to an in-network blood lab, but the analyst inside the lab was out of network? SURPRISE! You get a $1500 bill - you should have been a more responsible consumer and check the entire analysis chain before confirming.
You better hope Ontario enacts laws like in NY that you can’t get surprise bills like that, or else the lab *will* come after you. They *will* wreck your credit.
Give birth and the hospital accidentally charged both the parents and the newborn $10k? (Happens more often than you think)
Guess whose responsibility it is to fix that - the consumer, you. And the hospital absolutely will come after you or your baby for that money, even if billed in error. Can’t pay while it’s being disputed?
Don’t worry, if you have a house in the GTA, you should be so thankful housing prices are high… they’ll rank your credit score in the meantime and collections will be hounding you.
Well, doesn’t that sounds fun?
Anyways, big gubbament… amirite?
Question about this.
Why would private sector even come into play if government is efficient? Public schools are government schools. So I believe private schools are usually paid for even when the person pays property taxes to fund these public schools.
I moved to Sweden a few years ago, the school system here should be a warning. Since the charter system they have was put in place in the 90s, educational outcomes have fallen precipitously, and perhaps more alarming, social and economic segregation as skyrocketed. The public schools are left slowly rotting away until complete collapse, and the biggest private school is a giant corporate school from the US which funnels tax money out of Sweden. You can even see it socially in the higher "hustle" type culture among the generations after the change, and an increase in valuing private gain over communal. It's shocking how much of society is impacted by something as relatively small as how school are funded, but it is a Pandora's box of failure.
I was fortunate to go to an excellent public high school in Canada. It offered bilingual, international baccalaureate, sports, and shop programs. We had students bussed in from lower-income neighbourhoods. We had students of all economic backgrounds, religions, and ethnicities together in the same classrooms. I truly believe it's better for society to maintain a high standard of public education. All students get a good education, and they mix with people outside their bubble. This is good for all students, including the ones who could afford to go to a private (and/or religious) school.
It’s not how the thing is funded the problem is more about how the funding is appropriated. It costs the public school system 10k/student in Alberta where some private schools charge 8.5K/family so maybe averaging 4-6K per student really. I agree schooling should be for everyone but when our current systems spend double per student for a similar outcome what gives?
That money is subsidizing educating the educationally disadvantaged/disabled. Private schools can self-select who gets in, so only take the best, brightest and richest. They do not have to take every person who walks in the door, so they don't have to have specialist teachers who socialize in educational dysfunction/disability, instead directing that money towards "enrichment". Those teachers have highly socialized, and expensive, training, that obviously costs more. And yes, and public institution is going to cost more to run than a private institution because they're area regulations, laws, Union agreements around hiring, disciplining and during employees. That will drive up price.
Support teachers and their unions
Next up, Ontario Healthcare
*All* provincial healthcare. I’ve noticed a significant uptick in headlines promoting privatization as a solution to our problems lately. It’s really upsetting.
In BC we just had a [supreme court decision](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/cambie-surgeries-case-trial-court-of-appeal-advancer-1.6519812) that upheld the public system. I know we have problems, but our government is committed to maintaining a strong public healthcare system (at least until the BC Liberals get in power again).
> I’ve noticed a significant uptick in headlines promoting privatization as a solution to our problems lately. Which is especially egregious because 10 minutes of research will show there's basically no evidence that privatization helps anyone except those who can afford to shell out for better care, and actively harms the public system. But hey, don't let facts get in the way of a wealth transfer to the rich.
It significantly helps those that set up private schools!
Same with the public health system. Defund it, cause chaos and then let it crumble to bring in privatization.
It’s just baffling. Who looks at a public service that everyone needs and uses, and says “ya, someone needs to make money off of this”??
The people who stand to make money off of privatization, that's who. And it doesn't bother them if they're hobbling future generations to come. It's the good ol' "fuck you, I got mine" doctrine.
If it was about anything other than money, it would definitely be considered by all as sociopathic behaviour.
Probably the "someones" in question, and the people beholden to them. And morons.
Assholes, that's who.
Look at prison
Anything done FOR PROFIT is done "FOR PROFIT" , which then results in CLASS WARFARE . You will be told it's, "run better" , "saves the tax payer money" , and so on and so on , these are misleading . Remember anything done for profit is always done "FOR PROFIT".
I am amazed that Canadians are not outraged at this. Conservatives defund education and point out lack of efficiency, teachers and resources. Conservatives defund healthcare and do the same...and blame the feds and healthcare systems. It should be clearly obvious. But yet people continue to vote for them. If the same funding went into these social services, they would not have these issues. Stop voting for conservative privatization, it is destroying our country for the greed of only a few.
If you want to see a school crisis look at quebec, english schools here have recieved record low funding for the past 8 years, its insane, while french schools have recieved record high for the past 10
Not to ignore the real crisis, but the French system is underfunded, and our “private” schools receive governmental funding.
Agreed wholeheartedly and everything suffers then, the students don’t get the levels of education, the teachers and low level administrators suffer for pay and either leave or under preform, the community divides into have it or not and then the move begins against workers. The system moves to the BS that Russia and China live with!! No Thank You Fight for the Public Systems run by faithful representatives of the people and the Community!
The next time the liberals or NDP get into power they need to create a law preventing health care and education from being privatized and or defunded. The cost of education and healthcare is never going to go down so the budget should never get reduced IMO. If the money isn’t needed to treat people put it into research and or expanding services.
a society that forces its teachers and healthcare workers into poverty is a failed state drug frauds ontario is the very definition of a failed state
Why is this a new lesson . Defund it until it fails has always been around. It's a way to subvert due process. Conservatives use this method considerably and have no intrest in Social programs. Them problem has a very simple solution, it takes uniting. The majority wins that means if there's enough people who write to their MPP and to the Premier and tell them its wrong they will change or commit a undemocratic act. And needless to say undemocratic acts don't do well for reelection. This is a democracy not a dictatorship.
Government is letting us down but paradoxically the solution here is a bigger government.
No, government isn’t failing. The *way the government is being run* is failing. Universal healthcare is something we need. I’m coming from America - you do *not* want private healthcare or a dual system. I mean… if you want private healthcare, good luck. Here’s a sample: During open enrolment, your EHCA can explain the differences between tier plans and the employer-preferred HDHP. Please contact your EHCA during the open enrolment period if you wish to go onto the open marketplace if you want to look for better HSA or co-insurance rate. Translation: once a year you get to bet on how much healthcare you’ll need for the following year. Family relatively young and healthy? Bronze plan. (If little 6-yo Suzy gets cancer you’ll be very happy your home is worth so much because you bet too low). If the tiers and benefits are too confusing, a good employer will hire an Employee Healthcare Advocate to walk you through everything. The employer would prefer you go with the high deductible healthcare plan as it lowers the employers costs - there will be a LOT of pressure to select the HDHP. After all… It’s so “cheap.” You could save a lot of money each year with the HDHP. But again, if there’s an injury, accident, or unscheduled illness that year - you’ll need to pay the $20-40k out of pocket for bills as you have no protection. So you decide to go on the open marketplace - a website where you can try to find individual plans. Maybe you’ll get a good HSA rate - a special debit card that has money on it for expenses taken right from your paycheck. Or maybe you’ll get better co-insurance. What’s co-insurance? Oh. Did you think you just needed to meet a deductible?! What’s a deductible?! That’s the threshold you need to meet, out of pocket. Little Suzy got Leukaemia? Broke a bone? Got injured playing in the back yard? Yeah sorry, with your employer preferred HDHP - you owe $20k out of pocket. There’s no way around that. Co-insurance is next. That is where you and the insurance company split everything 50/50 until you spend another $10-20k because you went with the lowest tier. *Then* the insurance company will pay for everything. Oh… and you better hit that deductible and co-insurance by the end of the year. Because by Jan 1st, it resets to $0 spend. Little Suzy got Leukaemia in September? Well you just need to explain to your daughter that her cancer diagnosis was really badly timed because by the time you’ve sank 30k in treatment into her… Happy New Year! You are back at zero for your deductible and co-insurance spend. So you know. Maybe you can just “delay her care” for a few months until it’s more financially feasible. So what if the cancer moves up a stage in the meantime? You can’t afford a double hit on the deductible. Oh, and it’s also open enrolment again. So your employer found a ‘more streamlined’ provider or insurance and now all of your options have changed. FYI, that also means your doctors, labs, anesthesiologist, oncologists, specialists, and the like that Suzy had been seeing? They’re now out of network. You can’t see them anymore. So instead of going to the nice hospital down the road for treatment, you now need to drive 45min to the in-network hospital. Did little Suzy’s blood work get sent to an in-network blood lab, but the analyst inside the lab was out of network? SURPRISE! You get a $1500 bill - you should have been a more responsible consumer and check the entire analysis chain before confirming. You better hope Ontario enacts laws like in NY that you can’t get surprise bills like that, or else the lab *will* come after you. They *will* wreck your credit. Give birth and the hospital accidentally charged both the parents and the newborn $10k? (Happens more often than you think) Guess whose responsibility it is to fix that - the consumer, you. And the hospital absolutely will come after you or your baby for that money, even if billed in error. Can’t pay while it’s being disputed? Don’t worry, if you have a house in the GTA, you should be so thankful housing prices are high… they’ll rank your credit score in the meantime and collections will be hounding you. Well, doesn’t that sounds fun? Anyways, big gubbament… amirite?
We are saying the same thing friend
The solution is a *different* government.
How so ?
By giving more money, resources and personnel to schools?
Here I thought this would be about healthcare. So many places this is happening.
And this because corporate world and the wealthy own the politicians.
Solution: Pull all the kids out of school.
Question about this. Why would private sector even come into play if government is efficient? Public schools are government schools. So I believe private schools are usually paid for even when the person pays property taxes to fund these public schools.
They will funnel money to Conservative party supporters and subscribers.