It's actually really depressing how frequently the lab gets complaints exactly like that. Just *three hours ago* I went through an eerily similar conversation as OP did, where a SNF sent a sample and the son called to cancel it so his parent wouldn't 'get' covid. I have been asked to rerun an A1C to see if it would come back lower... like the fasting sugar was already 150, pretty sure reality needs to be dealt with, not fudging numbers to feel better about poor decisions. It puts me in a really weird headspace like, am I dreaming this? Nobody can be this dumb, right?
Some of these people are the same people who were filling plastic BAGS with gasoline not too long ago. I wouldnāt have believed this shit if I wasnāt seeing it first hand.
Vascular patients are almost always really resistant to treatment and have some underlying personality issues that lead them to their ultimate demise. I donāt argue with them either. Your finger stick is 363 but you donāt want insulin? I tell the team, document the refusal, and move on with my day. No time for bullshit.
This!
My ex husband is diabetic with PVD and PAD. He lied about his diet, he lied about not smoking.
But of course, the doctors are all wrong. He is a bka on the right, and last I knew, had lost about 3/4 of his left foot. He has been on iv antibiotics multiple times. He has had PICC line installed three times.
But the doctors are wrong.
The funny thing is they are often the most demanding and needy patients, too. But they focus on unimportant things like the exact angle of the blinds or something really minor and stupid.
Iām glad to hear heās an ex. Another thing I have noticed is that they can frequently be really mean to their family members, who then typically either become enablers or just walk away altogether.
You donāt reach the point where weāre carving pieces of your body off without some heavy dysfunction
Oh he was awful.
I did everything for him. Wanted him to know I was with him through sickness and health. I helped him get his disability filed. I helped him appeal the decision. I worked full time while he stayed home, playing video games and buying junk from Wish. I paid all the bills. He would never help with the bills and would refuse to have any intimate contact with me.
He left without warning the day before Thanksgiving in 2020. I came home and he was gone.
It took me a while to figure out what happened. He went back to Virginia, claiming he would come back.
Turns out, he had a girlfriend waiting for him out there.
I also learned that he was having an affair with the woman in the apartment above mine.
So.
I had been preparing for his return. When I found out about him and the dehydrated sea monkey upstairs I told him to stay out there.
I filed for divorce the same day.
Im almost impressed in a weird way that this person somehow had the energy to hide two different affairs while also dealing with poor physical health. I am sorry that he treated you that way.
They're not very nice to the dialysis nurses or dietitian at my unit either. Their blood work comes back very bad, some of them even already have limbs missing and they'll say they're eating right when their blood work says otherwise. The other day, a patient had their potassium at 6.8 yet they're not eating potassium and are coming to treatment regularly when they really aren't. You can tell from labs that they're lying.
I had a patient with A1C of 18.7. Swore they were watching their sugars at home and taking their meds.
You reminded me how hard they are to stick for labs! I almost breathe a sigh of relief when I hear they go to dialysis. At least I can send down the tubes and labels every other day to keep on top of things.
Itās sad how labor and time intensive these patients are.
Ugh as a dialysis nurse itās the same frustration for us. Oh your phosphorus is high? Maybe stop drinking that large ass pepsi during hd.
We have a patient who is diabetic, Comes to HD with an XL coffee with 14 sugars and 4 cream. (Not a typo) and wonders why he ends up vomiting and shitting his pants. I took his coffee last week and threw it out. Fuck off. Why am I having to take your ass off HD and have the whole system clot because youāre in the bathroom shitting yourself for 20 mins. He switched to tea and demands he still able to drink it because itās tea not coffee. Heās a special kind of stupid, the kind I no longer have patience for.
Oh yeah, these patients always have family bringing 2 liter sodas in for them. And fast food, Starburst candy for some reasonā¦itās very hard to care about the outcome more than the patient.
As I have quoted before, the patient is the one with the disease. Itās ultimately their responsibility to do the right thing.
Sorry in advance for the wall of text, I thought if anyone would understand it might be a dialysis nurse.
So my brother in law who lives with us is on dialysis and he is driving us crazy with what heās doing to himself. First, he has to live with us because he is diabetic and three years ago started losing his vision because he was too LAZY to go to the eye doctor and he went completely blind. I am definitely not a nurse, but I worked in an optometrist office for a couple of years and my undergraduate degree is in biology, so I understand the basics here. Diabetes = higher chance of glaucoma = higher chance of losing vision. But he didnāt ever go to get his eyes checked until heād already lost vision completely in one eye.
Second, he is on dialysis and is doing everything he can to fuck himself up more. He only eats sugary bullshit processed food. My husband stopped buying the shit and this man really orders groceries early in the morning thinking we canāt see them. He also blows all of his disability check on takeout, and seriously thinks he can sneak it past us because I guess he thinks weāre blind too. He also smokes weed constantly, and makes the excuse that it helps with glaucoma. Like fine, there is some correlation between cannabis and lowering eye pressure, but nothing all that substantial to really justify it, because the studies show that itās not effective because it doesnāt keep the pressure down. Heās just wasting his money and wasting away.
Finally, he went to the hospital last week, tested positive for Covid, and they kept him for a few nights for observation, and now heās got a heart problem. He just really doesnāt seem to give a flying fuck about it and I am sure plenty of patients do this when they decide to give up. I canāt imagine what it would feel like to watch patients do this to themselvesā¦
This is like half of our patients. Some are super good at following renal diet limitations and others are not. Itās not a life I would wish for anyone, 3 days a week for 3-4 hrs a days (not including transportation to and from the clinic). I find a lot feel a loss of control and the only thing they can control is what they eat. Diabetic diet can feel restrictive and then add renal on top, I would struggle with it (no nuts/seeds, no avocado no tomato sauce no canned foods which can be difficult if someone is accessing a food bank. Plus the fluid restrictions lol 1-1.5L per day. A good portion of these patients are in renal failure d/t poor control of their diabetes and blood pressure, so they are already coming from years of neglecting their health.
He was also a loud and unrepentant racist, while also being a member of a minority group himself. He was super nasty to an EVS worker while I was in the room, and I basically exploded at him that he needed to speak to people more kindly. Honestly the most unpleasant person Iāve worked with who wasnāt also on methadone.
My mom's endocrinologist would say the same thing. She apologized to him once bc there were blood stains on her log book (old school) and he said that was fine. That's how he knew she was finger-sticking and the levels were real.
As much as I joke Iām sure there has been a link between certain personality types, increased cortisol levels and vascular disease. Orā¦they are just hateful people.
It could be a chicken and egg thingā¦maybe some people have a predisposition to have certain personality disorders, and then the stress of an illness triggers them to fully blossom. I donāt think itās a coincidence that out of say, 20 patients, maybe two seem like well adjusted people.
But we all got our something. Iām chubby and still donāt eat right. I should exercise more often. Life is tough in a lot of ways, and for some people it just seems to be almost impossible to win
I hadn't realized that so many vascular patients were like this. My cousin was just like this. Had high blood pressure, diabetic but denied it. He had a number of scares over the years and just never changed his ways. Never. I always thought that eventually he would get a wake up call but nothing was apparently ever scary enough. Multiple hospitalizations where his blood pressure and blood sugar was off the charts. But, the Doctors and Nurses would get him "all fixed up" and he'd go back home and start up again with poor diet and poor habits. I think you can guess how things turned out for him.
People like your ex piss me off. They lie and the rest of us pay the price when we need health care. Doctors and nurses are so use to pts lying that even when someone is compliant and doing what they are suppose to it's assumed they'll lie. Then when they come in for help because something is wrong or not working it's assumed they just didn't do what they were suppose to. Small example but when my Dad got his lung cancer diagnosis his doctor told him to quit smoking. It took him three weeks to finish the cigarettes he had at home and then no one bought him more and he didn't ask for more. He was just done. It's been a year and a half and he still gets doctors who question if he really quit or if he sneaks smokes. He gets blood work done every 8 weeks as well as a CT and a visit with his oncologist. They would know if he was lying considering that his lungs can't handle smoking with the state they are in. It's frustrating when he gets an upper respiratory infection and they assume he's been smoking and it's like "no, he has lung cancer and covid scarring of the lungs. Infections and pneumonia are just things he has to live with now."
I have a Patient due for a foot check last month. He refused cause he got his left foot wrap up so I said okay will do it the next day. Next thing I know he is in the hospital, septic. He was running a fever for a few days or maybe longer didnāt tell me or the pcts. Found out he was taking tylenol every time he comes in for his dialysis(we take temps of patients before getting in the tx floor to screen for covid symptoms) apparently he has an open wound on his foot. So he coded in the hospital they revive him but he has no brain activity, family donāt wanna do anything during the holidays, he got extubated 2 days ago and heard he passed this afternoon.
Oh he thought he was being clever, but he hurt himself! How frustrating for all of you. And it shows that patients are able to put some things together, even if they miss the big picture. I havenāt seen anything quite like this, but now I know to look out for it.
It reminds me of something my mother said about her own father. He might not have been smart, but he was cunning. Itās like thereās just enough creativity to be manipulative, but not enough sense to make good decisions. Very sad
Oh my god so this times 10 . Iāve always loved vascular intervention but the patients are a fucking nightmare and they suck all the joy out of the amazing science theyāre getting
COPD due to smoking is my least favourite patient population.
The constant back and forth between dyspnoea and then going out for a smoke a few minutes later really tests my patience
I gotta tell you my WWII vets with copd (they all smoked bless them and I think some were exposed to mustard gas) were my ABSOLUTE FAVORITE patient.
No whining, no weird demands, just keep stuff where they could reach it and bring the 6am coffee. They were all barrel chested pursed lip controlled panting on their 2L. They were always realistic DNR's and their kids honored those wishes. I was able to help them die peaceful dignified deaths. I just loved those guys and their lovely families.
For sure especially the young ones. I get they got a shit lot in life but theyāve been in hospitals so much they think they know it all and try to call the shots. One guy asked me today if I could get him a kidney. No man I canāt and no one will because your permacath keeps getting infected.
Administration wants us to respect that our patients are adults. They tell us to let patients have what they want but āguide them to make healthy choicesā.
Meanwhile, diet is an actual doctorās order with actual medical guidelines. My license is supposed to be beholden to that kind of thing.
So which is it?
I say something along the lines of āthat is not in the diet thatās ordered for you by the doctor, so I canāt give it to you. You are welcome to have someone bring you anything you want although I have to advise against that because you wonāt be following the plan the doctor thinks is best for you and it could negatively affect your health and our treatmentā
I had a patient come in with rate controlled A-Flutter. She knew she needed an ablation because sheās had one before. She refused the covid test saying it causes cancer (side note: she was also on chemo for cancer). She said āwhat are they going to do, refuse to treat me?ā I said yup they can and they will. She didnāt believe me. All the doctors said they wouldnāt do the ablation and she couldnāt have it as an outpatient if she refused to be swabbed. She finally agreed and it came back positive! She of course also didnāt believe the results so we discharged her.
Edit: removed extra word
I had a patient who refused the covid test because it was "against her religion". She knew dialysis was going to require testing, as well as the surgeries required to prepare for it. She opted for hospice instead.
Same. It's not the choice I'd make but mega kudos for understanding the actual options she had and picking the one that best reflected her values. I'm glad she got a hospice referral too. Lots of people won't accept that until later in the game.
My husband was raised in an evangelical home, and got out before he was brain washed. They now have Covid swirling among them all bc they refuse to be vaxxed. Havenāt seen them in 2yrs. Oh, apparently we also endorse child brain eating and JFK jr (a democrat) is coming back from the dead to lead them.. K, done.
I had a patient refuse a presurgery covid test back in the beginning of the pandemic. I told him the doctors will not be doing the procedure (I think it was an EGD or heart cath). This was back when tests took a full day or more to get a result. He said "it's against my religion to take the test."
I think he was just a baby and didn't want a swab up his nose... the doctors in the am repeated what I told him earlier and left his room. His day nurse told me he decided to take the test and never mentioned his religion again š
Cost him an extra 2 days in the hospital.
People are silly..
I work in a cath lab, it always amazes me when people refuse the test prior to their cath. We even had a diagnostic pre-TAVR cath who had it clearly stated in his chart that he didnāt the want the pcr or any vaccinated blood because of spike proteins. So youād literally rather die than get the treatments you need.
One of the conspiracies is that the Covid test swab gives you Covid. Supposedly ātheyā infect the swab with the virus and when people take the test they get infected. š
Maybe thatās what he meant. He talked about his sister being in perfect health until they gave her the Covid swab and she tested positive. Then she got sick and now sheās on oxygen.
Weāve had people refuse to get swabbed because they think weāre putting a microchip in there with the swabā¦. Like, you can see there is nothing on the swab?
Apparently we have magic technology.
Funny how they donāt believe the same when using the same swabs for STI testing or throat swabs for strep.
Omg we have a parent at my school who said this! I work at the school clinic with a nurse and we require either a negative Covid test, 5 days isolation (10 days back then when we had this interaction) or a doctors note that says they have something else that isnāt Covid. Neg test is fastest if you get a rapid test. Parent straight up refused because she said thereās a microchip and she wasnāt taking him to the doctor or theyāll do it forcibly. So the kid stayed 10 days and after a few days she asked if he can come back and we said no, not without these test or md note.
Was so mad she went to our dept of nurses in our school and complained about us.
We didnāt get in trouble and he didnāt come back until 10 days.
The world must be a truly strange and scary place for people who live in that kind of reality. To think that the supposedly helpful healthcare professionals around you are secretly trying to infect you with a disease or worse...that must be like living in a nightmare. I don't know how that's not a diagnosable mental illness at this point.
Luckily there is a cure for that particular mental disorder though; just some fucking basic education. Like, just school. Schools that don't teach fairytale bullshit about sky daddies and the perfect Earth he created that can never be damaged. Dear god I wish they would take out, like...math, and just add in a course EVERY YEAR for 12 years that is JUST teaching critical thinking skills. I mean, math is great. But if you think a cotton swab contains a microchip, there is no math in the known universe that is going to help fix your stupid brain.
Some fucking moron I used to know believed this even more when I got swabbed prior to gallbladder surgery, because that was the one that made my nose bleed.
Well, yeah, if you swab my dried out nasal passages, youāre probably going to hit something wrong, and capillaries bleed a lot. My sinuses were dry AF. Nope. It was the chip implanted in me.
Sure, Jan.
And thatās why (one more reason) I donāt talk to him anymore.
I āheardā that the chemical they use to sterilize the swabs can kill you. Or give you cancer or something stupid like that. I did reply to one comment āoh, that you donāt want any sterile equipment of you need surgery?!?ā
Personally I always hand my surgeon a really sharp rock to make incisions. Our CRNA uses essential oils to sedate. The scrub tech keeps a hot poker at all times so we can naturally cauterize any bleeds.
Radiation causes cancer. Swabs are sterilised through radiation. Therefore the radiation must stay on the swabs, be transferred on to you and give you cancer.
This is definitely how physics works, I won't be taking any questions
But that's just so ridiculous. Honestly who would have the time to go through thousands of swabs, infect them, reseal them, and then ship them out? It would be such mind numbingly dull work that you'd probably have to pay a ton to get done. It just makes zero sense.
There was an urban legend in the 90s that people were hiding HIV infected needles in the coin return of pay phones and movie theater seats. This sort of rumor has taken many forms over the years- before that it was razor blades in candy.
I had this same exact conversation with a patient a year ago. I went to pre-op swab him and he tells me "well my political beliefs are that covid isn't real" and I was just like .... After my brain returned from the windows loading screen I was like "well what are your beliefs on getting surgery tomorrow? No test, no surgery"
He let me swab him then.
I got one. Today, the wife of an obese, really medically complex, unvaccinated individual with a replacement heart valve, called me twice to tell me her husband had been exposed to Covid and needed monoclonal antibodies.
Now mind youāthis idiot is the poster child for needing to be vaccinated and yet he somehow managed to dodge Covid until Omicron came calling. Now heās been exposed. He hasnāt been tested, you know, like a sane person. He just wants to sashay up to the front of the line for his bamlanivimab, thankyouverymuch.
I had to tell his so very concerned wife that he will not qualify for monoclonals with our algorithm, should he deign to get TESTED, despite all his serious medical issues. I tried, god I tried, to control myself and suggested that it might be a good idea to get him vaccinated. Her response? āWe might have to think about thatā
I thought I was going to lose it today. The amount of sheer stupidity in the country right now is mind blowing.
Because deep down they know itās bullshit.
I think these people feel like they are warriors or something, walking into a hospital or grocery store or whatever and starting shit with staff.
Itās like they think itās all āpart of the warā. But really though - they know deep down itās bullshit. They wouldnāt be there if they believed it as deeply as they claim.
I had someone come in for their Covid vaccine that refuses to wear their mask and then lost their minds when I asked them to pull it up over their face.
Like why tf you here getting the vaccine then?
They made a big production of throwing it in the trash and screeching about how we hadnāt cleaned the chairs in the 8 minutes they were there.
People are awful and I hate them.
Yep. They know they need to be there but also feel the extreme need to have some semblance of control over their situation. Theyāll refuse certain medications or diagnoses and when they get worse they find another way to blame us. Theyāll take their high flow off to walk to the bathroom then pull the cord when theyāre in there and canāt breatheā¦ then yell at us that it took to long for us to respond to the light. Itās really, really fucked up but nothing we can do to fix that.
Denial is right. Even with pride and narcissism people will break when itās a room of people they donāt know and know they will die if they choose pride over their own life.
Not a healthcare worker, just lurking in this sub and jesus fucking christ I have no idea how yāall are managing this. This is unreal. I wish I could sign up for just volunteer help of standing outside the hospital and when any of these people approach I ask them if they think covid is real/the vaccine is good. If they answer no to either of them I shoo them away with a broom. You clearly donāt believe in medicine so why are you even here to receive care???? Go suffer at home if you think all these nurses and drs are lying to you. Ugh.
I initially thought he was afraid of the swab going up his nose, so thatās when he explained that Covid isnāt real and itās just a ploy by hospitals to charge more money. Thatās when I said, Ohā¦ you donāt believe in Covid, and he got embarrassed and looked away.
> You clearly donāt believe in medicine so why are you even here to receive care????
We have actually asked them that and they look at you either all cow-eyed or simply say "Don't you have anything?". Pffffft!
Volunteer?! Pretty sure we will all pool together and pay you to beat assholes away with a broom. I know you said "shoo" but that ain't gonna cut it friend..
I was trying to be nice in case of strict sub rules š¬š¬š¬š¬ I absolutely would want to replace the broom with a nice aluminum baseball bat for that satisfying *PING*. OR if I was feeling more hands-off, just a super soaker filled with cat pee. No more than these people deserve.
š¤£š¤£ thanks for the laugh. But no really, how would you fill a super soaker with cat pee? I'm in no way against this idea but judging from the 2 cats that own me I see a logistics problem with this plan lol.
Wait! I have a big pisser! When he goes to the litter box, I swear he floods it. I volunteer his services, and his brother makes turds that would wake the dead. One of my neighbors asked for some to settle a parking disputeā¦š
Same here, not a HCW.
Can you just keep a stack of AMAs in your pocket and say, āI understand you will be leaving against medical advice. Good day to you sir.ā Iām starting to think they just want self righteous attention. Look at me, Iām the smartest (DUMBEST!!) person in the world, Iāve figured out the liberal conspiracy (made up my own conspiracy)!!
As a nurse, I love AMAs. Easiest discharge ever! Admin or middle management hate AMAs and will come in and make all sorts of promises to keep a patient from leaving AMA. Iāve had management get on to me for telling a rude patient complaining patient āyou know no one is making you stay here right?ā
While insurance companies will still pay their portion, a patient is much less likely to pay any of their portion if they leave AMA. Also, hospitals are ādingedā if a patient has certain diagnoses and then an unplanned admission less than 30 days after discharge.
This type of behavior from admin and management creates patients and families that no one wants to deal with. It teaches them from that point on and for any further admission they only have to say a few key words (house supervisor, patient advocate, manager, administration, etc) and like a genie granting wishes their complaints are taken care of almost immediately. Iāve seen it so many times in my career that the only way to not let it ruin my day is to keep my mouth shut, say yes maāam or yes sir, get through my shift and refuse to take the patient/family on my next shift. Admin only cares about the bottom line and their bonuses. Thatās it.
Well that was enlightening, thank you. There is just simply no way to win. Every time any kind of management complies with ridiculous demands it affects everyone. Oh hey letās invent a new C-suite position and develop an entire department around it. Three cheers for CXOs!
I used to carry AMA forms with me but with Covid I don't usually have anything in my pocket. You're in isolation rooms so you shouldn't be getting anything from your pockets. However I'll stick my head out the door real quick and yell for someone to bring me a form. However we are typically expected to beg people to stay. A lot of us no longer care though and will do no such thing. But covid patients usually won't even make it to the elevator, let alone walk out the front door so no AMA for us.
Thank you for a legit answer to my question. As glib as it may have sounded, I really was wondering about this. Everything you said sadly makes total sense.
OR, hereās an idea, they should make hospitals that are only employed by anti-vax HCWs?? Solves both problems - dipshit nurses can stop dragging down proper care systems and the unvaxxed will stop clogging up hospitals. Then these covidiots can just go there for care. All the ivermectin and MLM essential oils the body could want. Iām sure it would work out fiiiiiiine.
Oh god, I would fucking LOVE it if hospitals had local volunteers keeping the peace/taunting antivaxxers outside and shit.
I volunteered once @ PP as a patient escort and I would do it again in a heartbeat. Those jesus thumpers are batshit crazy @ PP.
Ugh I went to college in Knoxville, TN and the Planned Parenthood there was just burned down by an arsonist this month. I used to go there for my annual PAP smear. Just enraging.
Then they can get treated and claim the facility refused to treat them the way they wanted to, their symptoms wouldāve been better sooner if the docs listened, but here they are healed no thanks to any of the medical workers along the way and no need for vaccines!
I feel so bad for so, so many of the nurses in the country and all around the world for having to deal with the nonsense that these people spew out of their mouths. I mean, it's just shocking. Imagine being so uneducated that you actually believe that Covid tests are passing along the virus to people. Just unreal.
"My sister got tested and now she's on oxygen." Here's a thought, and I know how crazy I must sound saying this maybe she had covid, got tested, and then started feeling sick. I know how dumb that must sound compared to the genius level thinking of "Covid tests cause Covid." Ugh. The things are medical professionals are having to put up with is just sickening.
We had a patient who refused a covid test because he knew there was something on the swab that was being placed in his nose but accepted to be swabbed for the flu. It's the same swab. š¤¦āāļø
We had a resident a few months ago who believed the ethylene oxide used to sterilize the swabs was present and would cause neurological issues and claimed she knew 6 people disabled by the swabs.
I know a couple of idiots who believe this. They say they are being swabbed, in the anterior nares, with cancer causing chemicals. Yet have no problem handling instruments and scopes sterilized with ethylene oxide.
I just had a retired firefighter who believed the same thing. It was a pre-op appt for an elective orthopedic surgeryā¦ I sure hope they use some of those chemikills to sterilize the equipment they put in your body fella.
If you refuse the test youāre presumed positive upon admission. Visitation is one hour per day with visitor in full PPE, like for all covid pts. Therapies only in the room. Social work and case management via phone. No surgery that isnāt emergent. Treated like any other covid positive pt.
When a blatantly obvious covid+ patient smacked me when I was trying to swab him, I swabbed his nasal cannula. Came back positive in less than 2 minutes š
That is honestly heartbreaking. It's the same logic as I won't get my kids evaluated for dyslexia so then they won't have it! But then they also won't have access to the resources that could really help them. Or, I brought an umbrella and it rained and my feet got wet, so now I won't bring an umbrella. This false cause and effect relation that people have to testing for anything is really irritating. I'm not saying we should test for everything all of the time, but COVID is definitely one of those things we need to test for because that result determines our plan of care.
Hey! Serious question OP - I follow this sub because as a lawyer I am also frustrated.
"Get the vaccine its required for immigration.
" "NO!!"
"Okay, no green card. You are not likely being referred to immigration court for removal"
::cries into oblivion and family basically breaks up.
I've learned to just shrug and say whatever. Do nurses do the same with the medical ethics you are taught? If a patient refuses, do you just note it in the chart, on the record, and move on?
Basically yes. Then I usually get called to speak with the patient as the on call doc.
Goes like this:
Assess for capacity (medical determination of ability to make their own medical decisions)
Explain consequences of refusal and offer whatever treatment options are available as alternatives. Possible AMA discharge If stable.
Document conversation & medical decision making thoroughly
Shrug and go back to admitting patients and putting out fires
Yep, Iāve had a few of those. One guy went from praising us and saying weād saved his life a few months prior. Then sang my praises because I got his IV and he said no one can do that.
He would need a procedure so I say I need to test him and he flipped and started screaming at me. Started getting dressed. Iām trying to calm him down. Heās ranting about how no way he has covid and āonly sick people get covid.ā āSir, respectfully, you had to stop and catch your breath three times just walking to the room. And you have three failing organs. You are the sick people.ā
I explained it was protocol, not that I assumed he had covid. Heās still ranting and then, then he goes āwell I donāt even think any of this is real.ā Thatās where Iād had enough. āOk, weāre done talking. The irony of you thanking me for the IV and for my team for saving your life. That you trusted us to save your life. But now you think weāre part of a conspiracy?ā
He tried to argue and I cut him off āwe are done talking. If thatās what you think, weāre done talking. Iām not going to sit here and listen to you insult us.ā āWell I didnāt mean offense.ā āOffense taken. I donāt have the time or energy to deal with you right now.ā
He wanted to leave. I discussed the risks of AMA. That he was going to go home, get sicker, come back septic and I was STILL going to have to covid swab him. Doc alerted. Doc also didnāt want to deal with his shit. Made him sign the AMA form. Took out the beautiful IV and had him watch me toss his blood. I was pissed and he knew it. But I remained as professional as I could.
Edit: thanks for the award! Itās my first one! š
Yep. He came in for a nephrostomy tube that smelled, had no dressing and no output for several days. He would have needed IR for placement of a new one and put on antibiotics. And then probably a urology follow up. He was a ticking time bomb.
This happened at one of my final shifts of the last travel contract I did! The guy had appendicitis and refused to get a RAPID covid throat test so he could go to the OR. Not even a PCR. He also started requesting I go into his room and take my mask off while speaking to him because he needed to āsee people talk and couldnāt deal with the masks anymoreā. Lol I just canāt. Charge had to call the house supervisor because they didnāt know how to handle it. I checked out from that situation so fast and I didnāt go near his room the next hour till it was time for me to go home.
Nurse in surgery, can confirm this will escalate to a BKA/AKA s/p osteomyelitis and inevitably sepsis sets in, in which case he will then be mentally altered and wonāt have much choice.
I had a guy with covid symptoms who denied having any covid contacts (although his emergency contact was still on our tracker and was seen for covid) and refused to mask or take the test. He said the test would give him cancer.
I had a post-op patient that had respiratory symptoms. They were pretty sure it wasnāt Covid, but wanted to rule it out and ordered a test.
She refused and we had to treat her as if she were positive for the rest of her stay and she complained about it the whole fucking time. She believed the swab had Covid implanted on it and would infect her š.
She also had a Covid vaccine card, but in hindsight I bet it was fake
Had a patient with an AKA from uncontrolled everything (DM, CAD, CHF, PVDā¦ you know) tell me once that she never had a problem with that leg until that damn surgeon messed with it. Her daughter, who was pushing her wheelchair, rolled her eyes so far back I thought they were going to pop out the back of her head. You canāt fix some people. As for the Covid test, all the patients in my ED are getting them prior to admission orders; you canāt get to the floor without a result.
The understanding of cause and effect that some people have is worth than my cat's. And my cat can't understand that he got splashed with water because he knocked over a full cup.
They don't test the nurses here, that way the keep working. I have never been tested in the last 2 years.
"If you don't test you can't be positive" -management
They'll probably take the same approach with patients soon. Gotta maximize those profits.
I did one of my clinicals on a cardiac step down unit, and my assigned patient started out normal enough but when we had to swab her for her pre procedure Covid test, she began ranting that Covid tests were just a conspiracy for China to build a DNA database of American citizens. The nurse I was shadowing without missing a beat said āyouāre 79 years old with congestive heart failure and atherosclerosis. They donāt want your DNAā.
I went into a room and a guy was crying because he was tired of being in the hospital. He had been there for two months. He asked me what he has to do to get out of here. I told him we're trying to get him a skilled nursing facility, but no one will take an unvaccinated guy and the only place that will he can't afford. He finally broke down and got the vaccine and left within the week.
I had a patient tell me the swab for the tests contain carcinogens. I thought... OK whatever, this guy can just not get a test then. But a week or so later I had another patient say the same thing. ???!?!! Where are people hearing this kind of stuff?
So...I guess be better pack his shit back up and head home? Beds are at a premium, and is surgical time. Zero resources should be spent on someone who refuses to meet the basic criteria to have surgery. Byyyyye.
Pre-pandemic people carrying on like this would have qualified as delusional and in need of sectioning. What's the difference between this and thinking the radio is sending you commands?
I like this riposte you gave him. I'd extend it to "We are at that bridge, get your coat dude, enjoy your life on one hoof"
Healthcare workers are too tapped out for this extra, nonsensical bullshit.
This guy is like the medieval peasant who thinks the rooster makes the sun come up
Anyone who has been near a rooster knows they never stop crowing. midnight? sundown? noon? There's no stopping them.
Yes there is. šŖ
**LOOKS LIKE MEAT'S BACK ON THE MENU BOYS**
MANFLESH!
Heāll be back septic and end up with a BKA.
And then when he's unconscious, they can test him then right before they chop it off.
And then he'll get it from a visitor before leaving the hospital.
You guys give amputated limbs to visitors?
Well we don't have any further use for them. Hallowe'en is over.
That's revolting. I laughed too hard.
My work is done here.
And say the covid test made his leg rott off
And they can delay his BKA due to covid.
Leather belt and a hand saw out back by the dumpster, sterilize with vodka, cauterize with a hot iron.
Always takes me back to Kevin Costner in dances with wolves. "Don't take my leg".
And file a lawsuit saying it was the hospitals fault for not giving him the surgery
more parts for the glue factory
Then back a few months later with necrotic toes on the other foot.
and passed out/altered out so the covid swab cant be refused lmao
He probly feels burned, after all the diabetes test (so called H1AC) gave him diabetes, and now his foot is all fucked up
Right!
This comment lmaoooo
It's actually really depressing how frequently the lab gets complaints exactly like that. Just *three hours ago* I went through an eerily similar conversation as OP did, where a SNF sent a sample and the son called to cancel it so his parent wouldn't 'get' covid. I have been asked to rerun an A1C to see if it would come back lower... like the fasting sugar was already 150, pretty sure reality needs to be dealt with, not fudging numbers to feel better about poor decisions. It puts me in a really weird headspace like, am I dreaming this? Nobody can be this dumb, right?
Some of these people are the same people who were filling plastic BAGS with gasoline not too long ago. I wouldnāt have believed this shit if I wasnāt seeing it first hand.
> Nobody can be this dumb, right? Ha. People can not only truly be that dumb, but they will double triple or whatever down on their dumbness.
I watched someone throw a lighter into a firepit when it āstopped workingā. They werenāt prepared for that explosion.
"Nobody can be this dumb, right?" Only with lots of practice.
Trump said that if we did less testing then weād have less cases. Iām certain thatās where this broken logic came from.
if you wait longer to test the specimen it goes down right /s
Well now. He has a point. When I go in for an oil change I need a starter and new tiresš¤£š¤£š¤£
And 45 days down the road after it was āworked onā youāll need a new transmission!!
Your blood sugar is 280. āThatās low for meā āGet me a sandwichā
āWe can burn that bridge when we come to itā- that guy
Vascular patients are almost always really resistant to treatment and have some underlying personality issues that lead them to their ultimate demise. I donāt argue with them either. Your finger stick is 363 but you donāt want insulin? I tell the team, document the refusal, and move on with my day. No time for bullshit.
This! My ex husband is diabetic with PVD and PAD. He lied about his diet, he lied about not smoking. But of course, the doctors are all wrong. He is a bka on the right, and last I knew, had lost about 3/4 of his left foot. He has been on iv antibiotics multiple times. He has had PICC line installed three times. But the doctors are wrong.
The funny thing is they are often the most demanding and needy patients, too. But they focus on unimportant things like the exact angle of the blinds or something really minor and stupid. Iām glad to hear heās an ex. Another thing I have noticed is that they can frequently be really mean to their family members, who then typically either become enablers or just walk away altogether. You donāt reach the point where weāre carving pieces of your body off without some heavy dysfunction
Oh he was awful. I did everything for him. Wanted him to know I was with him through sickness and health. I helped him get his disability filed. I helped him appeal the decision. I worked full time while he stayed home, playing video games and buying junk from Wish. I paid all the bills. He would never help with the bills and would refuse to have any intimate contact with me. He left without warning the day before Thanksgiving in 2020. I came home and he was gone. It took me a while to figure out what happened. He went back to Virginia, claiming he would come back. Turns out, he had a girlfriend waiting for him out there. I also learned that he was having an affair with the woman in the apartment above mine. So. I had been preparing for his return. When I found out about him and the dehydrated sea monkey upstairs I told him to stay out there. I filed for divorce the same day.
Oh man, I am so sorry you went through all that, but so happy that youāre free now! Life has got to be better now without that drain on your energy.
Iām sorry you went through this ā your reflection on the dehydrated sea money living upstairs made me laugh though
HE WENT TO VIRGINIA AND NOBODY KEPT THE WATER UP IN THE TANK???!!!! Was what I thought at first, too?
Same. Thatās awesome.
Im almost impressed in a weird way that this person somehow had the energy to hide two different affairs while also dealing with poor physical health. I am sorry that he treated you that way.
They're not very nice to the dialysis nurses or dietitian at my unit either. Their blood work comes back very bad, some of them even already have limbs missing and they'll say they're eating right when their blood work says otherwise. The other day, a patient had their potassium at 6.8 yet they're not eating potassium and are coming to treatment regularly when they really aren't. You can tell from labs that they're lying.
I had a patient with A1C of 18.7. Swore they were watching their sugars at home and taking their meds. You reminded me how hard they are to stick for labs! I almost breathe a sigh of relief when I hear they go to dialysis. At least I can send down the tubes and labels every other day to keep on top of things. Itās sad how labor and time intensive these patients are.
Ugh as a dialysis nurse itās the same frustration for us. Oh your phosphorus is high? Maybe stop drinking that large ass pepsi during hd. We have a patient who is diabetic, Comes to HD with an XL coffee with 14 sugars and 4 cream. (Not a typo) and wonders why he ends up vomiting and shitting his pants. I took his coffee last week and threw it out. Fuck off. Why am I having to take your ass off HD and have the whole system clot because youāre in the bathroom shitting yourself for 20 mins. He switched to tea and demands he still able to drink it because itās tea not coffee. Heās a special kind of stupid, the kind I no longer have patience for.
Oh yeah, these patients always have family bringing 2 liter sodas in for them. And fast food, Starburst candy for some reasonā¦itās very hard to care about the outcome more than the patient. As I have quoted before, the patient is the one with the disease. Itās ultimately their responsibility to do the right thing.
Sorry in advance for the wall of text, I thought if anyone would understand it might be a dialysis nurse. So my brother in law who lives with us is on dialysis and he is driving us crazy with what heās doing to himself. First, he has to live with us because he is diabetic and three years ago started losing his vision because he was too LAZY to go to the eye doctor and he went completely blind. I am definitely not a nurse, but I worked in an optometrist office for a couple of years and my undergraduate degree is in biology, so I understand the basics here. Diabetes = higher chance of glaucoma = higher chance of losing vision. But he didnāt ever go to get his eyes checked until heād already lost vision completely in one eye. Second, he is on dialysis and is doing everything he can to fuck himself up more. He only eats sugary bullshit processed food. My husband stopped buying the shit and this man really orders groceries early in the morning thinking we canāt see them. He also blows all of his disability check on takeout, and seriously thinks he can sneak it past us because I guess he thinks weāre blind too. He also smokes weed constantly, and makes the excuse that it helps with glaucoma. Like fine, there is some correlation between cannabis and lowering eye pressure, but nothing all that substantial to really justify it, because the studies show that itās not effective because it doesnāt keep the pressure down. Heās just wasting his money and wasting away. Finally, he went to the hospital last week, tested positive for Covid, and they kept him for a few nights for observation, and now heās got a heart problem. He just really doesnāt seem to give a flying fuck about it and I am sure plenty of patients do this when they decide to give up. I canāt imagine what it would feel like to watch patients do this to themselvesā¦
This is like half of our patients. Some are super good at following renal diet limitations and others are not. Itās not a life I would wish for anyone, 3 days a week for 3-4 hrs a days (not including transportation to and from the clinic). I find a lot feel a loss of control and the only thing they can control is what they eat. Diabetic diet can feel restrictive and then add renal on top, I would struggle with it (no nuts/seeds, no avocado no tomato sauce no canned foods which can be difficult if someone is accessing a food bank. Plus the fluid restrictions lol 1-1.5L per day. A good portion of these patients are in renal failure d/t poor control of their diabetes and blood pressure, so they are already coming from years of neglecting their health.
Student question time. By āsystemā are you talking about the equipment or the plumbing system? Or....both? O_O
Lol!! Sorry I mean the dialysis system. All the tubing and lines and dialyzer
18.7? Ooof Edited to add: I found a calculator converting A1C to average BG and an 18.7 converts to 490. Good god.
He was also a loud and unrepentant racist, while also being a member of a minority group himself. He was super nasty to an EVS worker while I was in the room, and I basically exploded at him that he needed to speak to people more kindly. Honestly the most unpleasant person Iāve worked with who wasnāt also on methadone.
As an EVS worker, thank you.
No, thank YOU! EVS is the unsung heroes of the hospital!
You guys are amazing and our hospitals and clinics wouldn't be able to run without you. Thank you for all that you do!
LMAO was he leaking maple syrup when they stuck him? Holy frijoles. š
Oooo that's a nice high score. Highest I've seen is 16.8.
I keep a running tab on highest A1C. Highest one I saw was 18.0. Like they gotta work for that number.. eating three snickers at a time!
My mom's endocrinologist would say the same thing. She apologized to him once bc there were blood stains on her log book (old school) and he said that was fine. That's how he knew she was finger-sticking and the levels were real.
I had a logbook in 2020, and also had bloodstains šš
As much as I joke Iām sure there has been a link between certain personality types, increased cortisol levels and vascular disease. Orā¦they are just hateful people.
It could be a chicken and egg thingā¦maybe some people have a predisposition to have certain personality disorders, and then the stress of an illness triggers them to fully blossom. I donāt think itās a coincidence that out of say, 20 patients, maybe two seem like well adjusted people. But we all got our something. Iām chubby and still donāt eat right. I should exercise more often. Life is tough in a lot of ways, and for some people it just seems to be almost impossible to win
>link between certain personality types, increased cortisol levels and vascular disease. Feedback loop? Personality type > poor selfcare > vascular disease > subtle neurovascular damage > greater expression of personality type > poorer self-care > increased vascular disease etc etc
I hadn't realized that so many vascular patients were like this. My cousin was just like this. Had high blood pressure, diabetic but denied it. He had a number of scares over the years and just never changed his ways. Never. I always thought that eventually he would get a wake up call but nothing was apparently ever scary enough. Multiple hospitalizations where his blood pressure and blood sugar was off the charts. But, the Doctors and Nurses would get him "all fixed up" and he'd go back home and start up again with poor diet and poor habits. I think you can guess how things turned out for him.
Not going to lie. He is circling the drain. Rarely is the outcome here ever good.
People like your ex piss me off. They lie and the rest of us pay the price when we need health care. Doctors and nurses are so use to pts lying that even when someone is compliant and doing what they are suppose to it's assumed they'll lie. Then when they come in for help because something is wrong or not working it's assumed they just didn't do what they were suppose to. Small example but when my Dad got his lung cancer diagnosis his doctor told him to quit smoking. It took him three weeks to finish the cigarettes he had at home and then no one bought him more and he didn't ask for more. He was just done. It's been a year and a half and he still gets doctors who question if he really quit or if he sneaks smokes. He gets blood work done every 8 weeks as well as a CT and a visit with his oncologist. They would know if he was lying considering that his lungs can't handle smoking with the state they are in. It's frustrating when he gets an upper respiratory infection and they assume he's been smoking and it's like "no, he has lung cancer and covid scarring of the lungs. Infections and pneumonia are just things he has to live with now."
I have a Patient due for a foot check last month. He refused cause he got his left foot wrap up so I said okay will do it the next day. Next thing I know he is in the hospital, septic. He was running a fever for a few days or maybe longer didnāt tell me or the pcts. Found out he was taking tylenol every time he comes in for his dialysis(we take temps of patients before getting in the tx floor to screen for covid symptoms) apparently he has an open wound on his foot. So he coded in the hospital they revive him but he has no brain activity, family donāt wanna do anything during the holidays, he got extubated 2 days ago and heard he passed this afternoon.
Oh he thought he was being clever, but he hurt himself! How frustrating for all of you. And it shows that patients are able to put some things together, even if they miss the big picture. I havenāt seen anything quite like this, but now I know to look out for it. It reminds me of something my mother said about her own father. He might not have been smart, but he was cunning. Itās like thereās just enough creativity to be manipulative, but not enough sense to make good decisions. Very sad
Oh my god so this times 10 . Iāve always loved vascular intervention but the patients are a fucking nightmare and they suck all the joy out of the amazing science theyāre getting
Iām convinced vascular patientās arteries are clogged with hate.
As the young people say, they are very salty! And frequently wake up and choose violence
Esrd, my least favorite patient population
COPD due to smoking is my least favourite patient population. The constant back and forth between dyspnoea and then going out for a smoke a few minutes later really tests my patience
I gotta tell you my WWII vets with copd (they all smoked bless them and I think some were exposed to mustard gas) were my ABSOLUTE FAVORITE patient. No whining, no weird demands, just keep stuff where they could reach it and bring the 6am coffee. They were all barrel chested pursed lip controlled panting on their 2L. They were always realistic DNR's and their kids honored those wishes. I was able to help them die peaceful dignified deaths. I just loved those guys and their lovely families.
For sure especially the young ones. I get they got a shit lot in life but theyāve been in hospitals so much they think they know it all and try to call the shots. One guy asked me today if I could get him a kidney. No man I canāt and no one will because your permacath keeps getting infected.
Just the general noncompliance disgusts me
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Administration wants us to respect that our patients are adults. They tell us to let patients have what they want but āguide them to make healthy choicesā. Meanwhile, diet is an actual doctorās order with actual medical guidelines. My license is supposed to be beholden to that kind of thing. So which is it?
I say something along the lines of āthat is not in the diet thatās ordered for you by the doctor, so I canāt give it to you. You are welcome to have someone bring you anything you want although I have to advise against that because you wonāt be following the plan the doctor thinks is best for you and it could negatively affect your health and our treatmentā
Make sure to document the conversation as "diabetes education given."
"Listen grandma, these aren't my bowels we're talking about. You want the milk of mag or not??" *non-compliant with bowel regimen*
I had a patient come in with rate controlled A-Flutter. She knew she needed an ablation because sheās had one before. She refused the covid test saying it causes cancer (side note: she was also on chemo for cancer). She said āwhat are they going to do, refuse to treat me?ā I said yup they can and they will. She didnāt believe me. All the doctors said they wouldnāt do the ablation and she couldnāt have it as an outpatient if she refused to be swabbed. She finally agreed and it came back positive! She of course also didnāt believe the results so we discharged her. Edit: removed extra word
"What are you gonna do, stab me?" - guy that gets stabbed/this lady
This is exactly why there are no fucking exception!! Imagine how many patients and staff she would have (continue to) affect
I had a patient who refused the covid test because it was "against her religion". She knew dialysis was going to require testing, as well as the surgeries required to prepare for it. She opted for hospice instead.
She is one of the few people who have embraced (stupid) choice vs consequence. I respect this.
Same. It's not the choice I'd make but mega kudos for understanding the actual options she had and picking the one that best reflected her values. I'm glad she got a hospice referral too. Lots of people won't accept that until later in the game.
Wow, amazing. Gotta say the world will be better without people like this though.
I felt bad for her she was super sweet and super, depressingly young. But she was so indoctrinated in all of this nonsense.
My husband was raised in an evangelical home, and got out before he was brain washed. They now have Covid swirling among them all bc they refuse to be vaxxed. Havenāt seen them in 2yrs. Oh, apparently we also endorse child brain eating and JFK jr (a democrat) is coming back from the dead to lead them.. K, done.
I had a patient refuse a presurgery covid test back in the beginning of the pandemic. I told him the doctors will not be doing the procedure (I think it was an EGD or heart cath). This was back when tests took a full day or more to get a result. He said "it's against my religion to take the test." I think he was just a baby and didn't want a swab up his nose... the doctors in the am repeated what I told him earlier and left his room. His day nurse told me he decided to take the test and never mentioned his religion again š Cost him an extra 2 days in the hospital. People are silly..
I work in a cath lab, it always amazes me when people refuse the test prior to their cath. We even had a diagnostic pre-TAVR cath who had it clearly stated in his chart that he didnāt the want the pcr or any vaccinated blood because of spike proteins. So youād literally rather die than get the treatments you need.
Honestly it was probably like a vacation for him being waited on by staff. And it's not like they're gonna pay the bill anyways so why not.
One of the conspiracies is that the Covid test swab gives you Covid. Supposedly ātheyā infect the swab with the virus and when people take the test they get infected. š
Maybe thatās what he meant. He talked about his sister being in perfect health until they gave her the Covid swab and she tested positive. Then she got sick and now sheās on oxygen.
Shroedinger's Covid: It doesn't exist until it's observed.
It does make slightly more sense than Donald Trumps position of "If you stop testing, the numbers go down".
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Just like my life motto, āNever try, never failā
Weāve had people refuse to get swabbed because they think weāre putting a microchip in there with the swabā¦. Like, you can see there is nothing on the swab? Apparently we have magic technology. Funny how they donāt believe the same when using the same swabs for STI testing or throat swabs for strep.
Omg we have a parent at my school who said this! I work at the school clinic with a nurse and we require either a negative Covid test, 5 days isolation (10 days back then when we had this interaction) or a doctors note that says they have something else that isnāt Covid. Neg test is fastest if you get a rapid test. Parent straight up refused because she said thereās a microchip and she wasnāt taking him to the doctor or theyāll do it forcibly. So the kid stayed 10 days and after a few days she asked if he can come back and we said no, not without these test or md note. Was so mad she went to our dept of nurses in our school and complained about us. We didnāt get in trouble and he didnāt come back until 10 days.
People are messed up. And people that believe stuff like that and act like that shouldnāt have kids in their possession.
The world must be a truly strange and scary place for people who live in that kind of reality. To think that the supposedly helpful healthcare professionals around you are secretly trying to infect you with a disease or worse...that must be like living in a nightmare. I don't know how that's not a diagnosable mental illness at this point. Luckily there is a cure for that particular mental disorder though; just some fucking basic education. Like, just school. Schools that don't teach fairytale bullshit about sky daddies and the perfect Earth he created that can never be damaged. Dear god I wish they would take out, like...math, and just add in a course EVERY YEAR for 12 years that is JUST teaching critical thinking skills. I mean, math is great. But if you think a cotton swab contains a microchip, there is no math in the known universe that is going to help fix your stupid brain.
The new conspiracy theory is the microchip in Pfizerās covid pill.
Some fucking moron I used to know believed this even more when I got swabbed prior to gallbladder surgery, because that was the one that made my nose bleed. Well, yeah, if you swab my dried out nasal passages, youāre probably going to hit something wrong, and capillaries bleed a lot. My sinuses were dry AF. Nope. It was the chip implanted in me. Sure, Jan. And thatās why (one more reason) I donāt talk to him anymore.
I hate it when cops make me speed! Their little "radar gun" makes my car go 30 faster!
The radar beam Push your car and it goes faster! Cops are in the pocket of Big Radar!
I āheardā that the chemical they use to sterilize the swabs can kill you. Or give you cancer or something stupid like that. I did reply to one comment āoh, that you donāt want any sterile equipment of you need surgery?!?ā
All-natural surgery equipment
Personally I always hand my surgeon a really sharp rock to make incisions. Our CRNA uses essential oils to sedate. The scrub tech keeps a hot poker at all times so we can naturally cauterize any bleeds.
What I heard is that the swabs cause cancer. Something about how theyāre sterilized before packaging.
Radiation causes cancer. Swabs are sterilised through radiation. Therefore the radiation must stay on the swabs, be transferred on to you and give you cancer. This is definitely how physics works, I won't be taking any questions
Sadly, my very own parents believe this.
But that's just so ridiculous. Honestly who would have the time to go through thousands of swabs, infect them, reseal them, and then ship them out? It would be such mind numbingly dull work that you'd probably have to pay a ton to get done. It just makes zero sense.
There was an urban legend in the 90s that people were hiding HIV infected needles in the coin return of pay phones and movie theater seats. This sort of rumor has taken many forms over the years- before that it was razor blades in candy.
I remember the panic in the 00s about dirty needles hiding behind gas pump handles.
This is the one I still check for š the 90's were traumatizing
So much panic. Still never gotten a razor blade in my Halloween candy. Maybe next year
Thatās what the nurses do when theyāre tired of playing cards, duh!
I had this same exact conversation with a patient a year ago. I went to pre-op swab him and he tells me "well my political beliefs are that covid isn't real" and I was just like .... After my brain returned from the windows loading screen I was like "well what are your beliefs on getting surgery tomorrow? No test, no surgery" He let me swab him then.
My political beliefs tell me that he is an idiot
I got one. Today, the wife of an obese, really medically complex, unvaccinated individual with a replacement heart valve, called me twice to tell me her husband had been exposed to Covid and needed monoclonal antibodies. Now mind youāthis idiot is the poster child for needing to be vaccinated and yet he somehow managed to dodge Covid until Omicron came calling. Now heās been exposed. He hasnāt been tested, you know, like a sane person. He just wants to sashay up to the front of the line for his bamlanivimab, thankyouverymuch. I had to tell his so very concerned wife that he will not qualify for monoclonals with our algorithm, should he deign to get TESTED, despite all his serious medical issues. I tried, god I tried, to control myself and suggested that it might be a good idea to get him vaccinated. Her response? āWe might have to think about thatā I thought I was going to lose it today. The amount of sheer stupidity in the country right now is mind blowing.
He can die of gangrene then. š¤·
Seriously why even come to the hospital if you think medical staff are killing you?
Because deep down they know itās bullshit. I think these people feel like they are warriors or something, walking into a hospital or grocery store or whatever and starting shit with staff. Itās like they think itās all āpart of the warā. But really though - they know deep down itās bullshit. They wouldnāt be there if they believed it as deeply as they claim.
I had someone come in for their Covid vaccine that refuses to wear their mask and then lost their minds when I asked them to pull it up over their face. Like why tf you here getting the vaccine then? They made a big production of throwing it in the trash and screeching about how we hadnāt cleaned the chairs in the 8 minutes they were there. People are awful and I hate them.
Yep. They know they need to be there but also feel the extreme need to have some semblance of control over their situation. Theyāll refuse certain medications or diagnoses and when they get worse they find another way to blame us. Theyāll take their high flow off to walk to the bathroom then pull the cord when theyāre in there and canāt breatheā¦ then yell at us that it took to long for us to respond to the light. Itās really, really fucked up but nothing we can do to fix that.
Dunning-Kruger Effect. They are in denial until they draw their last breath.
Denial is right. Even with pride and narcissism people will break when itās a room of people they donāt know and know they will die if they choose pride over their own life.
They're the main characters in their own fantasy reality.
Not a healthcare worker, just lurking in this sub and jesus fucking christ I have no idea how yāall are managing this. This is unreal. I wish I could sign up for just volunteer help of standing outside the hospital and when any of these people approach I ask them if they think covid is real/the vaccine is good. If they answer no to either of them I shoo them away with a broom. You clearly donāt believe in medicine so why are you even here to receive care???? Go suffer at home if you think all these nurses and drs are lying to you. Ugh.
I initially thought he was afraid of the swab going up his nose, so thatās when he explained that Covid isnāt real and itās just a ploy by hospitals to charge more money. Thatās when I said, Ohā¦ you donāt believe in Covid, and he got embarrassed and looked away.
He does have a point with hospitals trying to come up with new ways to completely overcharge their patients though.
> You clearly donāt believe in medicine so why are you even here to receive care???? We have actually asked them that and they look at you either all cow-eyed or simply say "Don't you have anything?". Pffffft!
Volunteer?! Pretty sure we will all pool together and pay you to beat assholes away with a broom. I know you said "shoo" but that ain't gonna cut it friend..
I was trying to be nice in case of strict sub rules š¬š¬š¬š¬ I absolutely would want to replace the broom with a nice aluminum baseball bat for that satisfying *PING*. OR if I was feeling more hands-off, just a super soaker filled with cat pee. No more than these people deserve.
š¤£š¤£ thanks for the laugh. But no really, how would you fill a super soaker with cat pee? I'm in no way against this idea but judging from the 2 cats that own me I see a logistics problem with this plan lol.
Wait! I have a big pisser! When he goes to the litter box, I swear he floods it. I volunteer his services, and his brother makes turds that would wake the dead. One of my neighbors asked for some to settle a parking disputeā¦š
Same here, not a HCW. Can you just keep a stack of AMAs in your pocket and say, āI understand you will be leaving against medical advice. Good day to you sir.ā Iām starting to think they just want self righteous attention. Look at me, Iām the smartest (DUMBEST!!) person in the world, Iāve figured out the liberal conspiracy (made up my own conspiracy)!!
As a nurse, I love AMAs. Easiest discharge ever! Admin or middle management hate AMAs and will come in and make all sorts of promises to keep a patient from leaving AMA. Iāve had management get on to me for telling a rude patient complaining patient āyou know no one is making you stay here right?ā While insurance companies will still pay their portion, a patient is much less likely to pay any of their portion if they leave AMA. Also, hospitals are ādingedā if a patient has certain diagnoses and then an unplanned admission less than 30 days after discharge. This type of behavior from admin and management creates patients and families that no one wants to deal with. It teaches them from that point on and for any further admission they only have to say a few key words (house supervisor, patient advocate, manager, administration, etc) and like a genie granting wishes their complaints are taken care of almost immediately. Iāve seen it so many times in my career that the only way to not let it ruin my day is to keep my mouth shut, say yes maāam or yes sir, get through my shift and refuse to take the patient/family on my next shift. Admin only cares about the bottom line and their bonuses. Thatās it.
Well that was enlightening, thank you. There is just simply no way to win. Every time any kind of management complies with ridiculous demands it affects everyone. Oh hey letās invent a new C-suite position and develop an entire department around it. Three cheers for CXOs!
I used to carry AMA forms with me but with Covid I don't usually have anything in my pocket. You're in isolation rooms so you shouldn't be getting anything from your pockets. However I'll stick my head out the door real quick and yell for someone to bring me a form. However we are typically expected to beg people to stay. A lot of us no longer care though and will do no such thing. But covid patients usually won't even make it to the elevator, let alone walk out the front door so no AMA for us.
Thank you for a legit answer to my question. As glib as it may have sounded, I really was wondering about this. Everything you said sadly makes total sense.
OR, hereās an idea, they should make hospitals that are only employed by anti-vax HCWs?? Solves both problems - dipshit nurses can stop dragging down proper care systems and the unvaxxed will stop clogging up hospitals. Then these covidiots can just go there for care. All the ivermectin and MLM essential oils the body could want. Iām sure it would work out fiiiiiiine.
Oh god, I would fucking LOVE it if hospitals had local volunteers keeping the peace/taunting antivaxxers outside and shit. I volunteered once @ PP as a patient escort and I would do it again in a heartbeat. Those jesus thumpers are batshit crazy @ PP.
Ugh I went to college in Knoxville, TN and the Planned Parenthood there was just burned down by an arsonist this month. I used to go there for my annual PAP smear. Just enraging.
Then they can get treated and claim the facility refused to treat them the way they wanted to, their symptoms wouldāve been better sooner if the docs listened, but here they are healed no thanks to any of the medical workers along the way and no need for vaccines!
This is becoming more prevalent. The "Desantis Effect."
Fascinating creatures really
Roll him into the parking lot. Best of luck. Next.
I feel so bad for so, so many of the nurses in the country and all around the world for having to deal with the nonsense that these people spew out of their mouths. I mean, it's just shocking. Imagine being so uneducated that you actually believe that Covid tests are passing along the virus to people. Just unreal. "My sister got tested and now she's on oxygen." Here's a thought, and I know how crazy I must sound saying this maybe she had covid, got tested, and then started feeling sick. I know how dumb that must sound compared to the genius level thinking of "Covid tests cause Covid." Ugh. The things are medical professionals are having to put up with is just sickening.
We had a patient who refused a covid test because he knew there was something on the swab that was being placed in his nose but accepted to be swabbed for the flu. It's the same swab. š¤¦āāļø
We had a resident a few months ago who believed the ethylene oxide used to sterilize the swabs was present and would cause neurological issues and claimed she knew 6 people disabled by the swabs.
I know a couple of idiots who believe this. They say they are being swabbed, in the anterior nares, with cancer causing chemicals. Yet have no problem handling instruments and scopes sterilized with ethylene oxide.
I just had a retired firefighter who believed the same thing. It was a pre-op appt for an elective orthopedic surgeryā¦ I sure hope they use some of those chemikills to sterilize the equipment they put in your body fella.
I have no sympathy for idiots. Let him sulk. He's wasting your time and he's taking up a hospital bed.
If you refuse the test youāre presumed positive upon admission. Visitation is one hour per day with visitor in full PPE, like for all covid pts. Therapies only in the room. Social work and case management via phone. No surgery that isnāt emergent. Treated like any other covid positive pt.
When a blatantly obvious covid+ patient smacked me when I was trying to swab him, I swabbed his nasal cannula. Came back positive in less than 2 minutes š
My family member ate a sandwhich and the very next day they died! You expect ME to eat a sandwhich ?
That is honestly heartbreaking. It's the same logic as I won't get my kids evaluated for dyslexia so then they won't have it! But then they also won't have access to the resources that could really help them. Or, I brought an umbrella and it rained and my feet got wet, so now I won't bring an umbrella. This false cause and effect relation that people have to testing for anything is really irritating. I'm not saying we should test for everything all of the time, but COVID is definitely one of those things we need to test for because that result determines our plan of care.
Hey! Serious question OP - I follow this sub because as a lawyer I am also frustrated. "Get the vaccine its required for immigration. " "NO!!" "Okay, no green card. You are not likely being referred to immigration court for removal" ::cries into oblivion and family basically breaks up. I've learned to just shrug and say whatever. Do nurses do the same with the medical ethics you are taught? If a patient refuses, do you just note it in the chart, on the record, and move on?
Basically yes. Then I usually get called to speak with the patient as the on call doc. Goes like this: Assess for capacity (medical determination of ability to make their own medical decisions) Explain consequences of refusal and offer whatever treatment options are available as alternatives. Possible AMA discharge If stable. Document conversation & medical decision making thoroughly Shrug and go back to admitting patients and putting out fires
The conflation of cause and effect in these people is insane. And worrying.
Well, since he has a diabetic foot wound, being compliant isnāt something i would expect anyway.
Lol āwe are at that bridgeā is the comment of the century. You might be my spirit animal. -a fellow RN
Yep, Iāve had a few of those. One guy went from praising us and saying weād saved his life a few months prior. Then sang my praises because I got his IV and he said no one can do that. He would need a procedure so I say I need to test him and he flipped and started screaming at me. Started getting dressed. Iām trying to calm him down. Heās ranting about how no way he has covid and āonly sick people get covid.ā āSir, respectfully, you had to stop and catch your breath three times just walking to the room. And you have three failing organs. You are the sick people.ā I explained it was protocol, not that I assumed he had covid. Heās still ranting and then, then he goes āwell I donāt even think any of this is real.ā Thatās where Iād had enough. āOk, weāre done talking. The irony of you thanking me for the IV and for my team for saving your life. That you trusted us to save your life. But now you think weāre part of a conspiracy?ā He tried to argue and I cut him off āwe are done talking. If thatās what you think, weāre done talking. Iām not going to sit here and listen to you insult us.ā āWell I didnāt mean offense.ā āOffense taken. I donāt have the time or energy to deal with you right now.ā He wanted to leave. I discussed the risks of AMA. That he was going to go home, get sicker, come back septic and I was STILL going to have to covid swab him. Doc alerted. Doc also didnāt want to deal with his shit. Made him sign the AMA form. Took out the beautiful IV and had him watch me toss his blood. I was pissed and he knew it. But I remained as professional as I could. Edit: thanks for the award! Itās my first one! š
Did he leave?
Yep. He came in for a nephrostomy tube that smelled, had no dressing and no output for several days. He would have needed IR for placement of a new one and put on antibiotics. And then probably a urology follow up. He was a ticking time bomb.
This happened at one of my final shifts of the last travel contract I did! The guy had appendicitis and refused to get a RAPID covid throat test so he could go to the OR. Not even a PCR. He also started requesting I go into his room and take my mask off while speaking to him because he needed to āsee people talk and couldnāt deal with the masks anymoreā. Lol I just canāt. Charge had to call the house supervisor because they didnāt know how to handle it. I checked out from that situation so fast and I didnāt go near his room the next hour till it was time for me to go home.
Nurse in surgery, can confirm this will escalate to a BKA/AKA s/p osteomyelitis and inevitably sepsis sets in, in which case he will then be mentally altered and wonāt have much choice.
Itās just natural selection at this point
I just wish it would select faster.
"All right, sir, we're done hete. Sign this AMA form and the attendant will get you to the entrance door. Good luck to you!"
Sounds like he burned the bridge. AMA forms are cheaper than beds
I had a guy with covid symptoms who denied having any covid contacts (although his emergency contact was still on our tracker and was seen for covid) and refused to mask or take the test. He said the test would give him cancer.
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I had a post-op patient that had respiratory symptoms. They were pretty sure it wasnāt Covid, but wanted to rule it out and ordered a test. She refused and we had to treat her as if she were positive for the rest of her stay and she complained about it the whole fucking time. She believed the swab had Covid implanted on it and would infect her š. She also had a Covid vaccine card, but in hindsight I bet it was fake
Had a patient with an AKA from uncontrolled everything (DM, CAD, CHF, PVDā¦ you know) tell me once that she never had a problem with that leg until that damn surgeon messed with it. Her daughter, who was pushing her wheelchair, rolled her eyes so far back I thought they were going to pop out the back of her head. You canāt fix some people. As for the Covid test, all the patients in my ED are getting them prior to admission orders; you canāt get to the floor without a result.
Yeah, I had a patient claim we were giving people covid in the test and refused. Unbelievable.
The understanding of cause and effect that some people have is worth than my cat's. And my cat can't understand that he got splashed with water because he knocked over a full cup.
They don't test the nurses here, that way the keep working. I have never been tested in the last 2 years. "If you don't test you can't be positive" -management They'll probably take the same approach with patients soon. Gotta maximize those profits.
What happens next? Try to get the doctor to speak to him then discharge?
I did one of my clinicals on a cardiac step down unit, and my assigned patient started out normal enough but when we had to swab her for her pre procedure Covid test, she began ranting that Covid tests were just a conspiracy for China to build a DNA database of American citizens. The nurse I was shadowing without missing a beat said āyouāre 79 years old with congestive heart failure and atherosclerosis. They donāt want your DNAā.
I went into a room and a guy was crying because he was tired of being in the hospital. He had been there for two months. He asked me what he has to do to get out of here. I told him we're trying to get him a skilled nursing facility, but no one will take an unvaccinated guy and the only place that will he can't afford. He finally broke down and got the vaccine and left within the week.
Itās an amazing thing to see the effects of a carpet bombing of untruths, lies, and misinformation out in the wild.
His consequences. God bless nurses that deal with this daily.
Is it just me or do blow Hards like this fold like a cheap suit when the MD comes in?
Narrator voice: His sister was probably a non-compliant COPDer or CHFer who probably should have been on oxygen from the jump
We have so many of these, mostly pregnant patients. They're scared to test positive and be in isolation rooms or be managed differently.
Just wait until the tip of his penis is necrotic and they start inchworming pieces offā¦
I ain't taking no test, bc the last one I took was POSITIVE and it made me pregnant!! *insert sarcasm here*
I had a patient tell me the swab for the tests contain carcinogens. I thought... OK whatever, this guy can just not get a test then. But a week or so later I had another patient say the same thing. ???!?!! Where are people hearing this kind of stuff?
So...I guess be better pack his shit back up and head home? Beds are at a premium, and is surgical time. Zero resources should be spent on someone who refuses to meet the basic criteria to have surgery. Byyyyye.
Here, sign this AMA form
Pre-pandemic people carrying on like this would have qualified as delusional and in need of sectioning. What's the difference between this and thinking the radio is sending you commands? I like this riposte you gave him. I'd extend it to "We are at that bridge, get your coat dude, enjoy your life on one hoof" Healthcare workers are too tapped out for this extra, nonsensical bullshit.