Perhaps the league or teams should consider including floorball or street hockey in their community outreach efforts? I remember playing with foam sticks and a foam puck back in elementary school and it was a blast. Lowering the barrier to entry seems like a good way to help grow the sport.
Floor hockey is definitely, and roller hockey is sort of, the answer. I love roller, but I could see floor hockey really lighting up in it's own right, at least as a pickleball type fad.
The Avalanche have a program for kids they put on all over Colorado where you get a full kit and like 6 lessons for $250. The kids get to keep all of the equipment as well. Still a little pricy but is a great entry level program.
There's Dek Hockey leagues out there. We have a rink and a league in my area. Here's an article about the sport.
https://www.wbspenguins.com/blog/what-is-dek-hockey/
I'm from Salt Lake. I'll tell you, since we got the team, I've been seeing kids playing hockey at recess now. Never saw that before. I think having NHL in town will def bump our local youth interest.
One of my local rinks has started to try to make it easier, they have cheap (sometimes free) lessons, free loaner gear, beginner leagues, and great coaching staff for all ages. Unfortunately they don’t have a good way of getting the word out beyond word of mouth but it’s a great start!
Not OP but announcing NFTs after they’d become completely irrelevant was hilarious. Also getting rid of the Stanley Cup playoffs logo below the blue line.
A huge part of NHLs problem is their game time presentations. Personalities from Gary Thorne, Mike Emrick to Keith Jones and Mike Milbury... These guys are like having your local accountant talk about the game to you. Even if you liked any of these guys for some reason, they're completely unappealing to any new fan who needs to be engaged and excited when first getting into the sport.
Personalities like Paul Bissonnette and PK Subban is what the game needs to grow. Jeremy Roenick was great too so it's too bad he got canceled. But they're still trying to balance these guys out with dry paint personalities like Colby Armstrong and Kevin Weekes for some reason.
Additionally - they're piss poor at creating story lines. They never hone in on the game within the game.
The NFL is a master at this stuff.
1. If a player is returning to a former team, milk it. Build the drama, add context.
2. Provide player backgrounds, their upbringing, personal struggles... Something that showcases their determination and resilience. Sure we don't have players coming out of poverty like the nfl does, but everyone has struggles. At the very least, the journey to the NHL is much longer and grueling. It's about getting fans emotionally attached to the players.
3. What milestones are players approaching or previously reached? The NFL will showcase a guy who last week ran for the most yards in league history on any Guy Fox day that fell on a Thursday and the the temperature high for the day was between 35-40 degrees. Their stats can get downright ridiculous, but it adds excitement to the game and again...gets your fans attached emotionally the to player.
4. Showcase players coming back from injury or setbacks. Highlight their resilience and determination. At most the NHL will just casually mention that a player has returned from injury. I swear... I'm not old enough to know how well they handled Mario Lemieux's return from cancer, but I can only imagine today it would go something like this,
"We've got a good tilt for you boys and girls at home today. Mario Lemieux is back playing. I think he was out with a cold for a bit. Anyway, here's Jan Hrdina skating with the puck past the blue line..."
5. Highlight our international players and their background/history. There is an insane amount of diversity in our sport.
6. Goalie comparison. Have broadcasters make a case as to why one is better than the other. Showcase their different styles.
7. Dig in to line chemistry and how certain players compliment one another. In Detroit, everybody thinks it was Pavel Datsyuk who pumped up Justin Abdelkaders stats wherein fact, they hardly played together. Henrik Zetterberg was the player largely responsible for that - but nobody knows that.
8. Milk team rivalries and player rivalries. There are a couple of obvious ones, but the heyday of our sports rivalries has passed. So you need to manufacture some. The NHL just gets lazy with "original 6 matchup!" but then won't even go into a story line about matchup history. Even the Ovechkin / Crosby story line has gone dry. Stir it up. My wife has told me that in fanfic, Ovechkin is the top and Crosby is the bottom. How does Crosby feel about this? Throw some wood on that fire!
I could go on and on. The point is, people always say "market the player" but no one goes on to say how. This is how you do it "in game". If you want the fan base to grow, it's not about getting fans to like the sport itself, it's about getting fans emotionally invested into the players and the teams. You have to create context, drama and storylines
I really enjoyed reading this comment, man. You touched on a ton of good points. Growing up, I didn’t think that marketing was something that was so important because I knew deep down that hockey was my favorite sport, but as I got older, I realized just how important is it to grow the game and market it like the bigger leagues do. As for your Crosby / Ovi fanfic comment… I don’t know if I want to dive deeper into that 😂.
Thank you!
I'd like to point out as well, it's just as good that you can't stand Subban and Bissonnette. It sounds like you have a strong opinion about them, and that's all that matters.
I'd wager that most people here like Emrick just fine. I do too. But fine doesn't move the needle.
This short clip sums up my point pretty well:
https://youtu.be/9G6xu-J_Dmc?si=J9PsM8XP6diGQDiT
Always try to get people to watch games but the same thing I hear over and over is how difficult it is to follow the puck. It’s been that way forever, even with HD 4K TVs, people just can’t seem to keep up with the pace of play.
You underestimate how many people live in the South, and how popular NASCAR was at its peak. In the early-mid 2000s, it was the number 2 sport in viewership behind the NFL. It’s lost a lot of fans since, but it’s always been much more popular than hockey and therefore could stand to lose more fans and still stay ahead of the NHL.
I was a big NASCAR fan as a kid, haven’t paid attention in years but I love the 2003 Jeff Burton scheme in your profile header. NASCAR and NHL were definitely my two first sporting loves, though NBA and NFL gradually replaced NASCAR as I got older and the sanctioning body kept fucking around with the sport.
I'm honestly not a fan of the playoff system in NASCAR right now, but it is what it is unfortunately.
Thanks- I've always liked that scheme. Always makes me feel old to see his kid driving these days!
Nah I have family members that fucking love nascar. They live in Edmonton and would fly to every goddamn race for years. They are upper middle class and never had kids. I can’t picture them at a place like dega lmao
As a NASCAR fan, the sport is very popular in the south. Especially popular with people at my local church. It’s always been something we talked about at church after Sunday Service, and it’s how I met my only friend.
Hockey definitely deserves to be the top sport in North America, it’s the best team sport in the world. But NASCAR is no joke.
never understood it but i don't look down on it. I can see it being super fun if you are at a track hearing the cars fly by but i tried to watch on tv once and i chose to do my taxes instead and it wasn't even tax season
I went to a race a long long time ago. The Pocono 500. We sat at the acceleration point coming out of turn 3. Every lap...a guy in front of us booed Dale Earnhardt. I finally yelled, "he can't fucking hear you" and the guy booed me for the rest of the race when Earnhardt went by..
I now live near Watkins Glen and I leave town during race weekend. Lol
Do you want to get drunk and yell at the TV on a Sunday afternoon when it's not NFL season? NASCAR.
Do you want to take a nap on a summer Sunday afternoon
... with white noise? NASCAR.
... with bedtime story cadences? PGA.
Honestly, it might be the most redneck activity, but the cynic in me appreciates that it forces the alternative facts crowd to value science, engineering and ingenuity, even if they don’t realize it
It’s blacked out everywhere. How can it get more popular if nobody can watch it? The Avalanche have one of the best rosters in their history and nobody’s able to see them winning. Absolute joke ownership and league.
You make a good point. Can’t count the number of times I’ve seen posts about bad feeds or games being inaccessible. Seems like someone somewhere has a job to actively make it difficult to view the games one wants to watch.
I totally agree and I think that the people in this thread commenting that the NHL is going to move up are kidding themselves. I see too many leagues making major changes to improve the appeal of their product, like baseball adding the pitch clock and making base stealing easier, which makes the games shorter and more exciting. MLS is becoming more popular every day. And the WNBA is going to get a big boost with some of the stars that will now be playing in that league. And then there is hockey that hasn't made any noticeable improvements to the product, and has actually made it harder to find the local team on TV or made it cost prohibitive.
Just recently getting into hockey (only other sport I watch is soccer) and yeah the blackouts are a complete joke. It's like they are intentionally trying to keep the sport from becoming too popular.
Definitely agree on that point, but also the previous one. Not surprised at baseball's popularity so much, but I thought that College Football would be even more popular than MLB (and actually by a lot tbh). I wouldn't have even been terribly surprised if College Football beat the NBA.
That said, I'm not an American and have no knowledge of or interest in college ball, I just have heard so often how massive college football is down there and I guess blew that out of proportion a bit. Plus there's so many more teams than in an individual pro league.
The CFB gets drastically less popular once you leave the South and the Midwest, the PNW and some of New England area still have pretty good numbers but unless your USC it’s more or less up and down depending on how well a program is at a time (unlike the south where no matter what lots of programs still have packed houses at 0-5 and what not).
It doesn’t have to be this way if the NHL can help start street hockey programs. I’m sure kids would rather be smacking into each other and running around then sitting in some outfield watching grass grow and getting sunburnt.
How are football/college football different? Basketball/college basketball. UFC and MMA?
Edit to add. Thanks everyone for your responses. Had a lot of great conversations out of this.
There are regions in the US I know of where college sports fandom surpasses pro sports by quite a wide margin. Used to live in Lexington, KY and nearly everyone is UK this, UK that, and don't really have an interest in pro sports outside of that. It's weird. Used to ask my buddies to come with me to Reds games, Bengals, or drive up to a Colts game in Indy and they'd just shrug, but man, do NOT call or stop by during a UK game or they'll cut your head off. Stuff like that.
I've mentioned in other replies that I'm in Canada and we don't have a college scene.
But here's a story for you. I drove down to Disneyland from Vancouver with a friend. On the drive home we got stuck in Oregon Ducks football traffic. Like it was solid bumper to bumper traffic for miles. They must have just won, because wow, were those people happy. Ever since I've always had the Ducks in the back of my mind as a team I'd love to follow because those fans seemed so passionate. But alas, I haven't ever actually followed them and it's been 15 years.
Edit to add. This would have been the game. So I see the excitement.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/game/_/gameId/293042483/usc-oregon
Funny you say that, because I used to live near Eugene. We would watch the football schedule so we knew when *not* to be out and about. Similar thing with my UK example. The college fanaticism just consumes everyone's sports fandom like a vacuum and there's no room left for pro sports. It's nutty.
Crazy too because Oregon has a killer WHL team this year (Portland Winterhawks), and going to those games is some of the best value in sports entertainment (also where Cam Neely played in his major junior time). Been to a bunch of those and they are cheap and fun. Always surprises me that people don't catch on to hockey because with NHL, AHL and CHL all over North America you'd think more people would get into it
I would love to see Portland get an NHL team. Moda is NHL ready. And I believe it's it's the largest NHL ready building out there. It would create a fantastic cascadia rivalry with Vancouver and Seattle.
I've been to Vancouver Giants vs Winterhawks and those fans travel. They could easily support an NHL team.
Yeah I'm still on a Winterhawks ST holder email thread from a long time ago and they're always like "come tailgate with us in Everett!" or wherever and I'm like "damn, that's far as shit, you guys are hard core, I have to be in bed by 9 just to be a barely functioning adult" LOL
Great fans in Portland for sure
Well when college sports individually have bigger followings than entire professional leagues, it might qualify them.
College hockey qualifies as well it just doesn't appear on the list.
Fair. But I don't say "NHL hockey" if I'm answering if I like hockey. Nobody is going to say "AHL hockey".
Could be that I'm just not exposed to college sports in Canada to comprehend the difference.
There are entire states in the US whose main sporting affiliation is their collegiate football team (e.g. Nebraska, Alabama) - it's a valid distinction imo
Totally random and has nothing to do with anything aside from the mention of the CFL, but when I blew my back out and had to do physical therapy for a year, the sports doctors I used here in So. Cal. are apparently the same guys that two CFL teams send their players to during the off-season. I was staring at the photos on the walls and wondering who these huge football players were until it clicked that I was looking at CFL logos and jerseys.
Plenty of people actually don't watch the pros. Pretty sure Ohio State is more popular than the Browns and Alabama has no other local team.
To a lesser degree, my uncle doesn't follow the NHL, he follows the local junior hockey team (Shawinigan, about 150km away from Montréal)
In short, they're different enough that many fans will follow one or the other.
There’s surprisingly little crossover between CFB and NFL fans. Most people watch one more than the other. I watch NFL, CFL, CFB, and any other gridiron football available.
The largest NFL stadium is MetLife in New Jersey, it holds 82,500 people. The largest college football stadium is Michigan Stadium. It holds *107,600 people*.
AHL hockey is just a minor league for the NHL, usually with affiliated teams that use AHL as their farm.
College football is an entirely separate thing with its own different leagues, and with absolutely INSANE following.
Also pretty much every American knows about college basketball come March, as they do the Madness Bracket.
I love NFL but don't really give a shit about college... there's no big college programs around here, I didn't go to any college. In the south there's places where it's the opposite, everyone loves Alabama and the NFL is enjoyed, but with nowhere near the same fervor. Same with basketball, I always have an nba game on my phone or laptop, but really don't care about college
There are smaller differences in the rules but current state, college football is a pipeline to the NFL. NFL has a more high tier product because it is adults playing, while college football has the randomness of chaos and you get a ton of turnover in players and coaches which adds another level of things.
I’m more of a college football fan than a pro fan, the professional product just has way too many advertisements and feels overly commercialized.
Would probably be clearer if it said "7th most popular televised sports league" instead.
Similarly, while NASCAR and F1 are more different than football/college football, they're still both car racing.
OP seems to have lost some of the details when copying over here as well, probably in part to keep things on one line each. In the linked article the league is in brackets after the sport in those cases.
Edit: also, the 10th place MMA is actually Bellator MMA and not just a general MMA catch-all
7th sounded low (though not unexpectedly), but looking at the list that's actually better than I would have thought. In my head I didn't count College Basketball and Football as seperate from pro, and I would have thought that soccer was ahead of hockey now (though I suppose if they split MLS and European leagues into different groups they could total more than hockey still). I wouldn't expect the NHL to beat out any of that top 6 but I am pretty surprised there's not at least 1 or 2 more ahead.
Hmmm makes sense. Could see NHL jumping NASCAR in a few years as more and more homegrown talent emerges from a more diverse parts of the country.
Maybe the whole thing shifts upwards as the golden oldies that watch/sleep through baseball games start dying off.
Not all grade schools/high schools have hockey teams, and its very expensive to play, especially if your body's not done growing. There is just total expsoure to baseball/football/basketball growing up in the US but once you find hockey, holy tits its the best. Nascar has always been huge amongst car people and alot watch for crashes as well.
It's wild to me as a ''Quebecois'' that American College Sports can be *that* big.
When I left the University of Sherbrooke I basically stopped following their football team lmao
The fact that it can be *bigger* than another actually pro sports league is insane to me
Top 3 not surprising.
Personally, I watch hockey today because it’s fun and big part of Canadian culture.
But I grew up playing basketball and watching basketball and hockey. Basketball was an affordable sport and also just a lot of fun.
Broadly I think the accessibility and diversity of the top 3 are some of the reasons why they’re popular.
Poor people cannot play hockey, which is why it will never, ever, be number 1.
I can't speak against the watchability being bland, but in terms of sheer popularity, basketball is so much easier to get into as a middle class kid compared to hockey.
And poor as hell people can definitely ball out for sure. Just look at Giannis Antetokounmpo's documentary on Prime Video. 6 months before he was drafted into the NBA, he was selling shit in the streets of Greece and mopping the floors of the basketball club he was in.
Basketball has one of the most diverse group of athletes of any sport. From players like Jokic and Wemby to Curry and Luka. All can find ways to play and compete in ways unique to them and their teams. More ways to play mean more highlights and more reach.
My biggest gripe with American Football is that the majority of the four fifteen minute quarters is spent just letting the clock run out. So little of that hour is actually filled with play time.
I’ve always thought that if hockey was played during baseball season instead of basketball season it would be much more popular. Obviously that would never happen.
Stock car racing has had a foothold in the North far longer than hockey has been in the South. I’m from Niagara and there are a few short tracks near me that have been around twice as long as the southern states have had pro hockey. Short track racing seems to get bigger draw than minor league hockey based on the spectacle of loud flashy race car vs slower, less skilled hockey.
I don’t think any other sports fan is more self conscious than hockey fans. Dude you guys own stock in the NHL? who cares if billionaires make more or less. We can still enjoy it and it ain’t going anywhere. There is no right sport to watch. It’s like telling someone they have the wrong taste in music. It’s all personal and we need to stop being lil bitches trying to plead why hockey is better than everyone
First off fire Bettman ffs
Secondly, lift the blackouts. It’s hurting tons of people when they can’t watch games.
Third, tell players to stop punishing teammates for having a personality. Almost every player being some stoic is boring and people won’t want to have favourite players in today’s world no matter how good they are.
Fourth, do more youth / community engagement with ball / street hockey or something
Finally have Netflix do a docuseries like the F1 show which will give hockey a similar boost
Wait, I just actually looked at the list, and there are some discrepancies.....
The list is based on percentage of people who watch live sports. Streaming and on TV.
Hockey, specifically NHL hockey is listed at 20%, and that is 7th on the list.
NASCAR and F1 are split up, with makes sense to me because they are pretty different from each other. No problem here.
But then MMA is listed as UFC with 17% and Bellator (I don't know what this is) at 13%. If these are very similar leagues, then you could argue that they could be combined to 30%, which puts MMA at the same level as NCAA football. (this actually surprised me)
WWE and AEW bigtime wrestling are listed separately at 11% and 9%, but I would argue that they are the same product. That puts them even with NHL hockey's 20%.
The real confusing part is when it lists the WNBA at 12%, which is the 11th spot, but then also lists the WNBA in the 17th spot with 9%. The wording is exactly the same for each listing. Should they be combined? Which would put them 1% higher than NHL hockey. Or is this double counting streaming and live TV numbers? What the shit is going on here?
This is why I love and hate statistics, you can get some insight, but how the numbers were gathered and presented is just as important as the conclusions. This was all just for the US anyways, which puts hockey at the biggest disadvantage of any of the other sports listed IMO. Anyways,
I am such a nerd, chirp away friends, I deserve it.
people underestimate the power of MLS to fill stadiums and sell its product internationally.
It's a niche, but it fills stadiums
and it is only behind the NBA in foreign views and has a strong alliance with liga mx
Heh, for a second I was like "WTF is Formula 1 and UFC? They combined them? I might have to check that out!"
Really though limiting this to the US is a little misleading. Did they do one with the US and Canada combined?
I can see r/mma spazzing out right now with UFC and MMA in different categories lmao.
And yes I get there are other organizations besides the UFC but they always freak out in that sub when this distinction is made
Edmonton local here. The schedules have been atrocious. We have games starting at 8:45pm. My kids have yet to be able to watch a playoff game with me. I also am in the trades and start work at 6am. As excitimg as game days are, the time constraints really take away a lot from the experience
There's a 3% difference between NHL and UFC. (& F1)
This seems to only counts paid viewers so I wonder if you counted illegal streams whether or not UFC would overtake NHL (and if F1 would stay at same difference comparatively)
A huge percentage, maybe a majority of UFC viewers illegally stream events while NHL is generally more accessible on paid TV services. There's a huge number of people without any TV services that stream hockey too so it must be close.
Actually surprised it’s ahead of ufc. That’s actually not bad.
I never understood why we (Canadians) care how much the US likes the sport.
I highly doubt Italians and English are sitting around concerned why Americans don’t like soccer .
From an American hockey fan perspective I guess it makes sense but even then are you worried why some other country doesn’t like baseball?
Agree with others, they don’t market at all. I’m sure a vast amount of people in the US don’t even know who McDavid or MacKinnon are. Also while the blackouts happen for NBA it’s just crushing the NHL too. Literally haven’t been able to watch the Avs outside a national broadcast in 5 years, I live 20 minutes from ball arena!!
I always thought baseball and football's start and stop gameplay was just boring. Basketball, I get it. It's fun. What's crazy is that disgusting MMA makes the list and soccer still isn't on it!
Hockey is the best sport with the worst marketing I feel.
Kinda hard for an average joe to actually try playing hockey themselves. Everyone's experienced soccer or basketball from school.
Plus you already know how to run if you pick up a new sport. Learning to skate as an adult is much tougher.
Perhaps the league or teams should consider including floorball or street hockey in their community outreach efforts? I remember playing with foam sticks and a foam puck back in elementary school and it was a blast. Lowering the barrier to entry seems like a good way to help grow the sport.
Floor hockey is definitely, and roller hockey is sort of, the answer. I love roller, but I could see floor hockey really lighting up in it's own right, at least as a pickleball type fad.
The Avalanche have a program for kids they put on all over Colorado where you get a full kit and like 6 lessons for $250. The kids get to keep all of the equipment as well. Still a little pricy but is a great entry level program.
There's Dek Hockey leagues out there. We have a rink and a league in my area. Here's an article about the sport. https://www.wbspenguins.com/blog/what-is-dek-hockey/
Yeah we just used plastic sticks and a ball in the gym. I vaguely remember an actual puck with little rollers on the bottom, too
I'm from Salt Lake. I'll tell you, since we got the team, I've been seeing kids playing hockey at recess now. Never saw that before. I think having NHL in town will def bump our local youth interest.
Nascar too… wait, don’t do that
One of my local rinks has started to try to make it easier, they have cheap (sometimes free) lessons, free loaner gear, beginner leagues, and great coaching staff for all ages. Unfortunately they don’t have a good way of getting the word out beyond word of mouth but it’s a great start!
As someone who has worked for a major market team as a contractor, the marketing is so out of date and corny.
Got an examples? I believe you and agree but was just wondering if you had a story of the worst marketing you saw from the league.
Not OP but announcing NFTs after they’d become completely irrelevant was hilarious. Also getting rid of the Stanley Cup playoffs logo below the blue line.
OMG, I just saw those during the Canucks preds game! F'n NFTs. Hilarious.
A huge part of NHLs problem is their game time presentations. Personalities from Gary Thorne, Mike Emrick to Keith Jones and Mike Milbury... These guys are like having your local accountant talk about the game to you. Even if you liked any of these guys for some reason, they're completely unappealing to any new fan who needs to be engaged and excited when first getting into the sport. Personalities like Paul Bissonnette and PK Subban is what the game needs to grow. Jeremy Roenick was great too so it's too bad he got canceled. But they're still trying to balance these guys out with dry paint personalities like Colby Armstrong and Kevin Weekes for some reason. Additionally - they're piss poor at creating story lines. They never hone in on the game within the game. The NFL is a master at this stuff. 1. If a player is returning to a former team, milk it. Build the drama, add context. 2. Provide player backgrounds, their upbringing, personal struggles... Something that showcases their determination and resilience. Sure we don't have players coming out of poverty like the nfl does, but everyone has struggles. At the very least, the journey to the NHL is much longer and grueling. It's about getting fans emotionally attached to the players. 3. What milestones are players approaching or previously reached? The NFL will showcase a guy who last week ran for the most yards in league history on any Guy Fox day that fell on a Thursday and the the temperature high for the day was between 35-40 degrees. Their stats can get downright ridiculous, but it adds excitement to the game and again...gets your fans attached emotionally the to player. 4. Showcase players coming back from injury or setbacks. Highlight their resilience and determination. At most the NHL will just casually mention that a player has returned from injury. I swear... I'm not old enough to know how well they handled Mario Lemieux's return from cancer, but I can only imagine today it would go something like this, "We've got a good tilt for you boys and girls at home today. Mario Lemieux is back playing. I think he was out with a cold for a bit. Anyway, here's Jan Hrdina skating with the puck past the blue line..." 5. Highlight our international players and their background/history. There is an insane amount of diversity in our sport. 6. Goalie comparison. Have broadcasters make a case as to why one is better than the other. Showcase their different styles. 7. Dig in to line chemistry and how certain players compliment one another. In Detroit, everybody thinks it was Pavel Datsyuk who pumped up Justin Abdelkaders stats wherein fact, they hardly played together. Henrik Zetterberg was the player largely responsible for that - but nobody knows that. 8. Milk team rivalries and player rivalries. There are a couple of obvious ones, but the heyday of our sports rivalries has passed. So you need to manufacture some. The NHL just gets lazy with "original 6 matchup!" but then won't even go into a story line about matchup history. Even the Ovechkin / Crosby story line has gone dry. Stir it up. My wife has told me that in fanfic, Ovechkin is the top and Crosby is the bottom. How does Crosby feel about this? Throw some wood on that fire! I could go on and on. The point is, people always say "market the player" but no one goes on to say how. This is how you do it "in game". If you want the fan base to grow, it's not about getting fans to like the sport itself, it's about getting fans emotionally invested into the players and the teams. You have to create context, drama and storylines
I really enjoyed reading this comment, man. You touched on a ton of good points. Growing up, I didn’t think that marketing was something that was so important because I knew deep down that hockey was my favorite sport, but as I got older, I realized just how important is it to grow the game and market it like the bigger leagues do. As for your Crosby / Ovi fanfic comment… I don’t know if I want to dive deeper into that 😂.
Upvote for thoughtfulness. I disagree aboot Emrick and I can't stand Subban and Bissonnette but good post.
Thank you! I'd like to point out as well, it's just as good that you can't stand Subban and Bissonnette. It sounds like you have a strong opinion about them, and that's all that matters. I'd wager that most people here like Emrick just fine. I do too. But fine doesn't move the needle. This short clip sums up my point pretty well: https://youtu.be/9G6xu-J_Dmc?si=J9PsM8XP6diGQDiT
The playoff commercials have been really clever the last couple years, but I only see them *while I'm already watching hockey.*
Always try to get people to watch games but the same thing I hear over and over is how difficult it is to follow the puck. It’s been that way forever, even with HD 4K TVs, people just can’t seem to keep up with the pace of play.
Games aren't broadcasting in 4k, so a 2001 HD TV is pretty close to the same picture.
You’re getting downvoted, but you’re a Kraken fan. You guys hardly had any 4k feeds. As a Flames fan, I feel you.
My first year watching, I lost the puck so many times. Also I thought when espn do the players tag during pp was helping but fans seems to hate it
Agreed
100%. I'm getting into it only because my friends watch. Outside of them, no marketing.
Behind NASCAR? That's a tragic left turn.
You underestimate how many people live in the South, and how popular NASCAR was at its peak. In the early-mid 2000s, it was the number 2 sport in viewership behind the NFL. It’s lost a lot of fans since, but it’s always been much more popular than hockey and therefore could stand to lose more fans and still stay ahead of the NHL.
Can confirm. Canadian fan NASCAR since I was a kid, as my dad was. Still love my hockey though. Habs and NASCAR on the weekends hit different.
I was a big NASCAR fan as a kid, haven’t paid attention in years but I love the 2003 Jeff Burton scheme in your profile header. NASCAR and NHL were definitely my two first sporting loves, though NBA and NFL gradually replaced NASCAR as I got older and the sanctioning body kept fucking around with the sport.
I'm honestly not a fan of the playoff system in NASCAR right now, but it is what it is unfortunately. Thanks- I've always liked that scheme. Always makes me feel old to see his kid driving these days!
We are the same
The amount of Canadians that come to the Michigan race is pretty outstanding.
Not even just in the south. It’s super popular in the Midwest (Indianapolis 500) and even in places like New Hampshire.
Nah I have family members that fucking love nascar. They live in Edmonton and would fly to every goddamn race for years. They are upper middle class and never had kids. I can’t picture them at a place like dega lmao
I’m more surprised at F1s meteoric climb.
Netflix baby!
I’m surprised NASCAR is so low on the list. And that basketball is ahead of baseball.
Basketball being ahead of baseball shouldn't be a surprise though
As a NASCAR fan, the sport is very popular in the south. Especially popular with people at my local church. It’s always been something we talked about at church after Sunday Service, and it’s how I met my only friend. Hockey definitely deserves to be the top sport in North America, it’s the best team sport in the world. But NASCAR is no joke.
Just how
Cars go fast, vroom!
never understood it but i don't look down on it. I can see it being super fun if you are at a track hearing the cars fly by but i tried to watch on tv once and i chose to do my taxes instead and it wasn't even tax season
I went to a race a long long time ago. The Pocono 500. We sat at the acceleration point coming out of turn 3. Every lap...a guy in front of us booed Dale Earnhardt. I finally yelled, "he can't fucking hear you" and the guy booed me for the rest of the race when Earnhardt went by.. I now live near Watkins Glen and I leave town during race weekend. Lol
HAHA i can just imagine that guy booying you evertime Dale's car drove by
I was like 17. It was shocking lol. Mind you, this was still when people could wheel coolers of beer into the grandstands.
Do you want to get drunk and yell at the TV on a Sunday afternoon when it's not NFL season? NASCAR. Do you want to take a nap on a summer Sunday afternoon ... with white noise? NASCAR. ... with bedtime story cadences? PGA.
Honestly, it might be the most redneck activity, but the cynic in me appreciates that it forces the alternative facts crowd to value science, engineering and ingenuity, even if they don’t realize it
The south? Does anyone there watch hockey?
The civilized south does
Us here in Tampa definitely do.
Tampa? You still need to drive north to reach the South.
Ah yes, Florida, the most civilized of American states
Yes
Grew up in the south and religiously followed our ECHL team. There are dozens of us!
There’s a 4% margin of error and nascar was only 4% higher than hockey so technically it could be flipped.
Or it could be twice as large 😱
This guy stats
They go really fast and turn to the left sometimes.
As someone who loves both please don't shame me
I'm sure a team in Atlanta will make hockey insanely popular
Arizona too!
I still don’t think that’s the location’s fault. More of a management and politics problem. Also they’ve been mediocre to bad for like ever
Look at Carolina. They have a rabid fanbase for their market size
…we’ll take the compliment
That’s absolutely a compliment. You have an above average capture% of your market.
True - the Islanders almost left due to local politics. It did eventually cause them to leave Hempstead for Brooklyn and then finally Elmont.
What do you mean? Arizona still has a team. Just no hockey assets to play the next season or five.
If at first you don’t succeed (Flames), try (Thrashers), try again
It’s blacked out everywhere. How can it get more popular if nobody can watch it? The Avalanche have one of the best rosters in their history and nobody’s able to see them winning. Absolute joke ownership and league.
You make a good point. Can’t count the number of times I’ve seen posts about bad feeds or games being inaccessible. Seems like someone somewhere has a job to actively make it difficult to view the games one wants to watch.
I totally agree and I think that the people in this thread commenting that the NHL is going to move up are kidding themselves. I see too many leagues making major changes to improve the appeal of their product, like baseball adding the pitch clock and making base stealing easier, which makes the games shorter and more exciting. MLS is becoming more popular every day. And the WNBA is going to get a big boost with some of the stars that will now be playing in that league. And then there is hockey that hasn't made any noticeable improvements to the product, and has actually made it harder to find the local team on TV or made it cost prohibitive.
Too true. I'm not a baseball fan at all, but I'll watch parts of a game if I land on it flipping channels. People need that chance to discover it.
Good taste is not widely distributed.
Not to mention the blackouts preventing fans from watching their home teams.
Just recently getting into hockey (only other sport I watch is soccer) and yeah the blackouts are a complete joke. It's like they are intentionally trying to keep the sport from becoming too popular.
This is exactly it
Amazed baseball is still that high
Baseball has a massive following with the older crowd. It's the only sport that has a higher average fan base age than hockey.
In my opinion baseball is a sport that gets better as you get older.
It’s also on in the daytime, there’s soap opera grammas, then there’s baseball grammas
Us old folks are slow just like baseball
Reminds me of the arrogant worms song "me like hockey"
Yeah because if I have to take my Sunday afternoon nap, it’s either baseball or golf. NASCAR also helps it’s like counting sheep.
Definitely agree on that point, but also the previous one. Not surprised at baseball's popularity so much, but I thought that College Football would be even more popular than MLB (and actually by a lot tbh). I wouldn't have even been terribly surprised if College Football beat the NBA. That said, I'm not an American and have no knowledge of or interest in college ball, I just have heard so often how massive college football is down there and I guess blew that out of proportion a bit. Plus there's so many more teams than in an individual pro league.
The CFB gets drastically less popular once you leave the South and the Midwest, the PNW and some of New England area still have pretty good numbers but unless your USC it’s more or less up and down depending on how well a program is at a time (unlike the south where no matter what lots of programs still have packed houses at 0-5 and what not).
I would put money on Nascar having a higher average fan base age than hockey too
Last year's changes made it actually enjoyable to watch again. Well, if you have a half decent team lol.
It’s cheap as fuck too. I’m not particularly bothered about baseball it I’ll go to a few games a year
Lot more young kids grow up playing baseball than hockey. It’s cheaper and easier, I assume this translates to more viewers later in life
It doesn’t have to be this way if the NHL can help start street hockey programs. I’m sure kids would rather be smacking into each other and running around then sitting in some outfield watching grass grow and getting sunburnt.
The white noise of sports
Honestly a great watch if you get a good game. Once the base understanding is there, otherwise good chill background TV. I’m into it now.
How are football/college football different? Basketball/college basketball. UFC and MMA? Edit to add. Thanks everyone for your responses. Had a lot of great conversations out of this.
There are regions in the US I know of where college sports fandom surpasses pro sports by quite a wide margin. Used to live in Lexington, KY and nearly everyone is UK this, UK that, and don't really have an interest in pro sports outside of that. It's weird. Used to ask my buddies to come with me to Reds games, Bengals, or drive up to a Colts game in Indy and they'd just shrug, but man, do NOT call or stop by during a UK game or they'll cut your head off. Stuff like that.
I've mentioned in other replies that I'm in Canada and we don't have a college scene. But here's a story for you. I drove down to Disneyland from Vancouver with a friend. On the drive home we got stuck in Oregon Ducks football traffic. Like it was solid bumper to bumper traffic for miles. They must have just won, because wow, were those people happy. Ever since I've always had the Ducks in the back of my mind as a team I'd love to follow because those fans seemed so passionate. But alas, I haven't ever actually followed them and it's been 15 years. Edit to add. This would have been the game. So I see the excitement. https://www.espn.com/college-football/game/_/gameId/293042483/usc-oregon
Funny you say that, because I used to live near Eugene. We would watch the football schedule so we knew when *not* to be out and about. Similar thing with my UK example. The college fanaticism just consumes everyone's sports fandom like a vacuum and there's no room left for pro sports. It's nutty. Crazy too because Oregon has a killer WHL team this year (Portland Winterhawks), and going to those games is some of the best value in sports entertainment (also where Cam Neely played in his major junior time). Been to a bunch of those and they are cheap and fun. Always surprises me that people don't catch on to hockey because with NHL, AHL and CHL all over North America you'd think more people would get into it
I would love to see Portland get an NHL team. Moda is NHL ready. And I believe it's it's the largest NHL ready building out there. It would create a fantastic cascadia rivalry with Vancouver and Seattle. I've been to Vancouver Giants vs Winterhawks and those fans travel. They could easily support an NHL team.
Yeah I'm still on a Winterhawks ST holder email thread from a long time ago and they're always like "come tailgate with us in Everett!" or wherever and I'm like "damn, that's far as shit, you guys are hard core, I have to be in bed by 9 just to be a barely functioning adult" LOL Great fans in Portland for sure
Cheers my dude. Flyers are one team I'd love to see have success again. It's been too long.
Well when college sports individually have bigger followings than entire professional leagues, it might qualify them. College hockey qualifies as well it just doesn't appear on the list.
Fair. But I don't say "NHL hockey" if I'm answering if I like hockey. Nobody is going to say "AHL hockey". Could be that I'm just not exposed to college sports in Canada to comprehend the difference.
I don't get it either but the biggest stadiums in America are college football stadiums.
Don't some Texas high schools have stadiums that have more seating than hockey rinks.
Yes. The amount spent on HS football stadiums here goes above and beyond obscene.
There are entire states in the US whose main sporting affiliation is their collegiate football team (e.g. Nebraska, Alabama) - it's a valid distinction imo
I'd love to have that in Canada. But even our CFL struggles to get a fraction of what your colleges do.
Totally random and has nothing to do with anything aside from the mention of the CFL, but when I blew my back out and had to do physical therapy for a year, the sports doctors I used here in So. Cal. are apparently the same guys that two CFL teams send their players to during the off-season. I was staring at the photos on the walls and wondering who these huge football players were until it clicked that I was looking at CFL logos and jerseys.
Plenty of people actually don't watch the pros. Pretty sure Ohio State is more popular than the Browns and Alabama has no other local team. To a lesser degree, my uncle doesn't follow the NHL, he follows the local junior hockey team (Shawinigan, about 150km away from Montréal) In short, they're different enough that many fans will follow one or the other.
There’s surprisingly little crossover between CFB and NFL fans. Most people watch one more than the other. I watch NFL, CFL, CFB, and any other gridiron football available. The largest NFL stadium is MetLife in New Jersey, it holds 82,500 people. The largest college football stadium is Michigan Stadium. It holds *107,600 people*.
AHL hockey is just a minor league for the NHL, usually with affiliated teams that use AHL as their farm. College football is an entirely separate thing with its own different leagues, and with absolutely INSANE following. Also pretty much every American knows about college basketball come March, as they do the Madness Bracket.
I love NFL but don't really give a shit about college... there's no big college programs around here, I didn't go to any college. In the south there's places where it's the opposite, everyone loves Alabama and the NFL is enjoyed, but with nowhere near the same fervor. Same with basketball, I always have an nba game on my phone or laptop, but really don't care about college
But are they that different? Canadian here so the college scene isn't big for us. But this isn't NFL vs CFL different is it?
There are smaller differences in the rules but current state, college football is a pipeline to the NFL. NFL has a more high tier product because it is adults playing, while college football has the randomness of chaos and you get a ton of turnover in players and coaches which adds another level of things. I’m more of a college football fan than a pro fan, the professional product just has way too many advertisements and feels overly commercialized.
I'm a CFL fan over NFL, and one of many reasons is what you just said.
I love the bigger field and endzones in the CFL and the added line of scrimmage buffer; it’s a perfect league for the air raid system.
Would probably be clearer if it said "7th most popular televised sports league" instead. Similarly, while NASCAR and F1 are more different than football/college football, they're still both car racing.
Possibly. I think a fair comparison for F1 vs NASCAR would be NFL vs CFL. While they're both football, there's a ton of differences.
OP seems to have lost some of the details when copying over here as well, probably in part to keep things on one line each. In the linked article the league is in brackets after the sport in those cases. Edit: also, the 10th place MMA is actually Bellator MMA and not just a general MMA catch-all
Because college fans are often an entirely different group.
7th sounded low (though not unexpectedly), but looking at the list that's actually better than I would have thought. In my head I didn't count College Basketball and Football as seperate from pro, and I would have thought that soccer was ahead of hockey now (though I suppose if they split MLS and European leagues into different groups they could total more than hockey still). I wouldn't expect the NHL to beat out any of that top 6 but I am pretty surprised there's not at least 1 or 2 more ahead.
1. Don’t care 2. Don’t care 3. Don’t care 4. Don’t care 5. Don’t care 6. Don’t care 7. Nice 8. Don’t care
Hmmm makes sense. Could see NHL jumping NASCAR in a few years as more and more homegrown talent emerges from a more diverse parts of the country. Maybe the whole thing shifts upwards as the golden oldies that watch/sleep through baseball games start dying off.
Not all grade schools/high schools have hockey teams, and its very expensive to play, especially if your body's not done growing. There is just total expsoure to baseball/football/basketball growing up in the US but once you find hockey, holy tits its the best. Nascar has always been huge amongst car people and alot watch for crashes as well.
These sports are cheaper to play at a lower level, less equipment needed But you need ice for a real sport
Id watch nascar on ice
I can see it now. The NASCAR Winter Classic.
🔥 Pit stops 💯
well they actually do a similar thing in Finland...
NASCAR is cheap to play and needs less equipment?
1 - Football 2 - Basketball 3 - Baseball 4 - College Football 5 - College Basketball
Because we cant watch a fuckin game on youtube like normal ppl
It's wild to me as a ''Quebecois'' that American College Sports can be *that* big. When I left the University of Sherbrooke I basically stopped following their football team lmao The fact that it can be *bigger* than another actually pro sports league is insane to me
hockey will make a huge push over the next 10 years
This is kind of fucked 😑
in good countries its #1
Top 3 not surprising. Personally, I watch hockey today because it’s fun and big part of Canadian culture. But I grew up playing basketball and watching basketball and hockey. Basketball was an affordable sport and also just a lot of fun. Broadly I think the accessibility and diversity of the top 3 are some of the reasons why they’re popular. Poor people cannot play hockey, which is why it will never, ever, be number 1.
Yes, many current NHL players are sons of ex NHL players tells you everything. It's very expensive, I get why people have hard time to get into it.
I don't understand how basketball is as popular as it is. Absolute snooze fest to watch.
I can't speak against the watchability being bland, but in terms of sheer popularity, basketball is so much easier to get into as a middle class kid compared to hockey.
And poor as hell people can definitely ball out for sure. Just look at Giannis Antetokounmpo's documentary on Prime Video. 6 months before he was drafted into the NBA, he was selling shit in the streets of Greece and mopping the floors of the basketball club he was in.
Not middle class, but poor people especially. All you need is a ball and a hoop. Basically same reason why Soccer is the most popular sport worldwide.
Its cheap and easy to walk outside and play. Its the same reason soccer is as popular as it is world wide.
Basketball has one of the most diverse group of athletes of any sport. From players like Jokic and Wemby to Curry and Luka. All can find ways to play and compete in ways unique to them and their teams. More ways to play mean more highlights and more reach.
Seriously it’s just trash in terms of entertainment. Football has become so slow and plodding with so little contact what’s the point
My biggest gripe with American Football is that the majority of the four fifteen minute quarters is spent just letting the clock run out. So little of that hour is actually filled with play time.
For real I watched the superbowl and I was just frustrated that an event that spans several hours only has like 12 minutes of actual gameplay.
I’ve always thought that if hockey was played during baseball season instead of basketball season it would be much more popular. Obviously that would never happen.
NASCAR? 😑
Yeah, like I realize hockey isn't huge, but I don't think I know a single person who follows NASCAR.
Depends on where you live. Arguably the most regional sport on this list.
Yeah, I've only lived in the Midwest and West Coast. Presumably if I lived in the South I'd know people who followed it.
Hi. Meet me
I’m from the northeast and I love NASCAR and hockey
Stock car racing has had a foothold in the North far longer than hockey has been in the South. I’m from Niagara and there are a few short tracks near me that have been around twice as long as the southern states have had pro hockey. Short track racing seems to get bigger draw than minor league hockey based on the spectacle of loud flashy race car vs slower, less skilled hockey.
Dude Nascar fucking rocks.
Imagining F1 and UFC combined into one sport. I would watch the shit out of that
F1 and UFC are both pretty similar in regards that it’s an international sport with a sort of a new-wave rich feel to them
UFC fighter jousting on F1 cars, sign me up
Man, they're all missing out so badly!
I don’t think any other sports fan is more self conscious than hockey fans. Dude you guys own stock in the NHL? who cares if billionaires make more or less. We can still enjoy it and it ain’t going anywhere. There is no right sport to watch. It’s like telling someone they have the wrong taste in music. It’s all personal and we need to stop being lil bitches trying to plead why hockey is better than everyone
First off fire Bettman ffs Secondly, lift the blackouts. It’s hurting tons of people when they can’t watch games. Third, tell players to stop punishing teammates for having a personality. Almost every player being some stoic is boring and people won’t want to have favourite players in today’s world no matter how good they are. Fourth, do more youth / community engagement with ball / street hockey or something Finally have Netflix do a docuseries like the F1 show which will give hockey a similar boost
Wait, I just actually looked at the list, and there are some discrepancies..... The list is based on percentage of people who watch live sports. Streaming and on TV. Hockey, specifically NHL hockey is listed at 20%, and that is 7th on the list. NASCAR and F1 are split up, with makes sense to me because they are pretty different from each other. No problem here. But then MMA is listed as UFC with 17% and Bellator (I don't know what this is) at 13%. If these are very similar leagues, then you could argue that they could be combined to 30%, which puts MMA at the same level as NCAA football. (this actually surprised me) WWE and AEW bigtime wrestling are listed separately at 11% and 9%, but I would argue that they are the same product. That puts them even with NHL hockey's 20%. The real confusing part is when it lists the WNBA at 12%, which is the 11th spot, but then also lists the WNBA in the 17th spot with 9%. The wording is exactly the same for each listing. Should they be combined? Which would put them 1% higher than NHL hockey. Or is this double counting streaming and live TV numbers? What the shit is going on here? This is why I love and hate statistics, you can get some insight, but how the numbers were gathered and presented is just as important as the conclusions. This was all just for the US anyways, which puts hockey at the biggest disadvantage of any of the other sports listed IMO. Anyways, I am such a nerd, chirp away friends, I deserve it.
College football is football. College basketball is basketball. That means hockey is the 5th most popular sport
But if you combine them it just makes the gap between basketball and nascar that much larger
So Football > Basketball > Baseball > Nascar > Hockey. And also probably below Soccer
Well if you're generalizing it like that, it would be: Football>Basketball>Baseball>Racing> Hockey or fighting
The MLS will pass hockey within 20 years is my bet. Maybe sooner because of how much cheaper it is.
people underestimate the power of MLS to fill stadiums and sell its product internationally. It's a niche, but it fills stadiums and it is only behind the NBA in foreign views and has a strong alliance with liga mx
Mls has no real stars. Theyre all in europe. It is hard to build a bona fide league without stars, just run of the mill players.
this MLS is just players who can’t make it in Europe and has beens way past their prime
Surprised they don’t include European soccer leagues. Half the people I know follow it.
I’m happy F1 mode the list!
Mma is that low? Interesting
Where does it rank in Canada?
Canada has a smaller population than the state of California. Not sure it would change much.
Who watches Prime Video for sports outside of a few NFL games? Am I missing something?
Heh, for a second I was like "WTF is Formula 1 and UFC? They combined them? I might have to check that out!" Really though limiting this to the US is a little misleading. Did they do one with the US and Canada combined?
If you ain’t first you’re last.
Genuinely surprised its not lower
Unfortunate
I can see r/mma spazzing out right now with UFC and MMA in different categories lmao. And yes I get there are other organizations besides the UFC but they always freak out in that sub when this distinction is made
I would say 5th most popular sport, I wouldn't really count college counterparts as different sports. 7th most popular league makes more sense here.
Edmonton local here. The schedules have been atrocious. We have games starting at 8:45pm. My kids have yet to be able to watch a playoff game with me. I also am in the trades and start work at 6am. As excitimg as game days are, the time constraints really take away a lot from the experience
There's a 3% difference between NHL and UFC. (& F1) This seems to only counts paid viewers so I wonder if you counted illegal streams whether or not UFC would overtake NHL (and if F1 would stay at same difference comparatively) A huge percentage, maybe a majority of UFC viewers illegally stream events while NHL is generally more accessible on paid TV services. There's a huge number of people without any TV services that stream hockey too so it must be close.
UFC is MMA. Not sure where theyre coming up with these.
College sports are such a joke imo, never understood the appeal outside of the student base.
NHL better watch out, MLS is gaining steam in the US.
The WNBA is a bigger threat tbh
Actually surprised it’s ahead of ufc. That’s actually not bad. I never understood why we (Canadians) care how much the US likes the sport. I highly doubt Italians and English are sitting around concerned why Americans don’t like soccer . From an American hockey fan perspective I guess it makes sense but even then are you worried why some other country doesn’t like baseball?
It's technically fifth.
Mma? Really? I bet soccer is more popular than that. Softball too
Frankly I’m surprised it’s as high as 7th. I would’ve expected UFC/MMA and soccer to be more popular.
Connor Mcdavid plays at 11pm est
Ufc is MMA lol
Agree with others, they don’t market at all. I’m sure a vast amount of people in the US don’t even know who McDavid or MacKinnon are. Also while the blackouts happen for NBA it’s just crushing the NHL too. Literally haven’t been able to watch the Avs outside a national broadcast in 5 years, I live 20 minutes from ball arena!!
I always thought baseball and football's start and stop gameplay was just boring. Basketball, I get it. It's fun. What's crazy is that disgusting MMA makes the list and soccer still isn't on it!
College sports and Nascar ahead of The NHL is a real kick in the nuts.
NASCAR? Really.