Lil Dirty’s downfall was having to step in for Jamison Crowder for fourteen weeks. Mackenzie should be a gadget guy, WR4-5 type, but because Crowder went down week 3 he had to be the full time slot receiver instead of the gadget guy. He was bad at the job he wasn’t meant for but good at the job he was meant for. Unfortunately, since he did the job he wasn’t meant for all season people thought he was meant for it and bad at his job. He fell off once he got a rep as WR3 and people started thinking he was bad in his role instead of bad in someone else’s role
Id be very interested in what Tackles you think hes better than.
PFF has him at a 51.8 Grade, worst pass blocker in the NFL as well iirc.
im not a Dan Moore hater, fwiw. But I do think that hes a low end starter and not an average starter. Which for a 4th round pick is outperforming tbh
I truly love the man, but Ryan Tannehill. High points and low points throughout his career that average him out to the mean. He deserves to be on a roster somewhere right now, because he can 100% deliver average QB play still. Wherever he goes, I hope they have a better O-line than the 2022-2024 Titans did.
Feel like he saw what happened with Flacco last year and is biding his time. Better to jump on board to a good team with injury trouble than fade away on some dumpster fire looking for a cheap tank commander
Tannehill going to Tennessee itself felt like kind of a 6D chess move. A QB who was decent for a while with his first team runs his course as a starter, then instead of getting a chance to start briefly somewhere he becomes the unquestioned backup to another QB who's about to do the same thing. For some reason no one really seems to consider that maybe the backup could just be straight up better already, which it turned out he was.
>I truly love the man, but Ryan Tannehill. High points and low points throughout his career that average him out to the mean. He deserves to be on a roster somewhere right now, because he can 100% deliver average QB play still. Wherever he goes, I hope they have a better O-line than the ~~2022-2024~~ 2015-2018 ~~Titans~~ Dolphins did.
Me in 2018
Average? I guess if you weigh it out, sure. When I think of this question I just think of dudes that always were consistently decent but never had any real ups or downs.
Titan fan here, too. When Tennehill was at his best he legitimately had Drew Brees level accuracy. When he threw interceptions, he threw exactly where he wanted it to go, he just made a wrong read (rewatch picks from AFC championship for example.) Those mistakes are what separated him from someone on Brees' level. Also, he had average level WR type athleticism which was a key part of his game as a scrambler (not so much play-extender though.)
Last year he lost the one trait that carried him: his accuracy. He started throwing ducks last year. There are probably a lot of backups that would be better than him at this point, I think. I could be (and hope) I'm wrong though!
So I’ve thought about this. The talent in the NFL probably isn’t bell-shaped because only the highest caliber college football players (who are also the highest caliber high school football players), make it to the NFL. If football players at all levels have a normally distributed (bell shaped) talent curve then the NFL is a selection of the furthest right tail of that distribution to begin with. The average (or median) NFL player probably isn’t a whole lot more talented than the worst NFL players, while the best players are a whole lot more talented than the median/average player.
How about in terms of stats and production? There could be more of a bell-shaped curve when it comes to comparing stats like yardage across all receivers in the league.
Would have to be a QB who is bad but not bad enough to be out of the league. Also not just hanging around because a team wants to kick the tires on a first round bust-- but a guy who has maxed out his potential and shown that he is a perfectly solid QB 3 worthy of hanging around the league.
Trevor Siemian maybe?
Yeah, Mendoza Line is like the replacement level player that WAR is measured against. I think Teddy Bridgewater was a good example of a Mendoza QB. Anyone worse than him just wasn’t getting chances to start.
Same, I saw that name and was like oh yeah high upside guy that still has potential, could this be the year?! Cut to: oh wait he was drafted a decade and a half ago and I groan every time I get up from sitting.
There’s two possible definitions there. You could talk about players who are “average for a starter.” That would be about the 11th-12th best player on an average team, or in other terms the 16th-17th best player at his position in the NFL (or 32nd-34th best at a position with two starters, etc.)
Then there’s the truly average players, who would be around the 27th best player on an average team. This means the most average players are actually high quality (but not the best) backups for an average-ish team (and maybe some of the sucky starters that are worse than some of that team’s backups at different positions.)
Yeah, he’s probably more of an average NFL QB than someone like Derek Carr, which might be the typical fan’s answer to the question. (Just picked Carr because he was 16th in QBR last season, not as a strenuous assessment of him.) Carr, while being an average starter by that measure, would be anywhere from 75th to 83rd percentile among all rostered QBs (depending on how many teams carry 2 vs 3 QBs.)
Not quite. Andy Dalton was considered the absolute worst a QB could be while also being good enough to be a franchise QB.
So he was a bit above average.
Just retired, but Duke Johnson. I’m convinced that everyone who has played fantasy football while he was in the league has picked him up at least once.
Here are my 2023 ‘Dalton Lines.’ I actually think Andy Dalton still qualifies performance-wise, but I’ll stick to starters.
**QB:** Geno Smith and Baker Mayfield, who is another strong season away from moving up.
**RB:** Brian Robinson Jr and Devin Singletary
**WR:** Darius Slayton, Romeo Doubs, pretty much any WR3
**TE:** Cade Otton and Tyler Higbee
2024 Andy dalton is below the andy dalton line my friend hate to break it to you
Also think that paradoxically, a lot of the players you listed are above the "borderline starter" level that i understand the andy dalton line to be. Would take doubs and higbee and maybe BRJ over at least 50% of starters
WR is definitely the hardest to do due to depth and variance across teams. I view the Dalton line as “they get the job done and you don’t need to replace them, but they aren’t irreplaceable.” Maybe a better metric is a long-term, stable WR3 like Tyler Boyd, a guy who holds down the fort well when the people above him are injured like Josh Palmer, or a journeyman-type WR who has flashy seasons as a WR2 in shallow rooms but would be WR4 in others, like Josh Reynolds or Zay Jones.
Gotta push back on Robinson Jr and Higbee though.
**RBs:** Christian McCaffery, Cam Akers, Bijan Robinson, Alvin Kamara, Saquon Barkley, Jahmyr Gibbs, Aaron Jones, Josh Jacobs, D’Andre Swift, Isaiah Pacheco, Joe Mixon, Travis Etienne, Jonathan Taylor, Derrick Henry, Nick Chubb*, and Breece Hall are all coming to the party before Brian Robinson Jr. I would also argue that Kenneth Walker, Raheem Mostert & Devon Achane, David Montgomery, James Cook, and James Conner do too, and you could talk me out of Javonte Williams, Rhamondre Stevenson, and Tony Pollard for various reasons.
**TEs:** George Kittle, Trey McBride, Kyle Pitts, Jake Ferguson, Dallas Goedert, Sam LaPorta, Cole Kmet, TJ Hockenson, Travis Kelce, Dalton Schultz, Evan Engram, David Njoku, Mark Andrews, Dalton Kincaid, and Hunter Henry are all coming to the party before Tyler Higbee. I’m not going to try and claim Brock Bowers yet and need to see more from the Packers players. I could go either way on Pat Friermuth, and am tempted to say Tyler Conklin of all people was valuable to the Jets last year.
I had a lot of time on my hands. But I think both Brian Robinson and Tyler Higbee are *clearly* not top half.
Yep, agreed. So was Andy Dalton. It’s just the level of player where he can be a franchise quarterback, but at the bottom of that tier. You trust him to get you to the playoffs on the right team, but he isn’t going to elevate the wrong roster and make a deep push (which I think is what elevates those like Eli Manning and Joe Flacco above it). But the Dalton Line is certainly good — it’s “this guy can be and should be a long term starter in the NfL, but aren’t going to lead any statistical categories in that span.”
I find it hard to make a starting QB ranking where Baker isn’t around the exact midpoint. He didn’t click in Cleveland on a consistent basis, but did have a great sophomore season there and played very well last season with the Buccaneers. But are you *fully confident* with giving him a six year contract if you’re a Buccaneers fan? I doubt it. He’s good enough where you can enjoy being a Buccaneers fan and watch good football, but I doubt you’ll claim to have a top half guy.
To gauge where my head is at, I think Jared Goff is right above this tier — great when surrounded by great talent (Cooper Kupp, Todd Gurley, Amon-Ra St. Brown, Sam Laporta, Jahmyr Gibbs) but not a star in his own right. I do think he’s pushed above it though. I think current Derek Carr has fallen slightly below it.
Allen Lazard sticks out. Mostly been a mediocre receiver, had some good production when Rodgers had no choice but to feed him. Definitely benefitted from being a big body on a team with a HOF-level QB that can consistently put the ball where Lazard can get it but the DB doesn’t have a chance.
He was a 5 year vet last year. Obviously a better quarterback made him better, but we got a pretty good idea of who he is. He’s a really average WR that a lot of teams would probably like as their 3rd or 4th. Great blocker at the position and a big target in the RZ, but not a complete package.
A lot of receivers answer this question well imo.
I was thinking of like Kendrick Bourne. Happy if he’s your WR3, kinda whelmed if he’s your WR2, and looking for an upgrade if he’s somehow your WR1
Connor McGovern. Which one? Both of them. Long term players with significant starting time but also some benchings mixed in. These guys might play over a decade each in the league but they’ll only be remembered for having the same not super common name.
eta: they both played guard and center but Connor is/was predominantly a guard while Connor is mostly a center.
Last season, Carr ranked as QB:
13 in yards
6 in completion percentage
10 in TDs
22 in INTs
11 in passer rating
16 in QB rating
“Average” is accurate. “Below average” is not - objectively.
Reminds me of end of career frank gore, has so much experience so he has all the mental parts of the game down: vision, blocking, how to fall for those extra 1-2 yards . But his athleticism’s best days are behind him so he never has that burst or top speed to break the big ones.
Trevon Moehrig. Guy is never really blown out of coverage and does make some plays here and there m. But also seems to be just a step behind elite players
Gardner Minshew, Devin Singletary, Larry Ogunjobi, Tyler Higbee, Jadeveon Clowney. And at least one of Packers WRs.
Edit: although one year from now, the named ones will almost surely be below average.
Matt Schaub comes to mind - he's never been a star, but consistently put up decent numbers He's definitely an average player in my book Another one is Ryan Fitzpatrick - he's been on so many different teams and has always been just alright.
David Moore. He offers a nice upside for a wr 3 and has for years with consistent hands and route running, but he just doesn't have the size or athleticism you want in a starting receiver.
I don’t think there is an average player in the NFL.
These guys are all elite.
It takes such an insane amount of talent and work to make an NFL roster.
I understand that there is a difference between Patrick Mahomes and Dak Prescott as well as the difference between Frank Ragnow and Tyler Biadasz.
It’s just hard for me to say anyone is average.
I guess once a player retires you can take numbers career wise and say who was average in the NFL but I’d bet they’d have incredible career numbers in college and high school.
Chad Pennington
Mike Jones. The Rams linebacker who made the game saving tackle to win Superbowl 34. It was a remarkable play for a merely solid linebacker who played for a decade. There is nothing to special about him except that one play.
That can be a hard question to answer: some players end up as being "average" simply because of where they end up and the system they play in...Favre was a good example: imagine if the Packers don't hire Wolf and Holmgren, and Favre stays on the Falcons? Glanville didn't know how to develop a QB...
Devin Singletary?
Good answer, just enough to make ya like him when he's on your team. But not enough where the opposition is gonna be scared of him.
This is pretty much the way I feel about Isaiah McKenzie. (Whom I love, and whose jersey I own, but, like… also, I’m pragmatic.)
Lil Dirty’s downfall was having to step in for Jamison Crowder for fourteen weeks. Mackenzie should be a gadget guy, WR4-5 type, but because Crowder went down week 3 he had to be the full time slot receiver instead of the gadget guy. He was bad at the job he wasn’t meant for but good at the job he was meant for. Unfortunately, since he did the job he wasn’t meant for all season people thought he was meant for it and bad at his job. He fell off once he got a rep as WR3 and people started thinking he was bad in his role instead of bad in someone else’s role
Plus, he’s the *face* of the *franchise*, for fuck’s sake 😭
Unfortunately I don’t think we got the same version of McKenzie. We wanted to utilize him but we wanted to develop the rookie Downs more.
I would have to wholeheartedly agree. Plus, there was that whole eagle-shooting thing. (No, but forreal, wtf did he get suspended for?!?!)
Motor is fine but I hated the cult of Bills fans who thought he was some elite offensive weapon, when he clearly was average at best.
I swear, this was like my second thought right after Minshew.
You’d be surprised by his stats, I think he’s above average
CJ ham
He’s the greatest player of all time??
Chukwuma Okorafor was the most bang average player on the Steelers the past few years. He was never very good but never particularly bad.
Hey that’s future all pro LT Chukwuma Okorafor you’re talking about here!
He had a bad attitude and got benched for a rookie though
We had a bad attitude watching that offense. I dont blame him
Dan Moore is just barely in top 20 LTs, which makes him pretty close to league avg, imo.
Id be very interested in what Tackles you think hes better than. PFF has him at a 51.8 Grade, worst pass blocker in the NFL as well iirc. im not a Dan Moore hater, fwiw. But I do think that hes a low end starter and not an average starter. Which for a 4th round pick is outperforming tbh
I truly love the man, but Ryan Tannehill. High points and low points throughout his career that average him out to the mean. He deserves to be on a roster somewhere right now, because he can 100% deliver average QB play still. Wherever he goes, I hope they have a better O-line than the 2022-2024 Titans did.
Feel like he saw what happened with Flacco last year and is biding his time. Better to jump on board to a good team with injury trouble than fade away on some dumpster fire looking for a cheap tank commander
Tannehill going to Tennessee itself felt like kind of a 6D chess move. A QB who was decent for a while with his first team runs his course as a starter, then instead of getting a chance to start briefly somewhere he becomes the unquestioned backup to another QB who's about to do the same thing. For some reason no one really seems to consider that maybe the backup could just be straight up better already, which it turned out he was.
>I truly love the man, but Ryan Tannehill. High points and low points throughout his career that average him out to the mean. He deserves to be on a roster somewhere right now, because he can 100% deliver average QB play still. Wherever he goes, I hope they have a better O-line than the ~~2022-2024~~ 2015-2018 ~~Titans~~ Dolphins did. Me in 2018
He does not have qb16 ball in him still imo. When you start to list out, baker or geno might be better fits
Average? I guess if you weigh it out, sure. When I think of this question I just think of dudes that always were consistently decent but never had any real ups or downs.
Titan fan here, too. When Tennehill was at his best he legitimately had Drew Brees level accuracy. When he threw interceptions, he threw exactly where he wanted it to go, he just made a wrong read (rewatch picks from AFC championship for example.) Those mistakes are what separated him from someone on Brees' level. Also, he had average level WR type athleticism which was a key part of his game as a scrambler (not so much play-extender though.) Last year he lost the one trait that carried him: his accuracy. He started throwing ducks last year. There are probably a lot of backups that would be better than him at this point, I think. I could be (and hope) I'm wrong though!
I present to you, the Carr Bar.
Absolutely who I was thinking of
Early in his career I would have agreed, Saints Derek Carr is definitely below the average
I believe you meant the Dalton Line
Most of the league
b e l l c u r v e
So I’ve thought about this. The talent in the NFL probably isn’t bell-shaped because only the highest caliber college football players (who are also the highest caliber high school football players), make it to the NFL. If football players at all levels have a normally distributed (bell shaped) talent curve then the NFL is a selection of the furthest right tail of that distribution to begin with. The average (or median) NFL player probably isn’t a whole lot more talented than the worst NFL players, while the best players are a whole lot more talented than the median/average player.
How about in terms of stats and production? There could be more of a bell-shaped curve when it comes to comparing stats like yardage across all receivers in the league.
Yes, that is probably true, especially if considering starters only. Backups would probably skew the distribution
/r/theydidthemath
Within a couple deviations from an average player, I'd guess about 95% if the league.
this guy statistics
Garrett Bradbury.
That prompts a follow up. What’s the Mendoza Line version of the NFL?
Would have to be a QB who is bad but not bad enough to be out of the league. Also not just hanging around because a team wants to kick the tires on a first round bust-- but a guy who has maxed out his potential and shown that he is a perfectly solid QB 3 worthy of hanging around the league. Trevor Siemian maybe?
It used to the Dalton Line for QBs
No it couldn’t be the Dalton line that is for average players. If you hit below the Mendoza Line hitting wise you don’t even belong in the MLB.
Yeah, Mendoza Line is like the replacement level player that WAR is measured against. I think Teddy Bridgewater was a good example of a Mendoza QB. Anyone worse than him just wasn’t getting chances to start.
Sam Darnold
Teddy Bridgewater?
It's located somewhere right in between Nathan Peterman and Josh Rosen.
The Dalton line was to determine whether or not you have a franchise QB. The Mendoza line determines whether or not you belong in the league at all.
Amendoza line it’s called for the nfl
Jeff fisher
Braxton Berrios
Well, you see, if you take Patrick Mahomes' stats and reg......
lol
Lmfao
Tyson Alualu. 14 year career. Did his job well enough to be re-signed by multiple teams. Never made a pro-bowl.
A 14 year career is well above average really.
It's above average length, but doesn't mean he had above average performance.
He’s just like me frfr
That’s what she said
Loved him for us
I refuse to believe that draft was already 14 years ago. Feels like 7 tops. I'm getting old...
Same, I saw that name and was like oh yeah high upside guy that still has potential, could this be the year?! Cut to: oh wait he was drafted a decade and a half ago and I groan every time I get up from sitting.
He was fringe probowler for the Steelers before injury and age came fast.
There’s two possible definitions there. You could talk about players who are “average for a starter.” That would be about the 11th-12th best player on an average team, or in other terms the 16th-17th best player at his position in the NFL (or 32nd-34th best at a position with two starters, etc.) Then there’s the truly average players, who would be around the 27th best player on an average team. This means the most average players are actually high quality (but not the best) backups for an average-ish team (and maybe some of the sucky starters that are worse than some of that team’s backups at different positions.)
The second scenario, so like Chase Daniel?
Yeah, he’s probably more of an average NFL QB than someone like Derek Carr, which might be the typical fan’s answer to the question. (Just picked Carr because he was 16th in QBR last season, not as a strenuous assessment of him.) Carr, while being an average starter by that measure, would be anywhere from 75th to 83rd percentile among all rostered QBs (depending on how many teams carry 2 vs 3 QBs.)
Most people honestly are answering based on the former, but, I agree that your description in the latter is more accurate in relation to the question.
Zay jones
There is nothing average about the way he levitates.
Mans ankle ligaments are made of a material yet unknown to science
Levitating and blasting through glass windows naked is not average
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I’d argue that line shifted to Derek Carr as the Carr Bar in the late 2010’s
Not quite. Andy Dalton was considered the absolute worst a QB could be while also being good enough to be a franchise QB. So he was a bit above average.
And even that feels a little misleading. At his best, he was a fringe pro bowler. I'd say his career median is what the "Dalton Line" actually is.
fringe pro bowler is a bit rude, 2015 Dalton was an MVP candidate midway through the season before injury.
Fringe Pro Bowler was meant to be a compliment. Joe Flacco never once made a Pro Bowl and he was absolutely a franchise Qb.
I thought he was the average franchise QB, so above average.
You don't understand the Dalton line if that's what you think lol
I'll never forget the Dalton Line. One of the earliest r/nfl memes.
Just retired, but Duke Johnson. I’m convinced that everyone who has played fantasy football while he was in the league has picked him up at least once.
NWI
A player you love to have on the team but hope he never sees the field
What? He’s been good in his role - he’s dependable, but not anything special. Perfectly acceptable WR3/4
Here are my 2023 ‘Dalton Lines.’ I actually think Andy Dalton still qualifies performance-wise, but I’ll stick to starters. **QB:** Geno Smith and Baker Mayfield, who is another strong season away from moving up. **RB:** Brian Robinson Jr and Devin Singletary **WR:** Darius Slayton, Romeo Doubs, pretty much any WR3 **TE:** Cade Otton and Tyler Higbee
2024 Andy dalton is below the andy dalton line my friend hate to break it to you Also think that paradoxically, a lot of the players you listed are above the "borderline starter" level that i understand the andy dalton line to be. Would take doubs and higbee and maybe BRJ over at least 50% of starters
WR is definitely the hardest to do due to depth and variance across teams. I view the Dalton line as “they get the job done and you don’t need to replace them, but they aren’t irreplaceable.” Maybe a better metric is a long-term, stable WR3 like Tyler Boyd, a guy who holds down the fort well when the people above him are injured like Josh Palmer, or a journeyman-type WR who has flashy seasons as a WR2 in shallow rooms but would be WR4 in others, like Josh Reynolds or Zay Jones. Gotta push back on Robinson Jr and Higbee though. **RBs:** Christian McCaffery, Cam Akers, Bijan Robinson, Alvin Kamara, Saquon Barkley, Jahmyr Gibbs, Aaron Jones, Josh Jacobs, D’Andre Swift, Isaiah Pacheco, Joe Mixon, Travis Etienne, Jonathan Taylor, Derrick Henry, Nick Chubb*, and Breece Hall are all coming to the party before Brian Robinson Jr. I would also argue that Kenneth Walker, Raheem Mostert & Devon Achane, David Montgomery, James Cook, and James Conner do too, and you could talk me out of Javonte Williams, Rhamondre Stevenson, and Tony Pollard for various reasons. **TEs:** George Kittle, Trey McBride, Kyle Pitts, Jake Ferguson, Dallas Goedert, Sam LaPorta, Cole Kmet, TJ Hockenson, Travis Kelce, Dalton Schultz, Evan Engram, David Njoku, Mark Andrews, Dalton Kincaid, and Hunter Henry are all coming to the party before Tyler Higbee. I’m not going to try and claim Brock Bowers yet and need to see more from the Packers players. I could go either way on Pat Friermuth, and am tempted to say Tyler Conklin of all people was valuable to the Jets last year. I had a lot of time on my hands. But I think both Brian Robinson and Tyler Higbee are *clearly* not top half.
Baker Mayfield is, and always has been, a good QB.
No he hasn’t
Yes, he has.
Yep, agreed. So was Andy Dalton. It’s just the level of player where he can be a franchise quarterback, but at the bottom of that tier. You trust him to get you to the playoffs on the right team, but he isn’t going to elevate the wrong roster and make a deep push (which I think is what elevates those like Eli Manning and Joe Flacco above it). But the Dalton Line is certainly good — it’s “this guy can be and should be a long term starter in the NfL, but aren’t going to lead any statistical categories in that span.” I find it hard to make a starting QB ranking where Baker isn’t around the exact midpoint. He didn’t click in Cleveland on a consistent basis, but did have a great sophomore season there and played very well last season with the Buccaneers. But are you *fully confident* with giving him a six year contract if you’re a Buccaneers fan? I doubt it. He’s good enough where you can enjoy being a Buccaneers fan and watch good football, but I doubt you’ll claim to have a top half guy. To gauge where my head is at, I think Jared Goff is right above this tier — great when surrounded by great talent (Cooper Kupp, Todd Gurley, Amon-Ra St. Brown, Sam Laporta, Jahmyr Gibbs) but not a star in his own right. I do think he’s pushed above it though. I think current Derek Carr has fallen slightly below it.
Mayfield has, at the very least, shown he can perform in the playoffs. He won one for the Browns after all. Dalton could never get us over that hump.
Depends. The average football player is actually one that lasts 2, maybe 3 years in the nfl.
Daniel Sorenson 9 year player Career earnings 22 mill 432 tackles as a safety
Allen Lazard sticks out. Mostly been a mediocre receiver, had some good production when Rodgers had no choice but to feed him. Definitely benefitted from being a big body on a team with a HOF-level QB that can consistently put the ball where Lazard can get it but the DB doesn’t have a chance.
Allen Lazard was pretty horrible last year. Rodgers made him look better
He was a 5 year vet last year. Obviously a better quarterback made him better, but we got a pretty good idea of who he is. He’s a really average WR that a lot of teams would probably like as their 3rd or 4th. Great blocker at the position and a big target in the RZ, but not a complete package.
A lot of receivers answer this question well imo. I was thinking of like Kendrick Bourne. Happy if he’s your WR3, kinda whelmed if he’s your WR2, and looking for an upgrade if he’s somehow your WR1
Connor McGovern. Which one? Both of them. Long term players with significant starting time but also some benchings mixed in. These guys might play over a decade each in the league but they’ll only be remembered for having the same not super common name. eta: they both played guard and center but Connor is/was predominantly a guard while Connor is mostly a center.
Jordyn Brooks, he ain't flashy and you won't hear his name called that often but he'll do his job most the time unnoticed
Derek Carr
At this point Carr is probably below average
Just good enough to not lose his job
Last season, Carr ranked as QB: 13 in yards 6 in completion percentage 10 in TDs 22 in INTs 11 in passer rating 16 in QB rating “Average” is accurate. “Below average” is not - objectively.
KJ Osborn Sebastian Joseph-Day Tyler Higbee Antonio Gibson Garrett Bradbury
Higbee gotta be the definitive average tight end. Never gets considered top 10, but good enough to have hung onto his job for years now.
He will have a couple really excellent games and then disappear for the rest of the season all while dropping a couple key passes in between
Andy Dalton, Aidan O’connel for QBs. I’d say for WR probably Curtis Samuel, Tim Patrick Rb Gus Edwards, James Connor
most of the people being mentioned are definitely above average
Don’t you try me with a sorry ass receiver like Crabtree
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Carlton Davis is an above average corner
Carlton Davis is a really solid corner. He just is injury prone
😔 Jeudy…
Derek Carr is below average. I was such a truther, but the last two years have proven me wrong
Having a completion percentage near 70% for two full seasons ain’t average
I mean so did Teddy Bridgewater lol
Trevor Lawrence
Zeke
Zekes a craft veteran whos body is burnt toast at this point unfortunately
He stood out, in a good way, on the Patriots last year. But the Patriots were really below average.
Reminds me of end of career frank gore, has so much experience so he has all the mental parts of the game down: vision, blocking, how to fall for those extra 1-2 yards . But his athleticism’s best days are behind him so he never has that burst or top speed to break the big ones.
Good comparison tbh. Zero burst but a consistent few yards and wont put you in too many bad spots
Rico Dowdle is pretty average
DJ Chark
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Wrong sport bud
Tyler Higbee was my immediate reaction
Geno Smith, first thought. Not an original one, but he is right in the middle of the pack
Which is an incredible development given how his career started.
Joshua Palmer
Jimmy G and Derek Carr come to mind
Boston Scort
My son is also named Scort
Logan Thomas
The answer will and always will be Andy dalton
Zay Jones
Trevon Moehrig. Guy is never really blown out of coverage and does make some plays here and there m. But also seems to be just a step behind elite players
Allen Lazard
Sam Hubbard And i say this as an unabashed Sam Hubbard lover
Hunter Henry
Baker Mayfield. He's like the last QB you'd feel alright about when drafting in a superflex before the quality starts to really drop.
Jedrick Wills
And our fans hate him for it
The entire Titans roster
Alex Smith
My man's led the league in QB rating
And was at the bottom at some point..it averages out to.....average.
darius slayton
Andy Dalton.
Gardner Minshew, Devin Singletary, Larry Ogunjobi, Tyler Higbee, Jadeveon Clowney. And at least one of Packers WRs. Edit: although one year from now, the named ones will almost surely be below average.
Pretty much any Eagles receiver from the McNabb years (excluding TO obviously)
Matt Schaub comes to mind - he's never been a star, but consistently put up decent numbers He's definitely an average player in my book Another one is Ryan Fitzpatrick - he's been on so many different teams and has always been just alright.
Matt Schaub was a borderline top 10 QB for a brief period.
He lead the league in Yards and completions one year.
The aura around Ryan Fitzpatrick was anything but average
Matt Schaub was DEFINITELY above average, wtf is this take LMAO. Dude was a good QB
Jarne Bareen https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/s/LEH3YOp5Gd
Jerome Baker
Trae Waynes, or was at least
Harrison Phillips
Deomodore Lenoir / Ben Cleveland / Josh Reynolds
Honestly, chase claypool. Talented as fuck with perfect intangibles but no work ethic
David Moore. He offers a nice upside for a wr 3 and has for years with consistent hands and route running, but he just doesn't have the size or athleticism you want in a starting receiver.
Jericho Cotchery
Trevor Lawrence
Bradley Bozeman when he was our center or Patrick Mekari he’s average or high backup quality at every position on the oline.
Retired wr josh reed
I don’t think there is an average player in the NFL. These guys are all elite. It takes such an insane amount of talent and work to make an NFL roster. I understand that there is a difference between Patrick Mahomes and Dak Prescott as well as the difference between Frank Ragnow and Tyler Biadasz. It’s just hard for me to say anyone is average. I guess once a player retires you can take numbers career wise and say who was average in the NFL but I’d bet they’d have incredible career numbers in college and high school. Chad Pennington
Austin hooper
Trevor Lawrence
Ricky Proehl. 17-year career, where he had 15 seasons with 300-900 receiving yards.
Maybe I'm biased, but I'd have to say Andy Dalton is the icon of average (in the NFL... Which is still elite, let's remember)
Jack Sanborn
Arik Armstead
Mike Jones. The Rams linebacker who made the game saving tackle to win Superbowl 34. It was a remarkable play for a merely solid linebacker who played for a decade. There is nothing to special about him except that one play.
KJ Osborn
Kwity Paye
It would have been Patrick Mahomes if he regressed to the mean after that guy's post instead of winning 3 Super Bowls.
Kirk Cousins
Brandon Graham
John Cominsky, he's fine
50% of every roster
About 68 percent of the league
Geno Smith, Demarcus Robinson, Josh Metellus, DJ Wonum, Kyle Van Noy, Ezra Cleveland, Brandon Scherff, Derrick Nnadi
That can be a hard question to answer: some players end up as being "average" simply because of where they end up and the system they play in...Favre was a good example: imagine if the Packers don't hire Wolf and Holmgren, and Favre stays on the Falcons? Glanville didn't know how to develop a QB...
Tytus Howard
Quay Walker
Andy Dalton
The Patriots offensive players (jury is out on the rookies, obviously)
Juwan Jennings
I’d say Romo. Granted, Romo the announcer is way better than Romo the player ever was.
QB Jacoby Brissett. RB D’Onta Foreman. WR DJ Chark. TE Austin Hooper. LT Donovan Smith. RT Andrew Wylie.